1 00:00:01,496 --> 00:00:05,336 -[birds chirping] -[dog barks distantly] 2 00:00:27,936 --> 00:00:31,526 suspenseful music plays 3 00:01:15,526 --> 00:01:17,846 Anhydrous hydrazine. 4 00:01:18,046 --> 00:01:19,826 Ammonium nitrate. 5 00:01:20,026 --> 00:01:22,536 Nitromethane. 6 00:01:23,166 --> 00:01:24,686 Nitromethane. 7 00:01:24,886 --> 00:01:26,296 Ammonium nitrate. 8 00:01:26,496 --> 00:01:30,156 [indistinct radio chatter] 9 00:01:30,356 --> 00:01:32,096 Oh, shit. 10 00:01:32,296 --> 00:01:33,756 Shit. 11 00:01:34,716 --> 00:01:36,056 [door slams open] 12 00:01:36,256 --> 00:01:39,766 suspenseful music plays 13 00:01:56,736 --> 00:01:58,946 [man] Come on, man. We gotta go. 14 00:02:06,126 --> 00:02:08,836 [door opens and closes] 15 00:02:09,086 --> 00:02:12,626 suspenseful music plays 16 00:02:36,316 --> 00:02:39,826 theme music plays 17 00:03:34,796 --> 00:03:37,066 [Dan] Defense calls FBI Supervisory 18 00:03:37,266 --> 00:03:39,386 Special Agent Gary Noesner to the stand. 19 00:03:39,586 --> 00:03:41,576 [people murmuring] 20 00:03:41,776 --> 00:03:44,956 [Dan] As the lead negotiator for the FBI, 21 00:03:45,156 --> 00:03:46,416 how many hours did you spend 22 00:03:46,616 --> 00:03:48,146 on the phone with the Davidians? 23 00:03:48,346 --> 00:03:51,506 [Gary] Uh, it's hard to say, definitively. Hundreds. 24 00:03:51,706 --> 00:03:54,546 [Dan] Seems like you got to know them pretty well then. 25 00:03:54,746 --> 00:03:56,356 [Gary] I guess so. 26 00:03:57,686 --> 00:04:00,776 [Dan] Well enough to get some of them to come out. 27 00:04:01,776 --> 00:04:02,596 Yes. 28 00:04:02,796 --> 00:04:05,326 Uh, 35 people came out during the siege 29 00:04:05,526 --> 00:04:08,226 including 21 children. 30 00:04:08,426 --> 00:04:09,606 How did you do that? 31 00:04:09,806 --> 00:04:11,916 Get so many people out? 32 00:04:13,626 --> 00:04:16,316 You build trust over time. 33 00:04:16,516 --> 00:04:18,216 You start small, you give them something, 34 00:04:18,416 --> 00:04:19,906 in return they give something. 35 00:04:20,106 --> 00:04:21,256 You compromise. 36 00:04:21,456 --> 00:04:22,366 Trust. 37 00:04:22,566 --> 00:04:23,556 Uh-hmm. 38 00:04:23,756 --> 00:04:25,366 [Dan] Was it difficult to build that trust 39 00:04:25,566 --> 00:04:26,726 when other members of your team 40 00:04:26,926 --> 00:04:28,626 were cutting the power to the Davidians' home, 41 00:04:28,826 --> 00:04:30,686 or rolling tanks over their cars, 42 00:04:30,886 --> 00:04:33,296 or using sleep deprivation techniques, 43 00:04:33,496 --> 00:04:37,896 like, uh, blasting floodlights or music throughout the night? 44 00:04:40,196 --> 00:04:42,616 Yeah, my team, the negotiation team, 45 00:04:42,816 --> 00:04:47,366 worked in conjunction with the tactical team, HRT. 46 00:04:47,566 --> 00:04:50,586 And although our efforts were coordinated, 47 00:04:50,786 --> 00:04:53,876 sometimes we took different approaches. 48 00:04:54,206 --> 00:04:56,276 And that relationship with HRT, 49 00:04:56,476 --> 00:04:59,376 would you describe it as, um... 50 00:04:59,626 --> 00:05:02,616 -adversarial? -[chuckles] 51 00:05:02,816 --> 00:05:04,656 But just remember, the ATF's not gonna be around 52 00:05:04,856 --> 00:05:07,016 -to take the blame this time. -I don't give a shit! 53 00:05:07,216 --> 00:05:08,746 Uh, it could get heated, 54 00:05:08,946 --> 00:05:12,206 but we always had the same objective. 55 00:05:12,406 --> 00:05:13,516 To get everyone out safely. 56 00:05:13,716 --> 00:05:16,436 [Dan] Now, days before the final raid, 57 00:05:16,636 --> 00:05:18,796 you had reached an agreement with the Davidians 58 00:05:18,996 --> 00:05:21,006 regarding their surrender, correct? 59 00:05:21,206 --> 00:05:23,756 David had promised to come out before and never did. 60 00:05:23,956 --> 00:05:26,266 It's not uncommon in situations like this 61 00:05:26,466 --> 00:05:28,936 for people to say one thing and do another. 62 00:05:29,136 --> 00:05:30,826 So the FBI didn't believe 63 00:05:31,026 --> 00:05:32,646 the Davidians were gonna come out 64 00:05:32,846 --> 00:05:35,356 and a decision was made to go in. 65 00:05:35,556 --> 00:05:37,666 Who made that decision? 66 00:05:40,336 --> 00:05:41,486 The Attorney General. 67 00:05:41,686 --> 00:05:43,326 [Dan] In a meeting on April 12th? 68 00:05:43,526 --> 00:05:44,576 [Gary] Sure. 69 00:05:44,776 --> 00:05:46,966 Were you at that meeting? 70 00:05:49,096 --> 00:05:50,266 I was not. 71 00:05:50,466 --> 00:05:53,036 [Dan] Was anyone from the negotiations team there? 72 00:05:53,236 --> 00:05:55,396 -No. -[Dan] Why not? 73 00:05:56,186 --> 00:05:57,396 If you were a team, 74 00:05:57,596 --> 00:06:00,436 why wasn't half the team at this very important meeting? 