1 00:00:11,320 --> 00:00:13,080 Steve Kilbey. 2 00:00:13,080 --> 00:00:13,320 Steve Kilbey. I'm great. 3 00:00:13,320 --> 00:00:15,560 Jess, how are you? I'm good. I'm great. 4 00:00:16,960 --> 00:00:20,040 You grew up when the moon landings were actually happening. 5 00:00:20,040 --> 00:00:21,840 Yeah, yeah. What was that like? 6 00:00:21,840 --> 00:00:22,080 Yeah, yeah. Extraordinary. It was 1969. 7 00:00:22,080 --> 00:00:24,520 Extraordinary. It was 1969. 8 00:00:24,520 --> 00:00:24,760 ARMSTRONG: (OVER TV) Extraordinary. It was 1969. 9 00:00:24,760 --> 00:00:26,520 ARMSTRONG: (OVER TV) The Eagle has landed. 10 00:00:26,520 --> 00:00:29,760 And I remember it was during a maths class, 11 00:00:29,760 --> 00:00:30,000 And I remember it was and we had a little TV up there, 12 00:00:30,000 --> 00:00:32,800 and we had a little TV up there, 13 00:00:32,800 --> 00:00:35,080 and we watched them walk on the moon. 14 00:00:35,080 --> 00:00:35,320 and we watched them That's one small step for man, 15 00:00:35,320 --> 00:00:38,640 That's one small step for man, 16 00:00:38,640 --> 00:00:40,840 one giant leap for mankind. 17 00:00:42,520 --> 00:00:44,760 It was strange, we all just sat there and watched it and went, 18 00:00:44,760 --> 00:00:46,360 "Oh, yeah, we've landed on the moon." 19 00:00:46,360 --> 00:00:48,080 And then he just went on with the day. 20 00:00:48,080 --> 00:00:49,120 Yeah. Isn't that bizarre? 21 00:00:49,120 --> 00:00:51,080 And then back out in the playground, 22 00:00:51,080 --> 00:00:54,680 having your milk at 11:00 and trying to chat up a girl. 23 00:00:54,680 --> 00:00:54,920 having your milk at 11:00 (LAUGHS) 24 00:00:54,920 --> 00:00:55,800 (LAUGHS) 25 00:00:55,800 --> 00:00:57,880 It was a very different world. 26 00:00:57,880 --> 00:00:58,120 WOMAN: Lift-off for a group It was a very different world. 27 00:00:58,120 --> 00:01:00,960 WOMAN: Lift-off for a group of six women... 28 00:01:00,960 --> 00:01:03,840 Seeing as we are going out in reality... 29 00:01:03,840 --> 00:01:04,080 Seeing as we are MAN: Back to the moon and beyond. 30 00:01:04,080 --> 00:01:06,360 MAN: Back to the moon and beyond. 31 00:01:06,360 --> 00:01:09,840 ..how do we make sure that we do that well? 32 00:01:09,840 --> 00:01:10,080 ..how do we make sure We won't. 33 00:01:10,080 --> 00:01:11,560 We won't. 34 00:01:26,280 --> 00:01:27,440 Look, I know what you're thinking - 35 00:01:27,440 --> 00:01:29,920 it looks like I'm prepping for zero gravity. 36 00:01:29,920 --> 00:01:33,760 But no, I'm not leaving Earth, I'm making a sculpture. 37 00:01:35,680 --> 00:01:41,040 And I built this piece to celebrate one of Earth's smallest superheroes - 38 00:01:41,040 --> 00:01:41,280 the bee. And I built this piece to celebrate one of Earth's smallest superheroes - 39 00:01:41,280 --> 00:01:42,640 the bee. 40 00:01:42,640 --> 00:01:45,120 The inspiration was helping people to stay connected 41 00:01:45,120 --> 00:01:47,360 to their own love for the environment. 42 00:01:47,360 --> 00:01:51,280 Because I've always believed that art can speak to the urgent things - 43 00:01:51,280 --> 00:01:51,520 Because I've always believed that climate, care, connection. 44 00:01:51,520 --> 00:01:54,520 climate, care, connection. 45 00:01:54,520 --> 00:01:54,720 climate, care, connection. And I've spent most of my time 46 00:01:54,720 --> 00:01:56,560 And I've spent most of my time 47 00:01:56,560 --> 00:01:58,520 focused on the space beneath the clouds. 48 00:01:58,520 --> 00:02:01,040 On the series Star Trek: Strange New Worlds, 49 00:02:01,040 --> 00:02:02,800 she stars as Nurse Chapel. 50 00:02:02,800 --> 00:02:03,000 she stars as Nurse Chapel. Her body's rejecting the serum. 51 00:02:03,000 --> 00:02:04,240 Her body's rejecting the serum. 52 00:02:04,240 --> 00:02:04,480 That is until I joined the cast of Her body's rejecting the serum. 53 00:02:04,480 --> 00:02:08,560 That is until I joined the cast of Star Trek: Strange New Worlds, 54 00:02:08,560 --> 00:02:12,640 because suddenly then I was surrounded by scientists, 55 00:02:12,640 --> 00:02:12,880 because suddenly then I was futurists, thinkers, 56 00:02:12,880 --> 00:02:15,120 futurists, thinkers, 57 00:02:15,120 --> 00:02:18,400 people who opened my mind to what's happening up there. 58 00:02:18,400 --> 00:02:21,680 I can't wait for us to hear the sonic boom. 59 00:02:21,680 --> 00:02:22,680 Oh, the moon! 60 00:02:22,680 --> 00:02:26,000 You guys, I will have to tell you, look at the moon. 61 00:02:26,000 --> 00:02:30,080 Yep, we are entering a new era of space exploration. 62 00:02:30,080 --> 00:02:30,320 Yep, we are entering a new ALL: Taking Up Space! 63 00:02:30,320 --> 00:02:31,880 ALL: Taking Up Space! 64 00:02:31,880 --> 00:02:33,000 (ALL CHEER) 65 00:02:33,000 --> 00:02:33,240 I'm not gonna lie, it's a bit surreal and also a little terrifying. (ALL CHEER) 66 00:02:33,240 --> 00:02:37,880 I'm not gonna lie, it's a bit surreal and also a little terrifying. 67 00:02:39,120 --> 00:02:41,040 MAN: This is not right. Something happened. 68 00:02:41,040 --> 00:02:41,280 MAN: This is not right. Something happened. WOMAN: We have lost the ship. 69 00:02:41,280 --> 00:02:43,240 WOMAN: We have lost the ship. 70 00:02:43,240 --> 00:02:46,280 MAN: We appear to have had a launch vehicle failure. 71 00:02:46,280 --> 00:02:48,720 But most of all, it's got me thinking. 72 00:02:48,720 --> 00:02:49,000 How many resources went into putting these women into space? But most of all, it's got me thinking. 73 00:02:49,000 --> 00:02:53,360 How many resources went into putting these women into space? 74 00:02:53,360 --> 00:02:53,600 How many resources went into putting these women into space? With our track record here on Earth: 75 00:02:53,600 --> 00:02:56,040 With our track record here on Earth: 76 00:03:01,120 --> 00:03:05,440 And can art help guide the way? 77 00:03:08,440 --> 00:03:10,240 I've heard you've got five albums coming out. 78 00:03:10,240 --> 00:03:13,240 Yeah. Not slowing down at all? 79 00:03:13,240 --> 00:03:13,520 I can't. I'm wired into this thing 24 hours a day. Yeah. Not slowing down at all? 80 00:03:13,520 --> 00:03:17,200 I can't. I'm wired into this thing 24 hours a day. 81 00:03:18,640 --> 00:03:21,080 Why are we so obsessed with space, anyway? 82 00:03:21,080 --> 00:03:21,320 Why are we so obsessed with space, It's a planet in a spiritual sky. 83 00:03:21,320 --> 00:03:23,560 It's a planet in a spiritual sky. 84 00:03:23,560 --> 00:03:25,000 To find out, I've come to chat with 85 00:03:25,000 --> 00:03:29,280 one of Australia's greatest songwriters, Steve Kilbey. 