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This is about a break-up.

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She just left the entire relationship.

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He had threatened to kill me twice.

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Absolutely not.

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I just wanted to disappear.

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Putting aside whatever he did
or didn't do,

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it should make you very, very careful.
Really, it should.

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[narrator]
Today on Tribunal Justice...

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[theme music playing]

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This case was filed
in St. Paul, Minnesota.

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Your Honor, this is case #1061
on the calendar,

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in the matter of DeLisle versus Olson.

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Parties have been sworn in.
You may be seated.

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-Thank you, Byrd.
-[Byrd] You're welcome, Judge.

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Okay. You're ex-boyfriend and girlfriend
of five years.

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And what you're saying, Miss DeLisle,
is that you shared a love of animals.

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But apparently, not love for one another,
it seems,

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having read through these papers.

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You say that you started to
get into arguments in January.

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These things escalated,
you became frightened for your safety,

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and you moved out mid-March,
moved into an Airbnb.

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After a couple of weeks at this Airbnb,
you claim that you felt a little bit safer

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reaching out to him, and you did.
You said, I'm gonna break up with you.

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You wanted him to return your animals;
four cats, six tarantulas, one hedgehog

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and a snake. And he refused.
He became abusive.

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You filed an Order of Protection
on May 4th.

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Thereafter, you went with the police
to his home.

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You say all he did was
return one cat to you.

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The police went back a month later and
he gave them the snake and the hedgehog.

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You say that he still has
three more of your cats,

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six of your tarantulas.
You also paid for some vet bills

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when these cats were kittens.
So, you're seeking

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either the value of these pets,
which would be $2,750

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including the vet bills,
or the return of the pets.

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Mr. Olson, you say you
never got violent towards her.

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She filed the Order of Protection
against you because she was angry

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that you only gave her one cat,
one hedgehog and one snake.

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And you weren't going to give her
the animals that you paid for,

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which as I understand it were six ducks,
six snakes, 13 tarantulas,

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two geckos, five cats and
a partridge in a pear tree.

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[laughter]

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-[DiMango] Right?
-That is correct.

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You thereafter, on May 19th, filed
an Order of Protection against her,

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so you now have
mutual Orders of Protection,

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assuming that you went to the hearings
you were supposed to go to afterwards.

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If you're so afraid,
why don't you just go on with your life?

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Why do you need six tarantulas?

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You know, I was looking through
a couple of things. One,

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you were texting his mother for $60.

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That was when I first got the Airbnb.

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Yeah. I mean, you're claiming
how frightened you are,

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you're going for Orders of Protection,
and you're threatening his mother for $60.

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What is wrong with people today?

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Don't shrug, you're in the same boat.
You're the one who can't part

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with one snake.
You have six of them.

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-That's my life. Yeah.
-Your life are snakes?

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-Well, don't emulate them.
-It's my passionate hobby.

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-I'm not trying to...
-[audience laughs]

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All right, now, why should you not
give her back the kittens?

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I've been the sole caretaker of them and
she was just the support.

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When did you adopt these kittens?

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We got them the summer of 2020.

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[DiMango] And you'd been living
in the house together for two years.

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-Yes, ma'am.
-So, you both shared the kittens.

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This is when you first adopted them?

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It was well established
that I was gonna get them.

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I paid for all the vet bills.
I paid for the spay and neuter.

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She did pay for those things.

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Why aren't you paying her back
for all the bills?

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We never got to a discussion of that.
I would've gladly taken care of that

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outside of the court system.

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So, you would be willing to pay her
the vet bills for those kittens.

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I mean, if you're gonna keep them.

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I will keep them. And yes, I do...

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You'll only keep them if we say you will.

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Yes, I will pay her back
for whatever she needs.

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What'd you pay for these kittens,
the three of them?

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I think I gave her like $100
for three cats.

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[DiMango] You said he has six
of your tarantulas and you want those too.

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That's what I'm here for.
That or compensation of them.

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And if you don't get the six tarantulas,
we don't have any value.

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I didn't even see a picture.
I didn't see even an ad:

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tarantulas for sale, wonderful pets.
And actually, surprisingly,

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I swear I looked it up...
I said, who wants a tarantula?

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And meanwhile,
they're touted as these amazing pets.

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They sit in your hand. If they bite you,
of course, they have poisonous venom.

