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[tense music playing]
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{\an8}[announcer] The World Wrestling
Entertainment Ladies Champion,
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{\an8}Wendi Richter!
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[crowd cheering]
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{\an8}[McMahon] Wendi Richter was the champion,
and everything was fine for a while.
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{\an8}But Wendi had become a problem,
as I recall.
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Every woman in professional wrestling
wants my belt,
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but I want it too and I had to...
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[McMahon] When it was time
to do the honors,
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and pass that championship
to someone else, she resisted.
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And it's like, "This is show business."
You know? "I'm writing a script."
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"You're holding my championship belt."
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"It's mine, it's not yours."
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"I'm not gonna give it up."
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"Well, all right."
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"I'm gonna make you give it up, then."
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[announcer] This contest
is for the ladies' championship.
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{\an8}[McMahon]
The audience is expecting a match.
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{\an8}You don't wanna fire someone
when you're expecting a match,
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because you're screwing the public then.
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So, get the match in the ring,
as my dad used to say,
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and then you figure it out.
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[bell rings]
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[announcer] Bell's gone,
and we're underway in this title match-up.
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The match is in the ring,
Wendi has the championship.
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It's really easy.
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Somewhere in this match,
Wendi's gonna get rolled up.
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Told the ref simply,
"Just count to three."
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[announcer]
Oh, small package. Nicely executed.
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Whoa, was that close.
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-[crowd cheering]
-[bell ringing]
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[announcer] What was that?
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The referee counted, "One."
I lifted my shoulder up,
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and he counted, "two, three,"
even with my shoulders off the mat.
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[announcer]
Wendi Richter has lost her title.
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That was a very painful night. [sighs]
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My dreams were completely shattered.
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I was humiliated,
and it was on television.
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I didn't care.
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It was like,
the public being in an uproar...
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"Oh my God, you know,
it really wasn't a fair count."
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My answer to that is
life's not fair sometimes,
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and, you know, I don't fight fair.
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There's a saying in wrestling,
"It's nothing personal, just business."
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And I think that's what Vince McMahon is.
He's a businessman.
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[McMahon] Wendi came back after the match.
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She looked at me,
bowed her head, and walked out.
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That was the last I ever saw of Wendi.
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But for me, it was nothing personal.
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This is business, and there's nothing
I wouldn't do for our business.
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{\an8}[reporter 1] Vince McMahon came in
wearing a neck brace and smiling,
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{\an8}in his second week on trial
for steroid-selling conspiracy.
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Today, McMahon was upstaged
by his former number one star, Hulk Hogan.
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[reporter 2] The man behind the character
would shed his Spandex
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and jump into the ring
at US District Court
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to testify with immunity
against Vince McMahon, his former boss.
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This was to be the main event
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in the prosecution's conspiracy case
against McMahon.
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It was time for me to go testify.
I walked across the courtroom.
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As I walked by,
there was Vince McMahon sitting there,
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and we were
at each other's throats at the time.
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The feds thought that
this is the perfect opportunity for me
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to throw dirt on Vince
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and all of a sudden run wild
with the wrestling world.
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Went and testified,
and I think they were shocked.
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[reporter] On cross-examination,
a powerslam by the defense.
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[reporter reading transcript]
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One of the last times I talked to Vince,
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and it had been months and months
since we talked,
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one of the last things I said to him,
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"Brother, we go all the way up together,
and we go all the way down together."
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"Don't forget that."
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As far as Hulk Hogan on the stand,
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I can tell you
that the government was surprised.
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I could see the faces on the prosecutors.
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"This is not what we were expecting."
Because Hogan totally backed Vince.
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[interviewer] Did the government
know what you'd say?
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No, I wouldn't tell them.
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I just said, "I'll say whatever
you guys need me to say."
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Told them what they wanted to hear,
but I knew what I was gonna say.
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I was gonna tell the truth.
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He didn't sell steroids.
He didn't tell people to take them.
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All the stuff they said about him
was not true.
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[McMahon] He was crafty in terms of
giving the government what they wanted
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to a certain extent,
but not what they really wanted.
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They really wanted someone to say,
"Vince McMahon told me to take steroids."
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They even called me.
They wanted me to testify against Vince.
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"Did Vince encourage you to do steroids?"
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I said, "No, I was using steroids
before I met Vince."
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He let us do it, let's put it thataway,
but he didn't sell it to us.
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[Bret Hart] There was a strong influence
to take them, just based on common sense
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and realizing all the guys that are
on steroids are the main event guys,
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but Vince telling me
or any other wrestler to take steroids?
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I never saw it.
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Vince isn't going to someone and going,
"Hey, you, go on steroids."
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But would he say,
"Hey, you need to work out harder,"
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thinking they'll go on steroids?
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Um... who knows?
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I wasn't guilty of anything.
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Didn't change the fact these bastards
were coming after me for no good reason.
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So, naturally, I'm concerned.
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This is my liberty,
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and when you're about to hear the...
the verdict, it's like, "Holy shit."
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That's a moment you'll never forget.
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That's a moment whereby
my life is about to change.
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[reporter 1] World Wrestling Entertainment
head Vince McMahon
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allowed himself just
the slightest expression of relief
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as the verdict was read.
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[reporter 2] The verdict, not guilty.
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Cheers from fans
roared through the courtroom.
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An emotional hug
from his wife of 27 years, Linda.
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I was there. The verdict happened and, uh...
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it was relief.
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[Meltzer] it shouldn't have gone to trial.
They didn't have evidence to convict him.
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Hello, I'm Vince McMahon...
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[Meltzer] I think they did it because
they thought Vince was a bad guy,
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If you're a newspaper reporter,
you can go after him for that.
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If you're gonna put him on trial,
you have to have more than that.
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If there were any doubters
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as to what World Wrestling Entertainment
was and is all about,
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I think this just cleared up all of them.
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[Meltzer] I remember Linda, "It proved
we didn't have a steroid problem."
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And it's like, no,
the case proved, by all testimony,
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that most of your guys were on steroids,
and your biggest stars were on steroids.
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That's what the case proved.
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Gonna try to portray him as the good guy,
but Vince was the bad guy.
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He wasn't convicted,
nor should he have been,
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but he wasn't the good guy.
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[McMahon] I don't know
that I learned really anything.
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The only thing I learned about business is
some people in the government suck.
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World Wrestling...
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[Shoemaker] Vince always paints himself
as the victim in this trial.
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I don't think it was a surprise
that he was found innocent.
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I don't... I don't mean to imply
that he should have ended up guilty,
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but there are rumors and reports
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about everything Vince's team did
to try to win.
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Stories of contacting witnesses,
of payoffs, jury tampering,
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all of which paints Vince
in a way that's very different
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than the way
he would like to portray himself.
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Stay tuned...
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So after the trial,
after this whole series of scandals,
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Vince probably felt invincible.
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But that wasn't the case.
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[Prichard] Regardless
of what the outcome was,
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the trial affected business in a huge way.
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Things got tight, and things got scary.
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Some executives left. I don't blame them.
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Would I wish they didn't leave
and what have you?
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Sure I do.
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Uh, because it hurt the company,
the fact that they left.
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[Meltzer] During that period,
their business struggled.
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They had years that they lost money.
Their revenues were way down.
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They were, um,
in pretty big financial straits.
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[Hart] The company took
a huge drop in attendance.
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No more sell-outs.
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Business wasn't the same as it was
when Hulk Hogan was on top.
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What Vince was looking for
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was someone that
would replace Hulk as the face of WWE,
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and Vince thought it could be Lex.
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[McMahon] Made in the USA, Lex Luger!
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We did put the machine,
so to speak, behind Lex Luger
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and thought he was gonna be awesome.
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Let's take a look now
at some footage of the Lex Express.
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Lex was okay, but nowhere near Hulk Hogan.
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I know it, you know it,
everyone out there knows it...
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Lex just wasn't capable
of connecting with the audience.
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Lex was just another
in a long chain of guys
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trying to fill Hulk's shoes.
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They had to replace Hulk Hogan,
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and the guy that pulled the sword
out of the stone was Bret Hart.
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[echoing] Bret!
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Go get 'em, champ.
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[hard rock music playing]
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[kid] Wow.
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The New Generation was a new era.
We have new stars. We have Bret Hart.
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You know, in the WWE,
there is a lot of changes.
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{\an8}[Hart, present day]
Then we have Razor Ramon.
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There's only one man
who is oozing machismo.
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[Hart] We had Kevin Nash.
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On lives the new generation!
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[Hart] And we have Shawn Michaels.
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[Michaels] I'm the Heartbreak Kid,
Shawn Michaels, Jack.
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I'm the man that made history.
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Once you knew that it was
no longer sort of the Hogan era,
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it kind of just put
a question mark on everything.
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Everything is up for grabs.
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For most of us in the locker room,
it got a bit more hopeful
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that this was kind of anybody's ballgame.
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Hulk's gone, now who's gonna step up?
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That was the mindset.
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And there were plenty of guys
that were waiting to fill that void.
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[Hart] The guys that we had,
the New Generation guys,
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like myself and Undertaker,
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some of the best wrestlers maybe ever.
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I was kind of proud to be the torchbearer
for the New Generation.
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There were many liabilities
on the company at that time,
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and I was the safest guy.
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Bret Hart's not gonna get busted
with an underage girl in a hotel,
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or, "We found a kilo of cocaine
in his bag."
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It seems to me
that you bring a certain humility.
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That's why Vince said,
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"We're gonna make you champion
for a long time."
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"You can hold the fort while
we deal with all these issues right now."
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[Vince] Bret comes from the Hart family,
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{\an8}which has produced
many, many performers in the past.
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Very interesting family.
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Bret didn't have all that much charisma.
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He had some, enough.
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So it was kind of nip and tuck
for a while.
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At the same time,
during the course of that,
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Ted Turner starts grabbing
some of the talent,
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so had to deal with that as well.
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Ted opened up the checkbook
and said to the people working there,
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"You can do whatever you want.
Just make this happen."
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[Bollea] WCW is different than WWE,
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because there was
so much more money there.
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I mean, I cut these crazy deals
when I first walked in,
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and it was like dying and going to heaven
as far as the wrestling business.
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The amount of money he was offering them
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was far greater than the amount
they had ever made here,
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so it was logical for a lot of them
to leave and go join Ted's organization.
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And what you gonna do?
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[Bischoff] Shortly after Hulk Hogan,
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Randy Savage
all of a sudden became available.
