1 00:00:00,133 --> 00:00:02,133 He comes to your house and does the roof? 2 00:00:02,200 --> 00:00:03,066 Yes. 3 00:00:03,133 --> 00:00:06,000 It started raining, but you take it off anyway. 4 00:00:06,066 --> 00:00:08,767 I figured the only way I could tell what the problem was 5 00:00:08,834 --> 00:00:10,567 :was to take the roof off. 6 00:00:10,633 --> 00:00:13,834 The interior ceilings were at risk of caving in. 7 00:00:13,900 --> 00:00:14,867 Yes. 8 00:00:14,934 --> 00:00:17,133 You didn't complete the repair, 9 00:00:17,200 --> 00:00:18,166 so why are we here? 10 00:00:18,233 --> 00:00:21,166 [narrator] Today on Tribunal Justice. 11 00:00:21,233 --> 00:00:22,767 [theme music playing 12 00:00:43,066 --> 00:00:46,000 This case was filed in San Diego, California. 13 00:00:46,066 --> 00:00:48,867 Your Honor, this is case number 1100 on the calendar 14 00:00:48,934 --> 00:00:52,600 in the matter of Dapper versus Nichols. Parties have been sworn in. 15 00:00:52,667 --> 00:00:54,633 -You may be seated. -[Levy] Thank you, Byrd. 16 00:00:55,200 --> 00:00:58,033 Ms. Dapper, you, uh, contacted the Defendant, 17 00:00:58,100 --> 00:01:00,734 who had a roofing company and was a roofing contractor 18 00:01:00,800 --> 00:01:02,500 to inspect the roof on your home, 19 00:01:02,567 --> 00:01:06,100 which was a 63-foot-long and 12-foot-wide mobile home. 20 00:01:06,166 --> 00:01:06,834 Yes. 21 00:01:06,900 --> 00:01:10,100 [Levy] January of 2019, the Defendant came to your home 22 00:01:10,166 --> 00:01:13,000 and that a new roof was, in fact, needed. 23 00:01:13,066 --> 00:01:13,767 [Coleen] Yes. 24 00:01:13,834 --> 00:01:16,900 [Levy] He provided you with an estimate of $3,600, 25 00:01:16,967 --> 00:01:19,467 and you wrote him a check for that full amount. 26 00:01:19,533 --> 00:01:20,333 -Is that correct? -Yes, Your Honor. 27 00:01:20,400 --> 00:01:22,367 [Levy] All right. His company installed 28 00:01:22,433 --> 00:01:27,033 a brand-new, 30-year fiberglass shingle roof on top of your mobile home. 29 00:01:27,100 --> 00:01:28,200 -Right? -Right. 30 00:01:28,265 --> 00:01:31,333 [Levy] His company did so by putting it on top of the existing roof. 31 00:01:31,400 --> 00:01:32,734 Yeah, it's a roof-over. 32 00:01:32,800 --> 00:01:34,233 -[Levy] A roof over roof? -Mm-hmm. 33 00:01:34,300 --> 00:01:38,066 Within six months, you noticed that the ceiling 34 00:01:38,133 --> 00:01:40,800 in your home was bowing. 35 00:01:40,866 --> 00:01:42,133 Slightly bowing, yes. 36 00:01:42,200 --> 00:01:46,600 [Levy] And then over the next three years, you watched it get progressively worse. 37 00:01:46,667 --> 00:01:47,333 Yes. 38 00:01:47,400 --> 00:01:49,200 [Levy] You tried to reach out to the Defendant, 39 00:01:49,265 --> 00:01:51,600 but you were unsuccessful. How did you do that? 40 00:01:51,667 --> 00:01:54,767 Was that via phone or... or text or emails? 41 00:01:54,834 --> 00:01:56,500 My son called him. 42 00:01:56,567 --> 00:01:58,433 Were you there when he tried to call him? 43 00:01:58,500 --> 00:01:59,934 -No. -Then...then we can't take that. 44 00:02:00,066 --> 00:02:02,233 So-so you never tried to contact him yourself. 45 00:02:02,300 --> 00:02:03,433 Not in the beginning, no. 46 00:02:03,500 --> 00:02:05,166 [Levy] Okay, but you did thereafter? 47 00:02:05,233 --> 00:02:06,333 -[Coleen] Yes. -[Levy] Very well. 48 00:02:06,400 --> 00:02:08,734 You filed a claim with your insurance company 49 00:02:08,800 --> 00:02:11,233 regarding the roof because of the damages, 50 00:02:11,300 --> 00:02:14,633 and the insurance company sent out someone to inspect the roof? 51 00:02:14,700 --> 00:02:15,367 Yes. 52 00:02:15,433 --> 00:02:16,500 And when they came out, 53 00:02:16,567 --> 00:02:20,433 they realized that there were at least two, possibly three layers. 54 00:02:20,500 --> 00:02:21,867 -On that roof. -Yes, Your Honor. 55 00:02:21,934 --> 00:02:24,533 [Levy] You were advised and they provided you with documents 56 00:02:24,600 --> 00:02:25,600 from the insurance company 57 00:02:25,667 --> 00:02:29,667 confirming that the excessive weight of the shingles caused the roof to sag, 58 00:02:29,734 --> 00:02:33,066 damaging the rafters, trusses, and the ceiling 59 00:02:33,133 --> 00:02:35,800 -in the main section of the home. -Yes, Your Honor. 60 00:02:35,867 --> 00:02:39,166 And that the interior ceilings were at risk of caving in. 61 00:02:39,233 --> 00:02:41,966 -Yes. -[Levy] On August 11, 2022, 62 00:02:42,033 --> 00:02:43,400 according to your complaint, 63 00:02:43,466 --> 00:02:46,166 the insurance company denied your claim. 64 00:02:46,233 --> 00:02:46,900 Yes, sir. 65 00:02:46,966 --> 00:02:49,233 [Levy] Because it was the Defendant's failure 66 00:02:49,300 --> 00:02:52,700 to remove the old roof shingle before installing the new one, 67 00:02:52,767 --> 00:02:55,333 and they said that that was on the Defendant, not on them, 68 00:02:55,400 --> 00:02:57,400 and you should go after the Defendant for that money. 