86 00:03:29,280 --> 00:03:32,040 # You won't get some things outta my time 87 00:03:32,040 --> 00:03:34,360 # I got no reservations 88 00:03:34,360 --> 00:03:34,600 # You won't get something out of mind... # # I got no reservations 89 00:03:34,600 --> 00:03:38,920 # You won't get something out of mind... # 90 00:03:38,920 --> 00:03:41,880 He's world renowned as leader of the band The Church 91 00:03:41,880 --> 00:03:42,160 He's world renowned as leader of the band The Church and co-writer of their smash hit Under The Milky Way... 92 00:03:42,160 --> 00:03:44,880 and co-writer of their smash hit Under The Milky Way... 93 00:03:46,120 --> 00:03:49,360 # Under the Milky Way tonight... # 94 00:03:49,360 --> 00:03:49,560 # Under the Milky Way tonight... # ..with a musical imagination 95 00:03:49,560 --> 00:03:51,200 ..with a musical imagination 96 00:03:51,200 --> 00:03:54,080 that's taken listeners to other times and other worlds. 97 00:03:54,080 --> 00:03:57,120 # Nothing moved as it slept in space... # 98 00:03:57,120 --> 00:04:01,680 I'm keen to hear why Steve thinks space has inspired so many artists. 99 00:04:03,480 --> 00:04:09,080 Space and sci-fi has been something that is fairly new to me, 100 00:04:09,080 --> 00:04:11,000 and it seems that you share that interest, 101 00:04:11,000 --> 00:04:13,240 but maybe it goes back a little further. 102 00:04:13,240 --> 00:04:16,000 All the way, yeah. Yeah? 103 00:04:16,000 --> 00:04:16,240 All the way, yeah. I remember when I was 18, 104 00:04:16,240 --> 00:04:18,480 I remember when I was 18, 105 00:04:18,480 --> 00:04:22,560 suddenly this genre of space rock just came out of nowhere. 106 00:04:22,560 --> 00:04:22,800 suddenly this genre of space rock (HEAVY ROCK MUSIC PLAYS) 107 00:04:22,800 --> 00:04:25,480 (HEAVY ROCK MUSIC PLAYS) 108 00:04:25,480 --> 00:04:29,440 It was Hawkwind and Pink Floyd, and then Ziggy Stardust. 109 00:04:29,440 --> 00:04:29,680 It was Hawkwind and Pink Floyd, (HEAVY ROCK MUSIC CONTINUES) 110 00:04:29,680 --> 00:04:34,040 (HEAVY ROCK MUSIC CONTINUES) 111 00:04:34,040 --> 00:04:38,200 For the first time ever, musicians were exploring 112 00:04:38,200 --> 00:04:41,360 not just the idea of space, but the feeling of space. 113 00:04:41,360 --> 00:04:41,600 not just the idea of space, That really got me in. 114 00:04:41,600 --> 00:04:42,920 That really got me in. 115 00:04:44,240 --> 00:04:46,200 And this band Hawkwind, have you ever listened to them? 116 00:04:46,200 --> 00:04:48,720 I have had a little listen to them. Yeah, they're awesome. 117 00:04:48,720 --> 00:04:49,640 Yeah. So cool. 118 00:04:49,640 --> 00:04:49,880 # I Yeah. So cool. 119 00:04:49,880 --> 00:04:51,600 # I 120 00:04:51,600 --> 00:04:53,760 # I just took a ride 121 00:04:55,240 --> 00:04:56,520 # In a silver machine... # 122 00:04:56,520 --> 00:04:58,360 Well, they were the first band I ever heard 123 00:04:58,360 --> 00:05:00,160 who were trying to give you the feeling 124 00:05:00,160 --> 00:05:00,400 who were trying to give you of what space travel might be like. 125 00:05:00,400 --> 00:05:02,400 of what space travel might be like. 126 00:05:02,400 --> 00:05:04,520 And it sort of had this, 127 00:05:04,520 --> 00:05:08,160 for want of a better word, druggie feeling. 128 00:05:08,160 --> 00:05:11,160 The stars and the comets are all translated 129 00:05:11,160 --> 00:05:11,400 The stars and the comets as synthesisers and oscillators. 130 00:05:11,400 --> 00:05:13,640 as synthesisers and oscillators. 131 00:05:13,640 --> 00:05:16,400 (SPACE-AGE SYNTHESISER SOUNDS) 132 00:05:16,400 --> 00:05:17,600 It's like... (MIMICS SYNTHESISER) 133 00:05:17,600 --> 00:05:19,440 (SYNTHESISER CONTINUES) 134 00:05:19,440 --> 00:05:20,600 ..whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo. 135 00:05:20,600 --> 00:05:26,560 (HEAVY ROCK GUITAR SOLO PLAYS) 136 00:05:28,160 --> 00:05:31,200 (CHEERING, APPLAUSE) 137 00:05:31,200 --> 00:05:35,480 So, exploring space imaginatively for you 138 00:05:35,480 --> 00:05:35,720 So, exploring space imaginatively is more about the escapism of it? 139 00:05:35,720 --> 00:05:37,600 is more about the escapism of it? 140 00:05:37,600 --> 00:05:37,840 Yes. is more about the escapism of it? 141 00:05:37,840 --> 00:05:38,720 Yes. Yeah. 142 00:05:38,720 --> 00:05:43,280 In music and art, I'm not really interested in reality, 143 00:05:43,280 --> 00:05:47,040 I'm interested in this poetic aspect of space. 144 00:05:48,560 --> 00:05:51,480 And when you're immersed in this weird, 145 00:05:51,480 --> 00:05:54,520 spiritual, magical world, 146 00:05:54,520 --> 00:05:59,320 that's music that gives you ample opportunities for weirdness. 147 00:05:59,320 --> 00:06:00,920 Yeah. Because space is weird. 148 00:06:00,920 --> 00:06:01,160 Yeah. Different. 149 00:06:01,160 --> 00:06:01,960 Different. 150 00:06:01,960 --> 00:06:04,360 So, that's where I go back 151 00:06:04,360 --> 00:06:07,000 to find the things I want to give out to the audience. 152 00:06:07,000 --> 00:06:08,440 Yeah. This other world. 153 00:06:08,440 --> 00:06:08,680 Yeah. Yeah. 154 00:06:08,680 --> 00:06:09,440 Yeah. 155 00:06:09,440 --> 00:06:13,040 # Wish I knew what you were looking for... # 156 00:06:13,040 --> 00:06:17,080 And you can definitely feel that expansive, otherworldly quality 157 00:06:17,080 --> 00:06:19,960 in the Church's biggest song, Under The Milky Way. 158 00:06:21,240 --> 00:06:24,560 So, what do you think about the song 159 00:06:24,560 --> 00:06:28,040 is so accessible, universally connective? 160 00:06:28,040 --> 00:06:28,280 is so accessible, I think it's ambiguous, 161 00:06:28,280 --> 00:06:29,840 I think it's ambiguous, 162 00:06:29,840 --> 00:06:32,640 and I think ambiguity is a really interesting thing, 163 00:06:32,640 --> 00:06:35,480 and it's one of the things I kind of specialise in. 164 00:06:35,480 --> 00:06:35,720 and it's one of the things # And it's something quite... # 165 00:06:35,720 --> 00:06:37,600 # And it's something quite... # 166 00:06:37,600 --> 00:06:39,480 You've got this line of ambiguity. 167 00:06:39,480 --> 00:06:42,560 If you go too far and it's too specific, 168 00:06:42,560 --> 00:06:44,520 you're going to block a lot of people out. 169 00:06:44,520 --> 00:06:45,920 They're going to go, "That can't be me." 170 00:06:45,920 --> 00:06:49,480 But if you can fall right on the line and people love it. 171 00:06:49,480 --> 00:06:49,720 But if you can fall right on Under The Milky Way is that. 172 00:06:49,720 --> 00:06:51,320 Under The Milky Way is that. 173 00:06:51,320 --> 00:06:53,080 Anybody can inhabit that song. 174 00:06:58,080 --> 00:07:00,800 I happen to think that because it's under the stars 175 00:07:00,800 --> 00:07:01,040 I happen to think that that people can look up and realise 176 00:07:01,040 --> 00:07:03,280 that people can look up and realise 177 00:07:03,280 --> 00:07:04,520 that we're all seeing the same thing, 178 00:07:04,520 --> 00:07:06,400 and so it's unifying in a way. There you go. 179 00:07:06,400 --> 00:07:08,880 It's really beautiful. No-one's ever said that before. 