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00:11:36,237 --> 00:11:40,032
Unfortunately, Randy Savage
has been unable to sign a contract
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00:11:40,116 --> 00:11:41,534
with the WWE...
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[Bischoff] That was the next big one.
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That's when things started to really feel
like we had momentum.
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00:11:47,540 --> 00:11:50,543
After Hulk jumped on board
and after Randy jumped on board,
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00:11:50,626 --> 00:11:53,170
people were looking at WCW
a little differently.
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00:11:53,921 --> 00:11:56,549
At one point,
I had a meeting with Ted Turner,
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and he said, "Eric, what's it gonna take
to be competitive with WWE?"
233
00:12:01,178 --> 00:12:03,389
I said, "Well, Ted, Monday Night Raw,
234
00:12:03,472 --> 00:12:06,642
you know that's on Monday night
on USA prime time, right?"
235
00:12:06,726 --> 00:12:10,688
"We're on Saturday night
at 6:05 Eastern, 3:05 Pacific."
236
00:12:10,771 --> 00:12:12,857
"We can't compete."
237
00:12:12,940 --> 00:12:15,067
And without missing a beat,
238
00:12:15,151 --> 00:12:17,737
Ted looked over
to the head of TNT and said,
239
00:12:17,820 --> 00:12:20,823
"Give Eric two hours
every Monday night on TNT."
240
00:12:21,407 --> 00:12:24,076
And I was like, "Wh... What?!"
241
00:12:24,827 --> 00:12:26,579
I just thought it'd be a good idea,
242
00:12:26,662 --> 00:12:30,124
that'd at least show that
we've been on the map for so long.
243
00:12:30,207 --> 00:12:33,919
We have been hammerlocked, sucker-punched,
244
00:12:34,003 --> 00:12:36,547
beat up, jumped on, stomped out,
245
00:12:36,630 --> 00:12:38,841
chairs broken over our heads,
246
00:12:38,924 --> 00:12:41,927
all the wrestling stuff,
by Vince for so long,
247
00:12:42,011 --> 00:12:44,805
that I just thought
we'll just go head-to-head with him
248
00:12:44,889 --> 00:12:47,224
and see how it goes.
We'll get in the ring with him.
249
00:12:47,892 --> 00:12:50,227
As soon as I heard
they were gonna go head-to-head,
250
00:12:50,311 --> 00:12:53,230
that was like,
"Ooh-ooh. We're in trouble."
251
00:12:53,814 --> 00:12:55,816
I don't know what's gonna happen,
but won't be good.
252
00:12:56,817 --> 00:12:59,528
Or it was gonna put us
out of business, quite frankly.
253
00:13:00,112 --> 00:13:04,283
[announcer] Welcome back to the action
here on the debut edition
254
00:13:04,366 --> 00:13:07,787
of WCW Monday Nitro...
255
00:13:07,870 --> 00:13:09,789
[Bischoff]
Now I've got this thing called Nitro,
256
00:13:09,872 --> 00:13:13,125
I've got to figure out
a way to create some real surprises.
257
00:13:14,668 --> 00:13:17,505
[announcer] What a matchup
we have got in store.
258
00:13:17,588 --> 00:13:20,633
What?! What in the hell is he doing here?
259
00:13:20,716 --> 00:13:23,886
[Prichard] For their first show,
they had Lex Luger show up.
260
00:13:23,969 --> 00:13:27,264
{\an8}We had him on one of our live events
the Sunday night before,
261
00:13:27,348 --> 00:13:31,060
{\an8}and then he appeared on Nitro
the very next night.
262
00:13:31,143 --> 00:13:32,770
[announcer] Whoa! Wait a minute!
263
00:13:32,853 --> 00:13:35,022
It was a big surprise.
It was like, "Oh my God."
264
00:13:35,105 --> 00:13:36,565
What are you doing here, Luger?
265
00:13:36,649 --> 00:13:40,069
[Bischoff] When Lex walked out,
not only was the audience in shock,
266
00:13:40,152 --> 00:13:42,363
but everybody in WWE was in shock,
267
00:13:42,446 --> 00:13:44,657
because they thought
he was still under contract.
268
00:13:45,366 --> 00:13:46,450
And he's not.
269
00:13:46,534 --> 00:13:48,327
[understated music playing]
270
00:13:48,410 --> 00:13:51,455
[Bischoff] It was fortuitous
in the sense of timing
271
00:13:51,539 --> 00:13:54,834
because Lex Luger was tired of WWE.
272
00:13:54,917 --> 00:13:56,502
He wasn't happy there.
273
00:13:56,585 --> 00:13:59,171
So I said, "Lex, here's the deal.
We're gonna do a deal."
274
00:13:59,255 --> 00:14:02,007
"You cannot tell anybody.
You can't tell WWE."
275
00:14:02,091 --> 00:14:03,926
"You just go about your business."
276
00:14:04,009 --> 00:14:06,136
I'm here for one reason...
277
00:14:06,220 --> 00:14:09,098
Yeah, that was embarrassing.
That was really embarrassing.
278
00:14:09,181 --> 00:14:10,850
It pissed Vince off.
279
00:14:11,433 --> 00:14:13,227
[sighs] It was a beautiful thing.
280
00:14:13,310 --> 00:14:16,146
Lex Luger, you're a good man.
281
00:14:16,230 --> 00:14:19,400
[McMahon] All I had with these guys
was handshakes, not a contract expiring.
282
00:14:19,483 --> 00:14:21,986
I just had handshakes.
It had worked for years.
283
00:14:22,653 --> 00:14:27,116
No longer was it working
because of Ted's enormous wealth.
284
00:14:28,200 --> 00:14:31,871
And I was like,
"Man. Wow, this is brutal."
285
00:14:31,954 --> 00:14:35,207
Because you helped get these talents over,
you helped build them,
286
00:14:35,291 --> 00:14:37,960
then all of a sudden, poof. They're gone.
287
00:14:38,043 --> 00:14:39,420
[Prichard] They'd one-upped us.
288
00:14:39,503 --> 00:14:42,089
It looked like
that was the cool place to go,
289
00:14:42,172 --> 00:14:46,427
that people are leaving WWE to go to WCW
290
00:14:46,510 --> 00:14:48,846
because WCW is new,
it's cool, it's different.
291
00:14:49,430 --> 00:14:50,931
Eric was ruthless.
292
00:14:51,015 --> 00:14:53,851
It absolutely set the tone.
And that was the intent.
293
00:14:54,768 --> 00:14:57,521
After realizing I can't be
better than them at what they do,
294
00:14:57,605 --> 00:14:58,647
what are my options?
295
00:14:58,731 --> 00:15:04,236
I started making a list of every way
that I could be different than the WWE.
296
00:15:04,320 --> 00:15:06,363
Top of the list, they're taped.
297
00:15:06,906 --> 00:15:09,033
Hmm. Okay. I'm live.
298
00:15:09,116 --> 00:15:11,827
At Nitro, we are coming to you live!
299
00:15:12,411 --> 00:15:16,248
They're cartoonish, because they're
appealing to a teen and preteen audience.
300
00:15:16,332 --> 00:15:17,875
I'm gonna be more real.
301
00:15:18,459 --> 00:15:21,629
I wanted my characters
to appeal to an older audience.
302
00:15:22,212 --> 00:15:25,382
I wanted my stories
to be more reality-based.
303
00:15:25,466 --> 00:15:27,718
I'm not gonna try
to land my plane over here.
304
00:15:27,801 --> 00:15:29,511
I'm gonna land my plane over here.
305
00:15:31,096 --> 00:15:34,642
I wanted Nitro to be recognized
306
00:15:34,725 --> 00:15:38,896
as the wrestling company where
you never knew what was going to happen.
307
00:15:40,022 --> 00:15:42,358
[Bollea] I knew it was full-blown warfare
from that point on,
308
00:15:42,441 --> 00:15:45,486
because I know how Vince
feels about his competition.
309
00:15:45,569 --> 00:15:47,947
He wants to destroy it and then eat it.
310
00:15:48,989 --> 00:15:50,407
[hard rock music playing]
311
00:15:50,491 --> 00:15:54,370
[Bischoff] Hello, everybody,
and welcome! We are live!
312
00:15:54,453 --> 00:15:57,331
We are not like
the World Whining Entertainment,
313
00:15:57,414 --> 00:16:00,042
which is a taped, canned show.
314
00:16:00,125 --> 00:16:01,502
[Bischoff] I had live TV now,
315
00:16:01,585 --> 00:16:05,589
so I had the ability to do things
that my competition couldn't do.
316
00:16:05,673 --> 00:16:08,842
That gave me
a really strong tactical advantage.
317
00:16:08,926 --> 00:16:12,513
At that time, Monday Night Raw
was still being taped,
318
00:16:13,097 --> 00:16:16,392
and the results
of those tapings were public,
319
00:16:16,475 --> 00:16:19,812
because there were five or six
or seven thousand people in the arena.
320
00:16:19,895 --> 00:16:23,857
As soon as our show would open up,
I would say, "Yeah, we're live
321
00:16:23,941 --> 00:16:27,361
and anything can happen.
Not like those other guys."
322
00:16:27,444 --> 00:16:30,531
"In fact, don't bother watching that show.
Here's what happened."
323
00:16:30,614 --> 00:16:32,241
And I'd give away the finishes.
324
00:16:32,324 --> 00:16:35,119
[Bischoff] In case you're tempted
to grab the remote control,
325
00:16:35,202 --> 00:16:37,287
check out the competition, don't bother.
326
00:16:37,371 --> 00:16:39,623
Shawn Michaels beat the big guy
with a superkick.
327
00:16:39,707 --> 00:16:42,543
Stay right here. It's live.
It's where the action is.
328
00:16:43,127 --> 00:16:46,547
They would give away the results.
That hurt us for quite some time.
329
00:16:46,630 --> 00:16:48,340
Aggravated the hell out of us for sure.
330
00:16:48,424 --> 00:16:52,469
It's little things like that
that just went and...
331
00:16:52,553 --> 00:16:55,389
It was digs, constant digs.
332
00:16:55,472 --> 00:16:58,350
I wanted to upset the WWE audience,
333
00:16:59,351 --> 00:17:01,103
because I knew if I upset them enough,
334
00:17:01,186 --> 00:17:04,106
they'd tune in to see
what kind of dastardly stuff
335
00:17:04,189 --> 00:17:06,233
I was gonna do next week.
