1 00:00:03,703 --> 00:00:05,372          [Ryan McMahon]              The Brayden Bushby trial     2 00:00:05,405 --> 00:00:07,974     was a rare chance for the         system to get it right.     3 00:00:08,008 --> 00:00:10,043                ♪                 4 00:00:10,076 --> 00:00:11,945         There was a huge                 sigh of relief...        5 00:00:11,978 --> 00:00:14,547        when the judge read              the guilty verdict.       6 00:00:14,581 --> 00:00:19,386      And for me, it was just           a chance to breathe.       7 00:00:19,419 --> 00:00:22,789      It was like the long,              long exhale after         8 00:00:22,822 --> 00:00:25,392     months of what felt like           holding your breath.       9 00:00:25,425 --> 00:00:27,027         But, I couldn't                help but think of...       10 00:00:27,060 --> 00:00:29,462   the other Indigenous families        that didn't have this      11 00:00:29,496 --> 00:00:32,198      opportunity in court,           that would never see the     12 00:00:32,232 --> 00:00:34,501       killer of their loved              ones face a jury.        13 00:00:34,534 --> 00:00:38,371                ♪                 14 00:00:38,405 --> 00:00:40,306         What happened to               all of the teenagers       15 00:00:40,340 --> 00:00:42,242          who've died in                   Thunder Bay...          16 00:00:42,275 --> 00:00:43,910           most of them                suspiciously found dead     17 00:00:43,943 --> 00:00:46,713       in the city's rivers?      18 00:00:46,746 --> 00:00:49,849           What's being                    done for them?          19 00:00:49,883 --> 00:00:51,584        It's one thing to                have heard of it,         20 00:00:51,618 --> 00:00:54,087     but it's another thing,            I think, entirely,         21 00:00:54,120 --> 00:00:55,989     to pay attention to it.      22 00:00:56,022 --> 00:00:58,091      For them, there are no            suspects like Bushby       23 00:00:58,124 --> 00:01:00,060        to bring to trial.        24 00:01:00,093 --> 00:01:03,430     Police maintain there is         no evidence of foul play.    25 00:01:03,463 --> 00:01:05,899   They simply have no answers.   26 00:01:05,932 --> 00:01:07,667         I've never seen                  such a negligent         27 00:01:07,700 --> 00:01:09,903      death investigation in             my entire career.         28 00:01:09,936 --> 00:01:12,772    If these were white kids,               after two,             29 00:01:12,806 --> 00:01:15,575         can you imagine                    the outcry?            30 00:01:15,608 --> 00:01:17,944     And when you really pay          attention to this story,     31 00:01:17,977 --> 00:01:20,413     you understand that this           story is continuing        32 00:01:20,447 --> 00:01:22,515        to evolve, and it                just keeps going.         33 00:01:27,821 --> 00:01:29,556        I don't think it's                safe down there.         34 00:01:29,589 --> 00:01:32,625     There's something going          on down by the rivers.       35 00:01:32,659 --> 00:01:34,794     And one terrifying theory           that keeps swirling       36 00:01:34,828 --> 00:01:36,629       around Thunder Bay...      37 00:01:36,663 --> 00:01:38,465        suggests that this                  'something'            38 00:01:38,498 --> 00:01:40,400        is a serial killer.       39 00:01:40,433 --> 00:01:43,970                ♪                 40 00:01:44,003 --> 00:01:48,208        [Rolling thunder]         41 00:01:59,185 --> 00:02:06,059             [Sirens]             42 00:02:06,092 --> 00:02:13,466                ♪                 43 00:02:17,604 --> 00:02:20,573          This morning,               a source told us that...     44 00:02:20,607 --> 00:02:24,344     the park here, Kam Park,          was police taped off.       45 00:02:24,377 --> 00:02:27,413      And, came down to the           south side of the park,      46 00:02:27,447 --> 00:02:29,315    asked what was happening.     47 00:02:29,349 --> 00:02:30,850     He didn't say anything.      48 00:02:30,884 --> 00:02:34,154      And Jon received word        that the initial police report  49 00:02:34,187 --> 00:02:36,356       describes him as an               Indigenous male.          50 00:02:36,389 --> 00:02:39,292                ♪                 51 00:02:39,325 --> 00:02:43,029     You have what I believe          to be cops in a Zodiac,      52 00:02:43,062 --> 00:02:44,364          going up and                    down the river.          53 00:02:44,397 --> 00:02:48,434         A forensics van.           There's a drone watching us.   54 00:02:48,468 --> 00:02:51,104       I should wave to it.       55 00:02:51,137 --> 00:02:53,873        Hello. [Laughing]                 Is that weird?           56 00:02:53,907 --> 00:02:56,776     They're watching us and           we're watching them?        57 00:02:56,809 --> 00:02:57,877         They should get                 used to it 'cause         58 00:02:57,911 --> 00:03:00,013      we're gonna watch them                for a while.           59 00:03:00,046 --> 00:03:05,785                ♪                 60 00:03:05,818 --> 00:03:09,155                ♪                 61 00:03:09,189 --> 00:03:12,358   My motivation is to find out           why these things         62 00:03:12,392 --> 00:03:15,161    are still happening here,         and hold those that are      63 00:03:15,195 --> 00:03:18,898      supposed to be fixing           the problem to account.      64 00:03:18,932 --> 00:03:22,202   I take no joy in being here.   65 00:03:22,235 --> 00:03:25,371         But here we are.         66 00:03:25,405 --> 00:03:28,308        Since releasing the            podcast series in 2018,     67 00:03:28,341 --> 00:03:30,210      I've been hearing a few         theories on what could be    68 00:03:30,243 --> 00:03:33,379       happening in many of           these Indigenous deaths.     69 00:03:33,413 --> 00:03:37,183        Three theories that              I need to explore.        70 00:03:37,217 --> 00:03:39,085   When you look at the profile           of the teenagers         71 00:03:39,118 --> 00:03:41,020          who've died in                    Thunder Bay,           72 00:03:41,054 --> 00:03:43,489         similarities just                jump out at you.         73 00:03:43,523 --> 00:03:45,358     They were all Indigenous,    74 00:03:45,391 --> 00:03:49,062       all between the ages                of 14 and 18.           75 00:03:49,095 --> 00:03:52,332       And, they've all died              around waterways.        76 00:03:52,365 --> 00:03:56,369     And when you put pins on         a map, you have to say,      77 00:03:56,402 --> 00:03:58,871         "What the hell is                 going on here?"         78 00:03:58,905 --> 00:04:05,778                ♪                 79 00:04:05,812 --> 00:04:09,249    There have been concerns        within northern communities    80 00:04:09,282 --> 00:04:13,353    that there was in fact a         serial killer that was in     81 00:04:13,386 --> 00:04:16,389       Thunder Bay that was            specifically targeting      82 00:04:16,422 --> 00:04:19,926   vulnerable Indigenous youth.   83 00:04:19,959 --> 00:04:21,928         As crazy as that               might sound to some,       84 00:04:21,961 --> 00:04:25,965         we may actually                 have living proof.        85 00:04:25,999 --> 00:04:29,135    Dozens of locals who have        spotted a mysterious truck    86 00:04:29,168 --> 00:04:31,571       prowling the streets               and back alleys.         87 00:04:31,604 --> 00:04:33,740       Some swear it's blue.      88 00:04:33,773 --> 00:04:35,942      Others say it's white.      89 00:04:35,975 --> 00:04:39,579      And some who may have          actually come face-to-face    90 00:04:39,612 --> 00:04:41,814         with the killer.         91 00:04:41,848 --> 00:04:43,783     We were closing up like              we normally do,          92 00:04:43,816 --> 00:04:45,251        around 11:00 p.m.         93 00:04:45,285 --> 00:04:47,587   A young, maybe 30-something            Indigenous man           94 00:04:47,620 --> 00:04:50,423    walks straight towards us         from across the street.      95 00:04:50,456 --> 00:04:52,592         His clothes were              completely soaking wet      96 00:04:52,625 --> 00:04:53,893    when he was talking to us.    97 00:04:53,926 --> 00:04:55,561         He had obviously                 been assaulted.          98 00:04:55,595 --> 00:04:56,763         There was blood                  on his face and          99 00:04:56,796 --> 00:04:59,265         a large gash on                   his forehead.           100 00:04:59,299 --> 00:05:02,268     We were trying to insist         on calling the police or     101 00:05:02,302 --> 00:05:03,970          an ambulance,                      at least,             102 00:05:04,003 --> 00:05:06,306        which he was quite                adamant against.         103 00:05:06,339 --> 00:05:10,910                ♪                 104 00:05:10,943 --> 00:05:13,479   I have heard from many youth      in the city of Thunder Bay    105 00:05:13,513 --> 00:05:15,815        that they have had              similar experiences.       106 00:05:15,848 --> 00:05:20,520      But, I'm not a cop, and        feel way over my head here.   107 00:05:20,553 --> 00:05:22,488     And I can't say what they            experienced was a        108 00:05:22,522 --> 00:05:24,791         close call with                  a serial killer,         109 00:05:24,824 --> 00:05:29,495     but maybe Dave Perry can.    110 00:05:29,529 --> 00:05:30,663    What do you usually drink?    111 00:05:30,697 --> 00:05:32,598          Whiskey, but                   it's a bit early.         112 00:05:32,632 --> 00:05:35,635     I'm gonna make it easy,               have a latte.           