He gave you money in order to repair all of these planes
- and sell them. - Uh-hmm.
I gave him the cash and I found out I was in a con.
He took 'em from me and I never got a chance to even, you know,
be able to do anything with them.
He was scamming you.
Too good to be true.
I know you're saying no.
That's why you're here on that table and he's on that one.
Otherwise, you'd both be outside flying that plane.
[laughs]
[announcer] Now on Tribunal Justice.
["Ride of the Valkyries" plays]
[announcer] Today's case was filed in Tavares, Florida.
[Cassandra] Your Honor, this is case 2023,
Rocheleau versus Love.
All parties have been sworn in.
You may be seated.
[Judge Levy] Thank you, Cassandra.
Mr. Rocheleau, according to your complaint,
you loaned the defendant $3,500
for him to purchase 21 model airplanes
- and parts. - Yes.
[Judge Levy] He was supposed to assemble and sell the 21 planes.
He was supposed to return to you your $3,500 investment
and then split with you 50-50 the rest of the proceeds.
However, this deal went sideways and caused you to file a lawsuit
- against him for $3,500. - That's right.
[Judge Levy] According to your answer though, Mr. Love,
you say that you don't owe the plaintiff anything
because he never gave you an opportunity to sell those planes.
Right. He took 'em, like from--yeah.
[Judge Levy] He took them back before you had a chance?
Yeah. He took 'em from me and I never got a chance to even,
you know, be able to do anything with them.
[Judge Levy] And therefore you don't owe him anything.
- Correct. - [Judge Levy] Mr. Rocheleau,
how did you know the defendant
before you loaned him the money?
Well, I rented him a house.
You've known him for a while?
- No. - [Judge Levy] Oh, it was--
- it was just a brand... - [Rocheleau] I just met him.
- It was just a brand-new relationship? - [Rocheleau] Yup.
After about two months, he approached me with this deal on these airplanes.
What'd he say?
[Rocheleau] He said, um,
he knew a guy that had these 20 airplanes
or how many ever it was, 19, 20, 21.
Well, that's important. According to your complaint, you say 21.
- I wanna make sure we're accurate. - Well, what the deal was,
there were still some in a-- in packages that hadn't been assembled.
He said what he would do is if I could come up with the money,
he'd give me the money back right off the top of what he sold.
So it was a business opportunity for him?
[Rocheleau] Yeah, business opportunity.
- It was. - And I went and looked at the planes.
It was a good deal.
But it turned out not to be such a good deal.
- [Rocheleau] Nope. - Why not?
- Too good to be true. - Too good to be true?
By the way, when he brought this business opportunity to you,
what did he say was going to be the return?
He said they were worth up to 35,000.
- Are you in the model plane business? - [Rocheleau] No.
Did you know anything about them?
The only thing I know is I used to fly.
- [Judge Levy] Fly real planes? - Yes.
[Judge Levy] But what about him? Did he indicate to you though,
the defendant, that he had some knowledge--
specific knowledge about assembly
and selling and value and things like that?
He had a lot of knowledge.
- [Judge Levy] Is that true, sir? - Yes, it is.
- He had a couple planes of his own.
I've been dealing with RC hobbies for 30 something years.
- RC hobbies, that's cars, boats... - That's cars, drones, planes.
I've been doing it a long time as a side business as--and as a hobby.
So you had an associate, a friend of yours who was selling?
I didn't really know the guy.
I met him and then he, uh--he had quite a bit of stuff for sale
and he made me an offer. A few days went by.
I told him I had something I wanna talk to him about.
I never did ask him. And then one day I walked around Walmart,
he called, so I told him about it.
No problem. He came right with the money, $3,500.
I bought the planes.
I mean, that's how it started out.
[Judge Levy] Well, first of all, Mr. Rocheleau,
you brought with you a model plane.
Can you tell me about that please?
[Rocheleau] Well, this is one with electric motor.
[Judge Levy] Was this one of the 21 purchased by
this person that the defendant just mentioned?