336
00:17:06,316 --> 00:17:09,695
There were many things that they did
to aggravate the hell out of us,
337
00:17:09,778 --> 00:17:13,323
uh, which, when I'm angered, um,
338
00:17:14,116 --> 00:17:16,035
then I'm gonna focus all the more.
339
00:17:16,910 --> 00:17:19,163
[Bischoff] Everybody that I knew
that was close to Vince,
340
00:17:19,246 --> 00:17:23,375
like Hulk, like Randy,
they would say, "Vince will never sell."
341
00:17:23,459 --> 00:17:25,169
He doesn't sell.
342
00:17:25,252 --> 00:17:26,670
He never sold a thing.
343
00:17:26,754 --> 00:17:29,381
Selling is wearing your emotions
on your face.
344
00:17:29,465 --> 00:17:31,341
Yeah, Vince'll never
let you see him sweat.
345
00:17:31,425 --> 00:17:34,678
"Don't sell it.
Never acknowledge the competition."
346
00:17:35,512 --> 00:17:39,767
The more people would tell me that,
the more I'd go, "Watch. I'll get him."
347
00:17:39,850 --> 00:17:42,686
Eric would bring out
our former women's champion
348
00:17:42,770 --> 00:17:44,229
with our championship belt,
349
00:17:44,313 --> 00:17:46,106
and live on their show,
350
00:17:46,190 --> 00:17:47,858
throws it in the trash.
351
00:17:47,941 --> 00:17:49,443
[McMahon] That was upsetting.
352
00:17:49,526 --> 00:17:51,153
It was like, "Oh my God."
353
00:17:51,236 --> 00:17:53,906
[chuckles]
"What else are they gonna do to us?"
354
00:17:53,989 --> 00:17:56,909
I kept gnawing at him and biting him
and doing everything I could
355
00:17:56,992 --> 00:17:58,619
to get him to react, and he did.
356
00:17:58,702 --> 00:18:00,412
{\an8}[man] Billionaire Ted. First of all...
357
00:18:00,496 --> 00:18:02,623
{\an8}[Bischoff] They started doing
the Billionaire Ted skits.
358
00:18:02,706 --> 00:18:04,875
That was the first real sell.
359
00:18:04,958 --> 00:18:08,295
{\an8}I finally got him to react,
which means he was off balance.
360
00:18:08,378 --> 00:18:11,673
[mimicking Ted Turner]
Well, why can't I buy the WWE?
361
00:18:11,757 --> 00:18:15,928
When I saw them, it's like, "Let's tape
these things. I gotta run 'em up to Ted."
362
00:18:16,011 --> 00:18:20,599
We brought them up to Ted,
and Ted laughed his ass off.
363
00:18:20,682 --> 00:18:22,101
He thought they were funny as hell.
364
00:18:22,184 --> 00:18:23,143
[laughing]
365
00:18:23,227 --> 00:18:25,854
That's supposed to be the Hulkster.
[chuckles]
366
00:18:25,938 --> 00:18:28,482
I said, "We're trying
to have some fun with him."
367
00:18:28,565 --> 00:18:31,026
And then Kay Koplovitz shut us down.
368
00:18:31,110 --> 00:18:33,070
It was really distasteful.
369
00:18:33,153 --> 00:18:34,738
We didn't like it particularly,
370
00:18:34,822 --> 00:18:36,782
even though
we were competitors with Turner.
371
00:18:36,865 --> 00:18:41,787
It just didn't belong on our air.
It isn't who we wanted to be at USA.
372
00:18:42,496 --> 00:18:46,542
[McMahon] Kay Koplovitz made us stop
because Ted was a friend of hers.
373
00:18:46,625 --> 00:18:50,170
We're friends. Friendly competitors,
I guess you might say.
374
00:18:51,130 --> 00:18:53,632
[Prichard] USA Network
suggested that we stop,
375
00:18:53,715 --> 00:18:58,846
because they were receiving heat
from folks in the Turner organization,
376
00:18:58,929 --> 00:19:01,014
saying, "This is over the line,
377
00:19:01,098 --> 00:19:04,184
and now you're talking about
how much lithium he takes..."
378
00:19:04,268 --> 00:19:05,644
Jane, where's my lithium?
379
00:19:05,727 --> 00:19:08,981
In hindsight,
I wish that we hadn't done that.
380
00:19:09,565 --> 00:19:12,109
I think we should have been above it.
But we did.
381
00:19:12,192 --> 00:19:18,407
{\an8}And that's also where I figured out
Razor Ramon and Diesel,
382
00:19:18,490 --> 00:19:19,658
{\an8}they're not staying.
383
00:19:19,741 --> 00:19:22,578
Because I asked
Razor and Diesel to do one,
384
00:19:22,661 --> 00:19:24,121
and they didn't wanna do it.
385
00:19:24,204 --> 00:19:26,498
"Why wouldn't you do this?"
"Yeah, I just don't want to."
386
00:19:26,582 --> 00:19:29,293
"Are you going there?" "No, no, no."
387
00:19:29,376 --> 00:19:32,963
[McMahon] I had a long conversation,
with Scott Hall, Razor Ramon,
388
00:19:33,547 --> 00:19:35,507
and Diesel, Kevin Nash.
389
00:19:35,591 --> 00:19:38,010
They really didn't wanna go to WCW.
390
00:19:38,093 --> 00:19:41,388
At the same time,
they have to look into the mirror
391
00:19:41,471 --> 00:19:44,057
and have to know, "Wait a minute.
It's better for my family
392
00:19:44,141 --> 00:19:47,394
from a paycheck standpoint
to go there than it is here."
393
00:19:47,477 --> 00:19:49,396
That was just pure money and schedule.
394
00:19:49,479 --> 00:19:51,523
They were offered more money
and a better schedule.
395
00:19:52,357 --> 00:19:55,152
[Michaels] When Scott and Kevin
signed with WCW,
396
00:19:55,235 --> 00:19:57,821
certainly from a professional standpoint,
thrilled for them.
397
00:19:57,905 --> 00:20:02,242
From a personal standpoint, it hurt a bit
because I was gonna miss my buddies.
398
00:20:02,326 --> 00:20:07,497
There was a group of us that
were all friends backstage. "The Kliq."
399
00:20:08,165 --> 00:20:09,416
Kevin Nash,
400
00:20:09,499 --> 00:20:10,918
Scott Hall,
401
00:20:11,418 --> 00:20:13,253
Shawn Michaels,
402
00:20:13,337 --> 00:20:14,504
and myself.
403
00:20:15,130 --> 00:20:18,008
The Kliq sort of became this famous thing
404
00:20:18,842 --> 00:20:20,677
that everybody knew about
405
00:20:20,761 --> 00:20:23,805
even though it was never portrayed on TV.
406
00:20:25,307 --> 00:20:30,562
{\an8}So, you flash forward to the final night
of Diesel and Razor Ramon.
407
00:20:31,396 --> 00:20:34,399
It's not a pay-per-view.
It's a live event with no TV.
408
00:20:35,150 --> 00:20:38,320
Earlier in the day,
Shawn had talked to Vince
409
00:20:38,403 --> 00:20:41,949
about doing some kind of tribute
to those guys at the end of the night,
410
00:20:42,032 --> 00:20:44,952
and Vince agrees to,
"Something can happen."
411
00:20:45,035 --> 00:20:47,704
I remember him asking me,
"Is it important to you, Shawn?"
412
00:20:47,788 --> 00:20:51,083
I said, "Yes, sir." And he goes,
"Then it's important to me. Go ahead."
413
00:20:51,166 --> 00:20:55,879
Since two of them were leaving,
you know, "Okay. You got my blessing."
414
00:20:55,963 --> 00:20:57,047
[crowd cheering]
415
00:20:57,130 --> 00:21:01,134
[Levesque] Kevin and Shawn
were wrestling each other in a cage match.
416
00:21:01,218 --> 00:21:05,597
They get to the end of the match,
and we all end up in the cage together.
417
00:21:05,681 --> 00:21:08,392
There's this big embrace moment.
418
00:21:08,475 --> 00:21:11,270
-[man] Oh yeah!
-[crowd cheering]
419
00:21:11,353 --> 00:21:13,605
Basically, a curtain call.
420
00:21:14,564 --> 00:21:21,321
From an old-timer, uh, it was
sacrilege to have rivals do that
421
00:21:21,405 --> 00:21:25,367
and to just let everybody know,
"Hey, guys. You know, show's over."
422
00:21:25,450 --> 00:21:28,120
"We really love each other.
Everything's good."
423
00:21:28,203 --> 00:21:30,289
I was actually there
at the Garden that night.
424
00:21:30,872 --> 00:21:33,750
I'm sitting there in the audience
like, "What is this?"
425
00:21:33,834 --> 00:21:36,962
"I can't believe they're doing this.
My dad's gonna be so mad."
426
00:21:37,045 --> 00:21:39,506
Part of me thought
it was a little bit cool,
427
00:21:39,589 --> 00:21:42,342
but part of me was like,
"Oh, I know how wrong this is."
428
00:21:42,426 --> 00:21:44,845
To anyone of my age, it was cool.
429
00:21:45,429 --> 00:21:50,058
But to your older generation
of producers and wrestlers,
430
00:21:50,142 --> 00:21:51,977
it was the cardinal sin.
431
00:21:52,811 --> 00:21:56,189
I wasn't there that night,
but, yeah, I was with the company.
432
00:21:56,273 --> 00:21:59,735
-Yeah, I got thoughts on that. Yeah.
-[interviewer] What are your thoughts?
433
00:21:59,818 --> 00:22:00,861
I didn't like it.
434
00:22:00,944 --> 00:22:02,446
They killed wrestling that day.
435
00:22:03,530 --> 00:22:05,574
That was when wrestling
wasn't real anymore.
436
00:22:05,657 --> 00:22:08,535
We'd pulled the curtain back
and said, "This is how it works."
437
00:22:08,618 --> 00:22:11,955
That was the unveiling of
the new direction that wrestling would be.
438
00:22:12,039 --> 00:22:15,584
It's not wrestling anymore.
It's entertainment.
439
00:22:16,501 --> 00:22:19,755
When they came back out of the...
out of the ring,
440
00:22:20,756 --> 00:22:23,342
well, there were a number of performers
other than them
441
00:22:23,425 --> 00:22:25,635
who really hit the roof.
Like I can't imagine...
442
00:22:25,719 --> 00:22:27,971
It was what we call
a kayfabe type situation.
