1
00:00:11,163 --> 00:00:13,483
Gosh. OK...

2
00:00:13,523 --> 00:00:15,923
I'm glad this isn't live.

3
00:00:15,963 --> 00:00:17,963
I'm, like, so not on today.

4
00:00:18,003 --> 00:00:20,683
Can you just say
your name and pronounce it

5
00:00:20,723 --> 00:00:23,843
so nobody messes it up?
Sure, It's Mark Zuckerberg.

6
00:00:23,883 --> 00:00:26,403
How would you like to be identified?
Your title?

7
00:00:26,443 --> 00:00:27,963
Founder and CEO?

8
00:00:29,123 --> 00:00:32,683
I was a sophomore at Harvard
and we needed to- I guess...

9
00:00:34,363 --> 00:00:37,443
I've never really been asked
how the company was started before.

10
00:00:39,483 --> 00:00:41,723
How does how did Facebook start?

11
00:00:44,043 --> 00:00:45,763
Um, now I'm all embarrassed.

12
00:00:48,323 --> 00:00:50,563
I was there,
right from the beginning,

13
00:00:50,603 --> 00:00:53,443
and Mark always carried himself
in a way that showed confidence.

14
00:00:53,483 --> 00:00:56,963
You launched Facebook
- in your dorm room?
- Yeah.

15
00:00:57,003 --> 00:00:59,203
Have a 10 million dollar cheque
in your pocket

16
00:00:59,243 --> 00:01:01,163
probably does that to you.

17
00:01:08,763 --> 00:01:11,683
Facebook is like the world's
largest media company in history.

18
00:01:11,723 --> 00:01:15,243
And one person, Mark Zuckerberg,
is its dictator.

19
00:01:15,283 --> 00:01:19,403
When I first joined, the founders
is on the cover of Time magazine,

20
00:01:19,443 --> 00:01:22,443
movies were being made,
and now you are being told

21
00:01:22,483 --> 00:01:24,283
you destroyed democracy.

22
00:01:26,203 --> 00:01:29,763
And then his worst nightmare,
the threat of regulation.

23
00:01:30,923 --> 00:01:33,483
Congress says they are going to
call for his head,

24
00:01:33,523 --> 00:01:36,123
they summon him, then he appears.

25
00:01:41,163 --> 00:01:42,963
Today could be
the biggest day

26
00:01:43,003 --> 00:01:44,963
of Mark Zuckerberg's entire career.

27
00:01:45,003 --> 00:01:47,923
The Facebook CEO is set to testify
before Congress this afternoon

28
00:01:47,963 --> 00:01:49,843
for the very first time.

29
00:01:49,883 --> 00:01:52,563
The lines out of the door,
Julia, I mean, it's insane.

30
00:01:52,603 --> 00:01:55,403
Its definitely very crowded,
it's our understanding

31
00:01:55,443 --> 00:01:58,643
that he arrived through the garage,
then an elevator upstairs

32
00:01:58,683 --> 00:02:02,203
and he avoided all of the cameras
that where trying to stake him out.

33
00:02:02,243 --> 00:02:05,083
The stakes couldn't be
any higher for Zuckerberg

34
00:02:05,123 --> 00:02:07,563
after revelations
that the personal data

35
00:02:07,603 --> 00:02:11,123
of as many as 87 million users
was improperly obtained.

36
00:02:11,163 --> 00:02:14,443
Facebook really is
facing a crisis of trust.

37
00:02:14,483 --> 00:02:17,043
Mark, why hasn't anyone been
fired over this scandal?

38
00:02:17,083 --> 00:02:19,203
Mr Zuckerberg, is there
any regulation?

39
00:02:19,243 --> 00:02:21,243
Are you putting privacy
over profits now?

40
00:02:38,883 --> 00:02:43,083
Mr Zuckerberg...
are you too powerful?

41
00:02:44,043 --> 00:02:46,043
Do you think you're too powerful?

42
00:02:52,963 --> 00:02:55,443
Today's hearing is extraordinary,

43
00:02:55,483 --> 00:02:58,523
but then Facebook
is pretty extraordinary.

44
00:03:01,683 --> 00:03:04,163
We're here because of what you,
Mr Zuckerberg,

45
00:03:04,203 --> 00:03:05,843
have described as a breach of trust.

46
00:03:08,443 --> 00:03:13,563
As you said, "This is not likely
to be an isolated incident.

47
00:03:15,163 --> 00:03:18,603
We are listening,
America is listening,

48
00:03:18,643 --> 00:03:22,043
and quite possibly,
the world is listening too.

49
00:03:31,723 --> 00:03:35,603
My top priority has always been
our social mission

50
00:03:35,643 --> 00:03:38,403
of connecting people, building
community

51
00:03:38,443 --> 00:03:40,683
and bringing the world
closer together.

52
00:03:40,723 --> 00:03:44,083
We have faced a number of important
issues around privacy,

53
00:03:44,123 --> 00:03:46,123
safety and democracy,

54
00:03:46,163 --> 00:03:48,803
before I talk about the steps we are
taking to address them,

55
00:03:48,843 --> 00:03:51,603
I want to talk about how we got here.

56
00:03:51,643 --> 00:03:54,443
Facebook is an idealistic and
optimistic company,

57
00:03:54,483 --> 00:03:57,043
for most of our existence...

58
00:03:59,003 --> 00:04:01,723
You know, I was a tech journalist
for Fortune magazine.

59
00:04:01,763 --> 00:04:04,243
A PR person called me and said,

60
00:04:04,283 --> 00:04:06,403
"You know, Mark Zuckerberg is
coming to New York.

61
00:04:06,443 --> 00:04:09,163
Would you like to meet him?

62
00:04:09,203 --> 00:04:12,523
My first instinct was, "Oh, this is
ridiculous. I'm wasting my time.

63
00:04:12,563 --> 00:04:15,763
This is a baby." He was so young.

64
00:04:15,803 --> 00:04:18,603
I never had interviewed
someone that young before.

65
00:04:20,883 --> 00:04:24,563
But as soon as he started talking,
I settled down fast

66
00:04:24,603 --> 00:04:29,883
because he spoke with some of
the most visionary language

67
00:04:29,923 --> 00:04:34,123
that I had experienced
talking to anyone ever.

68
00:04:34,163 --> 00:04:37,563
I was sitting there talking to him
and said, "You know, I was thinking,

69
00:04:37,603 --> 00:04:39,803
maybe I should write a book
about your company."

70
00:04:39,843 --> 00:04:42,003
And he says, "Go for it."

71
00:04:42,043 --> 00:04:46,643
And I was like, "Holy shit, he
actually wants to cooperate."

72
00:04:46,683 --> 00:04:49,243
And that was too good of an
opportunity to pass up.

73
00:04:51,643 --> 00:04:53,603
He was one of four children.

74
00:04:53,643 --> 00:04:56,643
The only boy and his mother
called him the Prince.

75
00:04:59,963 --> 00:05:03,483
He was anointed even
within the family, in other words,

76
00:05:03,523 --> 00:05:06,643
and that shaped his worldview
tremendously.

77
00:05:10,363 --> 00:05:14,243
He went to one of the most
elite prep schools and thrived

78
00:05:14,283 --> 00:05:17,283
and triumphed there. And then,
of course, he got into Harvard.

79
00:05:20,323 --> 00:05:22,603
You know, Harvard is an anointment.

80
00:05:23,683 --> 00:05:27,563
You're feeling you have
unlimited possibilities.

81
00:05:30,683 --> 00:05:33,083
He really wanted to be noticed.

82
00:05:33,123 --> 00:05:36,603
He wanted to be the smartest kid on
campus. But Harvard is full of kids

83
00:05:36,643 --> 00:05:38,883
who were always the smartest kids
in their school.

84
00:05:38,923 --> 00:05:42,243
And so Mark Zuckerberg had to
find a way to get noticed.

85
00:05:42,283 --> 00:05:44,443
And he did that.

86
00:05:44,483 --> 00:05:47,723
Chair recognises the gentleman from
Missouri, Mr Long for 4 minutes.

87
00:05:47,763 --> 00:05:50,403
Thank you, Mr Chairman.
One question I would like to ask is,

88
00:05:50,443 --> 00:05:53,843
what was Facemash?
And is it still up and running?

89
00:05:54,963 --> 00:05:59,403
No congressman, Facesmash was
a prank website that I launched

90
00:05:59,443 --> 00:06:01,963
in college, in my dorm room.

91
00:06:07,003 --> 00:06:10,723
It's on page one, November 4 2003.

92
00:06:10,763 --> 00:06:14,523
"Hot or Not?
Website briefly judges looks."

93
00:06:14,563 --> 00:06:16,563
Which is a good headline.

94
00:06:16,603 --> 00:06:19,203
"Zuckerberg wrote a journal
published on the site itself,

95
00:06:19,243 --> 00:06:23,643
he wrote 'I need something to occupy
my mind, I just need an idea.'"

96
00:06:25,003 --> 00:06:28,403
It sort of spread across campus
that there were these rankings

97
00:06:28,443 --> 00:06:30,803
of the hottest students on
campus on Facemash.

98
00:06:30,843 --> 00:06:34,563
And everyone wanted to see the top
five hottest guys

99
00:06:34,603 --> 00:06:37,843
and the top five hottest girls.
And it was a unifying campus event.

100
00:06:37,883 --> 00:06:40,603
Everyone heard about it very
quickly all at once.

101
00:06:40,643 --> 00:06:42,883
And it was all we were
talking about.

102
00:06:42,923 --> 00:06:45,843
It was something he
just did for the fun, and then

103
00:06:45,883 --> 00:06:49,083
it got a little out of hand because
people liked it so much.

104
00:06:49,123 --> 00:06:52,643
It was sexist, it was juvenile.

105
00:06:52,683 --> 00:06:54,763
It did get him in trouble.

106
00:06:54,803 --> 00:06:57,323
I don't think he would have
probably been expelled,

107
00:06:57,363 --> 00:07:00,523
but he was called before
the disciplinary authorities
at the school.

108
00:07:01,763 --> 00:07:04,803
And that made him a celebrated
figure on campus.

109
00:07:04,843 --> 00:07:09,403
By the time he launched Facebook, he
was already like a famous innovator.

110
00:07:09,443 --> 00:07:12,963
So people wanted to know
what he was gonna do next.

111
00:07:15,243 --> 00:07:19,323
So, one night in February of 2004,
I'm sitting in my dorm room,

112
00:07:19,363 --> 00:07:23,523
and my roommate comes in,
and she shows me on the screen,

113
00:07:23,563 --> 00:07:27,843
this very rudimentary template where
your uploading a photo of yourself

114
00:07:27,883 --> 00:07:30,883
and sort of answering a few basic
biographical details

115
00:07:30,923 --> 00:07:32,803
and it's called The Facebook.

116
00:07:32,843 --> 00:07:34,843
What is
The Facebook exactly?

117
00:07:34,883 --> 00:07:39,243
You sign on, you make a profile about
yourself by answering some questions,

118
00:07:39,283 --> 00:07:42,723
entering some information
phone numbers, interests,

119
00:07:42,763 --> 00:07:46,923
what books you like, movies, and most
importantly, who your friends are.

120
00:07:46,963 --> 00:07:49,443
Then you can browse around

121
00:07:49,483 --> 00:07:52,723
and just find some interesting
information about people.

122
00:07:53,763 --> 00:07:57,563
It was definitely
romantically-charged.

123
00:07:57,603 --> 00:07:59,363
If you decided you like someone

124
00:07:59,403 --> 00:08:01,803
and you wanted to learn
more about them at the time,

125
00:08:01,843 --> 00:08:03,363
you had very few options.

126
00:08:03,403 --> 00:08:06,083
Relationship status, women would put

127
00:08:06,123 --> 00:08:08,363
that they were married
to their best friends.

128
00:08:08,403 --> 00:08:11,563
'It's complicated', I think
was also one that was popular.

129
00:08:11,603 --> 00:08:14,923
I do remember some of the questions
that were on the Facebook template

130
00:08:14,963 --> 00:08:17,523
included political views, everyone
put 'very liberal'.

131
00:08:17,563 --> 00:08:21,643
Favourite quote, people would put
earnest quotes.

132
00:08:21,683 --> 00:08:23,683
It was earnest.
It wasn't ironic at the time.

133
00:08:23,723 --> 00:08:26,763
I just threw it together
one week in January.

134
00:08:26,803 --> 00:08:29,243
This was in your dorm room?
Yeah.

135
00:08:29,283 --> 00:08:32,843
You launched Facebook
- in your dorm room?
- Yeah.

136
00:08:34,643 --> 00:08:38,443
I was the 60th user. It must have
been only a couple of hours

137
00:08:38,483 --> 00:08:42,243
after he made it go live,
but then very shortly after that,

138
00:08:42,283 --> 00:08:44,523
everyone on campus was on it.

139
00:08:59,923 --> 00:09:02,723
In one email exchange,
he was kind of joking.

140
00:09:02,763 --> 00:09:05,323
"Wow, all these people are
submitting their stuff,

141
00:09:05,363 --> 00:09:08,763
all these photos, they're so dumb,
they just give me their data.

142
00:09:08,803 --> 00:09:10,763
They don't understand how
precious data is."

143
00:09:22,003 --> 00:09:24,163
"Ha-ha, dumb fucks."

144
00:09:24,203 --> 00:09:27,083
Mark understands
when he's very young,

145
00:09:27,123 --> 00:09:30,163
that private data
on people can be used.

146
00:09:30,203 --> 00:09:33,043
He doesn't know how,
when he's in his early twenties,

147
00:09:33,083 --> 00:09:35,843
he has a certain voyeuristic
approach to the data.

148
00:09:35,883 --> 00:09:37,843
"I want to collect data
for data sake,"

149
00:09:37,883 --> 00:09:41,203
but initially it's just
it feels like power.

150
00:09:41,243 --> 00:09:43,643
Data feels like power to him.

151
00:09:46,403 --> 00:09:49,523
Thank you, Mr Chairman,
I want to follow up on the questions

152
00:09:49,563 --> 00:09:51,443
around the terms of service.

153
00:09:51,483 --> 00:09:54,883
Your terms of service are about
3,200 words with 30 links.

154
00:09:54,923 --> 00:09:57,283
One of the links
is to your data policy,

155
00:09:57,323 --> 00:10:00,363
which is about 2,700 words
with 22 links.

156
00:10:00,403 --> 00:10:02,963
And I think the point
has been well made that

157
00:10:03,003 --> 00:10:05,603
people really have no earthly idea
what they're signing up for

158
00:10:05,643 --> 00:10:09,763
but I'm wondering if you can explain
to the billions of users,

159
00:10:09,803 --> 00:10:12,883
in plain language,
what are they signing up for?

160
00:10:26,283 --> 00:10:28,963
Silicon Valley was
the mecca of software

161
00:10:29,003 --> 00:10:32,003
and innovation and technology.

162
00:10:32,043 --> 00:10:34,203
Amazon-dot-com, this is Lance.

163
00:10:34,243 --> 00:10:37,403
Money was being poured into
software companies

164
00:10:37,443 --> 00:10:40,443
and internet companies and it was
seen as, sort of,

165
00:10:40,483 --> 00:10:42,563
the promised land of capitalism.

166
00:10:42,603 --> 00:10:45,403
This is definitely very cool.
I like it a lot.

167
00:10:45,443 --> 00:10:48,963
Just three years ago I was sleeping
on the office floor

168
00:10:49,003 --> 00:10:51,403
and now, obviously, I've got
a million dollar car

169
00:10:51,443 --> 00:10:54,043
and quite a few creature comforts.

170
00:10:54,083 --> 00:10:56,883
And Zuckerberg was very impressed
by that, that's for sure.

171
00:10:57,763 --> 00:11:00,003
We had this feeling like,
OK, all these great companies

172
00:11:00,043 --> 00:11:03,083
come from Silicon Valley. Wouldn't it
be cool to spend a summer out there?

173
00:11:03,123 --> 00:11:06,323
Get that experience, but we expected
to go back to Harvard in the fall.

174
00:11:06,363 --> 00:11:08,883
The thing that made it so that
we didn't

175
00:11:08,923 --> 00:11:10,803
was that Harvard
has this great policy

176
00:11:10,843 --> 00:11:13,523
that lets you take as much
time off as you want.

177
00:11:13,563 --> 00:11:16,563
So in the summer of 2004,
he rented a house

178
00:11:16,603 --> 00:11:18,883
and took a bunch of
his Harvard chums out there,

179
00:11:18,923 --> 00:11:21,963
and they started programming
Facebook from Palo Alto.

180
00:11:30,243 --> 00:11:32,603
You know, the Internet,
kind of by definition,

181
00:11:32,643 --> 00:11:35,963
is sort of a lawless place,
particularly back then.

182
00:11:36,003 --> 00:11:38,483
Today the US Court of
Appeals ruled that Napster

183
00:11:38,523 --> 00:11:40,963
is infringing on copyrighted music,

184
00:11:41,003 --> 00:11:44,163
in essence,
letting its users steal songs.

185
00:11:45,603 --> 00:11:47,803
It's kind of, probably,
no coincidence

186
00:11:47,843 --> 00:11:52,603
that this sort of wild forum
would start in California,

187
00:11:52,643 --> 00:11:55,123
in the original Wild West.