113 00:05:35,668 --> 00:05:39,305      He's a former homicide              investigator...          114 00:05:39,339 --> 00:05:42,008     And someone familiar with        the city of Thunder Bay.     115 00:05:42,041 --> 00:05:44,510        Wow, spectacular.         116 00:05:44,544 --> 00:05:46,646        -It's a good view.                 -Look at this.          117 00:05:46,679 --> 00:05:51,117                ♪                 118 00:05:51,150 --> 00:05:53,953      I did almost 28 years            as a police officer.        119 00:05:53,986 --> 00:05:55,521     From human trafficking,      120 00:05:55,555 --> 00:05:57,557         I went into the                  homicide squad.          121 00:05:57,590 --> 00:06:00,059   Then I got a call and asked       if I would come down and      122 00:06:00,093 --> 00:06:02,462   take over the sexual assault        squad at headquarters.      123 00:06:02,495 --> 00:06:04,464     That's how I wrapped up                my career.             124 00:06:04,497 --> 00:06:05,965        One of the things             I loved about policing,      125 00:06:05,998 --> 00:06:07,233   and still do today is that,    126 00:06:07,266 --> 00:06:08,801        every adventure's                a new challenge.          127 00:06:08,835 --> 00:06:10,903     To me, the best part of            any day, for me to         128 00:06:10,937 --> 00:06:13,373   get focused on somebody and       to be able to go out and      129 00:06:13,406 --> 00:06:16,709      bring them to justice.      130 00:06:16,743 --> 00:06:18,411   It all seems so improbable,    131 00:06:18,444 --> 00:06:20,480      a serial killer seems              so improbable...          132 00:06:20,513 --> 00:06:23,015   until you dig into something      like the national inquiry     133 00:06:23,049 --> 00:06:24,884    into missing and murdered            Indigenous women.         134 00:06:24,917 --> 00:06:27,487     Like, that's improbable.     135 00:06:27,520 --> 00:06:30,356       I think when we take             a look at, you know,       136 00:06:30,390 --> 00:06:32,191        different current                 serial killers,          137 00:06:32,225 --> 00:06:36,562   out in BC, with Pickton and         what he did with the        138 00:06:36,596 --> 00:06:41,501   sex workers there, there is        a predatory instinct...      139 00:06:41,534 --> 00:06:45,938      to choose victims who           traditionally have been      140 00:06:45,972 --> 00:06:49,876        very neglected by                police services,          141 00:06:49,909 --> 00:06:54,280     where those deaths will        always be treated as, as...    142 00:06:54,313 --> 00:06:56,949       you know, bad luck.        143 00:06:56,983 --> 00:06:59,685        So, like, in the               realm of possibility,       144 00:06:59,719 --> 00:07:02,922  could there have been someone    targeting Indigenous people?    145 00:07:02,955 --> 00:07:06,292    If you just talk about the       serial killer component...    146 00:07:06,325 --> 00:07:09,962    there hasn't been obvious                                 evi. 147 00:07:09,996 --> 00:07:14,434   And typically, you have that       in a serial killer case.     148 00:07:14,467 --> 00:07:17,136     But there are exceptions,          like what happened in      149 00:07:17,170 --> 00:07:20,807    Toronto's gay village with        the Bruce McArthur case.     150 00:07:20,840 --> 00:07:24,076   [News] For nine days, police      sifted through two compost    151 00:07:24,110 --> 00:07:27,146     piles dumped on a ravine          behind the house where      152 00:07:27,180 --> 00:07:30,116       McArthur stored his              landscaping tools.         153 00:07:30,149 --> 00:07:32,585  [Dave] If you look at the City      of Toronto on a map and      154 00:07:32,618 --> 00:07:34,921          how small the                   gay village is,          155 00:07:34,954 --> 00:07:36,722        that little circle                  on the map,            156 00:07:36,756 --> 00:07:38,624        and that was all              happening in that area,      157 00:07:38,658 --> 00:07:40,626        that just screams               of a serial killer.        158 00:07:40,660 --> 00:07:43,095                ♪                 159 00:07:43,129 --> 00:07:44,897      There are there are no          similarities between that    160 00:07:44,931 --> 00:07:47,066      hustling and bustling            downtown neighbourhood      161 00:07:47,099 --> 00:07:49,135           in Toronto...          162 00:07:49,168 --> 00:07:50,636    and where Indigenous youth            have been found          163 00:07:50,670 --> 00:07:53,573    in the city of Thunder Bay.   164 00:07:53,606 --> 00:07:56,142    But, the direct similarity         between the two cases       165 00:07:56,175 --> 00:07:59,245    is that it all happened in          concentrated areas.        166 00:07:59,278 --> 00:08:02,982                ♪                 167 00:08:03,015 --> 00:08:04,951       But interestingly,              as in serial killers,       168 00:08:04,984 --> 00:08:07,086     where you're looking at          patterns of behaviour,       169 00:08:07,119 --> 00:08:09,522     there were patterns of         behaviour up in Thunder Bay    170 00:08:09,555 --> 00:08:11,657       that would draw any          investigator's attention to    171 00:08:11,691 --> 00:08:14,293     at least say, "What the          hell is going on here?"      172 00:08:14,327 --> 00:08:21,267                ♪                 173 00:08:21,300 --> 00:08:24,270    So, what do those in power      at the Police Service and at   174 00:08:24,303 --> 00:08:26,472      City Hall think of the              possibility of a         175 00:08:26,506 --> 00:08:29,542        serial killer loose                in Thunder Bay?         176 00:08:29,575 --> 00:08:32,445     I'm not sure it was ever          seriously considered.       177 00:08:32,478 --> 00:08:34,347          This is former                 Mayor Keith Hobbs,        178 00:08:34,380 --> 00:08:37,683    suggesting his own theory.    179 00:08:37,717 --> 00:08:39,485         There's been no               evidence of foul play       180 00:08:39,519 --> 00:08:41,454   in all those investigations.   181 00:08:41,487 --> 00:08:44,557    There was alcohol related          in every single one.        182 00:08:44,590 --> 00:08:48,127      Again, I think that we         have to start teaching the    183 00:08:48,160 --> 00:08:50,530  children that are coming down      from northern communities     184 00:08:50,563 --> 00:08:53,199         how to integrate                  into the city           185 00:08:53,232 --> 00:08:55,034   when they come to the city.    186 00:08:55,067 --> 00:08:58,371    "Integrate into the city."    187 00:08:58,404 --> 00:09:00,072    These words cut through me    188 00:09:00,106 --> 00:09:02,708        when a story breaks              across the country,       189 00:09:02,742 --> 00:09:05,811     instantly reminding me of           what "integration"        190 00:09:05,845 --> 00:09:09,181       failures looks like.                   and its              191 00:09:09,215 --> 00:09:11,050      On this Friday night,       192 00:09:11,083 --> 00:09:13,920          a devastating                  discovery in B.C.         193 00:09:13,953 --> 00:09:16,222       A graveyard full of              hundreds of children       194 00:09:16,255 --> 00:09:17,590    at a former residential...    195 00:09:17,623 --> 00:09:19,425       While we were filming               in Thunder Bay,         196 00:09:19,458 --> 00:09:21,827      news broke out of B.C.             that a mass grave         197 00:09:21,861 --> 00:09:24,830        had been found at a              residential school.       198 00:09:24,864 --> 00:09:27,600    We begin tonight with the         horrific discovery of a      199 00:09:27,633 --> 00:09:30,036         suspected burial                site for children,        200 00:09:30,069 --> 00:09:31,837     some as young as three,      201 00:09:31,871 --> 00:09:33,539          at the former                   Kamloops Indian          202 00:09:33,573 --> 00:09:36,409        Residential School              in British Columbia.       203 00:09:36,442 --> 00:09:37,376      The remains of what's               believed to be           204 00:09:37,410 --> 00:09:42,381     215 children were found            in unmarked graves.        205 00:09:42,415 --> 00:09:46,886                ♪                 206 00:09:46,919 --> 00:09:48,187       There are only a few           moments in my life where     207 00:09:48,220 --> 00:09:50,790     I feel like time stopped.    208 00:09:50,823 --> 00:09:53,759                ♪                 209 00:09:53,793 --> 00:09:56,429       This is one of them.       210 00:09:56,462 --> 00:10:03,803                ♪                 211 00:10:03,836 --> 00:10:06,472          I was numb when                 I heard the news.        212 00:10:06,505 --> 00:10:08,574     I have Indian residential            school survivors         213 00:10:08,608 --> 00:10:11,377         in my family, and                in my community.         214 00:10:11,410 --> 00:10:16,716                ♪                 215 00:10:16,749 --> 00:10:19,652       We had heard stories             like this for years.       216 00:10:19,685 --> 00:10:22,254                ♪                 217 00:10:22,288 --> 00:10:24,223    Just because Canada and the       world hadn't learned the     218 00:10:24,256 --> 00:10:27,593   whole truth yet, didn't mean      we didn't know it already.    219 00:10:27,627 --> 00:10:35,434                ♪                 220 00:10:35,468 --> 00:10:38,070     This is what happens when        you force Indigenous kids    221 00:10:38,104 --> 00:10:40,806         to integrate into                 white culture.          222 00:10:40,840 --> 00:10:43,576                ♪                 223 00:10:43,609 --> 00:10:46,112          You steal kids                 from their parents.       