180 00:07:08,880 --> 00:07:09,600 Really?! No. 181 00:07:09,600 --> 00:07:09,840 Really?! That's very surprising to me. 182 00:07:09,840 --> 00:07:10,760 That's very surprising to me. 183 00:07:10,760 --> 00:07:15,280 No, looking up, the cosmos reduces us all to one. 184 00:07:15,280 --> 00:07:17,600 Yeah, exactly. 185 00:07:17,600 --> 00:07:21,080 Looking up at the stars is kind of an equaliser. 186 00:07:21,080 --> 00:07:24,520 No matter who we are, we're all staring up at the same sky. 187 00:07:27,160 --> 00:07:30,080 And maybe that shared perspective is exactly 188 00:07:30,080 --> 00:07:32,600 what we need as we head back into space. 189 00:07:32,600 --> 00:07:34,960 You write your own story about yourself. 190 00:07:34,960 --> 00:07:38,560 At the start of this episode, I asked Steve... 191 00:07:38,560 --> 00:07:42,600 How do we make sure that we do that well? 192 00:07:42,600 --> 00:07:42,840 How do we make sure We won't. 193 00:07:42,840 --> 00:07:43,680 We won't. 194 00:07:43,680 --> 00:07:46,480 And let's just say he didn't sugar coat it. 195 00:07:46,480 --> 00:07:46,720 And let's just say We will go to other planets, 196 00:07:46,720 --> 00:07:48,520 We will go to other planets, 197 00:07:48,520 --> 00:07:51,320 we will pollute them and burn them out. 198 00:07:51,320 --> 00:07:55,120 And if there are people there, we will enslave them and kill them 199 00:07:55,120 --> 00:07:57,800 and try and make them believe in Jesus. 200 00:07:57,800 --> 00:08:01,520 And that sort of seems to be what humanity does. 201 00:08:01,520 --> 00:08:04,400 Which brings me to the real question. 202 00:08:04,400 --> 00:08:07,600 Do you think that the art that we make 203 00:08:07,600 --> 00:08:11,520 can have an impact on how things play out? 204 00:08:11,520 --> 00:08:11,760 can have an impact on Yes, I do. 205 00:08:11,760 --> 00:08:12,600 Yes, I do. 206 00:08:12,600 --> 00:08:17,120 You can get a glimpse of the world we could have through art. 207 00:08:17,120 --> 00:08:19,560 Now, that's something I can work with. 208 00:08:21,440 --> 00:08:25,400 Because, sure, art reflects the world we live in, 209 00:08:25,400 --> 00:08:28,960 but I'm interested in how it can offer an alternative. 210 00:08:30,960 --> 00:08:33,640 Right now, it's easy to feel like the future 211 00:08:33,640 --> 00:08:36,480 is being built for the few, not the many. 212 00:08:37,720 --> 00:08:40,720 I want to thank every Amazon employee 213 00:08:40,720 --> 00:08:40,960 I want to thank every Amazon employee and every Amazon customer, 214 00:08:40,960 --> 00:08:42,840 and every Amazon customer, 215 00:08:42,840 --> 00:08:45,400 because you guys paid for all this. 216 00:08:45,400 --> 00:08:49,400 And while billionaires turn space into their next big business... 217 00:08:51,200 --> 00:08:55,520 ..down here on Earth, one artist is imagining something else entirely. 218 00:09:00,200 --> 00:09:02,000 Hello? 219 00:09:02,000 --> 00:09:02,240 Hey. Hello. Hello? 220 00:09:02,240 --> 00:09:04,080 Hey. Hello. 221 00:09:04,080 --> 00:09:06,080 How are you going? Serwah, what's up? 222 00:09:06,080 --> 00:09:06,360 How are you going? Serwah, what's up? We out here. This is so cool. 223 00:09:06,360 --> 00:09:09,760 We out here. This is so cool. 224 00:09:09,760 --> 00:09:10,000 We out here. Thank you. 225 00:09:10,000 --> 00:09:10,880 Thank you. 226 00:09:10,880 --> 00:09:11,120 Serwah Attafuah's studio feels like Thank you. 227 00:09:11,120 --> 00:09:14,800 Serwah Attafuah's studio feels like stepping into a time portal. 228 00:09:14,800 --> 00:09:15,040 Serwah Attafuah's studio feels like Whoa, that's cool. 229 00:09:15,040 --> 00:09:16,040 Whoa, that's cool. 230 00:09:16,040 --> 00:09:18,880 On one side, piles of vintage tech. 231 00:09:18,880 --> 00:09:19,120 So, these are bits and pieces On one side, piles of vintage tech. 232 00:09:19,120 --> 00:09:22,640 So, these are bits and pieces of e-waste and, like, scrap tech. 233 00:09:22,640 --> 00:09:22,880 So, these are bits and pieces Epic. 234 00:09:22,880 --> 00:09:23,640 Epic. 235 00:09:23,640 --> 00:09:24,640 On the other... 236 00:09:24,640 --> 00:09:26,480 This monitor is crazy. 237 00:09:26,480 --> 00:09:28,960 ..this sleek, high-powered workstation 238 00:09:28,960 --> 00:09:31,560 with surreal new worlds in progress. 239 00:09:31,560 --> 00:09:33,720 This is my spaceship. 240 00:09:35,680 --> 00:09:38,760 It's where she builds her digital dreamscapes. 241 00:09:38,760 --> 00:09:42,560 Not as a visitor, but as the main character. 242 00:09:42,560 --> 00:09:45,960 Growing up, I was obsessed with, like, avatar-based games... 243 00:09:47,200 --> 00:09:50,200 ..but I felt like I could never totally be myself 244 00:09:50,200 --> 00:09:50,440 ..but I felt like I could or do what I wanted. 245 00:09:50,440 --> 00:09:52,200 or do what I wanted. 246 00:09:52,200 --> 00:09:55,920 So, I just started making my own little metaverses, 247 00:09:55,920 --> 00:09:57,840 and trying to create visions of our future 248 00:09:57,840 --> 00:09:58,080 where I could actually see myself. and trying to create visions of our future 249 00:09:58,080 --> 00:10:00,000 where I could actually see myself. 250 00:10:06,760 --> 00:10:09,520 Serwah's futures aren't billionaires' playgrounds, 251 00:10:09,520 --> 00:10:09,760 Serwah's futures aren't that's for sure. 252 00:10:09,760 --> 00:10:10,880 that's for sure. 253 00:10:10,880 --> 00:10:11,120 They're a lush, layered that's for sure. 254 00:10:11,120 --> 00:10:14,000 They're a lush, layered black perspective 255 00:10:14,000 --> 00:10:14,280 on what our journey to space could look like. They're a lush, layered black perspective 256 00:10:14,280 --> 00:10:17,000 on what our journey to space could look like. 257 00:10:17,000 --> 00:10:17,240 on what our journey to Displayed across five screens, 258 00:10:17,240 --> 00:10:19,480 Displayed across five screens, 259 00:10:19,480 --> 00:10:21,720 this one features female warriors 260 00:10:21,720 --> 00:10:26,520 rising from burning slave castles and shipwrecked colonial vessels. 261 00:10:26,520 --> 00:10:28,160 In Serwah's words, 262 00:10:28,160 --> 00:10:31,640 "a futuristic realm of resilience and reclamation". 263 00:10:31,640 --> 00:10:33,760 Like, I'm noticing that you have, like, 264 00:10:33,760 --> 00:10:34,000 Like, I'm noticing a real interest in vintage future. 265 00:10:34,000 --> 00:10:36,240 a real interest in vintage future. 266 00:10:36,240 --> 00:10:38,480 Yes. Like, old imaginings of the future. 267 00:10:38,480 --> 00:10:39,680 Mm-hm. Mm-hm. 268 00:10:39,680 --> 00:10:42,800 You can't look to the future without looking to the past. 269 00:10:42,800 --> 00:10:43,040 You can't look to the future I think that's where we mess it up, 270 00:10:43,040 --> 00:10:44,480 I think that's where we mess it up, 271 00:10:44,480 --> 00:10:47,520 is dreaming up futures that have nothing to do with our past. 272 00:10:47,520 --> 00:10:49,560 So, I think that's why I'm really into 273 00:10:49,560 --> 00:10:51,800 those, like, older depictions of the future, 274 00:10:51,800 --> 00:10:54,600 because they give us an indication of what we've wanted, 275 00:10:54,600 --> 00:10:57,720 what our dreams were, why we want to make these things. 