69 00:02:57,466 --> 00:02:59,867 -Yes, Your Honor. Yes. -[Levy] That's why you're here. 70 00:02:59,934 --> 00:03:01,500 Well, you contacted the Defendant, 71 00:03:01,567 --> 00:03:03,300 you told him what the insurance company said, 72 00:03:03,367 --> 00:03:06,700 and he and his son met you at your home to inspect the roof. 73 00:03:06,767 --> 00:03:11,133 Mr. Nichols came first, and then the next day, his son did. 74 00:03:11,200 --> 00:03:12,900 But, Ken was there first. 75 00:03:12,967 --> 00:03:15,967 Okay, so the Defendant was there first. And then did there come a time 76 00:03:16,033 --> 00:03:17,367 when his son showed up? 77 00:03:17,433 --> 00:03:18,567 [Coleen] Uh, the next day. 78 00:03:18,633 --> 00:03:20,333 Okay, is that correct, Mr. Nichols? 79 00:03:20,400 --> 00:03:21,633 -Your son came the next day? -Yes, yes, sir. 80 00:03:21,700 --> 00:03:24,000 [Levy] What role did your son have in the company, if any? 81 00:03:24,066 --> 00:03:27,133 Uh, he's... it's a corporation, and he's my, uh... 82 00:03:27,200 --> 00:03:28,700 -The other owner. -[Levy] Okay. 83 00:03:28,767 --> 00:03:32,433 According to your complaint, Ms. Dapper, when both the Defendant and his son 84 00:03:32,500 --> 00:03:36,066 are at your home, his son, who has a role in the company 85 00:03:36,133 --> 00:03:39,100 and can make statements on their behalf, made one to you when he said, 86 00:03:39,166 --> 00:03:42,100 -"Dad, there's three layers here." -[Coleen] The day before, 87 00:03:42,166 --> 00:03:45,367 Mr. Nichols had said there were only two layers 88 00:03:45,433 --> 00:03:48,600 and that the inspector was wrong, 89 00:03:48,667 --> 00:03:50,200 and there was only two layers, 90 00:03:50,266 --> 00:03:52,533 but he'd have his son come the next day 91 00:03:52,600 --> 00:03:55,066 to check it out to see if there was indeed three. 92 00:03:55,133 --> 00:03:56,600 And when his son came out, 93 00:03:56,667 --> 00:03:59,433 and again, based upon his son's role in the company... 94 00:03:59,500 --> 00:04:00,367 Yes. 95 00:04:00,433 --> 00:04:02,633 ...he made a statement to you which I just mentioned earlier. 96 00:04:02,700 --> 00:04:04,166 -Is that right? -Yes, Your Honor. 97 00:04:04,233 --> 00:04:06,033 [Levy] However, the Defendant did agree 98 00:04:06,100 --> 00:04:08,100 to take off the roof and put on a brand-new one. 99 00:04:08,166 --> 00:04:08,900 Yes. 100 00:04:08,967 --> 00:04:12,967 [Levy] And he took off that roof on September 6th of 2022. 101 00:04:13,033 --> 00:04:15,633 He started the demolition, installed a plywood sheet 102 00:04:15,700 --> 00:04:17,466 and a moisture barrier, according to your complaint. 103 00:04:17,533 --> 00:04:19,332 -Right. -[Levy] Now, who was doing the work? 104 00:04:19,399 --> 00:04:21,800 Was this fine gentleman to my right, your left, doing the work? 105 00:04:21,867 --> 00:04:23,967 -Or was it somebody else? -[Coleen] He was supervising. 106 00:04:24,033 --> 00:04:25,734 And he had his crew up there. 107 00:04:25,800 --> 00:04:27,233 -[Levy] Okay. -Getting things done. 108 00:04:27,300 --> 00:04:30,433 [Levy] So five days later, September 11th, the Defendant called you, 109 00:04:30,500 --> 00:04:33,332 according to you complaint, and said that he would send one of his workers 110 00:04:33,400 --> 00:04:35,100 the following day to complete the job. 111 00:04:35,166 --> 00:04:37,734 But the roof was exposed. It was already off. 112 00:04:37,800 --> 00:04:38,800 It was not covered. 113 00:04:38,867 --> 00:04:41,200 -And rain was in the forecast. -[Coleen] Yes, sir. 114 00:04:41,266 --> 00:04:42,467 [Levy] The next day, 115 00:04:42,533 --> 00:04:45,467 the Defendant and another one of his workers arrived, 116 00:04:45,533 --> 00:04:46,800 and that's when the rain started. 117 00:04:46,867 --> 00:04:50,567 [Coleen] Before that happened, he did say, when he came to my house, 118 00:04:50,633 --> 00:04:52,066 that his son was wrong. 119 00:04:52,133 --> 00:04:55,266 There was only two layers, but he would go ahead 120 00:04:55,332 --> 00:04:58,300 and take the layers off and reroof, 121 00:04:58,367 --> 00:05:00,667 however, he wasn't going to touch the ceiling 122 00:05:00,734 --> 00:05:03,533 because the ceiling had nothing to do with the roof. 123 00:05:03,600 --> 00:05:06,367 I understand. We were gonna get to that based on your complaint. 124 00:05:06,433 --> 00:05:07,600 -But that's okay. -Sorry. Okay. 125 00:05:07,667 --> 00:05:09,767 [Levy] With respect to the exposed roof 126 00:05:09,834 --> 00:05:11,934 and any damage that may have occurred as a result... 127 00:05:12,000 --> 00:05:13,333 -It started to rain. -Yes. 128 00:05:13,400 --> 00:05:15,734 Mr. Nichols and his worker 129 00:05:15,800 --> 00:05:17,332 very quickly tried to cover the roof, 130 00:05:17,400 --> 00:05:19,900 but that rain came down, and according to your complaint, 131 00:05:19,967 --> 00:05:21,400 it kept raining for about two days. 132 00:05:21,467 --> 00:05:22,367 Two days, yes. 133 00:05:22,433 --> 00:05:25,100 [Levy] And afterwards, after this...this deluge, 134 00:05:25,200 --> 00:05:27,400 the master bathroom had moisture on the ceiling. 