1 00:00:02,040 --> 00:00:04,255 This program me contains some strong language 2 00:00:04,280 --> 00:00:06,055 This is the wall of shame. 3 00:00:06,080 --> 00:00:11,015 Me and some of my 2,000 magazine covers, 4 00:00:11,040 --> 00:00:15,255 which is...the ego has landed. 5 00:00:15,280 --> 00:00:19,495 I love this one. "Joan. World's number one sex symbol." 6 00:00:19,520 --> 00:00:21,135 Yeah. How about that?! 7 00:00:21,160 --> 00:00:23,415 You look as though you're in your mid-20s, 8 00:00:23,440 --> 00:00:26,495 and, in fact, you would have been...51. Yeah. 9 00:00:26,520 --> 00:00:29,295 This was my first magazine cover. 10 00:00:29,320 --> 00:00:32,415 This was the first one? Yeah, the first one. 11 00:00:32,440 --> 00:00:34,695 "1950." Yeah. 12 00:00:34,720 --> 00:00:37,815 Did you feel like you'd made it? No. 13 00:00:37,840 --> 00:00:40,015 I was happy to get the £3... 14 00:00:40,040 --> 00:00:41,975 £3? That's not bad, is it? 15 00:00:42,000 --> 00:00:45,535 And then, this, I like. It's called Everybody's. Yes. 16 00:00:45,560 --> 00:00:48,055 What would you say to that young woman 17 00:00:48,080 --> 00:00:51,335 whose eyes are turned so ingenuously towards us? 18 00:00:51,360 --> 00:00:53,495 What would I say? 19 00:00:53,520 --> 00:00:56,255 Don't let the bastards get you down. 20 00:01:03,960 --> 00:01:08,015 Dame Joan Collins is one of the most iconic celebrities 21 00:01:08,040 --> 00:01:09,815 of the last 50 years. 22 00:01:10,840 --> 00:01:12,495 Ah! 23 00:01:12,520 --> 00:01:14,015 My photos. 24 00:01:14,040 --> 00:01:16,735 This is almost like Royal Corner. 25 00:01:16,760 --> 00:01:18,655 We've got the Queen... 26 00:01:18,680 --> 00:01:20,775 I loved her so much. 27 00:01:20,800 --> 00:01:23,255 That's the Damehood. And that's the Damehood. 28 00:01:23,280 --> 00:01:26,055 Then Prince, but now King Charles. 29 00:01:26,080 --> 00:01:29,535 I was quite nervous about that one, but he was very sweet. 30 00:01:29,560 --> 00:01:33,015 He said in his... He has a beautiful voice. 31 00:01:33,040 --> 00:01:36,055 Um... "About time, too."” 32 00:01:36,080 --> 00:01:39,615 Which I thought was rather fabulous. That's nice, isn't it? 33 00:01:40,680 --> 00:01:42,895 You met Princess Diana, didn't you? Yes. 34 00:01:42,920 --> 00:01:44,935 And what was your take on her? 35 00:01:44,960 --> 00:01:47,335 I thought she was treated very badly. 36 00:01:48,360 --> 00:01:50,015 Who by? 37 00:01:51,080 --> 00:01:54,655 I'm not going to go into that, because this is about me... Yes. 38 00:01:54,680 --> 00:01:56,255 ...not Princess Diana. 39 00:01:56,280 --> 00:01:59,135 Shall we go and sit down? Yes. I'm ready. 40 00:01:59,160 --> 00:02:02,935 A star whose career has spanned seven decades, 41 00:02:02,960 --> 00:02:07,015 Joan had agreed to open up for an intimate look at her life. 42 00:02:08,080 --> 00:02:11,055 Thank you for having me. You've moved all my stuff. 43 00:02:11,080 --> 00:02:14,335 You've moved my candles, you've moved my plants. 44 00:02:14,360 --> 00:02:16,535 Thank you for letting us in. 45 00:02:16,560 --> 00:02:19,535 Letting you in?! You've taken over! I know. 46 00:02:19,560 --> 00:02:22,615 Would you like anything else except water? 47 00:02:22,640 --> 00:02:24,335 I thought this was gin. 48 00:02:24,360 --> 00:02:26,655 Unfortunately, not at this hour. 49 00:02:26,680 --> 00:02:29,335 Back in the old days, maybe. 50 00:02:29,360 --> 00:02:32,455 All of this stuff is going to end up on the cutting room floor. 51 00:02:32,480 --> 00:02:34,735 Not all of it, I hope. A lot of it. 52 00:02:47,560 --> 00:02:50,735 I was visiting Joan at her villa in the south of France, 53 00:02:50,760 --> 00:02:52,575 not far from Saint-Tropez. 54 00:02:53,640 --> 00:02:56,775 Though she has homes in London and Los Angeles, 55 00:02:56,800 --> 00:02:59,335 it's here that she likes to spend her summers, 56 00:02:59,360 --> 00:03:02,375 alongside her husband of 22 years, 57 00:03:02,400 --> 00:03:05,735 the Peruvian-born theatre producer Percy Gibson. 58 00:03:07,520 --> 00:03:09,735 We'd arrived during a heat wave. 59 00:03:09,760 --> 00:03:12,055 It was a little warm. 60 00:03:12,080 --> 00:03:14,655 Would you like to take my arm or would you prefer...? 61 00:03:14,680 --> 00:03:16,655 I'll take your arm, yeah. 62 00:03:16,680 --> 00:03:18,775 Can you hear the cicadas? 63 00:03:18,800 --> 00:03:22,895 Just turn them down a bit. And the hotter it gets, the louder they are. 64 00:03:22,920 --> 00:03:25,775 Oh, my word. That's spectacular. 65 00:03:25,800 --> 00:03:29,535 Isn't it? Amazing. I never, ever get tired of it. 66 00:03:29,560 --> 00:03:31,975 How long have you been here? 30 years. 67 00:03:32,000 --> 00:03:36,295 People used to, really very brave people, used to walk all the way 68 00:03:36,320 --> 00:03:38,895 up to there, where it's the most fabulous view, 69 00:03:38,920 --> 00:03:41,255 and they would exercise. 70 00:03:41,280 --> 00:03:44,375 Does Percy do a lot of exercise? Yes, he does. He's very good. 71 00:03:44,400 --> 00:03:46,775 Do you keep him on point? I read... I don't do it. 72 00:03:46,800 --> 00:03:49,935 But you tell him, if he's getting a little tubby... No, I don't. 73 00:03:49,960 --> 00:03:54,055 Well, you said that in an interview. Well, I might mention it casually. 74 00:03:54,080 --> 00:03:57,015 What would you say? I'd say, erm, "You're getting fat." 75 00:03:57,040 --> 00:03:58,535 THEY LAUGH 76 00:03:58,560 --> 00:04:01,255 You wouldn't say it that baldly, would you? Would you?! 77 00:04:01,280 --> 00:04:03,055 I don't know what I'd say. 78 00:04:03,080 --> 00:04:07,495 I might say, "Perhaps we shouldn't eat so much bread... 79 00:04:07,520 --> 00:04:09,055 "..at dinner." 80 00:04:09,080 --> 00:04:11,775 You'd say "we", because "we" could mean either of you, 81 00:04:11,800 --> 00:04:14,695 so that's very sensitive. Listen, I've put on so much weight. 82 00:04:14,720 --> 00:04:17,055 That's why I'm wearing these clothes. Not at all. 83 00:04:17,080 --> 00:04:20,535 I can't believe that at all. My wife told me I was getting moobs. 84 00:04:20,560 --> 00:04:23,695 Moo...? Oh, my God! Do you know about moobs? Man boobs. Yeah 85 00:04:23,720 --> 00:04:26,535 But this was a few years ago, so then I started exercising. 86 00:04:26,560 --> 00:04:29,535 Feel that. I don't want to. Why not? Because it's soft. 87 00:04:29,560 --> 00:04:32,815 No, no... But I wasn't flexing it. Touch it like that. 88 00:04:32,840 --> 00:04:34,295 JOAN LAUGHS 89 00:04:34,320 --> 00:04:38,015 Oh, yeah, that's better. Now touch this. Just knock on it. 90 00:04:39,280 --> 00:04:41,255 Hello? Down here. 91 00:04:41,280 --> 00:04:44,015 Oh, that's impressive. Right? 92 00:04:45,080 --> 00:04:48,255 Wow. Is this a six-pack? TENSING: I would say so. 93 00:04:48,280 --> 00:04:49,975 THEY LAUGH 94 00:04:51,720 --> 00:04:53,815 Ladies and gentlemen, Joan Collins. 95 00:04:53,840 --> 00:04:55,015 Joan Collins. 96 00:04:55,040 --> 00:04:57,815 Would you welcome Joan Collins? APPLAUSE 97 00:05:00,800 --> 00:05:04,055 Joan is the ultimate show business survivor - 98 00:05:04,080 --> 00:05:07,655 an emblem of Hollywood glamour and unapologetic stardom. 99 00:05:09,400 --> 00:05:11,295 When did you get out? 100 00:05:11,320 --> 00:05:15,375 But before the red carpets and big hair, she'd been a fresh-faced 101 00:05:15,400 --> 00:05:20,295 film ingenue, having quit RADA to play a role as a female delinquent. 102 00:05:20,320 --> 00:05:23,095 It doesn't stop two old pals from having a drink, does it? 103 00:05:23,120 --> 00:05:25,255 Things is different, I tell you. 104 00:05:25,280 --> 00:05:27,215 Not for me, they aren't. 105 00:05:27,240 --> 00:05:30,375 Then came a move to Hollywood... 