1 00:00:02,043 --> 00:00:03,643 [reporter] There have been further shocking developments 2 00:00:03,643 --> 00:00:06,013 in the Mineola Swingers Club Case today. 3 00:00:06,013 --> 00:00:10,743 With defendants Jimmy Sones and Shelia Sones now free after taking plea deals, 4 00:00:10,743 --> 00:00:13,213 the convictions of three of the other defendants 5 00:00:13,213 --> 00:00:15,943 look increasingly likely to be overturned. 6 00:00:16,573 --> 00:00:18,473 [thuds] 7 00:00:18,473 --> 00:00:20,773 {\an8}[Mike] After the lawyers for the Jamie Pittman, 8 00:00:20,773 --> 00:00:24,673 {\an8}and Shauntel Mayo and Patrick Kelly cases filed appeals, 9 00:00:24,673 --> 00:00:28,373 the 14th Court of Appeals threw out those verdicts, 10 00:00:28,373 --> 00:00:31,543 based on numerous evidentiary errors 11 00:00:31,543 --> 00:00:34,313 that the court said that Judge Jack Skeen had made. 12 00:00:34,313 --> 00:00:36,043 And this was something that the defense attorneys 13 00:00:36,043 --> 00:00:38,573 had complained about the whole time, 14 00:00:38,573 --> 00:00:40,513 Skeen seemed to be siding with the state 15 00:00:40,513 --> 00:00:45,413 and he did it to such an extent that the court threw out those verdicts. 16 00:00:47,043 --> 00:00:51,573 He went to all the other defendants and offered them plea bargains. 17 00:00:51,573 --> 00:00:54,213 To plead guilty to injury to a child 18 00:00:55,043 --> 00:00:57,013 and time served so they could get out. 19 00:00:57,013 --> 00:00:58,213 [camera shutter clicks] 20 00:00:58,213 --> 00:01:02,313 [Melinda] But Dennis Pittman still had an appeal pending 21 00:01:02,313 --> 00:01:05,773 and so Dennis wasn't offered the plea bargain. 22 00:01:05,773 --> 00:01:10,313 It was assumed he would get out shortly afterwards, like the others. 23 00:01:10,313 --> 00:01:12,473 - [Melinda] But by then, Patrick Kelly, - [camera shutter clicks] 24 00:01:12,473 --> 00:01:17,643 Jamie Pittman and Shauntel had been in jail for almost four years. 25 00:01:19,113 --> 00:01:23,413 [Mike] Matt Bingham, one of the most law-and-order prosecutors, 26 00:01:24,043 --> 00:01:26,673 makes a deal to let out 27 00:01:26,673 --> 00:01:31,313 a bunch of the most perverted, maniacal, 28 00:01:31,313 --> 00:01:35,943 criminal monsters that had ever struck Texas? 29 00:01:35,943 --> 00:01:40,213 If Matt Bingham really believed that they had done what 30 00:01:40,213 --> 00:01:43,773 he had prosecuted them doing for four years, 31 00:01:43,773 --> 00:01:45,843 do you really think he would have let them go? 32 00:01:45,843 --> 00:01:50,373 Absolutely not. They would be rotting in prison for the rest of their lives. 33 00:01:52,313 --> 00:01:53,373 [theme music playing] 34 00:01:56,113 --> 00:01:59,043 [woman speaking] 35 00:02:02,673 --> 00:02:04,913 [child speaking] 36 00:02:04,913 --> 00:02:06,273 [man speaking] 37 00:02:07,743 --> 00:02:10,143 [boy speaking] 38 00:02:11,413 --> 00:02:15,213 [man speaking] 39 00:02:15,213 --> 00:02:16,513 [girl speaking] 40 00:02:25,573 --> 00:02:28,213 [Reporter] Patrick Kelly, nicknamed Booger Red, 41 00:02:28,213 --> 00:02:32,213 was sentenced to life in prison for his role in the alleged child sex ring. 42 00:02:35,773 --> 00:02:37,943 I was locked up for almost four years. 43 00:02:38,843 --> 00:02:40,313 [Patrick] When I was in prison, 44 00:02:40,313 --> 00:02:43,513 they overturned my case and offered that plea and I accepted it. 45 00:02:46,513 --> 00:02:48,213 I was tired, I wanted to get out. 46 00:02:49,473 --> 00:02:51,143 I wanted to see my family. 47 00:02:51,143 --> 00:02:55,113 I wanted to see my mother. I wanted to see my brother, my wife, my son. 48 00:02:55,113 --> 00:02:57,843 [Patrick] What's up bud? 49 00:02:57,843 --> 00:03:03,013 {\an8}This is my world right here. I will fight a grizzly bear for him. 50 00:03:03,013 --> 00:03:06,043 {\an8}I'm not that good anymore, but I'll still try. 51 00:03:06,043 --> 00:03:08,843 {\an8}I'll give him my best shot that's for damn sure. [laughs] 52 00:03:11,513 --> 00:03:13,943 [Steven] When he actually went to jail and they told me 53 00:03:13,943 --> 00:03:19,313 that's what they're accusing him of and the DA tried to get me to turn against him. 54 00:03:19,313 --> 00:03:21,413 I told them they're crazy 55 00:03:21,413 --> 00:03:23,573 because my dad ain't never done anything like that. 56 00:03:24,643 --> 00:03:26,413 'Cause it... 57 00:03:26,413 --> 00:03:28,913 That was just all made up stuff in their head. 58 00:03:30,843 --> 00:03:33,273 To me, that's the worst thing in the world for you to do, 59 00:03:33,843 --> 00:03:35,413 is to molest a child, 60 00:03:35,413 --> 00:03:38,143 But yet I got convicted on hearsay. 61 00:03:38,143 --> 00:03:42,643 It's what was said, no proof of anything, it's just what was said. 62 00:03:42,643 --> 00:03:45,743 [Patrick] I mean, these people don't even know me, know nothing about me, 63 00:03:45,743 --> 00:03:48,043 just because of my nickname, I was the devil. 64 00:03:49,313 --> 00:03:52,773 For Margie Cantrell to do the things she's done, 65 00:03:52,773 --> 00:03:55,773 to brainwash them kids to say the things they said, 66 00:03:55,773 --> 00:03:58,673 because these kids are going to be traumatized for the rest of their lives. 67 00:03:58,673 --> 00:04:00,413 Margie Cantrell is a monster. 68 00:04:00,913 --> 00:04:02,843 [rooster crowing] 69 00:04:03,373 --> 00:04:07,143 [dog barking] 70 00:04:11,373 --> 00:04:13,643 [rooster crowing] 71 00:04:13,643 --> 00:04:17,043 [Shuantel] This is Margie and John Cantrell 72 00:04:17,043 --> 00:04:20,573 and all of their foster children. And my three children. 73 00:04:21,673 --> 00:04:24,143 {\an8}That woman and that man stole my life. 74 00:04:25,373 --> 00:04:26,943 [camera shutter clicking] 75 00:04:27,413 --> 00:04:28,913 Prison was hard. 76 00:04:30,373 --> 00:04:31,913 I learned how to fight. 77 00:04:32,673 --> 00:04:34,413 I was sexually abused in prison, 78 00:04:36,213 --> 00:04:38,113 by a group of women. 79 00:04:39,673 --> 00:04:41,473 I was very targeted. 80 00:04:42,913 --> 00:04:44,773 There was no reason to live anymore. 81 00:04:46,743 --> 00:04:50,013 But I knew that God wasn't going to leave me there 82 00:04:50,013 --> 00:04:52,413 I didn't know how long it was going to take to get me home. 83 00:04:55,143 --> 00:04:59,313 I filled my time with Bible studies and law books. 84 00:05:00,773 --> 00:05:05,643 In 2011, I could have probably took my bar exam and passed. 