188
00:11:55,163 --> 00:11:58,643
At the time,
Silicon Valley companies

189
00:11:58,683 --> 00:12:01,243
were pushing
the regulatory envelope.

190
00:12:02,763 --> 00:12:05,563
They were doing things
that in various ways

191
00:12:05,603 --> 00:12:09,243
seemed unacceptable and doing it
with almost no consequences.

192
00:12:12,123 --> 00:12:15,003
Silicon Valley
and the ethos of Silicon Valley

193
00:12:15,043 --> 00:12:17,803
couldn't have been more perfectly
suited for Mark Zuckerberg

194
00:12:17,843 --> 00:12:19,603
if he had drawn it up himself.

195
00:12:19,643 --> 00:12:23,083
Because here you have this idea
that there are disruptors of society

196
00:12:23,123 --> 00:12:25,283
who are smarter than everyone else,

197
00:12:25,323 --> 00:12:27,403
and they should be given money.

198
00:12:27,443 --> 00:12:31,563
They should be given power because
they can create a technology

199
00:12:31,603 --> 00:12:34,123
that will disrupt the whole world.

200
00:12:40,803 --> 00:12:43,163
The life
of my profile pictures.

201
00:12:44,123 --> 00:12:46,843
That's my mom. We're in Lake Cuomo.

202
00:12:48,763 --> 00:12:51,883
I'm just amazed at how many photos
I have on Facebook

203
00:12:51,923 --> 00:12:55,083
and how they're all...
relentlessly optimistic.

204
00:12:56,243 --> 00:12:59,083
I think it's just a celebration
of my life actually.

205
00:12:59,123 --> 00:13:02,363
This wouldn't be bad
on my gravestone.

206
00:13:02,403 --> 00:13:05,003
Because this is actually
what I'd like to be remembered as.

207
00:13:06,163 --> 00:13:07,723
I'm Karel Baloun,

208
00:13:07,763 --> 00:13:11,083
I was Mark Zuckerberg's first
senior engineer at Facebook.

209
00:13:12,923 --> 00:13:15,123
I have a master's in Social Psych,

210
00:13:15,163 --> 00:13:18,283
so just the idea of connecting
people was really tremendous.

211
00:13:18,323 --> 00:13:21,803
I had been an engineer in Silicon
Valley for seven or eight years,

212
00:13:21,843 --> 00:13:24,283
and all of that
was in corporations.

213
00:13:24,323 --> 00:13:26,803
So I was ready for a start up.

214
00:13:30,043 --> 00:13:31,843
Alright, what's the safety word?

215
00:13:31,883 --> 00:13:34,283
It was the office
above the Chinese restaurant

216
00:13:34,323 --> 00:13:36,363
with the graffiti on the wall.

217
00:13:37,443 --> 00:13:41,123
One, two, three,
four, five, six...

218
00:13:42,043 --> 00:13:44,083
The office was very Spartan.

219
00:13:44,123 --> 00:13:46,243
There were IKEA tables.

220
00:13:46,283 --> 00:13:48,363
We assembled our own chairs
the first day.

221
00:13:48,403 --> 00:13:51,963
..eleven, twelve, thirteen.
Wow!

222
00:13:52,003 --> 00:13:55,323
The amount of energy and confidence
in that room was astounding.

223
00:13:55,363 --> 00:13:58,683
You could see Mark coding in
the corner on the floor sometimes.

224
00:13:58,723 --> 00:14:01,083
He would just-
Instead of sitting at the table,

225
00:14:01,123 --> 00:14:04,603
he would just lie down on the floor
with his laptop, flip flops up.

226
00:14:05,443 --> 00:14:08,323
And Mark Zuckerberg's handle
is 'Zuck'.

227
00:14:08,363 --> 00:14:10,403
It was a term of endearment.

228
00:14:10,443 --> 00:14:12,443
We were all that close.

229
00:14:14,963 --> 00:14:17,723
The way that I can be unique is
by revelling

230
00:14:17,763 --> 00:14:20,403
and being young
and just being a little crazy.

231
00:14:20,443 --> 00:14:23,883
So, for example, there's this
feature called 'poking'

232
00:14:23,923 --> 00:14:26,603
where you just go to someone's
profile and you can poke the person

233
00:14:26,643 --> 00:14:29,603
and like, what does that do?
Nothing. It sends them a message.

234
00:14:29,643 --> 00:14:32,083
It's like, "You've been poked",
you know? Like, who cares?

235
00:14:32,123 --> 00:14:34,963
It's like, I thought about it when
I was drunk or something, you know?

236
00:14:35,003 --> 00:14:37,923
And like people really like poking
each other for some reason.

237
00:14:37,963 --> 00:14:40,123
I don't think anyone
can really explain.

238
00:14:41,763 --> 00:14:45,643
Mark has a consistent vision that
is very clearly articulated

239
00:14:45,683 --> 00:14:48,763
for everyone to understand.
He wants to connect people.

240
00:14:48,803 --> 00:14:51,243
That was the supreme novel idea.

241
00:14:51,283 --> 00:14:53,963
Was that we are engaging
on things together

242
00:14:54,003 --> 00:14:57,403
and it's bringing people together.

243
00:15:01,523 --> 00:15:04,603
I've been covering tech since 2015.

244
00:15:04,643 --> 00:15:07,843
Somewhere within, almost every story

245
00:15:07,883 --> 00:15:11,123
in Silicon Valley
that I've come across...

246
00:15:12,043 --> 00:15:16,723
...Peter Thiel has been pretty
much inside, behind, around.

247
00:15:16,763 --> 00:15:20,083
He's one of the key power brokers.

248
00:15:20,123 --> 00:15:23,483
He's started a company
called PayPal with Elon Musk

249
00:15:23,523 --> 00:15:26,683
and from there, built this empire.

250
00:15:26,723 --> 00:15:30,963
The government is so-
is so fundamentally evil,

251
00:15:31,003 --> 00:15:34,603
that to deny the evil nature
of the government

252
00:15:34,643 --> 00:15:37,683
is equal to denying
the existence of the devil.

253
00:15:37,723 --> 00:15:40,643
Kind of what makes Thiel
interesting and special

254
00:15:40,683 --> 00:15:44,483
is that he's not just a money guy,
he's sort of an influence guy.

255
00:15:44,523 --> 00:15:48,683
Technology is this incredible
alternative to politics

256
00:15:48,723 --> 00:15:52,203
and the task in this world where
politics has become so broken

257
00:15:52,243 --> 00:15:55,963
and so dysfunctional
is to find a way to escape from it.

258
00:15:56,003 --> 00:16:00,363
Most of his beliefs boil down to an
idea that billionaires,

259
00:16:00,403 --> 00:16:02,883
in particular tech billionaires,

260
00:16:02,923 --> 00:16:07,003
should be afforded maximum freedom
to run the world.

261
00:16:07,043 --> 00:16:11,403
The initial founding vision was
that we were going to use technology

262
00:16:11,443 --> 00:16:14,323
to overturn the monetary system
of the world.

263
00:16:16,243 --> 00:16:19,723
It's really easy to see
why he liked Mark Zuckerberg.

264
00:16:20,803 --> 00:16:24,283
He had been sort of, you know,
a bad boy of campus.

265
00:16:24,323 --> 00:16:27,003
He was kind of like pushing
the bounds of what was acceptable

266
00:16:27,043 --> 00:16:29,603
and what was normal.

267
00:16:29,643 --> 00:16:33,843
And that is the kind of thing
that Peter Thiel absolutely loves.

268
00:16:33,883 --> 00:16:36,123
And you can kind of see why.

269
00:16:36,163 --> 00:16:39,043
Because those kind of rule-breakers
are the ones who are likely

270
00:16:39,083 --> 00:16:41,923
to, you know, find opportunities.

271
00:16:44,883 --> 00:16:49,523
Peter Thiel was the
first really serious businessperson

272
00:16:49,563 --> 00:16:54,003
to recognise the scale
of what this could become.

273
00:16:54,043 --> 00:16:57,443
Which is why he said, "OK,
I'll invest half a million

274
00:16:57,483 --> 00:16:59,483
for 10% of the company."

275
00:17:00,363 --> 00:17:03,803
And the parting words that Thiel
left them with,

276
00:17:03,843 --> 00:17:07,683
as they walked out of his office,
was, "Just don't fuck it up."

277
00:17:14,003 --> 00:17:18,563
Today, The Facebook has nearly 5
million users across 1,500 campuses.

278
00:17:18,603 --> 00:17:21,163
Joining me to talk about
the fast-growing company

279
00:17:21,203 --> 00:17:23,603
is the founder and CEO,
Mark Zuckerberg.

280
00:17:23,643 --> 00:17:26,203
Mark, thanks for joining us.
Thanks for having me.

281
00:17:26,243 --> 00:17:28,523
You received venture capital funding

282
00:17:28,563 --> 00:17:31,083
and received about $13 million.

283
00:17:31,123 --> 00:17:33,603
What was the pitch to VCs?

284
00:17:33,643 --> 00:17:36,363
Oh, we didn't do any pitch.
No?

285
00:17:38,323 --> 00:17:40,523
He looked very young...

286
00:17:40,563 --> 00:17:43,523
but he carried himself in a way
that showed confidence.

287
00:17:43,563 --> 00:17:46,443
You know, having a 10 million
dollar cheque in your pocket

288
00:17:46,483 --> 00:17:48,843
probably does that to you.

289
00:17:51,323 --> 00:17:53,563
What I can say about
the early investors

290
00:17:53,603 --> 00:17:55,803
is they're all
hardcore capitalists.

291
00:17:55,843 --> 00:17:57,523
They're all big time Valley people.

292
00:17:57,563 --> 00:18:00,523
They'd much rather have a one in
a hundred chance

293
00:18:00,563 --> 00:18:02,603
of becoming a trillion-dollar company

294
00:18:02,643 --> 00:18:04,643
than a guaranteed
$10 billion company.

295
00:18:04,683 --> 00:18:06,843
So, they're going to want you to
take risks

296
00:18:06,883 --> 00:18:10,363
and they want you
to be extreme in what you do.

297
00:18:12,203 --> 00:18:16,443
Mark thought of himself as
a renegade leader of opposition

298
00:18:16,483 --> 00:18:19,443
to the established order,

299
00:18:19,483 --> 00:18:23,363
so he would sign his pages
of the service.

300
00:18:23,403 --> 00:18:26,483
Sometimes you'd find the phrase,

301
00:18:26,523 --> 00:18:29,443
'Founder, Master and Commander,
Enemy of the State.

302
00:18:31,403 --> 00:18:34,563
Thank you, Mr Zuckerberg,
for being here.

303
00:18:34,603 --> 00:18:39,003
I note up, until 2014,
the mantra or motto of Facebook

304
00:18:39,043 --> 00:18:42,083
was "move fast and break things".

305
00:18:42,123 --> 00:18:43,963
Is that correct?

306
00:18:44,003 --> 00:18:47,043
I don't know when we changed it,
but the mantra is currently

307
00:18:47,083 --> 00:18:49,403
"move fast with
stable infrastructure",

308
00:18:49,443 --> 00:18:51,923
which is a much less sexy mantra.

309
00:18:51,963 --> 00:18:54,763
Sounds much more boring.
But my question is,

310
00:18:54,803 --> 00:18:58,083
during the time
it was Facebook's mantra,

311
00:18:58,123 --> 00:19:01,163
do you think some of the...
misjudgements

312
00:19:01,203 --> 00:19:04,163
were as a result of that
culture or that attitude?

313
00:19:08,203 --> 00:19:11,243
Where Thiel
influenced Zuckerberg

314
00:19:11,283 --> 00:19:15,723
was in this idea of
'move fast and break things'.

315
00:19:18,923 --> 00:19:22,923
Growing like as big as you
can, as fast as you can,

316
00:19:22,963 --> 00:19:25,203
that is the Peter Thiel approach.

317
00:19:25,243 --> 00:19:27,763
Push the gas as hard as you can,

318
00:19:27,803 --> 00:19:31,163
spend as much money as possible on
anything you can do to grow,

319
00:19:31,203 --> 00:19:34,083
to ensure that you have
absolute network dominance.

320
00:19:35,243 --> 00:19:39,603
Every day we would code and push
that immediately to the site.

321
00:19:39,643 --> 00:19:43,003
Then it would hit the site and we
would see whether it worked or not.

322
00:19:43,043 --> 00:19:47,003
And if there was a bug, we might
roll back what was on the site.

323
00:19:47,043 --> 00:19:49,603
Or we might just push
a patch right over it.

324
00:19:49,643 --> 00:19:52,443
And there was very little
safety or control.

325
00:19:53,403 --> 00:19:56,043
There's a video
of Mark Zuckerberg

326
00:19:56,083 --> 00:19:59,763
where he goes back to Harvard
and he essentially tells students

327
00:19:59,803 --> 00:20:02,523
that they should buck
the system the way he did.

328
00:20:02,563 --> 00:20:05,403
I think it's more useful to, like,
make things happen

329
00:20:05,443 --> 00:20:07,323
and then apologise later

330
00:20:07,363 --> 00:20:09,963
than it is to make sure
that you dot all your I's now

331
00:20:10,003 --> 00:20:12,363
and then, like
just not get stepped on.

332
00:20:12,403 --> 00:20:15,563
He loved playing strategy games
from a young age

333
00:20:15,603 --> 00:20:18,083
and winning in everything he did

334
00:20:18,123 --> 00:20:22,523
has always been a high priority
for him. Dominating, succeeding.

335
00:20:22,563 --> 00:20:26,643
He used to end every meeting at
the company by shouting,

336
00:20:26,683 --> 00:20:29,723
"Domination!" That was like his,
sort of, catch phrase

337
00:20:29,763 --> 00:20:32,243
that he ended meetings with.
And you know,

338
00:20:32,283 --> 00:20:35,603
that reflects a lot about
his personality, his goals.

339
00:20:35,643 --> 00:20:38,163
He wanted to dominate,
and he wanted to win.

340
00:20:49,523 --> 00:20:52,523
Mark Zuckerberg needs
to distinguish his company

341
00:20:52,563 --> 00:20:55,163
from other social media
companies at the time.

342
00:20:55,203 --> 00:20:59,363
Because even though he's incredibly
popular among college students,

343
00:20:59,403 --> 00:21:01,603
he still has competition.

344
00:21:01,643 --> 00:21:04,203
There's MySpace, there's Friendster.

345
00:21:05,123 --> 00:21:08,283
And he very quickly
understands that...

346
00:21:09,283 --> 00:21:13,203
by making decisions as
a company about what people see,

347
00:21:13,243 --> 00:21:15,683
he can create
a revolutionary product.

348
00:21:22,403 --> 00:21:26,043
What Mark did was really use
the first algorithmic device

349
00:21:26,083 --> 00:21:28,683
that would rank what you saw.

350
00:21:28,723 --> 00:21:30,283
It made decisions for you.

351
00:21:30,323 --> 00:21:32,563
People competed
with each other

352
00:21:32,603 --> 00:21:34,923
to have the most Facebook friends.

353
00:21:34,963 --> 00:21:37,403
"You have 100 friends?
I have 200 friends."

354
00:21:37,443 --> 00:21:39,523
Or 2,000, or whatever.

355
00:21:39,563 --> 00:21:42,243
All of a sudden, they could see
everything about you

356
00:21:42,283 --> 00:21:45,603
and you could see everything about
them in a newly automated fashion.

357
00:21:45,643 --> 00:21:47,483
And many people didn't like that.

358
00:21:52,083 --> 00:21:56,403
They viewed that as an invasion
of privacy and it was a crisis.

359
00:21:59,003 --> 00:22:01,643
Over and over again
in the history of Facebook,

360
00:22:01,683 --> 00:22:06,203
the company would kind of go to a
place that was, like, a little edgy.

361
00:22:08,683 --> 00:22:11,643
They just sort of violated
everyone's privacy without asking.

362
00:22:12,723 --> 00:22:16,643
Facebook's approach for most of
its history was to, you know,

363
00:22:16,683 --> 00:22:19,683
shoot first and ask questions later.

364
00:22:21,963 --> 00:22:25,563
He apologized publicly for
how he rolled it out

365
00:22:25,603 --> 00:22:29,243
or for poorly communicating
about this new feature.

366
00:22:29,283 --> 00:22:32,563
But the feature was going to be
there because it had real utility.

367
00:22:34,483 --> 00:22:38,483
He wanted you to spend
hours scrolling your news feed,

368
00:22:38,523 --> 00:22:41,843
getting this constant sort of
stream of data about people you knew

369
00:22:41,883 --> 00:22:44,243
and people you were interested in.

370
00:22:44,283 --> 00:22:48,763
Students looking at
Facebook average 18 minutes a day,

371
00:22:48,803 --> 00:22:51,763
and that fact has rocketed the
company's value

372
00:22:51,803 --> 00:22:55,083
into the hundreds of millions
of dollars, maybe more.

373
00:22:56,123 --> 00:22:59,363
The company was just
growing like crazy at that time.

374
00:23:05,123 --> 00:23:08,203
I got a phone call from an
executive at Facebook

375
00:23:08,243 --> 00:23:11,043
that I barely knew, and he said,

376
00:23:11,083 --> 00:23:14,403
"My boss is facing a crisis

377
00:23:14,443 --> 00:23:17,443
and he needs advice

378
00:23:17,483 --> 00:23:20,083
from somebody who really
understands Silicon Valley.

