1 00:00:02,959 --> 00:00:04,830 - This is Ammon Bundy. 2 00:00:04,917 --> 00:00:09,835 I normally do not do, you know, a quick video like this. 3 00:00:09,922 --> 00:00:12,838 But I felt it very important that I do it 4 00:00:12,925 --> 00:00:15,058 because of the circumstances. 5 00:00:15,145 --> 00:00:16,842 [dramatic music] 6 00:00:16,929 --> 00:00:19,932 - For many decades, Cliven Bundy had been grazing 7 00:00:20,020 --> 00:00:21,891 his cattle on federal land. 8 00:00:21,978 --> 00:00:25,416 And he decided, I'm not going to pay my grazing fees anymore. 9 00:00:25,503 --> 00:00:27,244 We're talking millions of dollars. 10 00:00:27,331 --> 00:00:29,551 - And suddenly, you went from this is a cattle issue-- 11 00:00:29,638 --> 00:00:31,118 [shouting] 12 00:00:31,205 --> 00:00:33,816 --to you have somebody in an overpass 13 00:00:33,903 --> 00:00:38,560 with a scoped high-power rifle, 14 00:00:38,647 --> 00:00:41,824 pointing it at a federal agent. 15 00:00:41,911 --> 00:00:44,696 - Long gun. Sidearm. 16 00:00:44,783 --> 00:00:49,223 These guys are coming on display. 17 00:00:49,310 --> 00:00:51,007 They're calling for people to come. 18 00:00:51,094 --> 00:00:52,226 - We need your help. 19 00:00:52,313 --> 00:00:53,488 - They're looking for a fight. 20 00:00:53,575 --> 00:00:56,056 [shouting] 21 00:00:56,143 --> 00:00:57,274 - We don't have the numbers. 22 00:00:57,361 --> 00:00:59,189 And this is going to be a bad outcome. 23 00:00:59,276 --> 00:01:03,193 [gunshots] 24 00:01:03,280 --> 00:01:05,717 [dramatic music] 25 00:01:05,804 --> 00:01:08,545 - In the FBI, we make a lot of headlines. 26 00:01:08,633 --> 00:01:11,419 ♪ ♪ 27 00:01:11,506 --> 00:01:13,073 Drug busts, 28 00:01:13,160 --> 00:01:15,640 mob stings, 29 00:01:15,727 --> 00:01:17,686 terrorist takedowns. 30 00:01:17,773 --> 00:01:19,949 - Get down! Get down! 31 00:01:20,036 --> 00:01:22,125 - We understand why people want to tell stories about us. 32 00:01:22,212 --> 00:01:23,518 - Mark it. 33 00:01:23,605 --> 00:01:24,693 - Freeze! - FBI. 34 00:01:24,780 --> 00:01:26,260 - FBI! - Action! 35 00:01:26,347 --> 00:01:28,479 - But they don't know the half of it. 36 00:01:28,566 --> 00:01:30,525 [indistinct radio chatter] 37 00:01:30,612 --> 00:01:32,309 What really goes down, 38 00:01:32,396 --> 00:01:34,658 we save that for each other 39 00:01:34,746 --> 00:01:36,574 when we're talking agent-to-agent. 40 00:01:36,661 --> 00:01:39,838 ♪ ♪ 41 00:01:39,925 --> 00:01:43,320 This is "FBI True." 42 00:01:46,889 --> 00:01:50,762 [tense music] 43 00:01:50,848 --> 00:01:53,417 - Explain to me what Bunkerville is. 44 00:01:53,503 --> 00:01:57,291 - Kristy Kottis is a 24-year veteran of the FBI. 45 00:01:57,378 --> 00:02:00,163 She worked gangs, crimes against children, 46 00:02:00,250 --> 00:02:03,471 as well as human and drug trafficking. 47 00:02:03,558 --> 00:02:06,865 - What happened in Bunkerville was something that 48 00:02:06,952 --> 00:02:10,130 had been boiling for decades. 49 00:02:10,217 --> 00:02:16,179 ♪ ♪ 50 00:02:16,266 --> 00:02:19,008 Cliven Bundy had been running his ranch 51 00:02:19,095 --> 00:02:22,316 and grazing his cattle 52 00:02:22,403 --> 00:02:26,581 on federal land for many decades. 53 00:02:26,668 --> 00:02:28,844 - Greg Bretzing followed in his father's footsteps 54 00:02:28,931 --> 00:02:32,413 when he joined the FBI in 1995. 55 00:02:32,500 --> 00:02:34,719 He retired as special agent in charge of the 56 00:02:34,805 --> 00:02:38,593 Portland, Oregon field office. 57 00:02:38,680 --> 00:02:41,987 - And at some point in time, Cliven Bundy decided, 58 00:02:42,074 --> 00:02:44,728 I'm not going to pay my grazing fees anymore. 59 00:02:44,816 --> 00:02:50,039 And case after case went to federal court in which he lost 60 00:02:50,126 --> 00:02:54,174 and was ordered to pay back fees, pay interest, 61 00:02:54,261 --> 00:02:58,308 or get his cattle off the land. 62 00:02:58,395 --> 00:03:00,658 And every time, he refused to do so. 63 00:03:00,745 --> 00:03:04,575 [cows lowing] 64 00:03:04,662 --> 00:03:07,230 - So, Eric, when are you first hearing about Bunkerville? 65 00:03:07,317 --> 00:03:09,754 - It's back at headquarters, actually on the Seventh Floor. 66 00:03:09,841 --> 00:03:11,974 But I'd spent enough time in my career out West 67 00:03:12,061 --> 00:03:15,586 that I was familiar with the territory, some of the issues. 