1 00:00:12,304 --> 00:00:15,306 OKA: When I got to ILM, it was really interesting, 2 00:00:15,307 --> 00:00:20,979 {\an8}because the first impression was like, "Hmm, this is not right." 3 00:00:22,064 --> 00:00:23,314 You're making Star Wars. 4 00:00:23,315 --> 00:00:25,942 It's all this, like, huge Hollywood company. 5 00:00:25,943 --> 00:00:29,612 I get there and I'm expecting all this, like, wow, you know, 6 00:00:29,613 --> 00:00:31,823 all the lights and action and everything. 7 00:00:32,449 --> 00:00:34,368 {\an8}It's like a dentist's office. 8 00:00:35,077 --> 00:00:37,411 {\an8}JIM: The street that ILM was on is Kerner. 9 00:00:37,412 --> 00:00:39,830 {\an8}And Star Wars had been a big deal. 10 00:00:39,831 --> 00:00:43,167 {\an8}And when George moved the business up here, 11 00:00:43,168 --> 00:00:45,002 {\an8}he wanted to keep it low-key 12 00:00:45,003 --> 00:00:48,048 {\an8}so that people wouldn't know what was going on and so forth. 13 00:00:49,174 --> 00:00:52,218 {\an8}DENNIS: We had a door that said Kerner Optical Company. 14 00:00:52,219 --> 00:00:55,805 That was just a diversion so people wouldn't be thinking, 15 00:00:55,806 --> 00:00:59,558 {\an8}"I don't see Industrial Light & Magic, or I don't see Star Wars anywhere." 16 00:00:59,559 --> 00:01:04,314 {\an8}They walk past and go on to somebody else, to the auto repair shop. 17 00:01:08,819 --> 00:01:11,487 KNOLL: One of the things that I felt like I could always say 18 00:01:11,488 --> 00:01:14,908 {\an8}when I was touring people around ILM was... 19 00:01:15,492 --> 00:01:19,120 {\an8}just by the kind of ratty rundown nature of the building that, 20 00:01:19,121 --> 00:01:21,415 "Hey, we're putting every dollar on the screen." 21 00:01:22,791 --> 00:01:25,627 It's not going into polished brass door knobs. 22 00:01:28,672 --> 00:01:29,756 It's going on screen. 23 00:01:35,137 --> 00:01:37,139 (THEME MUSIC PLAYING) 24 00:02:21,892 --> 00:02:25,187 I got handed a script for Pirates of the Caribbean. 25 00:02:25,687 --> 00:02:28,814 I'll admit, my first reaction when I saw the script was, 26 00:02:28,815 --> 00:02:30,900 "Oh, my God, this can't be any good." 27 00:02:30,901 --> 00:02:33,527 {\an8}I read through it, and the script was pretty good. 28 00:02:33,528 --> 00:02:36,864 {\an8}And so my next thought was, "Well, what about Hal?" 29 00:02:36,865 --> 00:02:38,824 {\an8}HAL: And so, he slides the script across the desk 30 00:02:38,825 --> 00:02:40,409 {\an8}and it says "Pirates of the Caribbean." 31 00:02:40,410 --> 00:02:45,456 {\an8}And I thought, "Oh, it's a movie based on a theme park ride." 32 00:02:45,457 --> 00:02:46,541 {\an8}I don't know. 33 00:02:47,250 --> 00:02:50,711 {\an8}♪ Yo-ho, yo-ho, a pirate's life for me ♪ 34 00:02:50,712 --> 00:02:53,047 {\an8}How do you make a story out of that, right? 35 00:02:53,048 --> 00:02:56,884 Strike your colors, ya bloomin' cockroaches! 36 00:02:56,885 --> 00:02:59,512 Show 'em your larboard side. 37 00:02:59,513 --> 00:03:02,640 It just seemed like, "Okay, you know, this is what I get handed." 38 00:03:02,641 --> 00:03:04,059 (WHISTLING) 39 00:03:04,518 --> 00:03:06,978 I love making a movie that's not supposed to work. 40 00:03:07,646 --> 00:03:11,190 {\an8}That's the magic. The adventure is, like, we don't know what's going to happen. 41 00:03:11,191 --> 00:03:14,110 A guy is shooting and poking and firing guns and doing all this stuff. 42 00:03:14,111 --> 00:03:18,239 Gore's whole vision for the project was offbeat and interesting and fresh. 43 00:03:18,240 --> 00:03:19,490 So, yeah, that first meeting, 44 00:03:19,491 --> 00:03:23,036 I came out of there just, you know, a couple of inches off the ground. 45 00:03:25,872 --> 00:03:28,249 It's kind of the punk rock Western, right? 46 00:03:28,250 --> 00:03:30,376 I mean, pirates are kind of rogues. 47 00:03:30,377 --> 00:03:33,587 They have a code, but they're willing to break it. 48 00:03:33,588 --> 00:03:36,173 In a corrupt world, there's no place for an honest thief. 49 00:03:36,174 --> 00:03:39,760 That aspect of the film was what initially grabbed me. 50 00:03:39,761 --> 00:03:41,679 The genre was really nonexistent, 51 00:03:41,680 --> 00:03:44,432 so it was super-exciting to come back to it. 52 00:03:44,433 --> 00:03:45,599 Fire! 53 00:03:45,600 --> 00:03:46,851 (CANNONS FIRING) 54 00:03:46,852 --> 00:03:52,606 I had grown up watching these old classic movies from the '40s and '50s 55 00:03:52,607 --> 00:03:56,485 of wooden boat in a studio tank, and I just loved that stuff. 56 00:03:56,486 --> 00:03:57,611 Suddenly, I had this script 57 00:03:57,612 --> 00:04:00,406 where I had this opportunity to build a tank 58 00:04:00,407 --> 00:04:04,118 and build some big wooden boats and shoot them 59 00:04:04,119 --> 00:04:07,163 kind of like in the Paramount or 20th Century Fox lot. 60 00:04:07,164 --> 00:04:08,873 And I thought, "This'll be huge fun." 61 00:04:08,874 --> 00:04:12,501 {\an8}Out back here, the stage guys built about a four-foot wall. 62 00:04:12,502 --> 00:04:15,421 Super, super strong. Lined it with plastic. 63 00:04:15,422 --> 00:04:17,048 We filled it with water. 64 00:04:18,008 --> 00:04:21,887 So we're having pirate ships that are 35-feet long. 65 00:04:23,638 --> 00:04:28,642 And these giant sets had to have pyro and model 66 00:04:28,643 --> 00:04:33,023 and stage guys with rigs to pull the ships across and wind. 67 00:04:33,732 --> 00:04:34,858 Talk about exciting. 68 00:04:35,734 --> 00:04:36,735 MAN: Fire! 69 00:04:42,032 --> 00:04:44,200 {\an8}(CREW CHEERING AND APPLAUDING) 70 00:04:44,201 --> 00:04:45,701 KNOLL: Hey, can I show you something here? 71 00:04:45,702 --> 00:04:46,786 VERBINSKI: Yeah. 72 00:04:46,787 --> 00:04:47,995 This is your geography. 73 00:04:47,996 --> 00:04:50,040 VERBINSKI: John and I have a weird psychic connection. 74 00:04:50,499 --> 00:04:53,334 My father was a nuclear physicist, and so was John's. 75 00:04:53,335 --> 00:04:55,669 And we found out years later they knew each other. 76 00:04:55,670 --> 00:04:57,880 I'm usually saying to John, like, 77 00:04:57,881 --> 00:05:00,466 "I need this tool that doesn't exist to do something." 78 00:05:00,467 --> 00:05:02,092 The dynamics aren't gonna be what you want, 79 00:05:02,093 --> 00:05:03,595 and then I'm gonna be trying to get rid of it. 80 00:05:04,095 --> 00:05:07,681 You get a lot more energy from someone like that 81 00:05:07,682 --> 00:05:10,142 when he starts to become challenged. 82 00:05:10,143 --> 00:05:11,477 VERBINSKI: Action! 83 00:05:11,478 --> 00:05:14,021 KNOLL: One of the big challenges on Pirates 1 84 00:05:14,022 --> 00:05:16,690 was that these pirates are cursed, 85 00:05:16,691 --> 00:05:22,029 {\an8}so that when they appear in moonlight, they're these desiccated skeletons. 86 00:05:22,030 --> 00:05:26,617 And when they're out of the moonlight, they're actors in their picture costumes. 87 00:05:26,618 --> 00:05:27,702 VERBINSKI: Action! 88 00:05:28,286 --> 00:05:34,209 KNOLL: And they had to transition from live-action to CG and then back. 89 00:05:34,751 --> 00:05:37,586 And so I thought, "Well, let's just shoot it with the actor, 90 00:05:37,587 --> 00:05:39,171 "and then we'll shoot a clean plate, 91 00:05:39,172 --> 00:05:42,383 "and I'll just paint out what I need to paint out, 92 00:05:42,384 --> 00:05:44,510 "and we'll just kind of deal with it." 93 00:05:44,511 --> 00:05:48,515 Our paint crew got to be really, really good at doing that. 94 00:05:51,309 --> 00:05:53,061 Couldn't resist, mate. 95 00:05:53,436 --> 00:05:56,105 VERBINSKI: It was important to understand what's actually happening, 96 00:05:56,106 --> 00:05:58,899 particularly as Barbossa transitions in the moonlight 97 00:05:58,900 --> 00:06:01,235 when he's explaining who we are. 98 00:06:01,236 --> 00:06:02,486 It was a tight shot. 99 00:06:02,487 --> 00:06:04,154 And we wanted to work on that shot first 100 00:06:04,155 --> 00:06:06,073 because we just knew it would be challenging. 101 00:06:06,074 --> 00:06:09,202 And if we could nail it, the audience would buy into the effect. 102 00:06:09,911 --> 00:06:10,911 So we did a little trick 103 00:06:10,912 --> 00:06:16,417 where for about a half-second after he transforms into our CG skeleton version, 104 00:06:16,418 --> 00:06:18,169 we kept his real eyes in there. 105 00:06:21,590 --> 00:06:22,882 Then he does a little half-blink 106 00:06:22,883 --> 00:06:25,760 and it switches to all CG from that point on... 107 00:06:26,720 --> 00:06:30,347 to kind of keep that little piece that we knew the audience was staring at 108 00:06:30,348 --> 00:06:34,227 for just a little longer over the border from real to digital. 109 00:06:35,020 --> 00:06:38,731 You best start believing in ghost stories, Miss Turner. 110 00:06:38,732 --> 00:06:39,858 You're in one. 111 00:06:40,525 --> 00:06:41,692 And it really worked. 112 00:06:41,693 --> 00:06:43,861 - (LAUGHS) - (ALL LAUGHING) 113 00:06:43,862 --> 00:06:46,489 Hal had started as a stop-motion animator. 114 00:06:46,907 --> 00:06:48,742 He really connected with the work. 115 00:06:52,621 --> 00:06:57,625 My upbringing, uh, the most important part of it was on a ranch in Colorado, 116 00:06:57,626 --> 00:07:01,254 about a million miles from anything film-related. 