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But I think that... You know,
maybe you want to

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leave the 13 with him
and see what happens.

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Maybe that's the answer
to your Order of Protection.

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So, did you replace any of your cats
or kittens?

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I did not replace them, no.

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Why should we let you keep these cats?

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In my opinion, she just left the entire
relationship and walked out on everything.

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Aha! And there we go.
You feel like she walked out on you.

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No, I wanted that.
I didn't want to lose my animals

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because they are my pride and joy
and I will fall on a sword for them.

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[DiMango] I think you should learn how
to relate better to humans

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than tarantulas and snakes, seriously.
So, when she walked out,

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why did you withhold them from her?

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Well, I didn't see it
that I was withholding anything.

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I owned the home, they lived there.
I take care of everything.

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And I just feel like my home
is the best place for them to be.

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So, the two of you...
This is about a breakup.

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It's a bad breakup with two people
who didn't divide their property properly.

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You know, your excuse is
'cause they're still there with you.

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You have a terrible personal demeanor
and attitude by now.

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-You know that, right?
-Sure.

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Which is very off-putting,
which is why I kinda think

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you get along with the pets you have.

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And you, on the other hand,
I mean, you've gotta move on.

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But I have to say that some of this
is really, on behalf of both of you,

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in my view, is just spite work.
Judge Levy?

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Miss DeLisle, so, when you went
to go file your Order of Protection,

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and you did so on May 5th, 2022.
You petitioned for an Order of Protection

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because you alleged "an immediate danger
of domestic abuse." That's what you wrote.

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Yes, he had threatened to kill me twice,
and that's why I left.

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[Levy] Well, time out. According
to what you said in those papers,

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on May 5th, 2022, he
threatened to kill you in January of 2022.

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It was January and February
were the two threats, and then...

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I get it. And I'm not minimizing it.
I just want to make sure

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that it's not as though
he made the threats on May 3rd or May 4th.

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This is something that had happened
months prior.

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-Right?
-Right.

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-[Levy] Did you threaten to kill her?
-Absolutely not.

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Right. So, that's what he's gonna say.
What I am more interested in,

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is in that Order of Protection
that was granted to you,

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it authorized you, with police escorts,
to get your four cats,

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your hedgehog, your snake
and six tarantulas.

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So, why didn't you do that?

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I tried. I went with the police escort,
and then, Christian just said no.

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And the police were like, well,
we can't force him to do anything,

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we just have to come back another day.

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Okay. So, I'm gonna look to you then,
sir, Mr. Olson.

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You get served with this
Order of Protection on May 5th, 2022.

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-Right?
-Mm-hmm.

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[Levy] And you read, just like I did,
in paragraph nine,

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that the petitioner, the Plaintiff here,
that she is to be permitted

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to retrieve her four cats, hedgehog,
boa and six tarantulas.

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You knew that when the police showed up.
Why didn't you give 'em to 'em?

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[theme music playing]

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[narrator]
Coming up on Tribunal Justice...

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What was it that he did
that frightened you?

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My brother shot and killed his wife
the day she was moving out,

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just a couple years ago. It was very real.
It was very hard to go through.

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And that day, he said that if I wasn't
careful, I would end up like...

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Which was terrifying.

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[theme music playing]

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[narrator] Janeice DeLisle
is suing her ex-boyfriend,

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Christian Olson for three cats,
six tarantulas and vet care.

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Christian claims they are his animals
because he paid for them.

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A judge issues an order directing you
to turn over certain animals

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What makes you think
you don't gotta follow a court order?

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It's not that I don't feel
I have to follow it, it was simply, uh,

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I felt like it was
a very falsified document

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and I wanted to make sure that before
anything went further than them...

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I'll give you that. However,
whether you feel as though

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it was a falsified, exaggerated document
or not,

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the place for you to argue that
is not with a couple of police officers

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standing in your home,
your best bet at that point

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would've been to turn over the animals
as the judge instructed you to,

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then you go to court and
you fight that out in court.

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-You follow?
-Yep.

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[Levy] All right, so that's one.
The text messages, Miss DeLisle,

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that you sent to the Defendant's mom.
I'm gonna go over those.

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So, on April 28th of 2022,

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which was just about a week before
you filed the Order of Protection. Right?

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00:08:55,800 --> 00:08:56,834
Yes.