85 00:05:06,143 --> 00:05:07,473 That's how hard I worked. 86 00:05:11,113 --> 00:05:12,543 After I got out of prison, 87 00:05:13,043 --> 00:05:14,413 I knew by law, 88 00:05:14,413 --> 00:05:17,843 I would never get to have contact with my kids 89 00:05:17,843 --> 00:05:19,673 until they were 18 and they found me. 90 00:05:20,913 --> 00:05:22,143 It was... it was horrible. 91 00:05:34,473 --> 00:05:36,843 [Hunter] Margie was an attention hog. 92 00:05:36,843 --> 00:05:40,213 Her appearance to the public was important to her. 93 00:05:40,213 --> 00:05:44,273 {\an8}So when we went on outings like this, I remember this is at the zoo. 94 00:05:44,273 --> 00:05:46,143 {\an8}- [camera shutter clicks] - [Hunter] I remember this picture. 95 00:05:47,543 --> 00:05:50,043 {\an8}[Hunter] This was more of just like a show of like, 96 00:05:50,043 --> 00:05:52,213 like "Oh, hey, I got this big happy family." 97 00:05:52,213 --> 00:05:54,413 But it was pretend. 98 00:05:54,413 --> 00:05:58,413 Behind closed doors, this was not true. 99 00:05:58,413 --> 00:06:01,213 The entire time with the Cantrells was 100 00:06:01,213 --> 00:06:03,573 the worst time of my life. 101 00:06:03,573 --> 00:06:05,843 [birds screeching] 102 00:06:12,673 --> 00:06:15,513 [Hunter] Being back here brings back a lot of memories. 103 00:06:15,513 --> 00:06:16,943 [camera shutter clicks] 104 00:06:16,943 --> 00:06:19,373 [Hunter] I was always worried. Always scared. 105 00:06:21,313 --> 00:06:23,373 Margie was just, she was an animal. 106 00:06:25,143 --> 00:06:29,213 [Carly] The back scratcher was the main punishment for everything. 107 00:06:31,573 --> 00:06:33,273 They would pull your pants down, 108 00:06:34,313 --> 00:06:36,213 {\an8}whoop you with that, we'd have welts 109 00:06:36,213 --> 00:06:38,843 {\an8}on our backs and everything. 110 00:06:40,673 --> 00:06:42,473 {\an8}And you weren't allowed to cry. 111 00:06:42,473 --> 00:06:44,943 {\an8}If you cried, you got whupped again. 112 00:06:51,543 --> 00:06:54,943 [Hunter] Making Margie angry was as simple as 113 00:06:55,413 --> 00:06:56,843 taking a cookie, 114 00:06:56,843 --> 00:06:59,113 just 'cause you didn't ask permission for it. 115 00:06:59,113 --> 00:07:01,673 [Carly] Or going outside without permission. 116 00:07:01,673 --> 00:07:03,743 [Hunter] Or talking to the neighbors without permission. 117 00:07:03,743 --> 00:07:07,573 It was everything, you know, we... we couldn't be kids. 118 00:07:07,573 --> 00:07:08,543 We weren't allowed to. 119 00:07:12,313 --> 00:07:15,673 I remember the time whenever I'd used all the blankets in the closet 120 00:07:15,673 --> 00:07:19,273 she had repeatedly bashed my head into the doorframe, 121 00:07:19,273 --> 00:07:21,773 she used to drag us across the floor downstairs. 122 00:07:26,213 --> 00:07:27,843 [Carly] I think the worst thing that happened to me 123 00:07:27,843 --> 00:07:30,413 was when my head got slammed into the tile floor. 124 00:07:32,843 --> 00:07:34,643 It was right around here. 125 00:07:38,413 --> 00:07:42,673 I ran away and she was yelling and stuff about me leaving. 126 00:07:44,113 --> 00:07:46,143 She ended up slamming my head. 127 00:07:46,143 --> 00:07:48,843 I was on my knees and she ended up slamming my head. 128 00:07:51,313 --> 00:07:58,943 [Hunter] I was downstairs and I heard the crash on the tile and I ran upstairs, 129 00:07:58,943 --> 00:08:01,673 and I saw Carly on the ground, 130 00:08:03,643 --> 00:08:05,113 it really set me off. 131 00:08:06,273 --> 00:08:07,573 It was just something you didn't do. 132 00:08:07,573 --> 00:08:09,573 You didn't put your hands on my sisters, no matter what you did. 133 00:08:13,013 --> 00:08:14,743 [Margie] Carly's never been struck. 134 00:08:14,743 --> 00:08:18,213 Carly has never had a spank and a swat, nothing, ever. 135 00:08:18,643 --> 00:08:19,773 Hunter was. 136 00:08:19,773 --> 00:08:21,513 Not by the back scratcher. 137 00:08:21,513 --> 00:08:24,773 I can sit here and say, "Oh, no, no, no, never." No, no I did. 138 00:08:28,943 --> 00:08:32,773 I slapped him a few times. I popped him in the mouth a few times. 139 00:08:51,843 --> 00:08:56,473 Not long after that, a hearing was held in family court in Tyler. 140 00:08:56,473 --> 00:08:59,573 {\an8}Finally, the world's gonna see who these people really are. 141 00:09:01,213 --> 00:09:04,013 {\an8}[Female reporter] Our top is about the hearing that took place today 142 00:09:04,013 --> 00:09:06,143 {\an8}regarding the welfare of the foster children 143 00:09:06,143 --> 00:09:09,273 {\an8}currently in the care of John and Margie Cantrell. 144 00:09:09,273 --> 00:09:13,143 Those children were the victims of the Mineola Sex ring trials. 145 00:09:13,143 --> 00:09:16,143 Representatives from Child Protective Services and attorneys 146 00:09:16,143 --> 00:09:19,573 were in court to hear the judges remarks about what to do with the children 147 00:09:19,573 --> 00:09:22,113 currently in the Cantrell's home. 148 00:09:22,113 --> 00:09:25,013 [male reporter] The allegations of abuse came from multiple children. 149 00:09:25,013 --> 00:09:29,043 One child alleged being beaten with a wooden back scratcher until it snapped 150 00:09:29,043 --> 00:09:33,043 And another alleged that Margie Cantrell popped her in the mouth and slapped her. 151 00:09:37,313 --> 00:09:40,773 {\an8}[Judge speaking] 152 00:09:48,573 --> 00:09:54,673 {\an8}The children were ultimately removed from Margie and John, um because of physical abuse 153 00:09:54,673 --> 00:09:56,843 {\an8}[judge speaking] 154 00:10:05,773 --> 00:10:08,573 They didn't make that choice. I made that choice. 155 00:10:08,573 --> 00:10:13,473 Like they said, um, "These are her kids. She can relinquish them." 156 00:10:13,473 --> 00:10:17,843 And I chose to relinquish the conservatorship. 157 00:10:19,543 --> 00:10:21,673 [male reporter] Also in the courtroom was Shauntel Mayo, 158 00:10:21,673 --> 00:10:24,313 herself a defendant in the Mineola Swingers Club case 159 00:10:24,313 --> 00:10:27,773 and the mother of three children removed today from the Cantrell household. 160 00:10:29,573 --> 00:10:32,043 My heart's relieved, 161 00:10:32,043 --> 00:10:36,143 because they've known before my kids were put in there. 162 00:10:36,143 --> 00:10:38,313 They took them out of a good loving home, 163 00:10:38,313 --> 00:10:42,673 granted there was issues in our home, but it wasn't issues that was accused of. 164 00:10:44,313 --> 00:10:48,213 And put them into a worse situation for nine years, they've been abused. 