117 00:07:03,965 --> 00:07:07,926 That gave me a strong identification with Luke Skywalker, 118 00:07:07,927 --> 00:07:10,763 both in terms of the fantasy narrative of Star Wars 119 00:07:10,764 --> 00:07:14,350 and being far, far from the bright center of the universe, 120 00:07:14,351 --> 00:07:16,060 or whatever Luke says about that. 121 00:07:16,061 --> 00:07:18,103 Well, if there's a bright center to the universe, 122 00:07:18,104 --> 00:07:20,397 you're on the planet that it's farthest from. 123 00:07:20,398 --> 00:07:22,274 - (HELICOPTER WHIRRING) - (ROARING) 124 00:07:22,275 --> 00:07:24,360 (SCREAMING) 125 00:07:24,361 --> 00:07:28,405 HAL: I was living on a pretty steady diet of midnight movies, 126 00:07:28,406 --> 00:07:32,410 horror, sci-fi, fantasy, mystery... 127 00:07:32,869 --> 00:07:36,205 most of the old Universal horror films, 128 00:07:36,206 --> 00:07:37,666 {\an8}everything by Ray Harryhausen. 129 00:07:41,920 --> 00:07:45,506 The sort of birthplace of the idea of being an animator for me 130 00:07:45,507 --> 00:07:48,885 was seeing the original King Kong on TV. 131 00:07:49,761 --> 00:07:53,138 I was outraged at Kong's treatment in the film 132 00:07:53,139 --> 00:07:56,725 and asked my mother to help me draft a letter to the local TV station 133 00:07:56,726 --> 00:07:59,813 who I held accountable for his death. 134 00:08:02,607 --> 00:08:07,903 {\an8}In 1988, I started on Will Vinton Studios doing stop-motion clay animation. 135 00:08:07,904 --> 00:08:09,321 {\an8}And they were blowing up 136 00:08:09,322 --> 00:08:11,949 {\an8}because they had gotten this account, the California Raisins, 137 00:08:11,950 --> 00:08:15,119 which were kind of a blip on the cultural radar in the '80s. 138 00:08:15,120 --> 00:08:18,330 ♪ Ooh, I heard it through the grapevine ♪ 139 00:08:18,331 --> 00:08:21,709 HAL: My goal was to ultimately come down to the Bay Area 140 00:08:21,710 --> 00:08:23,127 and work for ILM. 141 00:08:23,128 --> 00:08:26,673 So joining ILM ultimately was huge for me. 142 00:08:28,675 --> 00:08:31,009 VERBINSKI: We were huge fans of Ray Harryhausen 143 00:08:31,010 --> 00:08:32,469 and Jason and the Argonauts. 144 00:08:32,470 --> 00:08:34,847 But a lot of that stuff's locked off. They're miming. 145 00:08:34,848 --> 00:08:36,974 We didn't want to lock off the camera. 146 00:08:36,975 --> 00:08:38,392 (PIRATE GRUNTING) 147 00:08:38,393 --> 00:08:40,353 GORE: We wanted to liberate the camera. 148 00:08:41,896 --> 00:08:45,691 When you've got, you know, 70 characters interlaced 149 00:08:45,692 --> 00:08:49,319 and you're handheld and they're all doing this sort of choreography, 150 00:08:49,320 --> 00:08:51,739 you want to make it feel like there is no plan, 151 00:08:51,740 --> 00:08:53,782 that you're literally reacting. 152 00:08:53,783 --> 00:08:55,701 That guy's head's bouncing across the floor, 153 00:08:55,702 --> 00:08:58,746 that's just happening, so you want to respond intuitively. 154 00:08:58,747 --> 00:09:00,832 That was probably the biggest challenge. 155 00:09:01,583 --> 00:09:03,167 {\an8}KNOLL: The only thing that really made sense 156 00:09:03,168 --> 00:09:05,919 {\an8}was to go ahead and shoot the actors in their picture costumes 157 00:09:05,920 --> 00:09:08,506 {\an8}and then match move them as closely as we could. 158 00:09:12,302 --> 00:09:13,428 (BABBLING) 159 00:09:14,137 --> 00:09:15,597 (GROANING) 160 00:09:17,515 --> 00:09:21,101 But that process was really fraught and difficult and error-prone. 161 00:09:21,102 --> 00:09:25,522 There were times when the characters were only going to be the skeletons 162 00:09:25,523 --> 00:09:27,775 {\an8}where we did do some motion capture. 163 00:09:27,776 --> 00:09:32,530 {\an8}We just shot it on our stage here with some of our animators playing the roles. 164 00:09:43,666 --> 00:09:45,293 (SCREAMING) 165 00:09:47,003 --> 00:09:48,213 All right. Looks good. 166 00:09:51,007 --> 00:09:53,175 We were right in the finishing months, 167 00:09:53,176 --> 00:09:55,928 and Ray made one of his period visits to ILM, 168 00:09:55,929 --> 00:09:59,431 and he sat at my desk and I showed him some of the shots from Pirates. 169 00:09:59,432 --> 00:10:01,558 And he had a big smile on his face. 170 00:10:01,559 --> 00:10:04,646 He just got a big kick out of it and really enjoyed it. 171 00:10:06,356 --> 00:10:08,357 For anyone who grew up on Ray Harryhausen, 172 00:10:08,358 --> 00:10:14,696 and particularly folks who then subsequently did stop-motion as a job, 173 00:10:14,697 --> 00:10:16,616 you know, nothing could be more perfect. 174 00:10:22,455 --> 00:10:26,458 JOHNSTON: So, by the time Revenge of the Sith came along, 175 00:10:26,459 --> 00:10:28,418 you were already in a digital pipeline. 176 00:10:28,419 --> 00:10:32,339 - But George kept pushing the envelope. - Well, yeah. 177 00:10:32,340 --> 00:10:37,428 {\an8}Revenge of the Sith is when we really started to use a lot of digital doubles. 178 00:10:43,101 --> 00:10:44,143 In this particular shot, 179 00:10:44,144 --> 00:10:46,103 we're going to have to create a digital Obi-Wan. 180 00:10:46,104 --> 00:10:48,689 Here you can see we start putting in the cloth sim, 181 00:10:48,690 --> 00:10:52,235 so we're thinking about how the cloth is going to be reacting to the throw. 182 00:10:52,986 --> 00:10:54,027 And here's the final shot. 183 00:10:54,028 --> 00:10:57,072 We now have a digital stunt double doubling Ewan McGregor. 184 00:10:57,073 --> 00:10:59,032 George was always pushing the envelope 185 00:10:59,033 --> 00:11:02,119 in terms of what he wanted from his fights. 186 00:11:02,120 --> 00:11:05,664 (LIGHTSABERS BUZZING, HUMMING) 187 00:11:05,665 --> 00:11:10,169 And Revenge of the Sith had, I think, more sword-fighting in it 188 00:11:10,170 --> 00:11:11,963 than any of the other films. 189 00:11:13,965 --> 00:11:15,215 (LIGHTSABER HUMMING) 190 00:11:15,216 --> 00:11:18,594 Anytime you see someone leap or jump or flip, 191 00:11:18,595 --> 00:11:21,139 it's highly likely that it's a fully digital character. 192 00:11:23,474 --> 00:11:26,019 The other thing we did was head replacements. 193 00:11:26,895 --> 00:11:29,939 So there's a fight between Palpatine and Mace Windu... 194 00:11:30,523 --> 00:11:34,026 where Ian, as amazing as an actor he is, he was like, "Guys, I can't... I..." 195 00:11:34,027 --> 00:11:35,986 He could barely... You know, he can't swordfight. 196 00:11:35,987 --> 00:11:38,155 So they had a stunt double doing it, 197 00:11:38,156 --> 00:11:40,365 but then it didn't look enough like Palpatine. 198 00:11:40,366 --> 00:11:43,119 So we had a digital head that we put on. 199 00:11:48,041 --> 00:11:50,959 So that was some of the big innovations that we were doing. 200 00:11:50,960 --> 00:11:53,504 (LIGHTSABERS CRACKLING) 201 00:11:54,047 --> 00:11:56,716 The scale of the show, it kept growing. 202 00:11:58,509 --> 00:12:02,347 Not unlike the Star Wars to Empire to Jedi. 203 00:12:03,514 --> 00:12:07,226 I think on Episode I, it was just under 2,000 shots. 204 00:12:07,227 --> 00:12:08,937 (ENGINE REVVING) 205 00:12:10,188 --> 00:12:12,189 And then, Episode II was a little over. 206 00:12:12,190 --> 00:12:14,775 (SHOCKWAVE REVERBERATING) 207 00:12:14,776 --> 00:12:18,987 And I think Episode III was like 2,500 VFX shots. 208 00:12:18,988 --> 00:12:21,448 (LIGHTSABERS BUZZING, CRACKLING) 209 00:12:21,449 --> 00:12:25,369 So I was trying to work out technique for all the sequences. 210 00:12:25,370 --> 00:12:26,996 (ENGINE WHINING) 211 00:12:28,206 --> 00:12:34,670 {\an8}This is a very, very succinct collage of early ideas for Mustafar. 212 00:12:34,671 --> 00:12:38,507 And as we developed it more, things got a little bit darker. 213 00:12:38,508 --> 00:12:42,678 What's interesting now is that the model shop is doing a build 214 00:12:42,679 --> 00:12:46,808 that's not too dissimilar to this, uh, at a very large scale. 215 00:12:56,442 --> 00:13:00,153 PETERSON: When I was presented, you know, "Here's the storyboards for Mustafar," 216 00:13:00,154 --> 00:13:01,989 just now I was thinking, 217 00:13:01,990 --> 00:13:05,075 "Well, we've used the word big and really big. 218 00:13:05,076 --> 00:13:08,495 "And Mustafar was, like, really, really big." 219 00:13:08,496 --> 00:13:11,499 You know, and it's... We don't quite have words for that. 220 00:13:11,916 --> 00:13:13,626 LUCAS: It's meant to look like hell. 221 00:13:14,627 --> 00:13:18,047 {\an8}And that's sort of where Darth Vader comes from. 222 00:13:19,007 --> 00:13:22,509 KNOLL: My CG supervisor was pushing for, 223 00:13:22,510 --> 00:13:24,678 "Hey, we can do this stuff in computer graphics. 224 00:13:24,679 --> 00:13:27,097 "We can do lava. It'll look great." 225 00:13:27,098 --> 00:13:32,728 And I had had enough experience seeing fluid sims being done 226 00:13:32,729 --> 00:13:35,981 that I was skeptical that we were going to get enough resolution out of it, 227 00:13:35,982 --> 00:13:37,066 enough detail. 228 00:13:37,525 --> 00:13:41,946 Scott Farrar had done a movie called Congo back in the mid-'90s... 229 00:13:43,156 --> 00:13:46,825 where they had done lava using Methocel. 