135 00:05:27,467 --> 00:05:28,166 Yes. 136 00:05:28,233 --> 00:05:30,567 And you're suing the Defendant for damages 137 00:05:30,633 --> 00:05:33,467 to fix the ceiling in your home and other damages 138 00:05:33,533 --> 00:05:35,700 to materials below the roof deck 139 00:05:35,767 --> 00:05:37,734 that were caused by the excessive weight, 140 00:05:37,800 --> 00:05:40,266 causing those rafters and everything to bow, 141 00:05:40,332 --> 00:05:44,166 as well as the water damage and other damages associated with that. 142 00:05:44,233 --> 00:05:45,133 Yes, Your Honor. 143 00:05:45,200 --> 00:05:47,400 [Levy] Now, Mr. Nichols. I haven't forgotten about you. 144 00:05:47,467 --> 00:05:49,500 -'Cause you put an answer in. -Yes, sir. 145 00:05:49,567 --> 00:05:52,133 [Levy] And your answer says you've been in business for 45 years. 146 00:05:52,200 --> 00:05:55,834 Yes. Well, 42 years of business. I-I worked for other people before that. 147 00:05:55,900 --> 00:05:58,467 -[Levy] And you stand behind your work? -I certainly do. 148 00:05:58,533 --> 00:06:00,266 [Levy] Consistent with what Ms. Dapper said? 149 00:06:00,333 --> 00:06:02,633 That when you were notified about the damages 150 00:06:02,700 --> 00:06:05,667 and what the insurance carrier had to say and about the dangerous condition, 151 00:06:05,734 --> 00:06:08,567 you came over and did the right thing, agreed to put another roof on. 152 00:06:08,633 --> 00:06:11,233 -Yes, sir. -[Levy] But you said also in your answer 153 00:06:11,300 --> 00:06:14,600 that there was no proof that the damage to her roof 154 00:06:14,667 --> 00:06:16,767 or the other items, the rafters, 155 00:06:16,834 --> 00:06:18,533 were the result of anything that you did. 156 00:06:18,600 --> 00:06:19,266 Yes, sir. 157 00:06:19,332 --> 00:06:22,800 [Levy] All right. Could we take a look at photograph 00D1? 158 00:06:22,867 --> 00:06:25,033 So, let me ask you this. So, I'm circling right there. 159 00:06:25,100 --> 00:06:26,967 What are those? So we're all on the same page. 160 00:06:27,033 --> 00:06:30,300 [Kenneth] The lower ones are the, uh, joists, 161 00:06:30,367 --> 00:06:31,867 and the higher ones are the rafters. 162 00:06:31,934 --> 00:06:35,400 Basically, you can see the insulation, which covers up the joists. 163 00:06:35,467 --> 00:06:37,200 -Right. -[Kenneth] But the rafters 164 00:06:37,266 --> 00:06:41,633 are what she claims caused the damage to the ceiling. 165 00:06:41,700 --> 00:06:44,367 - [Levy] And so the... - But all the rafters are connected. 166 00:06:44,433 --> 00:06:47,767 As they should be. And not broken or nothing wrong with them. 167 00:06:47,834 --> 00:06:49,533 [Levy] And that's according to your inspection, 168 00:06:49,600 --> 00:06:51,734 notwithstanding what the insurance inspection showed? 169 00:06:51,800 --> 00:06:53,600 Yes, sir. That's why I took these pictures. 170 00:06:53,667 --> 00:06:54,667 Okay. 171 00:06:54,734 --> 00:06:55,933 [theme music playing] 172 00:06:56,000 --> 00:06:58,433 [narrator] Coming up on Tribunal Justice. 173 00:06:58,500 --> 00:07:00,734 What's the name of your company that was doing this work? 174 00:07:00,800 --> 00:07:03,066 Oceanside Roofing Contractors, Incorporated. 175 00:07:03,133 --> 00:07:05,400 [Levy] So Mr. Nichols, one thing I'm gonna ask you then is, 176 00:07:05,467 --> 00:07:07,767 when you were paid for the original job 177 00:07:07,834 --> 00:07:10,633 -by the Plaintiff for $3,600... -Yes. 178 00:07:10,700 --> 00:07:14,133 ...how come the check's not made out to Oceanside Roofing Contractors, 179 00:07:14,200 --> 00:07:15,834 but to you personally? 180 00:07:20,400 --> 00:07:22,000 [theme music playing] 181 00:07:22,567 --> 00:07:26,033 Coleen Dapper is suing contractor, Ken Nichols, 182 00:07:26,100 --> 00:07:29,266 for roof repairs on her manufactured home. 183 00:07:29,332 --> 00:07:32,000 Ken claims he completed the requested work 184 00:07:32,066 --> 00:07:33,900 and owes her nothing. 185 00:07:33,967 --> 00:07:36,734 Now when you came, according to your answer, Mr. Nichols, 186 00:07:36,800 --> 00:07:38,633 with you and your son to inspect the roof, 187 00:07:38,700 --> 00:07:41,400 you realized that the entire roof had to come off. 188 00:07:41,467 --> 00:07:43,433 That was a quote. You "realized" it had to come off. 189 00:07:43,500 --> 00:07:44,867 Well, only because 190 00:07:44,933 --> 00:07:50,033 I didn't know what was causing the ceiling to cave in or to come loose, 191 00:07:50,100 --> 00:07:52,433 and I didn't want her to get hurt. 192 00:07:52,500 --> 00:07:55,667 I didn't want to end up with a large lawsuit in the future, 193 00:07:55,734 --> 00:07:58,700 so I figured the only way I could tell what the problem was 194 00:07:58,767 --> 00:08:01,800 was to take the roof off, lift up the plywood, 195 00:08:01,867 --> 00:08:05,000 and see if the rafters were indeed compromised. 