75 00:06:00,816 --> 00:06:05,366 [breathes hard] You'd have to ask them. 76 00:06:05,566 --> 00:06:08,226 But you supported the decision they came to, 77 00:06:08,426 --> 00:06:11,076 to raid Mount Carmel on the 19th? 78 00:06:12,866 --> 00:06:14,316 Leadership felt it was the best way 79 00:06:14,506 --> 00:06:15,626 to avoid more loss of life. 80 00:06:15,826 --> 00:06:17,476 [Dan] I'm not asking what leadership thought. 81 00:06:17,676 --> 00:06:19,626 I'm asking for your personal opinion. 82 00:06:19,826 --> 00:06:22,006 Be careful, Mr. Cogdell. 83 00:06:24,586 --> 00:06:26,176 [sucks teeth] 84 00:06:27,636 --> 00:06:29,886 On April 16th, 85 00:06:30,306 --> 00:06:33,476 do you remember Steve Schneider 86 00:06:33,676 --> 00:06:36,056 asking you for a computer? 87 00:06:38,056 --> 00:06:38,756 Yes. 88 00:06:38,956 --> 00:06:40,466 [Dan] And why did he want that? 89 00:06:40,666 --> 00:06:44,486 Uh, he said it would help Koresh write the Seven Seals out, 90 00:06:44,686 --> 00:06:47,326 and once that was done, they'd come out. 91 00:06:47,526 --> 00:06:51,366 This is a request you made for the computer. 92 00:06:51,826 --> 00:06:54,056 Is that your signature there at the bottom? 93 00:06:54,256 --> 00:06:55,126 Yes. 94 00:06:55,326 --> 00:06:57,186 And the date next to the signature? 95 00:06:57,386 --> 00:06:58,396 April 16th. 96 00:06:58,596 --> 00:07:02,586 So, four days after a decision had been made 97 00:07:02,786 --> 00:07:06,156 to conduct the raid on Mount Carmel, 98 00:07:06,356 --> 00:07:07,596 you requested a new computer 99 00:07:07,796 --> 00:07:09,926 -for Steve Schneider? -[Gary] Yes. 100 00:07:10,126 --> 00:07:11,846 And how long does it normally take 101 00:07:12,046 --> 00:07:14,556 for a request like that to go through? 102 00:07:16,686 --> 00:07:18,516 -A week or so. -[Dan] A week. 103 00:07:18,716 --> 00:07:19,976 So you ordered a new computer 104 00:07:20,176 --> 00:07:23,276 knowing that it wouldn't arrive until after the raid? 105 00:07:23,776 --> 00:07:25,296 -Well-- -[Dan] Why do that? 106 00:07:25,496 --> 00:07:26,656 Why order something 107 00:07:26,856 --> 00:07:29,946 knowing that it wouldn't arrive until after the raid? 108 00:07:34,996 --> 00:07:38,166 Unless you didn't know the raid was coming. 109 00:07:41,836 --> 00:07:44,546 I don't recall exactly when I was told about the raid. 110 00:07:44,746 --> 00:07:46,696 You didn't know. They didn't tell you 111 00:07:46,896 --> 00:07:48,526 because they knew you'd be against it. 112 00:07:48,726 --> 00:07:50,536 Leadership made a tactical decision. 113 00:07:50,736 --> 00:07:53,746 It wasn't a tactical decision, it was an emotional one. 114 00:07:53,946 --> 00:07:56,536 They were getting embarrassed on national TV 115 00:07:56,736 --> 00:07:57,916 and they were sick of it. 116 00:07:58,116 --> 00:07:59,956 No, they just felt Koresh wasn't serious about coming out 117 00:08:00,156 --> 00:08:01,506 and they believed they were out of options. 118 00:08:01,696 --> 00:08:03,236 Because you failed? 119 00:08:03,436 --> 00:08:05,376 I don't believe negotiators ever fail. 120 00:08:05,576 --> 00:08:06,906 We either solve a situation 121 00:08:07,106 --> 00:08:10,856 or we create more time for HRT to prepare. 122 00:08:12,366 --> 00:08:14,056 HRT cited and I quote, 123 00:08:14,256 --> 00:08:18,536 "Once negotiations failed, we were left with no choice." 124 00:08:19,076 --> 00:08:20,746 That wasn't my assessment of the situation. 125 00:08:20,946 --> 00:08:22,526 They gave you 51 days, didn't they? 126 00:08:22,726 --> 00:08:25,626 That's a pretty long run to wind up with nothing. 127 00:08:26,626 --> 00:08:28,506 I wouldn't call it nothing. 128 00:08:28,706 --> 00:08:30,346 We got 35 people out. 129 00:08:30,546 --> 00:08:31,556 And who knows? 130 00:08:31,756 --> 00:08:32,866 Maybe you could've gotten another 35 131 00:08:33,066 --> 00:08:34,576 if you weren't running over their cars. 132 00:08:34,776 --> 00:08:36,516 -That wasn't us. -That wasn't the FBI? 133 00:08:36,716 --> 00:08:39,106 No, it was the FBI, but it wasn't my team. 134 00:08:39,306 --> 00:08:41,476 Oh, so that doesn't count? 135 00:08:43,186 --> 00:08:46,856 For Christ's sake, why don't you just ask it? 136 00:08:47,566 --> 00:08:48,776 Excuse me? 137 00:08:48,976 --> 00:08:51,446 I know where you're heading with all this. 138 00:08:51,646 --> 00:08:55,196 Cut to the chase, just ask the question. 139 00:08:56,946 --> 00:09:00,806 Uhm, what question would you like me to ask? 140 00:09:01,006 --> 00:09:02,416 [Bill] Objection! 141 00:09:02,616 --> 00:09:04,936 [Judge Smith] Overruled. 142 00:09:05,136 --> 00:09:07,006 You wanna know if it was inevitable, 143 00:09:07,206 --> 00:09:10,586 if they were planning to die all along. 