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00:08:56,900 --> 00:09:01,633
You sent his mom a text. "Were you able
to ask Christian about the $60 and mail?

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00:09:01,700 --> 00:09:05,700
At this point, I would not be surprised
if he just threw it out,

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00:09:05,767 --> 00:09:09,333
but I'm not gonna pay for his weed, lol."
That's what you wrote, right?

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00:09:09,400 --> 00:09:10,500
Yes.

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00:09:10,567 --> 00:09:12,567
She responds,
"I'd rather not get in the middle

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00:09:12,633 --> 00:09:14,667
of whatever arrangements
you two have made."

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"The arrangement is your son
isn't paying me money he owes me,

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threatens to kill me and cuts off
communication when he has all my animals.

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Haha, haha, haha."

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00:09:26,867 --> 00:09:31,300
The way that you are presenting yourself
in these text messages to the mom,

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"hahahaha," it ain't serious.
What you just said to his mother

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is he threatened to kill you and
in the same text, you respond "hahaha."

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00:09:39,433 --> 00:09:42,734
Miss DeLisle, do you understand how
someone reviewing that text message

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00:09:42,800 --> 00:09:44,165
would have a problem with it?

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00:09:44,233 --> 00:09:45,867
I can see that out of context, yes.

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00:09:45,934 --> 00:09:50,900
Okay. Then you continue, "Would you
like to cover the $60 that he owes me?"

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00:09:50,967 --> 00:09:54,767
You wrote, "I'll file the report tomorrow
if I don't see anything."

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00:09:54,834 --> 00:09:56,433
What report were you talking about

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00:09:56,500 --> 00:09:58,400
and you telling the mother
you were gonna file?

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00:09:58,467 --> 00:10:01,967
Earlier in that text message, I was like,
"I'll file a police report."

188
00:10:02,033 --> 00:10:03,433
You were gonna file a police report?

189
00:10:03,500 --> 00:10:05,800
I mean, I was like,
I can't file a police report over $60.

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00:10:05,867 --> 00:10:09,200
I don't know, at that time when
I was texting her, I was so frazzled...

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00:10:09,266 --> 00:10:11,934
[Levy] Yeah. Well, hold on one second.
Hold on one second.

192
00:10:12,000 --> 00:10:15,233
We understand that you weren't gonna
file a police report over the $60.

193
00:10:15,300 --> 00:10:20,367
But you did go to court and you filed a
formal request for an Order of Protection

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00:10:20,433 --> 00:10:22,433
-on May 4th, 2022.
-Yes.

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00:10:22,500 --> 00:10:24,734
[Levy] What you told the judge
in that Order of Protection

196
00:10:24,800 --> 00:10:27,633
was that you were in imminent danger
of domestic abuse.

197
00:10:27,700 --> 00:10:30,400
Those texts that you sent to his mother
don't support that, do they?

198
00:10:30,467 --> 00:10:32,100
That I was in imminent danger?

199
00:10:32,165 --> 00:10:34,934
Danger of domestic violence.
Let me explain to you what happens

200
00:10:35,000 --> 00:10:38,900
with real cases of domestic violence.
Real cases of domestic violence,

201
00:10:38,967 --> 00:10:41,967
when a judge gets a petition
before him or her,

202
00:10:42,033 --> 00:10:46,200
that says that a woman in your position
who is fearful for her life,

203
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fearing that she's gonna be killed.
That makes the judge say,

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00:10:50,100 --> 00:10:54,467
let me give her what she wants immediately
ex parte without a hearing.

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00:10:54,533 --> 00:10:57,967
What you did not do, most certainly
in the 19 pages that I've read,

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00:10:58,033 --> 00:11:02,233
is explain to the judge and provide the
judge your text messages to his mother

207
00:11:02,300 --> 00:11:06,166
in which you said, hahaha,
I'm not giving his $60 for his weed.

208
00:11:06,233 --> 00:11:10,433
And you threatened him by threatening
to send something to his school district

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00:11:10,500 --> 00:11:12,500
that you knew would get him in trouble.
Correct?

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00:11:12,567 --> 00:11:14,066
I guess so, yes.

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00:11:14,133 --> 00:11:16,834
[Levy] Okay, good. So, you
didn't tell any of that to the judge.

