1 00:00:02,000 --> 00:00:07,000 Downloaded from YTS.MX 2 00:00:08,000 --> 00:00:13,000 Official YIFY movies site: YTS.MX 3 00:00:20,603 --> 00:00:22,856 Hi, I'm Stan Lee. 4 00:00:22,856 --> 00:00:27,694 Editor of the Marvel Comics Group of superhero comic magazines. 5 00:00:28,945 --> 00:00:33,575 Comic books have been a big business for the past 25 years, 6 00:00:33,575 --> 00:00:35,827 and they are bigger than ever today. 7 00:00:36,745 --> 00:00:40,498 With this in mind, you'll be interested to know that the Marvel Comics Group 8 00:00:40,498 --> 00:00:42,375 is the acknowledged leader 9 00:00:42,375 --> 00:00:46,755 in monthly sales of all comic magazines published today. 10 00:00:47,088 --> 00:00:51,092 Our superheroes are the kind of people that you or I would be 11 00:00:51,092 --> 00:00:52,969 if we had a super power, 12 00:00:52,969 --> 00:00:56,931 which sets them apart from all other superheroes published today 13 00:00:56,931 --> 00:01:01,770 and seems to be the reason that they're actually far more popular than any others. 14 00:01:06,983 --> 00:01:11,321 Every one of us are a product of all the things we've experienced, 15 00:01:11,696 --> 00:01:14,324 seen, read, and heard in our lives. 16 00:01:14,824 --> 00:01:18,328 So, when I write, I'm remembering things that happened. 17 00:01:19,621 --> 00:01:21,581 Those things become part of the story. 18 00:01:26,503 --> 00:01:30,215 One day, I was trying to think of a new superhero 19 00:01:31,633 --> 00:01:34,135 and I saw a fly crawling on a wall. 20 00:01:38,640 --> 00:01:43,019 And I thought, "Gee, wouldn't it be something if a hero could stick to walls 21 00:01:43,019 --> 00:01:44,729 "and move on them like an insect." 22 00:01:47,482 --> 00:01:53,530 I decided I wanted somebody who every one of the readers could identify with. 23 00:01:55,323 --> 00:01:58,785 If I had superhuman powers, wouldn't I still have to worry 24 00:01:58,785 --> 00:02:02,497 about making a living or having my dates like me? 25 00:02:04,958 --> 00:02:10,839 {\an8}What I tried to do was write the kind of stories I would want to read, 26 00:02:10,839 --> 00:02:13,758 {\an8}and sometimes I had to buck a trend to do that. 27 00:02:15,969 --> 00:02:19,848 I think perseverance plays such a great part of it. 28 00:02:20,431 --> 00:02:23,393 If you think you've got it, you just mustn't give up. 29 00:02:24,561 --> 00:02:27,939 You gotta just keep working at it, hoping sooner or later 30 00:02:29,774 --> 00:02:31,860 somebody will recognize what you've done. 31 00:03:09,772 --> 00:03:16,362 December 28th was a very important date for me in the year 1922. 32 00:03:17,572 --> 00:03:19,073 That's when I was born. 33 00:03:20,200 --> 00:03:24,913 On the West Side of Manhattan, on 98th Street and West End Avenue. 34 00:03:27,290 --> 00:03:30,335 My name was Stanley Martin Lieber. 35 00:03:32,670 --> 00:03:35,840 {\an8}My parents came to New York from Eastern Europe, 36 00:03:36,966 --> 00:03:39,802 and they used to like to take photographs of me. 37 00:03:39,802 --> 00:03:42,889 They didn't have a camera, but there were people in the neighborhood. 38 00:03:43,139 --> 00:03:45,808 I think you'd pay them a dime at that time. 39 00:03:46,017 --> 00:03:50,021 They would have a little pony with them, and they put the little kid on the pony. 40 00:03:50,230 --> 00:03:53,775 (CHUCKLES) So, I had more photos of myself taken on ponies. 41 00:03:54,609 --> 00:03:58,613 I did have a brother who was born nine years after me. 42 00:03:58,613 --> 00:04:01,407 His name is Larry and he's a great guy, 43 00:04:01,407 --> 00:04:04,577 but unfortunately, I was nine years older, 44 00:04:04,786 --> 00:04:07,580 so it was tough to pal around with him. 45 00:04:08,706 --> 00:04:10,083 I loved reading. 46 00:04:10,833 --> 00:04:12,126 I think I was born reading, 47 00:04:12,126 --> 00:04:14,921 I mean, I can't remember a time when I wasn't reading. 48 00:04:16,172 --> 00:04:20,009 I loved Sherlock Holmes, Tarzan, The Hardy Boys, 49 00:04:20,385 --> 00:04:25,181 King Arthur and his Knights, The Odyssey, everything I could get my hands on. 50 00:04:25,890 --> 00:04:28,643 My mother said I would read the labels on ketchup bottles 51 00:04:28,643 --> 00:04:30,436 if there was nothing else around. 52 00:04:33,564 --> 00:04:36,317 We didn't have any money. It was during the Depression. 53 00:04:37,944 --> 00:04:40,154 The one thing I wanted was a bicycle. 54 00:04:41,364 --> 00:04:44,117 And finally, my folks scraped up enough money 55 00:04:44,117 --> 00:04:46,119 and they bought me this two-wheeler. 56 00:04:47,745 --> 00:04:52,208 And, man, I felt as though I could go anywhere on that bike. 57 00:04:53,126 --> 00:04:54,585 I had been freed. 58 00:05:18,985 --> 00:05:23,406 I used to go to the movies and I'd see Errol Flynn on the screen. 59 00:05:25,241 --> 00:05:28,119 He played Robin Hood, Captain Blood. 60 00:05:28,786 --> 00:05:30,204 He was always a hero. 61 00:05:33,082 --> 00:05:34,625 I wanted to be Errol Flynn. 62 00:05:39,589 --> 00:05:41,382 And I would leave the theater 63 00:05:41,382 --> 00:05:45,261 and ride my bike over the George Washington Bridge, 64 00:05:45,261 --> 00:05:47,680 which goes from Manhattan to New Jersey. 65 00:05:48,181 --> 00:05:52,977 And it was such a triumphant feeling to ride across the bridge. 66 00:05:53,936 --> 00:05:57,023 And I knew I was gonna become somebody important. 67 00:06:01,027 --> 00:06:02,945 NARRATOR: Again, we bring you another chapter 68 00:06:02,945 --> 00:06:05,573 of Edgar Rice Burroughs' amazing history 69 00:06:05,573 --> 00:06:07,700 of Tarzan of the Apes. 70 00:06:08,201 --> 00:06:10,828 The astounding record of a superman who became the... 71 00:06:10,828 --> 00:06:14,582 STAN: My father was a great guy, but he had trouble getting a job. 72 00:06:15,333 --> 00:06:16,793 He had been a dress cutter, 73 00:06:16,793 --> 00:06:19,796 and there were just no jobs apparently for dress cutters. 74 00:06:20,463 --> 00:06:23,216 And so, he was unemployed most of the time. 75 00:06:24,634 --> 00:06:27,804 My earliest memories are just him sitting home, 76 00:06:27,804 --> 00:06:30,264 reading the want ads in the newspaper. 77 00:06:31,432 --> 00:06:35,019 I always felt tremendous pity for him. 78 00:06:35,603 --> 00:06:40,233 It must be a terrible feeling to just not be bringing in the money 79 00:06:40,233 --> 00:06:41,943 that's needed for your family. 80 00:06:43,194 --> 00:06:48,074 To me, it seemed as if having a good job, a steady job, 81 00:06:48,074 --> 00:06:51,661 was the greatest success a person could attain, 82 00:06:51,661 --> 00:06:54,664 only because my father never had one. 83 00:06:56,332 --> 00:06:59,460 That's one of the reasons I started working at an early age. 84 00:07:00,586 --> 00:07:03,047 I got a job as an office boy, 85 00:07:03,047 --> 00:07:07,802 at the second largest trouser manufacturer. 86 00:07:07,802 --> 00:07:12,181 They had millions of salesmen, and whenever they wanted a glass of water, 87 00:07:12,181 --> 00:07:14,684 or they wanted someone to sharpen a pencil, 88 00:07:14,684 --> 00:07:16,769 they would yell, "Boy!" 89 00:07:17,353 --> 00:07:20,314 and whichever one of us was closer had to come running, 90 00:07:20,314 --> 00:07:22,358 and I resented the fact 91 00:07:22,358 --> 00:07:25,778 that they never took the trouble to learn my name. 92 00:07:27,071 --> 00:07:30,366 Like, a week before Christmas, they told me I have to leave 93 00:07:30,908 --> 00:07:32,243 and, oh, I was burned up. 94 00:07:33,453 --> 00:07:36,164 But if they hadn't fired me, I might have stayed there 95 00:07:36,706 --> 00:07:41,419 and I might have made my life working in trousers. I was lucky. 96 00:07:45,381 --> 00:07:48,092 {\an8}There was a general rush. Bank deposits... 97 00:07:49,343 --> 00:07:50,845 SPORTS ANNOUNCER: And Owens wins again... 98 00:07:51,095 --> 00:07:52,513 MAN ON TV: Oh, the humanity... 99 00:08:01,063 --> 00:08:05,485 STAN: Writing was always fun. In fact, I remember I was a very corny guy. 100 00:08:05,485 --> 00:08:09,614 I had a little briefcase and I loved carrying it with me 101 00:08:09,614 --> 00:08:12,867 when I walked in the streets so people would think I was a writer. 102 00:08:12,867 --> 00:08:14,869 You know, a little thin briefcase. 103 00:08:16,162 --> 00:08:18,789 When I graduated high school, I had an uncle 104 00:08:18,789 --> 00:08:20,708 and he worked for a publisher, 105 00:08:20,708 --> 00:08:24,337 and he told me that they were looking for an assistant. 106 00:08:25,087 --> 00:08:28,257 And I figured, "Gee, I'm going to apply." So I went up there, 107 00:08:29,842 --> 00:08:32,261 and I found out they also published comic books. 108 00:08:32,261 --> 00:08:34,847 They had an outfit called Timely Comics, 109 00:08:35,473 --> 00:08:37,850 and they hired me to run errands, 110 00:08:37,850 --> 00:08:41,521 {\an8}to proof-read, fill the inkwell, whatever had to be done. 111 00:08:43,564 --> 00:08:47,235 {\an8}I didn't really have any intention to be working in comics, 112 00:08:47,235 --> 00:08:48,819 but it was a job. 113 00:08:50,154 --> 00:08:52,949 There were two guys, Joe Simon and Jack Kirby, 114 00:08:52,949 --> 00:08:54,450 who were running the thing. 115 00:08:54,450 --> 00:08:59,747 Joe Simon was the boss and he walked around puffing a big cigar 116 00:08:59,747 --> 00:09:03,459 and he talked in a very deep voice, and he was great. I liked him. 117 00:09:03,459 --> 00:09:05,127 He had a lot of personality. 118 00:09:05,127 --> 00:09:07,505 And Jack would sit hunched over the drawing board 119 00:09:07,505 --> 00:09:09,632 and do most of the actual artwork. 120 00:09:10,925 --> 00:09:13,928 {\an8}I asked Stan how old he was. He says, "17." 121 00:09:13,928 --> 00:09:17,306 {\an8}So we gave him a job there. He was the gofer, you know. 122 00:09:17,431 --> 00:09:20,059 {\an8}And he'd go out and get coffee. 123 00:09:20,726 --> 00:09:23,938 STAN: I would ask Jack, "You comfortable? Do you want some more ink? 124 00:09:23,938 --> 00:09:26,399 "Is your brush okay? Is the pencil all right?" 125 00:09:26,399 --> 00:09:28,776 And he would yell at me for a while. 126 00:09:28,776 --> 00:09:31,237 And that was the way we spent our days. 127 00:09:32,321 --> 00:09:34,949 {\an8}SIMON: He drove Jack Kirby crazy. 128 00:09:35,700 --> 00:09:38,244 He had a little instrument. A piccolo? 129 00:09:38,619 --> 00:09:43,124 And he played this thing all day. And Kirby would tell him to shut up. 130 00:09:43,374 --> 00:09:45,418 And Stan would keep playing. 131 00:09:47,628 --> 00:09:51,340 STAN: We had The Human Torch and The Sub-Mariner and The Patriot 132 00:09:51,340 --> 00:09:53,509 and The Angel and The Destroyer. 133 00:09:54,468 --> 00:09:58,055 {\an8}But the main character we had was Captain America. 134 00:09:59,432 --> 00:10:02,560 {\an8}From the very beginning, we were very much affected 135 00:10:02,560 --> 00:10:05,605 {\an8}by what was going on in the world around us. 136 00:10:06,105 --> 00:10:10,484 {\an8}Joe Simon and Jack Kirby were doing stories of Captain America 137 00:10:10,484 --> 00:10:12,987 battling Hitler and the Nazis 138 00:10:12,987 --> 00:10:17,366 {\an8}even before America had gotten into the war. 139 00:10:17,366 --> 00:10:20,953 {\an8}Captain America came from the need for a patriotic character 140 00:10:20,953 --> 00:10:24,665 {\an8}because the times at that time were in a patriotic stir. 141 00:10:24,665 --> 00:10:28,336 {\an8}The war was coming on and the war clouds were gathering 142 00:10:29,086 --> 00:10:31,839 {\an8}and so Captain America had to come into existence. 143 00:10:34,967 --> 00:10:37,345 STAN: I came in in 1939, 144 00:10:38,387 --> 00:10:40,139 and it was such a small place 145 00:10:40,139 --> 00:10:43,059 that Jack Kirby and Joe couldn't keep up with all the stories. 146 00:10:43,684 --> 00:10:46,145 And they said, "Hey, could you help us write a story or two?" 147 00:10:46,145 --> 00:10:49,649 When you're 16, what do you know. I said, "Sure, I could do it." 148 00:10:55,863 --> 00:10:57,740 When I started doing comics, 149 00:10:57,865 --> 00:11:02,161 I figured I would just do them for a little while and get some experience 150 00:11:02,161 --> 00:11:04,955 and I thought one day I'll be a big time writer 151 00:11:04,955 --> 00:11:07,458 and maybe I'll write the Great American Novel. 152 00:11:08,584 --> 00:11:11,379 I always, in the back of my mind, liked comics, 153 00:11:11,379 --> 00:11:13,756 but I never considered that real writing. 154 00:11:14,924 --> 00:11:17,885 I said, "I'm not going to use my name for these silly comics." 155 00:11:18,469 --> 00:11:20,596 And I thought, "I need a pen name." 156 00:11:23,766 --> 00:11:27,311 So, I just took my first name, Stanley, and I cut it in two 157 00:11:27,311 --> 00:11:29,522 and I signed "Stan Lee." 158 00:11:29,522 --> 00:11:31,899 And the first story that I wrote was called 159 00:11:31,899 --> 00:11:34,694 "Captain America and the Traitor's Revenge." 160 00:11:36,445 --> 00:11:40,574 And what happened was, everybody started to know me as Stan Lee 161 00:11:40,574 --> 00:11:43,077 {\an8}and nobody knew me anymore as Stanley Lieber. 162 00:11:44,286 --> 00:11:46,414 {\an8}It was like my alter ego. 163 00:11:57,591 --> 00:11:59,969 (RADIO CRACKLING AND SWITCHING STATIONS) 164 00:11:59,969 --> 00:12:02,346 SPORTS ANNOUNCER: And the champion Yankees roar! 165 00:12:07,643 --> 00:12:10,771 STAN: After a while, Joe and Jack left Timely Comics 166 00:12:11,480 --> 00:12:14,942 and the publisher looked around at his vast empire, 167 00:12:14,942 --> 00:12:18,028 and he saw this one skinny kid with a broom in one hand 168 00:12:18,028 --> 00:12:19,488 and a typewriter in the other 169 00:12:19,488 --> 00:12:22,158 and he said, "Hey, where's the rest of my staff?" 