- Yes. - [Judge Levy] And do you know
approximately what the value of that plane is?
[Rocheleau] No idea.
That plane, when you put it together, is worth about 750.
[Judge Levy] So explain that to me.
It's only worth 750 but...
- Well, your labor in building a plane... - [Judge Levy] Uh-hmm.
... you gotta kind of evaluate that because those are handmade.
I mean, they're made out of balsa wood.
You still have to put it together. You have to cover it.
You wrap it. I mean, there's a lot to it.
You might have forty to sixty hours on one plane.
[Judge Levy] We also have some photographs, Mr. Rocheleau,
that you provided us with.
We have four of them.
Can you tell me what this photograph is of and where it was taken?
[Rocheleau] That's a yard sale he had in his--in my...
- [Judge Levy] Mr. Love? - [Rocheleau] Yes.
[Judge Levy] Okay. So, Mr. Love, this is your house?
Yes, it is. Well, it's his house. I rent it from him.
And these are the model planes that you have outside that...
- [Love] Correct. - [Judge Levy] ... were or were not
part of the 21?
These are all part of the 21, the planes themselves.
There's other stuff there, but, yes, those planes.
Okay. Mr. Rocheleau, tell me what this photograph is of.
[Rocheleau] That gives you the size of this one plane.
It's taller than me.
[Judge Levy] Do you have any idea what the value of that plane is?
No idea.
- [Judge Levy] Mr. Love. - That plane right there is about $3,500.
- And who has that plane right now? - He does.
- I do. - [Judge Levy] Okay.
What about the next one? Tell me what photograph that is.
[Rocheleau] That is a picture of the planes when we went
to get them in the guy's house.
They were covering up his living room.
And then, Mr. Rocheleau, what am I looking at here?
[Rocheleau] That's one of the planes he took to a hobby shop
and put it on consignment sale.
[Love] As a matter of fact, it's still there.
The guy at the hobby shop, Mike, is a good friend of mine.
He does mostly battery stuff.
He don't like the gas planes.
So that was one of the battery-operated ones.
Okay. Is that the only plane
that you provided to your friend in the hobby shop?
[Love] No. There was two.
It was the orange one in the last photo.
[Judge Levy] So there were two that you have for consignment?
- [Love] Yes. - [Judge Levy] Let's start here though,
Mr. Rocheleau. When was it that you two reached
this agreement to buy these planes, to give him the money?
- When was that? What was the date? - May 30th.
And when was it that you gave him the money?
I think it was the next day. I went to the bank, got the money.
You're right 'cause you gave us a copy of the bank statement.
I got it in cash, yes.
[Judge Levy] And did you give him that in cash?
I gave him the cash.
And I do wanna say that right off the bat,
he got a sale for one of the planes from the science guy on TV.
- [Judge Levy] Is that right? - Uh-hmm.
- [Judge Levy] And how much was that? - It was $500.
- I gave it to him. - [Judge Levy] And that was the agreement?
- Yes, it was. - [Judge Levy] Putting that aside
for a moment, what was it about this deal
that went sideways that caused you to file a lawsuit against him for $3,500?
Well, the first thing, he quit paying the rent.
[Judge Levy] Okay. Well, that's not even...
No. That's not--that's not true. That's not true.
[Judge Levy] Hold on one second.
Are you still currently living in the home?
No, sir.
-[Judge Levy] How long were you there? -Uh, almost eight months.
[Rocheleau] He paid the rent three times. That was it.
[Judge Levy] When do you say he stopped paying rent?
Was it around the time that you started demanding back your money?
Well, that--that's when I did start the demand,
once I checked him out...
- [Judge Levy] I get it. - ... and I found out I was in a con.
Well, you know, when you say that you found out you were in a con,
you didn't give us a whole lot of evidence to review.
- [Rocheleau] Oh, there is so much that... - Well, I know
but there might be so much but, you know,
you only gave us like two things.
Two. You would agree though that there were no written terms
- or oral terms as far as... - That's right.
... when he was supposed to refund the $3,500.