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00:11:16,900 --> 00:11:20,233
Because it's fair to say
that if you were completely open

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00:11:20,300 --> 00:11:24,667
and honest with that judge, you knew
he wouldn't, or she wouldn't,

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00:11:24,734 --> 00:11:28,266
give you what you wanted,
which was an order directing him

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00:11:28,333 --> 00:11:29,467
to return the animals.

216
00:11:29,533 --> 00:11:33,367
I was fearful, don't get me wrong.
I was not gonna be able to go to his house

217
00:11:33,433 --> 00:11:35,066
and get those. He still had those...

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00:11:35,133 --> 00:11:37,100
-[Levy] Well, hold on...
-He is scary.

219
00:11:37,165 --> 00:11:39,100
Yeah, I know he's scary,
I know he's real scary.

220
00:11:39,165 --> 00:11:42,300
But hold on. On May 4th,
according to your text with the mother,

221
00:11:42,367 --> 00:11:45,066
this is the same day you go to the judge!

222
00:11:45,133 --> 00:11:50,700
May 4th at 8:09 A.M. to his mother,
"A reminder, I'll be by

223
00:11:50,767 --> 00:11:55,834
after six to grab my things today."
And she gives you a thumbs up.

224
00:11:55,900 --> 00:11:57,300
-Right?
-Yes.

225
00:11:57,367 --> 00:12:01,033
I can't see anywhere
that you advised the judge

226
00:12:01,100 --> 00:12:06,066
on the same day at 10:58 A.M.
So, we're talking three hours later

227
00:12:06,133 --> 00:12:09,333
that you had already arranged
with the Defendant's mother

228
00:12:09,400 --> 00:12:12,467
to go to his house and to
pick up some of your personal items.

229
00:12:12,533 --> 00:12:16,333
I got a real problem with people going in
to domestic violence court

230
00:12:16,400 --> 00:12:19,834
requesting Orders of Protection
and making representations

231
00:12:19,900 --> 00:12:22,800
that aren't 100% accurate.
I got real problems with it.

232
00:12:22,867 --> 00:12:24,834
I'll tell you why
I got real problems with it.

233
00:12:24,900 --> 00:12:28,367
It's because when that happens,
it undermines the legitimacy

234
00:12:28,433 --> 00:12:32,200
of legitimate cases. I don't know the two
of you. I don't know what he did to you,

235
00:12:32,266 --> 00:12:36,433
what he said to you in January of 2022.
I don't. But what I know,

236
00:12:36,500 --> 00:12:39,567
is that there was nothing
that you suggested in any document,

237
00:12:39,633 --> 00:12:43,734
in any text message, in any email,
in any communication to suggest on May 4th

238
00:12:43,800 --> 00:12:47,266
that you were in imminent danger
of domestic assault. None.

239
00:12:47,333 --> 00:12:50,500
'Cause if the judge found out
what we found out with this evidence,

240
00:12:50,567 --> 00:12:54,467
the judge would've thrown you out
on your behind. Judge Acker.

241
00:12:54,533 --> 00:12:58,300
Thank you, Judge.
I do think Judge Levy's onto something.

242
00:12:58,367 --> 00:13:04,367
And I don't know what happened in January
when she says, sir,

243
00:13:04,433 --> 00:13:09,166
that you made these threats,
but what is abundantly clear to me,

244
00:13:09,233 --> 00:13:14,867
is that you filed your TRO in order
to get leverage in this civil situation.

245
00:13:14,934 --> 00:13:19,934
You filed a competing TRO complaining
about her showing up at your home

246
00:13:20,000 --> 00:13:24,800
on May 19th, which was the day she was
to show up and collect her animals.

247
00:13:24,867 --> 00:13:27,100
So, both of you made these filings

248
00:13:27,166 --> 00:13:30,800
in order to get
some sort of tactical advantage

249
00:13:30,867 --> 00:13:35,200
in this fight over the animals.
Look, as I said,

250
00:13:35,266 --> 00:13:39,165
don't know what happened in January,
but I am very much convinced

251
00:13:39,233 --> 00:13:43,633
that on May 4th, when you filed the TRO
claiming to be so afraid

252
00:13:43,700 --> 00:13:46,066
the day after
you were taunting his mother,

253
00:13:46,133 --> 00:13:50,000
the day after you were saying
I'm gonna go file this police report

254
00:13:50,066 --> 00:13:52,934
for the $60 and weed
and get him fired.