379
00:23:20,123 --> 00:23:22,323
Would you take a meeting
with Mark Zuckerberg?"

380
00:23:23,203 --> 00:23:27,523
And so Mark Zuckerberg
came to my office

381
00:23:27,563 --> 00:23:30,363
and he looked just
like Mark Zuckerberg. I mean,

382
00:23:30,403 --> 00:23:32,883
the grey hoodie, the jeans.

383
00:23:34,043 --> 00:23:38,683
And he goes, "Yahoo! has offered
a billion dollars to buy Facebook.

384
00:23:40,003 --> 00:23:42,123
And everybody I know,
including my parents,

385
00:23:42,163 --> 00:23:44,523
has told me to take the money."

386
00:23:44,563 --> 00:23:46,843
So I looked at Mark and I said,

387
00:23:46,883 --> 00:23:49,043
"Well, there's only one
that question matters.

388
00:23:49,083 --> 00:23:51,883
What do you want?
Do you want to sell the company?"

389
00:23:54,723 --> 00:23:58,403
He refused, famously,
to sell Facebook to Yahoo!

390
00:23:58,443 --> 00:24:02,683
for a billion dollars
and everybody was against him.

391
00:24:02,723 --> 00:24:05,083
It's a lot of money
for all of us, right?

392
00:24:05,123 --> 00:24:07,243
None of us were
independently wealthy.

393
00:24:07,283 --> 00:24:09,963
He was saying,
this is a valuable idea

394
00:24:10,003 --> 00:24:12,763
and I can execute it
better than Yahoo!

395
00:24:12,803 --> 00:24:15,803
That type of confidence
and fearlessness...

396
00:24:16,603 --> 00:24:19,603
...when even technical obstacles
are daunting.

397
00:24:20,483 --> 00:24:22,403
Well, it's courage.

398
00:24:23,843 --> 00:24:26,123
If they'd sold to Yahoo!
at a billion,

399
00:24:26,163 --> 00:24:29,803
they would all be quite rich, but
they were going to be really rich.

400
00:24:31,163 --> 00:24:34,603
More and more press attention
from people even like myself,

401
00:24:34,643 --> 00:24:37,003
was, you know, flattering them

402
00:24:37,043 --> 00:24:39,483
and making them feel
the centre of the universe.

403
00:24:39,523 --> 00:24:42,763
And they were like, "Yeah,
we are really the cool ones."

404
00:24:42,803 --> 00:24:45,603
Let's talk about
business. There are reports

405
00:24:45,643 --> 00:24:47,803
that this company is still not
breaking even.

406
00:24:47,843 --> 00:24:52,363
And what shocked me when I read
that was with 175 million customers,

407
00:24:52,403 --> 00:24:55,203
how can any business not make money?

408
00:24:55,243 --> 00:24:57,323
What's the explanation for that?

409
00:24:58,283 --> 00:25:01,483
Zuckerberg was still living on
a mattress on the floor,

410
00:25:01,523 --> 00:25:03,923
you know, hardly ever
even going home

411
00:25:03,963 --> 00:25:06,763
because he was just working
around the clock.

412
00:25:06,803 --> 00:25:09,123
He cared very little about
anything else

413
00:25:09,163 --> 00:25:11,923
other than user growth
and user engagement.

414
00:25:16,563 --> 00:25:19,523
Well after Facebook had been
going for...

415
00:25:19,563 --> 00:25:22,123
three years or so,

416
00:25:22,163 --> 00:25:25,883
the investors were
increasingly determined that

417
00:25:25,923 --> 00:25:29,083
somebody had to figure out how to
make a lot of money out of this

418
00:25:29,123 --> 00:25:31,963
tremendous cultural
and community success.

419
00:25:32,963 --> 00:25:35,083
Oh, wow. That's awesome.
How are you?

420
00:25:35,123 --> 00:25:38,243
Sheryl Sandberg is
an unlikely revolutionary.

421
00:25:38,283 --> 00:25:42,083
At 43, she is one of the few women
at the top of corporate America.

422
00:25:42,123 --> 00:25:44,843
Sheryl changed everything.

423
00:25:44,883 --> 00:25:47,323
She was a practice business leader

424
00:25:47,363 --> 00:25:51,483
who had, in many ways, built
the advertising business at Google.

425
00:25:51,523 --> 00:25:53,323
Panama hats.

426
00:25:53,363 --> 00:25:55,843
Let's say I was looking for Panama
hats today. Here I go.

427
00:25:55,883 --> 00:25:59,203
Panama Hats Direct,
a very specific search,

428
00:25:59,243 --> 00:26:01,403
looking for a very specific product.

429
00:26:01,443 --> 00:26:04,043
And the advertiser
is able to find me

430
00:26:04,083 --> 00:26:05,843
and I'm looking for that product.

431
00:26:05,883 --> 00:26:08,723
There is a crucial, crucial moment
in the evolution of Facebook.

432
00:26:08,763 --> 00:26:12,083
Sheryl Sandberg comes on board
and is given the mandate,

433
00:26:12,123 --> 00:26:14,123
'figure out how this
thing can make money.'

434
00:26:14,163 --> 00:26:17,323
We just literally had dinner
at my house

435
00:26:17,363 --> 00:26:19,203
and Mark would say,
sometimes, you know,

436
00:26:19,243 --> 00:26:22,483
"I'm so sorry, I can't
invite you over for dinner."

437
00:26:22,523 --> 00:26:25,163
But at the time, he only had
like a one room apartment.

438
00:26:25,203 --> 00:26:27,963
He never had any furniture,
make it a futon.

439
00:26:28,003 --> 00:26:30,963
He thought that would be awkward,
which it would have been.

440
00:26:32,883 --> 00:26:34,603
Thank you all.

441
00:26:34,643 --> 00:26:38,083
There are lots of choices that
she and they could have made.

442
00:26:38,123 --> 00:26:41,123
And they made a choice to sell
targeted advertising

443
00:26:41,163 --> 00:26:43,323
based on individual's data.

444
00:26:45,283 --> 00:26:47,803
The thing about Facebook
that was so unique

445
00:26:47,843 --> 00:26:51,403
was it had a whole lot of data
that you had voluntarily provided,

446
00:26:51,443 --> 00:26:53,803
where you lived, how old you were,

447
00:26:53,843 --> 00:26:57,283
whether you were in a relationship,
what your interests are.

448
00:26:57,323 --> 00:27:00,163
These are invaluable
pieces of information

449
00:27:00,203 --> 00:27:02,363
for people trying to sell ads.

450
00:27:02,403 --> 00:27:04,843
People were
uploading photos,

451
00:27:04,883 --> 00:27:08,683
people were posting status updates
to their feed.

452
00:27:08,723 --> 00:27:11,203
But it was really about what's
going on in my mind right now.

453
00:27:12,563 --> 00:27:15,043
The prompt is still the same.
What's on your mind?

454
00:27:15,083 --> 00:27:17,763
But people are really using it
in real time

455
00:27:17,803 --> 00:27:19,683
to say what was on their mind.

456
00:27:19,723 --> 00:27:24,283
Sheryl Sandberg realised that
a system with that many users

457
00:27:24,323 --> 00:27:27,563
was going to be a huge opportunity
for advertising.

458
00:27:29,163 --> 00:27:32,123
And from the time she arrived,

459
00:27:32,163 --> 00:27:33,923
they started making more money.

460
00:27:38,883 --> 00:27:40,923
Are you Facebook
friends with Mark?

461
00:27:40,963 --> 00:27:44,483
Yes. Yeah, I have been since
the beginning.

462
00:27:44,523 --> 00:27:46,603
He just posted he's going
to have another baby.

463
00:27:46,643 --> 00:27:48,963
And so I liked the fact that
he's having another baby,

464
00:27:49,003 --> 00:27:51,483
wished him a Happy New Year
at the beginning of this year.

465
00:27:51,523 --> 00:27:54,803
And he liked back in my comment,
wishing him a happy New Year.

466
00:27:54,843 --> 00:27:58,523
I found myself in the mid-2000's

467
00:27:58,563 --> 00:28:01,003
working at a company called Cisco

468
00:28:01,043 --> 00:28:02,723
and Facebook came
knocking on my door.

469
00:28:02,763 --> 00:28:06,123
Good afternoon,
Facebook how may I help you?

470
00:28:06,163 --> 00:28:08,843
When I arrived. Wow. It was chaotic.

471
00:28:15,323 --> 00:28:18,923
I just found these really smart,

472
00:28:18,963 --> 00:28:22,163
really high energy people
bouncing around.

473
00:28:27,883 --> 00:28:31,483
In those, sort of, early 20-tens,

474
00:28:31,523 --> 00:28:34,763
if you worked for Facebook,
everyone was fascinated by it.

475
00:28:36,203 --> 00:28:39,003
You did feel like, in a sense,
an ambassador

476
00:28:39,043 --> 00:28:43,083
for this amazing force that was
potentially gonna change the world.

477
00:28:44,043 --> 00:28:46,203
Um... I'm sorry. I'm kind of nervous.

478
00:28:46,243 --> 00:28:48,443
We have the President of
the United States here.

479
00:28:57,003 --> 00:28:59,283
My name is Barack Obama

480
00:28:59,323 --> 00:29:03,083
and I'm the guy who got Mark to
wear a jacket and tie.

481
00:29:05,163 --> 00:29:07,323
Thank you.

482
00:29:07,363 --> 00:29:10,083
And, in fact, if you'd like,
Mark, we can take our jackets off.

483
00:29:10,123 --> 00:29:12,123
That's good.

484
00:29:13,883 --> 00:29:18,083
Part of what...
makes for a healthy democracy

485
00:29:18,123 --> 00:29:21,883
is when you've got citizens who
are informed, who are engaged.

486
00:29:21,923 --> 00:29:25,563
And what Facebook allows us to do

487
00:29:25,603 --> 00:29:27,843
is make sure this isn't
just a one-way conversation.

488
00:29:28,683 --> 00:29:31,523
Well, it was widely said
at the time of Obama's election

489
00:29:31,563 --> 00:29:33,723
that one of the ways he won

490
00:29:33,763 --> 00:29:36,523
was by so effectively campaigning
on Facebook.

491
00:29:36,563 --> 00:29:39,123
Who is Barack Obama?

492
00:29:39,163 --> 00:29:42,763
The answer is right there on
my Facebook page.

493
00:29:44,083 --> 00:29:46,803
That was a deeply impressive
to Zuckerberg

494
00:29:46,843 --> 00:29:49,363
and made him feel pretty puffed up.
I'd say, yeah.

495
00:29:49,403 --> 00:29:52,843
"Hey, we helped get the president
elected." That was very heady.

496
00:29:52,883 --> 00:29:54,963
Hi, this is Lady Gaga.

497
00:29:55,003 --> 00:29:58,243
And I'm saying hello to all
of my little monsters on Facebook.

498
00:29:58,283 --> 00:30:00,323
I love you guys so much.

499
00:30:01,683 --> 00:30:04,243
You know, this clip,
Lady Gaga shows back then,

500
00:30:04,283 --> 00:30:06,283
Facebook was unambiguously cool.

501
00:30:08,163 --> 00:30:11,403
Here is what
Time magazine said in 2010

502
00:30:11,443 --> 00:30:13,683
when it named Zuckerberg
'Person of the Year',

503
00:30:13,723 --> 00:30:17,603
quote, "In less than seven years,
Zuckerberg wired together

504
00:30:17,643 --> 00:30:20,843
a 12th of humanity into
a single network,

505
00:30:20,883 --> 00:30:24,523
thereby creating a social entity
almost twice as large

506
00:30:24,563 --> 00:30:27,963
as the United States,
worth more than $80 billion.

507
00:30:28,003 --> 00:30:31,123
It has turned into something that
has changed the way human beings

508
00:30:31,163 --> 00:30:33,883
relate to one another on
a species-wide scale.

509
00:30:35,083 --> 00:30:39,403
Anybody. Literally anybody
with no technical skills

510
00:30:39,443 --> 00:30:44,323
had the power of the mainstream
media outlet and in their hands.

511
00:30:44,363 --> 00:30:46,243
Mark Zuckerberg says

512
00:30:46,283 --> 00:30:50,003
Facebook's almost guaranteed to
reach the 1 billion user mark.

513
00:30:51,323 --> 00:30:53,203
We were empowering people,

514
00:30:53,243 --> 00:30:55,723
people who previously
have been disempowered

515
00:30:55,763 --> 00:30:58,723
and that was a noble mission,
and we were all signed up for that.

516
00:30:58,763 --> 00:31:01,123
And that's what got you
out of bed in the morning,

517
00:31:01,163 --> 00:31:05,403
was putting the power of a major
communication platform

518
00:31:05,443 --> 00:31:07,443
into the hands of
an ordinary person,

519
00:31:07,483 --> 00:31:10,043
wherever they were
in the world, at no cost.

520
00:31:22,123 --> 00:31:26,123
Back in 2010, we had some Arabic
speakers already in the team

521
00:31:26,163 --> 00:31:29,483
who were looking at content
and they flagged the fact

522
00:31:29,523 --> 00:31:31,883
they were seeing interesting stuff.

523
00:31:37,763 --> 00:31:40,123
In particular,
there was an Egyptian page

524
00:31:40,163 --> 00:31:42,963
calling for a massive demonstration.

525
00:31:43,003 --> 00:31:45,123
Did you plan a revolution?

526
00:31:46,123 --> 00:31:47,883
Yeah, we did.

527
00:31:52,203 --> 00:31:54,603
Here were all these people in
countries like Tunisia,

528
00:31:54,643 --> 00:31:57,003
Syria and Egypt

529
00:31:57,043 --> 00:32:01,003
who could create their own
alternative media

530
00:32:01,043 --> 00:32:05,883
in opposition to a state that
control the media

531
00:32:05,923 --> 00:32:08,883
to within an inch of its life
and allowed them no space.

532
00:32:11,043 --> 00:32:13,163
They created the revolution, not us.

533
00:32:13,203 --> 00:32:15,923
We weren't there on the barricades,

534
00:32:15,963 --> 00:32:19,043
but we had given them a media tool.

535
00:32:19,083 --> 00:32:22,203
First Tunisia, now Egypt.
What's next?

536
00:32:22,243 --> 00:32:24,283
At Facebook.

537
00:32:24,323 --> 00:32:27,203
Facebook? You're giving Facebook
a lot of credit for this.

538
00:32:28,403 --> 00:32:30,003
Yeah, for sure.

539
00:32:30,043 --> 00:32:33,483
I want to meet Mark Zuckerberg
one day and thank him, actually.

540
00:32:39,403 --> 00:32:42,163
An Arab Spring was the point
at which, I think,

541
00:32:42,203 --> 00:32:43,963
a lot of the world
woke up to the fact

542
00:32:44,003 --> 00:32:46,003
this wasn't a platform for kids.

543
00:32:46,043 --> 00:32:48,963
It was actually influential
and potentially world-changing.

544
00:32:49,003 --> 00:32:51,123
And Mark was feted.

545
00:32:51,163 --> 00:32:53,563
I would go and see government
ministers in Europe

546
00:32:53,603 --> 00:32:56,163
who previously had not been
particularly interested

547
00:32:56,203 --> 00:32:58,923
who was suddenly going, "Oh,
you know, this Facebook thing,

548
00:32:58,963 --> 00:33:01,483
actually I want to know about it.
It is interesting.

549
00:33:01,523 --> 00:33:05,363
I want to meet Mark Zuckerberg."
Because now politicians

550
00:33:05,403 --> 00:33:07,963
see the platform
as politically powerful.

551
00:33:08,003 --> 00:33:11,203
And there was a glow for
a period of time after that.

552
00:33:13,403 --> 00:33:16,603
Today, an astronomical
benchmark

553
00:33:16,643 --> 00:33:21,283
as Facebook officially announces
it now has 1 billion users,

554
00:33:21,323 --> 00:33:23,803
one seventh of the
world's population.

555
00:33:34,403 --> 00:33:36,523
I joined a month
after the Arab Spring.

556
00:33:37,803 --> 00:33:41,723
I knew that they had made me the
offer on Valentine's Day of 2011.

557
00:33:41,763 --> 00:33:44,323
And so I posted, "I'm excited
that I'll be joining

558
00:33:44,363 --> 00:33:46,523
the Facebook DC team very soon."

559
00:33:46,563 --> 00:33:49,843
In all honesty, I'm having a lot of
feelings kind of flood back

560
00:33:49,883 --> 00:33:51,723
of what that felt like on that first
day,

561
00:33:51,763 --> 00:33:53,963
walking through the doors,
having no idea

562
00:33:54,003 --> 00:33:56,643
what the next ten years were going
to have in store for me.

563
00:33:59,963 --> 00:34:03,123
In 2011-ish, 2012,

564
00:34:03,163 --> 00:34:07,483
Facebook moved to the old
Sun Microsystems campus.

565
00:34:10,243 --> 00:34:14,403
Sun Microsystems was a very
prominent company in Silicon Valley

566
00:34:14,443 --> 00:34:18,003
and ended up going under.

567
00:34:20,923 --> 00:34:24,723
Mark was very worried
about being out-innovated.

568
00:34:25,763 --> 00:34:29,243
You don't want to become Friendster.
You don't want to become MySpace.

569
00:34:29,283 --> 00:34:31,523
You had to keep moving.
You had to keep doing stuff,

570
00:34:31,563 --> 00:34:35,163
because if you didn't, someone
was going to run faster than you.