196 00:08:05,066 --> 00:08:07,800 [Levy] And what you said, I believe, in your answer also was that 197 00:08:07,867 --> 00:08:09,367 not only did you not believe 198 00:08:09,433 --> 00:08:12,834 that it was as a result of you adding that second roof on 199 00:08:12,900 --> 00:08:15,200 without taking off the first that caused the damage, 200 00:08:15,266 --> 00:08:16,834 but it could have been something else. 201 00:08:16,900 --> 00:08:19,133 You said it could be rain or it could be snow. 202 00:08:19,200 --> 00:08:22,834 No, actually, what I believe caused it 203 00:08:22,900 --> 00:08:25,033 was it's like a 40-year-old home. 204 00:08:25,100 --> 00:08:26,734 And there's settling. 205 00:08:26,800 --> 00:08:28,934 And it looks like the ceiling joists, 206 00:08:29,000 --> 00:08:31,900 it looks like they've just settled down over the years 207 00:08:31,967 --> 00:08:34,799 and they're not connected as well as they should be anymore. 208 00:08:34,866 --> 00:08:37,200 And so you're saying that it was just happenstance 209 00:08:37,265 --> 00:08:41,000 or serendipitous that the damages, the bowing, occurred 210 00:08:41,066 --> 00:08:44,734 only after you put on the second layer of roofing materials? 211 00:08:44,800 --> 00:08:48,033 'Cause the Plaintiff's saying that she didn't notice that beforehand. 212 00:08:48,100 --> 00:08:50,100 And you didn't notice anything in 2019... 213 00:08:50,165 --> 00:08:51,467 -I did, sir. -[Levy] You did? 214 00:08:51,533 --> 00:08:53,934 At the time I didn't think anything of it 215 00:08:54,000 --> 00:08:56,200 because almost all homes 216 00:08:56,266 --> 00:08:59,066 have settling and you'll see cracks in, uh, in regular homes. 217 00:08:59,133 --> 00:09:01,033 I understand. And in your answer you say 218 00:09:01,100 --> 00:09:02,967 that the ceiling rafters were loose. 219 00:09:03,033 --> 00:09:04,533 -The rafters. -[Kenneth] Some of 'em. 220 00:09:04,600 --> 00:09:06,333 [Levy] And that they were being pulled away 221 00:09:06,400 --> 00:09:10,834 from the main beam, and it was, in fact, a dangerous situation. 222 00:09:10,900 --> 00:09:13,633 -Yeah, I thought it was. Yes, sir. -[Levy] It could've collapsed. 223 00:09:13,700 --> 00:09:15,900 -Your Honor, could I say one thing? -[Levy] Yes, please. 224 00:09:15,967 --> 00:09:18,967 Inspecting the roof in 2019, 225 00:09:19,667 --> 00:09:21,266 he never came into my house. 226 00:09:21,333 --> 00:09:24,266 [Levy] Well, that's important, so, thank you for adding that. 227 00:09:24,333 --> 00:09:27,200 Now, under those circumstances, and based on that testimony, Mr. Nichols, 228 00:09:27,266 --> 00:09:30,367 as you stand here right now, do you have an independent recollection 229 00:09:30,433 --> 00:09:34,867 of what the interior of Ms. Dapper's home looked like in 2019? 230 00:09:34,934 --> 00:09:37,300 -Um, no, sir. No, sir. -[Levy] Yeah. Okay. 231 00:09:37,367 --> 00:09:40,767 You say that you owe her nothing because you had nothing to do 232 00:09:40,834 --> 00:09:43,100 with the damages that were caused by the settling 233 00:09:43,165 --> 00:09:44,367 as you just testified to. 234 00:09:44,433 --> 00:09:45,533 -Correct? -Yes, sir. 235 00:09:45,600 --> 00:09:47,867 [Levy] What's the name of your company that was doing this work? 236 00:09:47,934 --> 00:09:50,367 Oceanside Roofing Contractors, Incorporated. 237 00:09:50,433 --> 00:09:53,900 So, Mr. Nichols, one thing I'm gonna ask you then is that in 2019, 238 00:09:53,967 --> 00:09:58,834 when you were paid for the original job by the Plaintiff for $3,600... 239 00:09:58,900 --> 00:10:00,033 -Yes. -She gave you a check. 240 00:10:00,100 --> 00:10:03,934 How come the check's not made out to Oceanside Roofing Contractors, 241 00:10:04,000 --> 00:10:05,233 but to you personally? 242 00:10:05,300 --> 00:10:07,367 I didn't realize it was, sir. 243 00:10:07,433 --> 00:10:09,700 Did you ask her that it be made out to you personally? 244 00:10:09,767 --> 00:10:11,066 I don't believe so. 245 00:10:11,133 --> 00:10:12,900 [Levy] Do you remember depositing that check 246 00:10:12,967 --> 00:10:14,800 or cashing it on the very same day? 247 00:10:14,867 --> 00:10:15,533 Probably. 248 00:10:16,333 --> 00:10:19,367 It would have gone into the roofing account. 249 00:10:19,433 --> 00:10:21,266 [Levy] Okay. Thank you very much. Judge Acker? 250 00:10:21,333 --> 00:10:22,100 Thank you, Judge. 251 00:10:22,166 --> 00:10:25,533 Um, I am not gonna get deep into the weeds 252 00:10:25,600 --> 00:10:28,266 about trusses and th... 'cause to me, 253 00:10:28,333 --> 00:10:30,934 there are some big-picture points in this case 254 00:10:31,000 --> 00:10:32,633 that I want to make sure I have clear. 255 00:10:32,700 --> 00:10:35,900 Two thousand nineteen, he comes to your house and does the roof. 256 00:10:35,967 --> 00:10:37,300 -Correct? -Yes. 257 00:10:37,367 --> 00:10:39,233 What sort of warranty do you provide? 258 00:10:39,300 --> 00:10:42,433 -A ten-year warranty against, uh, leaks. -[Acker] Ten-year warranty. 259 00:10:42,500 --> 00:10:43,734 Three years later, 260 00:10:43,800 --> 00:10:46,734 you notice some sagging, you call him, you come back 261 00:10:46,800 --> 00:10:50,000 because as you explained to the Judge, you want to avoid litigation, 262 00:10:50,066 --> 00:10:53,433 you want to try to tamp the problem down before it gets worse. 