170 00:12:22,158 --> 00:12:23,325 And I said, "I'm it." 171 00:12:23,451 --> 00:12:25,828 He said, "Somebody's gotta edit these books." 172 00:12:25,828 --> 00:12:29,039 He said, "Stan, can you hold down the job till I get somebody else?" 173 00:12:29,039 --> 00:12:31,041 And I said, "Okay, I'll take it." 174 00:12:31,041 --> 00:12:34,837 So, he went off into the outside world to seek another editor, 175 00:12:34,837 --> 00:12:37,923 and I was now Stan Lee, boy editor pro tem. 176 00:12:39,008 --> 00:12:42,762 And that was it, I became the editor, and I think he forgot to hire somebody 177 00:12:42,762 --> 00:12:44,722 because I remained the editor. 178 00:12:44,722 --> 00:12:47,224 So at 17, I was really running the place. 179 00:12:48,267 --> 00:12:51,729 And since I was my own writer and my own editor, 180 00:12:51,729 --> 00:12:54,064 I didn't have much to change. 181 00:12:54,064 --> 00:12:57,610 So I was able to get these stories moving very fast. 182 00:13:03,657 --> 00:13:05,826 {\an8}FRANKLIN D. ROOSEVELT: Since the unprovoked 183 00:13:06,702 --> 00:13:09,121 and dastardly attack 184 00:13:09,538 --> 00:13:12,917 by Japan on Sunday, 185 00:13:12,917 --> 00:13:16,670 December 7th, 1941, 186 00:13:17,463 --> 00:13:19,381 a state of war 187 00:13:20,424 --> 00:13:22,301 has existed 188 00:13:23,052 --> 00:13:24,887 between the United States 189 00:13:25,554 --> 00:13:27,556 and the Japanese Empire. 190 00:13:28,474 --> 00:13:30,476 STAN: Like an idiot, I volunteered. 191 00:13:31,769 --> 00:13:36,106 I felt it was my duty. It was a big war. And I wanted to be like Errol Flynn. 192 00:13:36,106 --> 00:13:37,817 I wanted to be a hero. 193 00:13:38,442 --> 00:13:40,736 But before they could send me overseas, 194 00:13:40,736 --> 00:13:43,572 they found out I had worked for this comic book company. 195 00:13:44,281 --> 00:13:46,408 The next thing I know, I got transferred 196 00:13:46,408 --> 00:13:49,078 to Astoria, Queens, in New York, 197 00:13:49,078 --> 00:13:50,955 where they had a film unit 198 00:13:50,955 --> 00:13:56,168 where they did training films and instructional books for the troops. 199 00:13:57,461 --> 00:14:00,256 Funny thing. I didn't know this until after the war ended. 200 00:14:00,256 --> 00:14:04,426 I looked at my army discharge and it said Army occupation, it said playwright. 201 00:14:05,344 --> 00:14:09,682 They were having a big problem training finance officers quickly enough. 202 00:14:09,682 --> 00:14:12,601 The men overseas weren't getting paid on time 203 00:14:12,601 --> 00:14:15,771 'cause there weren't enough payroll officers to pay them. 204 00:14:15,771 --> 00:14:19,692 So I was asked, could I rewrite the finance textbooks 205 00:14:19,692 --> 00:14:22,528 to make the training period shorter? 206 00:14:22,528 --> 00:14:26,574 I rewrote the finance textbooks using comic strips. 207 00:14:27,533 --> 00:14:31,495 We were able to shorten the training period for finance officers 208 00:14:31,495 --> 00:14:33,914 from six months to six weeks. 209 00:14:35,165 --> 00:14:36,834 It was then I realized 210 00:14:36,834 --> 00:14:41,046 that comic books can have a tremendous impact. 211 00:14:41,672 --> 00:14:44,675 You can convey a story or information 212 00:14:44,675 --> 00:14:49,388 faster, more clearly, and more enjoyably, than any other way, 213 00:14:49,388 --> 00:14:51,015 short of motion pictures. 214 00:15:06,572 --> 00:15:09,742 STAN: After the Army, I went back to the comic book company. 215 00:15:10,159 --> 00:15:12,703 Started doing what I had been doing all the time. 216 00:15:13,871 --> 00:15:16,874 I had a cousin and he was in the hat business. 217 00:15:18,042 --> 00:15:21,545 And one day, he said, there was a model, a hat model, 218 00:15:21,545 --> 00:15:23,714 at this place, named Betty. 219 00:15:23,714 --> 00:15:26,884 He thought I'd really like her and she might like me. 220 00:15:26,884 --> 00:15:30,054 So, I went up to this hat model place, 221 00:15:30,804 --> 00:15:32,598 and somebody opened the door. 222 00:15:33,849 --> 00:15:36,143 {\an8}I remember it very clearly. 223 00:15:36,143 --> 00:15:38,270 {\an8}He came to the door and he was... 224 00:15:38,687 --> 00:15:39,939 He had his raincoat 225 00:15:40,606 --> 00:15:41,857 thrown over his shoulder. 226 00:15:41,857 --> 00:15:43,651 Joan opened the door. 227 00:15:43,651 --> 00:15:46,737 Now, she was not the girl that I was supposed to meet. 228 00:15:46,737 --> 00:15:48,989 But she was the head model there. And she was... 229 00:15:48,989 --> 00:15:51,075 She opened the door and said... 230 00:15:51,075 --> 00:15:52,159 Hello! 231 00:15:53,452 --> 00:15:54,453 And he said, 232 00:15:56,914 --> 00:16:01,794 "Hello, I think I'm going to fall in love with you." 233 00:16:03,170 --> 00:16:04,338 STAN: I couldn't believe it. 234 00:16:04,838 --> 00:16:09,051 She had this beautiful English accent. And I'm a real Anglophile. 235 00:16:09,677 --> 00:16:11,720 An English accent knocks me out. 236 00:16:11,720 --> 00:16:13,764 And she was gorgeous. 237 00:16:14,431 --> 00:16:15,432 JOAN: I thought, 238 00:16:16,100 --> 00:16:18,602 "This one I can't let get away." 239 00:16:19,311 --> 00:16:21,021 It was really love at first sight. 240 00:16:35,244 --> 00:16:37,037 (PEOPLE CHATTERING INDISTINCTLY) 241 00:16:41,917 --> 00:16:44,211 STAN: At the time, we were known as Atlas Comics 242 00:16:44,211 --> 00:16:46,714 and we were just publishing what everybody else did. 243 00:16:46,714 --> 00:16:50,050 If western books were good, we published a thousand westerns. 244 00:16:50,050 --> 00:16:51,301 If romance books were in, 245 00:16:51,301 --> 00:16:53,846 we published a million romance books, and so forth. 246 00:16:53,846 --> 00:16:55,472 We just followed the trends. 247 00:16:56,140 --> 00:17:00,185 We did war stories, romance stories, humor stories, 248 00:17:00,811 --> 00:17:03,480 little funny animal animated comic stories. 249 00:17:04,523 --> 00:17:07,401 We were grinding out magazines like confetti, 250 00:17:08,277 --> 00:17:09,987 and we did that for years. 251 00:17:09,987 --> 00:17:13,991 At one point, we were churning out almost a hundred magazines a month. 252 00:17:16,201 --> 00:17:19,955 As a kid, all I wanted was a steady job, 253 00:17:21,874 --> 00:17:23,959 and now I had one. 254 00:17:25,836 --> 00:17:28,589 {\an8}Writing came very easily to me. 255 00:17:28,589 --> 00:17:32,593 {\an8}And in those early days, it was a fun way to make money. 256 00:17:33,260 --> 00:17:36,847 I was getting paid as an editor, art director, and head writer, 257 00:17:37,431 --> 00:17:41,852 but any stories that I wrote I got paid for on a freelance basis. 258 00:17:42,436 --> 00:17:44,980 So as the editor, I bought all my stories. 259 00:17:46,440 --> 00:17:49,234 My wife and I, we were a little bit extravagant. 260 00:17:49,985 --> 00:17:51,862 We lived right up to whatever I made, 261 00:17:52,780 --> 00:17:56,116 and I was and am very much in love with her. 262 00:17:56,784 --> 00:17:58,535 So whatever Joanie wanted, I'd say, 263 00:17:58,535 --> 00:18:01,830 "That's fine, honey, I'll write another story tonight to pay for it." 264 00:18:02,372 --> 00:18:04,708 Not only her, anytime I wanted something. 265 00:18:04,708 --> 00:18:06,293 I want a new car. 266 00:18:06,293 --> 00:18:09,546 Okay. I'll write a couple of stories, that'll take care of the down payment, 267 00:18:09,546 --> 00:18:12,966 and I'll keep writing stories every time the payments come due. 268 00:18:13,717 --> 00:18:17,471 I was always writing the stories to keep up with what we were doing. 269 00:18:17,471 --> 00:18:21,016 It was like having a tiger by the tail. But we loved living that way. 270 00:18:27,898 --> 00:18:30,067 (OLDIES MUSIC PLAYING ON RADIO) 271 00:18:34,738 --> 00:18:37,991 In those days, comics weren't thought of very highly. 272 00:18:38,909 --> 00:18:42,037 I remember we'd go to parties and somebody would walk over to me 273 00:18:42,037 --> 00:18:43,455 and say, "What do you do?" 274 00:18:43,455 --> 00:18:47,042 And I tried not to say, and I would say, "Oh, I'm a writer," 275 00:18:47,042 --> 00:18:49,920 and I'd walk away, but the person would follow me, 276 00:18:49,920 --> 00:18:51,421 "Well, what do you write?" 277 00:18:51,421 --> 00:18:53,757 And I'd say, "Oh, stories for young people." 278 00:18:53,757 --> 00:18:57,261 Walk away further. Follow me, "What kind of stories?" 279 00:18:57,261 --> 00:18:59,763 "Magazine stories." "Well, what magazine?" 280 00:18:59,763 --> 00:19:02,933 At some point, I had to say comic books, 281 00:19:03,475 --> 00:19:07,729 and the person who had been interrogating me would, "Oh, I see," 282 00:19:07,729 --> 00:19:10,399 and turn around and leave me, you know. 283 00:19:14,903 --> 00:19:17,614 MAN: Reading. What a wonderful thing this would be 284 00:19:17,614 --> 00:19:19,825 if they were reading something worthwhile. 285 00:19:19,825 --> 00:19:21,910 But they're not reading anything constructive, 286 00:19:21,910 --> 00:19:25,581 they're reading stories devoted to adultery, to sexual perversion, 287 00:19:25,581 --> 00:19:28,500 to horror, to the most despicable of crimes. 288 00:19:31,253 --> 00:19:34,214 STAN: In those days, we had to submit the comics 289 00:19:34,214 --> 00:19:37,634 to a self-censorship organization 290 00:19:37,634 --> 00:19:40,262 that had been set up by the publishers. 291 00:19:40,262 --> 00:19:43,348 It was called the Comics Code Authority. 292 00:19:43,348 --> 00:19:46,560 All the books we published had to be presented to them 293 00:19:46,560 --> 00:19:49,313 and they would make certain there was nothing in them 294 00:19:49,313 --> 00:19:51,815 that would ruin the youth of America. 295 00:19:58,697 --> 00:20:01,867 People thought of comics as being just for little kids. 296 00:20:03,619 --> 00:20:07,164 {\an8}And they were written and drawn with that in mind. 297 00:20:08,373 --> 00:20:10,500 {\an8}In those days, you're reading a comic book, 298 00:20:10,500 --> 00:20:12,461 {\an8}and it could really be any superhero, 299 00:20:12,461 --> 00:20:14,129 and he's walking down the street 300 00:20:14,129 --> 00:20:17,132 and he's got his little colorful long underwear suit on, 301 00:20:17,132 --> 00:20:20,052 and he sees a big, bug-eyed monster coming toward him, 302 00:20:20,052 --> 00:20:23,889 and his dialogue would have been something the equivalent of, 303 00:20:23,889 --> 00:20:26,683 "Oh, a creature from another planet. 304 00:20:27,100 --> 00:20:30,479 "I had better capture him before he destroys the world." 305 00:20:33,440 --> 00:20:36,652 {\an8}My publisher, Martin Goodman, he used to say to me, 306 00:20:36,652 --> 00:20:40,739 {\an8}"Remember, Stan, don't use words of more than two syllables. 307 00:20:40,739 --> 00:20:43,909 "Don't have too much dialogue. Get a lot of action. 308 00:20:43,909 --> 00:20:45,994 "Don't worry about characterization." 309 00:20:46,578 --> 00:20:49,122 After a while, I really wanted to quit. 310 00:20:51,959 --> 00:20:56,046 For the best motion picture, The Apartment, Billy Wilder. 311 00:20:56,046 --> 00:20:57,130 (WOMEN VOCALIZING) 312 00:20:58,090 --> 00:21:01,718 Ask not what your country can do for you... 313 00:21:04,221 --> 00:21:06,682 STAN: I always felt I was really wasting time. 314 00:21:06,682 --> 00:21:11,061 I felt okay, so I'm making a living with selling comics, 315 00:21:11,895 --> 00:21:16,275 but there are people building bridges and people doing medical research 316 00:21:17,025 --> 00:21:19,611 {\an8}and people doing things that matter. 317 00:21:21,446 --> 00:21:25,158 And I'm writing these stupid little fantasy stories. 318 00:21:26,994 --> 00:21:28,495 I always felt, you know, 319 00:21:28,495 --> 00:21:30,747 how could a grown man be doing comic books? 320 00:21:31,665 --> 00:21:34,960 And he just felt that he can't just go on doing this... 321 00:21:34,960 --> 00:21:36,795 What he thought was childish stuff. 322 00:21:37,879 --> 00:21:40,299 And then I said to him, 323 00:21:40,299 --> 00:21:44,303 "Well, why don't you create characters that you like?" 324 00:21:44,303 --> 00:21:46,430 "The worst that'll happen is you'll get fired 325 00:21:46,430 --> 00:21:47,931 "and you want to quit anyway. 326 00:21:47,931 --> 00:21:49,308 "Get it out of your system." 327 00:21:50,309 --> 00:21:55,522 At that time, Martin Goodman had found out that our competitor, DC Comics, 328 00:21:55,522 --> 00:21:58,317 they had done a book called The Justice League of America. 329 00:21:58,317 --> 00:22:01,153 A group of superheroes, and it was selling very well. 330 00:22:01,737 --> 00:22:04,156 And he said to me, "Stan, why don't you do a book 331 00:22:04,156 --> 00:22:06,450 "about a group of superheroes?" 332 00:22:06,450 --> 00:22:09,494 So I figured this is my chance to do it my way. 333 00:22:13,081 --> 00:22:14,708 So I went home and wrote. 334 00:22:16,084 --> 00:22:19,379 It occurred to me that it might be fun to put out the kind of stories 335 00:22:19,379 --> 00:22:21,173 that I would enjoy reading myself, 336 00:22:21,173 --> 00:22:24,176 rather than just writing for the eight or nine-year-old. 337 00:22:24,468 --> 00:22:27,888 {\an8}By that time, Jack Kirby had come back. 338 00:22:28,221 --> 00:22:32,309 {\an8}So I said, "Jack, wouldn't it be fun if we have good guys 339 00:22:32,309 --> 00:22:36,104 "who occasionally fall on their faces, who occasionally make mistakes, 340 00:22:36,104 --> 00:22:38,815 "trip at the last minute and let the bad guy get away? 341 00:22:38,815 --> 00:22:42,361 "Wouldn't it be nice to have bad guys that you could almost relate to 342 00:22:42,361 --> 00:22:45,822 "and feel, 'Ah, well, you know, maybe I'd have done the same thing 343 00:22:45,822 --> 00:22:47,616 "'if I was in his position?'" 