106 00:05:30,400 --> 00:05:33,135 REPORTER: This young star has been described as the greatest 107 00:05:33,160 --> 00:05:35,375 screen asset America has imported from Britain. 108 00:05:35,400 --> 00:05:37,055 You're so wrong. 109 00:05:37,080 --> 00:05:39,775 ...leading eventually to her career-defining role 110 00:05:39,800 --> 00:05:42,855 as the powerful spurned ex-wife Alexis 111 00:05:42,880 --> 00:05:46,415 on the wildly successful TV soap, Dynasty. 112 00:05:46,440 --> 00:05:49,535 I bought all of your holdings, including this house, 113 00:05:49,560 --> 00:05:52,975 and there's absolutely nothing you can do about it. 114 00:05:53,000 --> 00:05:54,455 Damn you, Alexis! 115 00:05:54,480 --> 00:05:58,055 The image stuck and, thereafter, she played off it in her performances, 116 00:05:58,080 --> 00:06:01,095 including this one - an advert for a chocolate bar. 117 00:06:01,120 --> 00:06:05,015 "Who'd want to smell like you?" Nice. Mature. Zip it, shrimpy! 118 00:06:05,040 --> 00:06:06,975 Dan, eat a Snickers. 119 00:06:07,000 --> 00:06:10,015 Why? Because you turn into a right diva when you're hungry. 120 00:06:10,040 --> 00:06:12,415 Better? Better. 121 00:06:18,560 --> 00:06:22,655 Now, aged 90, Joan still works regularly in plays, 122 00:06:22,680 --> 00:06:25,055 in films and writing books, 123 00:06:25,080 --> 00:06:29,735 enjoying the fruits of a life filled with love and controversy. 124 00:06:31,640 --> 00:06:34,055 Can I have some more water? 125 00:06:35,080 --> 00:06:36,495 Thank you. 126 00:06:36,520 --> 00:06:38,055 Yeah, sure. 127 00:06:38,080 --> 00:06:40,335 You just pro-rate the time you spend on my nose 128 00:06:40,360 --> 00:06:42,015 and I'll pay my contribution. 129 00:06:42,040 --> 00:06:43,735 JOAN LAUGHS 130 00:06:43,760 --> 00:06:45,055 Thank you. 131 00:06:46,120 --> 00:06:49,015 So can I start by saying what a privilege it is 132 00:06:49,040 --> 00:06:50,775 to be sitting across from you? 133 00:06:50,800 --> 00:06:54,535 You are a legend and you're accomplished on television, 134 00:06:54,560 --> 00:06:58,935 in film, in your writing, in so many ways. Thank you. 135 00:06:58,960 --> 00:07:02,135 And there's been so much life, both on the screen and off it, 136 00:07:02,160 --> 00:07:04,775 that it's hard to know where to begin. 137 00:07:04,800 --> 00:07:07,935 But in your career, the one that most people would think of 138 00:07:07,960 --> 00:07:10,295 is Dynasty, which I'm calling "Die-nasty", 139 00:07:10,320 --> 00:07:12,895 even though "Din-asty" is how we normally say it. 140 00:07:12,920 --> 00:07:16,775 Or some people say "Die-NASTY". Yeah. Oh, nice. "Die-NASTY". 141 00:07:16,800 --> 00:07:19,735 Because people are dying nasty. Nastily. 142 00:07:19,760 --> 00:07:22,055 You won a Golden Globe, I think. Yes. 143 00:07:22,080 --> 00:07:25,575 In a way it was your defining role, I think it's fair to say. 144 00:07:25,600 --> 00:07:27,055 It was, yes. 145 00:07:27,080 --> 00:07:31,655 And to some extent, people have conflated your personality and hers. 146 00:07:31,680 --> 00:07:36,535 And given that she's a scheming, machinating, temptress, minx - 147 00:07:36,560 --> 00:07:40,055 choose your favourite sexist term, right, 148 00:07:40,080 --> 00:07:43,415 does that feel like a mixed blessing, or... What's your...? 149 00:07:43,440 --> 00:07:45,295 Is that unfair, do you think? 150 00:07:45,320 --> 00:07:50,535 I thought it was at first, but the producers loved the idea. 151 00:07:50,560 --> 00:07:53,775 They would phone in to the supermarket rags, 152 00:07:53,800 --> 00:07:57,775 like Enquirer and Globe, stories that they had made up. 153 00:07:57,800 --> 00:08:01,215 "She went on the set and she put out her cigarette 154 00:08:01,240 --> 00:08:03,015 "in the yolk of an egg.” 155 00:08:03,040 --> 00:08:05,535 I was upset at first. 156 00:08:05,560 --> 00:08:11,575 And then I remembered something that Kirk Douglas had said to me. 157 00:08:11,600 --> 00:08:15,655 I was sitting with Kirk Douglas on a yacht, as one does, 158 00:08:15,680 --> 00:08:19,735 in the south of France, and he said, "Use it, honey." 159 00:08:19,760 --> 00:08:21,495 He said, "Use it." 160 00:08:21,520 --> 00:08:24,775 How much... How much overlap is there in terms of personality? 161 00:08:24,800 --> 00:08:27,735 How much of Alexis is in you? Oh, quite a bit. 162 00:08:27,760 --> 00:08:30,695 You have those steely qualities, I think. I sense that you have 163 00:08:30,720 --> 00:08:33,575 that ambition, maybe, and that ability to get the job done... 164 00:08:33,600 --> 00:08:35,215 Not really any more. No. 165 00:08:35,240 --> 00:08:38,335 You know, people have always talked to women about ambition 166 00:08:38,360 --> 00:08:40,175 like it's a dirty word. 167 00:08:40,200 --> 00:08:43,695 I've never, ever seen a man accused of being ambitious. 168 00:08:43,720 --> 00:08:46,255 I wanted to be successful, yes. 169 00:08:46,280 --> 00:08:49,295 I wanted to make a living, yes. 170 00:08:49,320 --> 00:08:54,095 And I wanted to make a living in a world that I enjoyed. 171 00:08:55,680 --> 00:08:58,535 Among the millions of fans of Dynasty 172 00:08:58,560 --> 00:09:01,775 was a young man who later went on to success. 173 00:09:01,800 --> 00:09:04,255 Well, success, that's debatable, as president. 174 00:09:04,280 --> 00:09:07,295 His name was Donald Trump. Yes. 175 00:09:07,320 --> 00:09:09,695 Did he... He was never on it, I don't think. No. 176 00:09:09,720 --> 00:09:13,535 He wanted to be on it. But he said, "Alexis is based on me." 177 00:09:13,560 --> 00:09:17,415 I said, when I was asked about my character, Alexis, 178 00:09:17,440 --> 00:09:20,135 "Who did you think of when you were preparing?” 179 00:09:20,160 --> 00:09:23,055 I said, "Well, a mixture of Donald Trump..." 180 00:09:23,080 --> 00:09:26,775 Who was not president then... No. He was a real estate mogul. 181 00:09:26,800 --> 00:09:30,375 Yeah. "..and a friend of mine called Cappy Badrutt”, 182 00:09:30,400 --> 00:09:35,335 who was a very, very glamorous woman about town, very clever, 183 00:09:35,360 --> 00:09:37,775 so I wanted to have a mixture of them. 184 00:09:37,800 --> 00:09:40,895 So you did sort of base it on... A little bit on him. 185 00:09:40,920 --> 00:09:42,735 Well, yes. Of course. 186 00:09:42,760 --> 00:09:44,735 What was the quality he had? 187 00:09:45,760 --> 00:09:47,615 Ruthlessness. Mm. 188 00:09:47,640 --> 00:09:49,295 What's your take on him? 189 00:09:49,320 --> 00:09:52,535 Well, you know, I'm trying not to get involved politically. 190 00:09:52,560 --> 00:09:55,815 I'm an actress. I don't think we should start spouting 191 00:09:55,840 --> 00:09:58,935 our political opinions. Not his politics, but his personality? 192 00:09:58,960 --> 00:10:01,735 Oh, personality. Erm... JOAN CHUCKLES 193 00:10:05,080 --> 00:10:08,535 Well, let's say that if you played him in a movie, 194 00:10:08,560 --> 00:10:11,935 people would say, "Nah, that's too over the top." 195 00:10:14,000 --> 00:10:16,535 So all that I need now is your approval... 196 00:10:16,560 --> 00:10:20,055 The captivating sense of villainy Alexis embodied 197 00:10:20,080 --> 00:10:24,015 won her millions of fans, making Joan the most highly paid 198 00:10:24,040 --> 00:10:26,775 TV actress in the world at the time 199 00:10:26,800 --> 00:10:29,375 and a global symbol of feminine power. 200 00:10:29,400 --> 00:10:31,655 I'm a very direct woman. 