230 00:13:46,826 --> 00:13:51,539 And that was... I felt like a pretty good way to work. 231 00:13:52,749 --> 00:13:56,918 And so, I pitched doing Mustafar as a big miniature. 232 00:13:56,919 --> 00:13:58,003 That was... 233 00:13:58,004 --> 00:14:02,549 I think the miniature was 40-feet wide by about 30-feet across. 234 00:14:02,550 --> 00:14:06,428 PETERSON: It was probably not quite as long as a tennis court 235 00:14:06,429 --> 00:14:07,805 and not quite as wide. 236 00:14:10,141 --> 00:14:15,812 Not only was it a huge sculpture to do, you know, out of these huge foam blocks, 237 00:14:15,813 --> 00:14:20,192 but there were, you know, hundreds of them sort of built like big building blocks. 238 00:14:20,193 --> 00:14:25,989 And we built all the lava channels with clear Plexiglass bottoms 239 00:14:25,990 --> 00:14:28,867 so that you could have this translucent Methocel 240 00:14:28,868 --> 00:14:32,537 and under-light it to get the glow coming up from them. 241 00:14:32,538 --> 00:14:34,415 Yeah. That's orange. 242 00:14:35,792 --> 00:14:39,336 And then, off to the side, we had someone you couldn't see 243 00:14:39,337 --> 00:14:43,256 that would be shoveling burnt cork of various sizes, 244 00:14:43,257 --> 00:14:46,718 from half-inch to eighth-inch to two inches. 245 00:14:46,719 --> 00:14:50,723 And so, the lava when it came down, would have that black crusty thing on it. 246 00:14:51,474 --> 00:14:53,225 I don't know quite how to describe it. 247 00:14:53,226 --> 00:14:56,394 It's like a ballet that everything has to come together, 248 00:14:56,395 --> 00:14:59,065 you know, to make that set work. 249 00:15:02,068 --> 00:15:04,153 But it worked out incredibly well, I thought. 250 00:15:04,654 --> 00:15:07,447 George was very satisfied. 251 00:15:07,448 --> 00:15:10,325 It was very gratifying for the model shop to do something like that, 252 00:15:10,326 --> 00:15:12,786 and have George so satisfied with it. 253 00:15:12,787 --> 00:15:14,122 (GRUNTING) 254 00:15:14,705 --> 00:15:16,749 (LIGHTSABERS BUZZING, CRACKLING) 255 00:15:18,459 --> 00:15:19,836 LUCAS: No, I think that looks great. 256 00:15:21,462 --> 00:15:22,463 Very good. 257 00:15:24,257 --> 00:15:26,259 (INDISTINCT CHATTER) 258 00:15:28,010 --> 00:15:32,597 DAVIS: At the end of Revenge of the Sith, that was it. 259 00:15:32,598 --> 00:15:34,934 We were done with the Star Wars movies for a while. 260 00:15:41,023 --> 00:15:44,109 In 2006, I got laid off 261 00:15:44,110 --> 00:15:47,363 {\an8}because things had gotten really quiet at the studio. 262 00:15:49,282 --> 00:15:51,825 LUCAS: We knew we were going to build a new ILM at some point. 263 00:15:51,826 --> 00:15:55,412 And the opportunity at the Presidio came up 264 00:15:55,413 --> 00:15:56,873 and I said, "Well, let's get that." 265 00:15:59,959 --> 00:16:02,461 I just wanted a beautiful place for people to work. 266 00:16:07,133 --> 00:16:09,467 {\an8}KNOLL: There was no visual effects business model 267 00:16:09,468 --> 00:16:11,846 that could ever support building a building like that. 268 00:16:12,138 --> 00:16:15,390 Um, George spent a lot of money building that 269 00:16:15,391 --> 00:16:17,643 that he knew he was never going to get back. 270 00:16:18,728 --> 00:16:19,728 LUCAS: So when they saw it, 271 00:16:19,729 --> 00:16:23,274 they realized that the old way of doing things was going to be gone. 272 00:16:24,692 --> 00:16:27,569 {\an8}DAVIS: We were really unsure as to what was going on. 273 00:16:27,570 --> 00:16:28,778 And then they had a meeting, 274 00:16:28,779 --> 00:16:31,656 and they invited us all back to the practical division. 275 00:16:31,657 --> 00:16:33,325 That's when they gave us the announcement 276 00:16:33,326 --> 00:16:36,037 that the practical division was being sold off. 277 00:16:36,621 --> 00:16:39,290 - JOHNSTON: How did that feel? - Oh, it was heartbreaking. 278 00:16:41,000 --> 00:16:43,669 I had always imagined, you know... 279 00:16:44,337 --> 00:16:47,673 once I got that job at ILM, I would retire there. 280 00:16:48,841 --> 00:16:50,760 {\an8}The sale of the model shop was... 281 00:17:00,519 --> 00:17:03,146 (SIGHS) It was the end of a great era. 282 00:17:03,147 --> 00:17:05,107 There was no going back. 283 00:17:14,325 --> 00:17:17,828 {\an8}When I came to ILM, ILM was pretty much the only game in town. 284 00:17:19,747 --> 00:17:21,039 {\an8}MORRIS: There was a long period of time 285 00:17:21,040 --> 00:17:23,792 {\an8}where we dominated the visual effects industry. 286 00:17:23,793 --> 00:17:27,045 {\an8}I'm Jim Morris. I'm the general manager at ILM. 287 00:17:27,046 --> 00:17:29,172 These folks are some of the key people. 288 00:17:29,173 --> 00:17:33,843 DAVIS: The plus side of ILM having such incredibly talented people 289 00:17:33,844 --> 00:17:35,637 and having so many of them... 290 00:17:35,638 --> 00:17:39,099 Pretty much everywhere I work, I do run into a couple of people from ILM. 291 00:17:39,100 --> 00:17:41,643 And if you look at all the visual effects companies 292 00:17:41,644 --> 00:17:43,186 that are out there now, 293 00:17:43,187 --> 00:17:47,149 the majority of them have been started by people at ILM. 294 00:17:47,817 --> 00:17:50,860 MORRIS: It's funny, back when I started, we'd sit around saying like, 295 00:17:50,861 --> 00:17:55,073 "One day, every film is going to need the stuff we do in visual effects." 296 00:17:55,074 --> 00:17:57,410 Later, it became, "Be careful what you wish for." 297 00:17:59,537 --> 00:18:02,582 {\an8}You know, suddenly you've spawned all this competition. 298 00:18:03,583 --> 00:18:07,043 There had been some people doing some simple CG in commercials and all. 299 00:18:07,044 --> 00:18:09,337 We were still way ahead. 300 00:18:09,338 --> 00:18:11,757 But we were in competition. 301 00:18:12,883 --> 00:18:15,885 {\an8}ILM was seen as sort of like both the pinnacle, 302 00:18:15,886 --> 00:18:19,140 {\an8}but also sort of as the champion you wanted to take down. 303 00:18:23,769 --> 00:18:26,313 {\an8}KNOLL: A lot of companies were trying to buy their way into it, 304 00:18:26,314 --> 00:18:30,400 offering people double and triple their salaries, 305 00:18:30,401 --> 00:18:34,030 which was really great for them, but it was really hard for us. 306 00:18:36,574 --> 00:18:38,325 {\an8}BROMLEY: There was some poaching going on. 307 00:18:38,326 --> 00:18:41,411 And, you know, people are going to be disgruntled from time to time, right? 308 00:18:41,412 --> 00:18:44,789 JOHNSTON: Anyone ever try to poach you away from ILM? 309 00:18:44,790 --> 00:18:47,668 Yeah, I had a few people wanting to take me. 310 00:18:48,127 --> 00:18:49,878 A couple of offers over the years. 311 00:18:49,879 --> 00:18:52,173 But nothing was quite as compelling... 312 00:18:52,965 --> 00:18:57,553 as being here in this storied facility. 313 00:19:00,306 --> 00:19:04,101 {\an8}JOHNSTON: Who were the major new players? And did ILM feel the competition? 314 00:19:04,852 --> 00:19:08,938 {\an8}There were a number of companies that got to be really, really good. 315 00:19:08,939 --> 00:19:12,651 {\an8}- (GUNSHOTS) - (BULLETS WHOOSHING) 316 00:19:12,652 --> 00:19:15,154 {\an8}KNOLL: Especially in the early 2000s. 317 00:19:20,743 --> 00:19:23,037 {\an8}MUREN: Some of the work that was coming out was really good. 318 00:19:26,374 --> 00:19:28,334 {\an8}Every year, it got better and better. 319 00:19:29,502 --> 00:19:30,795 {\an8}(ROARING) 320 00:19:34,799 --> 00:19:37,467 {\an8}Wētā, I would say, is our biggest competitor. 321 00:19:37,468 --> 00:19:43,431 {\an8}There's a lot of similarities in the way we approach our companies and the work. 322 00:19:43,432 --> 00:19:47,227 {\an8}You know, part of that is Joe Letteri running the company. 323 00:19:47,228 --> 00:19:50,647 He was a senior effects supervisor at ILM before he went to Wētā. 324 00:19:50,648 --> 00:19:52,816 {\an8}My title is technical director. 325 00:19:52,817 --> 00:19:57,278 {\an8}And I'm responsible for the way things look up on the screen. 326 00:19:57,279 --> 00:19:59,531 {\an8}The reason I went, really, was to work on Gollum, 327 00:19:59,532 --> 00:20:02,158 {\an8}because he was just a favorite character of mine from the books. 328 00:20:02,159 --> 00:20:06,663 My precious! 329 00:20:06,664 --> 00:20:09,374 There were a couple things that were revolutionary about Gollum. 330 00:20:09,375 --> 00:20:13,795 From a believability point of view, we needed the skin to look like skin. 331 00:20:13,796 --> 00:20:14,879 So there was a technique 332 00:20:14,880 --> 00:20:18,925 that we were just starting to develop at ILM before I left 333 00:20:18,926 --> 00:20:20,593 called subsurface scattering. 334 00:20:20,594 --> 00:20:23,263 You don't have any friends! 335 00:20:23,264 --> 00:20:25,640 Nobody likes you! 336 00:20:25,641 --> 00:20:28,017 The light goes in, scatters out the sides. 337 00:20:28,018 --> 00:20:32,189 That's what allowed us to make Gollum look so lifelike. 338 00:20:32,440 --> 00:20:33,732 (GROWLS) 339 00:20:33,733 --> 00:20:35,526 For achievement in visual effects... 340 00:20:36,026 --> 00:20:37,819 {\an8}JADA PINKETT: And the Oscar goes to... 341 00:20:37,820 --> 00:20:41,448 {\an8}Jim Rygiel, Joe Letteri, Randall William Cook, and Alex Funke 342 00:20:41,449 --> 00:20:43,908 for Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King. 343 00:20:43,909 --> 00:20:47,746 Thanks everyone at Wētā Digital for that burst of creative energy. 