263 00:10:53,500 --> 00:10:56,934 So there's an issue as to what happened in 2019. 264 00:10:57,000 --> 00:11:01,734 Your insurance company and you say that there were three layers of shingle. 265 00:11:01,800 --> 00:11:03,934 You say, no, not three layers, 266 00:11:04,000 --> 00:11:06,667 your son says, "Yes," you're like, "You made a mistake," 267 00:11:06,734 --> 00:11:10,567 but in any event, I'm gonna take it all off and give you a new roof. 268 00:11:10,633 --> 00:11:12,066 -Excuse me, Your Honor? -Yes. 269 00:11:12,133 --> 00:11:15,600 At the time when we started taking the roof off, 270 00:11:15,667 --> 00:11:19,467 we invited Mrs. Dapper to come up and look 271 00:11:19,533 --> 00:11:21,967 so that she could see that there were only two layers up there. 272 00:11:22,033 --> 00:11:24,934 [Acker] But I just want to be clear, you take it off anyway? 273 00:11:25,000 --> 00:11:27,433 Yes. It was the only way I could see down below. 274 00:11:27,500 --> 00:11:29,100 -[Acker] You start demolition? -Correct. 275 00:11:29,166 --> 00:11:32,433 This is the photograph that you, ma'am, have submitted. 276 00:11:32,500 --> 00:11:33,734 When was this taken? 277 00:11:33,800 --> 00:11:38,133 I contacted the insurance company about three or four days later 278 00:11:38,200 --> 00:11:39,567 to inspect it. 279 00:11:39,633 --> 00:11:42,900 [Acker] So, you start the demolition, sir, it started raining. 280 00:11:42,967 --> 00:11:44,734 According to the Plaintiff's complaint, 281 00:11:44,800 --> 00:11:47,165 you put some plastic sheeting up, 282 00:11:47,233 --> 00:11:49,467 but not enough, and then there's some damage. 283 00:11:49,533 --> 00:11:51,233 Is that your version of the story? 284 00:11:51,300 --> 00:11:53,000 He agreed to do the roof. 285 00:11:53,867 --> 00:11:55,600 Um, he did the demolition. 286 00:11:55,667 --> 00:11:58,800 And... it was about almost six days before he came back 287 00:11:58,867 --> 00:12:01,533 and started construction on the roof. 288 00:12:01,600 --> 00:12:03,600 [Acker] So, to be clear, 289 00:12:03,667 --> 00:12:07,834 in 2022, essentially, a new project has taken place, 290 00:12:07,900 --> 00:12:12,166 which is the demolition and replacement of the work that was done in 2019. 291 00:12:12,233 --> 00:12:13,367 -Correct? -That's correct. 292 00:12:13,433 --> 00:12:14,734 [Acker] And so the sagging... 293 00:12:14,800 --> 00:12:17,233 -Is this what we're seeing? -Yes. 294 00:12:17,300 --> 00:12:20,500 [Acker] And you started to notice that sagging 295 00:12:20,567 --> 00:12:22,834 three years after? 296 00:12:22,900 --> 00:12:24,533 [Coleen] About two years... 297 00:12:24,600 --> 00:12:27,100 [Acker] Because there are a couple of things at play here. 298 00:12:27,166 --> 00:12:29,734 Now, one, you undertook this new repair job, 299 00:12:29,800 --> 00:12:32,200 but had he not done that... 300 00:12:32,266 --> 00:12:35,467 Right? I mean, you know, maybe there are some other reasons 301 00:12:35,533 --> 00:12:37,533 that the sagging might have taken place. 302 00:12:37,600 --> 00:12:42,066 But that's not really in the record. There was a warranty. You came to fix it. 303 00:12:42,133 --> 00:12:44,533 You didn't complete the repair. 304 00:12:44,600 --> 00:12:46,834 So why are we here? Don't you just owe her a new roof? 305 00:12:46,900 --> 00:12:48,100 Or to complete the work? 306 00:12:48,165 --> 00:12:49,967 I didn't think I even owed her the new roof, 307 00:12:50,033 --> 00:12:52,734 but because I want my reputation to be good, 308 00:12:52,800 --> 00:12:56,300 and, more than that, I didn't want that ceiling to cave in on her. 309 00:12:56,367 --> 00:12:57,567 And what if it was my fault? 310 00:12:57,633 --> 00:13:00,433 [Acker] That's why I don't really understand why we're here. 311 00:13:00,500 --> 00:13:03,266 He came back to fix it. It started raining. 312 00:13:03,333 --> 00:13:05,834 When it stops raining, why can't he just finish the job? 313 00:13:05,900 --> 00:13:07,900 I'm gonna let Judge DiMango pick it up from there. 314 00:13:07,967 --> 00:13:08,633 Okay. 315 00:13:08,700 --> 00:13:11,433 Uh, yeah, I'm kind of having the same question in my mind. 316 00:13:11,500 --> 00:13:15,433 Because I think what you did, sir, was pretty noble as a businessman. 317 00:13:15,500 --> 00:13:16,533 To go in there 318 00:13:16,600 --> 00:13:21,166 and to replace an entire roof because you were concerned 319 00:13:21,233 --> 00:13:22,900 that there was something you could've done. 320 00:13:22,967 --> 00:13:25,500 You didn't wait to be proven to have been the one that did it. 321 00:13:25,567 --> 00:13:26,433 So let's start. 322 00:13:26,500 --> 00:13:31,200 because these shingles that he put on, those had a 30-year warranty. 323 00:13:31,266 --> 00:13:32,900 And there's nothing about the labor 324 00:13:32,967 --> 00:13:35,500 that you've demonstrated that was defective 325 00:13:35,567 --> 00:13:38,967 that would have caused any issue because the workmanship from the labor 326 00:13:39,033 --> 00:13:40,533 is what he's warrantying. 