68 00:03:15,673 --> 00:03:17,980 Can the federal government own land, 69 00:03:18,067 --> 00:03:20,678 land rights, grazing rights? 70 00:03:20,765 --> 00:03:23,159 It's sort of woven into a lot of the Western states, 71 00:03:23,246 --> 00:03:25,857 that relationship between the federal government, 72 00:03:25,944 --> 00:03:30,514 in this case, and people that live and work the land. 73 00:03:30,601 --> 00:03:34,518 - Eric Barnhart was a senior advisor to the FBI director 74 00:03:34,605 --> 00:03:37,086 before becoming special agent in charge of 75 00:03:37,173 --> 00:03:40,002 the Salt Lake City field office. 76 00:03:40,089 --> 00:03:41,786 - What about you, Greg? 77 00:03:41,873 --> 00:03:45,050 - Well, I was a brand-new SAC in Portland, Oregon. 78 00:03:45,137 --> 00:03:49,403 And when we heard what was going on down in Bunkerville 79 00:03:49,490 --> 00:03:51,753 and the Bundys, we knew we had some 80 00:03:51,840 --> 00:03:55,930 of these same characters in our division, in our territory. 81 00:03:56,018 --> 00:03:59,456 So we watched it very closely, the way it progressed, 82 00:03:59,543 --> 00:04:00,936 the way it escalated. 83 00:04:01,023 --> 00:04:02,546 - Tim, what about you? 84 00:04:02,633 --> 00:04:03,330 Where were you when Bunkerville started? 85 00:04:03,417 --> 00:04:05,723 - I was in Eugene. 86 00:04:05,810 --> 00:04:11,468 And my primary role was working domestic terrorism cases. 87 00:04:11,555 --> 00:04:14,819 - Tim Suttles was an FBI crisis negotiation leader 88 00:04:14,906 --> 00:04:17,779 with the Portland, Oregon, field office. 89 00:04:19,519 --> 00:04:21,173 - So when we're talking grazing fees, 90 00:04:21,261 --> 00:04:22,479 what are we talking about? 91 00:04:22,566 --> 00:04:24,089 - We're talking millions of dollars that were 92 00:04:24,176 --> 00:04:25,787 back-owed to the government. 93 00:04:25,874 --> 00:04:28,485 He's also putting too many cattle out on the land. 94 00:04:32,663 --> 00:04:36,493 They're destroying the land. 95 00:04:36,580 --> 00:04:39,714 I think it was 1993 when he paid his last 96 00:04:39,801 --> 00:04:41,759 grazing fees to the government. 97 00:04:41,846 --> 00:04:44,980 - So finally, in 2014, the Bureau of Land Management 98 00:04:45,067 --> 00:04:49,724 decided to take enforcement action and got a federal judge, 99 00:04:49,811 --> 00:04:52,770 sign a warrant that allowed them to go 100 00:04:52,857 --> 00:04:56,600 and collect the cattle that was illegally grazing on the land, 101 00:04:56,687 --> 00:04:59,951 which, of course, the Bundys didn't take too kindly to it. 102 00:05:00,038 --> 00:05:01,910 - Well, I've fought this thing legally. 103 00:05:01,997 --> 00:05:03,172 I fought it politically. 104 00:05:03,259 --> 00:05:04,826 I fought it through the media. 105 00:05:04,913 --> 00:05:08,699 And I will fight it on the ground if I have to. 106 00:05:08,786 --> 00:05:10,048 - They paint themselves out as the small guy-- 107 00:05:10,135 --> 00:05:11,789 - Right. 108 00:05:11,876 --> 00:05:14,705 - --being put upon by this big federal government 109 00:05:14,792 --> 00:05:16,228 that's heavy handed, 110 00:05:16,316 --> 00:05:17,882 that's taking away their rights. 111 00:05:17,969 --> 00:05:19,319 - They start with the premise of what 112 00:05:19,406 --> 00:05:21,103 they want for themselves. 113 00:05:21,190 --> 00:05:22,496 And then they go through the buffet 114 00:05:22,582 --> 00:05:25,368 and pick out things that will support their case. 115 00:05:25,455 --> 00:05:27,501 And most of the time, it's fringe thinking, 116 00:05:27,588 --> 00:05:29,198 to include federal government doesn't 117 00:05:29,285 --> 00:05:30,765 have the right to own land. 118 00:05:30,852 --> 00:05:32,984 And it gets to just the self-feeding. 119 00:05:33,071 --> 00:05:35,509 And it's so hard to unwind. 120 00:05:35,596 --> 00:05:38,599 - Did you guys quickly realize that the FBI 121 00:05:38,686 --> 00:05:40,644 would be getting involved in this situation? 122 00:05:40,731 --> 00:05:43,778 - BLM let us know what they were going to be doing. 123 00:05:43,865 --> 00:05:45,475 We knew they would be executing a search warrant. 124 00:05:45,562 --> 00:05:47,695 We knew that date, the time, the location. 