344 00:22:48,700 --> 00:22:54,206 MAN: Five, four, three, two, one, zero. 345 00:22:56,083 --> 00:22:58,710 STAN: That was really the start of everything. 346 00:23:01,129 --> 00:23:06,385 I came up with four superheroes I called The Fantastic Four. 347 00:23:06,385 --> 00:23:09,137 See what happened, they all went in a rocket ship 348 00:23:10,222 --> 00:23:13,141 and they were affected by cosmic rays. 349 00:23:13,141 --> 00:23:16,895 And the cosmic rays gave them superhuman abilities. 350 00:23:18,271 --> 00:23:21,024 And yet I tried to be realistic about it. 351 00:23:22,150 --> 00:23:25,112 The hero wasn't just a perfect guy, 352 00:23:25,112 --> 00:23:28,073 he was a fellow like me. He talks too much. 353 00:23:28,073 --> 00:23:30,075 He was always boring the others, 354 00:23:30,075 --> 00:23:33,662 because one of the other guys was always saying, "Will you shut up?" 355 00:23:33,662 --> 00:23:39,084 And instead of an obligatory female, who doesn't know who the hero really is, 356 00:23:39,084 --> 00:23:41,670 she was the hero's fiancée, 357 00:23:41,670 --> 00:23:46,383 and she also had a super power that was as good as anyone else's. 358 00:23:48,051 --> 00:23:51,555 The teenager in the group didn't want to be a superhero. 359 00:23:52,848 --> 00:23:55,058 {\an8}Like I would have been when I was a teenager. 360 00:23:55,058 --> 00:23:58,186 {\an8}He wanted to go out with girls and ride his sport car. 361 00:23:58,186 --> 00:24:02,107 And the fourth guy was a monster. Something had happened to him, 362 00:24:02,107 --> 00:24:04,943 and he became very ugly and incredibly strong. 363 00:24:04,943 --> 00:24:08,864 And I used him for both pathos and humor. 364 00:24:08,864 --> 00:24:11,241 He was always fighting with the others, 365 00:24:11,241 --> 00:24:14,911 and he was always picking on the Human Torch that was a teenager, 366 00:24:14,911 --> 00:24:18,373 who was always picking on him, and I got a lot of comedy out of them. 367 00:24:18,832 --> 00:24:22,794 Instead of having them live in a fictional place 368 00:24:22,794 --> 00:24:25,505 like Metropolis or Gotham City, 369 00:24:25,505 --> 00:24:28,008 I plunked 'em right down in New York City. 370 00:24:28,508 --> 00:24:31,678 Because I knew New York City, I could write about New York City, 371 00:24:31,678 --> 00:24:34,097 and I figured why not let 'em live in a real place? 372 00:24:34,764 --> 00:24:36,266 And one day it occurred to me, 373 00:24:36,266 --> 00:24:39,811 it would be fun to show that they lost all their money. 374 00:24:39,811 --> 00:24:43,064 I don't think that had ever happened in any other comic book, 375 00:24:43,064 --> 00:24:46,735 where a superhero group got kicked out of their headquarters 376 00:24:46,735 --> 00:24:48,528 'cause they couldn't pay the rent. 377 00:24:49,321 --> 00:24:53,158 I tried to keep everything as realistic as possible 378 00:24:53,158 --> 00:24:56,536 even though it was just a superhero comic. 379 00:25:03,335 --> 00:25:06,838 For the first decade or two, at the comic book company 380 00:25:06,838 --> 00:25:10,634 we never received fan mail, and I was sure these books are being published 381 00:25:10,634 --> 00:25:13,178 and destroyed somewhere, and that's the end of it. 382 00:25:13,178 --> 00:25:14,721 (AUDIENCE LAUGHING) 383 00:25:14,721 --> 00:25:16,765 I'm exaggerating. 384 00:25:16,765 --> 00:25:19,851 About once a year we'd get a letter, somebody would write, 385 00:25:20,685 --> 00:25:23,480 "Hey, I bought one of your books and there's a staple missing. 386 00:25:23,480 --> 00:25:24,773 "I want my money back." 387 00:25:25,815 --> 00:25:28,610 But all of a sudden, with The Fantastic Four, 388 00:25:28,610 --> 00:25:31,696 {\an8}we really got mail, we really had readers who said something. 389 00:25:33,031 --> 00:25:36,451 We were getting write-ups in newspapers and magazines, 390 00:25:36,451 --> 00:25:39,037 and people were asking me to do interviews. 391 00:25:39,704 --> 00:25:43,166 I began to realize we have a whole new audience. 392 00:25:44,334 --> 00:25:47,003 At that time we were calling the company Atlas. 393 00:25:47,462 --> 00:25:49,089 I said we gotta get a new name, 394 00:25:49,089 --> 00:25:52,300 these aren't the same things we were doing before. 395 00:25:53,093 --> 00:25:55,929 And Martin and I came up with the name Marvel. 396 00:25:57,681 --> 00:25:59,307 {\an8}That had been the name 397 00:25:59,307 --> 00:26:01,810 of the first comic book he had ever done, 398 00:26:01,810 --> 00:26:04,688 and I thought it was a great word. 399 00:26:04,688 --> 00:26:07,899 There's so much you can do with the word Marvel, 400 00:26:07,899 --> 00:26:12,737 {\an8}I used expressions like "Remember, gang, make mine marvel," 401 00:26:12,737 --> 00:26:16,324 {\an8}or "Welcome to The Marvel age of comics!" 402 00:26:16,324 --> 00:26:18,285 Or "Marvel moves on." 403 00:26:18,285 --> 00:26:21,329 I mean, it's the kind of name you can do a lot with. 404 00:26:22,372 --> 00:26:24,708 That's when everything changed for us. 405 00:26:26,585 --> 00:26:30,964 I've started realizing, to most people the most important thing 406 00:26:30,964 --> 00:26:35,135 is being entertained, getting pleasure out of something. 407 00:26:36,970 --> 00:26:39,139 And then, I realized it applies to me, too. 408 00:26:41,016 --> 00:26:45,478 And I figured maybe what I'm doing isn't really unimportant. 409 00:26:46,021 --> 00:26:50,692 Maybe entertainment is one of the most important things, 410 00:26:50,692 --> 00:26:54,154 because there are so many bad things in the world, 411 00:26:54,154 --> 00:26:58,241 that if you can entertain somebody for a while, it's a good thing. 412 00:27:08,501 --> 00:27:11,880 So then, instead of quitting, like I wanted to, 413 00:27:11,880 --> 00:27:16,885 I decided that I could make a big difference writing superhero books. 414 00:27:17,427 --> 00:27:19,512 I thought I could have a lot of fun with this 415 00:27:19,512 --> 00:27:21,640 and get some real writing in it. 416 00:27:21,640 --> 00:27:24,184 And I used the philosophy of 417 00:27:24,184 --> 00:27:27,103 what would I like to read if I were reading a book. 418 00:27:29,022 --> 00:27:33,526 When I was a kid, one of the books that I read was Jekyll and Hyde. 419 00:27:34,736 --> 00:27:37,947 So I wanted to take from Jekyll and Hyde 420 00:27:37,947 --> 00:27:41,993 where he could change from a normal person into the monster. 421 00:27:45,121 --> 00:27:49,292 And I always liked the Frankenstein movie, the old one with Karloff. 422 00:27:49,876 --> 00:27:52,337 I always felt the monster is really the good guy. 423 00:27:52,337 --> 00:27:53,880 He didn't wanna hurt anybody. 424 00:27:55,006 --> 00:27:57,217 So I thought it would be fun to get a monster 425 00:27:57,217 --> 00:28:00,220 who was really a good guy, but nobody knew that. 426 00:28:02,097 --> 00:28:04,891 And I remember the conversation I had with Jack Kirby, 427 00:28:04,891 --> 00:28:07,769 and I said, "Jack, we're gonna do a monster 428 00:28:07,769 --> 00:28:11,523 "but I want you to draw me a sympathetic monster. 429 00:28:11,523 --> 00:28:15,360 "Kind of, a good-looking monster that a reader can take to." 430 00:28:15,360 --> 00:28:20,031 And as I said it, I realized how stupid it sounded, but Jack never failed. 431 00:28:22,200 --> 00:28:23,493 {\an8}Hulk's in all of us. 432 00:28:24,244 --> 00:28:27,288 {\an8}I don't think monsters zero in on anyone in particular. 433 00:28:27,288 --> 00:28:32,419 {\an8}I think that's why they are generally pitied more than feared. 434 00:28:32,877 --> 00:28:35,880 I felt that monsters, in some way, had problems. 435 00:28:36,548 --> 00:28:40,093 Monsters, in human or inhuman form, are inevitably involved 436 00:28:40,093 --> 00:28:43,972 in some sort of conflict in which anybody can get hurt. 437 00:28:46,015 --> 00:28:48,435 If you read any dramatic news story, 438 00:28:48,435 --> 00:28:52,439 you'll find that the most dramatic part about 'em was that 439 00:28:52,897 --> 00:28:54,649 inside a human being 440 00:28:54,649 --> 00:28:58,737 there are some sort of problems that we're constantly trying to solve. 441 00:29:00,071 --> 00:29:04,451 STAN: One of life's great lessons that I have learned is, 442 00:29:04,451 --> 00:29:09,497 {\an8}don't try to please a certain segment of the public, don't try to please them, 443 00:29:10,290 --> 00:29:13,001 'cause you don't really know them, nobody knows them, 444 00:29:13,668 --> 00:29:15,211 but you know yourself. 445 00:29:15,712 --> 00:29:17,464 Try to please yourself. 446 00:29:17,464 --> 00:29:19,758 At least that's what happened to us at Marvel. 447 00:29:19,758 --> 00:29:23,803 We started writing stories that amused us. 448 00:29:23,803 --> 00:29:25,889 We started to say, "Hey, wouldn't it be fun 449 00:29:25,889 --> 00:29:29,184 "if we, you know, had a green-skinned monster and we call him the Hulk"? 450 00:29:29,184 --> 00:29:32,312 Wow, you know, and we forgot about the audience. 451 00:29:32,854 --> 00:29:34,314 We forgot about the public. 452 00:29:34,314 --> 00:29:38,151 We suddenly started having fun. The artists and me. 453 00:29:51,873 --> 00:29:55,251 {\an8}I came to New York in '63. 454 00:29:56,294 --> 00:30:01,549 {\an8}And I went on job interviews, and one of them was meeting Stan, 455 00:30:02,091 --> 00:30:06,513 {\an8}and he needed a gal Friday, which meant secretary, 456 00:30:06,513 --> 00:30:09,349 {\an8}only you couldn't type or take shorthand. 457 00:30:11,017 --> 00:30:16,272 Stan was always an upbeat person, even maybe when sales weren't going well. 458 00:30:16,272 --> 00:30:19,567 You know, if someone was in trouble, he always gave them a break. 459 00:30:19,567 --> 00:30:23,238 On the deadline, or they needed money. 460 00:30:23,238 --> 00:30:26,407 I never saw him angry. 461 00:30:27,826 --> 00:30:30,578 Not a whiner, not a complainer. 462 00:30:30,578 --> 00:30:33,748 If something's wrong, "Let's fix it." 463 00:30:35,875 --> 00:30:39,796 The job entailed opening the fan mail, 464 00:30:39,796 --> 00:30:43,258 and then making little cards and sending cards to the kids. 465 00:30:44,926 --> 00:30:46,135 Then, of course, 466 00:30:46,135 --> 00:30:49,597 superheroes started getting bigger so there was more mail. 467 00:30:51,140 --> 00:30:54,853 {\an8}You know, people were actually spending time writing these letters. 468 00:30:56,145 --> 00:31:00,608 It sort of developed gradually, that there was such a movement. 469 00:31:00,608 --> 00:31:02,777 {\an8}You know, the kids were so interested. 470 00:31:03,528 --> 00:31:05,363 {\an8}We were getting so many letters. 471 00:31:05,363 --> 00:31:09,033 Stan said, "Maybe we should have a little fan club." 472 00:31:09,576 --> 00:31:13,121 We started The Merry Marvel Marching Society. 473 00:31:13,580 --> 00:31:17,792 You got a little card, you got a button, 474 00:31:18,001 --> 00:31:21,379 probably some stickers and a little record. 475 00:31:22,297 --> 00:31:25,550 They got a record of The Merry Marvel Marching Society. 476 00:31:29,387 --> 00:31:33,349 Okay, out there in Marvel-land, face front, this is Stan Lee speaking. 477 00:31:33,474 --> 00:31:36,227 You've probably never heard a record like this before, 478 00:31:36,227 --> 00:31:38,521 because no one would be nutty enough to make one 479 00:31:38,521 --> 00:31:40,398 with a bunch of offbeat artists, 480 00:31:40,398 --> 00:31:42,108 so anything is liable to happen. 481 00:31:42,525 --> 00:31:44,736 KIRBY: Hey, who made you a Disc Jockey, Lee? 482 00:31:44,736 --> 00:31:48,114 STAN: Well, well, Jolly Jack Kirby. Say a few words to the fans, Jackson. 483 00:31:48,114 --> 00:31:49,741 KIRBY: Okay, a few words. 484 00:31:50,325 --> 00:31:53,036 STAN: Look, pal, I'll take care of the humor around here. 485 00:31:53,036 --> 00:31:56,664 KIRBY: You? You've been using the same gags over and over for years. 486 00:31:56,915 --> 00:31:59,667 STEINBERG: Oh, Stan? Do you have a few minutes? 487 00:31:59,667 --> 00:32:01,753 STAN: For our fabulous gal Friday? 488 00:32:01,753 --> 00:32:04,255 Sure, say hello to the fans, Flo Steinberg. 489 00:32:04,255 --> 00:32:07,342 STEINBERG: Hello, fans, it's very nice to meet you. 490 00:32:07,342 --> 00:32:08,426 (FOOTSTEPS APPROACHING) 491 00:32:08,426 --> 00:32:10,261 STAN: Hey. What's all that commotion out there? 492 00:32:10,261 --> 00:32:11,971 KIRBY: Why, it's shy Steve Ditko. 493 00:32:11,971 --> 00:32:14,474 He heard you're making a record and he's got mic fright. 494 00:32:14,474 --> 00:32:17,185 - STAN: Out the window again? - (GLASS BREAKING) 495 00:32:17,310 --> 00:32:19,771 You know, I'm beginning to think he is Spider-Man. 496 00:32:20,188 --> 00:32:24,275 MAN: (SINGING) You belong, you belong You belong, you belong 497 00:32:24,275 --> 00:32:28,029 To the Merry Marvel Marching Society 498 00:32:28,029 --> 00:32:32,700 March along, march along To the song of the Merry... 499 00:32:33,368 --> 00:32:37,246 Shall I tell you a little bit, a very little bit, 'cause it can get dull, 500 00:32:37,246 --> 00:32:39,332 even duller than what you've been hearing, 501 00:32:39,332 --> 00:32:42,377 about the way we write and draw these scripts? 502 00:32:42,961 --> 00:32:46,464 In the beginning, I was writing just about all the stories, 503 00:32:46,464 --> 00:32:51,386 and as we kept adding book after book, I couldn't keep up with all the artists, 504 00:32:51,386 --> 00:32:54,555 {\an8}so I'd be writing a script, let's say, for Jack Kirby. 