276 00:10:57,720 --> 00:10:58,920 Yeah. I guess, yeah. 277 00:10:59,960 --> 00:11:02,480 And Serwah's work is part of a tradition 278 00:11:02,480 --> 00:11:04,240 that digs deep into those dreams. 279 00:11:04,240 --> 00:11:07,160 It's called Afrofuturism, 280 00:11:07,160 --> 00:11:10,400 a reimagining of the future through a black cultural lens. 281 00:11:12,040 --> 00:11:16,000 It first emerged during the civil rights movement of the '60s, 282 00:11:16,000 --> 00:11:16,280 It first emerged during the civil rights movement of the '60s, partly in response to a very white space program. 283 00:11:16,280 --> 00:11:19,680 partly in response to a very white space program. 284 00:11:19,680 --> 00:11:22,400 We choose to go to the moon in this decade 285 00:11:22,400 --> 00:11:22,640 We choose to go to the moon and do the other things... 286 00:11:22,640 --> 00:11:24,320 and do the other things... 287 00:11:24,320 --> 00:11:26,920 From the cosmic jazz of Sun Ra 288 00:11:26,920 --> 00:11:29,960 to the science fiction of Octavia Butler, 289 00:11:29,960 --> 00:11:32,600 to Janelle Monae and Black Panther, 290 00:11:32,600 --> 00:11:35,800 it's about depicting a future where African history, 291 00:11:35,800 --> 00:11:39,960 culture, mythology and tradition thrive. 292 00:11:39,960 --> 00:11:42,800 Your work has been described as Afrofuturistic quite a bit. 293 00:11:42,800 --> 00:11:46,280 How do you feel about being included in that tradition of art-making, 294 00:11:46,280 --> 00:11:47,600 like, that world? 295 00:11:47,600 --> 00:11:49,000 It feels great. 296 00:11:49,000 --> 00:11:52,280 Like, the more I can sort of create visions like that, 297 00:11:52,280 --> 00:11:55,600 that can hopefully inspire, that really means a lot to me. 298 00:11:58,320 --> 00:12:01,800 For me, I make my artwork not really for the people of today, 299 00:12:01,800 --> 00:12:03,480 I make it for the people of the future. 300 00:12:03,480 --> 00:12:03,720 I make it for I make it for my future ancestors. 301 00:12:03,720 --> 00:12:06,520 I make it for my future ancestors. 302 00:12:06,520 --> 00:12:08,080 Sort of like the opposite of an elder. 303 00:12:08,080 --> 00:12:10,960 Like, as insane as it sounds, I feel like I'm trying 304 00:12:10,960 --> 00:12:12,800 to learn from people that aren't here yet. 305 00:12:12,800 --> 00:12:14,200 Instead of... That's so cool. 306 00:12:14,200 --> 00:12:15,600 You know, like, learn from my elders, 307 00:12:15,600 --> 00:12:19,520 but I also try and think about my great-great-grandchild, 308 00:12:19,520 --> 00:12:21,800 trying to make a world that she would want to live in. 309 00:12:28,320 --> 00:12:32,840 I love Serwah's works. She calls them heavenly dystopias. 310 00:12:34,520 --> 00:12:36,400 They're beautiful, bold, 311 00:12:36,400 --> 00:12:39,400 and they make space feel like it belongs to all of us, 312 00:12:39,400 --> 00:12:42,040 not just the richest, the fastest, or the first. 313 00:12:43,520 --> 00:12:46,120 They're not just visions of survival, 314 00:12:46,120 --> 00:12:49,880 they're visions of joy, of care, of possibility. 315 00:12:52,280 --> 00:12:55,200 But I know what you might be thinking. 316 00:12:55,200 --> 00:12:59,040 Can art really help shape the future? 317 00:12:59,040 --> 00:12:59,280 Can art really help Like, really? 318 00:12:59,280 --> 00:13:00,160 Like, really? 319 00:13:02,880 --> 00:13:06,080 MAN: I controlled myself and didn't wear my Star Trek uniform. 320 00:13:06,080 --> 00:13:09,400 Oh, that would have been so good! I would have loved that. 321 00:13:09,400 --> 00:13:10,840 It's in the closet. You tell me. 322 00:13:10,840 --> 00:13:11,920 (LAUGHS) 323 00:13:11,920 --> 00:13:14,400 I'm nowhere near as much of a sci-fi fan as you. 324 00:13:14,400 --> 00:13:16,080 Probably why you had friends in high school. 325 00:13:16,080 --> 00:13:16,320 Probably why you had friends (LAUGHS) 326 00:13:16,320 --> 00:13:17,560 (LAUGHS) 327 00:13:17,560 --> 00:13:17,760 WOMAN: Whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo! (LAUGHS) 328 00:13:17,760 --> 00:13:19,120 WOMAN: Whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo! 329 00:13:19,120 --> 00:13:20,720 We have Mike Gold. 330 00:13:20,720 --> 00:13:23,400 Through Star Trek, I've met some amazing people 331 00:13:23,400 --> 00:13:23,680 Through Star Trek, I've met some amazing people working in the space industry, and Mike Gold is one of them. 332 00:13:23,680 --> 00:13:26,960 working in the space industry, and Mike Gold is one of them. 333 00:13:26,960 --> 00:13:30,480 He is one of the biggest Star Trek fans around in the industry. 334 00:13:30,480 --> 00:13:31,880 He's not just a sci-fi fan, 335 00:13:31,880 --> 00:13:36,840 Mike spent his career turning science fiction into science fact, 336 00:13:36,840 --> 00:13:37,080 Mike spent his career turning from NASA to Redwire, 337 00:13:37,080 --> 00:13:38,840 from NASA to Redwire, 338 00:13:38,840 --> 00:13:39,080 a company building tech from NASA to Redwire, 339 00:13:39,080 --> 00:13:42,600 a company building tech for life beyond Earth. 340 00:13:42,600 --> 00:13:42,840 a company building tech And he's got me wondering, 341 00:13:42,840 --> 00:13:44,440 And he's got me wondering, 342 00:13:44,440 --> 00:13:48,960 can a TV show really shape what we build in space? 343 00:13:48,960 --> 00:13:51,400 You are, without a doubt, 344 00:13:51,400 --> 00:13:53,560 the biggest Star Trek fan that I've ever met. 345 00:13:53,560 --> 00:13:58,120 Did it influence you to embark on the career path that you've taken? 346 00:13:58,120 --> 00:13:59,080 Absolutely. 347 00:13:59,080 --> 00:13:59,320 My life wouldn't be what it is without Star Trek. Absolutely. 348 00:13:59,320 --> 00:14:03,640 My life wouldn't be what it is without Star Trek. 349 00:14:03,640 --> 00:14:08,720 Not just the inspiration and awe and wonder of space, 350 00:14:08,720 --> 00:14:13,840 but the optimistic society that Star Trek portrayed. 351 00:14:13,840 --> 00:14:16,680 While I may be the biggest Star Trek fan you know, 352 00:14:16,680 --> 00:14:19,880 if you go to NASA headquarters, I wouldn't be alone. 353 00:14:19,880 --> 00:14:23,840 That so many of us at NASA, so many of us in the private sector, 354 00:14:23,840 --> 00:14:26,080 were inspired by Star Trek. 355 00:14:27,120 --> 00:14:29,520 Could you, like, give us some insight into some ways 356 00:14:29,520 --> 00:14:29,760 Could you, like, give us that Star Trek has influenced NASA 357 00:14:29,760 --> 00:14:31,720 that Star Trek has influenced NASA 358 00:14:31,720 --> 00:14:33,840 and Redwire's approach to space exploration? 