327 00:13:40,600 --> 00:13:42,367 -Okay. -[DiMango] Now, you made a point, sir, 328 00:13:42,433 --> 00:13:44,333 that kind of was glossed over. 329 00:13:44,400 --> 00:13:46,734 When you went up on the roof to remove the shingles... 330 00:13:46,800 --> 00:13:48,200 -Yes. -...to show her, 331 00:13:48,266 --> 00:13:51,033 did you go up on the roof and look at the shingles he was showing you? 332 00:13:51,100 --> 00:13:52,066 No, Your Honor. 333 00:13:52,133 --> 00:13:55,500 [DiMango] But he did say, "Come up here. I wanna show you there's only two layers." 334 00:13:55,567 --> 00:13:56,300 No, Your Honor. 335 00:13:56,367 --> 00:13:59,333 [DiMango] I'm gonna tell you, I find his statement credible. 336 00:13:59,400 --> 00:14:02,333 I do. I'm looking here. I don't see three layers. 337 00:14:02,400 --> 00:14:05,667 I mean, I don't understand why somebody who'd want to show three layers 338 00:14:05,734 --> 00:14:08,567 just lifts it up like that, I mean... It doesn't look to me... 339 00:14:08,633 --> 00:14:11,233 Unless I'm mistaken, it only looks like two layers. 340 00:14:11,300 --> 00:14:13,100 But when he removed it, 341 00:14:13,166 --> 00:14:16,033 how many layers did you see coming off the roof? 342 00:14:16,100 --> 00:14:17,934 Honestly, I'm not, um... 343 00:14:18,567 --> 00:14:21,600 You would've seen different color roofs. Different layers, different dam... 344 00:14:21,667 --> 00:14:22,800 You would've seen something. 345 00:14:22,867 --> 00:14:25,100 Because I don't see where he's been faulty. 346 00:14:25,166 --> 00:14:27,433 He comes back at your request. 347 00:14:27,500 --> 00:14:30,667 He cautiously takes everything off. 348 00:14:30,734 --> 00:14:33,400 He does that because he's looking to see 349 00:14:33,467 --> 00:14:37,300 whether he, indeed, is to blame for any of the, uh, damages 350 00:14:37,367 --> 00:14:39,767 that you're alleging occurred inside the home. 351 00:14:39,834 --> 00:14:41,266 [theme music playing] 352 00:14:41,333 --> 00:14:43,400 [narrator] Coming up on Tribunal Justice... 353 00:14:43,467 --> 00:14:46,333 That part of your house had no damage absolutely 354 00:14:46,400 --> 00:14:47,734 before the rainstorm? 355 00:14:47,800 --> 00:14:49,767 That bathroom? Yes or no? It's a simple question. 356 00:14:49,834 --> 00:14:50,500 No. 357 00:14:50,567 --> 00:14:53,300 So, if it had no damage, then apparently it wasn't 358 00:14:53,367 --> 00:14:55,734 all the shingles on the roof that caused the problem. 359 00:15:00,533 --> 00:15:02,467 [theme music playing] 360 00:15:04,066 --> 00:15:06,700 So now he goes to install the new roof... 361 00:15:06,767 --> 00:15:08,834 Now, let me ask you, inside 362 00:15:08,900 --> 00:15:12,633 was all of the inside, uh, equally damaged? 363 00:15:12,700 --> 00:15:14,867 -From that rainstorm? -No. 364 00:15:14,934 --> 00:15:17,300 Were there difference in damages from the rainstorm? 365 00:15:17,367 --> 00:15:20,367 The damage to the master bathroom 366 00:15:20,433 --> 00:15:23,200 was separate from what was already going on 367 00:15:23,266 --> 00:15:24,567 throughout the ceiling. 368 00:15:24,633 --> 00:15:27,400 Now, I think the point that we've all been trying to make 369 00:15:27,467 --> 00:15:29,867 is that there are two separate times of damage. 370 00:15:29,934 --> 00:15:33,867 One from 2019 to 2022, 371 00:15:33,934 --> 00:15:36,200 and the second that you're contending occurred, 372 00:15:36,266 --> 00:15:38,300 when he took the roof off and you had the rainstorms. 373 00:15:38,367 --> 00:15:39,867 So my question to you is 374 00:15:39,934 --> 00:15:42,467 did you have damage all along across the ceiling? 375 00:15:42,533 --> 00:15:45,500 And did any of it get worse from the rainstorm? 376 00:15:45,567 --> 00:15:46,900 And if so, where? 377 00:15:46,967 --> 00:15:48,867 First of all, state of California 378 00:15:49,734 --> 00:15:53,567 does not allow more than one layer of roof on a manufactured... 379 00:15:53,633 --> 00:15:55,667 Okay, I'm not going back to that issue. 380 00:15:56,667 --> 00:15:58,266 Let's go back to my question. 381 00:15:58,333 --> 00:16:01,367 If your damages that you're claiming are from the rain, 382 00:16:01,433 --> 00:16:02,834 -I want to know. -They're not from the rain. 383 00:16:02,900 --> 00:16:06,467 They're not from the rain. They're not from when he took the roof off 384 00:16:06,533 --> 00:16:08,500 and he put down the what... what do you call it? 385 00:16:08,567 --> 00:16:12,900 No, I-I put a new roof on half of it, and we put plastic on the other half. 386 00:16:12,967 --> 00:16:16,500 Yeah, no, no, I'm... that's my point. The point is you did half the roof 387 00:16:16,567 --> 00:16:17,867 before the rainstorms started. 388 00:16:17,934 --> 00:16:20,133 -Right. -[DiMango] So if there was any negligence 389 00:16:20,200 --> 00:16:23,400 attributable to the way you covered the roof to protect it from the rain, 390 00:16:23,467 --> 00:16:25,834 then clearly, inside the home, 391 00:16:25,900 --> 00:16:28,867 would be more wet where you didn't cover properly 392 00:16:28,934 --> 00:16:31,066 as opposed to where you had the roof already on. 393 00:16:31,133 --> 00:16:33,633 That not what she's demonstrating to me at least here. 394 00:16:33,700 --> 00:16:35,433 And I've asked her several times, 395 00:16:35,500 --> 00:16:37,500 and we just keep going back to the same point. 