125 00:05:47,782 --> 00:05:51,046 The BLM, working together with others, 126 00:05:51,133 --> 00:05:53,701 executed the search warrant, advised the Bundys 127 00:05:53,788 --> 00:05:55,355 that they were going to collect the cattle, 128 00:05:55,442 --> 00:05:58,009 and over a period of several days, 129 00:05:58,096 --> 00:06:01,404 began operations and sent agents and officers out 130 00:06:01,491 --> 00:06:02,623 to round up the cattle and bring them 131 00:06:02,710 --> 00:06:04,668 to a central location where they 132 00:06:04,755 --> 00:06:07,192 could then take that cattle, cart it off, 133 00:06:07,279 --> 00:06:08,368 and take it to auction. 134 00:06:12,284 --> 00:06:15,505 And during that timeframe, the Bundys, Cliven, 135 00:06:15,592 --> 00:06:17,768 the dad, the patriarch of the group, 136 00:06:17,855 --> 00:06:20,510 and his sons, Ammon and Ryan-- 137 00:06:22,730 --> 00:06:25,994 Did a social media campaign calling for help. 138 00:06:26,081 --> 00:06:30,041 [messages pinging] 139 00:06:30,128 --> 00:06:33,349 Asking militia members, like-minded individuals, 140 00:06:33,436 --> 00:06:34,829 to come and help them. 141 00:06:34,916 --> 00:06:36,700 And it was always bring your guns. 142 00:06:36,787 --> 00:06:38,310 Bring your guns. 143 00:06:38,398 --> 00:06:40,530 Come help us and bring your guns. 144 00:06:40,617 --> 00:06:44,360 They're calling for people to come, and, in essence, 145 00:06:44,447 --> 00:06:46,362 they're looking for a fight. 146 00:06:49,626 --> 00:06:51,846 - We could monitor social media. 147 00:06:51,933 --> 00:06:54,414 We could see there was a lot of people responding. 148 00:06:54,501 --> 00:06:57,112 And, hey, I'll be there. You know, I'm on my way. 149 00:06:57,982 --> 00:07:01,943 [pinging] 150 00:07:02,030 --> 00:07:03,858 It escalated really quick. 151 00:07:03,945 --> 00:07:09,080 ♪ ♪ 152 00:07:09,167 --> 00:07:10,386 - But over days, you could see 153 00:07:10,473 --> 00:07:11,866 more and more militia showing up. 154 00:07:11,953 --> 00:07:17,654 ♪ ♪ 155 00:07:17,741 --> 00:07:20,918 - We're not talking about guys coming with a concealed weapon. 156 00:07:21,005 --> 00:07:22,659 We're talking about people coming fully kitted out. 157 00:07:22,746 --> 00:07:24,008 What does that look like? 158 00:07:24,095 --> 00:07:26,837 - Long gun. Bulletproof vest. 159 00:07:26,924 --> 00:07:29,100 Side arm. Extra magazines. 160 00:07:29,187 --> 00:07:32,713 These guys are coming on display, so not only 161 00:07:32,800 --> 00:07:36,238 are there to pick a fight, but they want to be on display 162 00:07:36,325 --> 00:07:38,327 while they're doing it. 163 00:07:38,414 --> 00:07:40,895 And it's important to remember, when you call for help, 164 00:07:40,982 --> 00:07:44,289 you're not picking who you're calling. 165 00:07:44,376 --> 00:07:46,030 You won't know who's coming. 166 00:07:46,117 --> 00:07:48,163 But you tell them, come and bring your guns, 167 00:07:48,250 --> 00:07:50,644 and there's no way you can control 168 00:07:50,731 --> 00:07:55,039 what they're going to do. 169 00:07:55,126 --> 00:07:58,173 - A lot of militias showed up. 170 00:07:58,260 --> 00:08:00,262 There was a lot of angst in that area, 171 00:08:00,349 --> 00:08:03,178 you know, agents being followed. 172 00:08:03,265 --> 00:08:06,181 BLM agents were being harassed. 173 00:08:06,268 --> 00:08:08,488 And there was guns pointed at each other. 174 00:08:08,575 --> 00:08:12,796 [tense music] 175 00:08:12,883 --> 00:08:16,408 - I still remember very clearly an individual lying 176 00:08:16,496 --> 00:08:21,152 on an overpass with his long gun in a sniper-prone position, 177 00:08:21,239 --> 00:08:25,200 pointing that weapon at the BLM officers. 178 00:08:25,287 --> 00:08:28,856 - And you have no idea what sort of discipline they have, 179 00:08:28,943 --> 00:08:31,598 how that person is seeing through the reticle. 180 00:08:31,685 --> 00:08:36,037 What's going to cause them to pull that trigger? 181 00:08:36,124 --> 00:08:40,258 This person could be here for a very bad reason. 182 00:08:40,345 --> 00:08:43,697 - I know personally the supervisor 183 00:08:43,784 --> 00:08:45,915 in charge of that operation. 