255
00:13:53,000 --> 00:13:56,600
I just don't think you were that scared.
I think you were using the TRO

256
00:13:56,667 --> 00:14:00,734
to get an advantage with respect
to the underlying dispute

257
00:14:00,800 --> 00:14:03,133
between the animals.
And I think that's shameful.

258
00:14:03,200 --> 00:14:08,834
So now, I want to go back to you,
Mr. Olson, because the problem

259
00:14:08,900 --> 00:14:14,200
from where I sit now is that I do think
that, as Judge Levy pointed out,

260
00:14:14,266 --> 00:14:19,333
this TRO was obtained
using really questionable evidence.

261
00:14:19,400 --> 00:14:22,967
Really questionable. I find it
a weaponization of the legal system,

262
00:14:23,033 --> 00:14:28,767
which troubles me. But Ms. DeLisle,
with respect to the allegations

263
00:14:28,834 --> 00:14:32,033
that you made against the Defendant
in the TRO.

264
00:14:32,100 --> 00:14:35,266
What was it that he did
that frightened you?

265
00:14:35,333 --> 00:14:39,200
My brother shot and killed his wife
the day she was moving out

266
00:14:39,266 --> 00:14:43,100
just a couple years ago. It was very real.
It was very hard to go through.

267
00:14:43,165 --> 00:14:47,867
That day, he said if I wasn't careful,
I would end up like...

268
00:14:47,934 --> 00:14:50,734
Which was terrifying. And then,
there was one more threat.

269
00:14:50,800 --> 00:14:53,000
And that's when I was like sitting with it
and I was like,

270
00:14:53,066 --> 00:14:55,433
okay, I have to get out of here or I...

271
00:14:55,500 --> 00:14:59,667
And he made those threats in January.
You moved out in May.

272
00:14:59,734 --> 00:15:03,834
I moved out mid-March.
I didn't really want to go to court

273
00:15:03,900 --> 00:15:07,467
and do all this. I just
wanted to disappear. Honestly.

274
00:15:07,533 --> 00:15:11,533
Listen, I want to be really careful
at how I communicate this.

275
00:15:11,600 --> 00:15:13,367
-Yes.
-[Acker] It's horrible.

276
00:15:13,433 --> 00:15:17,734
I mean, I think putting aside
whatever he did or didn't do,

277
00:15:17,800 --> 00:15:21,033
your having to live with that
is just horrible.

278
00:15:21,100 --> 00:15:22,433
I mean, that's a trauma.

279
00:15:22,500 --> 00:15:24,333
-I had to leave.
-[Acker] No doubt.

280
00:15:24,400 --> 00:15:27,667
When I got the Airbnb,
I said I was dog sitting and I left.

281
00:15:27,734 --> 00:15:30,133
So, he didn't know
that I wasn't coming back.

282
00:15:30,200 --> 00:15:34,333
That's a trauma. And I'm not
giving short shrift to that trauma.

283
00:15:34,400 --> 00:15:37,734
And that's a horrible thing and
it might make you hypersensitive.

284
00:15:37,800 --> 00:15:42,033
And it should make you very, very careful.
Really, it should.

285
00:15:42,100 --> 00:15:43,533
[theme music playing]

286
00:15:43,600 --> 00:15:45,734
[narrator]
Coming up on Tribunal Justice...

287
00:15:45,800 --> 00:15:48,767
Did you ultimately consent
to everything that was in there,

288
00:15:48,834 --> 00:15:51,734
staying away from her, not going near
her home, her school,

289
00:15:51,800 --> 00:15:54,934
her place of business, etc.
Did you consent to all of that?

290
00:15:55,000 --> 00:15:58,800
Yes, but there was some negotiations,
I might say.

291
00:15:58,867 --> 00:16:00,967
[DiMango]
And what were those negotiations?

292
00:16:05,133 --> 00:16:07,066
[theme music playing]

293
00:16:08,667 --> 00:16:11,734
Can I ask you something
as someone who loves animals?

294
00:16:11,800 --> 00:16:15,266
I believe you do, I do.
All things being equal,

295
00:16:15,333 --> 00:16:18,200
are the tarantulas better off
to move them?