396 00:16:37,567 --> 00:16:40,800 If you did that, and you were now only one layer on the roof 397 00:16:40,867 --> 00:16:43,367 and one that wasn't done yet and there was no damage from the rain 398 00:16:43,433 --> 00:16:46,600 and that's what she's asking for, then that's not something you did. 399 00:16:46,667 --> 00:16:50,400 And if it was something that occurred between '19 and '22, 400 00:16:50,467 --> 00:16:53,500 you can't show me, at least, that it was from what he did 401 00:16:53,567 --> 00:16:56,900 or it wasn't from other factors and variables. 402 00:16:56,967 --> 00:16:58,633 At this point I don't have any other questions 403 00:16:58,700 --> 00:17:00,800 so I think we're going to retire to deliberate. 404 00:17:00,867 --> 00:17:03,166 Just to clarify, there is one document, 405 00:17:03,233 --> 00:17:06,200 a bill that you sent, an invoice, for the master bath from the... 406 00:17:06,266 --> 00:17:09,400 the damage from the water as a result of the roof not being covered. 407 00:17:09,467 --> 00:17:11,666 -Right. -So when Judge DiMango asked you 408 00:17:11,733 --> 00:17:13,266 if there was anything specific... 409 00:17:13,333 --> 00:17:15,400 -There is one for $2,000. -[Coleen] Yes. 410 00:17:15,467 --> 00:17:17,867 -[Levy] Okay. -[DiMango] And none of that was prior? 411 00:17:17,934 --> 00:17:20,032 That part of your house had no damage absolutely 412 00:17:20,099 --> 00:17:21,500 before the rainstorm? 413 00:17:21,567 --> 00:17:22,266 That bathroom? 414 00:17:22,333 --> 00:17:24,200 -Yes or no. It's a simple question. -No. 415 00:17:24,266 --> 00:17:25,599 So, if it had no damage, 416 00:17:25,666 --> 00:17:29,066 then apparently it wasn't all the shingles on the roof that caused the problem. 417 00:17:29,133 --> 00:17:30,400 Uh, Your Honor. 418 00:17:30,467 --> 00:17:32,300 [DiMango] I'm good. I assume we're all good. 419 00:17:32,367 --> 00:17:33,834 We're gonna retire to deliberate. Thank you. 420 00:17:33,900 --> 00:17:36,233 [Byrd] Court is now in recess. Parties are excused. 421 00:17:36,300 --> 00:17:39,200 [theme music playing] 422 00:17:39,767 --> 00:17:42,433 Reviewing the evidence in the case presented by the Plaintiff, 423 00:17:42,500 --> 00:17:44,333 I was concerned. I was concerned 424 00:17:44,400 --> 00:17:46,066 because the Defendant acknowledged 425 00:17:46,133 --> 00:17:49,367 that, in fact, he had put on a roof on top of another roof. 426 00:17:49,433 --> 00:17:52,266 And in fact, in the state of California, on regular homes, 427 00:17:52,333 --> 00:17:55,133 two or three layers of shingles are acceptable. 428 00:17:55,200 --> 00:17:56,934 Mobile home, it's only one. 429 00:17:57,000 --> 00:17:59,633 Which means that you have to take off the original one 430 00:17:59,700 --> 00:18:02,000 before you put on the new one. 431 00:18:02,066 --> 00:18:03,967 And so whether it was two layers 432 00:18:04,033 --> 00:18:06,000 -or three layers... -It was more than one. 433 00:18:06,066 --> 00:18:08,033 That was my point. It was more than one. 434 00:18:08,100 --> 00:18:11,166 Furthermore, the Plaintiff indicated in her direct testimony 435 00:18:11,233 --> 00:18:15,633 to me as well as in her complaint that she recognized a problem immediately. 436 00:18:15,700 --> 00:18:19,300 She said within six months, she noticed parts of the interior ceiling 437 00:18:19,367 --> 00:18:22,300 to start drooping, but then it got progressively worse. 438 00:18:22,367 --> 00:18:26,900 As far as the Defendant, yeah, he came in and he fixed what he knew he should fix. 439 00:18:26,967 --> 00:18:29,734 And he said it was a dangerous situation, 440 00:18:29,800 --> 00:18:33,333 so all of those things taken into consideration 441 00:18:33,400 --> 00:18:37,567 as well as the fact that she had the roof put on in 2019 442 00:18:37,633 --> 00:18:41,033 and there was an implied covenant of good faith and fair dealing 443 00:18:41,100 --> 00:18:42,500 that the Defendant owed her... 444 00:18:42,567 --> 00:18:44,600 The fact that- that the testimony came out as it did, 445 00:18:44,667 --> 00:18:46,400 I believe that she met her burden. 446 00:18:46,467 --> 00:18:49,800 I believe that $7,831 estimate 447 00:18:49,867 --> 00:18:52,233 would be fair and reasonable under the circumstances, 448 00:18:52,300 --> 00:18:53,533 and that's what I would award her. 449 00:18:53,600 --> 00:18:56,166 I don't even think her burden was that high in this case 450 00:18:56,233 --> 00:18:59,133 because not only was there an implied covenant, 451 00:18:59,200 --> 00:19:01,633 there was a warranty. He gave her a ten-year warranty. 