- That's right. - [Judge Levy] And you see
- how that's a problem? - Oh, yes.
[announcer] Coming up on Tribunal Justice.
- You know, the Bermuda Triangle? - No, I don't.
That's where all the planes fly over, they disappear.
- Oh. - [Judge DiMango] So that's
what I'm gonna call the Bermuda Triangle defense.
That's what you're raising here.
[dramatic musical sting]
[theme music plays]
[announcer] Landlord Ronald Rocheleau is suing his former tenant,
Ronald Love, for $3,500.
The two agreed to a side hustle flipping 21 model airplanes
but using Rocheleau's money but only sold two.
Ronald Love claims his former landlord
jumped the gun in taking back the planes.
What he's saying is that you directed him to return the planes
and never gave him an opportunity to sell them first.
Oh, he had plenty of opportunity. He had months.
- Is that true? - [Love] Uh, not really.
It's kind of like bad timing 'cause the best time to sell planes
is when the Northerners come back down, the snowbirds.
They're the ones that like the old wood planes.
They're the one that-- they're the ones that have time
in the winter to build these planes.
And we talked about it.
I said it would take a few months.
He said, "No hurry."
He always said no hurry.
I said, "It's gonna take a little while 'cause I gotta figure out
what all we got."
And he said, "Hey, no problem. We're in no rush."
Well, it became a rush once there were these issues
regarding whatever the rent was.
[Love] Well, the issue-- there was no issue with the rent
until he started--showed up--
we had this yard sale on Saturday.
He showed up on Monday morning at 7:30.
I'm going through treatments for cancer.
So I was getting ready to walk out the door.
He shows up, demanding planes.
I said, "You were here Saturday. Why are you hee-haw..."
[Judge Levy] Tell me--tell me the date--approximate date of this,
'cause we have May 31st is when the money was given to you.
When is it now that he's coming over to your house, making this demand?
This would have been on October.
October? So we have June, July, August, September, October.
- So we have five months? - Yes.
[Judge Levy] How many planes had you been able to sell
within that five-month period?
I've sold two.
How many of the planes do you still have?
I have none of the planes. He has all the planes.
- [Judge Levy] Is that true? - I only have ten of them.
Where'd the rest of them go?
He's got every one he showed in those pictures and there's more than ten
in that picture, 'cause I gave him everything I had.
How much money have you received, Mr. Rocheleau,
in total for the repayment of that $3,500 loan?
Actually, I got $300.
And then he sold a motor while I was there at the yard sale for 50 bucks.
- Is that correct? - [Love] No.
Five hundred from the science guy.
But the 300 he's talking about is the one--the orange one
- that was sold from the hobby shop. - [Judge Levy] Okay.
So you gave him a total of 500 from the science guy, 300 for the orange.
And--well, yeah. And then the $50 for--so it'll be 750.
- [Judge Levy] That's 850. - 850, I mean.
You're claiming that you never received anything more than 350.
That's right, in cash.
- Do you have any receipts? - [Love] No.
I asked him if he wanted a receipt. He told me, "No, there was no need in it."
I get it. I think my colleague's gonna have some more questions about this.
- [Rocheleau] Your Honor... - Judge Acker--
Judge Acker is gonna have some questions for you.
[Judge Acker] Thank you, Judge Levy.
So I wanna try to see if I can resolve a few of the underlying
factual questions I have, because you, sir, say
that he only returned ten of the planes,
- I believe you said. - Yes.
No controllers, no parts.
- There was bins of parts. - [Love] Excuse me.
He's got the planes that's left and all the parts and pieces that--
he don't even know he's got-- one plane's worth $4,000.
So I'm not quite understanding why he's wanting
all the parts and planes and...
I understand why
- because he gave you money... - [Love] So--yeah.
... in order to repair all of these planes and sell them.
- Uh-hmm. - [Judge Acker] You didn't repair
and sell the planes
in what he would consider a timely fashion.
So he just wanted everything back.
And it sounds like he did not perhaps get everything back.
So tell me what you did between May 30th
when you purchased the planes
and September when the plaintiff wants them back.