344 00:20:47,747 --> 00:20:50,039 It's funny, because everything is top secret 345 00:20:50,040 --> 00:20:51,583 while you're working on the film. 346 00:20:51,584 --> 00:20:53,918 And as soon as it comes out, we just all talk about it. 347 00:20:53,919 --> 00:20:57,338 So everyone knows what you did as soon as the film comes out. 348 00:20:57,339 --> 00:20:59,632 We come from such a small community to start with 349 00:20:59,633 --> 00:21:01,468 that we still maintain these friendships. 350 00:21:01,469 --> 00:21:03,929 So we all build on each other's work. 351 00:21:04,597 --> 00:21:07,515 Gollum probably made it a little bit easier for ILM 352 00:21:07,516 --> 00:21:11,686 to pitch a digital version of Davy Jones. And they upped the game on that. 353 00:21:11,687 --> 00:21:15,106 This is Davy Jones. 354 00:21:15,107 --> 00:21:19,235 {\an8}The first time Gore talked to John and I about a Pirates 2 and 3 with Davy Jones, 355 00:21:19,236 --> 00:21:22,155 {\an8}he's like, "I've got this CG character. He'll be in a lot of the movie. 356 00:21:22,156 --> 00:21:25,283 "He's going to be super-important. I want you guys to be thinking about that." 357 00:21:25,284 --> 00:21:27,285 It was going to be his Gollum. 358 00:21:27,286 --> 00:21:29,287 VERBINSKI: Early on, I just started thinking that 359 00:21:29,288 --> 00:21:35,418 what if being out on the Flying Dutchman over time was like a curse, a disease, 360 00:21:35,419 --> 00:21:38,963 that you started to kind of grow parts of the ocean floor, 361 00:21:38,964 --> 00:21:42,550 becoming the dregs of the ocean and become part of these characters. 362 00:21:42,551 --> 00:21:43,635 So that was fun. 363 00:21:43,636 --> 00:21:46,054 And early on, just doing sketches of all those characters, 364 00:21:46,055 --> 00:21:47,181 it was joyous. 365 00:21:48,015 --> 00:21:50,558 And then, we knew we needed the devil himself 366 00:21:50,559 --> 00:21:52,143 to sort of rule over all of them. 367 00:21:52,144 --> 00:21:55,980 And calling in a really good friend and amazing artist, Crash McCreery, 368 00:21:55,981 --> 00:21:58,983 to come in and do, like, "Okay, let's design Davy Jones 369 00:21:58,984 --> 00:22:01,487 "knowing that that's the fundamental premise." 370 00:22:04,532 --> 00:22:08,493 On Pirates 1, Geoffrey Rush gets to play Barbossa as Barbossa, 371 00:22:08,494 --> 00:22:12,206 and only transitions into a CG character in these sort of handful of shots. 372 00:22:14,708 --> 00:22:19,212 Davy Jones, he's going to be digital for, virtually, well, every frame that he's in. 373 00:22:19,213 --> 00:22:22,799 So really, the question became less about motion capture 374 00:22:22,800 --> 00:22:24,175 and more about emotion capture. 375 00:22:24,176 --> 00:22:27,053 So you do this, but then this is sort of stuck out there, 376 00:22:27,054 --> 00:22:29,848 - and it seems like there's... - Yeah, yeah. I see. 377 00:22:29,849 --> 00:22:32,475 VERBINSKI: Bill Nighy was going to be Davy Jones. 378 00:22:32,476 --> 00:22:36,563 He did not want to give up the thought behind his... 379 00:22:36,564 --> 00:22:37,647 the window to the soul. 380 00:22:37,648 --> 00:22:40,191 I don't want to give up anything in his performance. 381 00:22:40,192 --> 00:22:43,278 And that was sort of the challenge to John, really, and the team. 382 00:22:43,279 --> 00:22:47,074 How do we get rid of this conflict of visual effects and actor? 383 00:22:50,244 --> 00:22:52,370 You will watch this. 384 00:22:52,371 --> 00:22:54,706 HICKEL: We knew we were going to have a great actor in the role. 385 00:22:54,707 --> 00:22:58,793 We wanted them to act on set face to face with all the other actors, 386 00:22:58,794 --> 00:23:01,963 and for that performance to be the performance that's in the film. 387 00:23:01,964 --> 00:23:03,673 {\an8}This had to be something robust. 388 00:23:03,674 --> 00:23:06,844 {\an8}It had to be field portable and low-footprint on set. 389 00:23:07,386 --> 00:23:09,679 And it was Hal Hickel who asked, 390 00:23:09,680 --> 00:23:12,432 "Hey, if these guys are going to be CG all the time, 391 00:23:12,433 --> 00:23:14,268 "then they can be wearing anything, right? 392 00:23:14,852 --> 00:23:16,811 "Can we put some kind of tracking marks on them 393 00:23:16,812 --> 00:23:19,480 "to make that process a little more technically accurate 394 00:23:19,481 --> 00:23:20,815 "and not as labor-intensive?" 395 00:23:20,816 --> 00:23:24,110 They came back to us with the IMocap system. 396 00:23:24,111 --> 00:23:25,194 Damn you. 397 00:23:25,195 --> 00:23:28,282 {\an8}My working costume is a deeply attractive grey tracksuit. 398 00:23:29,408 --> 00:23:32,160 People have seen the actors, of course, in these grey suits 399 00:23:32,161 --> 00:23:33,870 with the little reflective balls on them. 400 00:23:33,871 --> 00:23:35,663 We came up with a slightly different suit. 401 00:23:35,664 --> 00:23:38,124 And for one thing, it had these bands instead of balls. 402 00:23:38,125 --> 00:23:41,920 And that was just about how we were planning to track their motion. 403 00:23:41,921 --> 00:23:46,591 KNOLL: Carefully designed tracking marks that would let them recover 404 00:23:46,592 --> 00:23:51,387 both position and orientation and scale of all the joints. 405 00:23:51,388 --> 00:23:53,640 And this meant that the cameras could be operated 406 00:23:53,641 --> 00:23:55,141 however they wanted to be operated. 407 00:23:55,142 --> 00:23:58,353 They could be lit any way the DP wanted to light them. 408 00:23:58,354 --> 00:24:01,981 And we could be standing in two feet of water in a lagoon, 409 00:24:01,982 --> 00:24:05,735 or we could be on the deck of a ship in pouring rain. 410 00:24:05,736 --> 00:24:08,696 Everybody could just ignore that we were doing visual effects, 411 00:24:08,697 --> 00:24:12,409 just shoot the movie, and we'll do what we need to do later. 412 00:24:13,619 --> 00:24:17,538 VERBINSKI: Fortunately, we had Bill, who can walk on set in a spandex outfit 413 00:24:17,539 --> 00:24:20,083 covered in dots with little polka dots on his face, 414 00:24:20,084 --> 00:24:22,043 and you can show him the picture of Davy Jones 415 00:24:22,044 --> 00:24:23,670 and he's like, "Got it. I'm that guy." 416 00:24:23,671 --> 00:24:27,424 And suddenly, you feel like you're a time-traveler in your pajamas. 417 00:24:29,093 --> 00:24:31,928 He's just bringing everything. 418 00:24:31,929 --> 00:24:34,764 Bill would do these amazing things with his jaw. 419 00:24:34,765 --> 00:24:38,768 He would do all this kind of crazy... And he has no jaw. 420 00:24:38,769 --> 00:24:40,688 His character has no jaw. There's a beard. 421 00:24:42,022 --> 00:24:44,023 Open the chest. I need to see it! 422 00:24:44,024 --> 00:24:48,821 The most daunting task was this beard of 40-some tentacles. 423 00:24:49,655 --> 00:24:52,783 ING: It had to be constantly alive. 424 00:24:53,242 --> 00:24:55,076 It has a mind of its own, 425 00:24:55,077 --> 00:24:58,788 {\an8}so as he was acting, it would twist and twirl around like an octopus. 426 00:24:58,789 --> 00:25:02,000 Coiling around each other, colliding with each other, 427 00:25:02,001 --> 00:25:04,293 moving in response to his body motion, 428 00:25:04,294 --> 00:25:06,839 getting hooked on each other and pulling apart. 429 00:25:07,631 --> 00:25:09,841 VERBINSKI: Interesting translucency right in there. 430 00:25:09,842 --> 00:25:10,925 KNOLL: Is it too much? 431 00:25:10,926 --> 00:25:14,303 VERBINSKI: My only question is does it make him a little too fragile calamari? 432 00:25:14,304 --> 00:25:16,973 So, extensive conversations with our team about, 433 00:25:16,974 --> 00:25:19,976 no, here he's agitated, or here he's coy, 434 00:25:19,977 --> 00:25:22,688 or here it's curling, at that moment he's thinking. 435 00:25:25,315 --> 00:25:27,942 There was no way we could possibly do it by hand. 436 00:25:27,943 --> 00:25:30,988 We would still be making the film today if we tried that. 437 00:25:31,947 --> 00:25:36,242 There had to be some kind of an automatic procedural way to do that 438 00:25:36,243 --> 00:25:39,996 so that the beard could automatically be doing that in the shot 439 00:25:39,997 --> 00:25:43,249 while the animators layered on the facial animation 440 00:25:43,250 --> 00:25:44,375 and the body animation. 441 00:25:44,376 --> 00:25:47,420 KNOLL: So, you know, I think we've made a lot of improvements to it. 442 00:25:47,421 --> 00:25:49,630 VERBINSKI: Is it going soft before the rack to Orlando? 443 00:25:49,631 --> 00:25:51,007 HICKEL: So there's no plan B. 444 00:25:51,008 --> 00:25:54,802 The simulation engine we were creating to run his beard had to work. 445 00:25:54,803 --> 00:26:00,516 And it provided a lot of sleepless nights for me, literally, until it did work. 446 00:26:00,517 --> 00:26:02,518 And then, once it worked, it was like magic. 447 00:26:02,519 --> 00:26:04,396 It worked perfectly. 448 00:26:13,113 --> 00:26:14,489 That was sort of next level, 449 00:26:14,490 --> 00:26:19,243 all those things combined to feel like there's nothing CG about it. 450 00:26:19,244 --> 00:26:22,246 You know, it feels like he's literally that character. 