571
00:34:36,643 --> 00:34:40,003
Every day when you left, seeing
that Sun Microsystems logo

572
00:34:40,043 --> 00:34:42,523
was meant to be a reminder.

573
00:34:42,563 --> 00:34:45,203
You could be this
big behemoth one day

574
00:34:45,243 --> 00:34:49,603
and tomorrow you could be having a
rummage sale to sell your desks.

575
00:34:51,963 --> 00:34:54,243
He did not want
competition

576
00:34:54,283 --> 00:34:56,523
in the social media industry.

577
00:34:56,563 --> 00:34:59,043
No business leader
likes competition.

578
00:34:59,083 --> 00:35:01,243
He always saw Facebook
as an industry in itself.

579
00:35:03,483 --> 00:35:07,243
Mark has always been
a deeply competitive person.

580
00:35:10,323 --> 00:35:13,763
He didn't just want to be famous.
He wanted to be historic.

581
00:35:16,003 --> 00:35:18,763
Facebook is like the
largest media company in history,

582
00:35:18,803 --> 00:35:22,083
and one person, Mark Zuckerberg,
is its dictator.

583
00:35:23,403 --> 00:35:27,083
And that was set up early
on by Peter Thiel.

584
00:35:27,123 --> 00:35:30,723
Thiel was instrumental in creating
a situation where Zuckerberg

585
00:35:30,763 --> 00:35:34,323
had this kind of like,
controlling share in the company.

586
00:35:34,363 --> 00:35:36,243
He set Facebook up

587
00:35:36,283 --> 00:35:38,363
so that Zuckerberg could do
whatever he wants.

588
00:35:38,403 --> 00:35:41,483
Peter Thiel really backed
the idea of the 'founder-genius'.

589
00:35:41,523 --> 00:35:43,563
You founded this company.

590
00:35:43,603 --> 00:35:45,963
You came up with the idea
of a social network.

591
00:35:46,003 --> 00:35:49,003
You are the genius and you need
to be in control of this.

592
00:35:49,043 --> 00:35:51,283
You need to be calling
all the shots.

593
00:35:51,323 --> 00:35:53,803
To the degree that
we will structure your company

594
00:35:53,843 --> 00:35:55,843
so nobody can hold you accountable.

595
00:35:56,883 --> 00:36:00,763
That gave Zuckerberg essentially
complete control over this company,

596
00:36:00,803 --> 00:36:02,763
which continues to this day.

597
00:36:04,043 --> 00:36:07,323
Basically, Zuckerberg could do
whatever he wants.

598
00:36:07,363 --> 00:36:09,683
Facebook is buying Instagram.

599
00:36:09,723 --> 00:36:11,923
That's a popular
photo sharing service

600
00:36:11,963 --> 00:36:14,483
for $1 billion in cash and stock.

601
00:36:14,523 --> 00:36:17,763
Zuckerberg reportedly negotiated
the deal to acquire Instagram

602
00:36:17,803 --> 00:36:20,763
for a billion dollars without
alerting the board

603
00:36:20,803 --> 00:36:22,443
or consulting with the board.

604
00:36:22,483 --> 00:36:26,323
Instagram was tiny, but it was
growing very, very rapidly.

605
00:36:26,363 --> 00:36:29,163
It was obvious that it was cool

606
00:36:29,203 --> 00:36:32,083
and the cool people
were already using it,

607
00:36:32,123 --> 00:36:34,123
even though it only
had 30 million users.

608
00:36:34,163 --> 00:36:36,563
It had every major, you know,

609
00:36:36,603 --> 00:36:39,003
smart person in Silicon Valley
using it.

610
00:36:40,003 --> 00:36:42,923
He already knew that he was
a little behind the curve

611
00:36:42,963 --> 00:36:45,363
on adapting to the smartphone era

612
00:36:45,403 --> 00:36:48,963
because Facebook had been
built for the PC era,

613
00:36:49,003 --> 00:36:52,363
and Instagram was designed
for the mobile age.

614
00:36:52,403 --> 00:36:55,563
He was very concerned that if
he didn't buy Instagram,

615
00:36:55,603 --> 00:36:58,803
it would be a major competitive
problem for him.

616
00:37:01,403 --> 00:37:03,283
Everyone was convinced
that Zuckerberg

617
00:37:03,323 --> 00:37:06,403
spending a billion dollars
for Instagram was a sign that,

618
00:37:06,443 --> 00:37:09,523
you know, the world had gone crazy
because, like, how could a company

619
00:37:09,563 --> 00:37:12,683
with few dozen employees possibly
be worth a billion dollars?

620
00:37:12,723 --> 00:37:14,883
- What is that?
- I know!

621
00:37:15,803 --> 00:37:19,403
It's got 30 million users. Just like
a social media platform for photos?

622
00:37:19,443 --> 00:37:21,763
It's retro. Retro-
Can it make me look younger?

623
00:37:21,803 --> 00:37:24,603
Give a hand to the
Instagram founders!

624
00:37:25,883 --> 00:37:28,403
The idea is to sell
your company to a company

625
00:37:28,443 --> 00:37:31,203
that's gonna be a rocket ship.
And I remember Mike and I talking

626
00:37:31,243 --> 00:37:35,763
about, like, do we believe that by
being part of this larger company,

627
00:37:35,803 --> 00:37:39,523
Instagram can reach an even higher
potential even more quickly?

628
00:37:39,563 --> 00:37:41,803
And that was the bet that we made.

629
00:37:41,843 --> 00:37:45,443
Facebook makes money by collecting
data on its users and selling ads.

630
00:37:46,403 --> 00:37:49,963
Instagram was important because you
were that much more likely

631
00:37:50,003 --> 00:37:52,163
to share photos
which showed things in them

632
00:37:52,203 --> 00:37:53,963
of what you might be interested in.

633
00:37:54,003 --> 00:37:56,683
And if you're trying to sell
somebody a product, be it a car

634
00:37:56,723 --> 00:38:00,443
or T-shirt, it could show where
you were in terms of income bracket.

635
00:38:00,483 --> 00:38:03,083
And so a lot of these things
would have been really lucrative

636
00:38:03,123 --> 00:38:04,803
for Mark Zuckerberg.

637
00:38:04,843 --> 00:38:07,523
There's a clue to the
potential financial attraction

638
00:38:07,563 --> 00:38:09,283
the moment you download Instagram.

639
00:38:09,323 --> 00:38:12,123
30 million worldwide
now have the app.

640
00:38:12,163 --> 00:38:14,763
Every one of them has handed over
their personal details,

641
00:38:14,803 --> 00:38:17,003
creating a bulging database,

642
00:38:17,043 --> 00:38:18,763
now the property of Facebook.

643
00:38:19,763 --> 00:38:22,923
The same with WhatsApp,
you know, paying billions of dollars

644
00:38:22,963 --> 00:38:25,883
for this messaging platform
that had almost no revenue.

645
00:38:27,683 --> 00:38:30,803
Mr Zuckerberg, would you
be comfortable sharing with us

646
00:38:30,843 --> 00:38:33,363
the name of the hotel you
stayed in last night?

647
00:38:33,403 --> 00:38:35,403
Um.

648
00:38:37,883 --> 00:38:39,883
Uh, no.

649
00:38:41,923 --> 00:38:44,923
If you messaged anybody this week,

650
00:38:44,963 --> 00:38:48,243
would you share with us the names
of the people you messaged?

651
00:38:48,283 --> 00:38:51,843
Senator, no, I would probably not
choose to do that publicly here.

652
00:38:51,883 --> 00:38:54,123
I think that may be what
this is all about.

653
00:38:55,443 --> 00:38:57,323
Your right to privacy.

654
00:38:57,363 --> 00:38:59,563
The limits of your right to privacy

655
00:38:59,603 --> 00:39:02,683
and how much you give away
in modern America,

656
00:39:02,723 --> 00:39:06,123
in the name of, quote, "connecting
people around the world."

657
00:39:07,243 --> 00:39:09,803
Question, basically of...

658
00:39:09,843 --> 00:39:12,243
what information
Facebook is collecting,

659
00:39:12,283 --> 00:39:14,883
who they're sending it to,
and whether they ever asked me,

660
00:39:14,923 --> 00:39:17,363
in advance,
my permission to do that.

661
00:39:17,403 --> 00:39:20,483
Is that a fair thing for
a user of Facebook to expect?

662
00:39:25,043 --> 00:39:28,323
The Zuckerberg Files came out of...
a project where I was thinking

663
00:39:28,363 --> 00:39:31,243
about how does Zuckerberg
talk about privacy?

664
00:39:31,283 --> 00:39:34,603
So I started collecting blog posts
and speeches or interviews

665
00:39:34,643 --> 00:39:36,563
that he gave around privacy

666
00:39:36,603 --> 00:39:39,563
and decided to build
a digital archive.

667
00:39:39,603 --> 00:39:41,883
And so we've created
the Zuckerberg Files

668
00:39:41,923 --> 00:39:45,043
and have been collecting every
single thing that he says in public.

669
00:39:45,083 --> 00:39:49,003
One of the earliest clips
that we have is a family video

670
00:39:49,043 --> 00:39:51,083
of when Mark Zuckerberg received

671
00:39:51,123 --> 00:39:54,483
his acceptance letter
into Harvard University.

672
00:39:54,523 --> 00:39:58,323
One of his other first interviews
he gave to some filmmakers

673
00:39:58,363 --> 00:40:01,043
is him sitting on a couch
in shorts with a red cup,

674
00:40:01,083 --> 00:40:03,643
probably with beer in it,
and a T-shirt just hanging out

675
00:40:03,683 --> 00:40:05,483
and giving an interview.

676
00:40:05,523 --> 00:40:08,763
I mean, whether we have something
that will last for a long time

677
00:40:08,803 --> 00:40:10,883
or is this just, like,
kind of a cool toy

678
00:40:10,923 --> 00:40:13,163
for people to play with now?
We'll see.

679
00:40:13,203 --> 00:40:15,563
And that's one of the fun things
about the archive.

680
00:40:15,603 --> 00:40:19,043
We can see how he's kind of evolved
and how his image changes.

681
00:40:19,083 --> 00:40:22,323
And one of the moments when that
happened was an interview he gave

682
00:40:22,363 --> 00:40:25,323
where there were really hot lights,
some controversies going on,

683
00:40:25,363 --> 00:40:28,203
some really hard questions.
He was sweating onstage.

684
00:40:28,243 --> 00:40:31,083
You want to take off
- the hoodie?
- Woah.

685
00:40:32,123 --> 00:40:33,963
Alright. That's OK.

686
00:40:34,003 --> 00:40:36,723
You could tell he was uncomfortable.
He took off his sweatshirt

687
00:40:36,763 --> 00:40:41,363
and inside of his sweatshirt is like
this kind of weird company logo.

688
00:40:41,403 --> 00:40:43,843
We print our mission on the inside.
What?

689
00:40:43,883 --> 00:40:45,683
What is it? "Making the..."

690
00:40:45,723 --> 00:40:47,883
Making the world
more open and connected.

691
00:40:47,923 --> 00:40:49,923
Oh, my God. It's like a secret cult.

692
00:40:52,283 --> 00:40:55,203
And really, from that point on,
I think then they brought in

693
00:40:55,243 --> 00:40:57,643
the corporate communication
heavyweights,

694
00:40:57,683 --> 00:40:59,363
gave him some speech training.

695
00:40:59,403 --> 00:41:02,563
That's when we start seeing the jokes
about Zuckerberg as a robot.

696
00:41:02,603 --> 00:41:06,843
And, you know, and that there's this
kind of coldness to how he engages.

697
00:41:08,643 --> 00:41:11,763
More recently, he's been posting
more about his family...

698
00:41:12,803 --> 00:41:16,123
...including now occasionally
pictures of his children.

699
00:41:16,163 --> 00:41:19,403
But interestingly, we rarely
see his children's faces.

700
00:41:19,443 --> 00:41:22,483
So, I'm assuming he wants
to make sure his kids faces

701
00:41:22,523 --> 00:41:25,243
don't get put online
for privacy reasons

702
00:41:25,283 --> 00:41:28,403
or any kind of face recognition
or for their own safety.

703
00:41:28,443 --> 00:41:31,243
But of course,
his platform has built tools

704
00:41:31,283 --> 00:41:33,283
to scan our pictures and our faces.

705
00:41:35,283 --> 00:41:38,763
So, he's taking these steps
to protect his family, you know,

706
00:41:38,803 --> 00:41:41,963
in ways that maybe many users
don't understand how they should be

707
00:41:42,003 --> 00:41:45,723
doing similar things to protect
their own privacy on his platform.

708
00:41:49,163 --> 00:41:51,963
Facebook, as I said, Josh, hitting
another new all time high today,

709
00:41:52,003 --> 00:41:54,763
above 70 bucks.
It just seems unstoppable.

710
00:41:54,803 --> 00:41:56,683
They like every move he makes, now.

711
00:41:56,723 --> 00:41:59,803
I don't know how much longer this
lasts, but for right now,

712
00:41:59,843 --> 00:42:02,483
it seems he can do no wrong, and the
stock price reflects that.

713
00:42:24,803 --> 00:42:28,723
Ladies and gentlemen,
I am officially running...

714
00:42:31,083 --> 00:42:33,603
...for President
of the United States.

715
00:42:33,643 --> 00:42:36,803
When Trump first
came down that escalator...

716
00:42:36,843 --> 00:42:39,803
to announce that he was running
for president, myself,

717
00:42:39,843 --> 00:42:41,523
like a lot of others, was like,

718
00:42:41,563 --> 00:42:44,483
"This is probably not
going to last very long."

719
00:42:45,483 --> 00:42:48,963
I got an email one night
from Trump's PR that said...

720
00:42:49,003 --> 00:42:52,443
"Trump's thinking about running
for president. You want to help?"

721
00:42:52,483 --> 00:42:54,523
I was like, "Yeah, sure."

722
00:42:55,403 --> 00:42:57,603
I walk into this big room.

723
00:42:57,643 --> 00:42:59,483
So, I listened for an hour

724
00:42:59,523 --> 00:43:01,883
to a pitch of all this stuff
they're gonna do.

725
00:43:01,923 --> 00:43:04,203
And they asked what I think,
and I just said, "No."

726
00:43:04,243 --> 00:43:07,243
I just said, "We're going to do
something completely different."

727
00:43:07,283 --> 00:43:10,203
I said, "We're going to win
this thing on Facebook."

728
00:43:12,203 --> 00:43:15,163
I went home, and I focused all day,
every day,

729
00:43:15,203 --> 00:43:18,043
creating most of the content,
doing everything myself,

730
00:43:18,083 --> 00:43:20,003
my laptop at home, just me.

731
00:43:20,803 --> 00:43:24,083
We need to talk directly to every
single person individually

732
00:43:24,123 --> 00:43:26,803
so that they can have
the proper understanding

733
00:43:26,843 --> 00:43:28,763
of who Donald Trump is
and what he wants to do.

734
00:43:30,203 --> 00:43:32,483
Voters have busy lives,
they're doing things,

735
00:43:32,523 --> 00:43:35,283
but they're on Facebook during
lunch. Facebook in the evenings.

736
00:43:35,323 --> 00:43:37,723
They're on Facebook in the restroom.

737
00:43:37,763 --> 00:43:41,643
So, you have these moments of time
where you can get into their brain.

738
00:43:41,683 --> 00:43:43,723
Facebook said,
"We'll give you a team.

739
00:43:43,763 --> 00:43:46,683
They can sit in your office all day
and ask them whatever you want.

740
00:43:46,723 --> 00:43:49,363
Anything breaks, they'll fix it,
if you spend this much money."

741
00:43:49,403 --> 00:43:51,043
I said, I'm going spend
$100 million."

742
00:43:51,083 --> 00:43:53,323
They're like, "Well, that's plenty."

743
00:43:54,563 --> 00:43:57,723
Zuckerberg's ideology is
to 'bring the world together'.

744
00:43:57,763 --> 00:43:59,723
Donald Trump,
whether you like him or not,

745
00:43:59,763 --> 00:44:02,323
that is certainly not his ideology.

746
00:44:02,363 --> 00:44:05,563
I think he probably thought it was
going be the best possible outcome.

747
00:44:05,603 --> 00:44:07,523
Donald Trump driving
lots of engagement,

748
00:44:07,563 --> 00:44:10,123
Donald Trump buying lots of ads
and then Donald Trump losing.

749
00:44:10,163 --> 00:44:11,963
I think they thought
they'd take the money

750
00:44:12,003 --> 00:44:14,243
and Trump would be a joke
and they'd benefit from it.

751
00:44:14,283 --> 00:44:16,963
I don't think they saw what was
coming at all. I did.

752
00:44:17,003 --> 00:44:20,723
And yes, we will build a wall.

753
00:44:21,603 --> 00:44:24,403
The way you work with
Facebook as you say,

754
00:44:24,443 --> 00:44:26,723
the people I want to reach
look like this.

755
00:44:27,723 --> 00:44:30,803
Find all the people in Facebook...

756
00:44:30,843 --> 00:44:32,723
who look like the people I want.

757
00:44:32,763 --> 00:44:36,403
And when you have one in seven
voters in your custom audience,

758
00:44:36,443 --> 00:44:38,803
the precision with which
you can target

759
00:44:38,843 --> 00:44:40,443
is completely unprecedented.