165 00:10:48,213 --> 00:10:49,513 - So that's not true. - [indistinct chatter] 166 00:10:49,513 --> 00:10:54,013 and this is the lies they were spreading in the news about us. 167 00:10:54,013 --> 00:10:56,013 [male reporter] Throughout the Swingers Club Sex Ring Trial, 168 00:10:56,013 --> 00:10:58,473 foster mother Margaret Cantrell was instrumental 169 00:10:58,473 --> 00:11:01,843 instrumental in exposing the alleged abuse in Mineola and Tyler. 170 00:11:01,843 --> 00:11:04,913 However with these fresh accusations about her own conduct, 171 00:11:04,913 --> 00:11:08,373 the credibility of some of her statements has come into question. 172 00:11:08,373 --> 00:11:12,413 I believe, uh, from looking at that, 173 00:11:12,413 --> 00:11:16,213 that, uh, we were played in the media. 174 00:11:16,213 --> 00:11:21,213 To take innocent people and start slamming them is disgusting. 175 00:11:21,213 --> 00:11:22,843 {\an8}I think, over a course of time, 176 00:11:22,843 --> 00:11:26,573 {\an8}we might be seeing very interesting statements from these kids 177 00:11:26,573 --> 00:11:28,673 {\an8}about what actually happened to them. 178 00:11:28,673 --> 00:11:33,043 It's Thad Davidson, just pushing it and pushing it and pushing it. 179 00:11:33,043 --> 00:11:38,143 "If we can ever get the children away from Margie Cantrell's custody, 180 00:11:38,143 --> 00:11:41,673 we can get them to tell the truth." 181 00:11:41,673 --> 00:11:44,273 - Would you guys like to say anything? - No. 182 00:11:44,273 --> 00:11:46,543 - No, I don't think it's proper. - Nah. 183 00:11:46,543 --> 00:11:50,543 What do you think about these allegations that are being made against you? 184 00:11:50,543 --> 00:11:53,473 We don't even know most of them yet. [laughs] 185 00:11:55,043 --> 00:11:57,843 - [lawyer] Margaret! Don't talk to him. Go. - Yes, Ma'am. 186 00:11:57,843 --> 00:11:58,943 Yes, Ma'am. 187 00:11:58,943 --> 00:12:01,273 - No. - Go, hurry up. 188 00:12:01,773 --> 00:12:03,143 [lawyer] Go. 189 00:12:04,013 --> 00:12:05,773 [reporter] Would you like to say anything... 190 00:12:06,773 --> 00:12:10,743 We decided that the best thing, is to go back home. 191 00:12:11,843 --> 00:12:14,213 Home was always Vacaville, 192 00:12:15,773 --> 00:12:18,943 where we were loved, where people knew us, knew what we were like 193 00:12:21,043 --> 00:12:23,043 And it would be better. 194 00:12:24,043 --> 00:12:25,843 Yes, it was a dream home. 195 00:12:27,643 --> 00:12:32,673 But we loaded what we could load in a U-Haul and a trailer behind it. 196 00:12:32,673 --> 00:12:34,743 And everything else that we ever owned, 197 00:12:36,043 --> 00:12:38,043 was left behind. We locked the door, 198 00:12:39,673 --> 00:12:40,743 and we drove away. 199 00:12:52,673 --> 00:12:54,013 [camera shutter clicks] 200 00:12:54,013 --> 00:12:57,913 [Hunter] When they came to get us, I felt like it's about time. 201 00:12:57,913 --> 00:13:01,143 It had been so many years dealing with her 202 00:13:01,143 --> 00:13:04,673 it was just a major, major feeling of relief to get out of here. 203 00:13:17,773 --> 00:13:20,513 I was having a lot of issues with 204 00:13:21,143 --> 00:13:22,743 my adopted parents. 205 00:13:23,343 --> 00:13:24,873 We were not seeing eye to eye. 206 00:13:24,873 --> 00:13:27,773 And so I was you know like, "What can I do?" 207 00:13:27,773 --> 00:13:29,873 And then I thought about it, and I was like, 208 00:13:29,873 --> 00:13:32,573 "Well, I... I can look up my dad." 209 00:13:33,673 --> 00:13:37,613 And I got the idea to look him up on Facebook. 210 00:13:37,613 --> 00:13:41,613 We wasn't allowed to have any type of contact with Gabby. 211 00:13:41,613 --> 00:13:44,143 Uh, she would had to been eighteen years old before 212 00:13:44,143 --> 00:13:46,513 we were supposed to have contact with her. 213 00:13:46,513 --> 00:13:50,213 I got a Facebook page and all that stuff and I posted a lot of stuff in there, 214 00:13:50,213 --> 00:13:55,613 pictures and stuff of Gabby. And I left it open to the public. 215 00:13:55,613 --> 00:13:58,613 [Gabby] And that's how I found him and then I contacted him. 216 00:13:59,313 --> 00:14:01,473 She gave me her phone number. 217 00:14:01,473 --> 00:14:05,043 I called her and the next day her and her boyfriend come out to visit. 218 00:14:05,873 --> 00:14:07,513 As soon as I got out of the car, 219 00:14:07,513 --> 00:14:09,213 tears were running down my eyes 220 00:14:10,513 --> 00:14:12,113 and I just embraced her. 221 00:14:13,143 --> 00:14:15,573 I don't even know how long we stood there hugging. 222 00:14:15,573 --> 00:14:19,513 It was a happy, very happy emotional day. 223 00:14:19,513 --> 00:14:21,413 [Gabby] He hugged me for a really long time. 224 00:14:21,413 --> 00:14:23,573 - [camera shutter clicks] - [Gabby] It had been eight years 225 00:14:23,573 --> 00:14:25,413 since the last time I'd seen him. 226 00:14:35,243 --> 00:14:39,143 [Gabby] At that time, I was having a lot of problems with my foster parents 227 00:14:39,143 --> 00:14:41,973 - and so I... I just had enough. - [camera shutter clicks] 228 00:14:41,973 --> 00:14:45,113 [Gabby] I ran away and I never looked back. 229 00:14:46,973 --> 00:14:48,873 [Jimmy] When she ran away, 230 00:14:48,873 --> 00:14:51,113 she called me wanting me to come pick her up. 231 00:14:52,143 --> 00:14:53,773 So, I did. 232 00:14:54,713 --> 00:14:56,713 I damn sure wasn't gonna turn her down. 233 00:14:56,713 --> 00:14:57,973 [camera shutter clicks] 234 00:14:57,973 --> 00:14:59,843 [Gabby] There was no way I was going to be able to come home, 235 00:14:59,843 --> 00:15:02,943 not actually having formally recanted. 236 00:15:06,973 --> 00:15:08,843 [Mike] Jimmy read some of my stories 237 00:15:08,843 --> 00:15:10,873 and in 2014 called me up. 238 00:15:11,943 --> 00:15:14,473 {\an8}And he said, Gabby really wants to talk to you. 239 00:15:14,473 --> 00:15:16,513 {\an8}And so, we met at this truck stop, 240 00:15:20,043 --> 00:15:23,673 and all of a sudden, this big rig comes pulling into the parking lot and 241 00:15:23,673 --> 00:15:26,973 Jimmy gets out and he's... he's he's got this Duck Dynasty shirt on. 242 00:15:26,973 --> 00:15:31,713 And... and there's Gabby, who just looked like a goth teenager. 243 00:15:31,713 --> 00:15:34,473 They came in, and they sat down, and, and she was real nervous. 244 00:15:34,473 --> 00:15:36,113 I remember her, 245 00:15:36,113 --> 00:15:37,973 her leg going up and down and 246 00:15:39,413 --> 00:15:40,943 she just started spilling. 