224 00:10:46,145 --> 00:10:48,948                ♪                 225 00:10:48,981 --> 00:10:51,117        You force a foreign              language, religion,       226 00:10:51,150 --> 00:10:54,854      and culture on them...      227 00:10:54,887 --> 00:10:58,024         And, sometimes...        228 00:10:58,057 --> 00:11:00,426   you kill them along the way.   229 00:11:00,459 --> 00:11:05,631                ♪                 230 00:11:10,069 --> 00:11:12,338     What if I told you that,             in its own way,          231 00:11:12,371 --> 00:11:15,808       it's still happening             here in Thunder Bay?       232 00:11:15,841 --> 00:11:17,643      Because here's another            thing that connects        233 00:11:17,677 --> 00:11:19,679   most Indigenous teen victims:  234 00:11:19,712 --> 00:11:22,014      they were all forced to           leave their homes and      235 00:11:22,048 --> 00:11:24,617     families to come here...     236 00:11:24,650 --> 00:11:27,520            for school.           237 00:11:27,553 --> 00:11:30,022     Children have to go to           Thunder Bay if they are      238 00:11:30,056 --> 00:11:33,826    living in northern remote       communities because there is   239 00:11:33,859 --> 00:11:37,329   no facilities or schooling      for them to be able to pursue   240 00:11:37,363 --> 00:11:39,965       high school within             their own First Nation.      241 00:11:39,999 --> 00:11:44,036     And the answer provided             to these children         242 00:11:44,070 --> 00:11:45,538       in these communities       243 00:11:45,571 --> 00:11:47,707         is to take them                out of their homes,        244 00:11:47,740 --> 00:11:51,977    to put them into boarding          homes in Thunder Bay.       245 00:11:52,011 --> 00:11:55,514     It's really hard to see           your daughter leave.        246 00:11:55,548 --> 00:11:58,517     The fact that there are         students who have to leave    247 00:11:58,551 --> 00:12:01,020     their homes and families          to go to high school,       248 00:12:01,053 --> 00:12:02,988      you know, nowhere else              in this country          249 00:12:03,022 --> 00:12:06,892       that that happens.            And while it is a choice,     250 00:12:06,926 --> 00:12:09,729            you know,                  it's still so much...       251 00:12:09,762 --> 00:12:12,331     a forced choice, right?      252 00:12:12,364 --> 00:12:16,368  It is completely unimaginable     for me to go from living in    253 00:12:16,402 --> 00:12:19,438        a community where               you know everybody,        254 00:12:19,472 --> 00:12:23,709  to living in a community where     there are traffic lights,     255 00:12:23,743 --> 00:12:28,280    and all kinds of different       things that you have only     256 00:12:28,314 --> 00:12:31,917     experienced vicariously             on television...          257 00:12:31,951 --> 00:12:35,688      or through stories of            people that you know.       258 00:12:35,721 --> 00:12:38,591     For First Nations youth         who are coming to a whole     259 00:12:38,624 --> 00:12:40,960     new city and don't know          the rules of the city,       260 00:12:40,993 --> 00:12:44,029        the know-how of,               how do we get around,       261 00:12:44,063 --> 00:12:45,865       how do we stay safe,              who do we talk to,        262 00:12:45,898 --> 00:12:47,700      who do we not talk to-      263 00:12:47,733 --> 00:12:50,569      How do you navigate...      264 00:12:50,603 --> 00:12:53,739    urban populated settings?     265 00:12:53,773 --> 00:12:55,975   When these young people pack      their bags and move to the    266 00:12:56,008 --> 00:13:00,646    city for school, they leave          everything behind.        267 00:13:00,679 --> 00:13:03,048            Everything.           268 00:13:04,850 --> 00:13:05,818                ♪                 269 00:13:05,851 --> 00:13:08,587      I'm not from a northern             fly-in community,        270 00:13:08,621 --> 00:13:10,556     so I don't know what it's        like to move from one to     271 00:13:10,589 --> 00:13:13,425       a relatively big city              like Thunder Bay.        272 00:13:13,459 --> 00:13:15,594        But these folks do.       273 00:13:15,628 --> 00:13:18,264      -What's our team name?                -'Kick Ass.'           274 00:13:18,297 --> 00:13:19,765         -Can we do that?                      -Yeah.              275 00:13:19,799 --> 00:13:21,300      As long as your kookum           doesn't kick your ass       276 00:13:21,333 --> 00:13:23,169       for swearing on TV.        277 00:13:23,202 --> 00:13:25,304            [Laughing]            278 00:13:25,337 --> 00:13:28,107                ♪                 279 00:13:28,140 --> 00:13:32,778      -You go ahead, Amelia.                   -Okay.              280 00:13:32,812 --> 00:13:34,280    -Almost got the 8 ball in!                 -Pfft!              281 00:13:34,313 --> 00:13:35,781         That was the 8.          282 00:13:35,815 --> 00:13:37,683       She's had her spirit          helpers just directing it.    283 00:13:37,716 --> 00:13:40,419        [Laughing] I did.         284 00:13:40,452 --> 00:13:42,588           -You see it?                         -Eh!               285 00:13:42,621 --> 00:13:44,456         I have to close                    my one eye.            286 00:13:44,490 --> 00:13:46,091            [Laughing]            287 00:13:46,125 --> 00:13:47,426    I'm bad with perspective.     288 00:13:47,459 --> 00:13:49,495         You should have               heard my art teacher.       289 00:13:49,528 --> 00:13:52,031            [Laughing]            290 00:13:52,064 --> 00:13:55,100     Amelia is from here, but         Leslie and Lucille know      291 00:13:55,134 --> 00:13:57,336      how hard it is to leave             everything behind        292 00:13:57,369 --> 00:13:58,971      to come to Thunder Bay.     293 00:13:59,004 --> 00:14:00,873               No!                294 00:14:00,906 --> 00:14:04,343         It was exciting                coming here, and...        295 00:14:04,376 --> 00:14:07,513       But that excitement                 disappeared.            296 00:14:07,546 --> 00:14:10,482    I started to feel lonely,          started drinking and,       297 00:14:10,516 --> 00:14:12,885      you know, doing drugs,                   and...              298 00:14:12,918 --> 00:14:16,055        eventually, I just                 got sent home.          299 00:14:16,088 --> 00:14:19,158       When I moved to the,            the city from the rez,      300 00:14:19,191 --> 00:14:21,493        everything was so                different for me.         301 00:14:21,527 --> 00:14:25,064    I felt lost, I felt lonely           for my friends and        302 00:14:25,097 --> 00:14:27,666          family back in                   my community.           303 00:14:27,700 --> 00:14:28,901         Everything is so                 different here.          304 00:14:28,934 --> 00:14:30,703      Everything is so fast.      305 00:14:30,736 --> 00:14:32,071            So, is it                   overwhelming and...?       306 00:14:32,104 --> 00:14:34,406          Yeah, it was                 overwhelming, yeah...       307 00:14:34,440 --> 00:14:37,042          -That feeling.                -Where are you from?       308 00:14:37,076 --> 00:14:41,247      Webequie, is where I,             where I came from.         309 00:14:41,280 --> 00:14:42,915       Late Jordan Wabasse,       310 00:14:42,948 --> 00:14:44,583       one of our youth in                 my community,           311 00:14:44,617 --> 00:14:47,653     got thrown in the river,     312 00:14:47,686 --> 00:14:52,157          and I was very              devastated by that news.     313 00:14:52,191 --> 00:14:54,593        He's talking about                Jordan Wabasse,          314 00:14:54,627 --> 00:14:56,295         one of the youth                 that died here.          315 00:15:03,269 --> 00:15:05,104        Lucille, you okay?                      No.                316 00:15:05,137 --> 00:15:07,239           [Off-screen]                   ...take a break?         317 00:15:07,273 --> 00:15:15,281                ♪                 318 00:15:15,314 --> 00:15:18,183       I had a 15-year-old                 cousin who...           319 00:15:18,217 --> 00:15:20,252  came out here for high school.  320 00:15:20,286 --> 00:15:21,921        And she's from...         321 00:15:21,954 --> 00:15:25,457     she was from Nishganiga.     322 00:15:25,491 --> 00:15:28,260             Then...              323 00:15:28,294 --> 00:15:31,030          um, she went                   home for a break.         324 00:15:31,063 --> 00:15:32,298       She didn't want to,        325 00:15:32,331 --> 00:15:35,267       she didn't want to               come back out here.        326 00:15:35,301 --> 00:15:38,470          Then when she                  came back here...         327 00:15:38,504 --> 00:15:40,873       She killed herself.        328 00:15:40,906 --> 00:15:46,445                ♪                 329 00:15:46,478 --> 00:15:50,883    Even my sister, throughout      the time she's been out here   330 00:15:50,916 --> 00:15:54,219      for high school, she          tried to take her own life.    331 00:15:54,253 --> 00:15:58,824   I guess she was lonely and,         going through a lot.        332 00:15:58,857 --> 00:16:01,994        And I just didn't              know how to help her.       333 00:16:02,027 --> 00:16:06,298   Having to leave at 12 or 13       is just hard for any kid.     334 00:16:06,332 --> 00:16:10,970     I don't care how mature          or how strong you are,       335 00:16:11,003 --> 00:16:13,105          without those                 supports around you,       336 00:16:13,138 --> 00:16:15,607   when you go to high school,             far away from           337 00:16:15,641 --> 00:16:16,842         your family and                  your community,          338 00:16:16,875 --> 00:16:18,143        you're gonna have                  a rough time,           339 00:16:18,177 --> 00:16:19,511        you're gonna have                  a tough time.           340 00:16:19,545 --> 00:16:25,351        And I experienced                 that firsthand.          