443
00:22:28,055 --> 00:22:33,477
So if you go back
to the way the business was,
444
00:22:33,560 --> 00:22:34,978
there's a thing called kayfabe.
445
00:22:35,062 --> 00:22:36,021
Kayfabe.
446
00:22:36,104 --> 00:22:37,105
Kayfabe.
447
00:22:37,189 --> 00:22:38,231
Kayfabe.
448
00:22:38,315 --> 00:22:42,110
Kayfabe is a carnival term, initially.
449
00:22:42,194 --> 00:22:49,034
Kayfabe is the fiction
that is being produced by a con artist
450
00:22:49,117 --> 00:22:54,414
where everybody who's involved in the con
agrees to maintain this reality.
451
00:22:55,374 --> 00:22:59,544
[Hart] Kayfabe is basically
keeping the illusion that it's real.
452
00:22:59,628 --> 00:23:02,631
You say "kayfabe," and you know
that you gotta be in character
453
00:23:03,340 --> 00:23:04,925
and pretend everything is real.
454
00:23:05,008 --> 00:23:07,427
You know, good guys stayed with good guys,
455
00:23:07,511 --> 00:23:09,388
and bad guys stayed with bad guys,
456
00:23:09,471 --> 00:23:11,431
and never should the two intermingle.
457
00:23:11,515 --> 00:23:17,437
And for years and years,
we tried to work off of the premise
458
00:23:17,521 --> 00:23:20,732
that wrestling was not predetermined,
459
00:23:20,816 --> 00:23:24,736
and that when you had a feud
with somebody, it was a blood feud,
460
00:23:24,820 --> 00:23:27,906
and it carried on outside of the ring.
461
00:23:27,989 --> 00:23:31,159
The way I came up,
and in the time period I came up,
462
00:23:31,243 --> 00:23:34,371
I, I lived that,
and I believed in that mindset,
463
00:23:34,454 --> 00:23:39,418
even though I knew,
like, they know that I'm a real person,
464
00:23:39,501 --> 00:23:42,295
I always wanted to cast that doubt, like,
465
00:23:42,379 --> 00:23:44,589
"That dude is legit not right."
466
00:23:45,340 --> 00:23:47,342
"He thinks he is that guy."
467
00:23:47,426 --> 00:23:51,847
I kind of protected the business
and protected the character so much.
468
00:23:51,930 --> 00:23:55,350
I was just always trying
to keep people intrigued.
469
00:23:56,476 --> 00:23:59,771
But it was becoming this antiquated thing.
Like, everybody knew.
470
00:24:00,605 --> 00:24:05,277
In that period of time, there were what
were called newsletters, dirt sheets,
471
00:24:05,360 --> 00:24:07,904
with a lot of rumor and innuendo.
472
00:24:07,988 --> 00:24:09,614
So, if you went to a show,
473
00:24:09,698 --> 00:24:12,659
people are talking about
what's real and what's not.
474
00:24:12,742 --> 00:24:16,663
I honestly don't have any idea
why kayfabe and all that
475
00:24:16,746 --> 00:24:17,914
was still so important.
476
00:24:17,998 --> 00:24:20,834
And I guess that was our point
with the curtain call.
477
00:24:20,917 --> 00:24:23,128
We felt like everybody already knew then.
478
00:24:23,837 --> 00:24:27,257
What was sincerely meant to be
just an innocent act
479
00:24:27,340 --> 00:24:29,050
turned into such controversy.
480
00:24:29,634 --> 00:24:32,762
I felt like, "I don't know,
was I talked into this?"
481
00:24:32,846 --> 00:24:33,930
"Was I not?"
482
00:24:34,014 --> 00:24:35,348
You know, I let it happen.
483
00:24:35,432 --> 00:24:38,351
At the same time,
I can't let it happen again.
484
00:24:38,435 --> 00:24:41,062
So, um, there were some repercussions.
485
00:24:41,646 --> 00:24:47,110
[Levesque] Kev's gone, Scott's gone,
Shawn's WWE champion.
486
00:24:47,194 --> 00:24:48,403
[scoffs]
487
00:24:48,487 --> 00:24:50,113
Heads are gonna roll,
488
00:24:50,197 --> 00:24:53,992
but it's gonna only be one,
and it's going to be mine.
489
00:24:54,075 --> 00:24:56,244
Somebody has to pay for that,
490
00:24:56,328 --> 00:24:59,206
and, you know,
in that particular case, it was Hunter.
491
00:25:00,123 --> 00:25:03,084
[Levesque] So, at that point in time,
I was supposed to win King of the Ring,
492
00:25:03,168 --> 00:25:05,086
and that's all gonna go away.
493
00:25:05,170 --> 00:25:09,090
I said, "You know, Vince,
the one thing that's crazy to me..."
494
00:25:09,174 --> 00:25:10,091
[crowd cheering]
495
00:25:10,175 --> 00:25:15,055
"...the biggest reaction of the night
by far was that moment."
496
00:25:15,138 --> 00:25:17,224
"The world is changing,
497
00:25:17,307 --> 00:25:19,893
and we're going to have
to change with it, I think."
498
00:25:19,976 --> 00:25:22,687
And he said,
"Yeah, but it's not right now."
499
00:25:23,230 --> 00:25:26,024
"I gotta do something.
I can't just let this go."
500
00:25:26,107 --> 00:25:28,985
And to quote Vince,
"You're going to have to learn to eat shit
501
00:25:29,069 --> 00:25:30,320
and like the taste of it."
502
00:25:31,238 --> 00:25:36,076
Vince was not yet ready to adapt,
to evolve into the modern age.
503
00:25:36,159 --> 00:25:38,161
But WCW was.
504
00:25:38,245 --> 00:25:41,081
[hard rock music playing]
505
00:25:41,164 --> 00:25:44,251
[Bischoff] Welcome back live
to the first hour of this edition
506
00:25:44,334 --> 00:25:46,336
of WCW Monday Nitro on TNT.
507
00:25:46,419 --> 00:25:49,172
I'd been thinking about this storyline
in my head for a long time.
508
00:25:49,256 --> 00:25:50,966
Called it "The Outsiders."
509
00:25:51,049 --> 00:25:53,802
But I couldn't quite make it work
the way I wanted to make it work
510
00:25:53,885 --> 00:25:55,595
because I didn't have the right talent.
511
00:25:56,721 --> 00:26:00,642
And now with Scott coming in
and Kevin Nash becoming available,
512
00:26:00,725 --> 00:26:02,936
I now have the perfect cast.
513
00:26:03,019 --> 00:26:06,648
You people, you know who I am.
514
00:26:06,731 --> 00:26:09,442
[crowd cheering]
515
00:26:09,526 --> 00:26:13,613
But you don't know why I'm here.
516
00:26:13,697 --> 00:26:19,619
It was two guys coming in from the outside
to wreak havoc inside of WCW.
517
00:26:20,287 --> 00:26:22,581
This is where the big boys play, huh?
518
00:26:22,664 --> 00:26:23,999
[crowd cheering]
519
00:26:24,082 --> 00:26:25,667
We ain't here to play.
520
00:26:26,751 --> 00:26:30,297
[Cody Rhodes] The Outsiders
showing up and coming to WCW
521
00:26:30,380 --> 00:26:32,549
is maybe the last example
522
00:26:32,632 --> 00:26:35,427
of where fans could not fully tell,
523
00:26:35,510 --> 00:26:37,220
"Is this real?"
524
00:26:38,138 --> 00:26:42,434
[Bischoff] The way I brought them in,
some of the less-than-nuanced dialogue,
525
00:26:42,517 --> 00:26:46,980
led certain people to believe
that they were there on WWE's behalf.
526
00:26:47,063 --> 00:26:50,609
Do you work for the WWE?
527
00:26:50,692 --> 00:26:54,487
The audience wasn't sure
if it was real or if it was scripted.
528
00:26:54,571 --> 00:26:56,156
That's the sweet spot.
529
00:26:56,239 --> 00:26:58,366
You don't jack us around. Don't jack us...
530
00:26:58,450 --> 00:27:01,077
-[announcer] Oh, for crying... Oh!
-[crowd exclaiming]
531
00:27:01,161 --> 00:27:02,162
What are they doing?
532
00:27:02,245 --> 00:27:04,831
-Security!
-[announcer 2] Get up there right now!
533
00:27:04,914 --> 00:27:07,751
[crowd screaming]
534
00:27:07,834 --> 00:27:09,461
[announcer 1] Call security!
535
00:27:10,086 --> 00:27:12,088
[Bischoff] It was a hell of a great idea.
536
00:27:12,172 --> 00:27:14,924
Worked so well that Vince McMahon
decided he had to sue us.
537
00:27:15,800 --> 00:27:21,431
[McMahon] We sued them because they were
trampling on our intellectual property.
538
00:27:21,514 --> 00:27:24,351
[Prichard] They were presenting Scott Hall
as Razor Ramon.
539
00:27:24,434 --> 00:27:27,228
They didn't say his name was Razor Ramon,
540
00:27:27,812 --> 00:27:30,190
but it was as close to Razor Ramon
as you could get
541
00:27:30,273 --> 00:27:32,651
without saying, "Hey, Razor Ramon."
542
00:27:33,151 --> 00:27:34,319
You're stealing.
543
00:27:34,402 --> 00:27:37,697
You know, that's...
That's not the right way to do business.
544
00:27:38,406 --> 00:27:41,576
Eh, stealing is in the eye
of the beholder, isn't it?
545
00:27:41,660 --> 00:27:46,831
It's funny, because immediately,
Vince went into sympathetic babyface mode.
546
00:27:46,915 --> 00:27:49,626
He started whining
like a little schoolgirl with that.
547
00:27:49,709 --> 00:27:52,462
"Big bad billionaire Ted's
trying to run us out of business."
548
00:27:52,545 --> 00:27:56,424
When you have the resources
of a, uh, of a Ted Turner,
549
00:27:56,508 --> 00:27:59,678
and you use these resources
in a predatory fashion
550
00:27:59,761 --> 00:28:04,099
in an effort to put
a family-owned business out of action,
551
00:28:04,182 --> 00:28:05,141
I think it's time...
552
00:28:05,225 --> 00:28:07,310
[Bischoff] "Big bad billionaire Ted
553
00:28:07,394 --> 00:28:11,106
is trying to hurt this
small little family-run business."
554
00:28:11,189 --> 00:28:13,983
There has been a systematic, uh, attempt
555
00:28:14,067 --> 00:28:17,529
to raid the World Wrestling Entertainment
of its talent.