296
00:16:18,266 --> 00:16:22,333
Or is the best interest of the animals
to let them sit still

297
00:16:22,400 --> 00:16:24,633
and to compensate you financially?

298
00:16:24,700 --> 00:16:28,533
The tarantulas, I think will be fine
in either spot.

299
00:16:28,600 --> 00:16:32,033
And same with the cats. I don't really
want to break up the family at this point.

300
00:16:32,100 --> 00:16:34,467
It's been so long, like,
it's not in my interest...

301
00:16:34,533 --> 00:16:37,500
You really just want the money.
You want the compensation.

302
00:16:37,567 --> 00:16:41,800
Yeah, I'd like to rebuild
my own little family again.

303
00:16:41,867 --> 00:16:45,133
I hear you. And Mr. Olson,
before we go,

304
00:16:45,200 --> 00:16:49,533
I do think that because you had to
listen to these allegations be repeated,

305
00:16:49,600 --> 00:16:52,867
it's only fair that you have
an opportunity to respond.

306
00:16:52,934 --> 00:16:57,667
Yeah, thank you. [clears throat]
So, I guess to sum all of this up,

307
00:16:57,734 --> 00:17:02,367
I feel that I should be able to
continue caring for the animals

308
00:17:02,433 --> 00:17:03,834
that I have supported and loved.

309
00:17:03,900 --> 00:17:05,500
What do you do for a living?

310
00:17:05,567 --> 00:17:06,733
I'm a high school custodian.

311
00:17:06,800 --> 00:17:09,467
Oh, and that's why you were
making the threats...

312
00:17:09,532 --> 00:17:13,700
I didn't think his employer would be too
keen on the reason I had to move out.

313
00:17:13,767 --> 00:17:17,700
No, but what you said to the mom was
that you were gonna file a police report

314
00:17:17,767 --> 00:17:22,032
over the $60 over weed. And you
were gonna take that to the police.

315
00:17:22,099 --> 00:17:25,266
-I mean, that just seems petty.
-I was just upset. I mean...

316
00:17:25,333 --> 00:17:28,800
I never thought that would
come up in court. It is, it super is.

317
00:17:28,867 --> 00:17:32,600
There was a lot of pettiness and also,
perhaps, some reasonable fear.

318
00:17:32,667 --> 00:17:35,367
You deny it. I think I've heard enough.
Thank you both.

319
00:17:35,433 --> 00:17:38,967
[DiMango] I just have one question.
With regard to the Order of Protection,

320
00:17:39,033 --> 00:17:41,734
did you ultimately consent to
everything that was in there,

321
00:17:41,800 --> 00:17:44,667
staying away from her, not going near
her home, her school,

322
00:17:44,734 --> 00:17:46,033
her place of business, etc.

323
00:17:46,100 --> 00:17:49,166
Did you consent to all of that
at the time of the hearing?

324
00:17:49,233 --> 00:17:51,200
-Yes, ma'am.
-[DiMango] And included in that,

325
00:17:51,266 --> 00:17:55,066
would've been the consent
to return certain pets to her.

326
00:17:55,133 --> 00:17:58,767
Yes, but there was some negotiations,
I might say.

327
00:17:58,834 --> 00:18:00,400
And what were those negotiations?

328
00:18:00,467 --> 00:18:04,400
Uh, yeah, so, between her lawyer attorney
and myself,

329
00:18:04,467 --> 00:18:10,000
we discussed that I would admit to fault
but not go the full length.

330
00:18:10,066 --> 00:18:13,133
Okay, so you admitted to fault
so they would grant the order.

331
00:18:13,200 --> 00:18:16,100
You basically weren't gonna admit
to the substance of what was in here.

332
00:18:16,166 --> 00:18:17,166
That is correct.

333
00:18:17,233 --> 00:18:20,533
Okay, that's all I wanted to know.
Unless there's any other questions,

334
00:18:20,600 --> 00:18:23,300
we're gonna retire to deliberate
at this time. Thank you both.

335
00:18:23,367 --> 00:18:25,900
Court now stands in recess.
Parties are excused.

336
00:18:25,967 --> 00:18:28,467
[theme music playing]

337
00:18:29,266 --> 00:18:33,033
Well, this is a prime example
of abuse of a court process.