144 00:09:12,046 --> 00:09:15,546 So you should just ask me. 145 00:09:23,646 --> 00:09:25,516 Was it inevitable? 146 00:09:26,686 --> 00:09:28,196 No, it was not. 147 00:09:28,396 --> 00:09:29,676 [people murmuring] 148 00:09:29,876 --> 00:09:33,406 They were running out of water and resolve. 149 00:09:34,736 --> 00:09:37,846 And I believe that without the tactical maneuvers 150 00:09:38,046 --> 00:09:39,386 and a little more time, 151 00:09:39,586 --> 00:09:42,806 we could have gotten a lot more of them out, 152 00:09:43,006 --> 00:09:44,956 perhaps all of them. 153 00:09:45,996 --> 00:09:48,216 [Dan] Did you tell that to leadership? 154 00:09:48,416 --> 00:09:49,586 [Gary] I did. 155 00:09:50,206 --> 00:09:51,716 And that's why they didn't bring me 156 00:09:51,916 --> 00:09:54,296 to meet the Attorney General. 157 00:09:55,966 --> 00:09:57,676 That's why I was rotated out. 158 00:09:57,876 --> 00:10:00,596 Some FBI leaders were tired of the press 159 00:10:00,796 --> 00:10:03,096 and the attention. 160 00:10:03,636 --> 00:10:05,246 The American public was tired of it. 161 00:10:05,446 --> 00:10:07,396 Everyone was tired. 162 00:10:09,146 --> 00:10:12,606 The FBI wanted it over at any cost. 163 00:10:14,316 --> 00:10:16,236 Holy shit. 164 00:10:18,986 --> 00:10:21,516 Uh, no further questions, Your Honor. 165 00:10:21,716 --> 00:10:25,116 dramatic music plays 166 00:10:39,676 --> 00:10:41,536 [floor creaks] 167 00:10:41,736 --> 00:10:45,266 -[Carol grunts] -[men grunting] 168 00:10:47,396 --> 00:10:50,646 [dog barking] 169 00:11:02,036 --> 00:11:04,416 I have one question for you 170 00:11:04,616 --> 00:11:06,606 and I better like your answer. 171 00:11:06,806 --> 00:11:09,436 Why were you in Andy's trailer? 172 00:11:09,636 --> 00:11:10,836 That was yours? 173 00:11:11,036 --> 00:11:11,836 That was Andy's? 174 00:11:12,036 --> 00:11:13,086 I mean, I didn't-- 175 00:11:13,286 --> 00:11:15,656 I was--I was--I'm stupid, I was high 176 00:11:15,856 --> 00:11:18,006 and then I just went into the wrong trailer. 177 00:11:18,206 --> 00:11:20,426 When I realized I was in the wrong place, I left. 178 00:11:20,626 --> 00:11:21,576 Is that a crime? 179 00:11:21,776 --> 00:11:23,686 Go ahead. Search me. Go search my stuff. 180 00:11:23,886 --> 00:11:25,476 I didn't take nothin'. 181 00:11:25,676 --> 00:11:27,376 suspenseful music plays 182 00:11:27,576 --> 00:11:30,126 [Andy] What's the downside of killing her right here? 183 00:11:30,326 --> 00:11:32,126 I know she saw something in my trailer 184 00:11:32,326 --> 00:11:34,606 -she shouldn't have. -[guns cocking] 185 00:11:34,936 --> 00:11:36,946 -[dog barking] -[whispering] 186 00:11:37,146 --> 00:11:39,926 suspenseful music plays 187 00:11:40,126 --> 00:11:43,156 [indistinct whispering] 188 00:11:44,656 --> 00:11:48,036 [dog barking] 189 00:11:48,236 --> 00:11:49,646 -[gunshot] -Hey, no! 190 00:11:49,846 --> 00:11:52,146 You might hit the dogs! 191 00:11:52,346 --> 00:11:53,216 Auf! Auf! 192 00:11:53,416 --> 00:11:55,906 Blind 'em, I swear to God! These are good dogs, 193 00:11:56,106 --> 00:11:58,376 but call them or I'll fuck them up! 194 00:12:00,086 --> 00:12:01,136 Come on here! 195 00:12:01,336 --> 00:12:04,176 suspenseful music plays 196 00:12:04,386 --> 00:12:07,226 [gunshots] 197 00:12:12,306 --> 00:12:14,296 [Wayne on tape] There are 75 ATF agents 198 00:12:14,496 --> 00:12:17,136 around our building and they're shooting at us! 199 00:12:17,336 --> 00:12:19,346 There's women and children in here, 200 00:12:19,546 --> 00:12:20,676 and they're--call it off! 201 00:12:20,876 --> 00:12:22,306 [Sheriff Harwell] This is Sheriff Harwell. 202 00:12:22,506 --> 00:12:24,036 -[Wayne] Sheriff! -[Sheriff Harwell] Wayne. 203 00:12:24,236 --> 00:12:25,846 [Wayne] We got women and children in danger! 204 00:12:26,046 --> 00:12:29,286 -[Sheriff Harwell] Wayne! -[Wayne] Tell them to pull back! 205 00:12:32,666 --> 00:12:34,756 That call was placed by Wayne Martin 206 00:12:34,956 --> 00:12:37,546 moments after the ATF raid began. 207 00:12:39,296 --> 00:12:41,216 Wayne Martin isn't here to tell you about it today 208 00:12:41,416 --> 00:12:44,756 because he was burned alive 51 days later. 209 00:12:53,016 --> 00:12:55,546 Every case, 210 00:12:55,746 --> 00:12:58,606 every trial asks a question... 211 00:13:00,446 --> 00:13:04,496 and it's up to you the jury to answer that question 212 00:13:04,696 --> 00:13:06,446 for the rest of the world. 213 00:13:07,036 --> 00:13:10,126 I thought I knew what the question of this trial was. 214 00:13:10,326 --> 00:13:12,956 See, I thought the question of this trial was, 215 00:13:13,156 --> 00:13:15,026 "Does the United States government 216 00:13:15,226 --> 00:13:18,796 have the right to attack its own citizens?" 