247 00:15:40,943 --> 00:15:42,513 Can... can I read what she said? 248 00:15:45,413 --> 00:15:47,713 She told me that everything they'd said was a lie. 249 00:15:48,473 --> 00:15:51,143 "Sex kindergarten, the swingers' club. 250 00:15:51,143 --> 00:15:54,243 Their parents and all the other adults were innocent. 251 00:15:54,243 --> 00:15:57,743 She said, "They literally blew up my mind and planted stuff in it. 252 00:15:58,313 --> 00:15:59,943 I'm furious about it. 253 00:15:59,943 --> 00:16:02,943 They lied to me, they used me, they screwed up my life. 254 00:16:04,413 --> 00:16:07,113 And she said, my ultimate goal is for this to be overturned. 255 00:16:07,113 --> 00:16:09,413 My goal for myself is just to tell the truth." 256 00:16:11,843 --> 00:16:14,143 {\an8}And not only Gabby, but Hunter recanted as well. 257 00:16:14,143 --> 00:16:15,743 [camera shutter clicks] 258 00:16:15,743 --> 00:16:18,613 When I got a bit older, I actually pulled my older sister 259 00:16:18,613 --> 00:16:20,573 aside and asked her, you know, 260 00:16:20,573 --> 00:16:22,573 do you actually remember 261 00:16:22,573 --> 00:16:25,243 any of this swingers club stuff happening? 262 00:16:25,243 --> 00:16:28,613 'Cause I started realizing I don't remember any of this. 263 00:16:31,113 --> 00:16:33,413 And that's when it really clicked that Margie 264 00:16:33,413 --> 00:16:34,513 brainwashed us. 265 00:16:37,343 --> 00:16:42,213 In the beginning, she asked me if anybody had touched us and things like that. 266 00:16:42,213 --> 00:16:43,873 At first I said no. 267 00:16:43,873 --> 00:16:45,673 {\an8}[Margie speaking] 268 00:16:48,143 --> 00:16:49,673 {\an8}[Hunter speaking] 269 00:16:49,673 --> 00:16:53,943 {\an8}But eventually, I just basically started repeating what Margie had been asking. 270 00:16:53,943 --> 00:16:55,513 {\an8}[Margie speaking] 271 00:16:57,613 --> 00:16:58,943 {\an8}[Hunter speaking] 272 00:17:03,773 --> 00:17:05,313 {\an8}[Margie speaking] 273 00:17:06,143 --> 00:17:07,343 {\an8}[Margie speaking] 274 00:17:07,343 --> 00:17:09,243 [indistinct chatter] 275 00:17:09,243 --> 00:17:11,573 [Dr. Wood] My name is Dr. James Wood. 276 00:17:11,573 --> 00:17:16,513 I'm a retired professor of psychology at the University of Texas at El Paso 277 00:17:16,513 --> 00:17:20,613 {\an8}A lot of my research has been on child interviewing, child suggestibility. 278 00:17:21,113 --> 00:17:25,873 {\an8}[Margie speaking] 279 00:17:28,613 --> 00:17:31,673 One of the more amazing things was just seeing those 280 00:17:31,673 --> 00:17:34,043 interviews and then how they were conducted. 281 00:17:34,043 --> 00:17:35,473 {\an8}[Margie speaking] 282 00:17:35,873 --> 00:17:37,313 {\an8}[Hunter speaking] 283 00:17:37,773 --> 00:17:41,113 {\an8}[Margie speaking] 284 00:17:41,113 --> 00:17:42,243 {\an8}[Hunter speaking] 285 00:17:42,243 --> 00:17:43,773 {\an8}[Margie speaking] 286 00:17:44,143 --> 00:17:45,773 Okay. 287 00:17:45,773 --> 00:17:51,143 Introducing information. So we've had, uh kindergarten and did anything nasty happen? 288 00:17:51,143 --> 00:17:54,343 And you put them together. So you've actually linked the two ideas, so that 289 00:17:54,343 --> 00:17:59,743 suggests to... to Hunter, we want a statement about nasty things in kindergarten, right. 290 00:17:59,743 --> 00:18:01,743 That's coming from the adults, not from him. 291 00:18:01,743 --> 00:18:02,973 [Margie] Where did that happen? 292 00:18:04,313 --> 00:18:05,973 {\an8}[Ranger Kemp speaking] 293 00:18:09,243 --> 00:18:11,773 {\an8}[Dr. Wood] Margie is the last person you want touching that 294 00:18:11,773 --> 00:18:13,713 {\an8}child as you try to get a statement from him. 295 00:18:14,243 --> 00:18:16,713 She's pressuring him. 296 00:18:16,713 --> 00:18:20,743 She's demonstrating her control, she pulls his hands down like that. 297 00:18:20,743 --> 00:18:22,673 She's giving him a lot of signals about, 298 00:18:23,513 --> 00:18:25,573 you're gonna do what I want right now. 299 00:18:25,573 --> 00:18:27,043 {\an8}[Ranger Kemp speaking] 300 00:18:27,713 --> 00:18:28,773 {\an8}[Carly speaking] 301 00:18:28,773 --> 00:18:30,143 {\an8}[Ranger Kemp speaking] 302 00:18:30,143 --> 00:18:33,113 {\an8}[Dr. Wood] Another suggestive interviewing technique is 303 00:18:33,113 --> 00:18:35,113 {\an8}giving positive feedback, 304 00:18:35,113 --> 00:18:38,743 {\an8}which is praising a child for making an accusation. 305 00:18:38,743 --> 00:18:40,613 {\an8}Saying, "You're doing a great job." 306 00:18:40,613 --> 00:18:43,313 {\an8}[Ranger Kemp speaking] 307 00:18:54,613 --> 00:18:58,843 {\an8}When Margie is with Shelby or Margie is with Hunter, 308 00:18:58,843 --> 00:19:02,343 {\an8}one thing is you could say, well, that's their caretaker, right? 309 00:19:02,343 --> 00:19:06,473 {\an8}But in the case of Gabby, they had no relationship. 310 00:19:06,473 --> 00:19:08,313 {\an8}She wasn't her foster child. 311 00:19:08,313 --> 00:19:11,943 {\an8}And yet Kemp brings Margie in to question Gabby. 312 00:19:12,513 --> 00:19:14,243 {\an8}[Margie clears throat] 313 00:19:14,243 --> 00:19:17,513 {\an8}[Gabby] They would pull us into this room. It was a small white room. 314 00:19:17,513 --> 00:19:21,513 {\an8}It was just the same question, just in different words, over, and over again. 315 00:19:21,513 --> 00:19:25,613 Just hours of the same question, wanting me to change my answer. 316 00:19:26,213 --> 00:19:27,413 {\an8}[Margie speaking] 317 00:19:32,413 --> 00:19:33,673 {\an8}[Gabby speaking] 318 00:19:33,673 --> 00:19:35,873 {\an8}[Margie speaking] 319 00:19:35,873 --> 00:19:37,243 {\an8}[Gabby speaking] 320 00:19:37,243 --> 00:19:39,243 {\an8}[Margie speaking] 321 00:19:39,243 --> 00:19:40,943 {\an8}So they can't get her to change her story. 322 00:19:40,943 --> 00:19:44,413 {\an8}So they put her in a room with Shelby and let Shelby interview her. 323 00:19:44,413 --> 00:19:46,043 {\an8}[Gabby speaking] 324 00:19:46,043 --> 00:19:47,713 {\an8}[Shelby speaking] 325 00:19:47,713 --> 00:19:48,973 {\an8}[Gabby speaking] 326 00:19:51,613 --> 00:19:53,043 {\an8}[Shelby speaking] 327 00:19:53,743 --> 00:19:58,413 {\an8}[Gabby speaking] 328 00:20:02,673 --> 00:20:04,113 {\an8}[Shelby speaking] 329 00:20:06,513 --> 00:20:07,943 {\an8}[Dr. Wood] Totally in violation. 330 00:20:07,943 --> 00:20:10,613 {\an8}You're not supposed to have children question other children, 331 00:20:10,613 --> 00:20:13,573 {\an8}and you're not supposed to have children pressure other children. 