451 00:26:22,247 --> 00:26:27,877 Damn you, Jack Sparrow! 452 00:26:27,878 --> 00:26:29,588 NAOMI WATTS: And the Oscar goes to... 453 00:26:31,090 --> 00:26:34,634 John Knoll, Hal Hickel, Charles Gibson, and Allen Hall 454 00:26:34,635 --> 00:26:36,887 for The Pirates of the Caribbean. 455 00:26:37,221 --> 00:26:40,431 HAL: Pirates 2 came along at a really interesting time 456 00:26:40,432 --> 00:26:42,266 in terms of movies and visual effects, 457 00:26:42,267 --> 00:26:44,811 because we were in sort of early 2000s 458 00:26:44,812 --> 00:26:46,437 and there was kind of a malaise 459 00:26:46,438 --> 00:26:48,732 in terms of audience reaction to visual effects. 460 00:26:49,274 --> 00:26:50,858 Almost a backlash, maybe. 461 00:26:50,859 --> 00:26:53,945 The rapid... 462 00:26:53,946 --> 00:26:56,948 Super-rapid expansion of possibilities 463 00:26:56,949 --> 00:26:59,158 in terms of visual effects was 464 00:26:59,159 --> 00:27:03,246 in a way kind of responsible for making audiences lose their sense of wonder, 465 00:27:03,247 --> 00:27:04,789 which we really kind of depend on. 466 00:27:04,790 --> 00:27:06,666 They stopped asking, like, "How is it done?" 467 00:27:06,667 --> 00:27:08,835 They'd see it and say, "They can do anything nowadays. 468 00:27:08,836 --> 00:27:10,170 "They do it with a computer." 469 00:27:11,463 --> 00:27:16,592 {\an8}That was the project that showed me how we get an audience to say wow again. 470 00:27:16,593 --> 00:27:20,346 They were like, "I don't know what I'm seeing there. I don't... 471 00:27:20,347 --> 00:27:22,849 "Is that makeup? That can't be makeup. What is that?" 472 00:27:22,850 --> 00:27:25,685 And that gave them that little spark of wonder back. 473 00:27:25,686 --> 00:27:26,769 Thanks very much. 474 00:27:26,770 --> 00:27:28,688 HICKEL: It kind of renewed my faith 475 00:27:28,689 --> 00:27:30,898 that as filmmakers and visual effects artists, 476 00:27:30,899 --> 00:27:33,818 we could get audiences to just go, "Wow." 477 00:27:33,819 --> 00:27:36,696 - (SHOUTING) - (SCREAMING) 478 00:27:36,697 --> 00:27:38,906 VERBINSKI: By the time we were doing the third movie, 479 00:27:38,907 --> 00:27:42,326 there's the burden of how do you one-up the previous film? 480 00:27:42,327 --> 00:27:45,037 We want to launch in. Take turns, vying for close-up. Bam. 481 00:27:45,038 --> 00:27:47,623 - MAN: Yeah, yeah, yeah. - And then, kaboom. 482 00:27:47,624 --> 00:27:49,876 We needed to go out of 483 00:27:49,877 --> 00:27:52,336 what I'd call the trilogy with something extraordinary. 484 00:27:52,337 --> 00:27:53,671 Probably the sky first, 485 00:27:53,672 --> 00:27:57,508 and then a kind of first strike of lightning hits the sea and... 486 00:27:57,509 --> 00:27:58,968 And then it starts to move. 487 00:27:58,969 --> 00:28:01,512 So the two ships in the maelstrom felt like, 488 00:28:01,513 --> 00:28:04,515 okay, you could walk away saying, "Yeah, top that." 489 00:28:04,516 --> 00:28:06,935 It'd be great to see it framed like that. 490 00:28:07,853 --> 00:28:09,562 But you saw these guys jumping off... 491 00:28:09,563 --> 00:28:10,981 VERBINSKI: They're going that way? 492 00:28:12,649 --> 00:28:16,444 VERBINSKI: The challenges were, you know, that sort of location-based filmmaking 493 00:28:16,445 --> 00:28:20,114 that we had embraced with the first two, we couldn't embrace any longer. 494 00:28:20,115 --> 00:28:22,367 There's no way we could actually be at sea for that. 495 00:28:24,578 --> 00:28:28,790 KNOLL: This is the biggest blue screen setup I've ever seen. 496 00:28:29,333 --> 00:28:32,752 And I think this may be the largest blue screen ever. 497 00:28:32,753 --> 00:28:34,170 Got a lot of pixels to fill in. 498 00:28:34,171 --> 00:28:36,924 But I'm not a big fan of CG water. 499 00:28:37,591 --> 00:28:40,009 Water on that scale and how it behaves, 500 00:28:40,010 --> 00:28:43,512 we're still fundamentally building it as three or more basic 501 00:28:43,513 --> 00:28:46,515 completely different particle simulations. 502 00:28:46,516 --> 00:28:48,309 Only the problem I have with water sims is, 503 00:28:48,310 --> 00:28:53,314 you can get a big mass of water, but when it breaks, it turns to foam. 504 00:28:53,315 --> 00:28:55,776 And then the foam turns to spray. 505 00:28:56,276 --> 00:28:59,196 And it always looks like there's stitches. 506 00:29:00,489 --> 00:29:02,865 It's something that's inherently not real. 507 00:29:02,866 --> 00:29:06,243 And I think that was the one request that broke John, 508 00:29:06,244 --> 00:29:09,288 was like, "Hey, can you make me a water sim 509 00:29:09,289 --> 00:29:14,919 "that will be massive, but also break and become foam 510 00:29:14,920 --> 00:29:18,130 "and then the foam will become spray all in one sim?" 511 00:29:18,131 --> 00:29:20,509 It was much harder than I expected it to be. 512 00:29:22,761 --> 00:29:28,808 We had done pretty good fluid surface simulations on previous projects 513 00:29:28,809 --> 00:29:31,602 and I thought, "Okay, well, if we can do 514 00:29:31,603 --> 00:29:34,438 "a decent-looking patch of water in the foreground 515 00:29:34,439 --> 00:29:37,817 "and we can keep repeating that into the distance, 516 00:29:37,818 --> 00:29:41,988 "it's going to fade off into a big whirlpool shape 517 00:29:41,989 --> 00:29:45,242 "and rain and thunder and splashes." 518 00:29:46,785 --> 00:29:50,037 And as soon as I saw the first render of that idea, 519 00:29:50,038 --> 00:29:51,498 I thought it looked terrible. 520 00:29:52,624 --> 00:29:56,210 Plan B was I needed to do the whirlpool itself 521 00:29:56,211 --> 00:29:59,005 as the biggest simulation I could afford to do, 522 00:29:59,006 --> 00:30:04,219 and then do all of that fine detail, procedural detail in the foreground. 523 00:30:04,720 --> 00:30:05,720 {\an8}Ay-yi-yi-yi-yi. 524 00:30:05,721 --> 00:30:07,138 KNOLL: Gore hated it. 525 00:30:07,139 --> 00:30:08,514 It was like a toilet bowl. 526 00:30:08,515 --> 00:30:11,225 It was like the ships felt like a miniature. 527 00:30:11,226 --> 00:30:13,311 It felt completely off. 528 00:30:14,062 --> 00:30:18,025 Your brain's just going, "This isn't real." 529 00:30:21,778 --> 00:30:23,447 Uh... (CHUCKLES) 530 00:30:24,322 --> 00:30:26,366 Then we needed a plan C. 531 00:30:26,950 --> 00:30:29,285 The ship that takes the inside lane is moving faster. 532 00:30:29,286 --> 00:30:32,663 Those were some dark days for me because the clock was ticking. 533 00:30:32,664 --> 00:30:36,083 It was a very compressed post, and a lot of shots. 534 00:30:36,084 --> 00:30:38,127 They are trying to make it look plausible. 535 00:30:38,128 --> 00:30:40,296 JOHNSTON: John said you pushed him pretty hard. 536 00:30:40,297 --> 00:30:43,383 Yeah. And he loves it. 537 00:30:43,925 --> 00:30:46,261 He responds to that challenge. 538 00:30:49,264 --> 00:30:52,099 So I realized that the only part that I really cared about 539 00:30:52,100 --> 00:30:53,769 was the surface of the water. 540 00:30:54,686 --> 00:30:56,729 So what if we took the whole maelstrom 541 00:30:56,730 --> 00:30:59,608 and we flattened it so it was like a pancake? 542 00:31:01,568 --> 00:31:03,235 And then, when we were done with the sim, 543 00:31:03,236 --> 00:31:06,739 we would transform it back into that funnel shape. 544 00:31:06,740 --> 00:31:11,410 And that finally got us to a place where we were getting enough detail 545 00:31:11,411 --> 00:31:14,205 and resolution out of it and it looked big enough for Gore's taste. 546 00:31:14,206 --> 00:31:16,875 Fire! 547 00:31:19,127 --> 00:31:20,587 KNOLL: That's what's in the movie. 548 00:31:28,595 --> 00:31:29,637 That was plan C. 549 00:31:29,638 --> 00:31:34,558 It was done with that looming deadline and a lot of sleepless nights. 550 00:31:34,559 --> 00:31:36,102 Just last thing we're working on 551 00:31:36,103 --> 00:31:38,729 are little tiny water splashes on a bunch of those. 552 00:31:38,730 --> 00:31:40,065 Wow, that's fantastic, John. 553 00:31:40,649 --> 00:31:44,235 It's a friendship driven out of a love for adventure. 554 00:31:44,236 --> 00:31:46,822 We've never been there before. Let's go there together. 555 00:31:50,742 --> 00:31:53,036 (RUMBLING) 556 00:32:02,420 --> 00:32:04,213 {\an8}An effect isn't just spectacle. 557 00:32:04,214 --> 00:32:07,925 {\an8}If it's spectacle, you don't sit like this drawn into the screen, 558 00:32:07,926 --> 00:32:09,677 {\an8}sucked into the experience. 559 00:32:09,678 --> 00:32:11,303 You sit back and you... 560 00:32:11,304 --> 00:32:15,724 And there's a huge aesthetic distance between the audience and the film, 561 00:32:15,725 --> 00:32:18,477 because the effect is pushing the audience away 562 00:32:18,478 --> 00:32:21,313 because it's just maybe too big, too much to consume, 563 00:32:21,314 --> 00:32:24,483 to much for your eye to be able to sort it out 564 00:32:24,484 --> 00:32:27,069 into something that makes emotional sense. 565 00:32:27,070 --> 00:32:30,364 And so, every single special effect for me, anyway, 566 00:32:30,365 --> 00:32:34,535 in my films needs to make some sort of emotional sense. 567 00:32:34,536 --> 00:32:38,247 {\an8}I think I got a call from Steven one day saying he wants to do War of the Worlds. 