217 00:13:21,086 --> 00:13:24,466 It's a scary question when you say it out loud. 218 00:13:29,016 --> 00:13:31,266 But that's not the question. 219 00:13:33,976 --> 00:13:35,526 Because the government already believes 220 00:13:35,726 --> 00:13:37,646 it has that right. 221 00:13:38,606 --> 00:13:40,236 The real question 222 00:13:40,436 --> 00:13:45,536 that you the jury are tasked with answering today is this, 223 00:13:45,736 --> 00:13:48,326 "When the United States government 224 00:13:48,786 --> 00:13:51,056 comes for you and your family 225 00:13:51,256 --> 00:13:53,916 with no plan for peaceful surrender, 226 00:13:54,246 --> 00:13:58,836 do you have the right to defend yourselves?" 227 00:14:01,336 --> 00:14:03,966 That is what's at stake here today. 228 00:14:06,546 --> 00:14:08,216 For you... 229 00:14:10,216 --> 00:14:11,576 for all of us. 230 00:14:11,776 --> 00:14:15,226 dramatic music plays 231 00:14:23,896 --> 00:14:25,816 [Gary] You are really brave. 232 00:14:26,406 --> 00:14:29,446 Well, I'm a badass, Gary. What can I say? 233 00:14:29,986 --> 00:14:32,866 Do you know what tipped them off to you? 234 00:14:34,786 --> 00:14:35,996 No, I don't know. 235 00:14:36,196 --> 00:14:38,486 Maybe they saw me at Andy's house. 236 00:14:38,676 --> 00:14:39,586 What? Wait. 237 00:14:39,786 --> 00:14:41,356 You went to Andy the German's house? 238 00:14:41,556 --> 00:14:43,676 Yeah, I snuck in there when no one was looking. 239 00:14:43,876 --> 00:14:45,876 -[chuckles] -You shouldn't have done that. 240 00:14:46,426 --> 00:14:49,006 Well, I found something, so you're welcome. 241 00:14:50,846 --> 00:14:52,056 He had a notebook, okay? 242 00:14:52,256 --> 00:14:55,126 With a bunch of science-type stuff like chemicals. 243 00:14:55,326 --> 00:14:57,266 What kind of chemicals? 244 00:14:58,226 --> 00:15:00,986 Nitromethane... [sighs] 245 00:15:01,186 --> 00:15:03,126 anhyzahydrizone. 246 00:15:03,326 --> 00:15:05,046 Anhydrous hydrazine? 247 00:15:05,246 --> 00:15:06,946 That's racing fuel. 248 00:15:07,146 --> 00:15:10,116 And adaman--admantium... 249 00:15:10,316 --> 00:15:12,516 [sighs] Nitrous... 250 00:15:12,716 --> 00:15:13,616 [Angie] Ammonium nitrate. 251 00:15:13,816 --> 00:15:15,286 [snaps fingers] That's it. 252 00:15:15,866 --> 00:15:18,606 -Fertilizer. -Racing fuel and fertilizer. 253 00:15:18,806 --> 00:15:22,066 That's the same combination they use in The Turner Diaries 254 00:15:22,266 --> 00:15:23,146 to build their bomb. 255 00:15:23,346 --> 00:15:26,046 tense music plays 256 00:15:28,756 --> 00:15:30,806 [man] Robert Kling. 257 00:15:31,006 --> 00:15:33,536 Hey, happy early birthday. 258 00:15:33,736 --> 00:15:35,326 [Tim] What? 259 00:15:35,526 --> 00:15:37,896 April 19th, coming up quick. 260 00:15:38,096 --> 00:15:41,566 [rock music plays over radio] 261 00:15:41,766 --> 00:15:45,986 - suspenseful music plays -[indistinct chatter] 262 00:16:04,706 --> 00:16:06,086 There you go. 263 00:16:08,256 --> 00:16:10,086 You boys drive safe. 264 00:16:30,106 --> 00:16:32,776 [David] I received another vision from God. 265 00:16:36,236 --> 00:16:38,366 That's wonderful. 266 00:16:39,456 --> 00:16:42,726 Well, I'm not sure everyone will agree with you. 267 00:16:42,926 --> 00:16:44,836 What He's asking... 268 00:16:46,496 --> 00:16:49,126 a lot of people might say it's wrong. 269 00:16:52,256 --> 00:16:56,846 We don't judge you for what He asks you to do. 270 00:16:59,596 --> 00:17:01,746 Thanks, Clive. That's very comforting. 271 00:17:01,946 --> 00:17:05,356 dramatic music plays 272 00:17:13,776 --> 00:17:15,526 [door opens] 273 00:17:18,156 --> 00:17:20,156 [prison guard] Clive Doyle, get up. 274 00:17:20,996 --> 00:17:21,936 The verdict's in. 275 00:17:22,136 --> 00:17:26,256 dramatic music plays 276 00:17:26,456 --> 00:17:29,796 [Karen] Dad, can I ask you something? 277 00:17:29,996 --> 00:17:31,086 Of course. 278 00:17:31,296 --> 00:17:35,286 [Karen] Is everything David says the word of God? 279 00:17:35,486 --> 00:17:38,676 Or sometimes is he wrong? 280 00:17:41,556 --> 00:17:44,846 David hears the voice of God. 281 00:17:46,936 --> 00:17:51,046 And you believe everything he says, 282 00:17:51,246 --> 00:17:54,696 even when it's something strange? 283 00:17:56,906 --> 00:17:58,736 [bailiff] All rise. 284 00:18:17,386 --> 00:18:19,326 Has the jury reached a verdict? 285 00:18:19,526 --> 00:18:20,936 We have, Your Honor. 286 00:18:21,136 --> 00:18:23,596 [people murmuring] 287 00:18:32,186 --> 00:18:34,926 [Judge Smith] The jury rules as follows. 288 00:18:35,126 --> 00:18:36,176 On the first count, 289 00:18:36,376 --> 00:18:38,136 conspiracy to murder federal agents, 290 00:18:38,336 --> 00:18:41,726 the jury finds all four defendants... 291 00:18:41,926 --> 00:18:42,746 not guilty. 