452 00:19:01,700 --> 00:19:03,734 So when he came back three years later, 453 00:19:03,800 --> 00:19:06,433 uh, I agree, I mean, you know, it was 454 00:19:06,500 --> 00:19:09,567 maybe a good thing to do, but it was also the necessary thing 455 00:19:09,633 --> 00:19:13,633 he had to do because he gave her a ten-year obligation, 456 00:19:13,700 --> 00:19:15,900 but I absolutely believe that he owes her. 457 00:19:15,967 --> 00:19:17,500 Well, I... see, my confusion was 458 00:19:17,567 --> 00:19:19,300 this contract, the original one, 459 00:19:19,367 --> 00:19:21,800 for all we know, when they talked about it, he said, 460 00:19:21,867 --> 00:19:24,700 "I could take all the shingles off, and it'll cost you $10,000, 461 00:19:24,767 --> 00:19:27,400 or I could just put it over this one. It'll cost you 36. 462 00:19:27,467 --> 00:19:29,834 So all we have to work with is what exists now. 463 00:19:29,900 --> 00:19:32,767 I don't know how we could even say whether he covered it properly or not. 464 00:19:32,834 --> 00:19:35,633 She's asking for ten, and I'm not willing to do that. 465 00:19:35,700 --> 00:19:37,000 So, we're gonna do that. 466 00:19:37,066 --> 00:19:39,567 Mm-mmm. He has a warranty, he's gonna live up to the warranty. 467 00:19:39,633 --> 00:19:41,400 The roof doesn't work, it's...f... 468 00:19:41,467 --> 00:19:43,967 -Seven thousand eight thirty-one. -7,831, correct. 469 00:19:44,033 --> 00:19:46,066 [theme music playing] 470 00:19:47,233 --> 00:19:48,467 Court is back in session. 471 00:19:48,533 --> 00:19:50,333 Parties are reminded you're still under oath. 472 00:19:50,900 --> 00:19:54,567 Thank you. We've had an opportunity to discuss the matter and to deliberate. 473 00:19:55,133 --> 00:19:58,667 We'll say, Mr. Nichols, you know, you came back, you did the job in 2022, 474 00:19:58,734 --> 00:20:00,700 and that was real stand up of you. 475 00:20:00,767 --> 00:20:03,100 You had a warranty that you had offered, so, you know, 476 00:20:03,166 --> 00:20:05,433 some people would've said, "Hey, it was your responsibility," 477 00:20:05,500 --> 00:20:07,734 but she didn't have to sue you to come and do the job. 478 00:20:07,800 --> 00:20:09,033 You did that on your own. 479 00:20:09,100 --> 00:20:11,500 Ms. Dapper, you know part of the issue was one of causation. 480 00:20:11,567 --> 00:20:15,100 You know? Did, in fact, the work that Mr. Nichols did in 2019 481 00:20:15,166 --> 00:20:16,900 cause the damage, the substantial damage, 482 00:20:16,967 --> 00:20:19,300 to the interior of your home, the rafters, the trusses? 483 00:20:19,367 --> 00:20:24,300 It was the position of all three of us that it wasn't just serendipitous 484 00:20:24,367 --> 00:20:28,600 that you noticed six months after Mr. Nichols went to do the work in 2019, 485 00:20:28,667 --> 00:20:29,934 -you saw the bowing... -Right. 486 00:20:30,000 --> 00:20:33,533 it got progressively worse, so be it, but there was no other testimony 487 00:20:33,600 --> 00:20:36,266 that that could have been excessive rain, snow, sleet, ice 488 00:20:36,333 --> 00:20:38,033 where you live in California 489 00:20:38,100 --> 00:20:41,633 and it was most likely caused by the excessive weight on that roof. 490 00:20:41,700 --> 00:20:42,467 Yes, sir. 491 00:20:42,533 --> 00:20:44,600 Based upon the fact that we don't have any other expert testimony, 492 00:20:44,667 --> 00:20:48,567 we did not feel it appropriate to award you your top end of 14,000, 493 00:20:48,633 --> 00:20:53,667 but we did agree unanimously to award you $7,831 494 00:20:53,734 --> 00:20:55,367 that represents the damage to that home. 495 00:20:55,433 --> 00:20:57,700 We wish you the best of luck, both of you. Thank you. 496 00:20:57,767 --> 00:20:58,700 Thank you very much. 497 00:20:58,767 --> 00:21:01,900 [Byrd] This case is now concluded. Parties are excused. You may step out. 498 00:21:01,967 --> 00:21:03,800 [theme music playing] 499 00:21:06,633 --> 00:21:09,400 Her son called me in a panic, and said that, uh... 500 00:21:10,567 --> 00:21:13,567 "You did a roof for my mom and the ceiling is caving in." 501 00:21:13,633 --> 00:21:14,800 Well, that scared me. 502 00:21:14,867 --> 00:21:17,533 I mean, I would never want anybody's ceiling to cave in 503 00:21:17,600 --> 00:21:20,300 especially if it was from my... my fault. 504 00:21:20,367 --> 00:21:25,333 The state of California states that only one layer of roof 505 00:21:26,600 --> 00:21:29,333 is legal on a manufactured home. 506 00:21:29,400 --> 00:21:31,033 The weight of the shingles 507 00:21:31,767 --> 00:21:35,000 almost strengthens the roof rather than caves it in. 508 00:21:35,066 --> 00:21:37,800 And he said there weren't three layers. There's only two. 509 00:21:37,867 --> 00:21:41,500 But it doesn't matter. You can only have one layer. 510 00:21:41,567 --> 00:21:42,667 I stand by my work. 511 00:21:42,734 --> 00:21:45,700 I would like to thank them very much. This has been a great experience. 512 00:21:46,266 --> 00:21:48,000 [narrator] Having a family dispute? 513 00:21:48,066 --> 00:21:51,300 Let Tribunal Justice decide your case. 514 00:21:51,367 --> 00:21:54,533 Find us on social media at Tribunal Justice. 515 00:21:54,600 --> 00:21:57,033 [theme music playing]