184 00:08:46,003 --> 00:08:48,919 When they're pointing that weapon at those officers, 185 00:08:49,006 --> 00:08:51,269 they're pointing at people we know. 186 00:08:51,356 --> 00:08:56,057 And you can just imagine what they're feeling, 187 00:08:56,144 --> 00:08:58,581 with people and guns shouting at them 188 00:08:58,668 --> 00:09:00,583 as they're coming in and out of the area 189 00:09:00,670 --> 00:09:02,193 where they're collecting the cattle. 190 00:09:02,280 --> 00:09:04,587 It's their command post. 191 00:09:04,674 --> 00:09:07,459 - Get back! Get back! 192 00:09:07,547 --> 00:09:08,939 - And it's basically surrounded. 193 00:09:09,026 --> 00:09:12,160 [shouting] 194 00:09:12,247 --> 00:09:16,468 It evolved from a law enforcement operation, 195 00:09:16,556 --> 00:09:18,470 as Eric said, to collect cattle, 196 00:09:18,558 --> 00:09:21,299 to a near riot almost overnight. 197 00:09:21,386 --> 00:09:26,304 ♪ ♪ 198 00:09:26,391 --> 00:09:30,700 - It was all hands on deck for a lot of the surrounding areas. 199 00:09:32,006 --> 00:09:33,181 The Portland division, 200 00:09:33,268 --> 00:09:35,444 Las Vegas, California, 201 00:09:35,531 --> 00:09:37,620 Salt Lake, 202 00:09:37,707 --> 00:09:40,536 to dive into human intelligence, 203 00:09:40,623 --> 00:09:42,843 dive into social media intelligence, 204 00:09:42,930 --> 00:09:46,324 because we need to find a way to tamp this down 205 00:09:46,411 --> 00:09:48,152 and deescalate it somehow. 206 00:09:48,239 --> 00:09:50,024 all: No BLM! 207 00:09:50,111 --> 00:09:51,547 No BLM! 208 00:09:51,765 --> 00:09:53,897 No BLM! 209 00:09:53,984 --> 00:09:57,074 - About three days in, the confrontation with BLM 210 00:09:57,161 --> 00:10:01,905 comes to a point where Ammon Bundy is tased. 211 00:10:01,992 --> 00:10:03,777 [shouting] 212 00:10:03,864 --> 00:10:06,780 [taser crackling] 213 00:10:06,867 --> 00:10:09,652 [siren wailing] 214 00:10:09,739 --> 00:10:13,308 And that escalated the confrontation 215 00:10:13,395 --> 00:10:14,962 greatly at that point. 216 00:10:15,049 --> 00:10:17,529 - Back up! Back up! 217 00:10:17,617 --> 00:10:19,444 - It lit social media on fire. 218 00:10:20,315 --> 00:10:24,058 [pinging] 219 00:10:24,145 --> 00:10:26,582 - I think he got the outcome that he wanted. 220 00:10:26,669 --> 00:10:28,236 It was a rallying cry. 221 00:10:28,323 --> 00:10:31,152 - A real Wild West showdown, federal agents 222 00:10:31,239 --> 00:10:34,503 clashing with protesters, some from armed militia groups, 223 00:10:34,590 --> 00:10:39,116 who are arriving now from all over the country. 224 00:10:39,203 --> 00:10:41,292 - What are you seeing from a case agent standpoint? 225 00:10:41,379 --> 00:10:44,818 - Now, you're seeing a lot more people head that way. 226 00:10:44,905 --> 00:10:47,298 We were starting to hear intelligence 227 00:10:47,385 --> 00:10:49,170 from all over the country, 228 00:10:49,257 --> 00:10:54,349 militias in Arkansas and Florida heading that way. 229 00:10:54,436 --> 00:10:56,133 - They're looking for that viral moment. 230 00:10:56,220 --> 00:10:57,961 - No BLM! 231 00:10:58,048 --> 00:10:59,702 - Tell the American public what you just saw, dude. 232 00:10:59,789 --> 00:11:02,487 - Enemy aggressors. This is the road I grew up on. 233 00:11:02,574 --> 00:11:06,056 - They're looking for that spark that they can use 234 00:11:06,143 --> 00:11:08,145 to fan their flame of discontent. 235 00:11:08,232 --> 00:11:10,887 - Tell them what they did. - They threw me to the dirt. 236 00:11:10,974 --> 00:11:12,454 - And then they're going to exploit it. 237 00:11:12,541 --> 00:11:14,238 - Then I got hit twice. 238 00:11:14,325 --> 00:11:17,938 Oh, my gosh, there's blood. 239 00:11:18,025 --> 00:11:20,854 - They have it escalated so high 240 00:11:20,941 --> 00:11:25,293 that they're now forcing this confrontation. 241 00:11:25,380 --> 00:11:28,035 They're in the faces of the BLM officers. 242 00:11:28,122 --> 00:11:32,126 [shouting] 243 00:11:34,650 --> 00:11:37,348 They're antagonizing them. They're taunting them. 244 00:11:37,435 --> 00:11:40,743 [aggressive shouting] 245 00:11:42,092 --> 00:11:45,182 They're not obeying a lawful order 246 00:11:45,269 --> 00:11:47,750 to the point where they start heading to the pen 247 00:11:47,837 --> 00:11:50,927 to start letting out the cattle. 248 00:11:55,540 --> 00:11:57,412 [cheering] 249 00:11:57,499 --> 00:12:00,110 [dramatic music] 250 00:12:00,197 --> 00:12:01,677 [whistling] 251 00:12:01,764 --> 00:12:04,985 [indistinct police PA announcement] 252 00:12:05,072 --> 00:12:08,640 ♪ ♪ 253 00:12:08,728 --> 00:12:09,946 - We don't have the numbers. 