292 00:18:42,946 --> 00:18:44,786 [all gasp] 293 00:18:44,986 --> 00:18:46,246 On the second count of aiding 294 00:18:46,446 --> 00:18:49,316 and abetting the murder of federal agents, 295 00:18:49,516 --> 00:18:52,376 the jury finds all four defendants... 296 00:18:52,576 --> 00:18:55,236 -not guilty. -[all exclaim] 297 00:18:55,436 --> 00:18:58,136 On the count of using an illegal firearm 298 00:18:58,336 --> 00:19:00,516 in the commission of a crime, 299 00:19:00,716 --> 00:19:04,136 the jury finds Paul Fatta, 300 00:19:05,306 --> 00:19:07,766 Livingstone Fagan, 301 00:19:07,976 --> 00:19:09,876 and Ruth Riddle... 302 00:19:10,076 --> 00:19:10,936 guilty. 303 00:19:11,136 --> 00:19:13,006 [all gasp] 304 00:19:13,206 --> 00:19:16,466 dramatic music plays 305 00:19:16,666 --> 00:19:18,006 What does that mean? 306 00:19:18,206 --> 00:19:19,446 It means you've been cleared of all charges. 307 00:19:19,646 --> 00:19:21,496 You'll be free to go in a couple of hours. 308 00:19:21,696 --> 00:19:23,056 [Clive] But what about the others? 309 00:19:23,256 --> 00:19:24,456 [Judge Smith] Order in the court. Order. 310 00:19:24,656 --> 00:19:26,766 [Dan] It just doesn't-- there's something. 311 00:19:26,966 --> 00:19:28,436 Your Honor, 312 00:19:28,636 --> 00:19:32,756 we'd like to ask the court to reconsider that last verdict. 313 00:19:32,956 --> 00:19:33,856 On what grounds? 314 00:19:34,056 --> 00:19:36,116 On the grounds that it doesn't make a lick of sense 315 00:19:36,316 --> 00:19:39,196 to be convicted of using an illegal firearm 316 00:19:39,396 --> 00:19:40,466 to commit a crime 317 00:19:40,666 --> 00:19:42,456 when you weren't convicted of the actual crime. 318 00:19:42,656 --> 00:19:43,996 Well, that's not for us to say. 319 00:19:44,196 --> 00:19:45,266 -The jury ruled-- -[Rocket] Hang on. Hang on. 320 00:19:45,466 --> 00:19:47,246 Hang on. Mr. Cogdell is right. 321 00:19:47,446 --> 00:19:49,376 How can I be guilty of using a weapon 322 00:19:49,576 --> 00:19:53,146 during a crime if that crime never happened? 323 00:19:55,526 --> 00:19:58,236 Interesting legal paradox. 324 00:20:04,326 --> 00:20:07,246 But... I agree with the defense. 325 00:20:07,446 --> 00:20:10,246 I'm vacating the convictions on the firearms charges. 326 00:20:10,446 --> 00:20:11,566 The defendants are to be released. 327 00:20:11,766 --> 00:20:14,896 -Yes. -[all exclaim] 328 00:20:15,096 --> 00:20:17,586 dramatic music plays 329 00:20:34,226 --> 00:20:35,506 [Clive] Are you sure? 330 00:20:35,706 --> 00:20:37,566 I'll tell David. 331 00:20:42,486 --> 00:20:46,116 David. David. 332 00:20:46,786 --> 00:20:50,606 George Roden has been put in a mental hospital, 333 00:20:50,806 --> 00:20:53,206 because of his outburst in court. 334 00:20:55,706 --> 00:20:58,756 upbeat rock music plays 335 00:20:59,666 --> 00:21:01,756 You know what that means? 336 00:21:08,056 --> 00:21:11,206 [all] I think there's something you should know 337 00:21:11,406 --> 00:21:13,726 I think it's time I told you so 338 00:21:13,926 --> 00:21:16,566 There's something deep inside of me 339 00:21:16,766 --> 00:21:18,836 There's someone else I've got to be 340 00:21:19,036 --> 00:21:21,776 Take back your picture in a frame 341 00:21:21,976 --> 00:21:24,486 Take back your singing in the rain 342 00:21:24,686 --> 00:21:26,516 I just hope you understand 343 00:21:26,716 --> 00:21:29,556 Sometimes the clothes do not make the man 344 00:21:29,756 --> 00:21:34,376 All we have to do now 345 00:21:34,576 --> 00:21:37,296 Is take these lies 346 00:21:37,496 --> 00:21:40,046 And make them true somehow 347 00:21:40,246 --> 00:21:44,196 All we have to see 348 00:21:44,396 --> 00:21:46,766 Is that I don't belong to you 349 00:21:46,966 --> 00:21:50,416 And you don't belong to me yeah, yeah 350 00:21:50,616 --> 00:21:52,996 Freedom 351 00:21:53,196 --> 00:21:55,226 Freedom 352 00:21:55,426 --> 00:21:58,436 - Freedom... -[music stops] 353 00:22:05,276 --> 00:22:06,986 [exhales sharply] 354 00:22:17,956 --> 00:22:20,546 [David] God has given me this land 355 00:22:20,746 --> 00:22:22,716 and everything on it. 356 00:22:23,546 --> 00:22:26,886 I'll give you all ten minutes to get off my property. 357 00:22:28,636 --> 00:22:29,966 Or what? 358 00:22:31,516 --> 00:22:33,386 Or we do this mean. 359 00:22:38,936 --> 00:22:41,656 We're gonna live here by God's laws, 360 00:22:41,856 --> 00:22:44,236 not by man's weakness anymore. 361 00:22:44,736 --> 00:22:47,866 Those of you who wanna stay, can stay. 362 00:22:48,406 --> 00:22:50,286 But there's gonna be some new rules. 