505 00:32:54,555 --> 00:32:57,058 {\an8}Suddenly, Steve Ditko would walk in and he'd say, 506 00:32:57,058 --> 00:32:59,936 "Hey, Stan, I finished my last job, I need another one." 507 00:32:59,936 --> 00:33:02,605 So, out of sheer desperation I said to him, 508 00:33:02,605 --> 00:33:06,901 "Let me just give you a plot, you go on home and draw it, 509 00:33:06,901 --> 00:33:09,153 "any way you want. Bring it in to me, 510 00:33:09,153 --> 00:33:12,240 "and I'll put in the dialogue and the captions." 511 00:33:12,240 --> 00:33:14,325 It started as an emergency measure, 512 00:33:14,325 --> 00:33:18,705 but I began to realize, this is a great way to do it. 513 00:33:20,873 --> 00:33:24,002 Very often in the office when I'm describing a scene or something, 514 00:33:24,002 --> 00:33:25,795 I'd go storming around the office, 515 00:33:25,795 --> 00:33:28,965 and I would think anybody looking in on a story conference 516 00:33:28,965 --> 00:33:33,136 at our place would think they're watching some silent movie being filmed. 517 00:33:33,136 --> 00:33:34,679 STEINBERG: When an artist would come in 518 00:33:34,679 --> 00:33:37,056 and they would be working on the plot together, 519 00:33:37,056 --> 00:33:39,809 they would act it out and Stan would jump on the desk 520 00:33:39,809 --> 00:33:43,688 and run around on the desk, and you know, act the part of the superhero. 521 00:33:43,688 --> 00:33:46,691 They would brainstorm and there'd be all this noise. 522 00:33:46,691 --> 00:33:48,276 Sometimes if I were on the phone, 523 00:33:48,276 --> 00:33:51,904 I'd have to yell in there, "Keep it down, keep it down." 524 00:33:52,405 --> 00:33:55,283 STAN: Jack and I have gotten to work so well together, 525 00:33:55,283 --> 00:33:58,870 that our plotting session will be something like, 526 00:33:58,870 --> 00:34:03,499 "Hey, in the next Fantastic Four, Jack, let's let the villain be Doctor Doom." 527 00:34:03,499 --> 00:34:06,252 "Where did he come from? Where did we leave off with him?" 528 00:34:06,252 --> 00:34:09,714 And I'll say, "Oh, yeah, he was fading off into another universe. 529 00:34:09,714 --> 00:34:11,716 "Find some way to bring him back, Jack, 530 00:34:11,716 --> 00:34:14,677 "and then we'll have him attack the Fantastic Four, and then, 531 00:34:14,677 --> 00:34:18,264 "let's let the story end with him running off 532 00:34:18,264 --> 00:34:20,391 "and eloping with Sue Storm or something." 533 00:34:21,267 --> 00:34:23,352 Jack will say "Fine" and he goes off, 534 00:34:23,352 --> 00:34:25,688 and by the time he brings the artwork back, 535 00:34:25,688 --> 00:34:27,440 it might be that particular plot 536 00:34:27,440 --> 00:34:30,068 or he might have changed fifty million things. 537 00:34:30,860 --> 00:34:33,738 So he doesn't know exactly what I'm gonna write, 538 00:34:33,738 --> 00:34:35,615 what words I'm gonna put in their mouths. 539 00:34:35,615 --> 00:34:40,953 I don't know what he's gonna draw. The whole thing is virtual chaos. 540 00:34:40,953 --> 00:34:44,624 But somehow when it gets together, it seems to hold together pretty well, 541 00:34:44,624 --> 00:34:46,584 and we kinda like working this way. 542 00:34:47,460 --> 00:34:49,796 It isn't the artist, it isn't the writer. 543 00:34:49,796 --> 00:34:51,714 It's the artist and the writer. 544 00:34:51,714 --> 00:34:53,508 It's pictures and stories, 545 00:34:53,508 --> 00:34:58,429 and when they blend together perfectly, then you've got a great comic. 546 00:35:01,349 --> 00:35:06,187 Working that way as a team, it became known as the Marvel Method. 547 00:35:15,780 --> 00:35:20,743 Joan and I, we got a little apartment in New York on 94th Street. 548 00:35:21,369 --> 00:35:23,204 We stayed there for a year or two. 549 00:35:23,913 --> 00:35:25,665 And then, Joan got pregnant. 550 00:35:26,374 --> 00:35:29,460 We decided we ought to move to a house to have the baby 551 00:35:29,460 --> 00:35:31,003 and we moved to Long Island. 552 00:35:34,006 --> 00:35:37,135 We got a little house, and we could just barely afford it. 553 00:35:38,970 --> 00:35:41,389 {\an8}We had a daughter, Joan C. Lee. 554 00:35:42,265 --> 00:35:46,060 We're so vain! We decided to name our daughter Joan, 555 00:35:46,060 --> 00:35:49,438 and if we had had a son, we'd have called him Stan. 556 00:35:50,523 --> 00:35:53,943 In fact, we did have another baby, a girl, we couldn't call her Stan, 557 00:35:53,943 --> 00:36:00,491 so called her Jan, but unfortunately, she died a few hours after she was born, 558 00:36:01,659 --> 00:36:03,703 and Joan couldn't have any other kids, 559 00:36:05,496 --> 00:36:08,291 so we spoiled Joan rotten. 560 00:36:09,750 --> 00:36:11,919 {\an8}I think she's a mixture of both of us. 561 00:36:11,919 --> 00:36:13,254 {\an8}She's very talented. 562 00:36:14,589 --> 00:36:18,676 {\an8}Think it's difficult being a child of two such strong parents, 563 00:36:18,676 --> 00:36:21,179 {\an8}I think that's always difficult, and we are. 564 00:36:22,305 --> 00:36:24,307 STAN: After a while we called her J.C. 565 00:36:24,307 --> 00:36:27,185 'cause our daughter's name was Joan C. Lee. 566 00:36:27,310 --> 00:36:30,730 The C standing for Celia, which was my mother's name. 567 00:36:31,189 --> 00:36:33,524 And Joanie was Joan B. Lee. 568 00:36:37,778 --> 00:36:40,865 My wife and I are really so close. 569 00:36:40,865 --> 00:36:44,035 She's the greatest. I mean, she's an incredible woman. 570 00:36:44,660 --> 00:36:49,624 My wife, I think, is incredibly beautiful, smart, charming, fun to be with. 571 00:36:49,624 --> 00:36:53,419 When we used to dance, I let her lead. She was so good. 572 00:36:53,419 --> 00:36:55,046 I tried to keep up with her. 573 00:36:55,046 --> 00:36:58,758 So I tried to put those qualities in all the women I wrote about. 574 00:36:59,467 --> 00:37:06,015 Mary Jane, for example, was very peppy and effervescent and kinda hip and cool. 575 00:37:06,724 --> 00:37:07,892 That was my wife. 576 00:37:08,851 --> 00:37:10,186 She's the perfect wife for me 577 00:37:10,186 --> 00:37:14,357 because I spend so much time writing when I'm home, 578 00:37:15,066 --> 00:37:20,029 and Joanie, she can always keep herself busy, which is wonderful. 579 00:37:20,029 --> 00:37:23,157 So I don't feel guilty when I'm in my room writing. 580 00:37:25,451 --> 00:37:28,371 JOAN: He's a vanishing breed. There are no men like Stan today. 581 00:37:28,371 --> 00:37:30,957 He's an endangered species. One has to protect him. 582 00:37:30,957 --> 00:37:33,251 Because he's blessed with tremendous energy. 583 00:37:33,251 --> 00:37:35,127 He's an ever straight man. 584 00:37:35,253 --> 00:37:37,213 Doesn't take booze, doesn't smoke cigarettes. 585 00:37:37,213 --> 00:37:38,631 And gets up every day and says, 586 00:37:38,631 --> 00:37:41,092 "Thank God this arm works, and this leg works, 587 00:37:41,092 --> 00:37:42,343 "and life is great." 588 00:37:42,343 --> 00:37:44,512 He's been a very good husband. 589 00:37:45,471 --> 00:37:47,890 INTERVIEWER: So, what's your secret for a successful marriage? 590 00:37:48,432 --> 00:37:51,018 JOAN: He's my best friend and I'm his best friend... 591 00:37:51,018 --> 00:37:53,229 - liking each other. - Okay. 592 00:37:53,479 --> 00:37:55,898 You know, it isn't that kind of oh, love, love, love. 593 00:37:55,898 --> 00:37:58,776 Kids kinda fall in love and think you're gonna be in bed all day. 594 00:37:58,776 --> 00:38:01,070 That's not what marriage is. Marriage is like a farm. 595 00:38:01,070 --> 00:38:04,323 You have to get up every day and work at it every single day. 596 00:38:04,615 --> 00:38:08,911 He's still the most amazing person I've ever met in my life. 597 00:38:15,876 --> 00:38:18,087 (ROCK AND ROLL MUSIC PLAYING ON RADIO) 598 00:38:18,087 --> 00:38:19,213 (RADIO STATIONS SWITCHING) 599 00:38:19,213 --> 00:38:22,425 MAN ON RADIO: The early teens are years of upheaval and turmoil. 600 00:38:25,219 --> 00:38:26,595 REPORTER: Do you think that teenagers 601 00:38:26,595 --> 00:38:28,931 are any different today from how they used to be? 602 00:38:29,557 --> 00:38:30,558 Yes, I do. 603 00:38:31,225 --> 00:38:34,937 Do you think teenagers today are better or worse than they used to be? 604 00:38:34,937 --> 00:38:36,355 I think they're worse. 605 00:38:37,023 --> 00:38:42,945 Today, we've come to a time in history when there definitely is a generation gap. 606 00:38:42,945 --> 00:38:46,782 TEEN BOY: There is a teenage world, you know. If the adults don't like it 607 00:38:46,782 --> 00:38:48,909 {\an8}that's only because they don't want a part of it. 608 00:38:48,909 --> 00:38:50,953 STAN: Anything that can be done 609 00:38:50,953 --> 00:38:55,458 to help present the point of view of these young people 610 00:38:55,458 --> 00:38:58,294 without hostility, with respect, 611 00:38:58,294 --> 00:39:00,671 would be a very beneficial thing. 612 00:39:02,465 --> 00:39:04,425 When I was 17-years-old, 613 00:39:04,633 --> 00:39:07,553 I was an editor, art director, and head writer, 614 00:39:08,512 --> 00:39:12,475 but at that time, the teenager wasn't respected. 615 00:39:12,475 --> 00:39:14,977 So I figured, hell, I'm gonna change that. 616 00:39:15,770 --> 00:39:18,898 Why not have a teenager who's a hero? 617 00:39:18,898 --> 00:39:21,400 Why couldn't a teenager have a super power? 618 00:39:21,400 --> 00:39:22,568 I loved that idea. 619 00:39:25,404 --> 00:39:28,699 I felt that I would like to, for once, 620 00:39:28,699 --> 00:39:34,163 do a strip about a teenager who isn't a sidekick, but he is the hero. 621 00:39:34,872 --> 00:39:38,250 And I wanna make him like a real teenager. 622 00:39:38,250 --> 00:39:41,545 He's not a guy who can do anything and never has a problem. 623 00:39:42,838 --> 00:39:44,632 But I had to come up with a name. 624 00:39:46,300 --> 00:39:51,764 As a kid, I had loved a pulp magazine named The Spider. 625 00:39:52,139 --> 00:39:56,018 The most dramatic thing I could think of, the cover of this magazine, 626 00:39:56,018 --> 00:40:00,606 it said, "The Spider: Master of Men." 627 00:40:00,606 --> 00:40:03,442 Somehow, to me, at the age of nine, 628 00:40:04,193 --> 00:40:06,487 "Master of Men, oh, I'd love to be a..." 629 00:40:06,487 --> 00:40:09,073 You know, who wouldn't want to be a master of men? 630 00:40:09,073 --> 00:40:10,908 {\an8}And he had a ring, 631 00:40:10,908 --> 00:40:15,538 {\an8}and he'd punch a bad guy in the face and it had a little spider on the ring, 632 00:40:15,538 --> 00:40:19,041 and it would leave a spider mark on the guy's jaw. 633 00:40:21,043 --> 00:40:23,045 That name always stuck with me. 634 00:40:26,173 --> 00:40:28,008 Then I thought why not Spider-Man? 635 00:40:29,427 --> 00:40:31,387 (TYPEWRITER CLACKING) 636 00:40:42,606 --> 00:40:45,401 I walked in to the publisher Martin Goodman 637 00:40:45,401 --> 00:40:48,195 and I said "I have an idea for a book called Spider-Man 638 00:40:48,195 --> 00:40:51,198 "about a teenager who has a lot of problems." 639 00:40:51,699 --> 00:40:54,869 This time, Martin wouldn't go along with me, he said, "Stan, 640 00:40:55,369 --> 00:40:56,829 "I'm surprised at you. 641 00:40:56,829 --> 00:41:02,084 "And a hero can't be a teenager. A teenager can only be a sidekick. 642 00:41:02,084 --> 00:41:05,087 "And you say you want him to have problems? 643 00:41:05,087 --> 00:41:07,423 "Don't you know what a superhero is?" 644 00:41:09,633 --> 00:41:12,303 He was the boss and I couldn't put Spider-Man out. 645 00:41:15,347 --> 00:41:19,310 But I just felt I had to get it out of my system. 646 00:41:20,686 --> 00:41:23,606 Months later, we had a book we were going to kill 647 00:41:23,606 --> 00:41:26,275 called Amazing Fantasy. 648 00:41:26,275 --> 00:41:27,860 When you drop a book, 649 00:41:27,860 --> 00:41:31,572 nobody cares what you put in the last issue, 'cause you're killing it. 650 00:41:31,947 --> 00:41:34,533 So just to get it out of my system, 651 00:41:34,533 --> 00:41:37,119 I put Spider-Man and I feature him on the cover. 652 00:41:38,370 --> 00:41:40,831 I'm lucky Martin didn't fire me on the spot. 653 00:41:41,624 --> 00:41:42,958 But in that story, 654 00:41:43,334 --> 00:41:47,588 I tried to heap as many problems as I could on poor Peter Parker. 655 00:41:47,588 --> 00:41:53,302 Because I feel most people, even people who seem to be happy, have problems. 656 00:41:54,011 --> 00:41:57,389 Spider-Man's got the strength of 25 men 657 00:41:57,389 --> 00:42:02,311 and can walk on walls and swing from building to building on his own web, 658 00:42:02,686 --> 00:42:05,606 but he still can't go out and chase a villain 659 00:42:05,606 --> 00:42:09,485 because his old Aunt May says, "It's raining out 660 00:42:09,485 --> 00:42:12,071 "and you might catch cold. Better stay home tonight." 661 00:42:12,863 --> 00:42:16,450 I had not read any other superheroes 662 00:42:16,450 --> 00:42:20,454 who felt they wished they could quit being a superhero. 663 00:42:21,121 --> 00:42:24,750 I made him a guy who is very introspective. 664 00:42:24,750 --> 00:42:27,962 He questions, "Why am I doing this?" 665 00:42:31,006 --> 00:42:32,550 The book went on sale. 666 00:42:32,550 --> 00:42:35,511 Later, when the sales figures came in, 667 00:42:35,511 --> 00:42:38,389 Martin came running into my office, he said, "Stan! 668 00:42:38,389 --> 00:42:42,768 "Do you remember that character of yours, Spider-Man, that we both liked so much? 669 00:42:43,519 --> 00:42:45,437 "Why don't you do a series of him?" 670 00:42:49,108 --> 00:42:52,152 After that, I felt I can do anything. 671 00:43:00,744 --> 00:43:02,746 There were always good artists around. 672 00:43:03,872 --> 00:43:06,917 Jack and Steve, both were terribly unique. 673 00:43:08,794 --> 00:43:13,549 Conceptually, Jack's artwork is very much like a good, exciting movie. 