201 00:10:31,680 --> 00:10:34,015 If I do not get that approval... 202 00:10:35,080 --> 00:10:38,535 ...and please understand that I have a controlling interest 203 00:10:38,560 --> 00:10:42,135 in Denver Carrington, I shall fire you all on the spot 204 00:10:42,160 --> 00:10:45,175 and replace you with a board that will approve of the merger. 205 00:10:57,080 --> 00:10:59,775 Now, here's the most famous one of all. Here we go. 206 00:10:59,800 --> 00:11:03,015 Are you ready? Because your temperatures are about to spike. 207 00:11:03,040 --> 00:11:04,535 JOAN LAUGHS 208 00:11:04,560 --> 00:11:07,535 Playboy cover. The Gala Christmas issue, 209 00:11:07,560 --> 00:11:11,735 showing the divine Joan Collins looking svelte 210 00:11:11,760 --> 00:11:13,775 and poised elegantly, 211 00:11:13,800 --> 00:11:17,775 but projecting a winning sense of feminine power. 212 00:11:17,800 --> 00:11:20,295 Did they say that? You just made that up. 213 00:11:20,320 --> 00:11:23,935 I did make that up, yes. Very, very good. You should be a writer. 214 00:11:23,960 --> 00:11:27,495 And isn't that amazing? And that caused major waves. 215 00:11:27,520 --> 00:11:29,495 Oh, I can't tell you. 216 00:11:29,520 --> 00:11:31,895 Did your children take a view? 217 00:11:31,920 --> 00:11:34,295 Cos in '83... I don't think they even saw it. 218 00:11:34,320 --> 00:11:37,135 They would have been 16, 17, 18. Yeah. 219 00:11:37,160 --> 00:11:39,935 As far as you know, they were fine and it wasn't... Yeah. 220 00:11:39,960 --> 00:11:43,055 They know that, you know, this is a business in which you have to, 221 00:11:43,080 --> 00:11:46,055 you know, show off your... Besides which, there's nothing 222 00:11:46,080 --> 00:11:48,735 remotely distasteful about that picture. 223 00:11:48,760 --> 00:11:50,695 No, but we haven't seen inside. 224 00:11:50,720 --> 00:11:53,535 Ah, yes, well, you're not going to show... Do you have a copy? 225 00:11:53,560 --> 00:11:55,895 No, I don't. You were naked, I'm assuming. 226 00:11:55,920 --> 00:11:57,535 Slightly naked. 227 00:11:57,560 --> 00:12:01,015 But, you know, as I said, so was Diane Keaton, 228 00:12:01,040 --> 00:12:03,015 so was Glenda Jackson, 229 00:12:03,040 --> 00:12:05,055 so was Jane Fonda. Mm. 230 00:12:05,080 --> 00:12:09,735 It was the era of lady stars taking their kit off... Mm. 231 00:12:09,760 --> 00:12:12,615 ...so, you know, I did it just a bit. 232 00:12:15,360 --> 00:12:20,055 Joan's on-screen persona of strength and sexuality had, in a way, 233 00:12:20,080 --> 00:12:23,255 been something she created in partnership with her sister, 234 00:12:23,280 --> 00:12:25,495 the novelist Jackie Collins. 235 00:12:26,560 --> 00:12:30,535 At Joan's lowest ebb, struggling to find fulfilling work in the '70s, 236 00:12:30,560 --> 00:12:33,495 Jackie had, meanwhile, been enjoying massive success 237 00:12:33,520 --> 00:12:35,175 writing steamy fiction. 238 00:12:36,240 --> 00:12:39,695 Joan's decision to produce and star in an adaptation 239 00:12:39,720 --> 00:12:42,535 of one of Jackie's bonkbusters, The Stud, 240 00:12:42,560 --> 00:12:45,015 playing a sexually demanding nightclub owner, 241 00:12:45,040 --> 00:12:47,015 would transform her career. 242 00:12:48,800 --> 00:12:52,735 I've got 15 minutes, Tony. I'm late for the hairdresser's. 243 00:12:52,760 --> 00:12:55,095 Christ! I'm not a machine, you know? 244 00:12:55,120 --> 00:12:57,655 In the meantime, lover, you'll do. 245 00:13:01,080 --> 00:13:05,535 That's with my darling sister, there, and my darling brother. 246 00:13:05,560 --> 00:13:08,535 And Jackie sadly is no longer with us. No. 247 00:13:08,560 --> 00:13:10,535 What year did Jackie die? 248 00:13:10,560 --> 00:13:15,775 She died in, erm, 2015... Right. ..or 2016. I'm not sure. 249 00:13:15,800 --> 00:13:18,935 I know it's been about eight years. Seven or eight years ago. Yeah. 250 00:13:18,960 --> 00:13:21,735 I know. It's so sad. I think of her all the time. 251 00:13:22,800 --> 00:13:25,495 That's the way. That's life, isn't it? That's the way. 252 00:13:26,920 --> 00:13:29,735 Oh, you're going to go and look at our wall of friends. 253 00:13:29,760 --> 00:13:31,535 It's the wall of friends. 254 00:13:31,560 --> 00:13:35,415 And they've all been taken over the past 30 years. 255 00:13:35,440 --> 00:13:39,375 The coloured ones, they are Jackie's friends 256 00:13:39,400 --> 00:13:42,535 who used to come to all of her fabulous parties. 257 00:13:42,560 --> 00:13:45,535 Do you ever think about how extraordinary it is 258 00:13:45,560 --> 00:13:49,295 that the two of you went on to such great success, the two sisters? 259 00:13:49,320 --> 00:13:53,535 What it was that either your parents did or in your genes, 260 00:13:53,560 --> 00:13:55,655 because you were both huge in your own right. 261 00:13:55,680 --> 00:13:57,375 You were quite a double act. 262 00:13:57,400 --> 00:14:00,535 We were told as children to just get on with our lives. 263 00:14:00,560 --> 00:14:03,295 We were not played with, we were not entertained, 264 00:14:03,320 --> 00:14:08,015 and so we, therefore, had a whole vast amount of hobbies. 265 00:14:08,040 --> 00:14:09,775 Jackie's was writing, 266 00:14:09,800 --> 00:14:13,935 mine was painting, making doll's clothes for my doll's house... 267 00:14:13,960 --> 00:14:17,455 Were you competitive? I've read that you were a little, and maybe... 268 00:14:17,480 --> 00:14:19,895 All siblings are competitive in a way. Yeah. 269 00:14:19,920 --> 00:14:23,415 And that when you started writing and had some success as a writer 270 00:14:23,440 --> 00:14:25,655 and you sold a lot of books, that maybe she felt 271 00:14:25,680 --> 00:14:27,535 a little bit that you were on her turf. 272 00:14:27,560 --> 00:14:30,695 Well, when she wanted to be an actress, 273 00:14:30,720 --> 00:14:34,775 when I was already an actress, I took her to Hollywood 274 00:14:34,800 --> 00:14:39,295 and introduced her to the producers, directors, casting directors, 275 00:14:39,320 --> 00:14:44,055 and she... I encouraged her in her acting career. 276 00:14:44,080 --> 00:14:48,055 And she did several roles in films, actually. Mm. Yes. 277 00:14:48,080 --> 00:14:51,015 So, you know, if I could encourage her, 278 00:14:51,040 --> 00:14:55,015 she should not have not allowed me. 279 00:14:55,040 --> 00:14:58,055 Besides which, Michael Caine said, 280 00:14:58,080 --> 00:15:02,775 "Do you know, every actor should have another string to their bow." 281 00:15:02,800 --> 00:15:07,055 You cannot rely on this profession alone to support you. 282 00:15:07,080 --> 00:15:09,695 You have to have another... another string. 283 00:15:09,720 --> 00:15:14,495 And so he had a restaurant and I had writing, 284 00:15:14,520 --> 00:15:16,775 at which I'm reasonably good. 285 00:15:16,800 --> 00:15:20,015 I'm just about to publish my 19th book, 286 00:15:20,040 --> 00:15:22,695 Behind the Shoulder Pads, 287 00:15:22,720 --> 00:15:26,775 and I'll probably do at least one or two more. 288 00:15:26,800 --> 00:15:29,535 Mm. And I think... I think you were... 289 00:15:29,560 --> 00:15:33,535 The love existed in spite of whatever rivalry there was. 290 00:15:33,560 --> 00:15:36,815 You never stopped loving each other and having each other's back. 291 00:15:36,840 --> 00:15:38,535 Absolutely. Absolutely. 292 00:15:38,560 --> 00:15:43,215 And, unfortunately, a lot of people in my life... 293 00:15:43,240 --> 00:15:45,175 ...she hated. 294 00:15:45,200 --> 00:15:48,335 And, luckily, she adored Percy. 