332 00:20:13,573 --> 00:20:16,413 {\an8}[Gabby speaking] 333 00:20:16,973 --> 00:20:19,873 {\an8}[Shelby speaking] 334 00:20:19,873 --> 00:20:20,873 {\an8}[Gabby speaking] 335 00:20:24,343 --> 00:20:25,613 Margie Cantrell 336 00:20:25,613 --> 00:20:28,043 and Ranger Philip Kemp 337 00:20:28,043 --> 00:20:31,573 violated just about every rule in the book 338 00:20:31,573 --> 00:20:33,713 for good interviewing of children. 339 00:20:34,343 --> 00:20:36,113 {\an8}[Margie speaking] 340 00:20:44,073 --> 00:20:45,343 {\an8}[Ranger Kemp speaking] 341 00:20:45,343 --> 00:20:46,343 {\an8}[Margie speaking] 342 00:20:46,343 --> 00:20:47,343 {\an8}[Ranger Kemp speaking] 343 00:20:47,343 --> 00:20:49,243 {\an8}[Margie speaking] 344 00:20:53,143 --> 00:20:54,873 {\an8}[Dr. Wood] It was crystal clear 345 00:20:54,873 --> 00:20:59,243 {\an8}that the children were subjected to very intense pressure and 346 00:20:59,243 --> 00:21:03,143 {\an8}suggestive questioning by Ranger Kemp and Margie Cantrell. 347 00:21:03,143 --> 00:21:06,873 {\an8}[Gabby speaking] 348 00:21:07,343 --> 00:21:10,773 {\an8}[Margie speaking] 349 00:21:10,773 --> 00:21:14,873 {\an8}[Melinda] It was Margie Cantrell telling them 350 00:21:14,873 --> 00:21:16,243 {\an8}that these things happened. 351 00:21:16,243 --> 00:21:19,213 {\an8}So it's like, if you tell the kid there's a Santa Claus and 352 00:21:19,213 --> 00:21:21,873 {\an8}and if you're not good, Santa Claus won't bring you anything 353 00:21:21,873 --> 00:21:25,613 {\an8}and you're putting that belief in that child's head. 354 00:21:25,613 --> 00:21:28,413 {\an8}Then you could put the bad beliefs in there too. 355 00:21:28,413 --> 00:21:30,973 [Hunter] None of this stuff actually ever happened. 356 00:21:30,973 --> 00:21:33,673 We were manipulated in to believing it. 357 00:21:36,843 --> 00:21:40,043 {\an8}When I finally realized the sex scandal never happened 358 00:21:40,043 --> 00:21:43,713 {\an8}and she knew it never happened I didn't understand why 359 00:21:43,713 --> 00:21:49,513 {\an8}she forced a child into telling you something that didn't happen. 360 00:21:49,513 --> 00:21:51,713 {\an8}[Margie speaking] 361 00:21:55,973 --> 00:21:58,213 We learned much later 362 00:21:58,213 --> 00:22:00,243 the reason she's doing this 363 00:22:00,243 --> 00:22:03,343 is because the worse the child is 364 00:22:03,343 --> 00:22:05,973 then the more the foster parents pay. 365 00:22:07,673 --> 00:22:11,873 And so, Margie started saying that the children had told her 366 00:22:11,873 --> 00:22:13,413 that they were sexually abused. 367 00:22:14,873 --> 00:22:17,713 [Gabby] Margie Cantrell got a lot of money 368 00:22:17,713 --> 00:22:19,513 for Shelby, Hunter and Carly. 369 00:22:19,513 --> 00:22:21,343 The more messed up they were 370 00:22:21,343 --> 00:22:23,943 the more money she got for taking care of them. 371 00:22:24,573 --> 00:22:26,143 I think it's horrific. 372 00:22:27,513 --> 00:22:30,713 [Hunter] She was creating this horrible backstory for us 373 00:22:30,713 --> 00:22:33,513 so that she could get paid. 374 00:22:33,513 --> 00:22:36,413 Margie just needed the money. She wanted the money. 375 00:22:36,413 --> 00:22:39,773 [Jenna] She would brag, "Oh yeah. 376 00:22:39,773 --> 00:22:43,313 John, John, now if we say this about this kid, 377 00:22:43,313 --> 00:22:46,073 then, you know we can get $1,500 for that kid." 378 00:22:46,513 --> 00:22:48,243 So everybody, 379 00:22:48,243 --> 00:22:50,473 even if they didn't have issues, 380 00:22:51,143 --> 00:22:53,143 they were going to "have issues" 381 00:22:53,143 --> 00:22:55,343 when they got to the Cantrell's house. 382 00:22:56,843 --> 00:22:59,513 [Dr. Wood] From an economic point of view, 383 00:22:59,513 --> 00:23:03,243 if she has these three foster children staying with her, 384 00:23:03,243 --> 00:23:05,713 they typically will be returned to their parents. 385 00:23:05,713 --> 00:23:07,973 But if the parents are convicted 386 00:23:07,973 --> 00:23:09,873 and they're put into jail, 387 00:23:09,873 --> 00:23:11,713 then the children are not going to be returned to those parents 388 00:23:11,713 --> 00:23:17,473 and they become a steady, reliable source of income. 389 00:23:17,473 --> 00:23:21,513 [Melinda] That's how we learned that each one of these children they got, 390 00:23:21,513 --> 00:23:23,513 every single child, 391 00:23:23,513 --> 00:23:27,343 their level escalated, so that they made more money. 392 00:23:30,413 --> 00:23:31,943 {\an8}[woman speaking] 393 00:23:37,573 --> 00:23:38,773 Yes, I was. 394 00:23:38,773 --> 00:23:40,413 I heard 395 00:23:40,413 --> 00:23:44,773 through one of the articles that it was 3000, 396 00:23:44,773 --> 00:23:47,413 maybe like 700 per child. 397 00:23:47,973 --> 00:23:49,673 I wish. 398 00:23:49,673 --> 00:23:53,213 But no, never, ever, ever was that true. 399 00:23:54,143 --> 00:23:56,613 You're never paid 400 00:23:56,613 --> 00:23:58,513 to take care of these children. 401 00:23:58,513 --> 00:24:02,343 You have to put the money out first, support them. 402 00:24:02,343 --> 00:24:06,473 It's a reimbursement plan that the state has. 403 00:24:06,473 --> 00:24:09,973 And as one would come in 404 00:24:09,973 --> 00:24:14,243 that might have been a fire starter, 405 00:24:14,243 --> 00:24:19,973 um poke the eyes out of cats, rip their limbs off, 406 00:24:19,973 --> 00:24:25,773 they would definitely require about $1,400 a month 407 00:24:25,773 --> 00:24:27,343 or something like that. 408 00:24:27,343 --> 00:24:32,843 That would be much more but that's a 24-hour type child. 409 00:24:35,473 --> 00:24:37,613 [Thad] Margie is a master actor. 410 00:24:37,613 --> 00:24:41,613 She's totally alive when she gets to play hero to the jury. 411 00:24:41,613 --> 00:24:44,573 She's totally alive running around the countryside 412 00:24:44,573 --> 00:24:47,873 talking to whatever law enforcement agent is foolish enough to listen to her 413 00:24:47,873 --> 00:24:50,773 {\an8}about how these poor kids have been traumatized 414 00:24:50,773 --> 00:24:52,413 {\an8}and damaged by all these evil people, 415 00:24:52,413 --> 00:24:53,713 but I'm here to save them. 416 00:24:54,513 --> 00:24:56,413 But it's actually just a con. 417 00:24:56,413 --> 00:24:57,613 It's just a money scam. 418 00:24:59,043 --> 00:25:01,613 [Margie] I did my job. I did what I was supposed to do. 419 00:25:01,613 --> 00:25:03,573 And that's where my part ended. 