359 00:14:33,840 --> 00:14:34,680 Absolutely. 360 00:14:34,680 --> 00:14:35,760 And you'll have to stop me, 361 00:14:35,760 --> 00:14:40,160 because we could do a show just on this question alone. 362 00:14:40,160 --> 00:14:43,400 It was because of the diversity of Star Trek, 363 00:14:43,400 --> 00:14:45,440 and particularly the work of Nichelle Nichols, 364 00:14:45,440 --> 00:14:48,920 who played Lieutenant Uhura in the original series - 365 00:14:48,920 --> 00:14:50,680 she spent, I think, the better part of six months 366 00:14:50,680 --> 00:14:54,080 under contract from NASA, crisscrossing the country 367 00:14:54,080 --> 00:14:58,240 to find female and African-American astronauts, minority astronauts. 368 00:14:58,240 --> 00:15:01,640 And those became the first female and minority astronaut candidates 369 00:15:01,640 --> 00:15:01,880 And those became the first female in the history of NASA. 370 00:15:01,880 --> 00:15:03,640 in the history of NASA. 371 00:15:03,640 --> 00:15:05,280 This is your NASA. 372 00:15:05,280 --> 00:15:09,040 The name of the first space shuttle was originally, I believe, 373 00:15:09,040 --> 00:15:09,280 The name of the first space shuttle going to be Constellation, 374 00:15:09,280 --> 00:15:10,760 going to be Constellation, 375 00:15:10,760 --> 00:15:14,680 and it was because of Star Trek fans writing in and complaining 376 00:15:14,680 --> 00:15:18,360 that they made the name of the first space shuttle Enterprise. 377 00:15:19,440 --> 00:15:21,640 At Redwire, we're building a system 378 00:15:21,640 --> 00:15:26,040 that can take the dirt from the moon and turn it into roads, 379 00:15:26,040 --> 00:15:26,280 that can take the dirt from the moon turn it into housing, 380 00:15:26,280 --> 00:15:27,440 turn it into housing, 381 00:15:27,440 --> 00:15:29,480 and that very much is modelled off of 382 00:15:29,480 --> 00:15:32,280 the Star Trek Replicator technology. 383 00:15:32,280 --> 00:15:34,440 They're all fantastic examples 384 00:15:34,440 --> 00:15:38,120 of Star Trek influencing our future in space. 385 00:15:38,120 --> 00:15:40,360 But there's another one, a big one, 386 00:15:40,360 --> 00:15:40,600 But there's another one, that Mike himself helped bring about. 387 00:15:40,600 --> 00:15:42,480 that Mike himself helped bring about. 388 00:15:42,480 --> 00:15:42,720 If you had 15 seconds that Mike himself helped bring about. 389 00:15:42,720 --> 00:15:44,680 If you had 15 seconds in an elevator to tell me 390 00:15:44,680 --> 00:15:46,600 what the Artemis Accords are, what would you say? 391 00:15:46,600 --> 00:15:49,400 The Artemis Accords are a global commitment 392 00:15:49,400 --> 00:15:49,640 The Artemis Accords are by now 53 nations 393 00:15:49,640 --> 00:15:52,280 by now 53 nations 394 00:15:52,280 --> 00:15:55,960 to explore space in a peaceful, safe, 395 00:15:55,960 --> 00:15:58,320 sustainable and transparent fashion. 396 00:15:58,320 --> 00:16:00,240 I would say they're the vehicle 397 00:16:00,240 --> 00:16:03,000 to achieve the dream that is Star Trek. 398 00:16:03,000 --> 00:16:03,240 to achieve the dream Wow. And what was your part in it? 399 00:16:03,240 --> 00:16:05,880 Wow. And what was your part in it? 400 00:16:05,880 --> 00:16:08,680 Well, as you might note from the name, 401 00:16:08,680 --> 00:16:10,120 I named the Artemis Accords. 402 00:16:10,120 --> 00:16:13,240 (LAUGHS) Just that little thing. Yeah. 403 00:16:13,240 --> 00:16:15,760 I had to get my Star Trek reference in. 404 00:16:15,760 --> 00:16:18,840 You can't really get more direct than that, can you? (LAUGHS) 405 00:16:18,840 --> 00:16:19,080 You can't really get more direct Whoa. Can we just take a moment? 406 00:16:19,080 --> 00:16:21,320 Whoa. Can we just take a moment? 407 00:16:21,320 --> 00:16:25,280 That's a remarkable example of our journey into space 408 00:16:25,280 --> 00:16:27,440 being shaped by art and storytelling. 409 00:16:27,440 --> 00:16:30,560 It's such a magic, symbiotic kind of relationship, isn't it, 410 00:16:30,560 --> 00:16:31,600 between art and reality? 411 00:16:31,600 --> 00:16:33,160 It's very cool. Yes. 412 00:16:33,160 --> 00:16:37,000 I consider you and your colleagues part of the space program, 413 00:16:37,000 --> 00:16:41,480 because you play a role that is as important 414 00:16:41,480 --> 00:16:45,160 as any engineer, as any rocket science. 415 00:16:45,160 --> 00:16:45,400 as any engineer, Whoo! 416 00:16:45,400 --> 00:16:46,440 Whoo! 417 00:16:46,440 --> 00:16:49,720 Whoa. Talking to Mike, it really hits me. 418 00:16:52,040 --> 00:16:54,000 Art doesn't just imagine space, 419 00:16:54,000 --> 00:16:57,400 sometimes it helps us actually get there. 420 00:16:57,400 --> 00:17:02,880 A TV show became a blueprint, a story turned into a strategy. 421 00:17:04,360 --> 00:17:07,760 But while 20th-century sci-fi may have helped 422 00:17:07,760 --> 00:17:09,720 launch us toward the stars, 423 00:17:09,720 --> 00:17:13,680 the world's oldest continuous culture has had a deep relationship 424 00:17:13,680 --> 00:17:13,920 the world's oldest continuous with space for millennia. 425 00:17:13,920 --> 00:17:15,200 with space for millennia. 426 00:17:17,680 --> 00:17:22,000 To explore those stories, art historian Mary McGillivray 427 00:17:22,000 --> 00:17:23,880 is teaming up with astrophysicist 428 00:17:23,880 --> 00:17:26,640 and proud Wiradjuri woman Dr Kirsten Banks. 429 00:17:28,280 --> 00:17:32,880 So this is an early 18th-century star atlas. 430 00:17:32,880 --> 00:17:37,400 And Orion's belt, I think, is one of the most well-known constellations. 431 00:17:37,400 --> 00:17:41,760 Yes. In Wiradjuri we actually see the stars of Orion 432 00:17:41,760 --> 00:17:45,560 as the same sort of pattern representing a human or a man. 433 00:17:45,560 --> 00:17:49,360 For us, though, we see it as the Creator spirit Baiame. 434 00:17:49,360 --> 00:17:49,600 For us, though, we see it as the Creator spirit Baiame. And in one of the stories, 435 00:17:49,600 --> 00:17:50,840 And in one of the stories, 436 00:17:50,840 --> 00:17:53,800 he's running along and chasing an emu called Dinewan. 437 00:17:58,280 --> 00:18:00,480 And he trips on a log... 438 00:18:02,640 --> 00:18:04,040 ..and falls flat on his face. 439 00:18:06,040 --> 00:18:09,800 And that is illustrated in how the stars move. 440 00:18:10,640 --> 00:18:14,360 When Orion sets in the sky, from Australia's perspective, 441 00:18:14,360 --> 00:18:14,600 When Orion sets in the sky, he sets headfirst. 442 00:18:14,600 --> 00:18:15,960 he sets headfirst. 443 00:18:17,240 --> 00:18:19,480 So, Baiame is... Falling over the log. 444 00:18:19,480 --> 00:18:21,920 Yeah, headfirst into the ground. That's fantastic. 