295 00:15:48,360 --> 00:15:50,535 Adored him, adored him, adored him. 296 00:15:50,560 --> 00:15:54,255 And we all got along so well in the last... 297 00:15:54,280 --> 00:15:57,655 ...sadly, just few years of her life. 298 00:16:03,800 --> 00:16:07,015 Would you like something to drink? Only if you're having something. 299 00:16:07,040 --> 00:16:09,375 Well, of course. It's so hot. 300 00:16:09,400 --> 00:16:11,775 God, I've got to get a fan from somebody. 301 00:16:11,800 --> 00:16:14,615 Does anybody have my fan out there, please? 302 00:16:14,640 --> 00:16:16,295 Chrissy? 303 00:16:19,080 --> 00:16:22,255 Thank you, darling. Hi, Chrissy. Louis. How do you do? 304 00:16:22,280 --> 00:16:24,055 How do you do? Nice to meet you. 305 00:16:24,080 --> 00:16:26,375 How would you describe your... How you fit in? 306 00:16:26,400 --> 00:16:30,335 I dress Dame Joan when she's on stage and film, 307 00:16:30,360 --> 00:16:32,935 just to make sure that everything is as it should be. 308 00:16:32,960 --> 00:16:36,375 The West End. I've worked with her for over 20 years now. 309 00:16:36,400 --> 00:16:38,975 Very nice. Very nice to meet you. Nice to meet you. 310 00:16:39,000 --> 00:16:43,255 Can you ask somebody to get me some ice? Thank you. Here we go. 311 00:16:45,320 --> 00:16:47,895 Hang on, that's my director you just did that to. 312 00:16:47,920 --> 00:16:49,815 I know, but he won't mind. 313 00:16:49,840 --> 00:16:51,375 LOUIS LAUGHS 314 00:16:51,400 --> 00:16:54,495 Tiny bit more? Yeah, a little bit. Quelque chose... 315 00:16:54,520 --> 00:16:56,775 Percy, why don't you come join us? 316 00:16:56,800 --> 00:16:59,055 Come and have a glass with us. 317 00:16:59,080 --> 00:17:02,495 I brought you some food. I thought you might need some. 318 00:17:02,520 --> 00:17:04,255 Oh, chips... Oh! 319 00:17:05,320 --> 00:17:08,495 Wow! Isn't that lovely? How are you doing, Percy? 320 00:17:08,520 --> 00:17:10,295 Good, thank you very much. 321 00:17:10,320 --> 00:17:14,175 How long have the two of you been together? 22 years. 322 00:17:14,200 --> 00:17:17,295 You were on, you were the... I was the company manager. 323 00:17:17,320 --> 00:17:21,015 Of the production of Private Lives? Yeah. Erm, no. 324 00:17:21,040 --> 00:17:23,135 Love Letters. Love Letters. 325 00:17:23,160 --> 00:17:28,015 How long after you met did you, erm, get married then? 326 00:17:28,040 --> 00:17:31,055 A year and a bit. Yes. 327 00:17:31,080 --> 00:17:34,495 What was it, do you think? What is it? What does he have? 328 00:17:34,520 --> 00:17:37,015 What's his special quality? Humour. 329 00:17:37,040 --> 00:17:39,015 And great looks. 330 00:17:39,040 --> 00:17:41,335 And kindness. 331 00:17:41,360 --> 00:17:43,495 He's just a wonderful person. 332 00:17:43,520 --> 00:17:45,415 And from your side, Percy? 333 00:17:46,440 --> 00:17:48,175 Oh, my God. Look at her. 334 00:17:48,200 --> 00:17:54,015 I mean, wow. She's everything that a woman should embody and more. 335 00:17:54,040 --> 00:17:56,135 Thank you, darling. 336 00:18:06,280 --> 00:18:08,015 Tell us when you're ready. 337 00:18:08,040 --> 00:18:09,535 Oops. 338 00:18:09,560 --> 00:18:13,175 A fur hat... I'm going. I don't care if you're filming or not. 339 00:18:13,200 --> 00:18:15,255 Good. I like your attitude. 340 00:18:19,800 --> 00:18:25,215 You were a trailblazer in so many ways, by being both progressive 341 00:18:25,240 --> 00:18:28,535 and, you know, forward-looking. 342 00:18:28,560 --> 00:18:32,535 Nevertheless, you are also, in certain respects, traditional. 343 00:18:32,560 --> 00:18:35,895 You know, not afraid of a man, erm, who... 344 00:18:35,920 --> 00:18:39,495 Carrying my bags? Opening the door? No, do it. 345 00:18:40,520 --> 00:18:43,735 You know, I mean, I respect that. 346 00:18:43,760 --> 00:18:46,535 And I don't respect people who say, 347 00:18:46,560 --> 00:18:49,015 "I don't want you to open the door for me."” 348 00:18:49,040 --> 00:18:50,735 You know? Yeah, I do. 349 00:18:50,760 --> 00:18:52,935 I am traditional in that respect. 350 00:18:52,960 --> 00:18:55,735 I've read that you said that you're not a fan of the phrase 351 00:18:55,760 --> 00:18:58,695 "toxic masculinity". Oh, no. 352 00:18:58,720 --> 00:19:02,175 The quote was, "We're all too fucking soft now." 353 00:19:02,200 --> 00:19:05,775 That manliness has kind of gone out of fashion. 354 00:19:05,800 --> 00:19:08,775 Is any of this resonating with you? A bit. 355 00:19:08,800 --> 00:19:12,015 Do you stand by that view? Erm, yeah, somewhat. 356 00:19:12,040 --> 00:19:15,175 I think there has been a big change 357 00:19:15,200 --> 00:19:20,255 in how men and women want to be perceived. 358 00:19:20,280 --> 00:19:23,055 Are you on board with MeToo? 359 00:19:23,080 --> 00:19:26,855 Do you feel like that's been a helpful moment in the culture? 360 00:19:26,880 --> 00:19:30,055 I think it's been very good for some women. 361 00:19:30,080 --> 00:19:33,935 I think it's been tragic for some men. 362 00:19:33,960 --> 00:19:38,055 I mean, touching somebody on the shoulder... Mm-hm. 363 00:19:38,080 --> 00:19:41,935 ...or saying to somebody, "You look beautiful,” 364 00:19:41,960 --> 00:19:46,055 or, "I love your dress," this is against the law now? 365 00:19:46,080 --> 00:19:50,375 I mean, I'm sorry, but, no, I don't agree with that. 366 00:19:50,400 --> 00:19:53,855 But I do think that some of these men who've been called out, 367 00:19:53,880 --> 00:19:57,415 because I went through it in my generation of men, 368 00:19:57,440 --> 00:20:00,495 and I know how predatory they were. 369 00:20:01,520 --> 00:20:03,615 Horrible. Horrible. 370 00:20:03,640 --> 00:20:08,535 Everywhere you went. They'd be on the set, it could be a cameraman, 371 00:20:08,560 --> 00:20:10,695 it could be a producer, the director. 372 00:20:10,720 --> 00:20:13,375 Somebody... They'd come to your room, they'd knock, 373 00:20:13,400 --> 00:20:16,455 they'd try to force themselves on you. 374 00:20:16,480 --> 00:20:18,375 It was just a given. 375 00:20:18,400 --> 00:20:22,255 And many, many of the actors expected the leading ladies 376 00:20:22,280 --> 00:20:24,055 to go to bed with them. 377 00:20:24,080 --> 00:20:26,975 I mean, I had that with several of the ones that I worked with. 378 00:20:27,000 --> 00:20:30,775 Which would be, you know, bad enough, but if it's a powerful... 379 00:20:30,800 --> 00:20:34,495 Like, these titans of Hollywood, like Darryl...Darryl Zanuck. Mm. 380 00:20:34,520 --> 00:20:37,855 Well, Darryl Zanuck I had been warned about by Marilyn Monroe. 381 00:20:37,880 --> 00:20:39,775 Who was he? For the viewers. 382 00:20:39,800 --> 00:20:43,255 Darryl Zanuck was the head, head, head honcho of 20th Century Fox, 383 00:20:43,280 --> 00:20:45,775 which is where I was under contract, 384 00:20:45,800 --> 00:20:48,655 and I was warned to watch out for him 385 00:20:48,680 --> 00:20:53,335 because he could kill your career if you didn't go to bed with him. 386 00:20:53,360 --> 00:20:55,215 I mean, and he did. 387 00:20:55,240 --> 00:20:59,295 And one day he found me in the corridor 388 00:20:59,320 --> 00:21:05,695 and, literally puffing his vile cigar smoke breath into my face, 389 00:21:05,720 --> 00:21:09,055 said, "Honey, you haven't had anyone till you've had me. 390 00:21:09,080 --> 00:21:12,455 "I'm the biggest and the best and I can go all night." 391 00:21:12,480 --> 00:21:15,015 Which I thought was one of the most terrifying things 392 00:21:15,040 --> 00:21:16,935 anybody's ever said to me. 393 00:21:16,960 --> 00:21:20,535 And I thought, what do I do here? And I wriggled away... 394 00:21:20,560 --> 00:21:22,895 He literally said that? He literally said that. 395 00:21:22,920 --> 00:21:25,775 I'm the biggest, or I've got the biggest? I'm the biggest. 