341 00:16:25,384 --> 00:16:27,753         How does this tie               into our theory #1?       342 00:16:27,786 --> 00:16:31,623    Because their vulnerability         and their innocence,       343 00:16:31,657 --> 00:16:35,928    would have made them prime      targets for a serial killer.   344 00:16:35,961 --> 00:16:38,964       When we see history,                and we see how          345 00:16:38,998 --> 00:16:41,266       residential schools                 where, again,           346 00:16:41,300 --> 00:16:44,670    these kids were taken out         of the family home for       347 00:16:44,703 --> 00:16:47,706         the purpose of                 pursuing education,        348 00:16:47,740 --> 00:16:50,876       and what ultimately              ends up happening is       349 00:16:50,909 --> 00:16:52,644    nothing akin to education.    350 00:16:52,678 --> 00:16:57,783      What ends up happening             is ultimate death.        351 00:16:57,816 --> 00:17:00,452    When you are Indigenous in        the city of Thunder Bay,     352 00:17:00,486 --> 00:17:03,389       grieving and sadness                  and trauma            353 00:17:03,422 --> 00:17:06,225    is a part of your reality.    354 00:17:06,258 --> 00:17:09,895          But so, too, is             searching and fighting...    355 00:17:09,928 --> 00:17:12,531      and walking the streets          looking for loved ones      356 00:17:12,564 --> 00:17:14,133      that have gone missing.     357 00:17:14,166 --> 00:17:16,702        I've lived here my            whole life, right, so...     358 00:17:16,735 --> 00:17:19,138          I've searched                   for these kids.          359 00:17:19,171 --> 00:17:21,240   There's three of them that I     can remember searching for.    360 00:17:21,273 --> 00:17:22,674           When you say                 searching, you mean?       361 00:17:22,708 --> 00:17:24,376          Their bodies.           362 00:17:24,410 --> 00:17:26,578     There was always, like,          search parties going on,     363 00:17:26,612 --> 00:17:28,180     and we'd always go look.     364 00:17:28,213 --> 00:17:30,716   Like, why am I searching for     kids when I'm a kid, myself?   365 00:17:30,749 --> 00:17:33,886      Why is this happening                in this city?           366 00:17:33,919 --> 00:17:37,056     I've been in Sandy Lake      367 00:17:37,089 --> 00:17:39,825     when parents have to...      368 00:17:39,858 --> 00:17:42,694   Are getting ready to go to      the airport to get, you know,   369 00:17:42,728 --> 00:17:44,430       children on a plane,                 to get their           370 00:17:44,463 --> 00:17:46,365         and knowing that                they're, you know,        371 00:17:46,398 --> 00:17:50,002    they're going to a place         like Thunder Bay where...     372 00:17:50,035 --> 00:17:54,273   too many students have come     home in, you know, in coffins.  373 00:17:54,306 --> 00:17:57,876        And the fear, like              the fear is so real.       374 00:17:57,910 --> 00:18:03,615                ♪                 375 00:18:03,649 --> 00:18:09,555                ♪                 376 00:18:09,588 --> 00:18:14,393                ♪                 377 00:18:14,426 --> 00:18:18,597   I started thinking about when     my kids were in 7th grade,    378 00:18:18,630 --> 00:18:21,266      and thinking about them          needing to leave their      379 00:18:21,300 --> 00:18:24,236         safe place just                  to go to school.         380 00:18:24,269 --> 00:18:27,806         People should be                 shocked by that.         381 00:18:27,840 --> 00:18:30,309     I don't think people are         shocked enough by this,      382 00:18:30,342 --> 00:18:32,711       you know, hundreds of            kids having to leave       383 00:18:32,744 --> 00:18:37,783      their communities just              to go to school.         384 00:18:37,816 --> 00:18:39,451       I'm not the only one                 to say this,           385 00:18:39,485 --> 00:18:40,986      but I mean, it's like,                 you know,             386 00:18:41,019 --> 00:18:42,788     extension of residential             school and these         387 00:18:42,821 --> 00:18:45,724      continued policies of            our government to...        388 00:18:45,757 --> 00:18:54,299     to, what, assimilate us          Indians into mainstream?     389 00:18:54,333 --> 00:18:57,002      At first, I thought the       serial killer theory was just  390 00:18:57,035 --> 00:19:00,672        a wild rumour that           couldn't possibly be true.    391 00:19:00,706 --> 00:19:04,943        But then I took a                moment of pause...        392 00:19:04,977 --> 00:19:07,346     and I thought about the          history of this country.     393 00:19:07,379 --> 00:19:09,248                ♪                 394 00:19:09,281 --> 00:19:11,116      For Indigenous people,           everything's a rumour       395 00:19:11,150 --> 00:19:13,986     until it's proven true.      396 00:19:14,019 --> 00:19:18,090     And so, there was a time         in this country where...     397 00:19:18,123 --> 00:19:22,294  the atrocities at residential    schools were rumours, right?    398 00:19:22,327 --> 00:19:23,829     There was a time when it           wasn't believed that       399 00:19:23,862 --> 00:19:26,431         electric chairs                 were used on kids.        400 00:19:26,465 --> 00:19:28,534    Rumour until proven true.     401 00:19:28,567 --> 00:19:32,271    And right now, the rumour       that has existed here in the   402 00:19:32,304 --> 00:19:35,174    city is that someone could         be harming these kids.      403 00:19:35,207 --> 00:19:47,219                ♪                 404 00:19:47,252 --> 00:19:49,454    You're gonna go left where         these cars are, Sean.       405 00:19:49,488 --> 00:19:53,025                ♪                 406 00:19:53,058 --> 00:19:56,361   Let's go back to the case of     Jordan Wabasse for a moment.   407 00:19:56,395 --> 00:19:58,897      Because, when it comes               to theory #1,           408 00:19:58,931 --> 00:20:01,667       his story certainly             seems to fit the mold.      409 00:20:01,700 --> 00:20:06,004                ♪                 410 00:20:06,038 --> 00:20:10,642                ♪                 411 00:20:10,676 --> 00:20:14,313    He's down here, his shoe        is found, his hat is found,    412 00:20:14,346 --> 00:20:18,517       and then, somebody             says there's running...      413 00:20:18,550 --> 00:20:22,487      footprints that lead             towards the open ice.       414 00:20:22,521 --> 00:20:25,390      Suggesting that he was              being chased and         415 00:20:25,424 --> 00:20:27,859       running for his life.      416 00:20:27,893 --> 00:20:30,562   But the serial killer theory         actually falls apart       417 00:20:30,596 --> 00:20:33,265        before Jordan ever               got to the river...       418 00:20:33,298 --> 00:20:35,801          at the bus stop                 where he got off.        419 00:20:48,113 --> 00:20:51,883     So, this is where Jordan          got off the bus and...      420 00:20:51,917 --> 00:20:56,688        That's his house,             that second white door.      421 00:20:56,722 --> 00:20:59,024        What's that, like,                two, 300 meters?         422 00:20:59,057 --> 00:21:00,892              Yeah.               423 00:21:00,926 --> 00:21:03,295     That's sad, eh, when you         think he was this close?     424 00:21:03,328 --> 00:21:06,531     And I can't- This is the          part I can't get over.      425 00:21:06,565 --> 00:21:08,700        It's right there.         426 00:21:08,734 --> 00:21:10,569        You know, you can,                you can see it.          427 00:21:10,602 --> 00:21:11,903      Something interjected             right there, right?        428 00:21:11,937 --> 00:21:14,806      Something interjected            on what his path was.       429 00:21:14,840 --> 00:21:16,875               And,                      according to some,        430 00:21:16,908 --> 00:21:21,113     that 'something' was more            than one person.         431 00:21:21,146 --> 00:21:24,483   There were witnesses on the      bus who saw people waiting     432 00:21:24,516 --> 00:21:30,422     at the bus stop for him          when he got off the bus.     433 00:21:30,455 --> 00:21:32,324     So, if the story is that           there was more than        434 00:21:32,357 --> 00:21:34,259      one person waiting for             Jordan when he got        435 00:21:34,293 --> 00:21:37,896      off the bus that night,            that must mean that       436 00:21:37,929 --> 00:21:40,432    we're not actually dealing        with a serial killer...      437 00:21:40,465 --> 00:21:43,235                ♪                 438 00:21:43,268 --> 00:21:44,736    'Cause from what I'm told,    439 00:21:44,770 --> 00:21:48,407       serial killers almost              always act alone.        440 00:21:48,440 --> 00:21:51,510    And, Jordan isn't the only         one to be attacked by       441 00:21:51,543 --> 00:21:53,578          a group of men.         442 00:21:53,612 --> 00:21:57,416                ♪                 443 00:21:57,449 --> 00:22:01,153      I just thank God that         you're still alive with us.    444 00:22:01,186 --> 00:22:03,522     That's what the aunt of         Jayden Matthews says after    445 00:22:03,555 --> 00:22:05,791      her 16-year-old nephew            escaped an attempted       446 00:22:05,824 --> 00:22:07,326       abduction recently.        