445 00:18:21,920 --> 00:18:25,200 So, it illustrates the story quite well. 446 00:18:25,200 --> 00:18:26,160 I love it. 447 00:18:29,440 --> 00:18:33,400 In Wiradjuri culture, the Southern Cross isn't a cross. 448 00:18:33,400 --> 00:18:35,640 We actually see it as Yarran, which is a tree. 449 00:18:38,280 --> 00:18:42,240 But the two stars next to the cross, the Southern Pointers, 450 00:18:42,240 --> 00:18:46,200 we call them Mouyi Mouyi, which represent two cockatoos. 451 00:18:47,240 --> 00:18:50,480 And what's going on is that Yarran is their home, 452 00:18:50,480 --> 00:18:50,720 And what's going on is the tree is their home. 453 00:18:50,720 --> 00:18:51,880 the tree is their home. 454 00:18:51,880 --> 00:18:54,920 And they're following their home in the sky. 455 00:18:54,920 --> 00:18:58,680 And, again, it's illustrated in how the sky moves 456 00:18:58,680 --> 00:19:01,120 because of the rotation of the Earth. 457 00:19:01,120 --> 00:19:04,400 Mouyi Mouyi are always following their home in the sky. 458 00:19:07,440 --> 00:19:10,000 What's different about the dark emu compared to 459 00:19:10,000 --> 00:19:11,640 the constellations we've looked at here 460 00:19:11,640 --> 00:19:15,200 is that the patterns we look for with the dark emu 461 00:19:15,200 --> 00:19:16,760 are the negative spaces, 462 00:19:16,760 --> 00:19:19,360 the patches of gas and dust that naturally block 463 00:19:19,360 --> 00:19:22,280 the light from more distant stars in the Milky Way galaxy. 464 00:19:24,560 --> 00:19:25,880 And I can see it here. 465 00:19:25,880 --> 00:19:26,120 So, underneath the Southern Cross, And I can see it here. 466 00:19:26,120 --> 00:19:28,640 So, underneath the Southern Cross, you see this little patch here? 467 00:19:28,640 --> 00:19:31,520 It's kind of like the head and the beak of the emu. 468 00:19:31,520 --> 00:19:31,760 It's kind of like the head Yeah, yeah. 469 00:19:31,760 --> 00:19:32,520 Yeah, yeah. 470 00:19:32,520 --> 00:19:34,080 And then if you continue along this way 471 00:19:34,080 --> 00:19:36,600 towards the centre of the Milky Way, that's kind of, like, the neck. 472 00:19:38,320 --> 00:19:39,440 And then the... I can see it! 473 00:19:39,440 --> 00:19:41,320 ..bulge of the Milky Way is the body. 474 00:19:43,200 --> 00:19:45,400 It's a very kind of long, lean emu. 475 00:19:45,400 --> 00:19:47,600 Oh, it's huge. It's incredible. 476 00:19:49,640 --> 00:19:54,080 Once you see this constellation, you can't unsee it. It is amazing. 477 00:19:54,080 --> 00:19:56,160 And in Wiradjuri, we call him Gugurmin. 478 00:19:58,440 --> 00:20:01,400 It's also really useful in Wiradjuri culture. 479 00:20:01,400 --> 00:20:03,920 Its position in the night sky indicates 480 00:20:03,920 --> 00:20:06,160 when is the right time to go looking for emu eggs. 481 00:20:06,160 --> 00:20:07,360 Fantastic. 482 00:20:08,320 --> 00:20:13,160 Our fascination with the night sky has inspired incredible stories 483 00:20:13,160 --> 00:20:14,560 and exploration. 484 00:20:14,560 --> 00:20:17,480 But with the commercialisation of space travel, 485 00:20:17,480 --> 00:20:21,040 how do we protect these new frontiers? 486 00:20:21,040 --> 00:20:21,280 how do we protect This year, even the moon was listed 487 00:20:21,280 --> 00:20:23,520 This year, even the moon was listed 488 00:20:23,520 --> 00:20:25,840 as a threatened cultural heritage site. 489 00:20:26,840 --> 00:20:28,240 Amos. Jess, hi. 490 00:20:28,240 --> 00:20:28,480 Amos. Hey. I'm Jess. Nice to meet you. 491 00:20:28,480 --> 00:20:29,320 Hey. I'm Jess. Nice to meet you. 492 00:20:29,320 --> 00:20:31,040 This is Amos Gebhardt, 493 00:20:31,040 --> 00:20:31,280 an award-winning artist and cinematographer. This is Amos Gebhardt, 494 00:20:31,280 --> 00:20:34,400 an award-winning artist and cinematographer. 495 00:20:34,400 --> 00:20:36,080 And I've come to visit an installation 496 00:20:36,080 --> 00:20:36,360 And I've come to visit an installation that treats the moon not as a place to conquer, but as a collaborator. 497 00:20:36,360 --> 00:20:40,720 that treats the moon not as a place to conquer, but as a collaborator. 498 00:20:41,880 --> 00:20:43,400 And this is Alexis. 499 00:20:43,400 --> 00:20:43,640 These works, like this award-winning portrait And this is Alexis. 500 00:20:43,640 --> 00:20:46,680 These works, like this award-winning portrait 501 00:20:46,680 --> 00:20:48,920 of Waanyi writer Alexis Wright, 502 00:20:48,920 --> 00:20:52,120 were all created using the moon as the only light source. 503 00:20:53,680 --> 00:20:56,840 It's not the easiest thing to work with with film, 504 00:20:56,840 --> 00:21:00,040 but it's got this exquisite potential. 505 00:21:00,040 --> 00:21:00,280 but it's got this exquisite potential. Goodness gracious. It's beautiful. 506 00:21:00,280 --> 00:21:01,720 Goodness gracious. It's beautiful. 507 00:21:03,160 --> 00:21:06,960 They're not just beautiful, they're quietly powerful. 508 00:21:08,280 --> 00:21:10,880 There's a deep intimacy to them. 509 00:21:10,880 --> 00:21:14,280 I'm left with this visceral feeling of stillness. 510 00:21:19,560 --> 00:21:22,400 (SIGHS) I don't know, when I stand in this room, 511 00:21:22,400 --> 00:21:24,960 like, when we walked in, I felt, like, a release. 512 00:21:24,960 --> 00:21:25,200 like, when we walked in, Yeah, yeah. 513 00:21:25,200 --> 00:21:25,960 Yeah, yeah. 514 00:21:25,960 --> 00:21:29,360 You know, like, there was just, like, relaxation into the space. 515 00:21:29,360 --> 00:21:30,080 Yeah. Yeah. 516 00:21:30,080 --> 00:21:33,200 There's something about being under the moonlight together, 517 00:21:33,200 --> 00:21:36,320 in the darkness and the quietness of the nervous system. 518 00:21:36,320 --> 00:21:36,560 in the darkness and And to be there with a camera, 519 00:21:36,560 --> 00:21:37,920 And to be there with a camera, 520 00:21:37,920 --> 00:21:41,040 to kind of feel into what might be able 521 00:21:41,040 --> 00:21:42,920 to be photographed, because you can't see everything. 522 00:21:42,920 --> 00:21:44,520 There are kind of mysteries that are hovering 523 00:21:44,520 --> 00:21:44,760 There are kind of mysteries on the edges of your vision. 524 00:21:44,760 --> 00:21:46,120 on the edges of your vision. 525 00:21:47,200 --> 00:21:50,600 There was an almost childlike awe that kept coming out. 526 00:21:52,600 --> 00:21:55,320 This body of work is called Mangata, 527 00:21:55,320 --> 00:22:00,360 a word that I haven't heard before but won't be forgetting in a hurry. 528 00:22:00,360 --> 00:22:00,600 a word that I haven't heard before Mangata is a Swedish word 529 00:22:00,600 --> 00:22:02,840 Mangata is a Swedish word 530 00:22:02,840 --> 00:22:06,120 that translates literally to "moon road". 531 00:22:06,120 --> 00:22:08,640 It signifies that extraordinary image 532 00:22:08,640 --> 00:22:12,400 that the moon creates when it's hanging over a body of water. 