556
00:28:17,612 --> 00:28:19,072
"They raided our talent."
557
00:28:20,365 --> 00:28:23,827
Vince did the exact same thing
to Verne Gagne and the AWA
558
00:28:23,910 --> 00:28:24,911
and other territories.
559
00:28:24,994 --> 00:28:30,041
{\an8}He literally went into those territories
and offered their talent better deals.
560
00:28:30,125 --> 00:28:34,421
That is exactly the MO
of Vince McMahon in 1984 and 1985.
561
00:28:34,504 --> 00:28:37,841
He took stars other people had created
in certain parts of the country
562
00:28:37,924 --> 00:28:40,135
and signed them up for more money,
563
00:28:40,218 --> 00:28:42,429
and God bless him, he had the right to.
Free enterprise.
564
00:28:42,512 --> 00:28:45,432
But they had the right to do it too,
because it's free enterprise.
565
00:28:45,515 --> 00:28:49,394
[interviewer] One of your quotes was that
Turner engaged in predatory practices.
566
00:28:49,477 --> 00:28:50,729
-Right.
-[interviewer] Did you...
567
00:28:50,812 --> 00:28:55,400
You didn't see any similarity
to what you were doing in the territories?
568
00:28:55,483 --> 00:28:58,069
No. Again, Ted's philosophy was,
569
00:28:58,153 --> 00:29:00,405
"Let's go hurt.
I'm gonna hurt my competitor."
570
00:29:00,488 --> 00:29:03,575
And that's not mine. I wanna go compete.
571
00:29:03,658 --> 00:29:06,745
[interviewer] You didn't look at
what Ted was doing as competing?
572
00:29:06,828 --> 00:29:07,871
Sure, I did.
573
00:29:07,954 --> 00:29:09,456
[intriguing music playing]
574
00:29:09,539 --> 00:29:12,125
[interviewer] You said your philosophy
is different than Ted's.
575
00:29:12,208 --> 00:29:14,502
-He's trying to hurt the person.
-Right. Correct.
576
00:29:15,879 --> 00:29:18,381
Some would think it might be hypocritical
for me to say,
577
00:29:18,465 --> 00:29:22,385
"Uh, okay, I don't hurt someone else.
I just do what's best for me."
578
00:29:23,011 --> 00:29:26,681
Yet, when someone comes after me,
I don't think they have the right.
579
00:29:26,765 --> 00:29:29,893
Sure, they have the right.
Again, what I say a lot of times
580
00:29:29,976 --> 00:29:32,270
is totally different than what I think.
581
00:29:32,353 --> 00:29:36,441
Um, and the public
doesn't understand that sometimes.
582
00:29:36,524 --> 00:29:40,153
As a businessman,
you have to throw things out there.
583
00:29:40,236 --> 00:29:42,405
It's not really the way you feel,
584
00:29:42,489 --> 00:29:43,490
but...
585
00:29:44,491 --> 00:29:47,744
it controls thought process by doing that.
586
00:29:48,661 --> 00:29:50,288
[atmospheric music playing]
587
00:29:50,371 --> 00:29:52,791
[Prichard] Vince is going to do
whatever it takes
588
00:29:52,874 --> 00:29:55,376
to be successful on the business side.
589
00:29:55,960 --> 00:30:02,133
And during the Monday Night Wars,
WCW was challenging us to fight.
590
00:30:03,134 --> 00:30:08,640
A lot of people would tell you
that when Hall and Nash went to WCW,
591
00:30:08,723 --> 00:30:11,100
that that was the turning point.
592
00:30:11,184 --> 00:30:13,812
But if you go back
and you really look at the numbers
593
00:30:13,895 --> 00:30:15,563
and you look at everything that happened,
594
00:30:15,647 --> 00:30:19,734
what really turned the corner for WCW
595
00:30:19,818 --> 00:30:21,152
was the Bash at the Beach,
596
00:30:21,236 --> 00:30:25,615
where The Outsiders
were going to bring in the third member.
597
00:30:25,698 --> 00:30:26,783
Who's it going to be?
598
00:30:27,742 --> 00:30:30,245
[Rhodes] I was there
at the Bash at the Beach,
599
00:30:30,328 --> 00:30:34,457
and Scott Hall and Kevin Nash
have come from WWE
600
00:30:34,541 --> 00:30:36,292
to almost wreck shop.
601
00:30:36,376 --> 00:30:38,711
They were bad guys on this mission,
602
00:30:38,795 --> 00:30:42,298
and they were claiming
that they had a third man.
603
00:30:42,382 --> 00:30:45,093
He's here, and he's ready.
604
00:30:45,176 --> 00:30:49,264
Now the "Who's the Third Man?" mystery
is out there in the audience, right?
605
00:30:49,347 --> 00:30:52,350
[Bischoff] The third man is here,
but he's not in the ring.
606
00:30:52,433 --> 00:30:54,561
-[groans]
-[thud]
607
00:30:54,644 --> 00:30:57,355
[announcer] Now we're looking
at two-on-two in this hostile takeover.
608
00:30:57,438 --> 00:31:00,316
[Bischoff] Scott Hall
and Kevin Nash were winning.
609
00:31:00,400 --> 00:31:01,693
[crowd cheering]
610
00:31:01,776 --> 00:31:05,196
And so, Hulk Hogan's coming out
to make the save.
611
00:31:05,280 --> 00:31:07,824
-[announcer 1] Hulk Hogan is here!
-[announcer 2] Damn right he is!
612
00:31:07,907 --> 00:31:09,200
[announcer 1] Get 'em, Hulkster!
613
00:31:09,284 --> 00:31:11,703
[Bollea] When I walked out
at Bash at the Beach,
614
00:31:11,786 --> 00:31:13,580
Kevin Nash and Scott Hall
ran for their lives,
615
00:31:13,663 --> 00:31:16,249
[announcer 1] Yes, sir! Get 'em, Hogan!
616
00:31:16,332 --> 00:31:19,919
The roof was coming off.
The hero was coming to save the day.
617
00:31:20,003 --> 00:31:22,714
[announcer 1] Hulk Hogan arrives... Hulk!
618
00:31:22,797 --> 00:31:24,382
[announcer 2] What's he doing?!
619
00:31:24,465 --> 00:31:26,551
-Is he the third man?
-[announcer 1] Third man!
620
00:31:26,634 --> 00:31:28,678
[announcer 2] What the hell is going on?!
621
00:31:28,761 --> 00:31:32,223
When Hulk finally
dropped the leg on Randy Savage,
622
00:31:32,307 --> 00:31:34,934
people were literally shocked.
623
00:31:35,018 --> 00:31:37,520
-[announcer 2] What the hell is going on?!
-[announcer 1] Oh God!
624
00:31:37,604 --> 00:31:41,733
[Rhodes] It was a huge defining moment
in all of sports entertainment,
625
00:31:41,816 --> 00:31:46,487
because it was surreal to think
that the biggest babyface,
626
00:31:46,571 --> 00:31:50,033
the biggest good guy
in the history of the industry,
627
00:31:50,617 --> 00:31:52,493
is gonna go the other way.
628
00:31:52,577 --> 00:31:53,953
[announcer 1] Feels it all.
629
00:31:54,037 --> 00:31:55,997
[announcer 2]
Hulksters with tears rolling down.
630
00:31:56,080 --> 00:31:59,709
You can't turn Hulk Hogan bad.
You can't do that.
631
00:32:00,627 --> 00:32:04,005
That was a big "holy shit" moment.
632
00:32:04,088 --> 00:32:07,300
-[announcer 1] A career of a lifetime.
-[announcer 2] Right down the drain, kid.
633
00:32:07,383 --> 00:32:10,053
[Bollea] When I walked out
to be a bad guy,
634
00:32:10,136 --> 00:32:12,847
I knew this was either gonna be
the greatest moment of my career
635
00:32:12,931 --> 00:32:14,807
or this would destroy my career.
636
00:32:16,309 --> 00:32:20,688
That's the first time I'd ever been told
there's a thing that's too much heat.
637
00:32:20,772 --> 00:32:22,190
And maybe this was.
638
00:32:22,273 --> 00:32:23,316
[crowd clamoring]
639
00:32:23,399 --> 00:32:26,694
[Bollea] That rumble was there.
It got kinda quiet. I'm like, "Shit."
640
00:32:26,778 --> 00:32:29,238
I know we didn't have anybody
watching the ring
641
00:32:29,322 --> 00:32:31,240
in case they started coming.
642
00:32:31,324 --> 00:32:33,368
Back in the day,
I was used to them coming.
643
00:32:34,160 --> 00:32:38,331
{\an8}[announcer 1] What do we got here?
We got a fan coming in.
644
00:32:38,414 --> 00:32:39,999
[announcer 2] He didn't last long.
645
00:32:40,083 --> 00:32:43,753
There were people throwing stuff
in the ring and booing and screaming.
646
00:32:43,836 --> 00:32:45,546
There were people crying.
647
00:32:45,630 --> 00:32:48,466
[announcer 1] I never thought I'd see
people throwing debris...
648
00:32:48,549 --> 00:32:50,635
-[announcer 2] At Hulk Hogan.
-[announcer 1] ...at Hogan.
649
00:32:50,718 --> 00:32:53,179
It was the most amazing moment
of my career.
650
00:32:53,262 --> 00:32:56,474
[Rhodes] When you want to get
everything you can out of the audience,
651
00:32:56,557 --> 00:32:58,768
sometimes it's gotta be uncomfortable.
652
00:32:59,435 --> 00:33:04,732
And it was just a very strong
punch to the gut for wrestling fans.
653
00:33:04,816 --> 00:33:07,235
[interviewer] When they made Hogan a heel,
654
00:33:07,318 --> 00:33:10,029
had that been something
you guys were considering ever?
655
00:33:10,113 --> 00:33:12,407
No. Terry and I always thought
656
00:33:12,490 --> 00:33:14,993
that we would simply
keep Hulk Hogan as a good guy,
657
00:33:15,076 --> 00:33:17,704
always be someone standing up for justice.
658
00:33:19,205 --> 00:33:22,709
Vince McMahon missed out
on the most lucrative opportunity.
659
00:33:22,792 --> 00:33:25,586
He could've been the one
to turn Hulk Hogan heel.
660
00:33:26,504 --> 00:33:28,715
Every piece of trash
that got thrown in the ring
661
00:33:28,798 --> 00:33:32,760
was like a gold brick
as far as WCW was concerned.