396 00:21:25,800 --> 00:21:29,535 And he had it on his desk in gold as a paperweight. 397 00:21:29,560 --> 00:21:32,615 His penis? Yes. That's a bit weird, isn't it? 398 00:21:32,640 --> 00:21:36,255 And I'd been told by lots of girls who had actually gone through 399 00:21:36,280 --> 00:21:40,055 that dreadful, erm, event... 400 00:21:40,080 --> 00:21:42,895 ...that he did have it and he was very proud of it. 401 00:21:42,920 --> 00:21:45,455 Have what? His manhood! 402 00:21:45,480 --> 00:21:47,935 It was... It was pretty horrible. 403 00:21:47,960 --> 00:21:50,895 And then, when I refused, I thought, well, I've lost this role. 404 00:21:50,920 --> 00:21:52,775 I'm not going to get this role. 405 00:21:52,800 --> 00:21:55,535 But I'm not going to demean myself by, you know, 406 00:21:55,560 --> 00:21:59,015 allowing him to do... Use me as a plaything. 407 00:22:11,080 --> 00:22:14,055 Joan had been keen for me to sample some of the delights 408 00:22:14,080 --> 00:22:17,775 of the Cote d'Azur, and so I was joining her and Percy 409 00:22:17,800 --> 00:22:21,495 at Tahiti Beach, a fabled local eatery. 410 00:22:21,520 --> 00:22:23,575 Bonjour. 411 00:22:23,600 --> 00:22:25,375 Bonjour, bonjour. 412 00:22:25,400 --> 00:22:27,975 May I join you? Yes, please. 413 00:22:29,040 --> 00:22:32,015 Joan told me she's been coming here since the 1960s 414 00:22:32,040 --> 00:22:34,535 and is always warmly welcomed. 415 00:22:34,560 --> 00:22:38,495 But this time, with cameras in tow, not so much. 416 00:22:39,560 --> 00:22:42,695 Do they have any staff at this place? 417 00:22:42,720 --> 00:22:45,295 Did they know we were coming? Yes. 418 00:22:45,320 --> 00:22:48,015 Well, they're not exactly thrilled by it, are they? 419 00:22:49,520 --> 00:22:51,735 May I see a mirror, please? 420 00:22:51,760 --> 00:22:53,255 Fabulous. 421 00:22:53,280 --> 00:22:55,375 Good light. 422 00:22:55,400 --> 00:23:00,055 This is one of the oldest restaurants in Saint-Tropez. 423 00:23:00,080 --> 00:23:02,735 Whenever I come here, I just get fascinated 424 00:23:02,760 --> 00:23:04,495 by looking out at the sea. 425 00:23:04,520 --> 00:23:06,895 I love looking at water. 426 00:23:06,920 --> 00:23:09,615 It's just so beautiful. Frank Sinatra would love it here. 427 00:23:09,640 --> 00:23:12,295 Were you friendly with Frank Sinatra? First name basis. 428 00:23:12,320 --> 00:23:15,735 I did a film with him. You were quite friendly with Harry Belafonte. 429 00:23:15,760 --> 00:23:18,215 I was, yes. Quite friendly. 430 00:23:19,240 --> 00:23:20,855 Close your ears. 431 00:23:20,880 --> 00:23:24,055 You said that he had the most beautiful body you'd ever seen, 432 00:23:24,080 --> 00:23:26,775 or male body. I didn't say that. What did you say? 433 00:23:26,800 --> 00:23:30,455 I said he had a beautiful body. I didn't say that I'd ever seen. 434 00:23:30,480 --> 00:23:34,055 | noticed there were two editions of your first memoir, 435 00:23:34,080 --> 00:23:37,055 and they were slightly different. One was a bit more discreet. 436 00:23:37,080 --> 00:23:39,735 The second one left a few things out. 437 00:23:39,760 --> 00:23:41,295 Yes. 438 00:23:41,320 --> 00:23:45,055 Because my agent, Swifty, the first one, I said, 439 00:23:45,080 --> 00:23:47,695 "I've got all these wonderful stories about, you know, 440 00:23:47,720 --> 00:23:50,295 "when I met Laurence Olivier and John Gielgud..." 441 00:23:50,320 --> 00:23:53,535 He said, "Screw that." He said, "We don't want to hear about..." 442 00:23:53,560 --> 00:23:55,775 You know, "..you meeting Laurence Olivier." 443 00:23:55,800 --> 00:23:58,015 You know, "We want to hear who you fucked.” 444 00:23:58,040 --> 00:23:59,775 And so that's what I did. 445 00:23:59,800 --> 00:24:02,615 And maybe you went a little too far? Yeah. 446 00:24:02,640 --> 00:24:06,455 To some people's tastes. I did. But enough about Harry Belafonte. 447 00:24:06,480 --> 00:24:08,775 Let's talk about Percy Gibson. 448 00:24:08,800 --> 00:24:12,575 Now, he has the most beautiful body she's ever seen. 449 00:24:12,600 --> 00:24:16,495 If Percy Gibson was the greatest lover you've ever been with, 450 00:24:16,520 --> 00:24:18,495 who was the second greatest? 451 00:24:18,520 --> 00:24:20,015 PERCY LAUGHS 452 00:24:20,040 --> 00:24:21,735 I'm not answering that. 453 00:24:21,760 --> 00:24:24,295 I put that in just a sentence, 454 00:24:24,320 --> 00:24:28,815 and it was a throwaway sentence in my book, I know that. 455 00:24:28,840 --> 00:24:31,015 THEY LAUGH To Percy. 456 00:24:46,800 --> 00:24:51,295 Do you feel like you were judged by different standards in your career? 457 00:24:51,320 --> 00:24:54,695 You've described yourself as a serial monogamist. Yes. 458 00:24:54,720 --> 00:24:57,535 But looking at some of the clips over the years, 459 00:24:57,560 --> 00:25:00,975 there's a lot of quite nasty joking at your expense 460 00:25:01,000 --> 00:25:06,055 on various TV shows suggesting that you were sexually voracious, or... 461 00:25:06,080 --> 00:25:10,055 I know. ..there's some sort of judgment attached to you 462 00:25:10,080 --> 00:25:13,055 having had a sort of relatively normal romantic life. 463 00:25:13,080 --> 00:25:16,775 Yes, absolutely. I totally agree with you. 464 00:25:16,800 --> 00:25:21,775 And if you compare how I was in the '50s, '60s and '70s, 465 00:25:21,800 --> 00:25:24,935 in between husbands, with the way that some actresses, 466 00:25:24,960 --> 00:25:28,055 I shan't mention any names, are today, 467 00:25:28,080 --> 00:25:33,055 erm, I was positively nun-like, really. Mm. 468 00:25:33,080 --> 00:25:36,735 Yeah, I had a lot of boyfriends. I had a lot of boyfriends at RADA. 469 00:25:36,760 --> 00:25:39,295 It was the normal thing that you do, 470 00:25:39,320 --> 00:25:44,215 and you try out, you know, different permutations of men. 471 00:25:46,800 --> 00:25:49,295 I don't want to be... At a loss for words, Louis? 472 00:25:49,320 --> 00:25:51,975 No, I'm just trying to find the right... 473 00:25:52,000 --> 00:25:55,015 It won't be news to you that you've had five husbands. 474 00:25:56,560 --> 00:25:59,375 No, it won't be news to me, strangely enough. 475 00:25:59,400 --> 00:26:02,935 I mean, and the first one, Maxwell Reed, 476 00:26:02,960 --> 00:26:06,495 sounded like an absolute beast. 477 00:26:06,520 --> 00:26:07,895 Yes. 478 00:26:07,920 --> 00:26:10,375 Well, the thing is, that Maxwell Reed, 479 00:26:10,400 --> 00:26:13,295 and nobody will remember this except, you know, 480 00:26:13,320 --> 00:26:17,255 people who are very, very old, was a very big English movie star. 481 00:26:17,280 --> 00:26:19,535 And I cut his picture out, 482 00:26:19,560 --> 00:26:23,215 and I had three or four pages in my scrapbook 483 00:26:23,240 --> 00:26:25,775 filled with pictures of Maxwell Reed. Mm. 484 00:26:25,800 --> 00:26:29,535 And I had a picture of him under my desk at school, 485 00:26:29,560 --> 00:26:33,055 and I used to tell the girls, "I'm going to marry him one day." 486 00:26:33,080 --> 00:26:35,535 And then when I finally did meet him, 487 00:26:35,560 --> 00:26:39,495 when I was 18, and he asked me out on a date, 488 00:26:39,520 --> 00:26:41,495 I went. 489 00:26:41,520 --> 00:26:44,055 He was 32. I was 18. 