568 00:32:38,248 --> 00:32:40,208 - (LASER BLASTING) - (EXPLOSION) 569 00:32:41,168 --> 00:32:43,794 MUREN: And I had seen the original movie when it came out, 570 00:32:43,795 --> 00:32:47,131 and I was like six or eight and just thought it was amazing. 571 00:32:47,132 --> 00:32:48,257 So, okay. 572 00:32:48,258 --> 00:32:51,135 {\an8}And I remember one of the challenges of War of the Worlds was that 573 00:32:51,136 --> 00:32:52,845 Steven had thrown down the gauntlet 574 00:32:52,846 --> 00:32:54,972 and said, "We'll make this film in eight months." 575 00:32:54,973 --> 00:32:56,807 You know, a huge film like this, 576 00:32:56,808 --> 00:32:58,934 which should really be about a year and a half, 577 00:32:58,935 --> 00:33:00,644 he's like, "Let's do it in eight months." 578 00:33:00,645 --> 00:33:02,313 I remember when I heard that, I was like, 579 00:33:02,314 --> 00:33:05,065 "Okay, wow, the clock is ticking, we've got to run." 580 00:33:05,066 --> 00:33:08,570 We started shooting in December, and it was gonna be out in June or July. 581 00:33:09,070 --> 00:33:12,656 We were shooting in the cold on the Hudson River 582 00:33:12,657 --> 00:33:16,577 at five degrees in the middle of the night for a ferry that sinks. 583 00:33:16,578 --> 00:33:19,121 And then we'd be shooting in the daytime in New York 584 00:33:19,122 --> 00:33:22,416 and the sun would be going down behind the buildings at 4:00 p.m., 585 00:33:22,417 --> 00:33:24,335 so we could only shoot between 8:00 and 4:00. 586 00:33:24,336 --> 00:33:26,420 So everything was against us. 587 00:33:26,421 --> 00:33:30,257 But all those things also made people alert 588 00:33:30,258 --> 00:33:32,385 and made them be, I think, more creative. 589 00:33:36,890 --> 00:33:40,392 BOLTE: The great thing in the design of War of the Worlds was 590 00:33:40,393 --> 00:33:44,730 that the camera was always kept where Tom Cruise was 591 00:33:44,731 --> 00:33:47,650 so that you as an audience member 592 00:33:47,651 --> 00:33:51,028 had the sense that you were the protagonist, 593 00:33:51,029 --> 00:33:54,031 that these things were happening to you and in front of you. 594 00:33:54,032 --> 00:33:57,451 And the camera wouldn't go to a place where you couldn't be. 595 00:33:57,452 --> 00:34:03,499 And this was because of the two of these master filmmakers working together 596 00:34:03,500 --> 00:34:05,669 to work out every single shot. 597 00:34:06,878 --> 00:34:08,462 In the front seat. 598 00:34:08,463 --> 00:34:10,714 - Whose car is this? - Just get in. 599 00:34:10,715 --> 00:34:12,383 MUREN: There's a scene in War of the Worlds 600 00:34:12,384 --> 00:34:15,261 where Tom Cruise is racing away from the war machines 601 00:34:15,262 --> 00:34:17,596 that are starting to blow up the area around him, 602 00:34:17,597 --> 00:34:20,057 and there's this big bridge in the background. 603 00:34:20,058 --> 00:34:23,560 And it was shot in a real residential area. 604 00:34:23,561 --> 00:34:28,857 And Steven wanted the bridge to be hit from behind by explosions 605 00:34:28,858 --> 00:34:33,320 and kind of curl up like a scorpion tail, which is a neat idea. 606 00:34:33,321 --> 00:34:34,947 And I kind of tried it, and I thought, 607 00:34:34,948 --> 00:34:37,658 "You know, it looks kind of manmade and fake-y, 608 00:34:37,659 --> 00:34:42,329 "but what if we try it in sections, which is the way bridges are really made. 609 00:34:42,330 --> 00:34:45,874 "Between pylons would be the beam, and it could kind of bend and stay there. 610 00:34:45,875 --> 00:34:49,128 "Then the next one would ratchet up. And is that good for you?" 611 00:34:49,129 --> 00:34:51,130 He said, "Yeah, that'll work." 612 00:34:51,131 --> 00:34:53,632 The bridge is now a CG bridge. 613 00:34:53,633 --> 00:34:56,135 The houses are models that are made 614 00:34:56,136 --> 00:34:59,805 that we're sort of combining into the real background there 615 00:34:59,806 --> 00:35:02,891 and covering up the real house that's been undisturbed. 616 00:35:02,892 --> 00:35:06,562 Falling from the bridge is this tanker truck that is a model, 617 00:35:06,563 --> 00:35:08,272 probably about four or five feet long. 618 00:35:08,273 --> 00:35:12,401 We shot it outdoors in Marin in front of the blue screen, 619 00:35:12,402 --> 00:35:15,571 just dropping it down, and then it explodes, 620 00:35:15,572 --> 00:35:17,156 which is a couple of other elements. 621 00:35:17,157 --> 00:35:18,866 So the thing is made up of 622 00:35:18,867 --> 00:35:21,785 a bunch of separate pieces of elements put together, 623 00:35:21,786 --> 00:35:28,042 and it looks like this one continuous shot with all these different things going on. 624 00:35:28,043 --> 00:35:31,463 (EXPLOSIONS) 625 00:35:33,840 --> 00:35:35,174 MAN: Next shot! Good! 626 00:35:35,175 --> 00:35:37,051 It looked really great on the monitor. 627 00:35:37,052 --> 00:35:38,761 Dennis is terrific in the sense that 628 00:35:38,762 --> 00:35:40,971 he can see right through the clarity of designs 629 00:35:40,972 --> 00:35:42,431 and get to the heart of it. 630 00:35:42,432 --> 00:35:44,433 So you can try to sell him with all this bling, 631 00:35:44,434 --> 00:35:47,520 but it's like, "Is this design real, does it work?" 632 00:35:50,774 --> 00:35:53,108 MUREN: There's a shot in there that the camera is moving 633 00:35:53,109 --> 00:35:54,443 all around the minivan 634 00:35:54,444 --> 00:35:56,321 that Tom is driving with his family. 635 00:35:56,905 --> 00:36:00,824 It was all shot indoors in front of the blue screen. 636 00:36:00,825 --> 00:36:04,870 And it was made up of four or five different sections 637 00:36:04,871 --> 00:36:09,458 that the parts of the car could be pulled away, the van, 638 00:36:09,459 --> 00:36:11,418 and then you would switch to part two, 639 00:36:11,419 --> 00:36:13,921 and then you would go as far as you could and then stop. 640 00:36:13,922 --> 00:36:16,799 And there would be a transition of some sort, an invisible wipe. 641 00:36:16,800 --> 00:36:17,925 Like a... 642 00:36:17,926 --> 00:36:20,803 You know, a pillar would go by in the car, 643 00:36:20,804 --> 00:36:25,516 and that could be where it switches from one moment to another. 644 00:36:25,517 --> 00:36:28,143 For the backgrounds, which is the freeway, 645 00:36:28,144 --> 00:36:31,313 all the cars stuck on the freeway, and he's driving through it, 646 00:36:31,314 --> 00:36:35,025 that was shot actually on a real location where they blocked the freeway off. 647 00:36:35,026 --> 00:36:38,237 And Pablo Helman, who was my associate on that, 648 00:36:38,238 --> 00:36:40,739 {\an8}he would have, like, six or eight cameras on the top of it 649 00:36:40,740 --> 00:36:46,078 {\an8}shooting in every direction, making this big tile of 360 degrees. 650 00:36:46,079 --> 00:36:47,746 And when you put all those together, 651 00:36:47,747 --> 00:36:51,041 you had a very seamless transition moving all around 652 00:36:51,042 --> 00:36:54,044 for this two-and-a-half minute dialogue scene of the actors 653 00:36:54,045 --> 00:36:56,839 as though you're, like, magically moving through the car. 654 00:36:56,840 --> 00:36:59,341 - Who is attacking us? - Rachel. 655 00:36:59,342 --> 00:37:01,135 Rachel, you've got to keep it down. 656 00:37:01,136 --> 00:37:03,387 Rachel. Rachel. Shut up, Rachel! 657 00:37:03,388 --> 00:37:05,723 - You are freaking her out! - Look, I'm driving! 658 00:37:05,724 --> 00:37:06,807 Do something! 659 00:37:06,808 --> 00:37:10,185 War of the Worlds, I think, was one of ILM's, actually, 660 00:37:10,186 --> 00:37:12,604 a kind of a high watermark for the company, 661 00:37:12,605 --> 00:37:15,900 and a film that didn't get a whole lot of attention. 662 00:37:16,818 --> 00:37:19,194 But when I look at that film, 663 00:37:19,195 --> 00:37:23,657 I was astonished at how much they were able to do 664 00:37:23,658 --> 00:37:25,451 with a very little budget. 665 00:37:25,452 --> 00:37:26,994 That was my favorite film. 666 00:37:26,995 --> 00:37:29,371 - (DEEP RUMBLE) - (PEOPLE SCREAMING) 667 00:37:29,372 --> 00:37:31,081 MUREN: It's everything I liked to do. 668 00:37:31,082 --> 00:37:32,166 Spectacle. 669 00:37:32,167 --> 00:37:34,209 It's long takes. 670 00:37:34,210 --> 00:37:35,795 It's impossible. 671 00:37:36,421 --> 00:37:39,173 And the sequence in Newark 672 00:37:39,174 --> 00:37:42,010 when the pod comes out of the ground and all that stuff... 673 00:37:43,261 --> 00:37:44,720 it was terrific. 674 00:37:44,721 --> 00:37:47,014 Tom is running and the people are running along with him 675 00:37:47,015 --> 00:37:49,893 getting hit by these blasts and they were becoming, like, ash. 676 00:37:50,810 --> 00:37:54,022 And I had the clothes go up like angels... 677 00:37:55,565 --> 00:37:58,151 just so there's this subtext going on with it, you know? 678 00:38:00,820 --> 00:38:03,740 And it's all these amazing shots. 679 00:38:04,741 --> 00:38:08,076 And after that, I said, "I can't do any better than this," so I sort of... 680 00:38:08,077 --> 00:38:11,080 (CHUCKLING) That's kind of about the last show I officially did. 681 00:38:14,375 --> 00:38:20,047 {\an8}We had made some conservative decisions 682 00:38:20,048 --> 00:38:21,423 {\an8}in the past. 683 00:38:21,424 --> 00:38:25,344 You know, as an example, we turned down Avatar 684 00:38:25,345 --> 00:38:27,930 after many, many months of bidding it 685 00:38:27,931 --> 00:38:30,642 {\an8}and working on the tests that got it greenlit. 