760
00:44:41,563 --> 00:44:44,403
So he says, "I'm going to
sell a ton of hats

761
00:44:44,443 --> 00:44:46,443
that say, 'Make America Great'."

762
00:44:46,483 --> 00:44:49,403
Somebody buys one of those hats,
and then he says to Facebook,

763
00:44:49,443 --> 00:44:52,723
OK, now put a Trump 2016 ad

764
00:44:52,763 --> 00:44:55,563
in front of everybody
who has characteristics

765
00:44:55,603 --> 00:44:57,923
similar to the person
who bought the hat.

766
00:44:57,963 --> 00:45:01,123
Facebook knows everything
about everybody.

767
00:45:01,163 --> 00:45:04,763
So it finds all of these people
who are similar, in whatever way

768
00:45:04,803 --> 00:45:06,643
the Facebook algorithm can determine,

769
00:45:06,683 --> 00:45:08,603
to the person
who just bought the hat.

770
00:45:09,923 --> 00:45:12,683
Anything we were offering
to the Trump team.

771
00:45:12,723 --> 00:45:14,963
We're also offering
to the Clinton team.

772
00:45:15,803 --> 00:45:18,443
Hillary's folks were like,
"Thanks, we've got it.

773
00:45:18,483 --> 00:45:21,123
Don't call us. We'll call you
if we need help.

774
00:45:22,283 --> 00:45:26,483
Donald J Trump is calling for a
total and complete shutdown

775
00:45:26,523 --> 00:45:29,563
of Muslims entering
the United States

776
00:45:29,603 --> 00:45:33,083
until our country's representatives

777
00:45:33,123 --> 00:45:36,523
can figure out what
the hell is going on.

778
00:45:38,443 --> 00:45:41,003
Facebook was a perfect
medium for Donald Trump.

779
00:45:41,043 --> 00:45:44,043
He appeals to the emotions
that work on Facebook,

780
00:45:44,083 --> 00:45:47,203
our lizard brain emotions, and not
our thoughtful brain emotions.

781
00:45:47,243 --> 00:45:50,363
Hate him, love him. You have
immediate reactions to Donald Trump.

782
00:45:50,403 --> 00:45:54,283
That's how the Facebook algorithm
was tuned, particularly in 2016.

783
00:45:54,323 --> 00:45:57,563
I went to go check my phone
and I see Trump's post

784
00:45:57,603 --> 00:46:00,803
and immediately I'm like,

785
00:46:00,843 --> 00:46:03,203
"Oh, no, this is not good."

786
00:46:04,283 --> 00:46:07,443
And I ping some folks on my team
and I'm like,

787
00:46:07,483 --> 00:46:10,603
"Make sure nobody takes down
this post

788
00:46:10,643 --> 00:46:13,363
without escalating it
up to leadership."

789
00:46:15,643 --> 00:46:19,723
They are crossing a line
and we've not had that before.

790
00:46:19,763 --> 00:46:21,963
We want to protect political speech.

791
00:46:22,003 --> 00:46:25,243
And the assumption was that
political candidates

792
00:46:25,283 --> 00:46:29,563
will not say completely unreasonable
things that break our rules.

793
00:46:29,603 --> 00:46:32,043
You got to see this guy.
Oh, I don't know what I said.

794
00:46:32,083 --> 00:46:34,163
Aagh! I don't remember.

795
00:46:35,003 --> 00:46:38,003
He's starting to put things on
Facebook that are challenging us

796
00:46:38,043 --> 00:46:41,123
that we never thought
we'd have to grapple with.

797
00:46:41,163 --> 00:46:44,203
So if you see somebody getting ready
to throw a tomato,

798
00:46:44,243 --> 00:46:46,643
knock the crap out of it, would you?
Seriously?

799
00:46:46,683 --> 00:46:50,163
Are we seriously now in a spot
where we're have to think about...

800
00:46:51,003 --> 00:46:55,323
taking down content from a potential
President of the United States?

801
00:46:59,163 --> 00:47:01,483
Normally we'd have that
discussion with Sheryl.

802
00:47:01,523 --> 00:47:04,563
If it's sufficiently momentous,

803
00:47:04,603 --> 00:47:07,683
then Sheryl will then
take it to Mark,

804
00:47:07,723 --> 00:47:10,563
and then he'll either
go with it or he won't.

805
00:47:10,603 --> 00:47:14,163
When Mexico sends its people...
they're bringing drugs.

806
00:47:14,203 --> 00:47:17,123
They're bringing crime.
They're rapists.

807
00:47:18,123 --> 00:47:21,003
Mark did understand
the scope for abuse,

808
00:47:21,043 --> 00:47:23,963
and he felt that
the way you avoid that

809
00:47:24,003 --> 00:47:26,923
is you say we, the platform,
are neutral.

810
00:47:26,963 --> 00:47:29,563
We don't decide
what's in your news feed.

811
00:47:29,603 --> 00:47:32,483
You, the user, decide
what's in your news feed.

812
00:47:33,403 --> 00:47:35,643
Mark does
an interesting interview

813
00:47:35,683 --> 00:47:37,883
where he is in a room
full of people,

814
00:47:37,923 --> 00:47:42,323
and you can see he really held on to
this idea that all speech is good

815
00:47:42,363 --> 00:47:45,083
and that people would see
the misinformation for what it was.

816
00:47:46,123 --> 00:47:49,643
This is tricky, right?
Because lies...

817
00:47:51,003 --> 00:47:55,283
What the line is between something
which is factually untrue

818
00:47:55,323 --> 00:47:58,323
and what is a disagreement of opinion

819
00:47:58,363 --> 00:48:00,803
is not always a black and white line.

820
00:48:01,843 --> 00:48:05,883
we don't want to block people from
sharing something on Facebook,

821
00:48:05,923 --> 00:48:07,923
even if it's untrue.

822
00:48:08,963 --> 00:48:12,083
Forget the press. Read the Internet.

823
00:48:12,123 --> 00:48:15,443
Study other things.
Don't go for the mainstream media.

824
00:48:15,483 --> 00:48:18,563
I saw how Facebook was polluting
the news ecosystem,

825
00:48:18,603 --> 00:48:21,683
and I saw that
it was making media worse.

826
00:48:21,723 --> 00:48:25,003
I noticed that stories
with no information,

827
00:48:25,043 --> 00:48:28,803
salacious headlines,
all kinds of problematic features

828
00:48:28,843 --> 00:48:31,323
were doing much better
than other stories.

829
00:48:32,803 --> 00:48:34,643
That's when I started to really say,

830
00:48:34,683 --> 00:48:36,963
"Oh, wait, what's going on here?"

831
00:48:37,883 --> 00:48:41,123
And then, of course, we have Crooked
Hillary. Crooked Hillary!

832
00:48:48,203 --> 00:48:50,323
What should we be thinking
about fact checking?

833
00:48:50,363 --> 00:48:52,843
Should we be thinking about this?

834
00:48:52,883 --> 00:48:55,203
Is there anybody more
crooked than this woman?

835
00:48:55,243 --> 00:48:56,883
We're in the middle of an election.

836
00:48:56,923 --> 00:49:00,083
We don't want to look like we're
putting our thumbs on the scale.

837
00:49:00,963 --> 00:49:05,683
I was like, "He might win?
No, he's not going to win."

838
00:49:05,723 --> 00:49:07,683
I kind of had this...

839
00:49:07,723 --> 00:49:11,283
two sides in my brain fighting
against one another.

840
00:49:11,323 --> 00:49:13,683
And I think a lot of others
at the company did, too.

841
00:49:15,643 --> 00:49:18,283
Please welcome
the co-founder of PayPal

842
00:49:18,323 --> 00:49:22,163
and first investor in Facebook,
entrepreneur, Peter Thiel.

843
00:49:23,803 --> 00:49:26,523
Good evening. I'm Peter Theil.

844
00:49:26,563 --> 00:49:30,523
I build companies and I support
people who are building new things,

845
00:49:30,563 --> 00:49:32,843
from social networks to rocket ships.

846
00:49:33,643 --> 00:49:37,323
I'm not a politician,
but neither is Donald Trump.

847
00:49:38,203 --> 00:49:42,563
He is a builder,
and it's time to rebuild America.

848
00:49:44,883 --> 00:49:47,883
He's a self-described
libertarian,

849
00:49:47,923 --> 00:49:49,963
but he's a delegate
for Donald Trump.

850
00:49:50,003 --> 00:49:52,563
He's an immigrant from Germany, pro
tech, obviously.

851
00:49:52,603 --> 00:49:54,363
And is openly gay.

852
00:50:00,803 --> 00:50:04,283
Tonight, I urge all
of my fellow Americans

853
00:50:04,323 --> 00:50:07,603
to stand up and vote
for Donald Trump.

854
00:50:11,483 --> 00:50:14,163
Peter Thiel is very
interested in business,

855
00:50:14,203 --> 00:50:18,163
but has spent two decades as
a right-wing political activist.

856
00:50:20,923 --> 00:50:22,843
I think Thiel...

857
00:50:22,883 --> 00:50:25,283
has had an influence
on Zuckerberg's politics.

858
00:50:25,323 --> 00:50:29,603
And insofar as Zuckerberg is kind
of a libertarian who thinks that,

859
00:50:29,643 --> 00:50:32,203
you know, the world be better
off if tech companies could just

860
00:50:32,243 --> 00:50:35,243
do whatever they want and the
government should get out of his way

861
00:50:35,283 --> 00:50:39,243
and that he's kind of more OK with
Donald Trump than a lot of people.

862
00:50:39,283 --> 00:50:43,483
Those are things that Thiel,
I think, had an influence on him.

863
00:50:43,523 --> 00:50:46,763
But I don't think Zuckerberg has
deep political views at all.

864
00:50:46,803 --> 00:50:48,883
I think his politics are Facebook

865
00:50:48,923 --> 00:50:51,083
and his politics are
Mark Zuckerberg.

866
00:50:53,483 --> 00:50:56,043
I'm upstairs
with Trump in his residence,

867
00:50:56,083 --> 00:50:59,163
and I get a phone call from my data
staff that's pulling out the numbers

868
00:50:59,203 --> 00:51:02,043
and they're like, "Brad you did it.

869
00:51:02,083 --> 00:51:05,203
The numbers are there.
Trump's won. I can't believe it."

870
00:51:06,123 --> 00:51:08,923
I walked out and I told Donald
Trump, I shook his hand

871
00:51:08,963 --> 00:51:11,443
and I said, "Congratulations,
Mr President."

872
00:51:11,483 --> 00:51:13,643
He said, "Really?"
And I said, "It's done.

873
00:51:13,683 --> 00:51:16,363
They'll recount it two or three
times before they announce it.

874
00:51:16,403 --> 00:51:18,403
But you won.

875
00:51:19,283 --> 00:51:21,843
And confirmed
that Donald Trump

876
00:51:21,883 --> 00:51:25,443
will be the 45th President
of the United States.

877
00:51:32,603 --> 00:51:34,923
People are just shocked.

878
00:51:34,963 --> 00:51:38,363
How did this happen? What's going on?
What does it mean?

879
00:51:38,403 --> 00:51:43,163
And one of the quick
and early hypotheses is,

880
00:51:43,203 --> 00:51:46,603
"Oh, wait, it's because of Facebook.
Because the fake news on Facebook.

881
00:51:46,643 --> 00:51:49,483
It's because the way
the Facebook algorithm worked.

882
00:51:50,363 --> 00:51:53,243
Stories start to come out
about Russian influence.

883
00:51:53,283 --> 00:51:55,203
And the stories are overcooked,

884
00:51:55,243 --> 00:51:57,643
and they give too much credit
to the Russians.

885
00:52:00,843 --> 00:52:04,523
But suddenly it looks like
Facebook missed something.

886
00:52:13,723 --> 00:52:18,163
I ran a company which put-on
high-end tech conferences,

887
00:52:18,203 --> 00:52:22,523
and for years I had been trying to
get Zuckerberg to come and speak.

888
00:52:22,563 --> 00:52:25,523
And finally, you know, I hit it.

889
00:52:25,563 --> 00:52:28,083
Hey!
Hey. Good to see you.

890
00:52:28,123 --> 00:52:31,963
I wasn't even associating his
speaking at the conference

891
00:52:32,003 --> 00:52:34,923
with the fact that it was
two days after the election.

892
00:52:36,723 --> 00:52:38,843
And I do remember thinking...

893
00:52:38,883 --> 00:52:42,723
before he was on stage with me
that he seemed very preoccupied.

894
00:52:44,043 --> 00:52:47,123
But thank you so much
- for being here.
- Glad to.

895
00:52:47,163 --> 00:52:50,123
Post election you've been getting
a lot of pushback

896
00:52:50,163 --> 00:52:53,243
from people who feel that you didn't
filter out enough

897
00:52:53,283 --> 00:52:56,243
fake stories during
the course of the campaign.

898
00:52:56,283 --> 00:53:01,603
You know, personally... I think
the idea that...

899
00:53:02,683 --> 00:53:05,123
...you know, fake news on Facebook

900
00:53:05,163 --> 00:53:08,243
of which, you know,
it's a very small amount

901
00:53:08,283 --> 00:53:10,883
of- of the content,

902
00:53:10,923 --> 00:53:15,803
influenced the election in any way I
think is a pretty crazy idea, right?

903
00:53:15,843 --> 00:53:19,323
I was still fundamentally
sympathetic to him

904
00:53:19,363 --> 00:53:21,523
up to that point.

905
00:53:21,563 --> 00:53:25,163
But it was clear that,
no, it wasn't a crazy idea at all.

906
00:53:25,203 --> 00:53:28,003
That, in fact, whether they swung
the election or not

907
00:53:28,043 --> 00:53:30,203
is still a subject of debate,

908
00:53:30,243 --> 00:53:32,443
but fake news on Facebook had
had an impact.

909
00:53:32,483 --> 00:53:34,723
I was deeply disappointed in him.

910
00:53:36,003 --> 00:53:39,123
I was forced to think very hard.

911
00:53:40,163 --> 00:53:42,563
What do I really think about him?

912
00:53:42,603 --> 00:53:45,323
Thank you so much for being here.
Thank you, guys.

913
00:53:49,283 --> 00:53:52,883
I was really alarmed by what was
increasingly obvious

914
00:53:52,923 --> 00:53:56,803
to be the consequences of his
failures of governance.

915
00:53:59,083 --> 00:54:02,803
Overnight, we went from everything
we touched to turn to gold.

916
00:54:02,843 --> 00:54:06,283
To everything we touched
turned to dust.

917
00:54:06,323 --> 00:54:09,163
And now we're grappling with...

918
00:54:10,123 --> 00:54:12,603
...the downsides of this thing
that we built.

919
00:54:14,403 --> 00:54:17,803
When I first joined,
movies were being made.

920
00:54:17,843 --> 00:54:20,563
The founder is on the cover
of Time magazine.

921
00:54:20,603 --> 00:54:22,883
You're overthrowing dictators.

922
00:54:23,803 --> 00:54:27,723
And now seven years later, you're
being told you destroyed democracy.

923
00:54:30,043 --> 00:54:33,283
KIRKPATRICK It wasn't until
Donald Trump was elected

924
00:54:33,323 --> 00:54:35,483
that it began to be apparent

925
00:54:35,523 --> 00:54:38,163
just how dangerous a system
like this could be.

926
00:54:38,203 --> 00:54:41,043
And don't forget,
it was also Brexit.

927
00:54:41,083 --> 00:54:45,483
The sun has risen on an
independent United Kingdom.

928
00:54:45,523 --> 00:54:47,683
Erdogan in Turkey.

929
00:54:47,723 --> 00:54:49,803
Duterte in the Philippines.

930
00:54:49,843 --> 00:54:51,723
Orban in Hungary.

931
00:54:51,763 --> 00:54:56,323
All elected using Facebook,
in every single case.

932
00:54:59,603 --> 00:55:02,563
Everything changes from,
sort of, 2016 onwards

933
00:55:02,603 --> 00:55:04,683
after that Trump election.

934
00:55:04,723 --> 00:55:07,803
People in the company went
from feeling the sense of loyalty

935
00:55:07,843 --> 00:55:11,283
to feeling they had a wider loyalty
to something outside.

936
00:55:12,123 --> 00:55:14,723
They went from being proud to go
out and say I work for Facebook

937
00:55:14,763 --> 00:55:16,683
to being ashamed of it.

938
00:55:16,723 --> 00:55:19,043
You start to think,
maybe we are the bad guys.

939
00:55:24,203 --> 00:55:28,843
In terms of Mark's persona,
his big positive persona

940
00:55:28,883 --> 00:55:32,243
becomes a big negative persona
from that point onwards.

941
00:55:32,283 --> 00:55:34,443
Alright. Hey, everyone.

942
00:55:34,483 --> 00:55:37,483
I'm here with my friend

943
00:55:37,523 --> 00:55:39,763
and Facebook COO, Sheryl Sandberg,

944
00:55:39,803 --> 00:55:42,483
for our typical one-on-one.

945
00:55:42,523 --> 00:55:44,803
Welcome to our one-on-one.
Here we are.

946
00:55:45,963 --> 00:55:49,803
Sheryl Sandberg and Mark,
do these twice a week, one-on-ones.