447 00:22:22,574 --> 00:22:25,143   He says the men grabbed his       left arm and punched him      448 00:22:25,177 --> 00:22:28,347   three times in the stomach,         then, he saw a rock.        449 00:22:39,858 --> 00:22:42,294       Which brings us to a            second popular theory,      450 00:22:42,327 --> 00:22:47,199      and this one involves a          boy named Stephen Cole.     451 00:22:47,232 --> 00:22:51,970                ♪                 452 00:22:52,003 --> 00:22:55,340          [Dogs barking]          453 00:22:55,374 --> 00:22:59,711                ♪                 454 00:22:59,745 --> 00:23:05,550                ♪                 455 00:23:05,584 --> 00:23:07,919      Stephen Cole was about            the same age group,        456 00:23:07,953 --> 00:23:09,988         they anecdotally                 knew each other,         457 00:23:10,021 --> 00:23:12,557    and he told many people...    458 00:23:12,591 --> 00:23:15,727   that he did it, that he and      a friend or two had chased     459 00:23:15,761 --> 00:23:17,929      Jordan and rolled him             for a bag of weed.         460 00:23:17,963 --> 00:23:23,068                ♪                 461 00:23:23,101 --> 00:23:27,072        He told one friend               this the next day.        462 00:23:27,105 --> 00:23:29,508      He told his brother,            he told his girlfriend.      463 00:23:29,541 --> 00:23:31,777       I mean, continued to            tell people for years.      464 00:23:31,810 --> 00:23:35,013                ♪                 465 00:23:35,046 --> 00:23:37,682  [News] Thunder Bay Police are     reporting a major drug bust    466 00:23:37,716 --> 00:23:40,952        last night on the                city's north side.        467 00:23:40,986 --> 00:23:43,622         Gangs, and guns,                    and drugs-            468 00:23:43,655 --> 00:23:45,424      they're a huge part of             the crime problem         469 00:23:45,457 --> 00:23:47,292       here in Thunder Bay.       470 00:23:47,325 --> 00:23:48,927      And I think to myself,      471 00:23:48,960 --> 00:23:51,963        could this be what               happened to Jordan?       472 00:23:51,997 --> 00:23:53,231    Could this be what happened          to the others that        473 00:23:53,265 --> 00:23:56,234     have died in the rivers?     474 00:23:56,268 --> 00:23:58,637        I just don't think             we're ever gonna know.      475 00:23:58,670 --> 00:24:00,972    There was no investigation            of this lead to          476 00:24:01,006 --> 00:24:04,910         see if it could                 possibly be true.         477 00:24:04,943 --> 00:24:06,878      The Thunder Bay Police              dropped the case         478 00:24:06,912 --> 00:24:08,580          as soon as his                   body was found,         479 00:24:08,613 --> 00:24:12,217    and the coroner declared it     death by cold water drowning.  480 00:24:12,250 --> 00:24:14,920                ♪                 481 00:24:14,953 --> 00:24:18,723     That doesn't explain how         he got into that river.      482 00:24:18,757 --> 00:24:21,726      And that's really the          nexus of this whole story.    483 00:24:21,760 --> 00:24:23,895                ♪                 484 00:24:23,929 --> 00:24:27,165   The role of the police is to     figure out and investigate,    485 00:24:27,199 --> 00:24:29,401    why did that person drown?    486 00:24:29,434 --> 00:24:33,104       How did that person              get into the water?        487 00:24:33,138 --> 00:24:35,674       And the Thunder Bay              Police Service said,       488 00:24:35,707 --> 00:24:37,742        "We don't need to            investigate this further.     489 00:24:37,776 --> 00:24:40,645          No harm here.              Nothing's happened here."     490 00:24:40,679 --> 00:24:42,981                ♪                 491 00:24:43,014 --> 00:24:45,283           There is one                    other theory...         492 00:24:45,317 --> 00:24:47,285          And it's dark.          493 00:24:47,319 --> 00:24:55,827                ♪                 494 00:24:55,861 --> 00:24:57,696    To understand this theory,    495 00:24:57,729 --> 00:25:00,098       you have to hear the             incredible story...        496 00:25:00,131 --> 00:25:04,970       of Darryl Kakekayash.      497 00:25:05,003 --> 00:25:07,038       I have some sage if              you want to smudge.        498 00:25:07,072 --> 00:25:10,509              Yeah.               499 00:25:10,542 --> 00:25:12,310          Darryl grew up                   in Round Lake,          500 00:25:12,344 --> 00:25:14,045           a community                     500 kilometres          501 00:25:14,079 --> 00:25:16,348       north of Thunder Bay.      502 00:25:16,381 --> 00:25:18,283    He convinced his mother to       let him come to Thunder Bay   503 00:25:18,316 --> 00:25:20,552         for high school                  and opportunity,         504 00:25:20,585 --> 00:25:22,988         when he was just                  15 years old.           505 00:25:23,021 --> 00:25:25,123   Thanks for coming back here.     I'll give you this for your,   506 00:25:25,156 --> 00:25:26,691          your journey,                  if you need more.         507 00:25:26,725 --> 00:25:28,293            Thank you.            508 00:25:28,326 --> 00:25:31,296                ♪                 509 00:25:31,329 --> 00:25:34,699      The question of how so           many Indigenous people      510 00:25:34,733 --> 00:25:37,302    ended up in the rivers...     511 00:25:37,335 --> 00:25:41,473   in unexplained circumstances     has haunted me from the time   512 00:25:41,506 --> 00:25:45,744      I first was approached             about these cases.        513 00:25:45,777 --> 00:25:48,747    It started to dawn on me,         it's a strange pattern-      514 00:25:48,780 --> 00:25:52,918         youth or others,                down by the river,        515 00:25:52,951 --> 00:25:56,588     in a vulnerable state,          end up dead in the river.     516 00:25:56,621 --> 00:26:00,158                ♪                 517 00:26:00,191 --> 00:26:05,363            [Clicking]            518 00:26:07,399 --> 00:26:08,900            For Darryl,           519 00:26:08,934 --> 00:26:11,770      the day began like any             other school day.         520 00:26:11,803 --> 00:26:14,539         Lunch break was,                 like, one hour.          521 00:26:14,573 --> 00:26:17,676       So, I took off and               bought a tracksuit.        522 00:26:17,709 --> 00:26:19,244          It was white,                  and it was, like,         523 00:26:19,277 --> 00:26:21,513    black stripes on the side.    524 00:26:21,546 --> 00:26:22,581      You were looking good.      525 00:26:22,614 --> 00:26:24,549           -Yeah, so...                     -[Laughing]            526 00:26:24,583 --> 00:26:26,885    After school, Darryl jumps              on a bus and           527 00:26:26,918 --> 00:26:28,620      heads down to the mall.     528 00:26:28,653 --> 00:26:30,889     He's meeting his cousins          there to see a movie.       529 00:26:30,922 --> 00:26:32,891    What movie did you watch?     530 00:26:32,924 --> 00:26:35,460   My cousin wanted to go watch      Alvin, Simon and Theodore,    531 00:26:35,493 --> 00:26:36,628       'cause I don't know,                what the hell,          532 00:26:36,661 --> 00:26:38,263         that's for kids.                   I told him,            533 00:26:38,296 --> 00:26:39,798            [Laughing]            534 00:26:39,831 --> 00:26:42,934      They have a few laughs,            waste a few hours,        535 00:26:42,968 --> 00:26:45,737       and then it's time to           get home before curfew.     536 00:26:45,770 --> 00:26:49,541   After 6:00 or 7:00, the bus       schedule kind of changes.     537 00:26:49,574 --> 00:26:51,276      It starts to cut back.      538 00:26:51,309 --> 00:26:53,578         It was already                 getting like 10:00.        539 00:26:53,612 --> 00:26:54,779      And the boarding home            where I was staying,        540 00:26:54,813 --> 00:26:58,984   they told me that 10:30 was      the latest I can come home,    541 00:26:59,017 --> 00:27:01,386         so I said, maybe               I'll just walk home.       542 00:27:01,419 --> 00:27:05,056       I kept walking down.       543 00:27:05,090 --> 00:27:07,759   But up ahead, before getting        to the second bridge,       544 00:27:07,792 --> 00:27:10,996     I seen three guys there.     545 00:27:11,029 --> 00:27:15,000      They were, basically,              like white guys.          546 00:27:15,033 --> 00:27:18,403      He was confronted by             some white young men,       547 00:27:18,436 --> 00:27:20,171     who sounded like trolls           to me, quite frankly.       548 00:27:20,205 --> 00:27:23,408    They were underneath this      bridge that crossed the river,  549 00:27:23,441 --> 00:27:24,676      and they came out from            under the bridge and       550 00:27:24,709 --> 00:27:27,012       they confronted him.       551 00:27:27,045 --> 00:27:29,280   I knew they were a bit older          than me because of        552 00:27:29,314 --> 00:27:30,849          the way they                   looked and stuff.         553 00:27:30,882 --> 00:27:31,950        When you saw them,                what did you...          554 00:27:31,983 --> 00:27:33,318     I was gonna ignore them.     555 00:27:33,351 --> 00:27:35,787   Just mind your own business.   