How much work did you do?
Tell me what else you did.
I tried to organize the stuff that we had--
I mean, the stuff that I got.
Plus dealing with my sickness. I was having to deal with that as well.
So I don't have every day is a good day where I can go out and work on this stuff.
And I was in no hurry because our agreement was
we would wait till the people come down. It's where the money's at,
because they won't nickel-and-dime you in Florida for everything.
I mean, it's just nickel-and-dime, nickel-and-dime.
And in order to get the money that they're worth,
you have to wait. You gotta be patient.
If I put something up online for $3,500,
first thing people will do is, "Take a thousand for it?"
[Judge Acker] Did you post anything online?
- Yes, I--yes, I did. - [Judge Acker] Did you post--
there's no evidence from you.
[Love] No, I did.
There was never no issues.
I mean, he left on a Saturday, came back on a Monday with an attitude
and I don't know why.
[Judge Acker] So, Mr. Rocheleau, as Judge Levy pointed out,
it's not clear whether or not he actually breached the agreement.
I mean, you are the plaintiff here and you have the burden of proof.
And not only do I not understand really what the deal was,
I also don't have clarity about precisely what you have.
So how are you going to prove those elements of your case?
- Where's the planes? - [Judge Acker] That's for you to tell me.
Now, we know that two are at the hobby shop, correct?
Yup, those are the two.
[Judge Acker] Did you direct the hobby shop owner
- to give him those planes back? - No, no.
Why not?
[Love] There was--one was already sold, $300.
The one--it was--the other one, it was sold and the other one's got a hole on it.
I'm trying to understand if this is a result
of some confusion, some misunderstanding.
Have the planes been disassembled?
So maybe you're not sure what you have because that's also a part of his defense.
Oh, no, I'm sure what I've got.
I mean, they are disassembled but that's how you move them.
You take the wings off and you pack them up.
[Judge Acker] I don't have anything further.
- Judge. - [Judge DiMango] Thank you.
Do you know what the Bermuda Triangle is?
- [Love] No, I don't. - That's where all the planes fly over,
they disappear.
So that's what I'm gonna call the Bermuda Triangle defense.
That's what you're raising here.
'Cause what he's really accusing you of is selling planes
and not giving him money for it.
You got 21 planes.
He is not disputing that.
You're not disputing that.
He's got 10 planes.
Plus, we have at the shop, two.
So there would have been a total of 12 planes.
So somewhere, nine planes
fell into the black hole of the Bermuda Triangle.
- That brings me to you. - Okay.
What were you supposed to be doing to facilitate
the sale of these planes so that he could get some profit as well?
[Love] What was I doing? I was putting the planes together
and trying to figure out the inventory that we do have
and how much stuff can we--I mean, we had a lot of stuff.
There would have been at least 15 planes, 16 planes.
- Not counting there was a couple kits... - How do you say 16 planes?
You only sold two. There should have been 19.
So even by your story-- you couldn't have...
Because the kits--the kits, there's parts and pieces that was loaded up.
The parts and pieces when put together constitute a plane, correct?
- Yeah. - [Judge DiMango] Yes.
- Yes and no. Yes. - [Judge DiMango] And that's what he's
- referring to... - Okay.
... as a plane. This is my point.
This is like a good news case and a bad news case.
You meet a guy who's really a stranger and you say to him,
"Hey, listen, I got a deal for you.
But I have some good news and some bad news about it."
"What's the good news?"
"The good news is I could get 21 planes and sell them for $35,000."
"What's the bad news?" "Nobody wants them."
- Really? That's really what... - Well, the parts
are worth a lot of money.
Yeah, but nothing's selling.
- That's my good point... - [Rocheleau] That's right.
... and bad point. We got a lot of good stuff
going here but nobody wants them.
No, that's not the bad news.
Everybody wants them. It's just they don't wanna pay for them.
[Judge DiMango] Nobody wants them.
His point is there is no real market for them.
If there was, you were selling them and so you're full of it.