674 00:43:13,549 --> 00:43:20,097 Jack has a way of hitting the high point, visually, in every situation he's drawing. 675 00:43:20,097 --> 00:43:23,559 {\an8}He'll draw the extreme of that situation. 676 00:43:23,559 --> 00:43:27,354 Whatever is the most exciting element, he will draw that. 677 00:43:27,354 --> 00:43:31,483 {\an8}And consequently his artwork is always fascinating to watch. 678 00:43:33,569 --> 00:43:38,449 Steve Ditko, he drew characters, in many ways, the opposite of Jack. 679 00:43:38,449 --> 00:43:42,369 Steve's artwork, I always felt, was very low-key 680 00:43:42,369 --> 00:43:46,624 and he had a way of telling a story realistically. 681 00:43:46,624 --> 00:43:49,376 After a while, you'd forget you're reading a comic book 682 00:43:49,376 --> 00:43:51,587 and you'd think this was really happening. 683 00:43:52,921 --> 00:43:56,884 Jack Kirby was probably the greatest comic book artist around, 684 00:43:56,884 --> 00:44:00,304 and I wanted Jack, originally, to do the Spider-Man, 685 00:44:00,304 --> 00:44:02,765 but I didn't want Spider-Man to look heroic. 686 00:44:02,765 --> 00:44:06,060 I wanted him to be just a typical nebbishy kind of guy, 687 00:44:06,185 --> 00:44:07,853 and I mentioned that to Jack, 688 00:44:07,853 --> 00:44:12,149 but Jack was so used to drawing Captain America and characters like that. 689 00:44:12,149 --> 00:44:15,444 When he gave me the first couple of pages, I said, "No, that... 690 00:44:15,444 --> 00:44:17,279 "You got him looking too heroic." 691 00:44:17,279 --> 00:44:20,699 So I gave the strip to Steve. It didn't matter to Jack. 692 00:44:20,699 --> 00:44:22,409 Nobody knew it would be a big strip 693 00:44:22,409 --> 00:44:24,745 and Jack was busy doing all the other books. 694 00:44:24,745 --> 00:44:27,039 Steve was just perfect for it. 695 00:44:27,039 --> 00:44:30,334 He got that feeling of an average guy 696 00:44:30,334 --> 00:44:32,795 who turned into a hero and still had problems. 697 00:44:35,798 --> 00:44:38,384 And lo, a legend was born. 698 00:44:44,306 --> 00:44:47,976 BOY: Here's our special guest, Stan Lee. 699 00:44:47,976 --> 00:44:49,978 How about Spider-Man? Know about Spider-Man? 700 00:44:49,978 --> 00:44:51,063 KIDS: Yeah. 701 00:44:51,063 --> 00:44:53,065 - How about the Hulk? You know the Hulk? - Yeah. 702 00:44:53,065 --> 00:44:54,900 Which one is your favorite? 703 00:44:54,900 --> 00:44:58,779 Oh, gee. You know, that's almost like asking a parent who's his favorite child? 704 00:44:58,779 --> 00:45:00,406 I think I love them all. 705 00:45:00,406 --> 00:45:03,367 But maybe I like Spider-Man a little bit better, 706 00:45:03,367 --> 00:45:05,452 and maybe it's because he's just so popular. 707 00:45:05,452 --> 00:45:06,829 BOY: In comics, is it usually 708 00:45:06,829 --> 00:45:10,040 the big, strong, and ugly characters that are most successful? 709 00:45:11,041 --> 00:45:12,418 No. You know what it is? 710 00:45:12,418 --> 00:45:15,838 It's the ones that are the most interesting 711 00:45:15,838 --> 00:45:19,383 and the ones that the readers of comics can most relate to. 712 00:45:19,383 --> 00:45:23,011 It doesn't matter if the character is ugly, or is handsome, 713 00:45:23,011 --> 00:45:25,472 or is weak, or is strong. 714 00:45:25,472 --> 00:45:29,393 If there's something about the character that makes you like the character 715 00:45:29,393 --> 00:45:31,645 and care about the character, 716 00:45:31,645 --> 00:45:35,232 the word for that is, you have to empathize with the character. 717 00:45:36,692 --> 00:45:40,821 Why do there have to be superheroes and what makes a good one? 718 00:45:40,821 --> 00:45:44,158 What ingredients does it take to have like a Spider-Man or a Superman? 719 00:45:44,158 --> 00:45:45,826 The one important thing is empathy. 720 00:45:45,826 --> 00:45:48,662 It has to be a superhero the reader cares about. 721 00:45:48,662 --> 00:45:51,373 One thing we've tried to do at Marvel, 722 00:45:51,373 --> 00:45:55,878 we have tried to have superheroes that are more realistic, 723 00:45:55,878 --> 00:45:57,171 more flesh and blood 724 00:45:57,171 --> 00:46:01,133 and it prepares the young reader for the fact that 725 00:46:01,133 --> 00:46:03,969 - when he gets out into the world... - MAN: To climb walls. 726 00:46:03,969 --> 00:46:07,765 ...he realizes that he doesn't expect his heroes to be perfect. 727 00:46:09,975 --> 00:46:13,103 There was a time when Spider-Man received a check 728 00:46:13,103 --> 00:46:16,815 as a reward for something he had done, made out to Spider-Man 729 00:46:16,815 --> 00:46:20,277 and he went to a bank to cash it in his Spider-Man costume 730 00:46:20,277 --> 00:46:23,363 and the teller said, "Well, I can't cash this check, 731 00:46:23,363 --> 00:46:25,324 -"I need identification." - (WOMAN LAUGHS) 732 00:46:25,324 --> 00:46:27,743 And he said, "Oh, I'm wearing a Spider-Man costume." 733 00:46:27,743 --> 00:46:30,204 He said, "Anybody could wear a Spider-Man costume." 734 00:46:32,414 --> 00:46:34,583 He was never able to cash the check. 735 00:46:37,211 --> 00:46:42,257 I wanted those books, more than anything else, to be fun. 736 00:46:42,257 --> 00:46:46,678 And I wanted everything in them to attract the readers' attention 737 00:46:46,678 --> 00:46:49,431 and to cause the readers to talk. 738 00:46:50,224 --> 00:46:51,767 And I wanted to do whatever I could 739 00:46:51,767 --> 00:46:55,854 to set our books aside and apart from the rest. 740 00:46:56,605 --> 00:46:58,106 I was just having fun. 741 00:46:58,106 --> 00:47:00,234 Anything I thought of I said, "That's a good idea. 742 00:47:00,234 --> 00:47:03,111 "I'm gonna write, 'The world's greatest comic.' What the hell." 743 00:47:03,904 --> 00:47:08,367 INTERVIEWER: You describe what you call the wild wondrous world of Marvel Comics. 744 00:47:08,367 --> 00:47:10,077 What kind of world is it? 745 00:47:10,077 --> 00:47:14,748 Basically, we think of Marvel Comics as fairy tales for older people. 746 00:47:14,748 --> 00:47:19,294 Actually, I think what we do mostly is improve on the old legends, you see. 747 00:47:19,294 --> 00:47:22,297 We take the best of them and give it a little Marvel touch 748 00:47:22,297 --> 00:47:24,883 and we've got something really indescribable. 749 00:47:29,179 --> 00:47:33,267 Jack and I had already done The Hulk and The Fantastic Four. 750 00:47:33,267 --> 00:47:37,813 And I felt, what can we do to top these other characters? 751 00:47:37,813 --> 00:47:41,233 And it occurred to me, we hadn't done a god. 752 00:47:41,859 --> 00:47:46,071 Most people had read all about the Greek gods and the Roman gods 753 00:47:46,071 --> 00:47:50,742 but the Norse Gods weren't as well known. So I figured 754 00:47:50,742 --> 00:47:52,786 why not do the Norse Gods? 755 00:47:52,786 --> 00:47:55,914 And I thought Thor was the most dramatic of all 756 00:47:55,914 --> 00:48:00,335 'cause he had that magic hammer, and he was the most powerful one. 757 00:48:00,335 --> 00:48:03,297 And he was the God of Thunder. 758 00:48:07,718 --> 00:48:09,887 I thought it would just be another book, 759 00:48:09,887 --> 00:48:13,181 and I think that Jack has turned him into one of the greatest 760 00:48:13,849 --> 00:48:16,602 fictional characters there are. 761 00:48:16,935 --> 00:48:19,938 {\an8}KIRBY: All through the years, certainly, I've had a kind of affection 762 00:48:19,938 --> 00:48:22,649 {\an8}for any mythological type of character, 763 00:48:22,649 --> 00:48:25,110 and here Stan gave me the opportunity to draw one 764 00:48:25,110 --> 00:48:28,447 and I wasn't gonna draw back from really letting myself go. 765 00:48:28,447 --> 00:48:32,242 So I did. And the world became a stage for me. 766 00:48:32,242 --> 00:48:34,453 I gave the Norse characters twists 767 00:48:34,453 --> 00:48:37,497 that they never had in anybody's imagination, 768 00:48:37,956 --> 00:48:40,417 and somehow it turned out to be a lot of fun 769 00:48:40,417 --> 00:48:42,294 and I really enjoyed doing it. 770 00:48:47,341 --> 00:48:50,802 It occurred to us that what we do is we create our own mythology, 771 00:48:50,802 --> 00:48:52,721 and we create our own universes. 772 00:48:53,764 --> 00:48:57,851 {\an8}One thing I think that we've innovated that has been pretty successful 773 00:48:57,851 --> 00:49:00,854 {\an8}is overlapping characters and books. 774 00:49:01,355 --> 00:49:04,900 It's like a repertory theatre, where you've got your actors 775 00:49:04,900 --> 00:49:08,695 and you know what they can do, and you can use them as needed. 776 00:49:09,071 --> 00:49:13,575 {\an8}Once we have our cast of characters, whether heroes or villains, 777 00:49:13,575 --> 00:49:16,161 {\an8}it makes it easier for us to base stories, 778 00:49:16,453 --> 00:49:18,580 but we do it because it seems to me that 779 00:49:19,206 --> 00:49:21,625 you enjoy things you're familiar with, 780 00:49:21,625 --> 00:49:24,878 and the readers eventually get to know these characters, 781 00:49:24,878 --> 00:49:28,882 and they're interested in these characters and why just get rid of them? 782 00:49:28,882 --> 00:49:32,302 If we have a villain who fought the Fantastic Four, 783 00:49:32,302 --> 00:49:35,430 why shouldn't he eventually meet another one of our heroes? 784 00:49:35,430 --> 00:49:38,517 Or why shouldn't our heroes meet, as they often do, 785 00:49:38,517 --> 00:49:40,268 and guest star in each other's book? 786 00:49:40,268 --> 00:49:44,356 Because, according to the gospel as preached by Marvel, 787 00:49:44,356 --> 00:49:46,108 they all live in the same world. 788 00:49:52,406 --> 00:49:55,659 MAN ON RADIO: ...the US has added up to $3 billion and 14,000 men... 789 00:49:55,659 --> 00:49:56,743 (RADIO STATIONS SWITCHING) 790 00:49:56,743 --> 00:49:58,912 America's involvement grows deeper and more dangerous. 791 00:49:58,912 --> 00:50:01,206 STAN: We were very much affected at Marvel 792 00:50:01,206 --> 00:50:04,042 by what was going on in the world around us, 793 00:50:04,668 --> 00:50:08,005 and in Vietnam and what was going on at this time. 794 00:50:09,256 --> 00:50:12,718 I think it's a not only indefensible war, I think it's a ridiculous war. 795 00:50:12,718 --> 00:50:15,762 I agree with the word you used, I think it's an obscene war. 796 00:50:16,847 --> 00:50:20,934 {\an8}Everybody was against the war. The kids in those days hated it. 797 00:50:20,934 --> 00:50:22,894 {\an8}(INDISTINCT SHOUTING) 798 00:50:32,821 --> 00:50:35,240 We have a character called Iron Man. 799 00:50:36,408 --> 00:50:40,037 He's a guy in a big metal suit and he's very powerful 800 00:50:40,037 --> 00:50:42,914 and he has little jets on the bottom of the soles, 801 00:50:42,914 --> 00:50:44,624 which enable him to fly, 802 00:50:44,624 --> 00:50:47,961 and he was supplying weapons to the United States Army 803 00:50:47,961 --> 00:50:49,880 for the Vietnamese war and so forth. 804 00:50:51,882 --> 00:50:55,260 So, how do you make somebody really care about a guy like this? 805 00:50:57,888 --> 00:50:59,890 We made him lovable. 806 00:50:59,890 --> 00:51:03,310 He has a weak heart and he's been injured in battle, 807 00:51:03,310 --> 00:51:05,479 and he really is a good guy. 808 00:51:06,938 --> 00:51:10,734 Our heroes have all sorts of failings and fallacies. 809 00:51:10,734 --> 00:51:14,905 {\an8}They might lose just as often as win if they're fighting with a villain. 810 00:51:15,489 --> 00:51:19,493 And our villains are really adorable. They go right to your hearts. 811 00:51:20,827 --> 00:51:27,042 We learned the villains are usually at least as popular as the heroes are. 812 00:51:27,042 --> 00:51:28,627 They have a great appeal. 813 00:51:29,294 --> 00:51:32,589 We try to give them understandable qualities 814 00:51:32,589 --> 00:51:35,008 and reasons why they are the way they are. 815 00:51:35,008 --> 00:51:37,969 We've even had villains who reformed and became heroes. 816 00:51:37,969 --> 00:51:40,972 After a while, we don't know who the heroes and who the villains are. 817 00:51:40,972 --> 00:51:42,516 There's such a fine line. 818 00:51:45,769 --> 00:51:47,312 And that's the real world. 819 00:51:48,230 --> 00:51:50,899 Things aren't just black and white. 820 00:51:58,115 --> 00:52:02,119 What's happening in comics today? They've grabbed an older readership. 821 00:52:02,119 --> 00:52:05,580 - Yeah! - At Marvel, we have as many college kids 822 00:52:05,580 --> 00:52:07,916 reading our books as we have seven-year-olds. 823 00:52:07,916 --> 00:52:10,752 I rarely hold up books, but this is an interesting book... 824 00:52:10,752 --> 00:52:12,629 - It is. - Well, let him tell about it. 825 00:52:12,629 --> 00:52:14,381 He's a collector who is impartial. 826 00:52:14,381 --> 00:52:17,926 {\an8}I think that anybody, and I say this, 827 00:52:17,926 --> 00:52:20,679 {\an8}anybody could get into that book and get something out of it 828 00:52:20,679 --> 00:52:22,806 and learn something from it. It is a novel 829 00:52:22,806 --> 00:52:24,891 or a Cecil B. DeMille movie or anything else, 830 00:52:24,891 --> 00:52:26,726 only it's done with still pictures. 831 00:52:26,726 --> 00:52:30,063 Why do you say he has to learn? Can't he be entertained by what he reads? 832 00:52:30,063 --> 00:52:32,315 Does he have to read it like a school book? 833 00:52:32,315 --> 00:52:35,026 Can't you be educated and entertained at the same time? 834 00:52:35,026 --> 00:52:38,071 {\an8}We found our readers want to be entertained. 835 00:52:38,071 --> 00:52:41,032 {\an8}They want to lose themselves. They don't wanna be educated. 836 00:52:41,032 --> 00:52:42,742 {\an8}They don't want anything relevant. 837 00:52:42,742 --> 00:52:46,621 I would not recommend Superman or Batman to anyone over 12. 