686 00:38:31,184 --> 00:38:32,435 {\an8}You not fear. 687 00:38:34,521 --> 00:38:35,604 {\an8}You strong heart. 688 00:38:35,605 --> 00:38:38,941 {\an8}Our leadership at the time when faced with, 689 00:38:38,942 --> 00:38:45,572 {\an8}"Okay, this could be unachievable, it's so huge," 690 00:38:45,573 --> 00:38:48,451 they were not willing to take that risk. 691 00:39:01,714 --> 00:39:04,424 But we had a great relationship with Gore Verbinski. 692 00:39:04,425 --> 00:39:09,721 And, you know, he had this incredible idea. 693 00:39:09,722 --> 00:39:10,807 Rango. 694 00:39:18,857 --> 00:39:20,691 BOLTE: Rango was a huge undertaking. 695 00:39:20,692 --> 00:39:25,362 It was the first digital feature that ILM ever did. 696 00:39:25,363 --> 00:39:27,365 And it was really scary. 697 00:39:31,870 --> 00:39:33,620 VERBINSKI: I don't know how to make an animated movie. 698 00:39:33,621 --> 00:39:37,416 I mean, I know how to put 2,000 shots together and tell a story. 699 00:39:37,417 --> 00:39:40,752 And we certainly have made visual effects shots 700 00:39:40,753 --> 00:39:43,882 that are fully computer-generated. We've made lots of those. 701 00:39:45,425 --> 00:39:46,426 (SQUAWKS) 702 00:39:48,720 --> 00:39:49,929 (GROANS) 703 00:39:51,431 --> 00:39:52,431 I wanted to work with ILM 704 00:39:52,432 --> 00:39:55,851 just because I wanted to take everything that we'd learned from Davy Jones 705 00:39:55,852 --> 00:39:59,730 and, you know, Maya and Kevin and Hal and the team, 706 00:39:59,731 --> 00:40:04,526 like, everybody that we had become tight with in that process. 707 00:40:04,527 --> 00:40:07,154 It could have been a disaster, financially. 708 00:40:07,155 --> 00:40:13,994 This was an example of between John Knoll and Hal Hickel and Jacqui Lopez and me 709 00:40:13,995 --> 00:40:17,748 and a number of other people really pushing the company to say, 710 00:40:17,749 --> 00:40:19,833 "You know what, this is going to be amazing 711 00:40:19,834 --> 00:40:21,419 "and we want to be a part of it." 712 00:40:22,128 --> 00:40:23,462 ING: This was a new thing, right? 713 00:40:23,463 --> 00:40:26,924 Rango was completely an animated feature. 714 00:40:26,925 --> 00:40:30,510 And so, super-excited to work on this project. 715 00:40:30,511 --> 00:40:32,346 VERBINSKI: I think when you're making an animated movie, 716 00:40:32,347 --> 00:40:35,390 it's not sort of fly-it-as-you-build-it approach, you know? 717 00:40:35,391 --> 00:40:37,476 So the story reel became very important. 718 00:40:37,477 --> 00:40:40,395 And to afford that, we were at my house. 719 00:40:40,396 --> 00:40:41,897 Bring the flux... 720 00:40:41,898 --> 00:40:43,982 Flux capacitors... Are they phasing right now? 721 00:40:43,983 --> 00:40:45,860 - Are they phasing? - Yeah, they're phasing. 722 00:40:46,319 --> 00:40:48,320 VERBINSKI: Seven artists over a period of 18 months. 723 00:40:48,321 --> 00:40:50,030 We had a microphone, we had a Mac, 724 00:40:50,031 --> 00:40:52,783 and we were just basically drawing every frame of that narrative 725 00:40:52,784 --> 00:40:57,914 {\an8}and building the animatic so that it was really execution-specific. 726 00:40:58,873 --> 00:41:01,708 There was a huge change in ILM 727 00:41:01,709 --> 00:41:05,754 from "shot-based" to kind of, "Hey, we're telling a story." 728 00:41:05,755 --> 00:41:07,464 With typical visual effects, 729 00:41:07,465 --> 00:41:09,592 you're working on this one shot out of context. 730 00:41:09,968 --> 00:41:12,928 "I'm making this thing. I don't know where it fits." 731 00:41:12,929 --> 00:41:16,014 But on Rango, it's like, "No, stop thinking like that." 732 00:41:16,015 --> 00:41:18,767 Like, fundamentally change that way of thinking. 733 00:41:18,768 --> 00:41:20,268 We are... "What's the scene?" 734 00:41:20,269 --> 00:41:24,607 Gore wanted to foster a little more family feeling on Rango. 735 00:41:25,066 --> 00:41:28,485 He wanted to get to know the artists and invite them in as individuals 736 00:41:28,486 --> 00:41:31,154 into this filmmaking process and family. 737 00:41:31,155 --> 00:41:34,616 In other words, make them all feel like, "Hey, we're making a movie together." 738 00:41:34,617 --> 00:41:38,286 So we had spent all this time discussing the scene 739 00:41:38,287 --> 00:41:40,205 and where is the character coming from, 740 00:41:40,206 --> 00:41:42,249 where are they going to, where have they been, 741 00:41:42,250 --> 00:41:46,713 you know, so that every character who walks into a bar has a backstory. 742 00:41:46,879 --> 00:41:51,508 Uh, and so, that became, I think, really joyous for the animators. 743 00:41:51,509 --> 00:41:53,343 They became a family. 744 00:41:53,344 --> 00:41:56,097 Basically, at that point, they are my actors. 745 00:41:57,015 --> 00:41:59,683 {\an8}And until the people of Andromeda 5 return him safe and sound, 746 00:41:59,684 --> 00:42:01,561 {\an8}I will not sell my ranch! 747 00:42:02,645 --> 00:42:04,354 - What? - What are you doing? 748 00:42:04,355 --> 00:42:05,772 What? What are you doing? 749 00:42:05,773 --> 00:42:07,399 And there was just so much joy. 750 00:42:07,400 --> 00:42:12,070 You could see kind of like this great release of, "We never get to do this." 751 00:42:12,071 --> 00:42:13,656 You know, like... 752 00:42:14,282 --> 00:42:16,284 "We're telling the whole story." 753 00:42:18,202 --> 00:42:19,745 HICKEL: Most of our other departments 754 00:42:19,746 --> 00:42:23,206 had been for years really focused on doing things with realism. 755 00:42:23,207 --> 00:42:25,584 And fortunately, this project of Gore's 756 00:42:25,585 --> 00:42:28,086 kind of coupled animated characters 757 00:42:28,087 --> 00:42:31,173 but with a world that, while it was stylized, 758 00:42:31,174 --> 00:42:32,841 it had a very tactile, real feel. 759 00:42:32,842 --> 00:42:35,677 So if something was made of wood, it was very realistic-looking wood. 760 00:42:35,678 --> 00:42:38,055 If it was rusty iron, it was realistic-looking rusty iron. 761 00:42:38,056 --> 00:42:41,309 It wasn't some stylized, painted version of that. 762 00:42:42,143 --> 00:42:44,978 I came on to do the look development 763 00:42:44,979 --> 00:42:48,899 and shepherd through basically the whole town of Dirt, 764 00:42:48,900 --> 00:42:52,986 {\an8}where all of these little critters live out in the desert. 765 00:42:52,987 --> 00:42:55,781 So, really, what came to us on the team was 766 00:42:55,782 --> 00:43:00,118 all of the reference filtering through Tim Alexander and folks. 767 00:43:00,119 --> 00:43:03,789 And I remember them all telling us, "There Will Be Blood. 768 00:43:03,790 --> 00:43:05,999 "There Will Be Blood. Use that as your reference." 769 00:43:06,000 --> 00:43:08,710 Super-hot baking sun. 770 00:43:08,711 --> 00:43:11,379 High noon coming down on the characters. 771 00:43:11,380 --> 00:43:13,590 It's just like everything had to look parched. 772 00:43:13,591 --> 00:43:17,010 The landscape, the buildings, the characters, everybody's parched. 773 00:43:17,011 --> 00:43:20,097 So we had to build all that detail into this town 774 00:43:20,098 --> 00:43:23,600 and make it super-unique to Gore and his team's vision. 775 00:43:23,601 --> 00:43:26,144 But we kept adding more and more detail, 776 00:43:26,145 --> 00:43:28,563 so it started becoming unwieldy, 777 00:43:28,564 --> 00:43:31,566 and layout artists, animators, technical directors 778 00:43:31,567 --> 00:43:33,485 couldn't work with it anymore. 779 00:43:33,486 --> 00:43:35,487 So, a super-emergency in the middle of the show. 780 00:43:35,488 --> 00:43:36,905 We had to really step back 781 00:43:36,906 --> 00:43:40,325 and think about ways we could make it more modular 782 00:43:40,326 --> 00:43:42,119 so that you could turn things on and off, 783 00:43:42,120 --> 00:43:45,622 have levels of detail of each model of the building, 784 00:43:45,623 --> 00:43:49,960 bake out certain aspects of the geometry and the texture 785 00:43:49,961 --> 00:43:51,712 so that it would render. 786 00:43:52,213 --> 00:43:55,006 The vocal recording process was really unusual on Rango. 787 00:43:55,007 --> 00:43:58,426 Gore, coming from live-action, did not want to have his actors 788 00:43:58,427 --> 00:44:01,596 just one by one recording separately at a little lectern. 789 00:44:01,597 --> 00:44:04,307 He wanted to have them ensemble and recording together. 790 00:44:04,308 --> 00:44:05,393 And even... 791 00:44:05,810 --> 00:44:09,647 We even had props and cameras on set to kind of shoot the scenes. 792 00:44:10,731 --> 00:44:12,315 And you would get those happy accidents 793 00:44:12,316 --> 00:44:14,527 and people stepping on each other's lines and so forth. 794 00:44:14,986 --> 00:44:17,487 - That was really good! - It was-- No, I'm choking. 795 00:44:17,488 --> 00:44:19,281 - Oh. Oh, you do... - (CHUCKLING) 796 00:44:19,282 --> 00:44:21,116 You actually ate the bullet. 