556 00:27:35,820 --> 00:27:39,658     Just walk by and give a         little wave and that's it.    557 00:27:39,691 --> 00:27:42,694       But they stopped me.       558 00:27:42,727 --> 00:27:44,763  Darryl was saying, "I'm just,       I'm a high school kid,       559 00:27:44,796 --> 00:27:46,297      I just arrived here."       560 00:27:46,331 --> 00:27:49,300      They asked me, like,             if I had a cigarette.       561 00:27:49,334 --> 00:27:52,370   I gave them one stick each.    562 00:27:52,404 --> 00:27:55,006           Ah, then...            563 00:27:55,040 --> 00:27:58,276   And after, after that, I...    564 00:27:58,309 --> 00:28:00,011     I looked at my time and           I was already getting       565 00:28:00,045 --> 00:28:02,147     close to 10:30. I said,              "Anyways, guys,          566 00:28:02,180 --> 00:28:05,617   I got to get going." I said,         "I got to get home."       567 00:28:05,650 --> 00:28:08,286       So, I tried getting             around them, but they-      568 00:28:08,319 --> 00:28:11,823         they, they kept                  blocking me in.          569 00:28:11,856 --> 00:28:15,960       The guy on the left             threw the first punch.      570 00:28:15,994 --> 00:28:20,665  And then I lost my view where     that guy on the centre was.    571 00:28:20,699 --> 00:28:22,901        And frickin' guy,               he pulled out, like,       572 00:28:22,934 --> 00:28:26,171      maybe a 2x4 this big,       573 00:28:26,204 --> 00:28:29,240        and he smacked me             around the back with it.     574 00:28:29,274 --> 00:28:31,376         And that's how                  they got me down.         575 00:28:31,409 --> 00:28:33,978    And they basically kind of           dragged me towards        576 00:28:34,012 --> 00:28:36,881        down where that,               where that water was.       577 00:28:36,915 --> 00:28:38,349          It's October.           578 00:28:38,383 --> 00:28:41,186        It's Thunder Bay,              the river is freezing.      579 00:28:41,219 --> 00:28:44,255     Once I hit that water,         the coldness just hits you.    580 00:28:44,289 --> 00:28:47,425   And so, I started panicking,          started panicking.        581 00:28:47,459 --> 00:28:50,428       I stood up, but the             guys grabbed me again,      582 00:28:50,462 --> 00:28:53,598    and then I got thrown back       in there the second time.     583 00:28:53,631 --> 00:28:55,834     And so, there I started          thinking, like, this is,     584 00:28:55,867 --> 00:28:58,169        this is, this was              gonna probably be it.       585 00:28:58,203 --> 00:28:59,904   I was pretty loud in there,    586 00:28:59,938 --> 00:29:01,606      like yelling for help             and shit like that.        587 00:29:01,639 --> 00:29:03,842              -Yeah.                        -[Sniffling]           588 00:29:03,875 --> 00:29:06,277      The water wasn't deep,             but he was soaked.        589 00:29:06,311 --> 00:29:08,880     And so, what he tried to             do was escape to         590 00:29:08,913 --> 00:29:10,849   the other side of the river.   591 00:29:10,882 --> 00:29:12,851          But the ground                  under the water,         592 00:29:12,884 --> 00:29:15,887      it was so muddy, like,              I lost my shoes.         593 00:29:15,920 --> 00:29:18,256    So, I just kept thinking,                you know,             594 00:29:18,289 --> 00:29:20,091    get out, get out, get out.    595 00:29:20,125 --> 00:29:22,260        Finally, Darryl was              able to grab on to        596 00:29:22,293 --> 00:29:23,762       the branch of a tree.      597 00:29:23,795 --> 00:29:26,197      And then I pushed up,             and then I started         598 00:29:26,231 --> 00:29:28,600       running up the hill               as fast as I can.         599 00:29:28,633 --> 00:29:33,772        ♪ [Suspenseful] ♪         600 00:29:33,805 --> 00:29:36,574         After he got out,           he flagged down a city bus.   601 00:29:36,608 --> 00:29:37,876                ♪                 602 00:29:37,909 --> 00:29:40,278         An initial police                report was made.         603 00:29:40,311 --> 00:29:44,215       But, he quit school,              left Thunder Bay,         604 00:29:44,249 --> 00:29:48,319     and avoided talking about        what happened for years.     605 00:29:48,353 --> 00:29:51,389    Was your reluctance to...     606 00:29:51,422 --> 00:29:54,159       talk to the police              at all tied to, like,       607 00:29:54,192 --> 00:29:55,827     not trusting the police?     608 00:29:55,860 --> 00:29:58,096       Every body that they             found at the river,        609 00:29:58,129 --> 00:30:00,765        there was always,                 "No foul play."          610 00:30:00,799 --> 00:30:01,833      You know what I mean?       611 00:30:01,866 --> 00:30:04,803     It's like, I don't think        they're taking it serious.    612 00:30:04,836 --> 00:30:07,138     Listen, I've been around       this business my whole life.   613 00:30:07,172 --> 00:30:08,940    They were gonna kill him.     614 00:30:08,973 --> 00:30:11,242        What other purpose               would you have for        615 00:30:11,276 --> 00:30:13,244         hitting somebody                   with a 2x4,            616 00:30:13,278 --> 00:30:14,646        throwing him in a               freezing cold river,       617 00:30:14,679 --> 00:30:16,147      and then throwing him                in every time           618 00:30:16,181 --> 00:30:18,383      he tried to get out?          That was an attempt murder.    619 00:30:22,320 --> 00:30:27,926                ♪                 620 00:30:27,959 --> 00:30:31,429         Who would do this                to a teenager...         621 00:30:31,462 --> 00:30:35,667        who's just walking              home alone at night?       622 00:30:35,700 --> 00:30:36,801  This is where it all happened.  623 00:30:36,835 --> 00:30:38,436          This is where                  they attacked you?        624 00:30:38,469 --> 00:30:40,672              Yeah.               625 00:30:40,705 --> 00:30:44,042       That's the branch I              pulled myself with.        626 00:30:44,075 --> 00:30:46,344  This place looks so different.  627 00:30:46,377 --> 00:30:48,947                ♪                 628 00:30:48,980 --> 00:30:50,281         We've heard about              people getting things      629 00:30:50,315 --> 00:30:53,318        thrown at them out                of moving cars-          630 00:30:53,351 --> 00:30:56,721     chicken McNuggets, eggs,     631 00:30:56,754 --> 00:31:00,625            garbage...                    trailer hitches.         632 00:31:00,658 --> 00:31:03,962         We've heard about              attempted abductions.      633 00:31:03,995 --> 00:31:06,865      We know these stories,           so it's not outside the     634 00:31:06,898 --> 00:31:10,201   realm of possibility that it         is a group of people       635 00:31:10,235 --> 00:31:12,670       out there picking on                  vulnerable            636 00:31:12,704 --> 00:31:15,240    Indigenous people for fun.    637 00:31:15,273 --> 00:31:16,841         That is possible.        638 00:31:16,875 --> 00:31:18,877     You know, there's an old        story about what farm boys    639 00:31:18,910 --> 00:31:21,412      do to go have fun on a           Saturday night, right?      640 00:31:21,446 --> 00:31:25,250  They go and tip cows and have    a good laugh about it, right?   641 00:31:25,283 --> 00:31:27,585          So, what if...          642 00:31:27,619 --> 00:31:31,356    instead of tipping cows...    643 00:31:31,389 --> 00:31:33,825    they roll "drunk Indians"             into the river?          644 00:31:33,858 --> 00:31:35,994                ♪                 645 00:31:36,027 --> 00:31:38,997        Well, you sharing           your story, I know it brings   646 00:31:39,030 --> 00:31:41,432        everything up for               you again, you know.       647 00:31:41,466 --> 00:31:45,069      For me, when I offer             tobacco, like it's...       648 00:31:45,103 --> 00:31:47,572        like a chance for                 me to pray, but          649 00:31:47,605 --> 00:31:50,541        a chance for me to               give thanks, too.         650 00:31:50,575 --> 00:31:53,444    And I think for me giving        thanks tonight is to give     651 00:31:53,478 --> 00:31:55,346          thanks to you,               and giving thanks that      652 00:31:55,380 --> 00:31:57,749        you're still here,                   you know.             653 00:31:57,782 --> 00:32:00,919     I kind of thought, like,           I should have died.        654 00:32:00,952 --> 00:32:05,356        I should have been             done with at the time.      655 00:32:05,390 --> 00:32:08,860    Every day when I wake up,      I always say thank you for...   656 00:32:08,893 --> 00:32:10,695     thank you for letting me            live another day.         657 00:32:10,728 --> 00:32:13,431    That's what I always say.     658 00:32:13,464 --> 00:32:18,870                ♪                 659 00:32:18,903 --> 00:32:20,972             [Crying]             660 00:32:21,005 --> 00:32:23,875          [Rubbing hands                     together]             661 00:32:23,908 --> 00:32:38,056       [Anishinaabe prayer]       662 00:32:38,089 --> 00:32:39,891     There's something going          on down by the rivers.       663 00:32:39,924 --> 00:32:42,293        I don't think it's                safe down there.         664 00:32:42,327 --> 00:32:47,732    And I think the truth is        that some of these cases...    665 00:32:47,765 --> 00:32:49,434          are homicides.          666 00:32:49,467 --> 00:32:51,970                ♪                 667 00:32:52,003 --> 00:32:54,405       These three theories                  haunt me.             668 00:32:54,439 --> 00:32:56,808     I really want to know why         the cops didn't try to      669 00:32:56,841 --> 00:32:59,777          work harder to                 solve these deaths.       