363 00:22:50,486 --> 00:22:55,246 No drugs, no drinking, no smoking, no sex. 364 00:22:55,866 --> 00:22:58,686 If you stay, you stay to study your Bible, 365 00:22:58,886 --> 00:23:03,206 to find a new way, a better way. 366 00:23:03,756 --> 00:23:06,926 And if that doesn't interest you, 367 00:23:07,126 --> 00:23:10,426 well, it's time you found a new doorway to darken. 368 00:23:14,096 --> 00:23:15,036 [Gary] Oh, excuse me. 369 00:23:15,236 --> 00:23:16,626 Hey, Mitch. 370 00:23:16,826 --> 00:23:18,146 I got nothing to say to you. 371 00:23:18,346 --> 00:23:20,146 Okay. Look, I know you're pissed. 372 00:23:20,346 --> 00:23:21,526 I need your support on something. 373 00:23:21,726 --> 00:23:22,966 Yeah, well, you can't have it. 374 00:23:23,166 --> 00:23:24,236 Please, just hear me out. 375 00:23:24,436 --> 00:23:26,656 You took internal bureau discussions 376 00:23:26,856 --> 00:23:28,096 and you aired it to the world, Gary, 377 00:23:28,296 --> 00:23:29,696 you made us look like amateurs. 378 00:23:29,896 --> 00:23:31,496 Indecisive, spiteful little-- 379 00:23:31,696 --> 00:23:34,056 -I told the truth. -You made us weaker. 380 00:23:34,256 --> 00:23:36,856 People don't expect the government to be perfect, okay? 381 00:23:37,056 --> 00:23:39,376 But they do expect us to be accountable. 382 00:23:39,576 --> 00:23:41,236 You think I'm not accountable? 383 00:23:41,436 --> 00:23:43,376 You think I'm not accountable? 384 00:23:43,576 --> 00:23:44,626 You had the luxury 385 00:23:44,826 --> 00:23:46,406 of criticizing from the sidelines, Gary. 386 00:23:46,606 --> 00:23:47,616 You got to leave. 387 00:23:47,816 --> 00:23:49,306 I didn't. I stayed, 388 00:23:49,506 --> 00:23:52,706 made the tough call, and watched those people die. 389 00:23:52,906 --> 00:23:54,666 And I got to live with that. 390 00:23:54,866 --> 00:23:56,286 What, you think you're the only one 391 00:23:56,486 --> 00:23:57,916 still dealing with the consequences of Waco? 392 00:23:58,116 --> 00:24:00,086 I still dream about it every night, Gary. 393 00:24:00,286 --> 00:24:02,106 [shouts] So do I! 394 00:24:05,316 --> 00:24:06,586 But you know what, Mitch? 395 00:24:06,786 --> 00:24:08,756 I think that's what we deserve. 396 00:24:08,956 --> 00:24:13,486 What happened at Waco, it affected all of us. 397 00:24:14,286 --> 00:24:16,846 It affected the entire country. 398 00:24:17,046 --> 00:24:19,726 And I know you understand what I'm talking about. 399 00:24:19,926 --> 00:24:22,456 We both saw the protesters at Mount Carmel. 400 00:24:22,656 --> 00:24:25,336 We saw the increased militia presence 401 00:24:25,536 --> 00:24:28,506 and that has only gotten worse since the fire. 402 00:24:29,876 --> 00:24:32,346 And I believe that these people 403 00:24:32,546 --> 00:24:36,136 are planning an attack, something big. 404 00:24:37,726 --> 00:24:40,086 And I need the bureau's support to look deeper into it, 405 00:24:40,286 --> 00:24:42,306 but I can't get it alone. 406 00:24:43,726 --> 00:24:45,316 I need your help. 407 00:24:46,686 --> 00:24:48,546 What do you mean by attack? 408 00:24:48,746 --> 00:24:52,406 The advantage that we've had in dealing with these groups 409 00:24:52,606 --> 00:24:55,306 is handling them one at a time, sir. 410 00:24:55,506 --> 00:24:56,616 If Gary's right 411 00:24:56,816 --> 00:24:58,766 and they started communicating with each other 412 00:24:58,966 --> 00:25:01,536 through extensive fax networks, 413 00:25:02,576 --> 00:25:03,856 there's a real chance they could morph 414 00:25:04,056 --> 00:25:07,216 into some kind of headless terrorist network. 415 00:25:07,416 --> 00:25:09,256 If Gary's intel is good, 416 00:25:09,456 --> 00:25:10,716 I think we need to take a closer look. 417 00:25:10,916 --> 00:25:13,296 If the Intel is good. 418 00:25:14,596 --> 00:25:16,556 That's a pretty big "if." 419 00:25:17,806 --> 00:25:20,166 You're asking me to go way out on a limb here 420 00:25:20,366 --> 00:25:21,436 based on the word 421 00:25:21,636 --> 00:25:24,546 of an unsanctioned CI nobody has met. 422 00:25:24,746 --> 00:25:26,026 Well, I think the intel is good. 423 00:25:26,226 --> 00:25:28,716 -I trust her. -[Alan] I know you trust her. 424 00:25:28,916 --> 00:25:30,906 But before I go deeper into this, 425 00:25:31,106 --> 00:25:34,366 I need to meet her myself. 426 00:25:36,656 --> 00:25:38,036 Okay. 427 00:25:48,876 --> 00:25:50,876 You're gonna do great. 428 00:25:55,926 --> 00:25:58,916 So you're this mystery CI 429 00:25:59,106 --> 00:26:01,346 I've heard so much about. 430 00:26:02,016 --> 00:26:04,306 Yes, sir. Nice to meet you. 431 00:26:04,766 --> 00:26:06,646 And how did you get to know this group? 432 00:26:06,846 --> 00:26:08,896 The Aryan Brotherhood? 