662
00:33:33,553 --> 00:33:38,474
When he did turn heel, it was like, "Wow."
He did that very well.
663
00:33:38,558 --> 00:33:41,352
A lot of fans forget that I was a bad guy
664
00:33:41,436 --> 00:33:44,731
when I first went to the WWE
to work for Vince's father,
665
00:33:44,814 --> 00:33:47,734
so it wasn't like
this was my first barbecue.
666
00:33:47,817 --> 00:33:52,405
And so I just slid into that
Snidely Whiplash evil Hollywood character.
667
00:33:52,488 --> 00:33:55,908
Tell these people to shut up
if you wanna hear what I gotta say.
668
00:33:55,992 --> 00:33:57,285
[crowd yelling]
669
00:33:57,368 --> 00:33:59,829
I went out there, and I wheeled
that promo from my hip, man.
670
00:33:59,912 --> 00:34:01,706
That was nobody talking but me.
671
00:34:02,457 --> 00:34:08,588
These two men right here came from
a great big organization up north.
672
00:34:08,671 --> 00:34:11,549
I made that organization a monster.
673
00:34:11,632 --> 00:34:13,926
I made people rich up there.
674
00:34:14,010 --> 00:34:16,637
[Bollea] I wanted
to push hard against Vince
675
00:34:16,721 --> 00:34:19,724
to prove a point that
it takes two to tango.
676
00:34:19,807 --> 00:34:24,145
It just wasn't one guy that did all this.
It just wasn't Vince that did all this.
677
00:34:24,228 --> 00:34:29,817
The man Hulk Hogan got bigger
than the whole organization, brother.
678
00:34:29,901 --> 00:34:32,612
[McMahon] In those days,
it was a personal relationship
679
00:34:32,695 --> 00:34:34,489
as well as a business one.
680
00:34:35,198 --> 00:34:38,159
And when business goes wrong,
generally speaking,
681
00:34:38,242 --> 00:34:40,203
the personal relationship goes wrong.
682
00:34:40,286 --> 00:34:43,331
Vince is very much "business is business."
683
00:34:43,414 --> 00:34:50,088
However, there are certain times
where the human being gets hurt.
684
00:34:50,171 --> 00:34:52,840
With Hogan, it was personal.
685
00:34:52,924 --> 00:34:55,051
That was the moment in time that...
686
00:34:56,010 --> 00:34:57,178
shit changed.
687
00:34:57,261 --> 00:35:03,643
You can call this
the New World Order of Wrestling, brother.
688
00:35:03,726 --> 00:35:06,729
The Outsiders
eventually became the nWo storyline.
689
00:35:06,813 --> 00:35:10,441
Here's the nWo!
690
00:35:10,525 --> 00:35:12,610
Ready or not, here we come!
691
00:35:12,693 --> 00:35:13,653
[tense music plays]
692
00:35:13,736 --> 00:35:17,156
[Bischoff] nWo was coming in
to take over WCW
693
00:35:17,240 --> 00:35:21,452
and take all their biggest stars,
and eventually overcome WCW.
694
00:35:21,536 --> 00:35:25,748
The nWo is the only way to go!
695
00:35:25,832 --> 00:35:28,960
Yes, it was a storyline.
Yes, they were characters.
696
00:35:29,043 --> 00:35:31,254
But in every sense of the word,
697
00:35:31,337 --> 00:35:36,217
the nWo brand was in many respects
more powerful than the WCW brand.
698
00:35:36,926 --> 00:35:39,679
[Rhodes] During that period of time,
WCW was cool.
699
00:35:39,762 --> 00:35:41,973
It had the cool factor going on.
700
00:35:42,056 --> 00:35:45,143
I started to see the WWE as "less than."
701
00:35:45,226 --> 00:35:50,106
[Calaway] New World Order. It was edgy,
like nothing that anyone had ever seen.
702
00:35:50,189 --> 00:35:53,609
And they started kicking our ass
week after week after week.
703
00:35:54,193 --> 00:35:55,945
[Prichard] When Hulk became a bad guy?
704
00:35:56,028 --> 00:35:57,238
[whooshes]
705
00:35:58,197 --> 00:35:59,031
Switched.
706
00:36:00,199 --> 00:36:04,036
And they beat us in the ratings,
and they didn't look back for 83 weeks.
707
00:36:04,120 --> 00:36:06,289
How many weeks? 83 straight weeks!
708
00:36:06,372 --> 00:36:07,748
For 83 straight weeks!
709
00:36:07,832 --> 00:36:10,918
For 83 weeks? Was it 83, or was it 84?
710
00:36:11,002 --> 00:36:12,712
My podcast is called 83 Weeks.
711
00:36:12,795 --> 00:36:18,009
For 83 straight weeks,
we were stomping a mudhole in WWE.
712
00:36:18,092 --> 00:36:20,178
We were so far ahead of them,
it wasn't funny.
713
00:36:21,095 --> 00:36:25,099
{\an8}For us to be winning,
you know, week after week after week,
714
00:36:25,183 --> 00:36:26,392
{\an8}it became infectious.
715
00:36:26,475 --> 00:36:30,438
We thought we had the strongest team,
the better stories...
716
00:36:31,022 --> 00:36:32,440
No way we thought we could lose.
717
00:36:33,149 --> 00:36:36,235
Not only are they kicking our butts
in the ratings, they're mocking us.
718
00:36:36,319 --> 00:36:38,988
They're really having their way with us.
719
00:36:39,572 --> 00:36:44,327
This was a war, and I didn't know
whether or not we'd even stay in business,
720
00:36:44,410 --> 00:36:46,996
because Turner was coming after us.
721
00:36:47,079 --> 00:36:49,540
I'm either all the way in,
or I'm all the way out.
722
00:36:50,416 --> 00:36:54,212
So, once we committed
to go after Vince, I was all in.
723
00:36:54,295 --> 00:36:56,547
Is there any question now
724
00:36:56,631 --> 00:37:01,928
what is the most powerful organization
in professional wrestling?
725
00:37:02,011 --> 00:37:06,098
At some point, it was suggested to me
that I become a part of the nWo,
726
00:37:06,182 --> 00:37:07,475
and it... it made sense.
727
00:37:07,558 --> 00:37:08,976
I'm Eric Bischoff!
728
00:37:09,060 --> 00:37:13,981
[Bischoff] Because I was running WCW,
I was recognized as the president of WCW.
729
00:37:14,065 --> 00:37:16,776
-[announcer 1] Bischoff!
-[announcer 2] Look who is leading them!
730
00:37:16,859 --> 00:37:21,656
Who better to take over than the guy
that's actually writing the checks?
731
00:37:21,739 --> 00:37:25,326
For this man, I would do anything.
732
00:37:25,409 --> 00:37:27,328
[Prichard] In the beginning
of Monday Night Wars,
733
00:37:27,411 --> 00:37:30,623
I don't think that Vince
even considered Eric Bischoff.
734
00:37:30,706 --> 00:37:35,169
Vince looked at the Monday Night Wars
as something between Vince and Ted.
735
00:37:35,253 --> 00:37:38,256
When you go back
and you listen to the interviews,
736
00:37:38,339 --> 00:37:40,591
Vince always talked about Ted Turner.
737
00:37:40,675 --> 00:37:42,218
Ted Turner's wrestling organization...
738
00:37:42,301 --> 00:37:44,220
Ted Turner tried
to put him out of business.
739
00:37:44,303 --> 00:37:45,972
Ted Turner this, Ted Turner that.
740
00:37:46,055 --> 00:37:47,306
-Ted Turner...
-Ted Turner...
741
00:37:47,390 --> 00:37:51,143
Ted... Ted... Ted, trying to own
World Wrestling Entertainment.
742
00:37:51,227 --> 00:37:53,813
Was Vince McMahon
going to come out and say,
743
00:37:53,896 --> 00:37:57,108
"Hey, this guy named Eric Bischoff
that's never been a wrestling executive,
744
00:37:57,191 --> 00:38:00,569
has only been in a creative role
for about a year and a half,
745
00:38:00,653 --> 00:38:03,322
is kicking my butt every week
for 83 weeks"?
746
00:38:03,406 --> 00:38:05,825
He wanted the perception of the battle
747
00:38:05,908 --> 00:38:10,121
to be between
Ted Turner the billionaire media mogul
748
00:38:10,204 --> 00:38:12,123
and little old Vince McMahon.
749
00:38:12,206 --> 00:38:15,167
That elevated Vince,
it made him the sympathetic babyface,
750
00:38:15,251 --> 00:38:17,545
which is exactly what Vince wanted.
751
00:38:18,587 --> 00:38:20,298
[interviewer]
Do you remember the first time
752
00:38:20,381 --> 00:38:22,383
hearing about Eric Bischoff?
753
00:38:22,466 --> 00:38:26,178
Um, I didn't know...
Well, actually, I didn't realize this,
754
00:38:26,887 --> 00:38:32,852
{\an8}but years before, Eric had come to WWE
and auditioned as a television announcer.
755
00:38:33,561 --> 00:38:34,979
[interviewer] Who's your hero, Eric?
756
00:38:35,062 --> 00:38:37,481
My hero? Hulk Hogan, absolutely.
757
00:38:37,982 --> 00:38:40,651
The man, the myth, the legend.
758
00:38:40,735 --> 00:38:43,779
And I didn't get the job.
I was very disappointed.
759
00:38:44,363 --> 00:38:47,533
[interviewer] Did you regret
not hiring him when you saw him show up?
760
00:38:47,616 --> 00:38:49,660
-Regret not hiring him?
-[interviewer] Yeah.
761
00:38:49,744 --> 00:38:50,661
Um...
762
00:38:51,662 --> 00:38:53,331
-No.
-[interviewer] You don't regret it?
763
00:38:53,414 --> 00:38:56,667
Um... I don't think I regret
anything in my life.
764
00:38:56,751 --> 00:38:58,919
[crowd cheering]
765
00:38:59,003 --> 00:39:02,381
[McMahon] Eric did everything
he possibly could do, as anyone would,
766
00:39:02,923 --> 00:39:05,760
but everything that they basically did
767
00:39:06,552 --> 00:39:09,138
pretty much was a WWE creation
to begin with,
768
00:39:09,805 --> 00:39:13,893
including when Turner took our talent
that we had created.
769
00:39:15,978 --> 00:39:20,191
At that time,
I wanted to hang on to one of my stars.
770
00:39:20,274 --> 00:39:21,650
So I made a deal with Bret.