838 00:52:46,621 --> 00:52:47,914 They're nice for kids. 839 00:52:47,914 --> 00:52:52,127 Adults have come to believe there's nothing of value in comics for them, 840 00:52:52,127 --> 00:52:54,045 and there is something of value. 841 00:52:54,045 --> 00:52:56,756 You cannot condemn a medium on the basis of its format. 842 00:52:57,757 --> 00:53:02,345 STAN: The more I realized how influential our books were, 843 00:53:02,345 --> 00:53:06,808 the more I tried to get some moral lessons in the stories. 844 00:53:11,771 --> 00:53:15,901 I don't want to sound like I'm the most moral guy in the world, 845 00:53:15,901 --> 00:53:20,071 but I always felt there were some issues that ought to be addressed. 846 00:53:24,868 --> 00:53:28,496 {\an8}One of the things that is terrible is the fact that 847 00:53:28,496 --> 00:53:31,750 {\an8}so many people dislike 848 00:53:31,750 --> 00:53:34,461 {\an8}and hate other people 849 00:53:34,461 --> 00:53:36,421 {\an8}just because they're different. 850 00:53:39,257 --> 00:53:42,427 I did one story called "The Hate Monger," 851 00:53:42,969 --> 00:53:46,348 {\an8}and it was really a takeoff on the Ku Klux Klan. 852 00:53:47,599 --> 00:53:51,353 {\an8}It had to do with a villain who espoused hatred 853 00:53:51,353 --> 00:53:53,688 of one group of people for another. 854 00:53:55,232 --> 00:53:58,485 I sort of hoped it would give our readers 855 00:53:58,485 --> 00:54:02,656 the idea that all people should be treated the same. 856 00:54:03,823 --> 00:54:08,453 We tried to get that point across in all of the Marvel books. 857 00:54:16,628 --> 00:54:19,297 I wanted to do another superhero group, 858 00:54:20,006 --> 00:54:24,177 and I tried an anti-bigotry theme. 859 00:54:25,053 --> 00:54:28,723 And I thought, how can I give them some power in a different way? 860 00:54:28,723 --> 00:54:34,104 And then it occurred to me. We know that mutations exist in life. 861 00:54:34,729 --> 00:54:38,191 There are five-legged frogs and things like that. 862 00:54:38,316 --> 00:54:43,071 So I'll just give them whatever powers I want and say they mutated that way. 863 00:54:43,488 --> 00:54:45,615 I called them the X-Men. 864 00:54:45,615 --> 00:54:49,703 And our heroes of the X-Men are all different from average humans, 865 00:54:49,703 --> 00:54:55,083 and because they're that different, the general public hates them, 866 00:54:55,083 --> 00:54:59,546 hounds them, harasses them, fears them. 867 00:55:01,840 --> 00:55:06,136 In all of our books, we try to find some little moral 868 00:55:06,136 --> 00:55:08,138 besides running around and fighting. 869 00:55:08,847 --> 00:55:11,266 We have one character called the Silver Surfer. 870 00:55:11,266 --> 00:55:13,727 He's a character from another planet who comes to Earth. 871 00:55:14,269 --> 00:55:16,187 {\an8}Jack is the guy who first drew him. 872 00:55:18,606 --> 00:55:21,067 The Silver Surfer was always philosophizing 873 00:55:21,067 --> 00:55:23,945 and saying things about humans, such as, 874 00:55:23,945 --> 00:55:28,408 "Don't they realize they live in a planet that's a veritable garden of Eden? 875 00:55:28,408 --> 00:55:30,994 "Why do they fight and why are they greedy? 876 00:55:30,994 --> 00:55:32,620 "And why do they have bigotry? 877 00:55:32,620 --> 00:55:34,372 "Why don't they just love each other 878 00:55:34,372 --> 00:55:37,375 "and enjoy this paradise that they've inherited?" 879 00:55:38,293 --> 00:55:42,130 I believe that the world could be a much better world 880 00:55:42,130 --> 00:55:43,715 if we treated each other 881 00:55:43,715 --> 00:55:46,384 with a little more consideration and respect. 882 00:55:47,218 --> 00:55:50,555 If you really want to change things and make 'em better, 883 00:55:50,555 --> 00:55:54,184 you've gotta plunge in. You've gotta be a part of the process. 884 00:55:56,061 --> 00:55:58,897 "With great power comes great responsibility." 885 00:56:03,985 --> 00:56:06,905 I created Black Panther with Jack Kirby. 886 00:56:07,906 --> 00:56:12,243 We just figured that it's about time we had a Black superhero. 887 00:56:13,703 --> 00:56:18,208 After all, there are many, many Black American citizens. 888 00:56:20,627 --> 00:56:26,091 I loved the idea of a Black superhero who lives in Africa 889 00:56:27,592 --> 00:56:31,638 and is the equal of Reed Richards intellectually. 890 00:56:34,516 --> 00:56:37,352 {\an8}FAN: The reason I called is to compliment Marvel Comics 891 00:56:37,477 --> 00:56:41,106 {\an8}because they are the only comic books I've ever seen that have integrated. 892 00:56:41,106 --> 00:56:44,401 {\an8}They recognize the fact that there are more than one race. 893 00:56:44,401 --> 00:56:48,196 STAN: How can you have stories that are supposed to take place in today's world 894 00:56:48,196 --> 00:56:50,990 and not include all the types of people we have 895 00:56:50,990 --> 00:56:53,243 - and the types of situations? - FAN: Yeah, that's just it. 896 00:56:53,243 --> 00:56:55,954 You have a racially mixed background in it. 897 00:56:55,954 --> 00:56:58,581 Well, it's unusual for comics because you haven't seen it 898 00:56:58,581 --> 00:57:00,500 until you've read Marvel Comics. 899 00:57:09,551 --> 00:57:13,179 STAN: We tried to provide stories for older readers 900 00:57:13,179 --> 00:57:17,434 that will also be good for younger kids to read. 901 00:57:17,434 --> 00:57:21,020 If you think about it objectively, it's a totally impossible task, 902 00:57:21,020 --> 00:57:22,856 and I don't know how we've managed. 903 00:57:25,150 --> 00:57:29,904 I got a letter from the Office of Health, Education, and Welfare in Washington, 904 00:57:29,904 --> 00:57:34,367 and they said, "Mr. Lee, recognizing the influence of your comics, 905 00:57:34,367 --> 00:57:38,204 "drugs are a big problem. If you could do an anti-drug story?" 906 00:57:38,204 --> 00:57:40,665 I did a three-issue series. 907 00:57:42,500 --> 00:57:46,296 It had to do with a friend of Spidey's had taken too much of something 908 00:57:46,838 --> 00:57:50,800 and Spider-Man rescues him and says, "You're a jerk for doing that." 909 00:57:50,800 --> 00:57:52,886 And it was part of a bigger story. 910 00:57:53,678 --> 00:57:58,433 So, it didn't look like we were preaching. It was just an incident in a story. 911 00:57:58,683 --> 00:58:02,020 The Comic Code Administration sent the book back and said, 912 00:58:02,020 --> 00:58:05,815 "You can't publish this book. We won't put our seal of approval on." 913 00:58:06,608 --> 00:58:07,609 I said, "Why?" 914 00:58:07,901 --> 00:58:11,362 They said, "Well, according to the rules of the Code Authority, 915 00:58:11,362 --> 00:58:13,823 "you can't mention drugs in a story." 916 00:58:14,908 --> 00:58:17,702 And I said, "Look, we're not telling kids to take drugs. 917 00:58:17,702 --> 00:58:20,288 "This is an anti-drug theme." 918 00:58:20,288 --> 00:58:22,790 "Oh, no, it doesn't matter. You mentioned drugs." 919 00:58:23,333 --> 00:58:26,586 I said, "But the Office of Health, Education and Welfare, 920 00:58:26,586 --> 00:58:29,714 "a government agency, asked us to do it." 921 00:58:29,714 --> 00:58:32,342 "Doesn't matter. You can't mention drugs." 922 00:58:34,427 --> 00:58:37,722 Because we try to show things as they really are, 923 00:58:37,722 --> 00:58:40,808 I had quite a number of arguments with the Comics Code. 924 00:58:41,976 --> 00:58:46,105 I think that the things that people read should prepare them 925 00:58:46,105 --> 00:58:49,484 and initiate them for stepping into the real world. 926 00:58:49,484 --> 00:58:55,990 I feel that morally we are doing a greater service to our younger readers 927 00:58:55,990 --> 00:59:00,954 by showing them that it's best to do your best and to try to be good. 928 00:59:03,206 --> 00:59:06,876 I went to my publisher, Martin Goodman, and I said, 929 00:59:06,876 --> 00:59:09,879 "Martin, this is the story. This is why I did it. 930 00:59:10,421 --> 00:59:14,926 "I would like to publish it without the Code seal of approval." 931 00:59:16,052 --> 00:59:19,931 Well, I was very proud of our publisher because he said, 932 00:59:20,223 --> 00:59:22,934 "Absolutely, Stan. You go ahead and do that." 933 00:59:24,978 --> 00:59:30,358 So, all of those three issues went on sale without the seal of approval. 934 00:59:31,234 --> 00:59:34,237 And the world did not come to an end. 935 00:59:35,947 --> 00:59:38,283 {\an8}We got letters from church groups, 936 00:59:38,449 --> 00:59:40,827 parent-teachers... Everybody loved it. 937 00:59:44,414 --> 00:59:47,709 (CHATTERING INDISTINCTLY) 938 00:59:47,709 --> 00:59:50,211 A youngster's mind is like a sponge. 939 00:59:50,336 --> 00:59:52,714 And I really don't think there's anything 940 00:59:53,464 --> 00:59:54,507 that's too tough 941 00:59:55,383 --> 00:59:58,052 or too mature for a youngster to comprehend. 942 00:59:58,052 --> 01:00:01,764 I think they can understand so much more than we give them credit for, 943 01:00:01,764 --> 01:00:04,892 and they're capable of absorbing and learning so quickly. 944 01:00:04,892 --> 01:00:08,730 Most of them don't have the opportunity. It isn't thrown at them enough. 945 01:00:10,231 --> 01:00:12,233 You know, when we started Marvel Comics, 946 01:00:12,358 --> 01:00:15,445 I said, "Let's use a college level vocabulary," 947 01:00:15,445 --> 01:00:17,697 and everybody said, "Stan, you're out of your mind." 948 01:00:17,697 --> 01:00:21,534 I said, "Really?" I figured the kids would know... 949 01:00:21,534 --> 01:00:23,620 what the words meant by their use in the sentence 950 01:00:23,620 --> 01:00:26,122 or if they had to go to a dictionary and look up a word 951 01:00:26,122 --> 01:00:28,374 {\an8}it wasn't the worst thing in the world that would happen... 952 01:00:28,374 --> 01:00:30,793 {\an8}Maybe the older readers would appreciate it. 953 01:00:31,127 --> 01:00:34,964 So, strangely enough, in our little idiot Marvel Comics, 954 01:00:34,964 --> 01:00:39,510 I think there is as much or more learning for kids as you'll find anywhere else. 955 01:00:41,095 --> 01:00:45,683 I've walked pretty far for a comic on occasions, a few miles out of the way, 956 01:00:45,808 --> 01:00:48,853 just to get it a day early, which may seem a little silly, 957 01:00:49,562 --> 01:00:52,148 but some of us fans are weird. 958 01:00:56,736 --> 01:01:00,281 STAN: This is it. The second annual Mighty Marvel Convention. 959 01:01:00,281 --> 01:01:03,326 This is Stan Lee talking, and you are there. 960 01:01:03,326 --> 01:01:07,163 Now, I'll shut up and give you a chance to see what was happening. 961 01:01:07,163 --> 01:01:11,125 We start off with me signing autographs after making a speech. Here we go. 962 01:01:11,793 --> 01:01:14,379 Wherever I went, people would feel they knew me 963 01:01:14,379 --> 01:01:16,422 'cause they had been reading the books. 964 01:01:16,422 --> 01:01:21,594 Everyone said, "Hi, Stan." There was a warmth and a friendliness. 965 01:01:21,594 --> 01:01:25,098 I got a few votes in the last presidential election at some colleges. 966 01:01:25,098 --> 01:01:28,101 It was funny, you know. Some kids gave some write-in votes. 967 01:01:28,101 --> 01:01:29,644 I think I got 23 votes. 968 01:01:29,644 --> 01:01:31,979 It wasn't quite enough to carry the nation. 969 01:01:32,397 --> 01:01:33,981 What's your favorite character? 970 01:01:34,607 --> 01:01:36,567 Ben Grimm. The Thing. 971 01:01:36,567 --> 01:01:37,985 - Right! - And why is that? 972 01:01:38,736 --> 01:01:42,782 I don't know. It's just his personality and like, you know, what happened to him. 973 01:01:42,782 --> 01:01:44,909 He was turned into a monster and it wasn't his fault. 974 01:01:44,909 --> 01:01:46,744 The Falcon, Avengers. 975 01:01:46,744 --> 01:01:48,246 - The Falcon? - Yeah. 976 01:01:48,246 --> 01:01:49,872 - Iron Man. - How come? 977 01:01:49,872 --> 01:01:53,167 Because I just like what he does. I think he's a great character. 978 01:01:53,167 --> 01:01:57,755 I like the stories that they write about him and all the inventions. 979 01:01:57,755 --> 01:01:59,507 Who's your favorite writer? 980 01:02:00,133 --> 01:02:01,300 Uh, Stan Lee. 981 01:02:02,301 --> 01:02:06,055 {\an8}RADIO HOST: This is K100 conversations, and I have with me a wacky person 982 01:02:06,055 --> 01:02:07,849 {\an8}by the name of Stan Lee. 983 01:02:07,849 --> 01:02:10,685 {\an8}And anybody who is into comics knows that name, 984 01:02:10,685 --> 01:02:14,230 because you are the guy that really created Marvel Comics, aren't you? 985 01:02:14,230 --> 01:02:16,899 STAN: Yeah, well, after a while, when you become a living legend, 986 01:02:16,899 --> 01:02:21,946 they get to know your name. I created Marvel Comics with the help 987 01:02:21,946 --> 01:02:24,824 of the various artists involved also, of course. 988 01:02:28,870 --> 01:02:33,583 It's funny how every artist has one little thing that's sort of a hang-up, 989 01:02:33,583 --> 01:02:35,877 and he has trouble fixing it. 990 01:02:35,877 --> 01:02:39,046 Jack has a way of drawing tremendously thin ankles 991 01:02:39,046 --> 01:02:40,965 on men and women. 992 01:02:41,841 --> 01:02:43,301 I've always got to watch what I say, 993 01:02:43,301 --> 01:02:45,595 because our artists are not only the most talented 994 01:02:45,595 --> 01:02:49,015 but certainly, the most temperamental group in the world, 995 01:02:49,015 --> 01:02:52,810 and we'd be absolutely lost without any single one of them. 996 01:02:52,810 --> 01:02:56,814 {\an8}But I'm sure I'm gonna catch hell for saying anything to offend any of 'em. 997 01:02:56,814 --> 01:02:59,901 {\an8}INTERVIEWER: Could you tell us a little more about Steve 998 01:02:59,901 --> 01:03:02,195 because I noticed that he is one of the few people 999 01:03:02,195 --> 01:03:04,280 that you did not print a photograph of 1000 01:03:04,280 --> 01:03:06,282 in your first Marvel Annual 1001 01:03:06,282 --> 01:03:09,660 and he is not on the record that you sent around. 