947
00:55:49,843 --> 00:55:53,203
But it's put on for show
to make people feel that

948
00:55:53,243 --> 00:55:57,643
Facebook is a place largely for
good, rather than with conspiracies,

949
00:55:57,683 --> 00:56:00,923
hate speech and misinformation that
was really flooding the platform.

950
00:56:00,963 --> 00:56:03,243
It's been a really important year
for sharing

951
00:56:03,283 --> 00:56:05,843
because a lot has happened
and not all of it positive.

952
00:56:05,883 --> 00:56:08,523
This has been a year of
a lot of angst,

953
00:56:08,563 --> 00:56:11,883
a lot of people having issues,
really serious issues,

954
00:56:11,923 --> 00:56:15,163
violence, war, terrorism
all around the world.

955
00:56:15,203 --> 00:56:17,483
But you also see these
other moments.

956
00:56:17,523 --> 00:56:19,963
You see, you know, the number one
live video of the year

957
00:56:20,003 --> 00:56:21,923
was the Chewbacca mom.
Hey.

958
00:56:21,963 --> 00:56:25,963
I'm really excited to
share with you something I got.

959
00:56:26,003 --> 00:56:27,883
Here we go.

960
00:56:27,923 --> 00:56:30,283
I got to take of my glasses
for it.

961
00:56:33,363 --> 00:56:35,603
Naturally.
OK, here we go.

962
00:56:35,643 --> 00:56:38,483
So, yes.

963
00:56:38,523 --> 00:56:40,803
Now, watch when my mouth
actually moves.

964
00:56:48,203 --> 00:56:50,923
Oh, my gosh. I'm in tears.

965
00:56:52,923 --> 00:56:56,443
We see the Jewellers
and other Muslim-owned businesses

966
00:56:56,483 --> 00:56:59,723
being ransacked by Buddhist
residents and monks.

967
00:57:02,603 --> 00:57:05,323
In my mind, Myanmar
is the starkest example

968
00:57:05,363 --> 00:57:07,563
of what can go wrong with Facebook.

969
00:57:07,603 --> 00:57:09,803
It comes at a moment
where Facebook is desperate

970
00:57:09,843 --> 00:57:11,683
to expand to the rest of the world.

971
00:57:11,723 --> 00:57:14,403
They are committed to bringing
on the next 1 billion users.

972
00:57:14,443 --> 00:57:18,403
There is virtually no research done
into Myanmar as a country

973
00:57:18,443 --> 00:57:20,723
or understanding that
this is a place in the world

974
00:57:20,763 --> 00:57:23,203
where there is no free press,
there are no, you know,

975
00:57:23,243 --> 00:57:25,843
independent government institutions.

976
00:57:26,923 --> 00:57:29,083
They were buying their own PR,

977
00:57:29,123 --> 00:57:31,763
that the most important thing was
to bring people online.

978
00:57:31,803 --> 00:57:35,723
And if you brought people online,
inherent good would come from that.

979
00:57:35,763 --> 00:57:38,723
And they didn't want to listen
to the many people

980
00:57:38,763 --> 00:57:41,523
who were telling them
that in some cases,

981
00:57:41,563 --> 00:57:44,963
bringing people online
when there wasn't media literacy

982
00:57:45,003 --> 00:57:48,603
or a Free Press
or any other institution

983
00:57:48,643 --> 00:57:50,723
to hold it in account
could lead to hate speech.

984
00:57:53,523 --> 00:57:57,363
From a hilltop, we see a
young man, presumably Muslim,

985
00:57:57,403 --> 00:57:59,723
attacked by men wielding sticks.

986
00:58:00,923 --> 00:58:03,203
He staggers, attempting to flee...

987
00:58:06,003 --> 00:58:08,003
...but he is forced to the earth.

988
00:58:09,323 --> 00:58:11,963
I was a reporter in Myanmar,
and I wrote an article...

989
00:58:13,283 --> 00:58:16,963
...and part of that article
documented the rise in hate speech.

990
00:58:18,243 --> 00:58:20,883
I interviewed people
in Myanmar who said,

991
00:58:20,923 --> 00:58:24,763
"I didn't know the Rohingya
were raping and killing our women.

992
00:58:24,803 --> 00:58:27,363
But now that I'm on Facebook,
I know the Rohingya are actually

993
00:58:27,403 --> 00:58:29,643
these horrible creatures, you know."

994
00:58:29,683 --> 00:58:33,123
And I took that to Facebook,
as a reporter and I said,

995
00:58:33,163 --> 00:58:35,803
"Can you please look at these posts
that I'm sending you?

996
00:58:35,843 --> 00:58:37,923
Because I can tell that
this is actually footage

997
00:58:37,963 --> 00:58:40,243
that's been manipulated to make it
look as if

998
00:58:40,283 --> 00:58:43,243
the Rohingya are
carrying out atrocities.

999
00:58:43,283 --> 00:58:45,643
And Facebook told me to take a hike.

1000
00:58:49,203 --> 00:58:51,803
Later, I found out
even more activists

1001
00:58:51,843 --> 00:58:54,203
begin to send Facebook warnings

1002
00:58:54,243 --> 00:58:57,243
and saying hate speech
has just gone off the rails.

1003
00:58:57,283 --> 00:58:59,323
Report after report after report

1004
00:58:59,363 --> 00:59:01,883
and Facebook does nothing.

1005
00:59:01,923 --> 00:59:05,563
They even bring in an activist to
speak to them in their headquarters

1006
00:59:05,603 --> 00:59:10,243
who says, "If you do nothing,
a genocide could happen."

1007
00:59:10,283 --> 00:59:12,603
People that walk out
of that room with him and go,

1008
00:59:12,643 --> 00:59:14,483
"I think he's exaggerating.

1009
00:59:14,523 --> 00:59:16,403
I don't think he knows
what he's talking about.

1010
00:59:16,443 --> 00:59:18,683
That's not gonna happen.
That's not gonna be our fault.

1011
00:59:18,723 --> 00:59:22,043
You know, six months ago,
I asked your general counsel

1012
00:59:22,083 --> 00:59:25,363
about Facebook's role as
a breeding ground for hate speech.

1013
00:59:25,403 --> 00:59:28,603
This is a type of content I
was referring to,

1014
00:59:28,643 --> 00:59:31,843
it calls for the death
of a Muslim journalist.

1015
00:59:33,883 --> 00:59:37,563
That threat went straight
through your detection systems,

1016
00:59:37,603 --> 00:59:39,963
it spread very quickly.

1017
00:59:40,003 --> 00:59:44,003
And then it took attempt
after attempt after attempt

1018
00:59:44,043 --> 00:59:46,243
to get you to remove it.

1019
00:59:46,283 --> 00:59:50,243
Senator, what's happening in Myanmar
is a terrible tragedy

1020
00:59:50,283 --> 00:59:53,883
and we need to do more-We all
- agree with that.
- OK.But...

1021
00:59:55,043 --> 00:59:58,643
...UN investigators have blamed you,

1022
00:59:58,683 --> 01:00:00,923
blamed Facebook for playing a role

1023
01:00:00,963 --> 01:00:03,803
in citing possible
genocide in Myanmar.

1024
01:00:07,283 --> 01:00:10,763
He sees himself as having built
a platform for all humanity.

1025
01:00:11,803 --> 01:00:14,243
And in his mind,
that's a good thing.

1026
01:00:14,283 --> 01:00:16,443
There will be tremendous benefits

1027
01:00:16,483 --> 01:00:20,043
from making the world more open and
connected, et cetera, et cetera.

1028
01:00:20,083 --> 01:00:22,683
But humanity includes
some bad actors.

1029
01:00:22,723 --> 01:00:26,163
There's a lot of nasty people.
That's not his problem.

1030
01:00:26,203 --> 01:00:28,723
Yeah, there's going to be some
nasty shit that happens.

1031
01:00:28,763 --> 01:00:32,363
People are going to do things that
are illegal, immoral, cruel,

1032
01:00:32,403 --> 01:00:34,963
hateful, murderous, even.

1033
01:00:35,003 --> 01:00:37,723
"But don't blame me.
That's human nature."

1034
01:00:39,523 --> 01:00:43,003
It is reported that both
the Justice Department and the FBI

1035
01:00:43,043 --> 01:00:45,683
are investigating the now-defunct
political data firm,

1036
01:00:45,723 --> 01:00:47,643
Cambridge Analytica.

1037
01:00:47,683 --> 01:00:50,723
The data firm hired by
Donald Trump's presidential election

1038
01:00:50,763 --> 01:00:53,443
campaign used
secretly-obtained information

1039
01:00:53,483 --> 01:00:56,963
from tens of millions of
unsuspecting Facebook users.

1040
01:00:57,003 --> 01:01:00,763
Misuse of Facebook data is at
the centre of this scandal

1041
01:01:00,803 --> 01:01:04,003
involving both Facebook
and Cambridge Analytica.

1042
01:01:10,963 --> 01:01:13,603
Facebook now says 87 million users

1043
01:01:13,643 --> 01:01:17,283
may have had their information
shared with Cambridge Analytica.

1044
01:01:18,163 --> 01:01:20,883
We, as the public were impacted by
it,

1045
01:01:20,923 --> 01:01:23,643
notably have not heard
from the brand name of Facebook,

1046
01:01:23,683 --> 01:01:26,363
Mark Zuckerberg or
COO, Sheryl Sandberg.

1047
01:01:27,723 --> 01:01:30,203
Neither one of them wanted
to be the face of this.

1048
01:01:30,243 --> 01:01:32,843
And Zuckerberg was probably like,

1049
01:01:32,883 --> 01:01:35,323
"Well, it's your thing,
it's your department."

1050
01:01:35,363 --> 01:01:38,003
And she was probably
like, "You're the CEO."

1051
01:01:38,043 --> 01:01:41,523
And neither one of them could decide
who would go out and take the heat.

1052
01:01:41,563 --> 01:01:45,243
And eventually, five days later, it's
clear that someone has to come out.

1053
01:01:45,283 --> 01:01:48,243
I want to start with just
a basic question, Mark.

1054
01:01:48,283 --> 01:01:50,203
What happened? What went wrong?

1055
01:01:50,243 --> 01:01:52,643
So, this was a major breach of trust.

1056
01:01:52,683 --> 01:01:55,323
And I'm really sorry
that this happened.

1057
01:01:55,363 --> 01:01:58,243
You know, you have
a long list of apologies.

1058
01:01:58,283 --> 01:02:01,083
In 2003, it started at Harvard.

1059
01:02:01,123 --> 01:02:04,923
"I apologise for any harm done
as a result of my neglect."

1060
01:02:04,963 --> 01:02:08,163
2006, "We really messed
this one up."

1061
01:02:08,203 --> 01:02:13,043
2007, "We simply did a bad job,
I apologise for."

1062
01:02:13,083 --> 01:02:16,243
2010, "Sometimes we move too fast."

1063
01:02:16,283 --> 01:02:21,003
2011, "I'm the first to admit that
we've made a bunch of mistakes."

1064
01:02:21,043 --> 01:02:26,843
2017, "I ask for forgiveness.
I will work to do better."

1065
01:02:26,883 --> 01:02:29,323
So it seems to me...

1066
01:02:29,363 --> 01:02:32,963
that self-regulation
simply does not work.

1067
01:02:34,643 --> 01:02:37,163
Mark Zuckerberg's experience
as an individual

1068
01:02:37,203 --> 01:02:39,803
is that he does things
which upset people.

1069
01:02:39,843 --> 01:02:42,203
He apologises
and everybody moves on.

1070
01:02:42,243 --> 01:02:46,483
But there comes a moment in-
after Cambridge Analytica in 2018

1071
01:02:46,523 --> 01:02:48,923
where it's not working anymore.

1072
01:02:59,683 --> 01:03:03,403
Senator, do you think that
you really can trust a company

1073
01:03:03,443 --> 01:03:06,803
to police itself
when it comes to our privacy

1074
01:03:06,843 --> 01:03:10,483
and when it comes to things like
not censoring our freedom of speech?

1075
01:03:10,523 --> 01:03:13,523
As of right now, no.

1076
01:03:13,563 --> 01:03:16,363
Lawmakers in Washington were
getting impatient because

1077
01:03:16,403 --> 01:03:18,123
the controversies were stacking.

1078
01:03:18,163 --> 01:03:21,523
Sentiment was turning against
the technology industry.

1079
01:03:22,443 --> 01:03:26,083
They had wanted Mark Zuckerberg
to testify for more than a year

1080
01:03:26,123 --> 01:03:28,483
and Facebook declined, they refused.

1081
01:03:29,723 --> 01:03:32,643
And then they threatened
to subpoena Mark Zuckerberg

1082
01:03:32,683 --> 01:03:36,843
if he didn't appear in hearings
in Washington.

1083
01:03:36,883 --> 01:03:40,003
And so finally, they agreed that

1084
01:03:40,043 --> 01:03:42,243
Mark Zuckerberg would come
to testify.

1085
01:03:44,003 --> 01:03:46,363
There's a reason all these
incredibly important

1086
01:03:46,403 --> 01:03:50,723
and effective disruptors of
social media communications,

1087
01:03:50,763 --> 01:03:54,843
shopping, started in America because
we had light touch regulation.

1088
01:03:54,883 --> 01:03:57,603
Now they've gotten big.
So we have a job to step in.

1089
01:03:57,643 --> 01:04:00,923
If they don't perform according to
the rules of the road.

1090
01:04:02,243 --> 01:04:05,403
Facebook has not been regulated
at all at that point,

1091
01:04:05,443 --> 01:04:09,043
and any sort of regulation
that could pop up

1092
01:04:09,083 --> 01:04:12,283
would be catastrophic
for the company.

1093
01:04:13,243 --> 01:04:16,283
Any regulation and privacy,
and data collection

1094
01:04:16,323 --> 01:04:18,643
would impede Facebook's
business model,

1095
01:04:18,683 --> 01:04:21,123
which is to collect
as much data as possible

1096
01:04:21,163 --> 01:04:23,843
and to sell that data
to advertisers.

1097
01:04:23,883 --> 01:04:26,523
That is the heart of
Facebook's business model.

1098
01:04:30,403 --> 01:04:33,003
Mark knows
that it's high stakes.

1099
01:04:34,923 --> 01:04:38,523
You know that the chances of getting
something wrong are quite high.

1100
01:04:38,563 --> 01:04:41,443
So I think he's absolutely
laser-focused.

1101
01:04:42,523 --> 01:04:45,363
Facebook hired one
of the biggest law firms,

1102
01:04:45,403 --> 01:04:49,323
and for two weeks this law firm went
to Menlo Park

1103
01:04:49,363 --> 01:04:53,083
and spent time with Mark Zuckerberg
holed up in conference room,

1104
01:04:53,123 --> 01:04:55,643
grilling him in, sort of,
mock hearings,

1105
01:04:55,683 --> 01:04:58,163
grilling him on the names
of members of Congress,

1106
01:04:58,203 --> 01:05:02,083
on what questions they'd ask. It was
almost a mock debate preparation.

1107
01:05:02,123 --> 01:05:04,643
I think what he wants is,
to get in there.

1108
01:05:04,683 --> 01:05:06,563
Don't screw up. Get out.

1109
01:05:10,763 --> 01:05:13,083
It's a monumental moment
for Facebook.

1110
01:05:13,123 --> 01:05:15,123
This is a company
that's become ubiquitous.

1111
01:05:15,163 --> 01:05:18,683
It's now under fire for not being
transparent with its users

1112
01:05:18,723 --> 01:05:21,363
about its use of our data.

1113
01:05:21,403 --> 01:05:24,443
Now, CEO Mark Zuckerberg,
will have his moment on Capitol Hill

1114
01:05:24,483 --> 01:05:26,483
testifying before Congress.

1115
01:05:28,803 --> 01:05:31,603
The stakes are very, very high.

1116
01:05:33,323 --> 01:05:36,963
Mark Zuckerberg walked into
the hearing rooms

1117
01:05:37,003 --> 01:05:39,323
in the navy, blue suit

1118
01:05:39,363 --> 01:05:41,763
and surrounded by an entourage
of lobbyists.

1119
01:05:44,163 --> 01:05:48,643
He came in with almost, like,
a slight smile on his face,

1120
01:05:48,683 --> 01:05:52,803
trying to look cordial, trying to
look cool and calm and collected.

1121
01:05:52,843 --> 01:05:55,403
They're unfazed.
They don't want to show that

1122
01:05:55,443 --> 01:05:57,883
they're deeply inside
very, very nervous.

1123
01:06:01,843 --> 01:06:05,603
I think there was
a sense among lawmakers

1124
01:06:05,643 --> 01:06:09,243
that this was an opportunity to
arrest this...

1125
01:06:09,283 --> 01:06:13,763
incredibly fast-growing, dominant
social cultural business phenomenon.

1126
01:06:15,083 --> 01:06:17,763
Mark, are you putting
privacy over profits now?

1127
01:06:19,803 --> 01:06:22,963
His lobbyists had negotiated
with staff to make sure that

1128
01:06:23,003 --> 01:06:25,083
the air conditioning was jacked up

1129
01:06:25,123 --> 01:06:27,923
so that Mark Zuckerberg
wouldn't sweat on camera.

1130
01:06:29,003 --> 01:06:31,723
Not only is the public, competitors

1131
01:06:31,763 --> 01:06:34,163
and lawmakers all watching
this hearing,

1132
01:06:34,203 --> 01:06:36,123
but so is the stock market.