338
00:18:33,100 --> 00:18:35,967
The Orders of Protection, I think
we all pointed it out

339
00:18:36,033 --> 00:18:39,300
from a different angle in some way.
But this is clearly a woman

340
00:18:39,367 --> 00:18:41,567
who was not in imminent fear
of her safety.

341
00:18:41,633 --> 00:18:45,734
No woman in fear of her safety, as I said,
would text the mother for $60,

342
00:18:45,800 --> 00:18:48,767
threaten him, go back to the house,
demand tarantulas.

343
00:18:48,834 --> 00:18:53,133
So, that's troublesome. So, I think
we're just looking at this now.

344
00:18:53,200 --> 00:18:56,266
from a clean slate, basically.
What is she entitled to

345
00:18:56,333 --> 00:18:57,734
and what isn't she entitled to?

346
00:18:57,800 --> 00:19:00,734
And I would be perfectly happy
to dismiss the complaint altogether.

347
00:19:00,800 --> 00:19:03,066
But I wouldn't mind giving her
the $100 for the kittens.

348
00:19:03,133 --> 00:19:07,734
I believe that the best thing for these
people, the best thing for these animals,

349
00:19:07,800 --> 00:19:11,400
would be to let him keep them,
but I believe she needs to be made whole

350
00:19:11,467 --> 00:19:15,000
for the contributions that she made.
And he doesn't have an issue with that.

351
00:19:15,066 --> 00:19:18,567
I think all we need to do is find out
from her and from him

352
00:19:18,633 --> 00:19:22,800
before that issue is resolved on
the vet care bill, what were those bills?

353
00:19:22,867 --> 00:19:27,333
I'm less concerned about the vet bills
because they were living together.

354
00:19:27,400 --> 00:19:30,633
I don't know what their arrangement was
as to who was paying for what.

355
00:19:30,700 --> 00:19:33,934
I'm not prepared to make any award
on the vet bills.

356
00:19:34,000 --> 00:19:37,467
I am prepared to award her $100
for the cats.

357
00:19:37,533 --> 00:19:41,700
And I am prepared to consider some award
for the tarantulas.

358
00:19:41,767 --> 00:19:46,900
Can we just ask her
what you paid for the tarantulas?

359
00:19:46,967 --> 00:19:50,700
Listen, it would be well worth it to ask
a couple of follow up questions of her.

360
00:19:50,767 --> 00:19:53,900
Just... Yeah. Let's just
dig in a little bit.

361
00:19:53,967 --> 00:19:56,900
And if you don't mind,
I would just include...

362
00:19:56,967 --> 00:19:59,367
Because this was a big bill,
that vet care bill.

363
00:19:59,433 --> 00:20:04,133
That's $1,650 that she's asking for.
Do you have any proof

364
00:20:04,200 --> 00:20:06,800
that money was actually paid by you.
Do you have that here?

365
00:20:06,867 --> 00:20:09,133
If she says she doesn't have that...
This is her court day.

366
00:20:09,200 --> 00:20:12,667
If she doesn't have it, then I'm
all for it, that's not something she gets.

367
00:20:12,734 --> 00:20:15,533
I'm gonna tell you,
no matter what they say, I'm at $100.

368
00:20:15,600 --> 00:20:18,166
So, I'm gonna dissent unless...
I'll look at the both of you,

369
00:20:18,233 --> 00:20:20,934
you tell me what you want to do,
and that's it, but I'm dissenting.

370
00:20:21,000 --> 00:20:22,900
Should we have a code?

371
00:20:22,967 --> 00:20:25,767
-Yes.
-Wait and see.

372
00:20:25,834 --> 00:20:27,533
Okay, so, we're not anything.

373
00:20:27,600 --> 00:20:30,166
We're nothing. We've made no decision.

374
00:20:33,867 --> 00:20:37,233
Court is back in session. Parties
are reminded you're still under oath.

375
00:20:37,300 --> 00:20:41,433
Thank you, Byrd. We just have
some follow up questions which we think

376
00:20:41,500 --> 00:20:45,400
might help clarify some issues that have,
at this moment, still not been resolved.

377
00:20:45,467 --> 00:20:47,567
Ma'am, do you have any evidence
with you today,

378
00:20:47,633 --> 00:20:50,200
as to what you paid for the vet bills?

379
00:20:50,266 --> 00:20:53,000
No. He took me off of the account
at the vet.