1002 01:03:09,827 --> 01:03:11,579 - STAN: You want to know why? - Yes. 1003 01:03:11,579 --> 01:03:14,415 STAN: Purely personal. Steve does not want publicity. 1004 01:03:14,582 --> 01:03:16,042 I don't know what his reason is. 1005 01:03:16,042 --> 01:03:18,961 He says, "Oh, golly! I want my work to speak for me." 1006 01:03:18,961 --> 01:03:20,296 I'm not quoting him exactly, 1007 01:03:20,296 --> 01:03:22,465 but the feeling I get is that he doesn't feel 1008 01:03:22,465 --> 01:03:25,843 that he himself should be publicized. He just wants the work 1009 01:03:25,843 --> 01:03:28,554 that he does to be well known, and we respect his opinion. 1010 01:03:31,265 --> 01:03:34,143 {\an8}Steve had complained to me a number of times, 1011 01:03:34,894 --> 01:03:38,314 {\an8}when there were articles written about Spider-Man, 1012 01:03:38,314 --> 01:03:40,900 which called me the creator of Spider-Man, 1013 01:03:41,818 --> 01:03:45,947 and I had always thought I was, because I'm the guy who said, 1014 01:03:45,947 --> 01:03:50,827 I have an idea for a strip called Spider-Man and so forth. 1015 01:03:52,870 --> 01:03:56,624 Steve had said having an idea is nothing 1016 01:03:57,166 --> 01:04:02,630 {\an8}because until it becomes a physical thing, it's just an idea, 1017 01:04:02,755 --> 01:04:08,511 and he said it took him to draw the strip and to give it life, so to speak, 1018 01:04:08,511 --> 01:04:10,930 or to make it something tangible. 1019 01:04:11,639 --> 01:04:14,308 Otherwise, all I had was an idea. 1020 01:04:14,433 --> 01:04:15,434 So, I said to him, 1021 01:04:15,434 --> 01:04:19,856 "Well, I think the person with the idea is the person who creates it," 1022 01:04:20,022 --> 01:04:22,024 And he said, "No, because I drew it." 1023 01:04:29,824 --> 01:04:33,578 In the very beginning, I would come up with a rather detailed plot. 1024 01:04:34,120 --> 01:04:35,788 Tell Steve what it was. 1025 01:04:36,372 --> 01:04:40,001 He would draw the strip any way he wanted. I didn't give him a complete script. 1026 01:04:40,001 --> 01:04:43,212 He'd add a lot of things that I hadn't even thought of. 1027 01:04:43,212 --> 01:04:45,464 And then, I would get the pages of artwork, 1028 01:04:45,464 --> 01:04:48,926 and I would put in the dialogue trying to give everything 1029 01:04:48,926 --> 01:04:52,346 and everyone the personality that I wanted them to have. 1030 01:04:53,723 --> 01:04:57,643 Steve is a very creative guy. And the two of us, 1031 01:04:57,643 --> 01:05:00,187 whenever we discuss plots, we always just argue 1032 01:05:00,187 --> 01:05:03,274 because I want to do it one way and he wants to do it another. 1033 01:05:03,274 --> 01:05:05,526 And even though I may disagree, 1034 01:05:05,526 --> 01:05:09,071 I feel just the fact that he did it differently will make it good 1035 01:05:09,071 --> 01:05:12,658 because it won't be the usual type of plot coming out of our stable. 1036 01:05:12,658 --> 01:05:16,996 He'll just do them as he wants them, which makes it twice as difficult for me. 1037 01:05:17,788 --> 01:05:20,291 I enjoy it, though. I get a story back from him, 1038 01:05:20,291 --> 01:05:23,044 and I don't have the vaguest idea what this is about 1039 01:05:23,044 --> 01:05:25,796 because I didn't even give him a thumbnail idea. 1040 01:05:25,796 --> 01:05:28,341 He just went home, and he did whatever he wanted. 1041 01:05:30,051 --> 01:05:33,137 {\an8}So, I said, "Fine, I'll tell everybody you're the co-creator." 1042 01:05:34,347 --> 01:05:36,098 {\an8}That didn't quite satisfy him. 1043 01:05:39,727 --> 01:05:43,564 {\an8}I really think the guy who dreams the thing up created it. 1044 01:05:43,564 --> 01:05:46,776 You dream it up, and then you give it to anybody to draw it. 1045 01:05:51,989 --> 01:05:54,283 STAN: We've just lost the artist Steve Ditko 1046 01:05:54,283 --> 01:05:56,535 - MAN: Horrible. - (PEOPLE GROANING) 1047 01:05:57,078 --> 01:05:59,789 STAN: One day he just phoned and he said, "I'm leaving." 1048 01:06:00,873 --> 01:06:02,041 So that was it. 1049 01:06:03,000 --> 01:06:04,460 He was such a popular artist. 1050 01:06:05,419 --> 01:06:09,090 I think that we've managed to find people to replace him 1051 01:06:09,090 --> 01:06:12,677 where those boos will change to a chorus of cheers. 1052 01:06:16,681 --> 01:06:20,017 Steve and I worked beautifully together. 1053 01:06:21,185 --> 01:06:25,356 As far as I was concerned, he was the perfect collaborator. 1054 01:06:26,148 --> 01:06:28,109 His artwork was superb. 1055 01:06:28,609 --> 01:06:31,404 His story sense was brilliant. 1056 01:06:33,030 --> 01:06:36,701 I was heartbroken when Steve finally stopped working with us. 1057 01:06:47,336 --> 01:06:50,297 INTERVIEWER: You've put out more comics, I think than about anyone. 1058 01:06:50,297 --> 01:06:51,549 Yeah, we're the biggest. 1059 01:06:51,549 --> 01:06:53,426 Isn't there a problem of control? 1060 01:06:53,718 --> 01:06:56,012 STAN: It's one of our biggest problems. You're right. 1061 01:06:56,012 --> 01:06:59,181 I would love nothing better than to be doing one magazine, 1062 01:06:59,181 --> 01:07:01,183 which I could personally write and edit 1063 01:07:01,183 --> 01:07:04,979 and, unfortunately, we're a little bit like a mass production outfit. 1064 01:07:04,979 --> 01:07:07,064 I think we're all frustrated. 1065 01:07:07,064 --> 01:07:10,234 We'd all like to be able to spend a week on one story. 1066 01:07:10,234 --> 01:07:14,405 Unfortunately, because of the economics of this business, it's totally impossible. 1067 01:07:17,658 --> 01:07:20,786 We produce about two complete comic books a day. 1068 01:07:20,786 --> 01:07:22,371 It's like a production line. 1069 01:07:22,371 --> 01:07:26,459 If you ever saw the old Charlie Chaplin movie Modern Times, 1070 01:07:26,459 --> 01:07:29,253 there was a scene where Charlie Chaplin is on a production line 1071 01:07:29,253 --> 01:07:31,464 and his job is to do this with two wrenches 1072 01:07:31,464 --> 01:07:34,675 while things come down and he has to tighten the bolts 1073 01:07:34,675 --> 01:07:37,762 and he goes home at night and he's still doing this, you know. 1074 01:07:37,762 --> 01:07:41,599 Well, sometimes we feel like that. We don't even know what we're working on. 1075 01:07:41,599 --> 01:07:43,392 The pages are just coming by and... 1076 01:07:43,392 --> 01:07:45,352 "Proofread that. Change that title, 1077 01:07:45,352 --> 01:07:47,104 "get the lettering out and finish." 1078 01:07:47,104 --> 01:07:48,564 And off it goes. Two books a day. 1079 01:07:50,399 --> 01:07:53,110 In those days, everybody was just busy doing his work. 1080 01:07:53,694 --> 01:07:56,697 There was a lot of pressure to turn those things out in time. 1081 01:07:57,406 --> 01:08:00,618 Because of the fact that they don't get paid very much per page 1082 01:08:00,618 --> 01:08:04,455 and that they have to do a lot of pages a day in order to eke out a living, 1083 01:08:04,455 --> 01:08:06,624 the artists would say that they don't have a chance 1084 01:08:06,624 --> 01:08:08,375 to really show how good they are. 1085 01:08:11,253 --> 01:08:13,380 Sometime around then, Kirby left. 1086 01:08:34,944 --> 01:08:36,946 {\an8}RADIO HOST: We're speaking with Jack Kirby live. 1087 01:08:36,946 --> 01:08:41,325 {\an8}And now we can announce the very special surprise guest, 1088 01:08:41,325 --> 01:08:44,036 {\an8}your colleague, Stan Lee. 1089 01:08:44,036 --> 01:08:46,038 {\an8}STAN: I wanna wish Jack a happy birthday. 1090 01:08:46,038 --> 01:08:48,791 KIRBY: Well, Stanley, I want to thank you for calling and I hope 1091 01:08:48,791 --> 01:08:51,877 you're in good health and I hope you stay in good health. 1092 01:08:51,877 --> 01:08:54,296 STAN: I'm doing my best and the same to you. 1093 01:08:54,296 --> 01:08:56,006 You know, whatever we did together, 1094 01:08:56,006 --> 01:08:58,926 and no matter who did what, and I guess that's something 1095 01:08:58,926 --> 01:09:00,761 that'll be argued forever. 1096 01:09:00,761 --> 01:09:03,848 But I think that the product that was produced 1097 01:09:03,848 --> 01:09:07,268 was really even more than a sum of its parts. 1098 01:09:07,268 --> 01:09:11,730 I think there was some slight magic that came into effect, 1099 01:09:11,730 --> 01:09:13,315 when we worked together. 1100 01:09:13,315 --> 01:09:16,235 KIRBY: Well, I was never sorry for it, Stanley. 1101 01:09:16,235 --> 01:09:18,571 It was a great experience for me. 1102 01:09:18,571 --> 01:09:22,199 If the product was good, that was my satisfaction. 1103 01:09:22,324 --> 01:09:24,243 RADIO HOST: You know, when it comes right down to it, 1104 01:09:24,243 --> 01:09:27,246 it doesn't matter who exactly did what. 1105 01:09:27,246 --> 01:09:28,914 STAN: Well, I'll say this. 1106 01:09:28,914 --> 01:09:31,917 Every word of dialogue in those scripts was mine. 1107 01:09:32,918 --> 01:09:35,254 RADIO HOST: Well, I don't want... STAN: Every story. 1108 01:09:35,254 --> 01:09:38,966 RADIO HOST: I don't want to get into controversy about that. What I want to... 1109 01:09:38,966 --> 01:09:41,218 KIRBY: I can tell you that I wrote a few lines myself 1110 01:09:41,218 --> 01:09:44,555 - above every panel that I... - RADIO HOST: Yes, I've seen those. 1111 01:09:44,555 --> 01:09:47,391 STAN: They weren't printed in the book. RADIO HOST: Look. 1112 01:09:47,391 --> 01:09:49,852 STAN: Jack, answer me truthfully. KIRBY: I wasn't allowed to... 1113 01:09:49,852 --> 01:09:52,938 STAN: Did you ever read one of the stories after it was finished? 1114 01:09:52,938 --> 01:09:54,315 I don't think you did. 1115 01:09:54,315 --> 01:09:56,692 I don't think you ever read one of my stories. 1116 01:09:56,692 --> 01:09:58,944 I think you were always busy drawing the next one. 1117 01:09:58,944 --> 01:10:00,863 You never read when it was finished. 1118 01:10:00,863 --> 01:10:04,074 KIRBY: Whatever was written in 'em wasn't... 1119 01:10:04,074 --> 01:10:08,871 Well, look, it was the action I was interested in. 1120 01:10:08,871 --> 01:10:11,540 I know, and I think you felt, "Well, it doesn't matter. 1121 01:10:11,540 --> 01:10:14,585 "Anybody can put the dialogue in, it's what I'm drawing that matters." 1122 01:10:14,585 --> 01:10:17,421 And maybe you're right. I don't agree with it. 1123 01:10:17,421 --> 01:10:21,717 No. I'm only trying to say that one man and his writing and drawing, 1124 01:10:21,717 --> 01:10:24,720 and doing a strip, it should come from an individual. 1125 01:10:24,720 --> 01:10:27,097 I believe that you should have the opportunity, 1126 01:10:27,097 --> 01:10:29,183 uh, to do the entire thing yourself. 1127 01:10:29,183 --> 01:10:32,603 RADIO HOST: The success of Marvel had to do with... 1128 01:10:32,603 --> 01:10:36,899 To keeping a greater attention to the characters 1129 01:10:36,899 --> 01:10:39,777 than to the egos of the people creating them. 1130 01:10:39,777 --> 01:10:42,905 STAN: When you mention an ego problem, the funny thing is, 1131 01:10:42,905 --> 01:10:45,866 I'm afraid those problems are only cropping up now. 1132 01:10:45,866 --> 01:10:49,870 I think when Jack and I did the strips, there was no ego problem. 1133 01:10:49,870 --> 01:10:51,997 We were just doing the best we could. 1134 01:10:51,997 --> 01:10:55,751 KIRBY: Listen, you can understand now, uh, 1135 01:10:56,794 --> 01:10:58,379 how things really were. 1136 01:11:07,346 --> 01:11:10,182 (RADIO PLAYING INDISTINCTLY) 1137 01:11:23,070 --> 01:11:28,075 My guest is somebody who is not only an old friend and associate 1138 01:11:28,075 --> 01:11:33,622 but one of the genuine talented movers and shakers of our business. 1139 01:11:33,622 --> 01:11:37,459 Roy Thomas, editor-emeritus of Marvel Comics, 1140 01:11:37,459 --> 01:11:41,297 and as good a writer as we're ever going to find anywhere 1141 01:11:41,297 --> 01:11:43,757 in the comic business and maybe in any other business. 1142 01:11:44,008 --> 01:11:47,303 It just was as though you were the answer to a prayer. Remember, you... 1143 01:11:47,303 --> 01:11:51,098 You took over the Fantastic Four. You took over the Avengers, the X... 1144 01:11:51,098 --> 01:11:53,267 - I guess you did almost all the stories. - Most. 1145 01:11:53,267 --> 01:11:56,729 And as good as anybody could have wanted. Built up your own following. 1146 01:11:56,729 --> 01:11:58,105 I began to hate you 1147 01:11:58,105 --> 01:12:00,190 - as the fans began to love you. - (CHUCKLES) 1148 01:12:02,234 --> 01:12:05,696 When I became publisher, I stopped most of the writing. 1149 01:12:06,322 --> 01:12:09,992 When I was writing, I had total control of them. 1150 01:12:09,992 --> 01:12:12,161 And they matured, if you want to use that word, 1151 01:12:12,161 --> 01:12:13,537 the way I wanted them to. 1152 01:12:13,537 --> 01:12:17,291 But I realized, the minute you stop writing a series 1153 01:12:17,291 --> 01:12:21,795 and other writers take over, they've got to do it their way. 1154 01:12:24,465 --> 01:12:29,136 {\an8}Comic books started out really dealing with male heroes 1155 01:12:29,136 --> 01:12:30,804 'cause at that time, years ago, 1156 01:12:30,804 --> 01:12:33,724 {\an8}nobody even thought to have too many women heroes. 1157 01:12:33,724 --> 01:12:35,559 {\an8}But now, as publisher, 1158 01:12:35,559 --> 01:12:39,855 I have found that 10% of our readers are females. 1159 01:12:40,481 --> 01:12:43,859 So we ourselves are trying to increase that readership. 