433 00:26:09,096 --> 00:26:10,756 Uh, well, I was dating this guy. 434 00:26:10,956 --> 00:26:12,606 His name was Wild Bill. 435 00:26:13,146 --> 00:26:15,156 Uh, he liked to rob banks, do all kinds 436 00:26:15,356 --> 00:26:16,806 of crazy shit like that. 437 00:26:17,006 --> 00:26:20,326 Um, yeah, but then one night we got into an argument 438 00:26:20,526 --> 00:26:21,826 and he beat me up pretty bad. 439 00:26:22,026 --> 00:26:25,246 I still can't see super good out of this eye, you know. 440 00:26:25,446 --> 00:26:28,436 And that, that pissed me off. 441 00:26:28,636 --> 00:26:30,416 So I narced on him. 442 00:26:31,626 --> 00:26:33,216 No offense. 443 00:26:33,546 --> 00:26:36,326 None taken. We're not narcs. 444 00:26:36,526 --> 00:26:37,426 We're Feds. 445 00:26:37,626 --> 00:26:40,096 Oh, yeah, that's much better, 446 00:26:40,756 --> 00:26:42,096 sort of. 447 00:26:42,596 --> 00:26:45,386 So, this place, this Elohim City, 448 00:26:45,976 --> 00:26:49,226 you think they're building a bomb of some kind? 449 00:26:52,146 --> 00:26:53,316 Yes. 450 00:26:53,686 --> 00:26:56,366 Uh, they--there-there was a bunch of chemicals 451 00:26:56,566 --> 00:26:57,866 that could be used to build a bomb 452 00:26:58,066 --> 00:27:00,226 written down in Andy the German's notebook. 453 00:27:00,426 --> 00:27:02,036 Um, and they talk a lot 454 00:27:02,236 --> 00:27:06,076 about making the government pay for what happened at Waco. 455 00:27:06,996 --> 00:27:08,626 Have you been in contact with Wild Bill 456 00:27:08,826 --> 00:27:10,586 since he was arrested? 457 00:27:13,086 --> 00:27:14,696 No, sir. [chuckles] 458 00:27:14,896 --> 00:27:16,236 That's over. 459 00:27:16,436 --> 00:27:17,386 [Alan] Hmm. 460 00:27:17,586 --> 00:27:19,056 So if I told you that I had the phone logs 461 00:27:19,256 --> 00:27:21,386 from Arkansas State Penitentiary, 462 00:27:21,586 --> 00:27:24,596 where Wild Bill is incarcerated, 463 00:27:24,796 --> 00:27:26,636 would that change your answer? 464 00:27:33,646 --> 00:27:35,006 I might have called him a few times. 465 00:27:35,206 --> 00:27:36,696 -[Alan] How many? -Um, I don't know for sure. 466 00:27:36,896 --> 00:27:38,056 -More than five? -[Carol] Maybe. 467 00:27:38,256 --> 00:27:39,986 -More than ten? -[Carol] Maybe. 468 00:27:40,196 --> 00:27:41,976 [Alan] This Aryan Brotherhood, 469 00:27:42,176 --> 00:27:43,726 they just let you live there 470 00:27:43,926 --> 00:27:48,116 and read their notebooks with no problem. 471 00:27:48,866 --> 00:27:49,896 No. 472 00:27:50,096 --> 00:27:52,736 They almost killed me. I had to run. 473 00:27:52,936 --> 00:27:54,046 [Alan] Did anyone see this? 474 00:27:54,246 --> 00:27:58,126 -Yeah, yeah, yeah. I did. -Huh. 475 00:27:58,716 --> 00:28:00,236 You know, there's been a lot of chatter 476 00:28:00,436 --> 00:28:01,716 from groups like these, 477 00:28:01,926 --> 00:28:03,056 you know, saying things, 478 00:28:03,256 --> 00:28:06,686 like, um, they wish the FBI would dare 479 00:28:06,886 --> 00:28:08,726 try something like we did at Waco. 480 00:28:08,926 --> 00:28:10,566 Have you heard any of those people 481 00:28:10,766 --> 00:28:12,376 saying anything like that? 482 00:28:12,576 --> 00:28:14,176 I-I don't know. 483 00:28:14,366 --> 00:28:15,906 Not-not-not in those words exactly. 484 00:28:16,106 --> 00:28:18,136 [Alan] Did they ask you to tell us this? 485 00:28:18,336 --> 00:28:19,716 Why would they? I don't understand. 486 00:28:19,916 --> 00:28:22,036 [Alan] To goad us into maybe another conflict. 487 00:28:22,236 --> 00:28:25,346 You know, something they can all rally around. 488 00:28:25,546 --> 00:28:27,496 Did they ask you to tell us this? 489 00:28:27,696 --> 00:28:30,086 No, I'm telling the truth. Okay? 490 00:28:30,286 --> 00:28:34,376 Hey. Uh, could we have a moment, please? 491 00:28:35,836 --> 00:28:37,716 Come on. What, what are you doing? 492 00:28:37,916 --> 00:28:39,986 She's been through a lot for us. 493 00:28:40,186 --> 00:28:41,986 -For you. -No, for all of us. 494 00:28:42,186 --> 00:28:43,366 She's a good kid. 495 00:28:43,566 --> 00:28:45,386 If I knew you were gonna berate her like this-- 496 00:28:45,586 --> 00:28:46,476 It does not matter 497 00:28:46,676 --> 00:28:48,246 if everything she says is true 498 00:28:48,446 --> 00:28:50,316 if she can't hold it together on the stand. 