1133
01:06:36,163 --> 01:06:38,563
Investors were watching the hearings

1134
01:06:38,603 --> 01:06:41,283
to see if Mark Zuckerberg
might trip up

1135
01:06:41,323 --> 01:06:44,523
and say something that could hurt
the future of the business

1136
01:06:44,563 --> 01:06:47,443
and therefore hurt the stock.

1137
01:07:03,163 --> 01:07:06,083
Committee on the Judiciary
and the Commerce,

1138
01:07:06,123 --> 01:07:09,323
Science and Transportation
will come to order.

1139
01:07:12,363 --> 01:07:15,323
The beginning of the hearings
with Mark Zuckerberg are tense.

1140
01:07:15,363 --> 01:07:18,283
You could tell the Facebook
flock in the room are tense.

1141
01:07:18,323 --> 01:07:20,483
You could tell Mark is tense,
the way he's sitting.

1142
01:07:20,523 --> 01:07:23,163
He's kind of very squared off.

1143
01:07:23,203 --> 01:07:26,083
I was captivated. What are the
questions they're going to ask?

1144
01:07:26,123 --> 01:07:28,803
What are they going to uncover?
What are they going to learn?

1145
01:07:28,843 --> 01:07:31,003
Mr Zuckerberg,
what is Facebook doing

1146
01:07:31,043 --> 01:07:35,723
to prevent foreign actors from
interfering in US elections?

1147
01:07:35,763 --> 01:07:37,923
How will you protect user's data?

1148
01:07:37,963 --> 01:07:41,283
Do you collect user data
through cross-device tracking?

1149
01:07:41,323 --> 01:07:43,763
Are you willing to expand my right

1150
01:07:43,803 --> 01:07:45,843
to know who you're sharing
my data with?

1151
01:07:45,883 --> 01:07:48,683
Do you believe European regulations
should be applied in the US?

1152
01:07:48,723 --> 01:07:51,163
Are you willing to change
your business model

1153
01:07:51,203 --> 01:07:54,963
in the interest of protecting
individual privacy?

1154
01:07:55,003 --> 01:07:57,323
Congresswoman,
I'm not sure what that means.

1155
01:07:58,723 --> 01:08:01,363
It would seem like
that would be the start

1156
01:08:01,403 --> 01:08:04,163
of what would be
a really intense grilling.

1157
01:08:04,203 --> 01:08:07,083
But I was really surprised
to hear how many times

1158
01:08:07,123 --> 01:08:09,963
Mark Zuckerberg was able to say... I
can have my team follow up with you.

1159
01:08:10,003 --> 01:08:12,043
I'll have my team get back to you.

1160
01:08:12,083 --> 01:08:15,483
I'm happy to have my team follow up
with you if that would be helpful?

1161
01:08:15,523 --> 01:08:18,123
...without answering
the question at that moment.

1162
01:08:18,163 --> 01:08:19,963
And there was no follow up.

1163
01:08:20,003 --> 01:08:22,443
Some of the questions
were very basic and very simple.

1164
01:08:22,483 --> 01:08:25,963
And I was watching this and I was
communicating with other people

1165
01:08:26,003 --> 01:08:29,443
who follow the industry well and
they were saying the same thing.

1166
01:08:29,483 --> 01:08:31,203
Why is there no follow up?

1167
01:08:32,603 --> 01:08:36,563
Mark Zuckerberg was probably
thinking the same thing,

1168
01:08:36,603 --> 01:08:39,363
that some of these questions
were not so hard

1169
01:08:39,403 --> 01:08:42,083
and that the hearings themselves
would not be the grilling,

1170
01:08:42,123 --> 01:08:45,763
the, sort of, slaying
that he had feared.

1171
01:08:45,803 --> 01:08:48,923
You're supposed to answer 'yes'
to this question.

1172
01:08:49,923 --> 01:08:52,363
OK, come on.
I'm trying to help you, right.

1173
01:08:52,403 --> 01:08:55,283
I mean, give me a break.
The answer is 'yes'.

1174
01:08:55,323 --> 01:08:57,523
OK, so thank you.

1175
01:08:57,563 --> 01:09:00,163
The hearings could have
been a turning point,

1176
01:09:00,203 --> 01:09:04,203
but some of the members of Congress
asked these incredibly fumbling
questions.

1177
01:09:04,243 --> 01:09:06,403
'What is this Facebook machine?'
You know,.

1178
01:09:06,443 --> 01:09:10,083
they just they sound like your dad
is asking a question about Facebook.

1179
01:09:10,123 --> 01:09:14,363
How do you sustain
a business model in which
users don't pay for your service?

1180
01:09:15,883 --> 01:09:17,883
Senator, we run ads.

1181
01:09:18,923 --> 01:09:20,403
I see.

1182
01:09:20,443 --> 01:09:23,043
It became so clear that these
members of Congress

1183
01:09:23,083 --> 01:09:27,723
didn't know the very basic
technology that Facebook ran on

1184
01:09:27,763 --> 01:09:31,523
and that they were so out
of their league in understanding

1185
01:09:31,563 --> 01:09:33,923
the fundamentals
of Facebook as a company.

1186
01:09:33,963 --> 01:09:36,163
How could they possibly
hold them to account?

1187
01:09:36,203 --> 01:09:40,043
You want to break now? Or you want
to keep going.

1188
01:09:40,083 --> 01:09:43,483
Sure. I mean, that was that was
pretty good. So, alright.

1189
01:09:44,803 --> 01:09:46,923
In the room at that moment you
understood,

1190
01:09:46,963 --> 01:09:48,643
like, he's got this.

1191
01:09:48,683 --> 01:09:51,643
He's got these members of Congress
wrapped around his little finger.

1192
01:09:51,683 --> 01:09:53,523
I remember talking to
a Facebook executive

1193
01:09:53,563 --> 01:09:55,843
who was fairly sceptical of
Zuckerberg, talking about

1194
01:09:55,883 --> 01:09:59,923
everybody in a cafeteria celebrating
as he knocks the senators back.

1195
01:09:59,963 --> 01:10:02,723
And just that was a moment
where a company,

1196
01:10:02,763 --> 01:10:04,763
which had lost a bit of faith
in their leader,

1197
01:10:04,803 --> 01:10:06,203
decided they loved him again.

1198
01:10:06,243 --> 01:10:08,563
The hearing is adjourned.

1199
01:10:12,083 --> 01:10:14,163
He came out of it pretty well.

1200
01:10:14,203 --> 01:10:16,083
Much better than
I would have expected.

1201
01:10:17,843 --> 01:10:20,683
I mean, at the end, I think
we feel we've done a good job.

1202
01:10:20,723 --> 01:10:24,243
We prepared our CEO, we've
negotiated the terms of the hearing.

1203
01:10:26,363 --> 01:10:29,363
And if he gets away, you know,
at the end of it

1204
01:10:29,403 --> 01:10:31,203
and nothing has gone
terribly wrong...

1205
01:10:32,203 --> 01:10:34,603
...that is-
You feel professionally...

1206
01:10:35,403 --> 01:10:37,603
Tick. You know,
you've done your job.

1207
01:10:43,163 --> 01:10:46,363
The upshot was that any hopes
for regulation

1208
01:10:46,403 --> 01:10:48,603
to curtail the power of Facebook

1209
01:10:48,643 --> 01:10:51,043
would never really happen
any time soon

1210
01:10:51,083 --> 01:10:53,723
because lawmakers
were incapable of doing so.

1211
01:10:53,763 --> 01:10:56,363
Do you feel that any
senator here

1212
01:10:56,403 --> 01:10:59,083
has really laid a glove on
Mark Zuckerberg?

1213
01:10:59,123 --> 01:11:01,363
If you think being slapped
with wet noodles is hard,

1214
01:11:01,403 --> 01:11:02,723
I guess that's hard.

1215
01:11:02,763 --> 01:11:06,483
The real proof that the hearings
were not so terrible

1216
01:11:06,523 --> 01:11:09,083
for Facebook or Mark Zuckerberg

1217
01:11:09,123 --> 01:11:11,403
was that Facebook stock rose.

1218
01:11:12,803 --> 01:11:16,603
Mark Zuckerberg became, personally,
billions of dollars richer.

1219
01:11:18,603 --> 01:11:21,763
He left that day back to Menlo Park,

1220
01:11:21,803 --> 01:11:25,883
and his lobbyist went to a wine bar
in Georgetown to celebrate.

1221
01:11:26,763 --> 01:11:29,203
The hearings were a success
from their point of view.

1222
01:11:40,803 --> 01:11:44,403
You might think this is
a map of the world, but it's not.

1223
01:11:45,323 --> 01:11:47,083
It's a blank screen.

1224
01:11:47,123 --> 01:11:50,083
And for every person who's using
Facebook, we put a dot.

1225
01:11:50,123 --> 01:11:53,043
And when you do that, it
effectively draws the world.

1226
01:12:02,363 --> 01:12:04,643
When I joined Facebook
in 2019,

1227
01:12:04,683 --> 01:12:07,603
I think it was actually
in kind of a momentary calm.

1228
01:12:08,843 --> 01:12:11,243
The year before they had
Cambridge Analytica,

1229
01:12:11,283 --> 01:12:14,003
which had blown up catastrophically.

1230
01:12:14,043 --> 01:12:16,523
So I think if you had asked
a random employee,

1231
01:12:16,563 --> 01:12:18,923
they would have said
things are looking up. Right.

1232
01:12:18,963 --> 01:12:21,603
We've survived Cambridge Analytica.
We've weathered it.

1233
01:12:21,643 --> 01:12:23,883
Our stock is on the upswing.

1234
01:12:25,083 --> 01:12:27,323
You know, I worked
on civic misinformation.

1235
01:12:27,363 --> 01:12:29,883
So that's, you know,
things like ethnic violence.

1236
01:12:29,923 --> 01:12:32,483
And just a few months before,

1237
01:12:32,523 --> 01:12:36,163
they had realised that
they didn't have a policy

1238
01:12:36,203 --> 01:12:38,443
against politicians
calling for violence.

1239
01:12:39,723 --> 01:12:42,203
There were now political parties
in the world

1240
01:12:42,243 --> 01:12:45,323
that were explicitly doing things
like demonizing minorities

1241
01:12:45,363 --> 01:12:48,723
by calling them, you know,
'rodents', that kind of thing.

1242
01:12:49,683 --> 01:12:52,643
And a working group was formed
to start figuring out

1243
01:12:52,683 --> 01:12:56,403
what should the policy be when
situations like that happen.

1244
01:12:58,123 --> 01:13:01,003
It took a working group
of maybe 30 or 40 people,

1245
01:13:01,043 --> 01:13:05,323
months to write
the political speech policy

1246
01:13:05,363 --> 01:13:09,123
for Facebook,
and they present it to Mark.

1247
01:13:10,563 --> 01:13:13,203
And Mark takes a look at he
goes, "I don't like this.

1248
01:13:13,243 --> 01:13:16,323
I can do better."
And he goes home that weekend

1249
01:13:16,363 --> 01:13:19,523
and he writes the political speech
policy for the company.

1250
01:13:20,683 --> 01:13:23,283
So think for a moment about
the arrogance of this. Right.

1251
01:13:23,323 --> 01:13:27,283
So Mark takes the work of
like 30, 40 people.

1252
01:13:27,323 --> 01:13:30,243
Many of these people have PhDs in
ethnic violence and he says,

1253
01:13:30,283 --> 01:13:34,043
"Oh, no. I can write a better
political policy over the weekend.

1254
01:13:34,083 --> 01:13:36,443
I don't think that
we want private companies

1255
01:13:36,483 --> 01:13:39,083
censoring politicians in the news.

1256
01:13:39,123 --> 01:13:41,483
I generally believe that
as a principle,

1257
01:13:41,523 --> 01:13:44,243
people should decide what is credible

1258
01:13:44,283 --> 01:13:46,803
and what they want to believe
and who they want to vote for.

1259
01:13:46,843 --> 01:13:49,883
I don't think that that should be
something that we want tech companies

1260
01:13:49,923 --> 01:13:52,363
or any kind of other company doing.

1261
01:13:57,883 --> 01:14:01,003
2020 was a make it or break in
moment for Facebook.

1262
01:14:01,043 --> 01:14:03,843
You had a sitting US President,
Donald Trump, who was,

1263
01:14:03,883 --> 01:14:07,483
daily, pushing the limits of what
should be said on their platform.

1264
01:14:07,523 --> 01:14:10,443
He was using it every single day
in ways that were challenging

1265
01:14:10,483 --> 01:14:13,443
for Facebook to defend
or make decisions on.

1266
01:14:14,683 --> 01:14:18,243
And there was this real sense inside
Facebook of almost daily panic

1267
01:14:18,283 --> 01:14:20,483
of what's he going to say next?

1268
01:14:20,523 --> 01:14:22,603
What kind of PR storm is
this going to create for us?

1269
01:14:22,643 --> 01:14:25,163
What kind of negative headline
is going to get written today

1270
01:14:25,203 --> 01:14:27,203
about our company?

1271
01:14:28,403 --> 01:14:31,843
I remember the day after the
US election speaking to someone

1272
01:14:31,883 --> 01:14:34,203
at Facebook who was on their
election team who said,

1273
01:14:34,243 --> 01:14:37,963
"God, what a relief, it's over.
Trump has lost."

1274
01:14:41,123 --> 01:14:42,883
Good evening.

1275
01:14:42,923 --> 01:14:46,243
I'd like to provide the American
people with an update on our efforts

1276
01:14:46,283 --> 01:14:49,923
to protect the integrity of
a very important 2020 election.

1277
01:14:51,243 --> 01:14:53,763
If you count the legal votes,

1278
01:14:53,803 --> 01:14:55,723
I easily win.

1279
01:14:55,763 --> 01:14:58,283
People knew prior to
the 2020 election that

1280
01:14:58,323 --> 01:15:01,563
Trump was gonna try to delegitimize
the election if he failed,

1281
01:15:01,603 --> 01:15:05,243
and we know this because he had been
threatening it for a long time.

1282
01:15:06,083 --> 01:15:09,123
The lead up to January 6th
was not random.

1283
01:15:11,803 --> 01:15:14,923
Take me inside Mark Zuckerberg's
head to like the moment that

1284
01:15:14,963 --> 01:15:18,363
you decided you needed to change
Facebook's core mission.

1285
01:15:18,403 --> 01:15:21,883
I feel like we have a responsibility
to do more in the world.

1286
01:15:21,923 --> 01:15:25,443
So, what is the new mission
of Facebook?

1287
01:15:25,483 --> 01:15:29,403
So, our new mission is to bring
the world closer together.

1288
01:15:29,443 --> 01:15:31,883
What we need to do is empower people

1289
01:15:31,923 --> 01:15:34,243
all around the world
to build communities.

1290
01:15:34,283 --> 01:15:36,923
Things like church groups
and sports teams

1291
01:15:36,963 --> 01:15:38,963
and neighbourhood groups...

1292
01:15:39,003 --> 01:15:41,643
Facebook was created
initially for people

1293
01:15:41,683 --> 01:15:44,283
who shared an interest
to get together

1294
01:15:44,323 --> 01:15:47,523
and which evolved into
this gigantic system

1295
01:15:47,563 --> 01:15:50,483
that included both chess clubs

1296
01:15:50,523 --> 01:15:53,323
but also white supremacists
and terrorists.

1297
01:15:55,483 --> 01:15:59,043
Facebook groups wound up
becoming the home

1298
01:15:59,083 --> 01:16:01,243
to politically engaged extremism.

1299
01:16:03,763 --> 01:16:05,483
That we had not seen before.

1300
01:16:07,683 --> 01:16:11,523
There had been a study,
internal Facebook study

1301
01:16:11,563 --> 01:16:14,923
what they discovered
was that 64% of the time

1302
01:16:14,963 --> 01:16:18,403
that people join
an extremist Facebook group...

1303
01:16:19,763 --> 01:16:23,403
...the trigger for joining was
a recommendation made by Facebook.

1304
01:16:28,123 --> 01:16:31,683
A group called Stop the
Steal started to post on Facebook

1305
01:16:31,723 --> 01:16:35,043
and it is committed to spreading
the false idea that the election

1306
01:16:35,083 --> 01:16:37,083
was stolen from Donald Trump,

1307
01:16:37,123 --> 01:16:40,843
and they managed to get hundreds of
thousands to join their group.

1308
01:16:40,883 --> 01:16:44,283
Internally in Facebook, there's this
kind of moment of panic

1309
01:16:44,323 --> 01:16:46,803
when they realise this is
one of the fastest growing groups

1310
01:16:46,843 --> 01:16:49,763
in Facebook's history
and it is committed to spreading

1311
01:16:49,803 --> 01:16:52,883
the false idea that the election
was stolen from Donald Trump.

1312
01:17:14,283 --> 01:17:17,963
And then January rolls around and
you have these rallies of people

1313
01:17:18,003 --> 01:17:21,563
all over the United States that are
coming together under the banner of

1314
01:17:21,603 --> 01:17:25,323
the election was stolen and they're
organizing themselves on Facebook.

1315
01:17:31,723 --> 01:17:35,523
We will never give up. We will
never concede it doesn't happen.

1316
01:17:35,563 --> 01:17:38,243
You don't concede with this theft.