32?7 OK. 490 00:26:44,080 --> 00:26:46,495 So he was quite a bit older anyway. Yes, yes. 491 00:26:46,520 --> 00:26:49,055 I was 18, but I was going on, 492 00:26:49,080 --> 00:26:53,535 in terms of a young woman of today, 11... Mm. 493 00:26:53,560 --> 00:26:56,295 ...in terms of knowledge of men, knowledge of... 494 00:26:56,320 --> 00:26:59,055 Inexperienced in the arts of love. Yeah. 495 00:26:59,080 --> 00:27:02,095 Of anything, of anything. I'd never seen a naked man. 496 00:27:02,120 --> 00:27:04,055 Never. 497 00:27:04,080 --> 00:27:06,455 I was a virgin. Very much so. 498 00:27:06,480 --> 00:27:09,055 You know, I had been brought up to be a virgin. 499 00:27:09,080 --> 00:27:12,735 I'd been brought up to believe that you didn't do anything with a man 500 00:27:12,760 --> 00:27:14,695 unless you were married. 501 00:27:14,720 --> 00:27:18,415 So when you went out on that first date with Maxwell Reed, 502 00:27:18,440 --> 00:27:20,535 can you talk about what happened? 503 00:27:20,560 --> 00:27:24,055 Well... First of all, this was at a time when 504 00:27:24,080 --> 00:27:29,295 there were a lot of private clubs in London that were in houses, 505 00:27:29,320 --> 00:27:32,535 so when we went to Hanover Square and walked... 506 00:27:32,560 --> 00:27:36,535 And went up three flights of very dark stairs, 507 00:27:36,560 --> 00:27:38,815 and I said, "Well, where are we going?" 508 00:27:39,880 --> 00:27:43,015 And he said, "Oh, a club. The Country Club.” 509 00:27:44,280 --> 00:27:46,775 And I didn't think anything of it. 510 00:27:46,800 --> 00:27:49,535 And then when we got into this apartment, 511 00:27:49,560 --> 00:27:52,295 he said, "Do you want a drink, honey?" 512 00:27:52,320 --> 00:27:55,535 And I said, "Yeah. Can I have a rum and coke?" 513 00:27:55,560 --> 00:27:59,295 That's what I drank in those days, thinking it was so sophisticated. 514 00:27:59,320 --> 00:28:03,015 And he said, "All right, I'll give you a drink and I'll take a shower. 515 00:28:03,040 --> 00:28:04,775 I thought, take a shower? 516 00:28:04,800 --> 00:28:09,175 He'd just picked me up and he's going to take a shower? 517 00:28:09,200 --> 00:28:12,255 And he said, "I'll give you a book to amuse you." 518 00:28:12,280 --> 00:28:14,535 And he gave me this book, 519 00:28:14,560 --> 00:28:19,495 and it was etchings of a pornographic nature, 520 00:28:19,520 --> 00:28:21,495 which I'd never seen before. 521 00:28:21,520 --> 00:28:25,015 And I was looking at this book and drinking my rum and coke, 522 00:28:25,040 --> 00:28:28,255 and the next thing I knew... 523 00:28:29,800 --> 00:28:32,815 ...I was coming to on the sofa, and... 524 00:28:33,880 --> 00:28:38,335 ...he had, as they say in Victorian novels, had his way with me. 525 00:28:38,360 --> 00:28:40,015 I was raped. 526 00:28:43,080 --> 00:28:46,015 Horrible experience. I don't wish to relive it. No. 527 00:28:46,040 --> 00:28:48,015 That's all I'm going to say. 528 00:28:49,600 --> 00:28:51,855 Well, we should just reflect, though, 529 00:28:51,880 --> 00:28:55,495 that that having happened, you married him. Yeah. 530 00:28:57,760 --> 00:29:00,295 How did you rationalise it? I don't know. 531 00:29:00,320 --> 00:29:04,535 I was... I told you, I was 18 going on 11. Seriously. 532 00:29:04,560 --> 00:29:07,175 So you thought maybe this is how... I rationalised it... 533 00:29:07,200 --> 00:29:09,055 Oh, well, he's done this to me. 534 00:29:09,080 --> 00:29:12,055 Mummy always said if you did it, you'd have to get married. 535 00:29:12,080 --> 00:29:15,015 He was the one who wanted to get married. 536 00:29:15,040 --> 00:29:17,935 Off we went to our honeymoon, 537 00:29:17,960 --> 00:29:21,415 which was a disaster. It was in the south of France. 538 00:29:22,440 --> 00:29:25,495 We were in Cannes, it was a hot day, 539 00:29:25,520 --> 00:29:29,535 and, erm, I was... 540 00:29:29,560 --> 00:29:31,695 ...talking to these beach boys. 541 00:29:31,720 --> 00:29:36,295 You know, I was in a bikini, we were on the beach, and he hit me. 542 00:29:36,320 --> 00:29:39,815 It was the first time and the last I've ever been hit by a man. 543 00:29:39,840 --> 00:29:45,055 And I then finally graduated from being 11 to being 12, 544 00:29:45,080 --> 00:29:49,455 and, erm, realised I had married a complete nutter. 545 00:29:53,480 --> 00:29:57,095 I married Maxwell Reed. Mistake. 546 00:29:57,120 --> 00:30:00,055 I married Anthony Newley, my second husband, 547 00:30:00,080 --> 00:30:04,935 because I fell in love with his enormous talent. Mm. 548 00:30:04,960 --> 00:30:07,295 I loved what he did as a singer. 549 00:30:07,320 --> 00:30:10,295 He's not as well remembered as he should be. He's not. 550 00:30:10,320 --> 00:30:13,695 Incredible songwriter who wrote Goldfinger. 551 00:30:13,720 --> 00:30:18,295 No, no, he hasn't been. I met him when I was 28. 552 00:30:18,320 --> 00:30:20,055 You know, I fell for him. 553 00:30:20,080 --> 00:30:23,415 And he's the father of two of my children. 554 00:30:23,440 --> 00:30:26,815 We had a very good marriage, I thought. 555 00:30:26,840 --> 00:30:28,535 WRY LAUGH 556 00:30:28,560 --> 00:30:32,775 I thought, until I realised after seven years 557 00:30:32,800 --> 00:30:37,535 that he was a serial, erm... womaniser. 558 00:30:37,560 --> 00:30:41,535 And he admitted it in this dreadful film he did 559 00:30:41,560 --> 00:30:44,495 called Can Heironymus Merkin Ever Forget Mercy Humppe 560 00:30:44,520 --> 00:30:46,455 and Find True Happiness? 561 00:30:51,080 --> 00:30:54,735 Heironymus Merkin is an idiosyncratic film musical 562 00:30:54,760 --> 00:30:59,535 by Anthony Newley, in which Joan played Polyester Poontang, 563 00:30:59,560 --> 00:31:03,015 the on-screen wife of her real-life husband. 564 00:31:03,040 --> 00:31:06,015 # I'm a fool, maybe 565 00:31:07,040 --> 00:31:11,015 # But I don't mind chalk 566 00:31:11,040 --> 00:31:15,255 # With my cheese... # 567 00:31:17,080 --> 00:31:20,015 Taking inspiration from Newley's life... 568 00:31:20,040 --> 00:31:22,255 My wife doesn't understand me. 569 00:31:22,280 --> 00:31:26,015 ...it turned out to be a none-too- discreet admission on film 570 00:31:26,040 --> 00:31:28,015 of his infidelities. 571 00:31:29,720 --> 00:31:31,775 I saw the film. 572 00:31:31,800 --> 00:31:34,255 Universal gave me a private screening. 573 00:31:34,280 --> 00:31:36,055 And... 574 00:31:36,080 --> 00:31:41,535 ...I was in floods of tears at the end of it. 575 00:31:41,560 --> 00:31:46,735 I couldn't believe that this was what he would do. 576 00:31:49,200 --> 00:31:52,695 He admitted that he had had lots of affairs 577 00:31:52,720 --> 00:31:56,375 and couldn't stop, and was going to continue having lots of affairs 578 00:31:56,400 --> 00:31:58,975 and could not be faithful to one woman. 579 00:31:59,000 --> 00:32:02,215 And I said, "I'll have a separation. 580 00:32:02,240 --> 00:32:05,295 "I can't live like this." 581 00:32:05,320 --> 00:32:09,775 I felt that my life still had a good way to go. 582 00:32:11,560 --> 00:32:15,975 Then, sadly, my next husband, Ron Kass, 583 00:32:16,000 --> 00:32:18,255 he developed a drug habit. 584 00:32:18,280 --> 00:32:21,535 While you were married? Yes, while we were married. 585 00:32:22,800 --> 00:32:24,655 Then Peter Holm... 586 00:32:24,680 --> 00:32:28,775 A former pop star turned, what? Businessman, was he? 587 00:32:28,800 --> 00:32:31,415 Former pop star turned gigolo? 588 00:32:31,440 --> 00:32:33,375 Oh, I can't say that. No. 589 00:32:33,400 --> 00:32:35,095 Former pop star, yeah. 590 00:32:35,120 --> 00:32:38,055 He's not here to, you know, give his version, 591 00:32:38,080 --> 00:32:42,055 but from the clippings, he comes across as a bit of a fortune seeker. 592 00:32:42,080 --> 00:32:44,495 Yes, I think you might be right there. 