- [Love] Well, like he--like he... - Basically, you used the word
he was scamming you.
- Yes. - No.
I know you're saying no.
That's why you're here on that table and he's on that one.
Otherwise, you'd both be outside flying that plane.
[Love] Well, Your Honor, all his stuff is valued...
What have you done between the time and now?
[Love] Exactly what I said I would do.
Nothing.
[announcer] Coming up on Tribunal Justice.
He's expecting reasonable efforts by you.
I'm not saying that you should go with the planes back and forth,
planes for sale, you know, like they do on the beaches.
- I did do that. I'm sorry that I... - You did?
You had planes going across the beach with those trailers
in the back that say planes for sale?
[dramatic musical sting]
[theme music plays]
[announcer] A business deal between Ronald Rocheleau
and Ronald Love to fix up and sell
21 model airplanes never got off the ground.
Now, Ronald Rocheleau claims some of the planes are missing
so he's suing his former partner
for the $3,500 he invested.
When you were selling them at your house at that yard sale,
did you put any flyers up and around that you had these planes?
- Did he? - No. I put the word out.
- I didn't see any. - [Judge DiMango] What's the word?
- I put the word... - "I got planes."
- What's the word? - [Love] Well, that's not how we...
What did you do?
[Love] I--through my hobby shop.
I told everybody I was gonna have them.
- A few people I knew. - [Judge DiMango] What--you stood
- in the hobby shop and said, "I got... - No.
... planes." So how did you do it in the hobby shop?
No. I got friends that recommend-- you know--well...
[Judge DiMango] Is this really how you think you would sell something?
I mean, 'cause when he's getting in a deal with you,
he's expecting reasonable efforts by you.
I'm not saying that you should go with the planes back and forth,
planes for sale, you know, like they do on the beaches.
[Love] Well, it's just not what you're saying
- but that's kind of... - [Judge DiMango] Yeah. But you didn't do
- any of that. - I did do that.
- I'm sorry that I... - You did?
You had planes going across the beach with those trailers
- in the back that say planes for sale? - [Love] Okay.
It's like putting them in a hobby shop, Your Honor.
- [Judge DiMango] No. You see you... - They're hanging in a hobby shop.
- You put one plane in a hobby shop. - [Love] There's two.
That's exactly what--oh, two.
I'm sorry. Thanks for the correction.
- Yeah. - That's all we really had at the time.
But the point is you have a limited vision for sale.
Back to you.
You got back how much, $300?
- 300 for that one. - [Judge DiMango] And you paid him
- 3,500? - Yeah.
[Judge DiMango] So what are you suing for 3,500 for?
- 3,200... - [Rocheleau] That's what I paid for 'em.
... you should be looking for.
This is the bottom line here.
What are you gonna do with the planes you have because you've readily
and candidly admitted each time, I think it was Judge Levy
who said to you, "Do you know what it's worth?"
"I don't know what it's worth."
"Do you know what to do?" "I don't know what--"
What you're gonna do with the line of planes you have?
I'm gonna sell them off if I can.
Well, why wouldn't you sell them beforehand anyway?
Just because you sell...
I didn't think that was right until this was settled.
You might give them all back to him. I don't know.
- You might... - [Love] Your Honor...
You might keep 'em. [laughs]
- [Judge DiMango] We might keep 'em. - Yeah.
[Judge DiMango] Anybody have anything?
[Judge Levy] I do. Mr. Rocheleau,
Judge DiMango was correct in saying what have you done
to mitigate your damages, to sell what you have.
Because what you should be able to do is recoup at least your $3,500
and get out from what was not a very well-thought-out agreement, right, deal?
- No, it wasn't. - [Judge Levy] Right.
So you have in your possession, by your own admission,
parts that are worth "a lot of money."
I have nothing further.
We're gonna retire to deliberate. Thank you both.
[Cassandra] Court is now in recess.
Parties are excused.
[dramatic musical sting]
All right. It's a breach of contract case
and the contract was anything but clear.