670 00:32:59,811 --> 00:33:02,647     And I hate to say it, but          I'm starting to think      671 00:33:02,680 --> 00:33:05,917      maybe they didn't want             to know the truth.        672 00:33:05,950 --> 00:33:09,921          Maybe they just                didn't give a shit.       673 00:33:09,954 --> 00:33:12,857    I have a lot of questions-       I have a lot of questions     674 00:33:12,890 --> 00:33:15,326      that we may never have             answers to because        675 00:33:15,360 --> 00:33:19,330    the whole fucking problem        we have in front of us...     676 00:33:19,364 --> 00:33:22,533   is that we know the Thunder          Bay Police Service         677 00:33:22,567 --> 00:33:24,969    botched the investigation             to begin with.           678 00:33:25,003 --> 00:33:28,106                ♪                 679 00:33:28,139 --> 00:33:31,609     There's only one way to       describe the systemic reality   680 00:33:31,642 --> 00:33:35,480     around Indigenous deaths             in Thunder Bay.          681 00:33:35,513 --> 00:33:38,016        I used to think it             was just incompetence.      682 00:33:38,049 --> 00:33:41,152    Now I realize, the system         operates in Thunder Bay      683 00:33:41,185 --> 00:33:43,654         exactly as it's                 meant to operate.         684 00:33:43,688 --> 00:33:47,959      There are two kinds of           lives in Thunder Bay.       685 00:33:47,992 --> 00:33:50,395     There are worthy lives-           non-Indigenous people       686 00:33:50,428 --> 00:33:52,230   who are worth investigating-   687 00:33:52,263 --> 00:33:54,699     and there are Indigenous           lives that are not.        688 00:33:54,732 --> 00:33:56,534          I sound like a                conspiracy theorist,       689 00:33:56,567 --> 00:33:59,337       but you have to ask              yourself a question:       690 00:33:59,370 --> 00:34:03,574  How many times do people need     to see the same thing over     691 00:34:03,608 --> 00:34:06,344    and over again before they        start asking questions?      692 00:34:06,377 --> 00:34:09,480      I can't comprehend...       693 00:34:09,514 --> 00:34:16,921         what the, these               parents go through...       694 00:34:16,954 --> 00:34:19,857  because they lost their kid...  695 00:34:19,891 --> 00:34:22,393      in such a tragic way.       696 00:34:22,427 --> 00:34:24,262                ♪                 697 00:34:24,295 --> 00:34:27,198          Which brings us                   back to this,          698 00:34:27,231 --> 00:34:30,601       the fact that it just              keeps happening.         699 00:34:30,635 --> 00:34:32,670    Just when you think things         can't get any worse in      700 00:34:32,703 --> 00:34:37,608      Thunder Bay, they find            a way to get worse.        701 00:34:37,642 --> 00:34:42,947      The scale of this whole          thing is overwhelming.      702 00:34:42,980 --> 00:34:45,283   I've talked with people here     in the community that figure   703 00:34:45,316 --> 00:34:49,520    there may be dozens, maybe       even hundreds more deaths     704 00:34:49,554 --> 00:34:51,956          that we've just                  never heard of.         705 00:34:51,989 --> 00:34:55,059             And yet,                 the official story, well,    706 00:34:55,093 --> 00:34:57,361      we're told that all of                these deaths           707 00:34:57,395 --> 00:34:59,897    are just tragic accidents.    708 00:34:59,931 --> 00:35:02,733                ♪                 709 00:35:02,767 --> 00:35:05,470   And for those that have been      watching for a long time,     710 00:35:05,503 --> 00:35:10,141    those tragic accidents have      been happening for decades.   711 00:35:10,174 --> 00:35:12,577     One person with intimate         knowledge of all of this,    712 00:35:12,610 --> 00:35:16,114      is Deputy Grand Chief          Anna Betty Achneepineskum.    713 00:35:16,147 --> 00:35:18,049             -Hello!                         -Hi, Ryan.            714 00:35:18,082 --> 00:35:20,818         What a beautiful                 spot you choose.         715 00:35:20,852 --> 00:35:23,821         Anna Betty lost                 her niece in 2016,        716 00:35:23,855 --> 00:35:26,924        and her grandnephew                   in 2015.             717 00:35:26,958 --> 00:35:29,760    Two more in a long line of       suspicious deaths in this     718 00:35:29,794 --> 00:35:33,898        city that she can              trace back to the 70s.      719 00:35:33,931 --> 00:35:36,100    I've sat on the riverbank     720 00:35:36,134 --> 00:35:39,637      after a person's body               was discovered.          721 00:35:39,670 --> 00:35:41,772      And the young mom had             just been told that        722 00:35:41,806 --> 00:35:45,743     her son was identified.      723 00:35:45,776 --> 00:35:48,246        And then there was               two other mothers.        724 00:35:48,279 --> 00:35:51,582           One had a...           725 00:35:51,616 --> 00:35:55,086      was pushing a walker.       726 00:35:55,119 --> 00:35:57,255       And she talked about                 how her son            727 00:35:57,288 --> 00:36:00,191         had been found                  in the river too.         728 00:36:00,224 --> 00:36:03,427     And he was 15 years old,     729 00:36:03,461 --> 00:36:06,597     had come to Thunder Bay              for schooling.           730 00:36:06,631 --> 00:36:11,702     And the deaths were not           treated as homicides        731 00:36:11,736 --> 00:36:14,105    or investigated properly.     732 00:36:14,138 --> 00:36:16,207       And it's very, ah...       733 00:36:16,240 --> 00:36:21,179        It's very colour,            colour-coded, race-coded.     734 00:36:21,212 --> 00:36:25,183    And, this was in the 70s.     735 00:36:25,216 --> 00:36:27,118       So, I know this has                been happening           736 00:36:27,151 --> 00:36:29,153     for a really long time.      737 00:36:29,187 --> 00:36:36,460                ♪                 738 00:36:36,494 --> 00:36:38,829          Biiskabaaying.          739 00:36:38,863 --> 00:36:41,799 Biiskabaaying, is a word in the    Ojibwe language that means,    740 00:36:41,832 --> 00:36:45,136      'To look back in order             to look forward'.         741 00:36:45,169 --> 00:36:47,171       And when I look back             here in Thunder Bay,       742 00:36:47,205 --> 00:36:50,875        I see indifference               and incompetence.         743 00:36:50,908 --> 00:36:53,377         This has gone on                   for decades,           744 00:36:53,411 --> 00:36:54,812    and people just throw their          hands up in the air       745 00:36:54,845 --> 00:36:57,882      and go, "I don't know."     746 00:36:57,915 --> 00:37:00,084           "Who knows?"           747 00:37:00,117 --> 00:37:04,689                ♪                 748 00:37:04,722 --> 00:37:07,992     As a parent, it's really               devastating            749 00:37:08,025 --> 00:37:10,228      when you lose a child.      750 00:37:10,261 --> 00:37:12,930     And your world crashes.      751 00:37:12,964 --> 00:37:18,736       And I have to slowly               pick myself up.          752 00:37:18,769 --> 00:37:22,373   And I just don't want other      parents to go through that.    753 00:37:22,406 --> 00:37:25,776         It's not good to         754 00:37:25,810 --> 00:37:29,914       take your child back              home in a coffin.         755 00:37:29,947 --> 00:37:32,350         Like, I've said                 it before that...         756 00:37:32,383 --> 00:37:35,253    if these were white kids,               after two,             757 00:37:35,286 --> 00:37:37,188     there would have been...     758 00:37:37,221 --> 00:37:42,093       after three, can you             imagine the outcry?        759 00:37:42,126 --> 00:37:44,528    For years, those that have        lost people in this city     760 00:37:44,562 --> 00:37:45,963        have been pleading                desperately for          761 00:37:45,997 --> 00:37:49,600      an official provincial         inquest into these deaths,    762 00:37:49,634 --> 00:37:52,103         but with no luck.        763 00:37:52,136 --> 00:37:53,704        You know, I don't                know what it is.          764 00:37:53,738 --> 00:37:58,643      Is it because it's an            Indigenous "problem"?       765 00:37:58,676 --> 00:38:02,246     Is it because we're in          the north, and, you know,     766 00:38:02,280 --> 00:38:05,650     our problems aren't as           important as, you know,      767 00:38:05,683 --> 00:38:09,787             Toronto,                     people may feel?         768 00:38:09,820 --> 00:38:13,991            Or Ottawa?                        Like...              769 00:38:14,025 --> 00:38:16,294          I don't know.           770 00:38:16,327 --> 00:38:22,800                ♪                 771 00:38:22,833 --> 00:38:26,070            And then,                     an announcement.         772 00:38:26,103 --> 00:38:30,408             Finally,                     a sliver of hope.        773 00:38:30,441 --> 00:38:33,444     Ontario's Chief Coroner         announced an inquest today    774 00:38:33,477 --> 00:38:36,614     into the deaths of seven           Aboriginal students.       775 00:38:36,647 --> 00:38:39,083   Central to the inquiry will      be the challenges faced by     776 00:38:39,116 --> 00:38:42,019   hundreds of kids from remote     communities forced to leave    777 00:38:42,053 --> 00:38:46,424        their homes for a              high school education.      778 00:38:46,457 --> 00:38:48,092       And none of it would           have happened without the    779 00:38:48,125 --> 00:38:53,030       unwavering voice of              one grieving mother.       