1317
01:17:39,243 --> 01:17:42,523
And then you have Trump himself
issuing calls on Facebook saying,

1318
01:17:42,563 --> 01:17:46,163
"Come to Washington on January 6th,
come rally in my name.

1319
01:17:46,203 --> 01:17:48,083
The election was stolen from me."

1320
01:18:09,763 --> 01:18:12,123
And it is that moment
that Facebook understands

1321
01:18:12,163 --> 01:18:14,083
this is a four alarm fire.

1322
01:18:14,123 --> 01:18:16,803
And will this finally be the moment
where they have to

1323
01:18:16,843 --> 01:18:19,203
take down Donald Trump's account?

1324
01:18:20,443 --> 01:18:23,403
And Mark kind of sits there and you
think, should I call Trump?

1325
01:18:23,443 --> 01:18:25,443
Should I try to use backchannels
to him to say,

1326
01:18:25,483 --> 01:18:27,603
"Hey, we're thinking
of taking down your account?

1327
01:18:27,643 --> 01:18:30,723
And people close to him say,
"I don't think it's a good idea.

1328
01:18:30,763 --> 01:18:33,643
Like, you could be seen as
colluding with this."

1329
01:18:41,723 --> 01:18:45,003
People are sharing on Facebook
live videos and photos

1330
01:18:45,043 --> 01:18:47,523
of themselves marching through
the halls of Congress

1331
01:18:47,563 --> 01:18:51,523
looking for Nancy Pelosi, looking
for Vice President Pence.

1332
01:18:56,363 --> 01:18:59,003
If you're Mark Zuckerberg
and you've created technology

1333
01:18:59,043 --> 01:19:02,323
whose sole purpose is to connect
people, that's your worldview,

1334
01:19:02,363 --> 01:19:04,643
that connecting people is inherently
good

1335
01:19:04,683 --> 01:19:07,043
and introducing that
technology to the world

1336
01:19:07,083 --> 01:19:09,923
has made you one of the world's
wealthiest and most powerful men.

1337
01:19:09,963 --> 01:19:13,883
It is very, very hard, I imagine,
to then sit there and think,

1338
01:19:13,923 --> 01:19:17,483
is my underlying premise wrong?
Is connecting the world bad?

1339
01:19:19,923 --> 01:19:22,603
And it really is only
when it gets to the point where

1340
01:19:22,643 --> 01:19:26,123
people sitting next to me are
saying, "This is gonna go to trial,

1341
01:19:26,163 --> 01:19:28,963
there are going to be congressional
hearings about this."

1342
01:19:29,003 --> 01:19:32,363
And Donald Trump can continue to
use this Facebook page

1343
01:19:32,403 --> 01:19:34,403
to agitate for violence.

1344
01:19:36,643 --> 01:19:38,483
And we're going to get held
responsible

1345
01:19:38,523 --> 01:19:42,363
that Mark Zuckerberg sits there
and goes, "It's gone too far.

1346
01:19:42,403 --> 01:19:44,643
We need to take down his account."

1347
01:19:44,683 --> 01:19:47,843
Good afternoon and we
start with some breaking news,

1348
01:19:47,883 --> 01:19:51,203
President Trump has been banned,
indefinitely, from Facebook,

1349
01:19:51,243 --> 01:19:54,123
according to Mark Zuckerberg.
In a statement, he said,

1350
01:19:54,163 --> 01:19:57,003
"The current context is now
fundamentally different,

1351
01:19:57,043 --> 01:20:00,683
involving use of our platform
to incite violent insurrection

1352
01:20:00,723 --> 01:20:03,363
against a democratically
elected government.

1353
01:20:16,963 --> 01:20:20,523
When I started reporting on
Facebook, I realised very quickly

1354
01:20:20,563 --> 01:20:23,883
that you needed to have sources
at all levels of the company.

1355
01:20:25,043 --> 01:20:27,723
People who work at Facebook are not
used to speaking to the press

1356
01:20:27,763 --> 01:20:30,163
because they've been instilled
with such a fear of what

1357
01:20:30,203 --> 01:20:32,723
talking to the press
can do for their careers.

1358
01:20:34,523 --> 01:20:39,123
There is a very serious top-down
threat of if you speak to the press,

1359
01:20:39,163 --> 01:20:41,163
you will not just be fired.

1360
01:20:41,203 --> 01:20:44,563
You will never work in tech again.
Your name will be blacklisted.

1361
01:20:45,763 --> 01:20:48,523
It's compounded by these
very fierce NDAs,

1362
01:20:48,563 --> 01:20:51,163
which stands for
non-disclosure agreements,

1363
01:20:51,203 --> 01:20:53,283
that the people who work there
have to sign.

1364
01:20:53,323 --> 01:20:56,603
I used to work in the Middle East,
and I used to speak to people

1365
01:20:56,643 --> 01:20:59,683
who were dissenters in governments
with dictatorships and monarchies

1366
01:20:59,723 --> 01:21:02,363
where speaking to the press
meant being imprisoned.

1367
01:21:02,403 --> 01:21:06,963
And I had an easier time getting
people in those countries

1368
01:21:07,003 --> 01:21:08,883
to speak to me sometimes than I did

1369
01:21:08,923 --> 01:21:11,163
getting employees at Facebook
to speak to me.

1370
01:21:12,323 --> 01:21:14,643
Facebook for most of its history,

1371
01:21:14,683 --> 01:21:17,883
has had an entire department
dedicated to finding leakers.

1372
01:21:17,923 --> 01:21:20,683
People who speak to journalists
are rooted out

1373
01:21:20,723 --> 01:21:23,003
and fired in very public ways
within the company.

1374
01:21:23,043 --> 01:21:25,123
They're constantly talked about.

1375
01:21:25,163 --> 01:21:28,283
At one point, it was fairly common
to talk about them as rats.

1376
01:21:32,403 --> 01:21:35,603
In the aftermath of January six,
I realised the only way Facebook

1377
01:21:35,643 --> 01:21:38,763
could save itself is if they
got help from the outside

1378
01:21:38,803 --> 01:21:40,643
and so I was ready
to blow the whistle.

1379
01:21:45,803 --> 01:21:49,203
Imagine you come in and you think
it's a crisis,

1380
01:21:49,243 --> 01:21:51,963
and then you actually sit there and
start accumulating the case

1381
01:21:52,003 --> 01:21:54,243
to prove the crisis.

1382
01:21:54,283 --> 01:21:56,123
You know, you think you
know how bad it is.

1383
01:21:56,163 --> 01:21:59,163
And now you're like, you're looking
at the whole stack of evidence.

1384
01:21:59,203 --> 01:22:02,643
You're like, "Oh, this is far worse
than I thought it was.

1385
01:22:04,843 --> 01:22:08,803
It took me a long time to figure out
how could I document what the public

1386
01:22:08,843 --> 01:22:11,403
needed to know in a way
that would be effective?

1387
01:22:11,443 --> 01:22:13,883
And I took a bunch of screenshots.

1388
01:22:13,923 --> 01:22:16,843
Every time there'd be something
that was sufficiently embarrassing,

1389
01:22:16,883 --> 01:22:19,363
they would put up a wall
around information.

1390
01:22:19,403 --> 01:22:22,283
And so my fear was that, you know,
this was like the last chance,

1391
01:22:22,323 --> 01:22:26,323
like I had to do a good job because
the public might never know.

1392
01:22:28,323 --> 01:22:31,083
Blowing the whistle
is very complicated,

1393
01:22:31,123 --> 01:22:33,523
and at some point my screen shot
stopped working.

1394
01:22:33,563 --> 01:22:36,243
And so I was like, "Oh,
so I know I'm being spied on."

1395
01:22:46,043 --> 01:22:49,203
I totally align myself with all
the possible consequences

1396
01:22:49,243 --> 01:22:51,283
of what Facebook might do
to me if they caught me,

1397
01:22:51,323 --> 01:22:53,963
because I assumed as soon
as that journalism happened,

1398
01:22:54,003 --> 01:22:56,683
they would know it was me
because they can go and triangulate

1399
01:22:56,723 --> 01:22:59,323
these are the documents. She's
the only way to access them.

1400
01:23:00,723 --> 01:23:03,803
In the run up to when the Wall
Street Journal began publishing,

1401
01:23:03,843 --> 01:23:06,083
my lawyers basically told me
that I was delusional,

1402
01:23:06,123 --> 01:23:08,563
they thought my identity
could stay a secret

1403
01:23:08,603 --> 01:23:11,243
because Facebook
at any point could out me

1404
01:23:11,283 --> 01:23:14,323
and a lot whistleblowers
are discredited.

1405
01:23:14,363 --> 01:23:16,883
And so I got basically gotten
presented with the choice, like,

1406
01:23:16,923 --> 01:23:19,123
do you want to tell your own story

1407
01:23:19,163 --> 01:23:21,283
or do you want them
to tell your story?

1408
01:23:28,563 --> 01:23:31,683
Scathing accusations
from a former Facebook executive

1409
01:23:31,723 --> 01:23:35,523
about how the company handles
hate content and misinformation.

1410
01:23:35,563 --> 01:23:37,483
She is the former employee

1411
01:23:37,523 --> 01:23:41,363
who is now accusing the social
media giant of knowing how harmful

1412
01:23:41,403 --> 01:23:44,323
their algorithm is
for our entire democracy.

1413
01:23:44,363 --> 01:23:48,803
When Frances Haugen
comes out from the shadows

1414
01:23:48,843 --> 01:23:51,083
as the whistleblower.

1415
01:23:51,123 --> 01:23:54,083
It was an astonishing moment.

1416
01:23:54,123 --> 01:23:57,563
A lot of what she had been saying
was what we had been hearing.

1417
01:23:57,603 --> 01:24:00,963
We had many Frances Haugen's,
but she had documents

1418
01:24:01,003 --> 01:24:04,523
and she was willing to put her face
and her name behind that.

1419
01:24:04,563 --> 01:24:06,683
She was willing to testify.

1420
01:24:06,723 --> 01:24:10,603
Facebook's products stoke division
and weaken our democracy.

1421
01:24:10,643 --> 01:24:12,643
Almost no one outside of Facebook

1422
01:24:12,683 --> 01:24:14,723
knows what happens
inside of Facebook.

1423
01:24:15,643 --> 01:24:19,483
The company intentionally hides
vital information from the public.

1424
01:24:21,003 --> 01:24:23,723
Perhaps one of the most disturbing

1425
01:24:23,763 --> 01:24:27,563
and surprising revelations
from Frances Haugen

1426
01:24:27,603 --> 01:24:30,043
was that there were internal studies

1427
01:24:30,083 --> 01:24:34,123
on how Facebook's
recommendation engines

1428
01:24:34,163 --> 01:24:37,003
can lead teenagers
into these rabbit holes.

1429
01:24:37,043 --> 01:24:39,883
A troubling new report
today spells out

1430
01:24:39,923 --> 01:24:42,363
what all that time on social media
is doing to our teenagers.

1431
01:24:42,403 --> 01:24:47,563
For example, a teenager looking
at some influencer of fitness

1432
01:24:47,603 --> 01:24:51,203
would then get served to them,
recommendations to diets,

1433
01:24:51,243 --> 01:24:54,283
and then that would then lead to

1434
01:24:54,323 --> 01:24:57,403
recommendations
for eating disorders,

1435
01:24:57,443 --> 01:25:00,923
things like bulimia,
how to become anorexic,

1436
01:25:00,963 --> 01:25:03,243
really destructive behaviour.

1437
01:25:03,283 --> 01:25:06,523
Content that elicits
an extreme reaction from you

1438
01:25:06,563 --> 01:25:09,963
is more likely to get a click,
a comment or reshare.

1439
01:25:10,003 --> 01:25:14,603
These are the kinds of rabbit holes
that were leading to suicide.

1440
01:25:14,643 --> 01:25:16,683
Thoughts of suicide ideation.

1441
01:25:16,723 --> 01:25:19,163
And Facebook understood this.

1442
01:25:19,203 --> 01:25:21,203
It was, in fact, studying this.

1443
01:25:21,243 --> 01:25:24,123
The company's leadership knows
how to make Facebook

1444
01:25:24,163 --> 01:25:27,403
and Instagram safer but won't make
the necessary changes

1445
01:25:27,443 --> 01:25:31,403
because they have put their
astronomical profits before people.

1446
01:25:50,803 --> 01:25:54,723
It is time for us to adopt
a new company brand

1447
01:25:54,763 --> 01:25:57,963
to encompass everything that we do,

1448
01:25:58,003 --> 01:26:01,723
to reflect who we are
and what we hope to build.

1449
01:26:01,763 --> 01:26:04,523
I am proud to announce
that starting today,

1450
01:26:04,563 --> 01:26:07,963
our company is now Meta.

1451
01:26:08,003 --> 01:26:10,003
I gotta pause that.

1452
01:26:10,043 --> 01:26:12,523
Look. L- Look!

1453
01:26:13,963 --> 01:26:17,683
Let's remember, all this pride

1454
01:26:17,723 --> 01:26:20,923
and this cocky stuff
was at the exact moment

1455
01:26:20,963 --> 01:26:24,963
when all of Frances Haugen's
whistleblowing revelations

1456
01:26:25,003 --> 01:26:28,523
were cascading
across the news media.

1457
01:26:28,563 --> 01:26:31,003
When they were getting new
articles every day

1458
01:26:31,043 --> 01:26:34,363
based on Frances Haugen's
documentation that, basically,

1459
01:26:34,403 --> 01:26:39,163
proved their culpability,
at the height of that period.

1460
01:26:39,203 --> 01:26:42,243
They had a big press conference
to change their name

1461
01:26:42,283 --> 01:26:45,603
and make their new strategy,
the Metaverse!

1462
01:26:45,643 --> 01:26:48,643
And you know what? It worked.

1463
01:26:51,523 --> 01:26:53,523
Now...

1464
01:26:54,643 --> 01:26:57,363
You know, I really just cared about
building something that

1465
01:26:57,403 --> 01:27:00,243
my girls are going to grow up
and be proud of me for.

1466
01:27:01,723 --> 01:27:05,763
And I mean, that's what is kind of my
guiding philosophy at this point is,

1467
01:27:05,803 --> 01:27:09,843
and I- you know, come and work on a
lot of hard things during the day.

1468
01:27:09,883 --> 01:27:14,003
And I go home and just ask, "Will my
girls be proud of what I did today?"

1469
01:27:18,443 --> 01:27:22,043
There's no doubt history
is going to remember Mark Zuckerberg

1470
01:27:22,083 --> 01:27:24,843
for creating the first really
global social media company.

1471
01:27:26,043 --> 01:27:30,483
I don't see how we as a society
go back in time to a point where

1472
01:27:30,523 --> 01:27:33,403
we're not all instantaneously
connected to everyone

1473
01:27:33,443 --> 01:27:35,443
we want to be connected
to all over the world.

1474
01:27:35,483 --> 01:27:37,883
It really has created a new reality.

1475
01:27:41,283 --> 01:27:45,323
I think the people closest to Mark
that have now left the company

1476
01:27:45,363 --> 01:27:48,763
and reflect on their time
there say that

1477
01:27:48,803 --> 01:27:51,683
the biggest problems
at Facebook come

1478
01:27:51,723 --> 01:27:55,003
because of the absolute power
that was handed to one individual.

1479
01:27:55,043 --> 01:27:57,603
It's the President
of the United States!

1480
01:27:59,523 --> 01:28:03,043
And that no matter how smart
you were as a 19 or 20-year-old

1481
01:28:03,083 --> 01:28:05,643
in creating a very specific type of
technology,

1482
01:28:05,683 --> 01:28:08,123
there is just no situation
in which it is appropriate

1483
01:28:08,163 --> 01:28:11,723
for one person to have
unbridled power

1484
01:28:11,763 --> 01:28:14,403
and decision-making over
such a large group of people.

1485
01:28:14,443 --> 01:28:17,563
And that by having really no cheques
and balances

1486
01:28:17,603 --> 01:28:20,403
on Mark Zuckerberg's
power or his decision making,

1487
01:28:20,443 --> 01:28:23,283
Facebook ultimately made
a number of mistakes

1488
01:28:23,323 --> 01:28:26,203
that affected millions of people
all over the world.

1489
01:28:39,363 --> 01:28:42,843
When someone becomes
worth $100 billion

1490
01:28:42,883 --> 01:28:45,603
and is the richest person
in human history of that age,

1491
01:28:45,643 --> 01:28:51,043
it makes them feel magical...
unchallengeable

1492
01:28:51,083 --> 01:28:56,843
and, I feel, self-justifying
to a tremendously harmful degree.

1493
01:29:04,563 --> 01:29:08,923
The main question of Facebook
going forward is,

1494
01:29:08,963 --> 01:29:10,963
who keeps Mark Zuckerberg in check?

1495
01:29:12,483 --> 01:29:16,043
There are very few people
that hold him accountable.

1496
01:29:16,083 --> 01:29:19,043
Who's the one who tells him, "Mark,

1497
01:29:19,083 --> 01:29:21,763
that decision may not be good
for the company?

1498
01:29:21,803 --> 01:29:24,163
It may not be good
for the business model."

1499
01:29:25,083 --> 01:29:28,443
And very importantly,
who is asking him,

1500
01:29:28,483 --> 01:29:32,603
"Mark Zuckerberg, is that decision
you're making good for the world?"

1501
01:30:07,803 --> 01:30:14,763
AccessibleCustomerService@sky.uk