420 00:25:03,573 --> 00:25:07,343 Even though people can hate me and try to blame things on me, 421 00:25:07,343 --> 00:25:09,873 I did not know the inner workings of this case, 422 00:25:09,873 --> 00:25:11,613 nor the people, nor anything, 423 00:25:11,613 --> 00:25:12,773 and then you start hearing 424 00:25:12,773 --> 00:25:14,573 well you made it all up Margie, 425 00:25:14,573 --> 00:25:16,043 you made this whole thing up. 426 00:25:16,043 --> 00:25:17,973 And now I'm on trial. 427 00:25:17,973 --> 00:25:21,143 But, where's the kids in the mix? 428 00:25:21,143 --> 00:25:24,513 Listen to them. Maybe talk to them more. 429 00:25:24,513 --> 00:25:28,143 Maybe another forensic... I don't know. 430 00:25:28,143 --> 00:25:31,143 But somewhere lies the truth. 431 00:25:32,713 --> 00:25:34,473 {\an8}[woman speaking] 432 00:25:38,343 --> 00:25:41,343 [Margie] After everything I've been through and everything I've seen, 433 00:25:41,343 --> 00:25:43,413 I don't think they had a choice. 434 00:25:44,143 --> 00:25:46,613 But Shelby says this is her truth 435 00:25:46,613 --> 00:25:48,773 and she stands by it to this day, 436 00:25:50,343 --> 00:25:52,973 and that's the end of her story. 437 00:26:01,143 --> 00:26:02,973 {\an8}[man speaking] 438 00:26:06,143 --> 00:26:08,513 I probably couldn't say anything to her. 439 00:26:08,513 --> 00:26:10,713 I would... I would probably just leave. 440 00:26:13,973 --> 00:26:16,243 [door squeaking] 441 00:26:19,413 --> 00:26:21,873 [Hunter] They basically took my childhood from me. 442 00:26:23,143 --> 00:26:25,473 They did steal my memories. 443 00:26:28,473 --> 00:26:31,713 With everything that happened, I never thought I'd ever see my mom again. 444 00:26:33,143 --> 00:26:36,513 {\an8}I can imagine it hurt a lot 445 00:26:36,513 --> 00:26:39,873 to have your children testify against you, 446 00:26:39,873 --> 00:26:42,243 and put you in prison for something you didn't do. 447 00:26:42,243 --> 00:26:45,243 And knowing that they were manipulated into doing it. 448 00:26:46,143 --> 00:26:47,343 It must have been hard. 449 00:26:49,143 --> 00:26:55,143 [Hunter quoting prosecutor and himself] 450 00:27:04,773 --> 00:27:11,143 "The record will reflect Hunter pointed to and identified the defendant." 451 00:27:11,143 --> 00:27:14,413 [Shauntel] Having my son testify against me broke my heart. 452 00:27:15,473 --> 00:27:16,713 It broke my spirit. 453 00:27:18,213 --> 00:27:20,513 It broke my spirit for all the kids. 454 00:27:21,243 --> 00:27:23,213 {\an8}[man speaking] 455 00:27:23,213 --> 00:27:25,313 There was no reason to forgive him. 456 00:27:26,573 --> 00:27:28,313 I've never blamed my children. 457 00:27:31,143 --> 00:27:32,943 From day one, I've known that it wasn't... 458 00:27:32,943 --> 00:27:34,713 it had nothing to do with the kids. 459 00:27:38,613 --> 00:27:41,343 When we were reunited after all these years 460 00:27:41,343 --> 00:27:43,613 my mom was just so happy to see me, 461 00:27:43,613 --> 00:27:47,043 she... she couldn't control her feelings seeing me, 462 00:27:47,043 --> 00:27:49,613 I mean she busted into tears. 463 00:27:49,613 --> 00:27:52,043 She was hugging me. She wouldn't let me go or anything. 464 00:27:53,713 --> 00:27:56,143 [Shauntel] I didn't think that I deserved 465 00:27:56,143 --> 00:27:59,673 the chance to... to be his mom. 466 00:27:59,673 --> 00:28:02,843 I couldn't believe that he even wanted to be around me. 467 00:28:02,843 --> 00:28:05,343 Because they wouldn't have been taken from me 468 00:28:05,343 --> 00:28:08,773 if I hadn't started doing drugs in 2003. 469 00:28:09,573 --> 00:28:10,973 It was my fault. 470 00:28:12,613 --> 00:28:14,713 It's always been my fault. 471 00:28:15,943 --> 00:28:17,613 After I got out of prison, 472 00:28:17,613 --> 00:28:20,513 I would have major anxiety attacks. 473 00:28:20,513 --> 00:28:23,143 I couldn't handle it, I couldn't get a job. 474 00:28:24,313 --> 00:28:26,613 But Jamie held my hand and 475 00:28:27,413 --> 00:28:31,073 taught me how to live again. 476 00:28:31,073 --> 00:28:33,873 My children haven't forgiven me completely. 477 00:28:33,873 --> 00:28:35,413 But I have. 478 00:28:35,413 --> 00:28:37,073 and I had to forgive myself 479 00:28:37,073 --> 00:28:41,843 because I couldn't be a mom to them without forgiving myself. 480 00:28:52,073 --> 00:28:53,613 [Gabby] After I had recanted, 481 00:28:53,613 --> 00:28:56,073 the reuniting with my mom happened. 482 00:28:56,073 --> 00:28:59,073 It was really emotional. Uh, she didn't know I was coming. 483 00:28:59,643 --> 00:29:01,343 I remember she was... 484 00:29:02,443 --> 00:29:04,883 she was watering some plants out, 485 00:29:05,913 --> 00:29:08,643 uh, by the porch area that they had. 486 00:29:11,643 --> 00:29:14,713 [Shelia] This truck pulls up. It was Jimmy in the... 487 00:29:16,273 --> 00:29:19,883 didn't know who the hell that was in the passenger seat. 488 00:29:19,883 --> 00:29:23,013 Then they both got out of the truck. 489 00:29:25,373 --> 00:29:27,413 And I finally realized... 490 00:29:28,013 --> 00:29:29,513 who she was. 491 00:29:33,273 --> 00:29:36,243 I dropped my water hose and 492 00:29:37,343 --> 00:29:39,783 I grabbed that child up so fast 493 00:29:39,783 --> 00:29:42,413 and so hard and I hugged her so long. 494 00:29:46,073 --> 00:29:48,173 I didn't want to let her go 495 00:29:48,173 --> 00:29:50,413 and I didn't want her to go away. 496 00:29:53,343 --> 00:29:55,413 Look how cute you were. 497 00:29:57,643 --> 00:29:59,713 Not that you're not cute now. You're adorable. 498 00:29:59,713 --> 00:30:02,543 [Gabby] She was like, "I can either be your best friend, 499 00:30:02,543 --> 00:30:06,643 or I can step back into the role of your mother, it's up to you." 500 00:30:06,643 --> 00:30:09,273 And I was, you know, finally like, "I, 501 00:30:09,273 --> 00:30:11,443 I want you to be my mom again." 502 00:30:11,443 --> 00:30:13,913 [Shelia] That's the picture I had. 503 00:30:13,913 --> 00:30:16,413 That's the picture I kissed every night. 504 00:30:16,813 --> 00:30:18,413 And I talked to. 505 00:30:26,613 --> 00:30:28,543 [Jimmy] I wrote this when I was in prison. 506 00:30:30,343 --> 00:30:34,913 And I was definitely depressed, 507 00:30:34,913 --> 00:30:37,443 I mean, I was giving up hope. 508 00:30:37,443 --> 00:30:42,243 I was laying in my bunk asleep, and I had this dream. 