1160 01:12:43,859 --> 01:12:45,736 And these past few months and years, 1161 01:12:46,070 --> 01:12:49,031 we've been adding more and more female characters. 1162 01:12:49,698 --> 01:12:53,660 We have one character who's a barbarian called Red Sonja, 1163 01:12:53,660 --> 01:12:55,579 in the pre-historical days. 1164 01:12:55,746 --> 01:12:57,748 She wields a sword and she's great. 1165 01:12:57,748 --> 01:13:00,751 {\an8}We have a character called Medusa. We have the Black Widow. 1166 01:13:00,751 --> 01:13:05,339 {\an8}We have a new one called Ms. Marvel. She's gonna be a big one. 1167 01:13:06,465 --> 01:13:10,010 It was the first time in all the years I had been working there 1168 01:13:10,511 --> 01:13:14,681 that I had given the artists the freedom to do the books 1169 01:13:14,681 --> 01:13:16,600 the way they wanted to do them. 1170 01:13:17,726 --> 01:13:21,438 I find it's a little bit difficult now. The one thing that I regret, 1171 01:13:21,438 --> 01:13:24,566 of course, we're not together 24 hours a day. 1172 01:13:24,566 --> 01:13:26,443 Roy does his writing at home, 1173 01:13:26,443 --> 01:13:30,447 and we've lost a little bit of that perfect control we had 1174 01:13:30,447 --> 01:13:32,074 over all the characters. 1175 01:13:32,491 --> 01:13:36,453 Once or twice, I may wanna use a certain villain, and I'll say to Roy, 1176 01:13:36,453 --> 01:13:39,915 say "I'm gonna bring back Dr. Octopus in the next issue," and Roy'll say, 1177 01:13:39,915 --> 01:13:42,584 "Oh, Stan, you can't. I just did it in the Avengers." 1178 01:13:42,584 --> 01:13:45,337 You see? And it makes it a little difficult. 1179 01:13:45,629 --> 01:13:48,715 There probably are times where things don't gel 1180 01:13:48,715 --> 01:13:51,218 or dovetail quite as perfectly. 1181 01:13:51,218 --> 01:13:54,179 But that's one of the little things we have to put up with 1182 01:13:54,179 --> 01:13:56,682 because of the fact that we've grown so. 1183 01:14:00,602 --> 01:14:06,150 I've reached the pinnacle of idleness, 1184 01:14:06,150 --> 01:14:07,818 I'm now the publisher. 1185 01:14:07,818 --> 01:14:09,528 They kicked me upstairs. 1186 01:14:09,528 --> 01:14:13,449 {\an8}And it's my job to see to it that the other people do all the writing, 1187 01:14:13,449 --> 01:14:15,826 {\an8}but I really miss the writing. 1188 01:14:26,795 --> 01:14:30,507 When they named me the publisher of this thing, I became a big businessman. 1189 01:14:34,511 --> 01:14:37,389 I always wanted to become somebody important, 1190 01:14:38,974 --> 01:14:40,350 but I'm not a businessman. 1191 01:14:42,436 --> 01:14:46,315 I've really no interest in working with figures and things like that. 1192 01:14:46,773 --> 01:14:50,986 The board of directors, they wanted me to come up with a five-year plan. 1193 01:14:50,986 --> 01:14:54,865 Where will we be in five years and how much budget do we need? 1194 01:14:54,865 --> 01:14:58,327 But to me, anything that has to do with business is dull. 1195 01:15:01,330 --> 01:15:03,582 (CROWD CHEERING) 1196 01:15:05,125 --> 01:15:07,753 So I kept the title publisher, 1197 01:15:07,753 --> 01:15:10,339 but instead of just being a businessman, 1198 01:15:11,757 --> 01:15:16,261 I traveled around the country talking up Marvel Comics. 1199 01:15:16,261 --> 01:15:17,971 Thank you, culture-lovers. 1200 01:15:19,640 --> 01:15:23,310 {\an8}I was going to colleges and television shows 1201 01:15:23,310 --> 01:15:26,271 and radio shows pitching Marvel. 1202 01:15:26,396 --> 01:15:29,816 HOST: The superhero of the comic book business, Stan Lee. 1203 01:15:29,816 --> 01:15:30,943 (AUDIENCE APPLAUDING) 1204 01:15:30,943 --> 01:15:37,741 STAN: I've always felt comic books were a more powerful cultural device 1205 01:15:37,741 --> 01:15:40,369 than they ever had a chance to prove to be. 1206 01:15:40,369 --> 01:15:43,121 I hope to give them that chance now. 1207 01:15:43,121 --> 01:15:47,751 I want to make comic books much more important than they've ever been. 1208 01:15:48,502 --> 01:15:52,839 Basically, it's really a religious crusade, I like to think. 1209 01:15:52,839 --> 01:15:54,007 (AUDIENCE LAUGHS) 1210 01:15:54,007 --> 01:15:55,175 WOMAN: Indeed. (LAUGHS) 1211 01:16:02,182 --> 01:16:05,477 STAN: By this time, I had been at Marvel for many years. 1212 01:16:06,311 --> 01:16:10,857 I had had a lifetime job, and I was damn well worth it. 1213 01:16:11,358 --> 01:16:13,277 Here's what I think we ought to do. 1214 01:16:15,070 --> 01:16:16,321 I marked them all up. 1215 01:16:16,655 --> 01:16:19,199 But the company was sold. 1216 01:16:21,368 --> 01:16:23,579 One of the owners of the new company said, 1217 01:16:23,579 --> 01:16:26,707 "Stan, don't worry, you're going to be better than ever." 1218 01:16:26,707 --> 01:16:29,293 And he was gonna give everyone new contracts. 1219 01:16:29,418 --> 01:16:32,045 So the new contract I was offered was 1220 01:16:32,045 --> 01:16:36,008 instead of a lifetime contract, a two-year contract, 1221 01:16:36,008 --> 01:16:37,968 which made me very unhappy. 1222 01:16:40,095 --> 01:16:43,432 I always resented the fact that when I wrote these stories, 1223 01:16:44,182 --> 01:16:48,478 I never thought, "Gee, I ought to try to copyright something myself and own it." 1224 01:16:48,478 --> 01:16:50,439 It always belonged to the company. 1225 01:16:50,439 --> 01:16:53,692 So from a business point of view, that was a mistake. 1226 01:16:56,069 --> 01:16:59,531 I was heartbroken. There wasn't much I could do about it. 1227 01:17:05,203 --> 01:17:08,749 In a series of deliberate and deadly terrorist acts... 1228 01:17:10,250 --> 01:17:11,627 BARACK OBAMA: It is time for a change. 1229 01:17:11,752 --> 01:17:13,420 CROWD: Yes! Yes, we can! 1230 01:17:19,593 --> 01:17:21,136 KENNETH BRANAGH: Let's put a camera up. 1231 01:17:21,136 --> 01:17:22,846 Let's not keep this young man waiting. 1232 01:17:24,890 --> 01:17:27,184 STAN: Marvel finally settled things. 1233 01:17:27,851 --> 01:17:30,604 MAN: Guys, let's clear. Everybody, please. 1234 01:17:31,104 --> 01:17:34,399 STAN: They gave me title Chairman Emeritus, 1235 01:17:34,399 --> 01:17:36,777 which was an honorary title. 1236 01:17:37,361 --> 01:17:38,904 I was very happy about that. 1237 01:17:39,029 --> 01:17:42,783 BRANAGH: And, action! Camera! Car! 1238 01:17:44,034 --> 01:17:45,035 Stan! 1239 01:17:45,035 --> 01:17:46,244 Did it work? 1240 01:17:46,953 --> 01:17:50,332 Stan, thank you so much for being here. It is our absolute pleasure 1241 01:17:50,332 --> 01:17:53,168 and forgive us if there's lots of handshakes and autographs asked 1242 01:17:53,168 --> 01:17:54,795 before you get out of here, 1243 01:17:54,795 --> 01:17:57,005 but thank you so much. We are honored to have you. 1244 01:17:57,005 --> 01:17:59,299 - Thank you! Thanks a lot! - Thank you. 1245 01:17:59,299 --> 01:18:00,801 STAN: So many people walk up and say, 1246 01:18:00,801 --> 01:18:04,179 "I just want to thank you for all the enjoyment you've brought." 1247 01:18:04,805 --> 01:18:06,973 And I've been doing this since the 1940s. 1248 01:18:07,683 --> 01:18:09,643 People who've read the books then 1249 01:18:09,643 --> 01:18:11,770 still remember them and have stayed with them. 1250 01:18:11,895 --> 01:18:15,357 And now they have their own kids. Some have their grandkids. 1251 01:18:16,525 --> 01:18:19,945 {\an8}I often look back at the early '60s in the famous Marvel bullpen 1252 01:18:19,945 --> 01:18:23,031 {\an8}and think about the characters that came out of the imaginations of Stan Lee, 1253 01:18:23,031 --> 01:18:26,952 {\an8}Jack Kirby, Steve Ditko, and all of the co-creators. It's incredible. 1254 01:18:26,952 --> 01:18:29,079 And when we sit around our conference room tables 1255 01:18:29,079 --> 01:18:32,165 in development sessions on these movies, I find myself thinking, 1256 01:18:32,165 --> 01:18:35,836 "Boy, if we could just tap into 5% of that crucible of imagination." 1257 01:18:37,129 --> 01:18:39,756 We're just trying to emulate what the comics have been doing so well 1258 01:18:39,756 --> 01:18:41,341 for so many decades. 1259 01:18:42,843 --> 01:18:45,345 STAN: In the days I was writing those books, 1260 01:18:45,762 --> 01:18:47,472 I was hoping they'd sell 1261 01:18:47,597 --> 01:18:50,976 so I wouldn't lose my job and I could keep paying the rent. 1262 01:18:51,435 --> 01:18:55,981 {\an8}All of a sudden, these characters have become world-famous. 1263 01:18:56,440 --> 01:19:00,068 They're the subject of blockbuster movies, 1264 01:19:00,068 --> 01:19:02,738 and I'm lucky enough to get little cameos in 'em. 1265 01:19:04,489 --> 01:19:07,784 Cut. Ladies and gentlemen, that's a camera wrap 1266 01:19:07,784 --> 01:19:10,996 on the creator of Iron Man, Mr. Stan Lee. 1267 01:19:10,996 --> 01:19:15,083 STAN: The fact that I'm working with characters that I've created... 1268 01:19:15,083 --> 01:19:16,168 Action. 1269 01:19:16,168 --> 01:19:19,212 Superheroes in New York? Give me a break. 1270 01:19:20,046 --> 01:19:23,675 And the fact that they are being directed so beautifully... 1271 01:19:23,884 --> 01:19:25,302 Did it work? 1272 01:19:25,427 --> 01:19:29,598 That's Captain America? I thought he'd be taller. 1273 01:19:29,765 --> 01:19:32,267 - To work with such professionals. - Oh, man. 1274 01:19:32,267 --> 01:19:34,519 I am so fired. 1275 01:19:34,644 --> 01:19:37,063 And they all have a love of the characters. 1276 01:19:37,063 --> 01:19:39,357 Are you Tony Stank? 1277 01:19:39,483 --> 01:19:42,068 I never thought it would turn into something like this. 1278 01:19:42,068 --> 01:19:44,905 Anyway, before I was so rudely interrupted... 1279 01:19:45,447 --> 01:19:47,491 To work with creative people, 1280 01:19:47,866 --> 01:19:50,327 especially people who make movies, 1281 01:19:51,077 --> 01:19:52,788 is such a thrill. 1282 01:19:56,166 --> 01:19:57,375 No! 1283 01:19:57,751 --> 01:19:58,794 Yes! 1284 01:19:59,377 --> 01:20:01,922 It's overwhelming when I think about it. 1285 01:20:01,922 --> 01:20:05,717 Well, the '60s were fun, but now I'm paying for it. 1286 01:20:05,717 --> 01:20:06,802 MAN: And cut it. 1287 01:20:07,010 --> 01:20:08,637 I think I'll just take these... 1288 01:20:09,262 --> 01:20:12,766 bring them over here and hold on for safekeeping. 1289 01:20:13,850 --> 01:20:17,145 What's the matter with you kids? You never seen a spaceship before? 1290 01:20:17,145 --> 01:20:18,230 MAN: Action. 1291 01:20:18,939 --> 01:20:20,273 "Trust me, true believer." 1292 01:20:21,608 --> 01:20:25,362 I would have to be crazy not to feel fulfilled. 1293 01:20:27,489 --> 01:20:30,826 {\an8}It's certainly been nice to see the world catch up with what Stan did. 1294 01:20:30,826 --> 01:20:33,995 {\an8}Even if it took movies and TV shows to do it. 1295 01:20:33,995 --> 01:20:35,539 {\an8}The world kinda has to admit now, 1296 01:20:35,539 --> 01:20:38,333 {\an8}you know, maybe there is something to some of this stuff. 1297 01:20:38,333 --> 01:20:40,460 For goodness sake, how're you? 1298 01:20:40,460 --> 01:20:42,087 (INDISTINCT CONVERSATION) 1299 01:20:43,296 --> 01:20:46,132 THOMAS: The seeds of all that stuff are all set back in what Stan did 1300 01:20:46,132 --> 01:20:48,426 with Jack and Steve. 1301 01:20:48,426 --> 01:20:51,763 You know, you could always trace anything that they do now. 1302 01:20:52,180 --> 01:20:55,267 In fact, it all kind of flows from this fountain that was unleashed 1303 01:20:55,392 --> 01:20:58,186 when Stan and Jack and Ditko, you know, got together 1304 01:20:58,186 --> 01:21:01,231 and suddenly became this wonderful triumvirate, 1305 01:21:01,231 --> 01:21:03,191 creating a whole universe. 1306 01:21:07,863 --> 01:21:11,449 Neither of them could have, really, you know, done it without the other. 1307 01:21:16,997 --> 01:21:20,500 {\an8}Join me in giving a big welcome to Mr. Stan Lee. 1308 01:21:20,500 --> 01:21:22,460 {\an8}(AUDIENCE CHEERING) 1309 01:21:25,380 --> 01:21:26,381 Thank you. 1310 01:21:30,677 --> 01:21:32,429 I spent quite a lot of time 1311 01:21:33,346 --> 01:21:37,434 writing a 25-page speech that I could give you 1312 01:21:38,977 --> 01:21:42,439 and as I looked at it, I said, "Would I want to hear this speech?" 1313 01:21:43,857 --> 01:21:44,900 So I tore it up. 1314 01:21:45,984 --> 01:21:49,195 So I stand here now defenseless, 1315 01:21:50,030 --> 01:21:52,616 with nothing except to tell you 1316 01:21:53,992 --> 01:21:55,869 if you have an idea 1317 01:21:55,869 --> 01:21:59,122 that you genuinely think is good, 1318 01:21:59,998 --> 01:22:02,584 don't let some idiot talk you out of it. 1319 01:22:02,584 --> 01:22:08,590 That doesn't mean that every wild notion you come up with is gonna be genius, 1320 01:22:08,590 --> 01:22:12,302 but if there is something that you feel is good, 1321 01:22:12,636 --> 01:22:17,265 {\an8}something you want to do, something that means something to you, 1322 01:22:17,807 --> 01:22:22,062 try to do it. Because you can only do your best work 1323 01:22:22,646 --> 01:22:25,565 if you're doing what you want to do 1324 01:22:25,565 --> 01:22:29,611 and if you're doing it the way you think it should be done, 1325 01:22:29,611 --> 01:22:32,989 and if you can take pride in it after you've done it, 1326 01:22:32,989 --> 01:22:34,491 no matter what it is, 1327 01:22:34,491 --> 01:22:38,536 you can look at it and say, "I did that and I think it's pretty damn good." 1328 01:22:38,662 --> 01:22:39,913 That's a great feeling. 1329 01:22:40,664 --> 01:22:45,126 I want to wish all of you the best luck in the world. 1330 01:22:45,126 --> 01:22:49,214 Just do your thing. Whatever you do, give it your best shot. 1331 01:22:49,214 --> 01:22:51,257 You'll be glad you did. 1332 01:22:51,257 --> 01:22:53,009 - Excelsior! - (AUDIENCE CHEERING)