254 00:12:10,033 --> 00:12:11,469 And they're not going to respect 255 00:12:11,556 --> 00:12:12,688 our authority to be here. 256 00:12:25,832 --> 00:12:27,137 - This is going to be a bad outcome. 257 00:12:27,224 --> 00:12:30,924 ♪ ♪ 258 00:12:31,011 --> 00:12:33,404 - And on the federal government side, 259 00:12:33,491 --> 00:12:37,844 bringing more numbers in wasn't an option at this point either. 260 00:12:37,931 --> 00:12:39,715 Tempers were high. 261 00:12:39,802 --> 00:12:43,719 [shouting] - Hey, hey, hey! 262 00:12:43,806 --> 00:12:47,244 - There were already out there a large number of armed people, 263 00:12:47,331 --> 00:12:48,985 aching for a fight. 264 00:12:49,072 --> 00:12:53,773 ♪ ♪ 265 00:12:53,860 --> 00:12:57,646 This was a fight that was going to be won another day. 266 00:12:57,733 --> 00:13:03,086 And in order to avoid bloodshed and a shootout 267 00:13:03,173 --> 00:13:07,221 and innocent parties or guilty parties being hurt, 268 00:13:07,308 --> 00:13:08,962 a decision was made. 269 00:13:09,049 --> 00:13:13,314 BLM officers gathered their stuff and drive out. 270 00:13:13,401 --> 00:13:16,317 [cheering] 271 00:13:16,404 --> 00:13:23,454 ♪ ♪ 272 00:13:29,939 --> 00:13:33,638 And of course, they're doing it to the chorus of cheers 273 00:13:33,725 --> 00:13:37,947 and applause as they have driven 274 00:13:38,034 --> 00:13:40,907 the federal government away, and they kept their cattle. 275 00:13:40,994 --> 00:13:45,085 [cars honking] 276 00:13:45,172 --> 00:13:48,479 - When it ended, I knew 277 00:13:48,566 --> 00:13:50,612 that this was going to give a lot of steam 278 00:13:50,699 --> 00:13:53,354 to the militia movement 279 00:13:53,441 --> 00:13:55,965 because they just beat the U.S. government. 280 00:13:56,052 --> 00:13:59,186 - We're going to kick the BLM out of the state. 281 00:13:59,273 --> 00:14:01,318 Kick all the other federal agencies out of the state 282 00:14:01,405 --> 00:14:02,711 that aren't authorized to be here. 283 00:14:02,798 --> 00:14:04,060 - They just won. 284 00:14:04,147 --> 00:14:10,545 ♪ ♪ 285 00:14:14,244 --> 00:14:16,768 - A week-long battle between a cattle rancher 286 00:14:16,856 --> 00:14:20,033 and federal officers comes to a sudden end. 287 00:14:20,120 --> 00:14:23,123 - What did they agree to today, though? 288 00:14:23,210 --> 00:14:24,733 - They agreed to get out of here. 289 00:14:24,820 --> 00:14:28,737 - When you get pictures of the BLM agents 290 00:14:28,824 --> 00:14:31,174 collecting their gear, putting in their trucks, 291 00:14:31,261 --> 00:14:33,481 and speeding out-- 292 00:14:33,568 --> 00:14:36,005 - There they go. 293 00:14:36,092 --> 00:14:40,705 - --that is a picture-perfect victory for the Bundys. 294 00:14:40,792 --> 00:14:43,534 - Good morning, America! 295 00:14:43,621 --> 00:14:46,189 [cheers and applause] 296 00:14:46,276 --> 00:14:47,887 - Cliven now has a bigger pulpit. 297 00:14:47,974 --> 00:14:49,976 He continues to give interviews and tell his story, 298 00:14:50,063 --> 00:14:51,629 get the narrative out there. 299 00:14:51,716 --> 00:14:56,243 - 20 years ago, I could see that the federal government, 300 00:14:56,330 --> 00:15:00,073 the Bureau of Land Management, the Forest Service, 301 00:15:00,160 --> 00:15:02,902 the Park Service, these people were only-- 302 00:15:02,989 --> 00:15:05,556 their only desire was to eliminate 303 00:15:05,643 --> 00:15:08,472 us ranchers off this land. 304 00:15:08,559 --> 00:15:11,432 - But then he imploded once he started 305 00:15:11,519 --> 00:15:15,088 to opine on some horrific views on race. 306 00:15:15,175 --> 00:15:17,699 - I'm wondering, Cliven Bundy is wondering, 307 00:15:17,786 --> 00:15:20,006 about these people. 308 00:15:20,093 --> 00:15:22,182 Now, I'm talking about the Black community. 309 00:15:22,269 --> 00:15:24,967 - And as quickly as he came on the scene 310 00:15:25,054 --> 00:15:27,404 and was given his moment in the sun, 311 00:15:27,491 --> 00:15:29,580 his true colors came out. 312 00:15:29,667 --> 00:15:32,583 - And I've often wondered, are they better off as slaves, 313 00:15:32,670 --> 00:15:35,804 picking cotton and having family life and doing things, 314 00:15:35,891 --> 00:15:38,328 or are they better off under government subsidy? 