533 00:22:12,400 --> 00:22:12,640 that the moon creates when it's That kind of pathway towards itself 534 00:22:12,640 --> 00:22:14,880 That kind of pathway towards itself 535 00:22:14,880 --> 00:22:17,680 speaks to this idea of a pathway into the unknown. 536 00:22:19,320 --> 00:22:22,760 And the subjects of Amos's portraits are all on that pathway. 537 00:22:23,840 --> 00:22:27,800 They're visionaries, imagining liberated collective futures. 538 00:22:32,160 --> 00:22:38,480 Why do you think the moon is such a potent symbol for change? 539 00:22:38,480 --> 00:22:41,680 I think one of the things that really struck me 540 00:22:41,680 --> 00:22:44,120 was this idea of renewal, 541 00:22:44,120 --> 00:22:48,400 where we see this celestial companion constantly shrinking 542 00:22:48,400 --> 00:22:51,840 and expanding, and reminding us of change. 543 00:22:51,840 --> 00:22:54,600 How do you feel about human expansion into space? 544 00:22:54,600 --> 00:22:58,680 Um, it strikes me as a pathology, actually. 545 00:22:58,680 --> 00:23:01,800 Um, in Aileen Moreton-Robinson's interview, actually, 546 00:23:01,800 --> 00:23:02,080 her grandparents raised her on Quandamooka Country, Um, in Aileen Moreton-Robinson's interview, actually, 547 00:23:02,080 --> 00:23:04,400 her grandparents raised her on Quandamooka Country, 548 00:23:04,400 --> 00:23:07,040 and, um, she came home one day, as a little kid, 549 00:23:07,040 --> 00:23:07,280 and, um, she came home one day, as a little kid, when man landed on the moon. 550 00:23:07,280 --> 00:23:08,120 when man landed on the moon. 551 00:23:08,120 --> 00:23:10,040 She was very excited to her grandfather, 552 00:23:10,040 --> 00:23:12,560 and he was just devastated. 553 00:23:13,800 --> 00:23:15,320 Because he knew what it meant, 554 00:23:15,320 --> 00:23:17,800 he knew that the implications of conquest, 555 00:23:17,800 --> 00:23:19,400 to expand into space in that way, 556 00:23:19,400 --> 00:23:19,640 and that the arrogance to expand into space in that way, 557 00:23:19,640 --> 00:23:21,600 and that the arrogance and the audacity. 558 00:23:21,600 --> 00:23:21,840 and that the arrogance Yeah, I sit on that fence, I think. 559 00:23:21,840 --> 00:23:24,080 Yeah, I sit on that fence, I think. 560 00:23:24,080 --> 00:23:24,920 Yeah. 561 00:23:24,920 --> 00:23:29,440 I think if you can't experience awe from the place that we're born into 562 00:23:29,440 --> 00:23:29,680 I think if you can't experience awe and onto, in balance with the Earth, 563 00:23:29,680 --> 00:23:31,400 and onto, in balance with the Earth, 564 00:23:31,400 --> 00:23:31,640 then I think there's and onto, in balance with the Earth, 565 00:23:31,640 --> 00:23:34,960 then I think there's something out of whack. 566 00:23:34,960 --> 00:23:35,200 then I think there's Mm-hm. Mm. 567 00:23:35,200 --> 00:23:36,360 Mm-hm. Mm. 568 00:23:39,240 --> 00:23:41,280 Amos's words are so valid. 569 00:23:43,640 --> 00:23:46,280 A reminder that our dreams of space travel 570 00:23:46,280 --> 00:23:49,920 are often intertwined with the language of colonialism and empire. 571 00:23:51,560 --> 00:23:54,840 MAN: Because that challenge is one that we intend to win. 572 00:23:56,760 --> 00:24:00,240 Those connections can be hard to shake. 573 00:24:00,240 --> 00:24:03,320 But what if we had a stronger relationship with the stars 574 00:24:03,320 --> 00:24:03,560 But what if we had a stronger from here on Earth? 575 00:24:03,560 --> 00:24:05,360 from here on Earth? 576 00:24:05,360 --> 00:24:08,600 How would that change the way we think about space? 577 00:24:15,040 --> 00:24:16,600 Hi. Hi, Jess. 578 00:24:16,600 --> 00:24:17,760 Hey, Shireen. Nice to meet you. Come in. 579 00:24:17,760 --> 00:24:19,480 Nice to meet you, too. How are you doing? 580 00:24:19,480 --> 00:24:21,320 Great. Is it always this tidy, or did... 581 00:24:21,320 --> 00:24:23,360 Well, I mean, it's pretty messy over there, but... 582 00:24:23,360 --> 00:24:23,600 Well, I mean, it's pretty messy Come on, it's beautiful in here. 583 00:24:23,600 --> 00:24:24,720 Come on, it's beautiful in here. 584 00:24:24,720 --> 00:24:24,960 It feels like a display home. Come on, it's beautiful in here. 585 00:24:24,960 --> 00:24:28,120 It feels like a display home. Oh, no. (LAUGHS) 586 00:24:33,440 --> 00:24:37,280 Shireen Taweel is an artist whose connection to the stars 587 00:24:37,280 --> 00:24:40,280 has taken her on an extraordinary journey 588 00:24:40,280 --> 00:24:43,880 and has forged a link between her Lebanese-Australian heritage 589 00:24:43,880 --> 00:24:47,200 and a science-fiction vision of the future. 590 00:24:47,200 --> 00:24:50,760 So, in the studio, I've been investigating 591 00:24:50,760 --> 00:24:51,000 So, in the studio, celestial navigation technologies. 592 00:24:51,000 --> 00:24:53,240 celestial navigation technologies. 593 00:24:53,240 --> 00:24:56,200 And, really, it comes back to the core materiality of copper 594 00:24:56,200 --> 00:24:56,440 And, really, it comes back to and its connection to science 595 00:24:56,440 --> 00:24:58,320 and its connection to science 596 00:24:58,320 --> 00:25:04,360 and astronomy and practice of time, and its cultural connections. 597 00:25:04,360 --> 00:25:07,080 The navigation devices I've been delving into 598 00:25:07,080 --> 00:25:07,320 The navigation devices are from the Arabic sciences, 599 00:25:07,320 --> 00:25:08,480 are from the Arabic sciences, 600 00:25:08,480 --> 00:25:10,720 and they're made also from precious metals, 601 00:25:10,720 --> 00:25:10,960 and they're made also like copper and brass and silver. 602 00:25:10,960 --> 00:25:13,320 like copper and brass and silver. 603 00:25:13,320 --> 00:25:16,480 Shireen hand-crafted these three devices 604 00:25:16,480 --> 00:25:18,360 used for navigating by the stars - 605 00:25:18,360 --> 00:25:22,480 a quadrant, an astrolabe, and a compass. 606 00:25:22,480 --> 00:25:26,760 My tools are literally the same as the astronomers' tools 607 00:25:26,760 --> 00:25:29,040 you would have found at an observatory 608 00:25:29,040 --> 00:25:29,280 you would have found up until, like, the last century. 609 00:25:29,280 --> 00:25:31,520 up until, like, the last century. 610 00:25:31,520 --> 00:25:32,480 Wow. Yeah. 611 00:25:32,480 --> 00:25:36,720 And, so, this is a rete, which is the front face of an astrolabe. 612 00:25:36,720 --> 00:25:39,040 But what's so beautiful about an astrolabe 613 00:25:39,040 --> 00:25:43,600 is, like, you're holding the universe in the palm of your hands. 