380
00:20:53,066 --> 00:20:55,867
So, when I called to get the receipts,
they wouldn't give them to me.

381
00:20:55,934 --> 00:20:58,934
Okay, so that's out.
And with regard to the tarantulas,

382
00:20:59,000 --> 00:21:02,133
does anybody have any proof
who purchased them,

383
00:21:02,200 --> 00:21:04,400
how many were purchased
at the same time

384
00:21:04,467 --> 00:21:07,033
or what periods of time,
and what they cost?

385
00:21:07,100 --> 00:21:10,100
I again, don't have any
of the actual receipts.

386
00:21:10,166 --> 00:21:13,166
Four of them, I paid cash
at a reptile show.

387
00:21:13,233 --> 00:21:14,800
How much did you pay for those four?

388
00:21:14,867 --> 00:21:18,767
I think that they were like $45 each and
it was like a deal, or something.

389
00:21:18,834 --> 00:21:22,834
Okay, so, at this point,
I believe we're good?

390
00:21:22,900 --> 00:21:24,066
I'm joining your tentative.

391
00:21:24,133 --> 00:21:26,000
-Okay, thank you. And Adam?
-Agreed.

392
00:21:26,066 --> 00:21:30,300
All right, then. So, I think what
we've all come to a conclusion with here

393
00:21:30,367 --> 00:21:34,500
is that people should treat one another
with at least as much respect

394
00:21:34,567 --> 00:21:38,200
and love and dignity
that they treat their pets.

395
00:21:38,266 --> 00:21:41,934
The bottom line here is you have
the kittens, you have all the animals.

396
00:21:42,000 --> 00:21:45,400
None of them are gonna be heartbroken
at this point

397
00:21:45,467 --> 00:21:48,567
that you maintain them
as the parent.

398
00:21:48,633 --> 00:21:51,100
You on the other hand,
you've already indicated to us

399
00:21:51,166 --> 00:21:54,166
that you're willing to accept
that you don't get the tarantulas,

400
00:21:54,233 --> 00:21:58,033
that you've gotten one cat. You
would be willing to let the other kittens

401
00:21:58,100 --> 00:22:00,967
live with him in their environment
and not break them up

402
00:22:01,033 --> 00:22:03,900
because they were buddies all along.
That's what love is about.

403
00:22:03,967 --> 00:22:08,200
It's about putting others,
the things you love, before yourself.

404
00:22:08,266 --> 00:22:11,700
We're willing to reimburse you the $100.
With regard to the other items

405
00:22:11,767 --> 00:22:15,233
that you've requested, the
veterinary bills, the tarantulas and all,

406
00:22:15,300 --> 00:22:19,033
you have fallen short in your proof
by a preponderance of the evidence

407
00:22:19,100 --> 00:22:22,500
as to the value of those or
that you're entitled to their return.

408
00:22:22,567 --> 00:22:25,133
So, the unanimous verdict of this court
at this time,

409
00:22:25,200 --> 00:22:28,834
is that you receive $100.
And hopefully, the two of you

410
00:22:28,900 --> 00:22:32,200
would just stay out of each other's
half a head of hair.

411
00:22:32,266 --> 00:22:33,967
-All right?
-[gavel bangs]

412
00:22:34,033 --> 00:22:38,233
[Byrd] This case is now concluded.
Parties are excused, you may step out.

413
00:22:41,200 --> 00:22:46,000
Pretty fair decision. I mean, I feel like
it, uh, couldn't have gone better.

414
00:22:46,066 --> 00:22:50,233
The relationship just went sour.
Just stayed sour.

415
00:22:50,300 --> 00:22:54,033
It all ended kind of on a rough patch.
So, I think it's just kinda,

416
00:22:54,100 --> 00:22:56,033
she's riding it out, all the negativity.

417
00:22:56,100 --> 00:22:58,700
Oh, God, I hope
I never have to see him again.

418
00:22:58,767 --> 00:23:00,266
That will be awesome.

419
00:23:00,333 --> 00:23:06,066
[narrator] Have you been falsely accused?
Let Tribunal Justice decide your case.

420
00:23:06,133 --> 00:23:09,100
Find us on social media
at Tribunal Justice.

421
00:23:09,166 --> 00:23:11,100
[theme music playing]