509 00:30:42,243 --> 00:30:45,643 And I got up immediately after the dream stopped, and I wrote it. 510 00:30:51,013 --> 00:30:54,613 "As I sit and think about my beautiful Gabby, 511 00:30:54,613 --> 00:30:58,813 how all it was is now nothing more than memories, 512 00:30:58,813 --> 00:31:02,443 I look outside and watch an angel fall from the sky. 513 00:31:05,373 --> 00:31:10,013 I look at her with a smile, although no words are said, 514 00:31:10,013 --> 00:31:12,913 she grabs my face and breaks down instead. 515 00:31:15,543 --> 00:31:17,813 I ask, 'What's the matter?' 516 00:31:17,813 --> 00:31:20,343 as I wipe her tears away, 517 00:31:20,343 --> 00:31:23,973 she leans in closer and she had this to say." 518 00:31:25,883 --> 00:31:27,813 "Love life and keep it simple, 519 00:31:27,813 --> 00:31:30,173 but most of all, keep your heart open, 520 00:31:30,173 --> 00:31:31,443 [sniffles] 521 00:31:34,173 --> 00:31:37,273 because she loves you and still needs you. 522 00:31:38,543 --> 00:31:40,443 My angel closed her eyes, 523 00:31:41,273 --> 00:31:43,143 and her body went limp 524 00:31:44,813 --> 00:31:47,643 as her spirit ascended back to heaven. 525 00:31:47,643 --> 00:31:50,813 I just sat there and cried because I knew what she meant... 526 00:31:51,143 --> 00:31:52,273 Gabby." 527 00:31:56,243 --> 00:31:57,543 You okay? 528 00:32:00,173 --> 00:32:02,543 It makes me cry every time I read it. 529 00:32:06,443 --> 00:32:09,543 I mean, I was to the point where I was ready just to off myself. 530 00:32:11,173 --> 00:32:12,713 That's how depressed I was. 531 00:32:16,443 --> 00:32:18,913 This right here kept me alive. 532 00:32:47,073 --> 00:32:50,613 The place where it all supposedly began. 533 00:33:06,243 --> 00:33:07,973 How could such an innocent building 534 00:33:07,973 --> 00:33:10,173 be so damn evil for me? 535 00:33:10,173 --> 00:33:11,373 I mean... 536 00:33:12,273 --> 00:33:14,073 this is where it started. 537 00:33:15,143 --> 00:33:17,343 It's where the lies came from. 538 00:33:18,643 --> 00:33:21,713 and I really don't like being here. 539 00:33:21,713 --> 00:33:23,413 If my little old arms could do it, 540 00:33:23,413 --> 00:33:26,073 I'd take every damn brick out of this bitch. 541 00:33:28,013 --> 00:33:30,243 [Shauntel] I didn't know it existed. 542 00:33:30,243 --> 00:33:32,543 How did my kids know what the inside of it looked like? 543 00:33:34,373 --> 00:33:35,783 Because I don't. 544 00:33:35,783 --> 00:33:38,273 But ask my two oldest kids 545 00:33:38,273 --> 00:33:40,343 and they can tell you what it looks like. 546 00:33:40,343 --> 00:33:42,913 That woman walked my kids through this building. 547 00:33:51,413 --> 00:33:52,713 [door closes] 548 00:33:54,643 --> 00:33:58,343 [Hunter] Margie brought me to this building the first time I was here. 549 00:34:02,243 --> 00:34:04,013 We drove up one day, 550 00:34:04,013 --> 00:34:06,273 Margie talking about wanting to buy the place 551 00:34:06,913 --> 00:34:09,443 and I was like 8 years old. 552 00:34:11,913 --> 00:34:13,143 It was creepy. 553 00:34:13,883 --> 00:34:16,173 And, uh, I remember stopping 554 00:34:16,173 --> 00:34:18,413 and seeing a basketball in the back. 555 00:34:18,413 --> 00:34:21,173 And, uh, I can't remember what I said about it, 556 00:34:21,173 --> 00:34:23,243 but I think I wanted the basketball 557 00:34:23,243 --> 00:34:25,273 so I think Margie just kind of took that 558 00:34:25,273 --> 00:34:27,273 and kind twisted that, 559 00:34:27,273 --> 00:34:30,543 you know, trying to make it seem like we had been here before 560 00:34:30,543 --> 00:34:31,973 and that was my basketball. 561 00:34:35,713 --> 00:34:38,143 As far as she's talking about memories, 562 00:34:38,143 --> 00:34:40,413 I don't know if Shelby maybe said something, 563 00:34:40,413 --> 00:34:43,513 but I had no memory of the place at all. 564 00:34:45,543 --> 00:34:51,713 I've never been in here with any family member ever, 565 00:34:51,713 --> 00:34:54,713 um, not even in the building or on the property. 566 00:35:13,343 --> 00:35:15,013 [dog barking] 567 00:35:20,783 --> 00:35:22,913 [Carly] My mother bought me a house. 568 00:35:22,913 --> 00:35:25,173 It's a mobile home right across the street from her 569 00:35:25,173 --> 00:35:26,543 with two lots, 570 00:35:28,073 --> 00:35:29,713 so if anything happens, 571 00:35:30,783 --> 00:35:32,013 I'm right there. 572 00:35:33,073 --> 00:35:37,543 In a year or so, I'm hoping to have me and my mother 573 00:35:37,543 --> 00:35:41,173 and my grandmother all right there in the same vicinity, 574 00:35:41,173 --> 00:35:42,713 if not side by side. 575 00:35:45,613 --> 00:35:48,243 [Hunter] I hope to go back and finish school 576 00:35:48,243 --> 00:35:49,913 and get some stability 577 00:35:50,713 --> 00:35:52,013 is really what I hope. 578 00:35:52,013 --> 00:35:53,543 In 10 years it would be nice 579 00:35:53,543 --> 00:35:56,273 to have a family of my own. 580 00:35:56,273 --> 00:35:59,013 [Shauntel] There you go. There you go, Carly. 581 00:36:02,173 --> 00:36:03,973 [Hunter] I would like to see myself 582 00:36:03,973 --> 00:36:06,713 closer to the family I have right now. 583 00:36:10,713 --> 00:36:13,413 I constantly feel guilt about what happened. 584 00:36:13,413 --> 00:36:17,513 I do feel like if I'd have stuck with my answer "no" in the beginning, 585 00:36:17,513 --> 00:36:19,713 that it had never happened, 586 00:36:19,713 --> 00:36:23,073 um, I feel like none of this would have ever happened. 587 00:36:26,643 --> 00:36:30,013 [Gabby] The fallout is devastating and it still affects us. 588 00:36:31,813 --> 00:36:35,543 This is something that we have to live with for the rest of our lives. 589 00:36:36,913 --> 00:36:39,013 Justice for my parents 590 00:36:39,013 --> 00:36:42,373 would be their names cleared, 591 00:36:42,373 --> 00:36:46,173 it taken off of their record, because that felony is still on their record. 592 00:36:46,173 --> 00:36:49,613 Justice for Margie would be seeing her behind bars. 593 00:36:52,643 --> 00:36:54,443 [Shelia] This one woman 594 00:36:55,883 --> 00:36:57,783 hated so much 595 00:36:58,413 --> 00:37:01,413 that she destroyed us. 596 00:37:01,413 --> 00:37:03,173 She was the rich woman. 597 00:37:03,173 --> 00:37:06,013 They're going to believe her over the poor people. 598 00:37:07,643 --> 00:37:11,143 Especially poor people that have had 599 00:37:11,783 --> 00:37:13,883 poor people problems. 