614 00:25:43,600 --> 00:25:46,280 And, so, within a device of an astrolabe, 615 00:25:46,280 --> 00:25:46,520 And, so, within a device of which is kind of like a computer, 616 00:25:46,520 --> 00:25:48,080 which is kind of like a computer, 617 00:25:48,080 --> 00:25:48,320 each point you would find which is kind of like a computer, 618 00:25:48,320 --> 00:25:50,920 each point you would find on the device 619 00:25:50,920 --> 00:25:53,560 is actually pointing to a specific star, yeah. 620 00:25:53,560 --> 00:25:56,120 Wow. Yeah. 621 00:25:57,440 --> 00:26:02,360 There's something so beautiful about how tactile and elemental it is, 622 00:26:02,360 --> 00:26:04,120 and you're also exploring ideas of, like... 623 00:26:04,120 --> 00:26:06,040 Yeah. ..things that are so far beyond. 624 00:26:06,040 --> 00:26:06,280 Yeah. Oh, absolutely. 625 00:26:06,280 --> 00:26:07,120 Oh, absolutely. 626 00:26:07,120 --> 00:26:10,600 And this materiality has had such a play in astronomy. 627 00:26:15,360 --> 00:26:18,440 Last year, Shireen went on a pilgrimage, 628 00:26:18,440 --> 00:26:21,600 a Hajj, following a line towards Mecca 629 00:26:21,600 --> 00:26:26,840 across Australia and New Zealand for over 5,000 nautical miles. 630 00:26:26,840 --> 00:26:29,360 And she used those handmade instruments 631 00:26:29,360 --> 00:26:31,040 and ancient navigation techniques 632 00:26:31,040 --> 00:26:31,280 to plot a course using the stars and ancient navigation techniques 633 00:26:31,280 --> 00:26:34,120 to plot a course using the stars in the night sky. 634 00:26:36,280 --> 00:26:39,320 It was such an extraordinary experience, 635 00:26:39,320 --> 00:26:42,920 constantly being connected to the night sky 636 00:26:42,920 --> 00:26:48,120 and just literally, like, eyeballing the star you're relating to. 637 00:26:48,120 --> 00:26:50,360 It must be an incredible feeling to be 638 00:26:50,360 --> 00:26:53,360 so aware of your global location in such a tactile way. 639 00:26:53,360 --> 00:26:53,600 so aware of your global location Oh, absolutely. 640 00:26:53,600 --> 00:26:54,680 Oh, absolutely. 641 00:26:54,680 --> 00:26:58,120 Like, you're so connected to the whole of Earth at any time. 642 00:26:59,680 --> 00:27:02,240 Shireen's journey was part of an artwork called 643 00:27:02,240 --> 00:27:02,480 Shireen's journey was part of Pilgrimage Of A Hajjanaut, 644 00:27:02,480 --> 00:27:04,280 Pilgrimage Of A Hajjanaut, 645 00:27:04,280 --> 00:27:07,400 taking age-old practices of faith and migration 646 00:27:07,400 --> 00:27:11,240 and imagining what they would look like on a journey into space. 647 00:27:15,160 --> 00:27:18,080 Within, like, the Arab region, for millennia, 648 00:27:18,080 --> 00:27:18,320 Within, like, the Arab region, we've been extraordinary travellers. 649 00:27:18,320 --> 00:27:21,360 we've been extraordinary travellers. 650 00:27:21,360 --> 00:27:26,560 We know the iconic pilgrim for Hajj wears, like, the white garments. 651 00:27:26,560 --> 00:27:29,080 I was wanting to fold in the space garments, 652 00:27:29,080 --> 00:27:33,120 but also it, like, unzips and becomes a sacred space for prayer. 653 00:27:37,880 --> 00:27:42,160 Did you get any, like, profound insights from your process? 654 00:27:42,160 --> 00:27:46,320 Well, it's definitely an experience I'm still reflecting on. 655 00:27:46,320 --> 00:27:49,240 Myself, being Lebanese Australian, 656 00:27:49,240 --> 00:27:52,280 where my parents migrated here, and having grown up here, 657 00:27:52,280 --> 00:27:54,760 we've always had to think of the future 658 00:27:54,760 --> 00:27:58,400 and work towards that sense of kind of survival 659 00:27:58,400 --> 00:28:01,560 and establishing a sense of place and belonging. 660 00:28:01,560 --> 00:28:01,800 and establishing a sense of place So, it's been really beautiful 661 00:28:01,800 --> 00:28:03,120 So, it's been really beautiful 662 00:28:03,120 --> 00:28:05,560 to think about future practices 663 00:28:05,560 --> 00:28:09,440 that are also connected to off-Earth experiences of the sacred. 664 00:28:11,400 --> 00:28:14,400 If we are to journey out into space as a species, 665 00:28:14,400 --> 00:28:14,640 If we are to journey out how do we not mess it up? 666 00:28:14,640 --> 00:28:17,680 how do we not mess it up? 667 00:28:17,680 --> 00:28:23,040 There needs to be far more diverse voices in the activity of space, 668 00:28:23,040 --> 00:28:25,560 because we're all connected to the night sky 669 00:28:25,560 --> 00:28:28,440 and we all come from paths that have involved 670 00:28:28,440 --> 00:28:28,680 and we all come from paths really beautiful dialogues 671 00:28:28,680 --> 00:28:30,440 really beautiful dialogues 672 00:28:30,440 --> 00:28:33,520 and contributions to our understanding of astronomy. 673 00:28:33,520 --> 00:28:33,760 and contributions Mm-hm. 674 00:28:33,760 --> 00:28:34,560 Mm-hm. 675 00:28:36,000 --> 00:28:40,080 It's incredible how Shireen's deep research into the ancient past 676 00:28:40,080 --> 00:28:43,000 brings us to the moment we're in right now, 677 00:28:43,000 --> 00:28:45,520 standing on the threshold of the universe. 678 00:28:48,160 --> 00:28:51,640 Why is it important for us to go into space 679 00:28:51,640 --> 00:28:55,240 with a collective approach, as opposed to a competitive one? 680 00:28:55,240 --> 00:28:57,960 Space is hard. Really hard. 681 00:28:57,960 --> 00:28:58,960 Quote of the day. 682 00:28:58,960 --> 00:29:00,520 Everything in space wants to kill you, 683 00:29:00,520 --> 00:29:00,760 Everything in space from the vacuum to radiation. 684 00:29:00,760 --> 00:29:03,000 from the vacuum to radiation. 685 00:29:03,000 --> 00:29:07,280 It's extremely dangerous, and that requires innovation. 686 00:29:07,280 --> 00:29:11,360 And diversity is the fuel for innovation. 687 00:29:11,360 --> 00:29:14,800 The more diverse a group is, the more likely it is to be creative 688 00:29:14,800 --> 00:29:18,200 and come up with solutions that we never thought of before. 689 00:29:18,200 --> 00:29:21,440 And that's why diversity isn't just the right thing to do, 690 00:29:21,440 --> 00:29:27,440 it's mission critical to achieve the dreams that we have in space. 691 00:29:27,440 --> 00:29:29,880 I set out on this journey to see if there was a way 692 00:29:29,880 --> 00:29:32,400 we could explore space without messing it up. 693 00:29:32,400 --> 00:29:32,640 we could explore space And like everything we humans do, 694 00:29:32,640 --> 00:29:34,400 And like everything we humans do, 695 00:29:34,400 --> 00:29:37,400 it's complicated with no easy answers. 696 00:29:38,600 --> 00:29:42,160 But I do think art offers a way to keep our eyes open 697 00:29:42,160 --> 00:29:42,400 But I do think art offers a way and steer us in the right direction. 698 00:29:42,400 --> 00:29:44,400 and steer us in the right direction. 699 00:29:44,400 --> 00:29:49,440 And if our vision of the future can make room for more voices, 700 00:29:49,440 --> 00:29:49,720 then our next giant leap into the unknown And if our vision of the future can make room for more voices, 701 00:29:49,720 --> 00:29:52,080 then our next giant leap into the unknown 702 00:29:52,080 --> 00:29:54,880 could land us somewhere truly incredible.