315 00:15:38,415 --> 00:15:41,070 - And I think that was the end of his media tour. 316 00:15:41,157 --> 00:15:43,943 - That is when the leadership of the Bundy family 317 00:15:44,030 --> 00:15:48,034 transitioned from Cliven Bundy, patriarch, 318 00:15:48,121 --> 00:15:53,735 and firmly taken over by his son, Ammon Bundy. 319 00:15:53,822 --> 00:15:55,998 - And Ammon Bundy has a more charismatic 320 00:15:56,085 --> 00:15:58,087 "aw shucks" sort of person. 321 00:15:58,174 --> 00:16:00,002 But I think what you had is, you know, he could 322 00:16:00,089 --> 00:16:02,222 be maybe the new messenger 323 00:16:02,309 --> 00:16:04,528 now that the old man had flamed out. 324 00:16:04,615 --> 00:16:08,315 - Ammon Bundy took that as an opportunity to proselyte. 325 00:16:08,402 --> 00:16:10,665 And he took that story, 326 00:16:10,752 --> 00:16:13,320 and he had a speaking tour throughout the West. 327 00:16:13,407 --> 00:16:15,017 He was in Idaho. 328 00:16:15,104 --> 00:16:17,280 He was in Utah. He went through Nevada. 329 00:16:17,367 --> 00:16:19,717 And he told this story. 330 00:16:24,766 --> 00:16:29,466 - But months and months, then a year, 331 00:16:29,553 --> 00:16:31,033 and then a year and a half go by, 332 00:16:31,120 --> 00:16:33,731 and no charges are brought. 333 00:16:33,818 --> 00:16:35,951 So that then leaves them emboldened 334 00:16:36,038 --> 00:16:39,476 and looking for their next fight. 335 00:16:39,563 --> 00:16:43,524 - In an unrelated matter, in June 2012, two Oregon ranchers, 336 00:16:43,611 --> 00:16:46,918 Dwight and Steven Hammond were convicted of committing arson 337 00:16:47,006 --> 00:16:48,833 on federal land in Harney County. 338 00:16:48,920 --> 00:16:51,184 - And the fires set by the Hammonds, 339 00:16:51,271 --> 00:16:53,012 fires that they admitted setting, 340 00:16:53,099 --> 00:16:54,274 they put people's lives at risk, 341 00:16:54,361 --> 00:16:56,667 including the BLM firefighters. 342 00:16:56,754 --> 00:16:58,756 - The Hammonds were convicted of lighting 343 00:16:58,843 --> 00:17:01,281 a fire that spread to federal land 344 00:17:01,368 --> 00:17:05,023 in protest over cattle grazing rights. 345 00:17:05,111 --> 00:17:08,505 - And the judge sentenced them. 346 00:17:08,592 --> 00:17:10,290 There's a five-year mandatory minimum 347 00:17:10,377 --> 00:17:12,291 for arson of federal property. 348 00:17:12,378 --> 00:17:14,903 He sentenced them to less than that. 349 00:17:14,990 --> 00:17:17,079 So that was appealed. 350 00:17:17,165 --> 00:17:19,994 The appellate court finally made 351 00:17:20,082 --> 00:17:23,738 a decision in like October of 2015, 352 00:17:23,825 --> 00:17:26,306 said, no, the judge erred. 353 00:17:26,393 --> 00:17:28,134 You need to serve the rest of your five years 354 00:17:28,221 --> 00:17:29,265 to both of them. 355 00:17:29,352 --> 00:17:31,659 - Two Oregon ranchers must go back 356 00:17:31,746 --> 00:17:34,357 to prison for starting fires that burned on federal land, 357 00:17:34,444 --> 00:17:36,925 even though they already served time for the charges. 358 00:17:37,012 --> 00:17:38,579 - I don't know what to say. 359 00:17:38,666 --> 00:17:40,059 It's just seems like a little overreach 360 00:17:40,146 --> 00:17:44,454 for having burned 127 acres. 361 00:17:44,541 --> 00:17:47,022 - The Bundys were looking for a rallying cry. 362 00:17:47,109 --> 00:17:48,328 This was their rallying cry. 363 00:17:48,415 --> 00:17:50,460 They were going to go protect the Hammonds. 364 00:17:50,547 --> 00:17:53,550 The Hammonds were supposed to report to prison 365 00:17:53,637 --> 00:17:57,728 to finish their sentence on January 4 of 2016. 366 00:17:57,815 --> 00:18:01,558 So in October of 15, the Bundys start showing up. 367 00:18:01,645 --> 00:18:05,867 ♪ ♪ 368 00:18:05,954 --> 00:18:08,043 - These abuses to the Hammonds 369 00:18:08,130 --> 00:18:10,959 will continue to go on and on and on 370 00:18:11,046 --> 00:18:13,657 if they are not put to an end at this time. 371 00:18:13,744 --> 00:18:15,529 - I spoke to Dave Ward. 372 00:18:15,616 --> 00:18:17,792 Dave Ward was the sheriff of Harney County. 373 00:18:17,879 --> 00:18:21,535 And shortly after Ammon Bundy and his brother 374 00:18:21,622 --> 00:18:24,625 came into Burns, they visited him in his office. 