771
00:39:21,734 --> 00:39:24,028
He flew up to Calgary,
flew up to my house,
772
00:39:24,111 --> 00:39:27,406
and gave me his offer
of a 20-year contract.
773
00:39:27,490 --> 00:39:32,328
I owe it all to my WWE fans.
I'll be with the WWE forever.
774
00:39:32,411 --> 00:39:34,205
[crowd cheering]
775
00:39:34,288 --> 00:39:37,249
All right! All right!
776
00:39:37,333 --> 00:39:39,668
As soon as I signed, I said,
"This isn't gonna be good."
777
00:39:39,752 --> 00:39:41,379
"Wrong thing ego-wise."
778
00:39:41,462 --> 00:39:44,799
It's a... It was a bad move,
bad business move to try and keep Bret.
779
00:39:44,882 --> 00:39:46,300
"I had to keep Bret."
780
00:39:46,384 --> 00:39:51,097
"No, dumbass Vince, you didn't have to.
Just create new stars, Vince."
781
00:39:51,180 --> 00:39:54,475
So in any event, now there's
a big contract, and it's not working.
782
00:39:54,558 --> 00:39:58,896
So I go to Bret, and I said,
"Bret, look, I can't afford to pay you
783
00:39:58,979 --> 00:40:00,272
what I'm paying you now."
784
00:40:00,356 --> 00:40:04,318
My dad took Bret's contract
and showed Bret where the loopholes were,
785
00:40:04,402 --> 00:40:08,364
and said, "You can use this as leverage
to help negotiate yourself
786
00:40:08,447 --> 00:40:10,449
a much better deal with WCW."
787
00:40:11,992 --> 00:40:16,455
[McMahon] So Bret went for the other guys
and, uh, was paid a lot of money.
788
00:40:16,539 --> 00:40:19,959
[Shane McMahon] Bret Hart happened to be
the WWE champion at the time.
789
00:40:20,042 --> 00:40:23,129
All that my dad expected back was for Bret
790
00:40:23,212 --> 00:40:25,965
to do the right thing business-wise
since he was leaving
791
00:40:26,048 --> 00:40:28,551
and lose to Shawn Michaels.
792
00:40:28,634 --> 00:40:33,097
"You know, Bret, you have the property
around your waist that belonged to WWE."
793
00:40:33,180 --> 00:40:37,017
"It didn't belong to you.
You didn't win it, you were granted that."
794
00:40:37,101 --> 00:40:40,855
"I can't let you go to Turner
with the WWE championship belt."
795
00:40:40,938 --> 00:40:42,356
"That doesn't make any sense."
796
00:40:42,440 --> 00:40:44,233
Bret had different ideas.
797
00:40:44,900 --> 00:40:48,988
[Michaels] Everybody felt like he should
drop the title to somebody before he goes,
798
00:40:49,071 --> 00:40:52,491
and I don't even think
Bret had a problem losing the match.
799
00:40:53,492 --> 00:40:55,286
It was losing it to me.
800
00:40:56,120 --> 00:40:59,165
Shawn was a real dick at that time,
801
00:41:00,166 --> 00:41:01,667
and that's just the truth.
802
00:41:02,251 --> 00:41:07,673
The Bret and Shawn rivalry thing,
it was real and authentic.
803
00:41:07,756 --> 00:41:12,094
Both Bret and I felt that Vince
and the WWE were kind of capitalizing
804
00:41:12,178 --> 00:41:15,389
on this real-life dissension that we had.
805
00:41:15,473 --> 00:41:20,019
Shawn and Bret, two great performers, uh...
were not getting along.
806
00:41:20,686 --> 00:41:23,564
Shawn starting cutting
what we call shooting promos.
807
00:41:23,647 --> 00:41:26,484
They would go off-script
and say something personal.
808
00:41:26,567 --> 00:41:29,570
He stabbed World Wrestling Entertainment
in the back.
809
00:41:29,653 --> 00:41:33,824
Why? For his financial gain.
810
00:41:33,908 --> 00:41:35,284
After a while,
811
00:41:35,367 --> 00:41:37,786
you begin to know what bothers somebody,
812
00:41:37,870 --> 00:41:40,414
and, man, I poked that bear
like nobody's business.
813
00:41:40,498 --> 00:41:43,918
I was... Look, I was such a prick.
814
00:41:44,835 --> 00:41:48,714
[Hart] I came close to punching Shawn
quite a few times.
815
00:41:48,797 --> 00:41:52,801
[Michaels] Even though, lately,
you've had some "sunny" days, my friend...
816
00:41:52,885 --> 00:41:58,057
{\an8}[Hart] Telling on national TV that
I'm banging Sunny, when I'm a married man,
817
00:41:58,140 --> 00:42:01,769
you're crossing a line
where you're messing with my family.
818
00:42:01,852 --> 00:42:06,315
You're messing with me
on a personal level, and it's bullshit.
819
00:42:06,398 --> 00:42:08,901
[interviewer]
What were your thoughts about that?
820
00:42:08,984 --> 00:42:12,321
My thoughts at the time was,
"Well, this is good for television."
821
00:42:12,404 --> 00:42:14,990
{\an8}[announcer] The Survivor Series,
presented live by Milton Bradley...
822
00:42:15,074 --> 00:42:17,535
{\an8}[McMahon] So we had
this last match in Montreal.
823
00:42:18,285 --> 00:42:20,621
{\an8}"Bret, I want you to do the honors
for Shawn tonight,
824
00:42:20,704 --> 00:42:24,291
uh, because we need
someone to replace you."
825
00:42:24,375 --> 00:42:27,086
And Bret said,
"Well, I don't wanna do that."
826
00:42:28,128 --> 00:42:30,005
"Especially in Canada."
827
00:42:30,089 --> 00:42:35,594
There was a... a phone call that happened
with Shawn, myself, and Vince.
828
00:42:36,303 --> 00:42:39,890
Vince said, "Look, Bret's not gonna do it.
He refuses to do it."
829
00:42:39,974 --> 00:42:43,102
I don't remember all the specifics,
but I was the one that was like,
830
00:42:43,185 --> 00:42:45,145
"Fuck that.
If he won't do it, do it for him."
831
00:42:45,980 --> 00:42:48,190
[Michaels] I met Vince
when I was 23 years old.
832
00:42:48,274 --> 00:42:51,110
I've spent more time with him
than I have my own father.
833
00:42:51,193 --> 00:42:54,280
I get emotional about it, 'cause it's... uh...
834
00:42:55,030 --> 00:42:56,991
You know, I put him through a lot.
835
00:42:57,658 --> 00:43:01,704
I was in a bad, bad place
for a lot of years, and he put up with it.
836
00:43:01,787 --> 00:43:05,416
To me, he deserves
something in return for that.
837
00:43:05,499 --> 00:43:07,710
And so, for that, I gave him my loyalty.
838
00:43:07,793 --> 00:43:11,380
All he had to do was look at me
and say, "Shawn, this is what I want,"
839
00:43:11,463 --> 00:43:12,590
and I did it.
840
00:43:13,465 --> 00:43:14,592
[bell ringing]
841
00:43:14,675 --> 00:43:16,844
[Michaels] On that night,
he did not want Bret Hart
842
00:43:16,927 --> 00:43:19,305
walking out of that building
with the championship,
843
00:43:19,388 --> 00:43:20,806
and I made sure that happened.
844
00:43:21,765 --> 00:43:25,477
[Prichard] Day of, I was told
that it was gonna be a schmoz finish.
845
00:43:25,561 --> 00:43:28,147
Everybody was gonna get involved.
We were gonna throw the match out,
846
00:43:28,230 --> 00:43:31,400
and we'd figure out what to do afterwards.
847
00:43:32,067 --> 00:43:35,195
[Hart] A schmoz is a big brawl
with a bunch of different guys,
848
00:43:35,279 --> 00:43:37,156
and the referee just throws it out.
849
00:43:37,239 --> 00:43:40,743
No one really wins or loses,
and it was like, "That works for me."
850
00:43:41,827 --> 00:43:46,206
But WWE had been screwing wrestlers
in different ways for a long time.
851
00:43:46,832 --> 00:43:50,961
I knew about Wendi Richter,
so I didn't trust anything.
852
00:43:51,045 --> 00:43:53,297
Never took my eyes off Shawn.
853
00:43:53,380 --> 00:43:54,965
If he wants to make this a real fight,
854
00:43:55,049 --> 00:43:57,509
we can make it a real fight
anytime he wants to.
855
00:43:57,593 --> 00:43:59,178
I will fight him to the death.
856
00:43:59,261 --> 00:44:01,847
-[announcer 1] Look out!
-[announcer 2] Shawn Michaels is in.
857
00:44:01,930 --> 00:44:04,767
[Hart] If you watch that match,
it's a great match.
858
00:44:04,850 --> 00:44:09,897
[announcer 1] It's a down-and-dirty fight
between guys that hate each other's guts.
859
00:44:09,980 --> 00:44:11,565
[crowd cheering]
860
00:44:11,649 --> 00:44:13,984
[Hart] Eventually,
Shawn puts me in the sharpshooter,
861
00:44:14,068 --> 00:44:16,111
which is my finishing move,
862
00:44:16,195 --> 00:44:17,946
and he, in fact, puts it on wrong.
863
00:44:18,030 --> 00:44:21,033
If you see it,
I correct Shawn while he's doing it,
864
00:44:21,116 --> 00:44:24,995
and he switches it and puts it on right,
and then turns me over,
865
00:44:25,079 --> 00:44:28,957
and I can see the timekeeper,
and I see Vince yell at him.
866
00:44:29,041 --> 00:44:32,544
I'm yelling at the timekeeper,
"Ring the bell, ring the bell."
867
00:44:32,628 --> 00:44:35,089
Even though Bret never tapped out.
868
00:44:35,798 --> 00:44:38,092
And he won't ring it.
He's, like, stunned. He's like...
869
00:44:38,175 --> 00:44:41,762
And then I see Vince snap at him,
"Ring the fucking bell!"
870
00:44:41,845 --> 00:44:44,056
Ring! Ring the bell, ring the bell!
871
00:44:44,139 --> 00:44:46,266
[bell ringing]
872
00:44:46,350 --> 00:44:48,852
[rock music playing]
873
00:44:48,936 --> 00:44:52,815
The bell rings, and I'm screaming
on the headset. "Why'd you ring the bell?"
874
00:44:52,898 --> 00:44:54,692
Oh shit!
875
00:44:55,609 --> 00:44:58,278
And I can feel it.