600 00:37:13,883 --> 00:37:16,713 You could tell by the newspaper clippings 601 00:37:16,713 --> 00:37:20,073 and everything that 602 00:37:20,073 --> 00:37:24,643 society thought that, because we were poor, we were indecent, 603 00:37:25,013 --> 00:37:27,343 immoral, dirty. 604 00:37:27,913 --> 00:37:30,513 {\an8}[man speaking] 605 00:37:36,243 --> 00:37:37,973 I don't trust anybody. 606 00:37:40,883 --> 00:37:44,443 My life experiences are really negative toward the world. 607 00:37:45,443 --> 00:37:48,543 People are liars and they're mean. 608 00:37:54,813 --> 00:37:56,713 [Jimmy] We were innocent. 609 00:37:56,713 --> 00:37:59,273 Our lives were turned upside down. 610 00:37:59,273 --> 00:38:01,573 It cost me four years of my freedom, 611 00:38:03,273 --> 00:38:05,213 the loss of my daughter. 612 00:38:05,213 --> 00:38:07,543 I wasn't there as a father. 613 00:38:10,573 --> 00:38:13,373 You know it makes me sad the fact that 614 00:38:14,473 --> 00:38:15,843 I wasn't there. 615 00:38:18,743 --> 00:38:21,213 I didn't get to raise my daughter. 616 00:38:21,213 --> 00:38:23,183 I will never get those years back. 617 00:38:35,743 --> 00:38:38,013 {\an8}[Mike] After those guys got out, 618 00:38:38,013 --> 00:38:40,743 {\an8}I would still get letters from Dennis Pittman, 619 00:38:40,743 --> 00:38:44,743 {\an8}and basically saying, "Look, all these other people are out, what about me?" 620 00:38:44,743 --> 00:38:48,473 {\an8}And he would always sign his letters, 621 00:38:48,473 --> 00:38:50,943 {\an8}"Dennis Pittman, the innocent man." 622 00:38:51,843 --> 00:38:53,473 {\an8}And... 623 00:38:53,473 --> 00:38:56,573 he just got caught up in Smith County justice. 624 00:38:56,573 --> 00:38:58,643 We all knew he should be free, 625 00:38:58,643 --> 00:39:01,943 but the wheels of the criminal justice system turn really slowly. 626 00:39:03,113 --> 00:39:04,913 So, every year went on, and it was like, 627 00:39:04,913 --> 00:39:07,013 of course this guy's gonna get out eventually. 628 00:39:07,013 --> 00:39:08,213 [buzzes] 629 00:39:32,213 --> 00:39:37,013 [Jason] I would check to see where he was in the parole review. 630 00:39:37,013 --> 00:39:39,713 Because Dennis was convicted of an offense 631 00:39:39,713 --> 00:39:42,543 that allowed him to be parole eligible 632 00:39:42,543 --> 00:39:44,843 with less than half time served. 633 00:39:44,843 --> 00:39:49,473 So I would periodically check just to see and I happened to 634 00:39:49,473 --> 00:39:51,313 look it up and see that 635 00:39:51,313 --> 00:39:53,913 it didn't show he was in TC any longer, 636 00:39:54,473 --> 00:39:57,313 and so I text Melinda 637 00:39:57,313 --> 00:40:01,213 and I said, "Dennis might've made parole." 638 00:40:01,213 --> 00:40:04,113 And, you know, she responded back 639 00:40:04,113 --> 00:40:06,013 "Or he died," 640 00:40:06,013 --> 00:40:07,813 which I'd never even considered. 641 00:40:07,813 --> 00:40:09,443 And then we started looking into it and 642 00:40:09,443 --> 00:40:12,373 of course found out that he had indeed passed away. 643 00:40:17,273 --> 00:40:19,643 [Mike] He died of COVID complications. 644 00:40:20,213 --> 00:40:22,013 And that was that. 645 00:40:22,673 --> 00:40:24,213 So the last innocent man... 646 00:40:24,943 --> 00:40:26,083 was dead. 647 00:40:32,013 --> 00:40:33,913 {\an8}[man speaking] 648 00:40:35,273 --> 00:40:37,083 {\an8}- No. - [man speaking] 649 00:40:37,913 --> 00:40:39,313 He did? 650 00:40:40,473 --> 00:40:43,113 What? I did not know that. 651 00:40:46,083 --> 00:40:49,113 What? Oh, my gosh. Ugh. 652 00:40:49,113 --> 00:40:50,743 Well, now I feel really bad. 653 00:40:52,373 --> 00:40:53,743 Yeah, I didn't know. 654 00:40:54,573 --> 00:40:57,183 His life now is defined by this. 655 00:40:57,573 --> 00:40:59,083 You know, he died 656 00:40:59,083 --> 00:41:02,313 without ever having a chance to tell his story 657 00:41:02,313 --> 00:41:04,183 and for people to believe him. 658 00:41:04,183 --> 00:41:07,573 And so imagine how lonely and isolating it must have felt. 659 00:41:07,573 --> 00:41:10,843 It's not about pride and arrogance and winning cases. 660 00:41:10,843 --> 00:41:14,083 It's real lives that were affected and impacted. 661 00:41:14,083 --> 00:41:16,213 We all had a responsibility. 662 00:41:16,213 --> 00:41:17,943 We have failed him in many ways. 663 00:41:20,443 --> 00:41:23,473 [Mike] It was the final tragedy in this story. 664 00:41:23,473 --> 00:41:27,273 And you can trace every single terrible event back to two people. 665 00:41:27,913 --> 00:41:30,643 Margie and John Cantrell. 666 00:41:30,643 --> 00:41:33,113 They were never held accountable. 667 00:41:35,313 --> 00:41:39,573 There were various people talking about ways they could go after them 668 00:41:39,573 --> 00:41:41,713 with some kind of fraud charges. 669 00:41:41,713 --> 00:41:43,273 You know, I think, ultimately, 670 00:41:43,743 --> 00:41:45,743 the fact that 671 00:41:45,743 --> 00:41:48,913 we were dealing with a bunch of people who lived in trailers, 672 00:41:48,913 --> 00:41:50,913 a bunch of people who didn't have any money. 673 00:41:50,913 --> 00:41:52,713 I mean, ultimately, I think people just didn't give a [bleep]. 674 00:41:53,943 --> 00:41:56,743 She got away with it. And what does she do? 675 00:41:56,743 --> 00:41:58,113 She goes back to California 676 00:41:58,113 --> 00:42:00,113 and scuddles back into her hole. 677 00:42:08,743 --> 00:42:10,313 [Margie] Life is good. 678 00:42:10,313 --> 00:42:12,943 I've been swimming a lot. 679 00:42:13,813 --> 00:42:16,713 And I take care of my husband. 680 00:42:16,713 --> 00:42:20,743 He has PTSD and some problems. 681 00:42:20,743 --> 00:42:23,573 And we work in the backyard. 682 00:42:24,183 --> 00:42:26,543 Our backyard is gorgeous 683 00:42:26,543 --> 00:42:28,473 and I have, 684 00:42:28,473 --> 00:42:32,113 oh, so many grandkids surrounding me, 685 00:42:32,113 --> 00:42:34,673 and grandma's very involved in what they're doing. 686 00:42:34,673 --> 00:42:36,373 And, um... 687 00:42:36,943 --> 00:42:39,273 they make me laugh 688 00:42:39,273 --> 00:42:42,643 and they're coming into those teenage years so it really makes me laugh 689 00:42:42,643 --> 00:42:44,473 because I get to send them home. 690 00:42:44,473 --> 00:42:47,373 But it's good. Life is... is good. 691 00:42:48,573 --> 00:42:50,213 {\an8}[man speaking] 692 00:42:52,113 --> 00:42:56,373 I have regrets at walking away from my home 693 00:42:56,373 --> 00:42:58,373 and our dreams. 694 00:42:59,813 --> 00:43:02,913 But we have new dreams and they're pretty awesome.