375 00:18:24,712 --> 00:18:27,149 And Dave Ward told me, initially, 376 00:18:27,236 --> 00:18:28,846 they were very complimentary. 377 00:18:28,933 --> 00:18:32,154 They let him know that he was the sheriff of the county. 378 00:18:32,241 --> 00:18:34,722 He was the highest elected law enforcement official, 379 00:18:34,809 --> 00:18:38,769 that it was his duty to stand up and protect 380 00:18:38,856 --> 00:18:41,772 these poor people, the Hammonds, 381 00:18:41,859 --> 00:18:44,514 who were being unfairly treated by 382 00:18:44,601 --> 00:18:46,386 an oppressive federal government. 383 00:18:46,473 --> 00:18:49,389 And Sheriff Ward said, as long as I'm nodding 384 00:18:49,476 --> 00:18:52,435 and just listening, they're very kind. 385 00:18:52,522 --> 00:18:54,133 You know, they're very, very polite. 386 00:18:54,220 --> 00:18:56,004 As soon as the sheriff said, 387 00:18:56,091 --> 00:18:58,049 yeah, I'm not going to do that, 388 00:18:58,137 --> 00:19:00,443 Sheriff Ward said it was remarkable how quickly 389 00:19:00,530 --> 00:19:02,924 it went from polite and kind to threatening. 390 00:19:03,011 --> 00:19:04,360 And if you're not going to do your job, 391 00:19:04,447 --> 00:19:06,275 we'll do your job for you. 392 00:19:06,362 --> 00:19:08,016 - They were pushing for the sheriff 393 00:19:08,103 --> 00:19:12,586 to protect the Hammonds because he's the highest official 394 00:19:12,673 --> 00:19:14,414 in the land because they don't recognize 395 00:19:14,501 --> 00:19:16,024 the federal government. 396 00:19:16,111 --> 00:19:17,243 He has a duty to protect them, 397 00:19:17,330 --> 00:19:19,070 to keep them from going to jail. 398 00:19:19,158 --> 00:19:21,421 - How far away from Burns did the Bundys live? 399 00:19:21,508 --> 00:19:23,162 - By car, eight-hour drive. 400 00:19:23,249 --> 00:19:24,815 - They're eight hours from their home. 401 00:19:24,902 --> 00:19:26,382 - Yeah. 402 00:19:26,469 --> 00:19:28,297 - And they've decided to come into Burns, 403 00:19:28,384 --> 00:19:30,908 speak to the sheriff there, tell him his job. 404 00:19:30,995 --> 00:19:32,040 - Right. 405 00:19:37,219 --> 00:19:39,090 They're proposing to defy the federal government, 406 00:19:39,178 --> 00:19:42,703 to keep the Hammonds from turning themselves 407 00:19:42,790 --> 00:19:45,880 into the point of even barricading them in their house 408 00:19:45,967 --> 00:19:49,013 and preventing federal marshals from taking them, 409 00:19:49,100 --> 00:19:51,755 as if that was ever the plan. - Right. 410 00:19:51,842 --> 00:19:53,931 - But they were offended on the part of a third party 411 00:19:54,018 --> 00:19:55,281 that wanted really no part of this. 412 00:19:55,368 --> 00:19:56,282 - Right. 413 00:19:56,369 --> 00:19:57,892 - The Hammonds didn't want this. 414 00:19:57,979 --> 00:20:00,764 - The plan was for them to turn themselves in peacefully. 415 00:20:00,851 --> 00:20:03,680 And they wanted to interrupt that plan. 416 00:20:03,767 --> 00:20:07,249 And, again, they're always looking for that confrontation. 417 00:20:07,336 --> 00:20:09,164 I like to call it, they're looking for 418 00:20:09,251 --> 00:20:12,341 the federal foil, somebody they can push up against. 419 00:20:12,428 --> 00:20:14,343 And that's what they're trying to instigate. 420 00:20:14,430 --> 00:20:16,737 - So when the Hammonds didn't work, 421 00:20:16,824 --> 00:20:19,218 and the Hammonds weren't as cooperative as they would like, 422 00:20:19,305 --> 00:20:21,045 they had to pivot to something else. 423 00:20:21,132 --> 00:20:23,091 - Ammon Bundy here. 424 00:20:23,178 --> 00:20:26,181 There's been a lot of rumor bouncing around about 425 00:20:26,268 --> 00:20:28,662 what's going on in Harney County. 426 00:20:28,749 --> 00:20:32,535 And I am wanting to talk to the individual, to the patriot, 427 00:20:32,622 --> 00:20:35,190 that this is not a time to stand down. 428 00:20:35,277 --> 00:20:38,889 It is a time to stand up and come to Harney County. 429 00:20:38,976 --> 00:20:40,456 We need your help. 430 00:20:40,543 --> 00:20:45,461 You need to get to Burns on the 2nd or before. 431 00:20:45,548 --> 00:20:48,595 We need your help. Thank you. 432 00:20:48,682 --> 00:20:52,076 - I remember I was dropping my daughter off at the airport 433 00:20:52,163 --> 00:20:56,080 to send her back to college, January 2. 