593 00:32:46,080 --> 00:32:49,735 I have had a lot of horrible things happen to me. 594 00:32:50,800 --> 00:32:53,055 But, you know, I believe in marriage, 595 00:32:53,080 --> 00:32:55,335 which is why I've done it five times! No. 596 00:32:55,360 --> 00:32:57,055 I believe in marriage. 597 00:32:57,080 --> 00:32:59,455 And I finally have a wonderful marriage. 598 00:32:59,480 --> 00:33:01,375 You and Percy? Mm-hm. 599 00:33:01,400 --> 00:33:04,535 One of the things you've said is, I can't remember the exact quote, 600 00:33:04,560 --> 00:33:07,015 but you said, "Oh, I'd never go out with an older man. 601 00:33:07,040 --> 00:33:09,975 “I much prefer younger men." Yes. 602 00:33:10,000 --> 00:33:13,815 Percy is 30-odd years younger than me. 603 00:33:13,840 --> 00:33:16,455 What is it about younger men? 604 00:33:16,480 --> 00:33:19,775 First of all, I don't even feel my age. You know what that is. 605 00:33:19,800 --> 00:33:22,495 I don't even talk about it. I don't think about it. 606 00:33:22,520 --> 00:33:25,055 And I just feel that I couldn't... 607 00:33:25,080 --> 00:33:29,255 I have some friends around my age and, erm... 608 00:33:30,280 --> 00:33:32,975 ...I don't find them interesting. 609 00:33:33,000 --> 00:33:36,495 Let's hope they're not watching. JOAN LAUGHS 610 00:33:38,560 --> 00:33:41,495 Everybody's gotten older except me. Mm. 611 00:33:48,760 --> 00:33:50,775 Despite the gap in years, 612 00:33:50,800 --> 00:33:53,855 Joan and Percy's love has proved a lasting one. 613 00:33:55,040 --> 00:33:58,055 OK, so we're going that way? 614 00:33:58,080 --> 00:34:01,775 You lead. I lead. We're in your manor. 615 00:34:02,840 --> 00:34:05,695 Hoping to see them in their weekly routine, 616 00:34:05,720 --> 00:34:08,575 I join them at the Saint-Tropez open air market. 617 00:34:09,640 --> 00:34:12,535 Joan had offered to give me some style tips. 618 00:34:12,560 --> 00:34:16,375 Louis, do you like hats? This one's quite chic. 619 00:34:17,400 --> 00:34:19,295 Percy, you don't wear a hat. 620 00:34:19,320 --> 00:34:22,015 I'm starting to model my grooming on you, I think. 621 00:34:23,040 --> 00:34:25,495 Would you wear this? Let me see. 622 00:34:25,520 --> 00:34:27,055 I think... 623 00:34:27,080 --> 00:34:30,695 Latin Americans have such style, don't they Joan? Yes. 624 00:34:30,720 --> 00:34:33,855 Particularly if they're Peruvians. Yes, we do. Peruvians. 625 00:34:33,880 --> 00:34:36,575 No! THEY LAUGH 626 00:34:37,640 --> 00:34:40,255 You should get one of these for your wife. 627 00:34:40,280 --> 00:34:43,135 You just throw them on around the house. 628 00:34:43,160 --> 00:34:44,855 Those are really good. 629 00:34:44,880 --> 00:34:48,535 Are you bringing her a present? Erm... What's her name? Nancy. 630 00:34:48,560 --> 00:34:51,055 Nancy. I should do, shouldn't I? This would be great. 631 00:34:51,080 --> 00:34:54,535 Does she like black? Erm, she does. She would love that. All right. 632 00:34:54,560 --> 00:34:58,055 You can tell her that I chose it for her. All right, I think I will. 633 00:34:58,080 --> 00:35:01,055 OK. And she will... I mean, but you can just wear it anywhere... 634 00:35:01,080 --> 00:35:04,295 I can never tell how she's going to react when I buy her something. 635 00:35:04,320 --> 00:35:07,055 Oh, really? But I'UL go for it. I'll say Joan suggested it. 636 00:35:07,080 --> 00:35:09,535 Have you got a secretary, or, I mean, a private... 637 00:35:09,560 --> 00:35:12,095 I've got a personal assistant. Lady? Yeah. 638 00:35:12,120 --> 00:35:13,695 Then give it to her. 639 00:35:13,720 --> 00:35:16,495 I tell you, if somebody gave me that, I would be very pleased. 640 00:35:16,520 --> 00:35:18,175 All right. Leave it with me. OK. 641 00:35:20,640 --> 00:35:24,135 Do you need anything? Could you hold that for me? Of course. 642 00:35:24,160 --> 00:35:27,375 I'm your smallest fan. PERCY LAUGHS 643 00:35:30,880 --> 00:35:33,255 Do you want me to... Why don't I carry something? 644 00:35:33,280 --> 00:35:35,575 No, no, you do the fan. OK. 645 00:35:41,720 --> 00:35:45,775 Amid the stalls, I had a moment to reflect on the love Joan and Percy 646 00:35:45,800 --> 00:35:49,815 had found together, based on a perfect meshing of their qualities - 647 00:35:49,840 --> 00:35:52,535 her ageless beauty and artistry, 648 00:35:52,560 --> 00:35:56,015 his good humour and instinct for calm management. 649 00:35:57,040 --> 00:35:58,695 This is it. 650 00:35:58,720 --> 00:36:01,735 Shopping done, we went to cool down in a cafe. 651 00:36:02,760 --> 00:36:05,255 There we go. Thank you so much. 652 00:36:05,280 --> 00:36:08,015 Are you getting anything from that? Yeah, a lot. 653 00:36:09,080 --> 00:36:11,975 There's also a nice breeze coming from somewhere else. 654 00:36:12,000 --> 00:36:14,255 What he did... LOUD CRASH 655 00:36:15,320 --> 00:36:18,055 Oh, my God... That was ten seconds. That was the fast... 656 00:36:18,080 --> 00:36:20,895 Ten seconds had gone by. You're going to be charged for that. 657 00:36:20,920 --> 00:36:22,935 The BBC will have to pay. 658 00:36:22,960 --> 00:36:26,295 Ten seconds... You saw it. It was fine when I left it. 659 00:36:26,320 --> 00:36:29,015 PERCY LAUGHS Someone else did something. 660 00:36:29,040 --> 00:36:31,015 Yeah. I saw nothing! 661 00:36:31,040 --> 00:36:33,015 THEY LAUGH 662 00:36:34,080 --> 00:36:36,535 Conversation turned to the recent death 663 00:36:36,560 --> 00:36:39,135 of one of Joan's industry peers, Jane Birkin. 664 00:36:39,160 --> 00:36:41,895 Amidst the news coverage had been an article 665 00:36:41,920 --> 00:36:43,815 that took a bit of a dig at Joan. 666 00:36:43,840 --> 00:36:47,055 I was quite hurt by it, actually. 667 00:36:47,080 --> 00:36:51,775 It was saying, in a way, how wonderful everything in French was 668 00:36:51,800 --> 00:36:55,535 and how tacky and awful everything in England was. Oh. 669 00:36:55,560 --> 00:36:58,735 And the first thing that he said was, "Jane Birkin... 670 00:36:58,760 --> 00:37:00,775 "The French have Jane Birkin..." 671 00:37:00,800 --> 00:37:03,935 "The French have Jane Birkin, the English have Joan Collins." 672 00:37:03,960 --> 00:37:06,815 And then it went on, "The French have the Eiffel Tower, 673 00:37:06,840 --> 00:37:09,775 "the English have..." Blackpool Tower. Blackpool Tower. 674 00:37:09,800 --> 00:37:12,055 But that goes to the heart of something... 675 00:37:12,080 --> 00:37:14,815 Do you not feel completely appreciated? 676 00:37:14,840 --> 00:37:17,335 I'm not saying I'm not appreciated. 677 00:37:17,360 --> 00:37:21,055 Erm... I think I have become more. 678 00:37:21,080 --> 00:37:26,535 But there's a grudging kind of, "Yeah, she's terrific in many ways, 679 00:37:26,560 --> 00:37:31,295 "but she can't act and she can just play these roles and..." 680 00:37:31,320 --> 00:37:37,535 You know. And early reviews of everything only talked about 681 00:37:37,560 --> 00:37:41,695 the way I looked and, you know, "the way she swung her hips", 682 00:37:41,720 --> 00:37:47,295 or, "the way she made...", you know, "..Google eyes at her lead men. 683 00:37:47,320 --> 00:37:51,695 Yeah, they were always very half-assed snide. 684 00:37:51,720 --> 00:37:53,335 Do you care? 685 00:37:53,360 --> 00:37:55,735 No. You're bringing it up. 686 00:37:56,800 --> 00:37:59,295 I don't care. I think you're very loved, 687 00:37:59,320 --> 00:38:02,495 and I think it's easy to hear the criticism 688 00:38:02,520 --> 00:38:04,455 but not hear all the praise. 689 00:38:04,480 --> 00:38:06,455 I think it's very human. 