780 00:38:53,064 --> 00:38:56,267     [Ryan] I have the words          "Reggie Bushie's mother"     781 00:38:56,300 --> 00:38:59,537         written on this                  piece of paper.          782 00:38:59,570 --> 00:39:02,306     [Alvin] When governments               said, "No,"            783 00:39:02,340 --> 00:39:04,508         she kept at it,                and she kept at it.        784 00:39:04,542 --> 00:39:06,811          And when they                 finally said, "Yes,"       785 00:39:06,844 --> 00:39:08,946       they only wanted to              look at one death,         786 00:39:08,979 --> 00:39:11,349     which was Reggie Bushie.     787 00:39:11,382 --> 00:39:16,354  And they also wanted to limit      the scope of the inquest,     788 00:39:16,387 --> 00:39:20,124      and Rhoda said, "No,            we also need to look at      789 00:39:20,157 --> 00:39:24,195   the other students that died        here in Thunder Bay."       790 00:39:24,228 --> 00:39:26,564         We all arrive at                 the courthouse.          791 00:39:26,597 --> 00:39:29,367     And of course, you have           your usual, you know,       792 00:39:29,400 --> 00:39:31,035     the Mayor of Thunder Bay              at that time,           793 00:39:31,068 --> 00:39:32,470           Mayor Hobbs,                      showed up.            794 00:39:32,503 --> 00:39:36,073      You know, people want          their photo op on day one.    795 00:39:36,107 --> 00:39:39,910     But almost immediately,         that hope is overshadowed.    796 00:39:39,944 --> 00:39:43,180    And we were in one of the      smallest courtrooms available   797 00:39:43,214 --> 00:39:46,050   in our brand-new courthouse.   798 00:39:46,083 --> 00:39:49,854         And, they had a                total of ten seats.        799 00:39:49,887 --> 00:39:53,090      But the lawyers were            taking up some of them.      800 00:39:53,124 --> 00:39:57,228    And there was one strip of            four tiny seats          801 00:39:57,261 --> 00:39:59,730       that were connected               against the wall,         802 00:39:59,764 --> 00:40:03,667      and that was all that           was provided for family,     803 00:40:03,701 --> 00:40:07,671      for community leaders,                for friends.           804 00:40:07,705 --> 00:40:12,276    I remember somebody got a        chair for Beulah Wabasse,     805 00:40:12,309 --> 00:40:14,178         the grandmother                 of Jordan Wabasse,        806 00:40:14,211 --> 00:40:16,347   and she had to sit outside.    807 00:40:16,380 --> 00:40:19,383    Somebody opened the doors         so that she can see in.      808 00:40:19,417 --> 00:40:23,254   And we were told repeatedly,     "There's nothing we can do.    809 00:40:23,287 --> 00:40:25,890   There's nothing we can do."    810 00:40:25,923 --> 00:40:28,959     I can't really describe          why this is happening.       811 00:40:28,993 --> 00:40:30,761      But I know one thing,                  you know.             812 00:40:30,795 --> 00:40:33,731       If these were seven          non-Native kids, believe me,   813 00:40:33,764 --> 00:40:35,800      the court system would          move heaven and earth to     814 00:40:35,833 --> 00:40:38,803         accommodate the               seven families, but...      815 00:40:38,836 --> 00:40:40,938        because these are              First Nation families,      816 00:40:40,971 --> 00:40:43,307      they're shoved into a           corner in a little room.     817 00:40:43,340 --> 00:40:47,111   That room that they provided           said everything          818 00:40:47,144 --> 00:40:51,048      to the families on the             first day, right?         819 00:40:51,081 --> 00:40:55,119   "Your children don't matter.          You don't matter."        820 00:40:55,152 --> 00:40:57,254     And that was one of the        hardest parts that followed,   821 00:40:57,288 --> 00:41:00,057       was watching mothers             get on the stand and       822 00:41:00,090 --> 00:41:03,294       have to, basically,          beg the jury to believe that   823 00:41:03,327 --> 00:41:08,666    their child was worthy of       anyone giving a fuck about.    824 00:41:08,699 --> 00:41:14,271                ♪                 825 00:41:14,305 --> 00:41:17,975      There was, in my view,           a predetermined theory      826 00:41:18,008 --> 00:41:20,144     from the coroner council               perspective,           827 00:41:20,177 --> 00:41:22,246       from the Thunder Bay           Police Service Board and     828 00:41:22,279 --> 00:41:24,281       Chief's perspective,       829 00:41:24,315 --> 00:41:26,016         from the City of             Thunder Bay perspective,     830 00:41:26,050 --> 00:41:29,587      that every youth died             due to drinking and        831 00:41:29,620 --> 00:41:31,589        fell in the water.        832 00:41:31,622 --> 00:41:33,524       Drinking, drinking,              drinking, drinking.        833 00:41:33,557 --> 00:41:37,127   This became the story, and      this is every racist's dream.   834 00:41:37,161 --> 00:41:41,799      "Ah, drunks, you know?                  Drunks."             835 00:41:41,832 --> 00:41:44,368     It's something that we          hear over and over again,     836 00:41:44,401 --> 00:41:48,005    whether it's the police or      those in law enforcement and   837 00:41:48,038 --> 00:41:51,208       the justice system:             These children sort of      838 00:41:51,242 --> 00:41:56,213     bring it upon themselves             to end up dead.          839 00:41:56,247 --> 00:41:58,816       As Indigenous youth,                that somehow,           840 00:41:58,849 --> 00:42:03,153       they're responsible             for their own demise.       841 00:42:03,187 --> 00:42:06,023  What's really dangerous about    that is that the assumptions    842 00:42:06,056 --> 00:42:09,827       that were made about             these young people,        843 00:42:09,860 --> 00:42:14,832   is that their actions didn't         have to be explained       844 00:42:14,865 --> 00:42:17,668          because of the                   intoxication.           845 00:42:17,701 --> 00:42:21,372     It doesn't have to make             sense that Jordan         846 00:42:21,405 --> 00:42:24,041   got off the bus and went in         the wrong direction,        847 00:42:24,074 --> 00:42:27,177          walked down a                  rocky steep slope,        848 00:42:27,211 --> 00:42:31,148   and then fell into a river,         because he was drunk.       849 00:42:31,181 --> 00:42:33,851    Although there wasn't one         shred of evidence that       850 00:42:33,884 --> 00:42:37,087     any of these youth ended            up in the water...        851 00:42:37,121 --> 00:42:39,023         due to drinking,         852 00:42:39,056 --> 00:42:42,993       but they just solely               focused on that.         853 00:42:43,027 --> 00:42:46,063   There are a different set of     rules for Indigenous people.   854 00:42:46,096 --> 00:42:48,232         And that's how,               right, that's how the       855 00:42:48,265 --> 00:42:51,769      children of Indigenous         people were stolen, right?    856 00:42:51,802 --> 00:42:55,439         That's how the                 60s Scoop happened.        857 00:42:55,472 --> 00:42:57,841     As the inquest drags on,     858 00:42:57,875 --> 00:43:00,210        the hope dwindles            that the mysterious deaths    859 00:43:00,244 --> 00:43:03,280      of these children will              ever be solved.          860 00:43:03,314 --> 00:43:05,182      But at the very least,      861 00:43:05,215 --> 00:43:07,885       the police now know             they're being watched.      862 00:43:07,918 --> 00:43:12,222          So things have                  to change, right?        863 00:43:12,256 --> 00:43:14,959              Right?              864 00:43:14,992 --> 00:43:17,695             [Sirens]             865 00:43:17,728 --> 00:43:19,763       The evidence that's             available to officers       866 00:43:19,797 --> 00:43:21,865       or investigators are               not suspicious.          867 00:43:21,899 --> 00:43:24,802         "No evidence of                potential foul play.       868 00:43:24,835 --> 00:43:26,470      Don't worry, everyone,                 go home."             869 00:43:26,503 --> 00:43:28,472    Like, they were trying to      keep me away from seeing him,   870 00:43:28,505 --> 00:43:30,407      like they were trying             to hide something.         871 00:43:30,441 --> 00:43:32,643      This is an area where          somebody could have easily    872 00:43:32,676 --> 00:43:34,812     saved themselves, even          if they were intoxicated.     873 00:43:34,845 --> 00:43:36,580        Well, I would have              said you were wrong.       874 00:43:36,614 --> 00:43:39,083   You know, I would have just     guessed death by misadventure.  875 00:43:39,116 --> 00:43:41,819      But now, I don't know             what else is there.        876 00:43:41,852 --> 00:43:43,220       He knew how to swim.       877 00:43:43,253 --> 00:43:44,622       How come he ended up                in the water?           878 00:43:44,655 --> 00:43:46,457   Officers didn't take photos,   879 00:43:46,490 --> 00:43:48,926        did not interview                 key witnesses.           880 00:43:48,959 --> 00:43:51,161         No crime scene,                 no forensic truck,        881 00:43:51,195 --> 00:43:54,665        no holding of the             scene until an autopsy.      882 00:43:54,698 --> 00:43:57,234       What is it that the            Thunder Bay Police knew?     883 00:43:57,267 --> 00:43:59,436  When did they know it and why      didn't they tell anybody?     884 00:43:59,470 --> 00:44:02,206                ♪                 885 00:44:17,988 --> 00:44:40,778 ♪