434 00:20:56,167 --> 00:20:58,735 Been through a nice holidays. New Year's is over. 435 00:20:58,822 --> 00:21:00,650 She's on her way back. 436 00:21:00,737 --> 00:21:04,132 And as I'm dropping her off on the curb, my phone is ringing. 437 00:21:04,219 --> 00:21:06,961 And it's the sheriff, 438 00:21:07,048 --> 00:21:09,833 letting me know the Bundys, 439 00:21:09,920 --> 00:21:12,488 still trying to cloak themselves in the Hammond cause, 440 00:21:12,575 --> 00:21:15,578 they organize a parade and rally 441 00:21:15,665 --> 00:21:17,711 in support of the Hammonds before they turn 442 00:21:17,798 --> 00:21:20,322 themselves in on January 4. 443 00:21:20,409 --> 00:21:24,631 [indistinct chatter] 444 00:21:24,718 --> 00:21:28,765 And the parade was, by all accounts, largely peaceful. 445 00:21:28,852 --> 00:21:31,594 [indistinct chatter] 446 00:21:37,731 --> 00:21:41,691 A lot of people displaying weapons and flags. 447 00:21:41,778 --> 00:21:44,172 It made its way through town and ended up 448 00:21:44,259 --> 00:21:48,394 in the Safeway parking lot. 449 00:21:48,481 --> 00:21:52,485 And that is where Ammon Bundy gets up on his soapbox. 450 00:21:52,572 --> 00:21:53,790 - For those that understand that they 451 00:21:53,877 --> 00:21:55,705 came to make a hard stand-- 452 00:21:55,792 --> 00:21:57,794 - Has a bunch of things to say. 453 00:21:57,881 --> 00:22:00,188 - --those that know what's going on here and have seen it 454 00:22:00,275 --> 00:22:02,799 for many, many, many, many years, 455 00:22:02,886 --> 00:22:05,976 those who are ready to actually do something about it. 456 00:22:06,063 --> 00:22:09,415 - And towards the end, announces that they're heading off 457 00:22:09,502 --> 00:22:12,243 to the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge. 458 00:22:12,331 --> 00:22:14,681 And he calls on those there 459 00:22:14,768 --> 00:22:17,205 to follow him out there to take it over. 460 00:22:17,292 --> 00:22:19,468 - I'm asking you to follow me 461 00:22:19,555 --> 00:22:23,080 and go to the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge. 462 00:22:23,167 --> 00:22:25,039 And we're going to make a hard stand. 463 00:22:25,126 --> 00:22:26,432 - We've been watching these guys now for months. 464 00:22:26,519 --> 00:22:28,390 We saw what happened in Bunkerville. 465 00:22:28,477 --> 00:22:30,218 - No BLM! - You need to leave. 466 00:22:30,305 --> 00:22:31,828 [shouting] 467 00:22:31,915 --> 00:22:34,875 [cheering] 468 00:22:34,962 --> 00:22:37,312 - But we had no idea that it was 469 00:22:37,399 --> 00:22:40,794 in their plans to head out to the refuge and take it over. 470 00:22:40,881 --> 00:22:42,970 I don't think anybody there knew 471 00:22:43,057 --> 00:22:44,101 that this was Ammon's plan. 472 00:22:44,188 --> 00:22:47,670 [cars whooshing] 473 00:22:47,757 --> 00:22:50,412 So they enter the Wildlife Refuge-- 474 00:22:50,499 --> 00:22:56,636 ♪ ♪ 475 00:22:56,723 --> 00:23:00,335 And start moving into the offices, 476 00:23:00,422 --> 00:23:04,731 start repositioning vehicles, 477 00:23:04,818 --> 00:23:07,124 and start setting up a defensive perimeter. 478 00:23:07,211 --> 00:23:08,909 - Man, the people better wake up, 479 00:23:08,996 --> 00:23:11,302 get here, and fight for your country! 480 00:23:11,390 --> 00:23:12,739 Right now! 481 00:23:15,698 --> 00:23:18,222 - We're not going to fall into the same trap 482 00:23:18,309 --> 00:23:20,181 that happened in Bunkerville. 483 00:23:20,268 --> 00:23:21,487 - We need you to bring your arms. 484 00:23:21,574 --> 00:23:22,749 And we need you to come to 485 00:23:22,836 --> 00:23:24,707 the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge. 486 00:23:24,794 --> 00:23:28,058 - They put armed men in a 100-foot fire tower 487 00:23:28,145 --> 00:23:29,973 with sniper rifles. 488 00:23:30,060 --> 00:23:31,410 They took fire practice. 489 00:23:31,497 --> 00:23:32,672 - Fire! 490 00:23:32,759 --> 00:23:36,153 [gunfire] 491 00:23:36,240 --> 00:23:40,157 - The folks at the refuge said if we can kidnap an FBI agent 492 00:23:40,244 --> 00:23:41,681 we can end this on our terms. 493 00:23:41,768 --> 00:23:43,247 - ♪ What you gonna do ♪ 494 00:23:43,334 --> 00:23:45,424 ♪ When the militia comes after you, FBI? ♪