797 00:44:21,117 --> 00:44:23,034 I... I ate my prop. 798 00:44:23,035 --> 00:44:24,536 HAL: So that Gore can really get... 799 00:44:24,537 --> 00:44:27,122 he can work within the way he's used to working with them. 800 00:44:27,123 --> 00:44:30,083 And that process was dubbed emotion capture, 801 00:44:30,084 --> 00:44:32,043 which a lot of people have asked about. 802 00:44:32,044 --> 00:44:34,296 Emotion capture was really just a jokey name 803 00:44:34,297 --> 00:44:36,298 for this whole goofy thing of having the actors 804 00:44:36,299 --> 00:44:39,509 on this empty stage in their cowboy costumes acting like idiots. 805 00:44:39,510 --> 00:44:40,594 May I present 806 00:44:40,595 --> 00:44:44,181 Madam Lupone's Terpsichorean Troupe of Traveling Thespians! 807 00:44:44,182 --> 00:44:46,308 - What is that? - I think they's thespians. 808 00:44:46,309 --> 00:44:47,517 Thespians? 809 00:44:47,518 --> 00:44:49,436 HICKEL: It wasn't about reinventing feature animation. 810 00:44:49,437 --> 00:44:51,605 It was about working the way he was comfortable working 811 00:44:51,606 --> 00:44:53,523 and getting that kind of live feel. 812 00:44:53,524 --> 00:44:54,858 Not that we broke every rule, 813 00:44:54,859 --> 00:44:58,862 but we were certainly more of a hybrid visual effects model animated movie. 814 00:44:58,863 --> 00:45:01,532 ING: I love everything I worked on in Rango. 815 00:45:02,033 --> 00:45:06,536 It wasn't a sort of cookie-cutter animated feature. 816 00:45:06,537 --> 00:45:12,334 Uh, it was this weird blend of a photorealistic style 817 00:45:12,335 --> 00:45:16,588 blended with a very stylized look and feel. 818 00:45:16,589 --> 00:45:19,174 HICKEL: It didn't look like Pixar, Disney feature animation, 819 00:45:19,175 --> 00:45:20,467 didn't look like Illumination, 820 00:45:20,468 --> 00:45:21,927 didn't look like DreamWorks. 821 00:45:21,928 --> 00:45:24,971 It was its own animal in every regard. 822 00:45:24,972 --> 00:45:27,641 The animators at ILM always had that ability, 823 00:45:27,642 --> 00:45:30,018 but didn't always have the opportunity. 824 00:45:30,019 --> 00:45:33,648 And I think, really, that's the magic of Industrial Light & Magic. 825 00:45:34,106 --> 00:45:35,691 We're all storytellers. 826 00:45:48,788 --> 00:45:52,500 {\an8}ROSE DUIGNAN: This used to be the original ILM. 827 00:45:55,086 --> 00:45:56,921 Magic was made here. 828 00:46:03,261 --> 00:46:05,929 {\an8}When George moved everybody to the Presidio, 829 00:46:05,930 --> 00:46:08,349 all the model shop people stayed. 830 00:46:09,433 --> 00:46:13,104 We continued to work for ILM and many others. 831 00:46:13,771 --> 00:46:17,942 We did Pirates of the Caribbean, Transformers, we did a ton of stuff. 832 00:46:19,902 --> 00:46:21,194 But the revenues dropped 833 00:46:21,195 --> 00:46:24,030 from 20 million to 10 million to 5 million. 834 00:46:24,031 --> 00:46:28,953 That's when I just said, "Guys, it's over. It's really over." 835 00:46:43,050 --> 00:46:45,177 Lots of memories on this stage. 836 00:46:46,137 --> 00:46:48,639 This is where we shot so much stuff. 837 00:46:49,432 --> 00:46:50,598 It was so fun. 838 00:46:50,599 --> 00:46:53,728 And now we're organizing for the final goodbye party. 839 00:46:59,358 --> 00:47:01,610 (INDISTINCT CHATTER) 840 00:47:03,029 --> 00:47:04,071 Good to see you. 841 00:47:07,158 --> 00:47:09,659 I said something to George one time, and it was right... 842 00:47:09,660 --> 00:47:12,288 (INDISTINCT CONVERSATION) 843 00:47:14,498 --> 00:47:16,584 (CHEERING AND APPLAUDING) 844 00:47:18,419 --> 00:47:22,547 {\an8}In 1978, the art department for Empire Strikes Back 845 00:47:22,548 --> 00:47:24,717 {\an8}was over in San Anselmo. 846 00:47:25,051 --> 00:47:27,802 And one day, this wooden crate arrived. 847 00:47:27,803 --> 00:47:31,097 We opened it up, and it was the white plastic Boba Fett suit 848 00:47:31,098 --> 00:47:34,393 that Ralph and I had been working on designing. 849 00:47:34,852 --> 00:47:36,436 I went to Jane Bay 850 00:47:36,437 --> 00:47:39,105 and I said, "I need a place to paint this thing." 851 00:47:39,106 --> 00:47:41,191 And she handed me a set of keys. 852 00:47:41,192 --> 00:47:47,072 She said, "George has just leased a building in San Rafael at 3160 Kerner. 853 00:47:47,073 --> 00:47:49,991 "It's empty. You can have any room you want." 854 00:47:49,992 --> 00:47:51,910 The other day... Friday, actually, 855 00:47:51,911 --> 00:47:57,832 we shot our last interview for the Light & Magic Season 2 documentary 856 00:47:57,833 --> 00:48:00,336 in this very stage right there. 857 00:48:00,961 --> 00:48:04,923 And I think that it's time to say goodbye. 858 00:48:04,924 --> 00:48:08,760 Uh, the work that was done here by all of you people 859 00:48:08,761 --> 00:48:10,679 and many who came before you... 860 00:48:11,263 --> 00:48:13,390 will live forever 861 00:48:13,391 --> 00:48:18,686 on movie screens and TV screens till the end of time. 862 00:48:18,687 --> 00:48:22,899 And this is indeed hallowed ground. 863 00:48:22,900 --> 00:48:24,568 So I would just like to say... 864 00:48:25,528 --> 00:48:29,406 ILM Kerner, it's been a pleasure to know you. 865 00:48:29,407 --> 00:48:30,532 Thank you. 866 00:48:30,533 --> 00:48:32,368 (CHEERING AND APPLAUDING) 867 00:48:38,165 --> 00:48:40,250 You know, it's in our DNA. It truly is. 868 00:48:40,251 --> 00:48:43,045 I think that's the special sauce. 869 00:48:44,046 --> 00:48:46,589 We strive to do things better. 870 00:48:46,590 --> 00:48:49,426 We want to change and evolve, 871 00:48:49,427 --> 00:48:52,847 whether it's in how we do the work... 872 00:48:53,931 --> 00:48:55,724 or how we manage the work... 873 00:48:57,518 --> 00:49:00,187 or how we engage with our talent. 874 00:49:00,813 --> 00:49:03,858 In any kind of way, we want to push the envelope. 875 00:49:05,067 --> 00:49:07,403 George was always pushing ILM. 876 00:49:07,987 --> 00:49:11,991 I think at one point, he said, "ILM was created to do the impossible." 877 00:49:12,491 --> 00:49:16,370 And we are continually asked to the impossible. 878 00:49:16,912 --> 00:49:18,413 We took a lot of pride in that. 879 00:49:18,414 --> 00:49:22,125 So there was definitely a cultural thing 880 00:49:22,126 --> 00:49:26,963 that was very ingrained and still is ingrained in us forever. 881 00:49:26,964 --> 00:49:30,175 It's funny, because I know most people will think George Lucas, 882 00:49:30,176 --> 00:49:31,552 Star Wars, right? 883 00:49:32,470 --> 00:49:35,013 And yes, that's true. Definitely. He's the creator of Star Wars. 884 00:49:35,014 --> 00:49:37,807 He's the creator of Indiana Jones. Those are the obvious things. 885 00:49:37,808 --> 00:49:39,142 But I think in the industry, 886 00:49:39,143 --> 00:49:41,519 he's going to go down more as an innovator. 887 00:49:41,520 --> 00:49:43,563 You know, you see THX sound. 888 00:49:43,564 --> 00:49:46,442 He revolutionized audio in motion pictures. 889 00:49:47,860 --> 00:49:50,487 You look at nonlinear editing... Avid. 890 00:49:50,488 --> 00:49:51,905 We turn it sideways. 891 00:49:51,906 --> 00:49:54,115 George Lucas was behind that. 892 00:49:54,116 --> 00:49:55,200 And then you have... 893 00:49:55,201 --> 00:49:58,161 Pixar was born from Industrial Light & Magic. 894 00:49:58,162 --> 00:50:01,122 To infinity and beyond! 895 00:50:01,123 --> 00:50:05,920 LEWIN: Now there's a lot of talk, obviously, about AI and real-time. 896 00:50:06,795 --> 00:50:12,968 I'm curious to see the extent to which those technologies really move the needle. 897 00:50:14,136 --> 00:50:18,848 It's hard to imagine that AI won't play a massive role in digital effects. 898 00:50:18,849 --> 00:50:21,142 It's going to make a lot of work get approached 899 00:50:21,143 --> 00:50:24,562 in completely different ways than we've ever approached them before. 900 00:50:24,563 --> 00:50:30,485 But I never feel like there's some technology or some breakthrough 901 00:50:30,486 --> 00:50:33,864 that's going to dramatically change... 902 00:50:35,074 --> 00:50:38,327 what we have that's so special at ILM, which is the people. 903 00:50:39,328 --> 00:50:45,668 37 years ago, I walked in that front door and was instantly made to feel welcome. 904 00:50:48,045 --> 00:50:52,715 Part of an amazing and formidable group of the most talented people around. 905 00:50:52,716 --> 00:50:56,928 If I carefully observed how they worked, paid attention to what they were doing, 906 00:50:56,929 --> 00:50:58,555 asked the right questions, 907 00:50:58,556 --> 00:51:02,642 I thought I might get to a place where I could say that I belonged here. 908 00:51:02,643 --> 00:51:05,854 And to everybody who helped build this place 909 00:51:07,356 --> 00:51:10,066 and make the incredible art produced here, 910 00:51:10,067 --> 00:51:13,236 a deep and sincere thank you for all you did 911 00:51:13,237 --> 00:51:16,239 and for welcoming me to be a small part of that. 912 00:51:16,240 --> 00:51:18,701 (CHEERING) 913 00:51:21,662 --> 00:51:27,835 I attended just the greatest school ever working for some of these folks. 914 00:51:31,005 --> 00:51:32,505 And my way of paying back 915 00:51:32,506 --> 00:51:36,593 is to try and do the same thing for the next generation, 916 00:51:36,594 --> 00:51:40,597 with the hope that they can go to much higher heights 917 00:51:40,598 --> 00:51:41,849 than I ever did.