876
00:44:58,362 --> 00:45:02,157
Everything is coming to me now.
Like, "They did it. They did screw you."
877
00:45:02,783 --> 00:45:07,079
[McMahon] I wanted to be out at ringside
so that he would know what happened,
878
00:45:07,162 --> 00:45:09,873
and I took back what was mine.
879
00:45:09,957 --> 00:45:12,042
Bret obviously didn't like that.
880
00:45:12,126 --> 00:45:14,461
When you have a match
as hard as I was wrestling,
881
00:45:14,545 --> 00:45:16,880
you get a fair bit of froth in your mouth.
882
00:45:17,464 --> 00:45:19,967
I leaned over, and I spit on his face.
883
00:45:20,050 --> 00:45:21,885
I got him bullseye.
884
00:45:23,595 --> 00:45:25,139
[McMahon] Right into my eye.
885
00:45:25,222 --> 00:45:29,309
That was gross, but nonetheless,
I thought, "Damn, how did he do that?"
886
00:45:29,393 --> 00:45:31,228
[crowd clamoring]
887
00:45:31,311 --> 00:45:33,313
[Hart] Then I went out
and broke all the monitors
888
00:45:33,397 --> 00:45:36,191
and smashed all them to pieces
on the floor.
889
00:45:36,275 --> 00:45:37,401
It was just chaos.
890
00:45:38,235 --> 00:45:40,612
Bret writes "WCW" in the air.
891
00:45:41,363 --> 00:45:44,450
[Hart] It's hard for people to imagine
how mad you can get
892
00:45:44,533 --> 00:45:47,119
when you get betrayed like that
on national television
893
00:45:47,202 --> 00:45:49,163
and, in a lot of ways, made a fool of.
894
00:45:49,830 --> 00:45:52,374
My brother Owen was very calming.
895
00:45:53,041 --> 00:45:55,335
He goes, "It wasn't right, what they did.
That was wrong."
896
00:45:55,419 --> 00:45:58,005
"You have all the respect
of everybody in the dressing room."
897
00:45:58,088 --> 00:46:00,257
That kind of stuff. He was very...
898
00:46:00,340 --> 00:46:03,761
[clears throat, voice breaks]
...consoling to me at that time. And...
899
00:46:07,931 --> 00:46:09,141
[exhales emotionally]
900
00:46:09,224 --> 00:46:14,480
{\an8}Fourteen years,
I've given Vince McMahon 100% every night.
901
00:46:14,563 --> 00:46:18,817
I've bled for him, took front turnbuckles
at 100 miles an hour.
902
00:46:18,901 --> 00:46:22,070
I've given him Christmas mornings
with my kids that never happened.
903
00:46:22,154 --> 00:46:25,282
I've never missed a show.
I've given this guy everything I got.
904
00:46:25,365 --> 00:46:28,911
I couldn't have given a man
more than what I gave Vince McMahon.
905
00:46:28,994 --> 00:46:32,331
None of that meant anything when
Vince screwed me that day in Montreal.
906
00:46:32,414 --> 00:46:34,666
[crowd clamoring]
907
00:46:34,750 --> 00:46:38,921
[Hart] When I walk back to that
dressing room, I'm ready to kill him.
908
00:46:39,004 --> 00:46:40,881
Like, kill him. Beat him to death.
909
00:46:40,964 --> 00:46:42,716
Shawn, you weren't in on that?
910
00:46:43,425 --> 00:46:47,471
[Michaels] No fucking idea.
I didn't know, God as my fucking witness.
911
00:46:47,554 --> 00:46:50,557
He came up immediately
and said, "Did you know?"
912
00:46:50,641 --> 00:46:52,726
I said, "Hand to God, I did not."
913
00:46:52,810 --> 00:46:54,728
Vince was so adamant.
914
00:46:54,812 --> 00:46:59,107
We had to absolutely swear
that we knew nothing about this.
915
00:46:59,191 --> 00:47:02,820
He was like, "I don't care who asks you,
you bold-face lie right to them
916
00:47:02,903 --> 00:47:06,114
and say, 'I knew nothing about this.
This was a Vince McMahon call.'"
917
00:47:06,198 --> 00:47:07,699
{\an8}I swear to God, I knew nothing...
918
00:47:07,783 --> 00:47:12,079
{\an8}Yeah, swear to God all you want,
but someday, God is gonna strike you down.
919
00:47:12,162 --> 00:47:16,124
It was chaos in the back,
and people everywhere were freaking out.
920
00:47:16,208 --> 00:47:19,878
Just remember, someday, Hunter,
what goes around comes around.
921
00:47:19,962 --> 00:47:25,467
I remember being just so pissed
that they did things this way.
922
00:47:26,134 --> 00:47:27,803
I think Vince was in a panic mode, like,
923
00:47:27,886 --> 00:47:32,558
"What can I do
to stop this rebellion right now?"
924
00:47:33,809 --> 00:47:39,022
I felt like, in a strange sort of way,
because Bret and I had this relationship,
925
00:47:39,106 --> 00:47:42,317
I felt like I sort of owed Bret something,
926
00:47:42,401 --> 00:47:46,196
uh, because from his standpoint,
I'd double-crossed him.
927
00:47:46,280 --> 00:47:47,656
[man speaking indistinctly]
928
00:47:47,739 --> 00:47:50,617
Vince said, "He's gonna want to hit me,
and I owe him that."
929
00:47:51,285 --> 00:47:54,746
[Levesque] I can picture him
walking in that locker room in Montreal.
930
00:47:54,830 --> 00:47:57,583
Everybody else fired up,
everybody else emotional.
931
00:47:58,417 --> 00:48:01,003
I leave the room, 'cause I don't
wanna watch Vince get punched.
932
00:48:01,837 --> 00:48:04,131
[Calaway] Finally, Bret gets up,
walks across the room.
933
00:48:04,214 --> 00:48:05,841
They all kind of meet.
934
00:48:05,924 --> 00:48:09,720
I walk over to his locker room,
hands down,
935
00:48:09,803 --> 00:48:13,265
and Bret hauls off and,
man, he hit me so hard.
936
00:48:13,348 --> 00:48:14,474
Right in the temple.
937
00:48:14,558 --> 00:48:17,603
There was no, like,
"Vince is gonna give me a shot."
938
00:48:17,686 --> 00:48:21,273
I don't know where they get that story,
because that is such a bunch of bullshit.
939
00:48:21,982 --> 00:48:24,443
It was Vince and me came at each other,
940
00:48:24,526 --> 00:48:27,070
and we actually
tied up like a wrestling match.
941
00:48:27,154 --> 00:48:30,616
Everybody's ready to pounce on me
as soon as we grab each other,
942
00:48:30,699 --> 00:48:33,452
and I remember going,
"The only way I can get a shot in,
943
00:48:33,535 --> 00:48:36,914
one shot, maybe, is an uppercut."
944
00:48:36,997 --> 00:48:40,083
And I came right up between Vince's arms,
945
00:48:40,167 --> 00:48:45,172
and it was like, um... You know when
you hit the bell and the thing goes up?
946
00:48:45,255 --> 00:48:49,384
To this day,
I have no idea how the punch got through.
947
00:48:49,468 --> 00:48:51,303
He was out cold like a starfish.
948
00:48:51,887 --> 00:48:53,597
-Drilled him.
-[Julia] I'm proud of you.
949
00:48:53,680 --> 00:48:54,598
They're over there.
950
00:48:55,223 --> 00:48:58,518
-As hard as I could. Knocked him out.
-[Julia] I'm scared.
951
00:48:58,602 --> 00:49:01,438
Probably the best thing I ever did,
and he deserved every bit.
952
00:49:02,230 --> 00:49:05,108
[Prichard] Vince did get seriously hurt,
I mean... [chuckles]
953
00:49:05,192 --> 00:49:07,653
Vince had, you know, a big, nice shiner.
954
00:49:08,779 --> 00:49:10,906
[McMahon] That night, I'm limping around,
955
00:49:10,989 --> 00:49:15,160
and, like, "Oh my God, stars are
all over the place in terms of my head."
956
00:49:15,243 --> 00:49:16,453
Pretty good concussion.
957
00:49:17,245 --> 00:49:20,874
I felt bad.
I felt bad for Bret. I felt bad for Vince.
958
00:49:20,958 --> 00:49:24,586
Vince didn't wanna do that,
but he had to do what's best for business,
959
00:49:24,670 --> 00:49:27,339
and that's what he's always gonna do.
960
00:49:28,632 --> 00:49:31,843
[McMahon] That was the Montreal Screwjob,
as it was called,
961
00:49:31,927 --> 00:49:35,263
and, to this day,
I don't regret any of it.
962
00:49:36,139 --> 00:49:40,435
Things just got real, and it gave me
a whole different perspective
963
00:49:41,603 --> 00:49:42,771
for the business.
964
00:49:43,897 --> 00:49:46,525
[Levesque] The Montreal Screwjob
was like a moment in time
965
00:49:46,608 --> 00:49:48,902
where you can see the shift.
966
00:49:48,986 --> 00:49:51,697
You know, it's like a land mass moving.
967
00:49:51,780 --> 00:49:53,740
You don't see it,
but then there's a big earthquake
968
00:49:53,824 --> 00:49:55,492
and it moves, and you go, "Ooh, I saw it."
969
00:49:55,575 --> 00:49:57,035
[clamoring]
970
00:49:57,119 --> 00:50:00,288
It, like, shifted,
and there was a... a seismic change.
971
00:50:02,040 --> 00:50:04,042
The real-life event that happened,
972
00:50:04,126 --> 00:50:07,421
the dispute with Bret
and the controversy afterwards,
973
00:50:07,504 --> 00:50:12,676
led to the birth
of a Mr. McMahon character
974
00:50:12,759 --> 00:50:15,804
that became
one of the most hated characters
975
00:50:15,887 --> 00:50:19,182
and most beloved characters of all time.
976
00:50:19,266 --> 00:50:20,851
[crowd cheering]
977
00:50:20,934 --> 00:50:24,688
In the midst of chaos,
a lot of times, genius comes out of it.
978
00:50:24,771 --> 00:50:29,651
Is this the final nail, so to speak,
in World Wrestling Entertainment?
979
00:50:29,735 --> 00:50:32,446
Au contraire. We're just getting started.
980
00:50:32,529 --> 00:50:34,740
[tense music builds and fades]
981
00:50:37,659 --> 00:50:40,746
[closing theme music playing]