It most certainly wasn't written, but as we know,
there can be oral contracts,
as long as the terms of the contract are clear.
There was no start date, end date, as far as when these planes
were gonna be returned.
So we have a problem right off the bat with whether or not
you can have a legitimate breach of contract case without
there being a meeting of the minds.
The plaintiff admitted that he has the planes and parts
that are worth a lot of money,
but at the same time, he also did absolutely nothing
to mitigate his damages,
which is what he needs to do.
I am convinced based upon their testimony that Mr. Rocheleau
is in possession of planes and parts that exceed $3,500.
I think they both testified to that.
Therefore, I believe that that should be the extent of his success in this case,
which is keeping the planes, and his request for $3,500
repayment, I would say fails.
I think that's spot on.
I didn't necessarily find the defendant--I didn't find
that he lacked credibility necessarily, but I just felt like the plaintiff
was too unsure of too many key facts for me to find that he met his burden.
I agree with both of you. I think the plaintiff
was credible to the extent that he had any information at all
about what was going on.
But the bottom line is he didn't establish that there was a meeting
of the minds for any contractual agreement that we could enforce.
And I think that he should keep the planes,
which should reimburse him, as we all agree, at least the $3,500.
And I think we should request that the defendant
permit the plaintiff to get the planes...
- In the hobby shop. - [Judge DiMango] ... still in the hobby
shop or to dispose of them as the plaintiffs deems fit.
- They belong to the plaintiff. - [Judge Levy] Okay.
I agree with that.
That seems fair.
- [Judge DiMango] Okay. - Great.
[Judge Levy] Unanimous.
[dramatic musical sting]
[Cassandra] Court is back in session.
All parties are reminded that you're still under oath.
We've reached a unanimous verdict.
Mr. Rocheleau, we wish we had better news.
We do.
The contract that you had doesn't have to be in writing.
It could be an oral contract.
Many of them are.
But the terms of that oral contract need to be just as clear
as the terms of a written one.
There has to be a meeting of the minds
in order for there to be a legitimate contract for one to then allege a breach.
The terms of the agreement understanding that you had with Mr. Love
were anything but clear and concise with respect to repayment timeframes,
because the defense, as you know, is what it is.
You did not give him enough time to sell those planes.
You said the deal was too good to be true
and we all know if a deal is too good to be true, it probably is.
And your lawsuit against the defendant is going to be dismissed.
But we are going to order--
we're gonna issue an order today, Mr. Love,
and I'm sure you have no problem with it,
to direct the hobby shop to provide the plane...
- Right. - [Judge Levy] There is one left?
- Yes. - [Judge Levy] To the plaintiff.
Now, we recognize that you are friends with the hobby shop owner
and, you know--and there are shenanigans that could go on
but we don't expect there to be any
because you've done nothing but come in today
and to tell us your truths.
And you can take that order, in case there's any problem whatsoever,
and you can take that to your local law enforcement and you can say that,
"I need assistance in effectuating this judgment."
- You have no problem with that, correct? - No. He can have it.
[Judge Levy] If you wanna leave it with the shop owner, you can.
And then sell 'em, mitigate your damages, and collect...
- [Rocheleau] Right. - ... what we expect to be more than
$3,500.
And, gentlemen, thank you both for coming in.
- We appreciate it. - [Rocheleau] It's been fun.
- Thank you. - [Rocheleau] It won't stop me from
- helping somebody else if they need it. - [Judge Levy] I know it won't, sir.
This case has concluded.
All parties are excused.
[theme music plays]
If I made 500 bucks, I was gonna be happy.
We had a barbecue Saturday. He ate my barbecue.
"Oh, that's good. Da-da-da-da."
Comes back on Monday morning at 7:30.
"I want all my planes. I don't like you."
He quit paying the rent.
The guy's, you know, a pretty nasty guy.
- I'm fine with it. - But now I'm outta making money,
so--you know, hey, it's okay.
[announcer] Are you being sued?
Let Tribunal Justice decide your case.
Find us on social media at Tribunal Justice.
["Ride of the Valkyries" plays]