690 00:38:06,480 --> 00:38:09,255 I think I'm identified, 691 00:38:09,280 --> 00:38:13,055 very much so still by many people, 692 00:38:13,080 --> 00:38:17,255 with Alexis and all of the movies that I've done 693 00:38:17,280 --> 00:38:19,215 in which I played a baddie. 694 00:38:19,240 --> 00:38:21,055 What was the other one? 695 00:38:21,080 --> 00:38:27,015 And then they like to move that on to your personal life as well. 696 00:38:27,040 --> 00:38:32,015 You feel it's prevented people from seeing everything you can do? 697 00:38:33,280 --> 00:38:36,695 Yes, it has. There's no question. 698 00:38:36,720 --> 00:38:40,335 I remember Sue Mengers, big Hollywood agent, 699 00:38:40,360 --> 00:38:42,295 saying to me years ago, 700 00:38:42,320 --> 00:38:46,695 after my children were, like, four and five, four and six, 701 00:38:46,720 --> 00:38:50,055 I said, "I really would like to get back in the business,” you know. 702 00:38:50,080 --> 00:38:53,375 And she said, "Honey, if you want to get back in the business, 703 00:38:53,400 --> 00:38:56,135 "take off your make-up and don't get your hair done 704 00:38:56,160 --> 00:38:59,135 "and wear some drab clothes so they take you seriously.” 705 00:38:59,160 --> 00:39:02,015 I said, "Really? Is that what it's going to take? 706 00:39:02,040 --> 00:39:03,935 "I'm going to have to do that?" 707 00:39:03,960 --> 00:39:08,535 I said, "I grew up with a mother and ten aunts 708 00:39:08,560 --> 00:39:12,295 "who were all incredibly glamorous, who always had their hair done, 709 00:39:12,320 --> 00:39:15,015 "who always wore make-up, who always wore nice clothes, 710 00:39:15,040 --> 00:39:17,055 "even going to the supermarket.” 711 00:39:17,080 --> 00:39:19,495 We didn't have supermarkets then, but the market. 712 00:39:19,520 --> 00:39:21,775 "So why should I throw all that up 713 00:39:21,800 --> 00:39:27,535 "so that some ditzy casting director can think that I can act? 714 00:39:27,560 --> 00:39:31,055 "Because I go around with no make-up and my hair scraped back,” you know? 715 00:39:31,080 --> 00:39:34,015 It's, erm... So I decided to be true to myself. 716 00:39:41,080 --> 00:39:44,295 For the last 30 years while being true to herself, 717 00:39:44,320 --> 00:39:48,495 Joan has worked consistently finding success in her profession, 718 00:39:48,520 --> 00:39:50,975 but perhaps more importantly, 719 00:39:51,000 --> 00:39:54,735 enjoying the contentment that comes from having a strong relationship. 720 00:39:56,560 --> 00:40:00,495 Her appetite for work and life remaining undiminished. 721 00:40:05,320 --> 00:40:08,055 Considering your achievement, you know... 722 00:40:08,080 --> 00:40:11,375 ...your vast body of work across all the different media, 723 00:40:11,400 --> 00:40:14,375 your public role, your role as yourself 724 00:40:14,400 --> 00:40:18,295 has been maybe your greatest one, because a lot of it's to do 725 00:40:18,320 --> 00:40:21,055 with your Joan Collins-ness, if that makes sense. 726 00:40:21,080 --> 00:40:23,135 JOAN LAUGHS Joan Collins-ness! 727 00:40:23,160 --> 00:40:28,055 Your ability to inhabit stardom or celebrity, to endure setbacks 728 00:40:28,080 --> 00:40:32,295 with grace, to have public failures, but also public triumphs. 729 00:40:32,320 --> 00:40:34,775 I mean, I know you haven't won an Oscar, right, 730 00:40:34,800 --> 00:40:37,535 You won a Golden Globe. It was for... And People's Choice. 731 00:40:37,560 --> 00:40:40,535 For Dynasty. People's Choice. So you've won accolades. 732 00:40:40,560 --> 00:40:44,295 But not, forgive me, I feel churlish to even say it, 733 00:40:44,320 --> 00:40:47,415 but not at the very highest level. I know. Yeah, I agree. 734 00:40:47,440 --> 00:40:51,535 And nevertheless, you are a cultural figure of significance, 735 00:40:51,560 --> 00:40:54,495 and I just wonder if that's by dint of who you are 736 00:40:54,520 --> 00:40:56,415 and how you've played out your life. 737 00:40:56,440 --> 00:41:01,055 I just can't think that I'm a cultural figure of significance. 738 00:41:01,080 --> 00:41:02,495 No. 739 00:41:02,520 --> 00:41:04,735 I mean, thank you for that. 740 00:41:04,760 --> 00:41:08,495 I do know that I am a national treasure. Apparently. 741 00:41:08,520 --> 00:41:10,535 And I'm called an icon. 742 00:41:10,560 --> 00:41:13,775 And maybe it's because they've all seen something. 743 00:41:13,800 --> 00:41:18,495 And so I think I'm Llike a thorn in people's side. 744 00:41:18,520 --> 00:41:20,255 I'm just there. 745 00:41:22,520 --> 00:41:25,015 I'm going to say a rude word. 746 00:41:25,040 --> 00:41:27,055 Retirement. 747 00:41:27,080 --> 00:41:30,175 What's that? THEY LAUGH 748 00:41:30,200 --> 00:41:33,295 I think you know. Do you still keep a secret of your age? Not really. 749 00:41:33,320 --> 00:41:35,775 I don't keep a secret, but I don't talk about it... 750 00:41:35,800 --> 00:41:38,215 I'll say it. No, I don't... Is it very gauche of me... 751 00:41:38,240 --> 00:41:41,055 Close your ears while I announce to the viewing public... 752 00:41:41,080 --> 00:41:42,975 Don't say it. OK. 753 00:41:43,000 --> 00:41:45,495 Why should I be defined by a number? 754 00:41:45,520 --> 00:41:48,575 Nevertheless, you could retire if you... I mean, it doesn't... 755 00:41:48,600 --> 00:41:51,295 Who's going to support me? According to Google, 756 00:41:51,320 --> 00:41:55,615 you're worth, I think, 20 or 30 million. That's absolute bollocks. 757 00:41:55,640 --> 00:41:58,575 That is such bollocks. Steady. No need for that kind of language. 758 00:41:58,600 --> 00:42:00,775 Thank you, Google. You're turning the air blue. Yeah. 759 00:42:00,800 --> 00:42:03,015 I mean, where do they get that number from? 760 00:42:03,040 --> 00:42:07,255 Maybe they Googled it. Maybe it's what I've made during my life. 761 00:42:07,280 --> 00:42:10,175 I think you would have made more than that, surely. No. 762 00:42:10,200 --> 00:42:13,255 I don't think so. I've never been that well paid. 763 00:42:13,280 --> 00:42:16,775 And I want to work. I like to work. You have no plans to slow down? 764 00:42:16,800 --> 00:42:18,775 Oh, I am slowing down. 765 00:42:18,800 --> 00:42:23,775 I am. Compared to what I was doing in Dynasty, I'm a snail 766 00:42:23,800 --> 00:42:26,335 But you'll keep working. That's what I'm hearing. 767 00:42:26,360 --> 00:42:28,535 I'll keep working if I'm asked. 768 00:42:29,560 --> 00:42:32,495 I went to see an astrologist. 769 00:42:32,520 --> 00:42:35,055 I'm quite into astrology. 770 00:42:35,080 --> 00:42:40,015 And he said to me, "You have nine lives. 771 00:42:40,040 --> 00:42:43,015 "You are going to go on for a very, very long time." 772 00:42:45,000 --> 00:42:46,975 You never asked my star sign. 773 00:42:47,000 --> 00:42:49,015 What is it? Can't you tell? 774 00:42:49,040 --> 00:42:52,055 Aries? No. Taurus. 775 00:42:52,080 --> 00:42:54,055 Oh, Taurus? May 20th. 776 00:42:54,080 --> 00:42:57,695 Oh, really? I know you're May 23rd, aren't you? Yes. 777 00:42:57,720 --> 00:43:03,255 Apparently, Taurus and Gemini aren't a good fit as lovers, 778 00:43:03,280 --> 00:43:08,175 but they can be great friends. But they have to be a little patient. 779 00:43:09,560 --> 00:43:12,695 To be friends? Mm. Well, we'll be great friends. 780 00:43:12,720 --> 00:43:16,455 Yeah, I'd like that. I'll invite you to my Christmas party. Thank you. 781 00:43:16,480 --> 00:43:19,055 If you'd like to come. I would love to. 782 00:43:19,080 --> 00:43:21,255 I only have people that I really like. 783 00:43:22,800 --> 00:43:25,855 OK. Thank you. It's a wrap. 784 00:43:25,880 --> 00:43:27,935 THEY LAUGH