499 00:28:50,516 --> 00:28:52,976 Well, I can work with her. I can get her to calm down. 500 00:28:53,176 --> 00:28:56,106 We cannot afford another Waco. 501 00:28:57,896 --> 00:28:59,696 It's over. 502 00:29:00,736 --> 00:29:02,696 I gave you your time. 503 00:29:14,326 --> 00:29:17,126 [sighs] 504 00:29:18,626 --> 00:29:20,716 They're not gonna pursue it. 505 00:29:23,546 --> 00:29:25,386 Did I screw up? 506 00:29:26,046 --> 00:29:27,556 No. 507 00:29:28,636 --> 00:29:29,976 No, he had his mind made up 508 00:29:30,176 --> 00:29:32,806 before we even walked in the room. 509 00:29:36,476 --> 00:29:38,396 You have somewhere to go? 510 00:29:39,686 --> 00:29:42,606 No, I don't. 511 00:29:47,526 --> 00:29:49,116 You know, you asked me once 512 00:29:49,316 --> 00:29:51,056 how a nice girl like me wound up 513 00:29:51,256 --> 00:29:53,686 in a place like Elohim City. 514 00:29:53,886 --> 00:29:55,086 Was easy. 515 00:29:55,286 --> 00:29:57,796 They're the only ones that wanted me. 516 00:30:00,166 --> 00:30:01,906 And, Gary, if we ever cross paths again, 517 00:30:02,106 --> 00:30:04,136 you act like you don't know me, 518 00:30:04,336 --> 00:30:06,796 safer that way, okay? 519 00:30:09,096 --> 00:30:11,266 Good luck to you, Carol. 520 00:30:16,766 --> 00:30:19,606 [sighs deeply] 521 00:30:20,646 --> 00:30:23,986 upbeat blues music playing 522 00:30:24,186 --> 00:30:26,446 [lock buzzes] 523 00:30:50,466 --> 00:30:54,186 [singer] I've spent too long 524 00:30:54,386 --> 00:30:57,896 Away from home 525 00:30:58,096 --> 00:31:01,236 Did all the things 526 00:31:01,436 --> 00:31:06,316 I could have done... 527 00:31:08,446 --> 00:31:10,406 [both laugh] 528 00:31:11,906 --> 00:31:15,146 -[Clive] Oh. -[Ruth] Oh. 529 00:31:15,346 --> 00:31:17,796 -Let me get four more. -Yeah. 530 00:31:17,996 --> 00:31:19,166 Hey, is Jocelyn working tonight? 531 00:31:19,366 --> 00:31:21,446 She, she usually works Tuesdays. 532 00:31:21,646 --> 00:31:22,876 -The waitress? -Yeah. 533 00:31:23,076 --> 00:31:24,836 She quit this morning. 534 00:31:25,546 --> 00:31:29,056 And I was gonna propose to her tonight. [chuckles] 535 00:31:29,256 --> 00:31:30,826 Yeah. She seemed cool, 536 00:31:31,026 --> 00:31:32,156 kind of came out of nowhere. 537 00:31:32,356 --> 00:31:34,346 She begged for the job a couple of months back. 538 00:31:34,546 --> 00:31:35,936 -Yeah. -Then just up and quit. 539 00:31:36,136 --> 00:31:37,666 Wait, when did you say she started working here again? 540 00:31:37,866 --> 00:31:40,356 Just after New Year's, I think. 541 00:31:40,976 --> 00:31:44,066 Like January 7th, like when we started working here? 542 00:31:44,266 --> 00:31:45,896 Could have been. 543 00:31:47,696 --> 00:31:48,926 [mutters] That son of a bitch. 544 00:31:49,126 --> 00:31:50,766 -Excuse me, Mr. Cogdell. -What? Oh, yeah. 545 00:31:50,966 --> 00:31:52,576 You have a call up front. 546 00:31:53,906 --> 00:31:55,416 Hello. 547 00:31:55,616 --> 00:31:57,536 Yeah, what's up? 548 00:31:59,206 --> 00:32:00,396 The judge did what? 549 00:32:00,596 --> 00:32:02,876 [singer] But their streets 550 00:32:03,076 --> 00:32:05,586 Did not feel 551 00:32:05,786 --> 00:32:08,756 Like mine 552 00:32:08,956 --> 00:32:10,946 So long... 553 00:32:11,146 --> 00:32:13,636 What do you say we get out of here? 554 00:32:13,836 --> 00:32:15,556 It sounds good to me. 555 00:32:16,056 --> 00:32:17,996 [singer] Goin' home... 556 00:32:18,196 --> 00:32:19,836 [sighs] 557 00:32:20,036 --> 00:32:21,556 [both sigh] 558 00:32:23,316 --> 00:32:25,986 Wait a sec. Wait a sec. 559 00:32:26,186 --> 00:32:27,156 Stop. 560 00:32:27,356 --> 00:32:28,696 -What's wrong? -What's going on? 561 00:32:28,896 --> 00:32:29,906 Need to take you back inside, 562 00:32:30,106 --> 00:32:31,946 your release has been delayed. 563 00:32:32,616 --> 00:32:34,176 Delayed? What do you-- what do you mean? 564 00:32:34,376 --> 00:32:35,866 -No, it's over. -No, they, they said 565 00:32:36,066 --> 00:32:38,016 -she was not guilty. -Hands behind your back. 566 00:32:38,216 --> 00:32:39,396 -No. -Sir, the-the judge 567 00:32:39,596 --> 00:32:41,956 -already said that she-- -No. No. 568 00:32:42,156 --> 00:32:43,436 No, no, but I'm free. 569 00:32:43,636 --> 00:32:45,756 -You can't do this. I'm free. -Let's go. 570 00:32:45,956 --> 00:32:47,176 -I'm free! -We'll figure it out, Ruth, 571 00:32:47,376 --> 00:32:49,696 -it's-- -I'm free. 572 00:32:49,896 --> 00:32:51,656 No. 573 00:32:51,856 --> 00:32:55,406 [grunting] I'm free! 574 00:32:55,606 --> 00:32:57,166 I'm free! 575 00:32:57,366 --> 00:32:58,436 I'm free! 576 00:32:58,636 --> 00:33:00,126 [Judge Smith] I have had some time to reflect 577 00:33:00,326 --> 00:33:03,526 and I believe now I was too hasty 578 00:33:03,726 --> 00:33:06,216 in my initial decision to vacate the convictions 579 00:33:06,416 --> 00:33:07,636 on the weapons charges. 580 00:33:07,826 --> 00:33:11,076 Thus, I am reinstating them now and we'll move on 581 00:33:11,276 --> 00:33:12,446 -to sentencing. -What? 582 00:33:12,646 --> 00:33:14,196 Your Honor, this seems wildly outside of the-- 583 00:33:14,396 --> 00:33:17,096 Please don't interrupt me, Mr. Cogdell. 584 00:33:17,296 --> 00:33:19,896 But you're finding them guilty of a--of a non-existent crime, 585 00:33:20,096 --> 00:33:22,106 of a crime that you yourself were willing to vacate. 586 00:33:22,306 --> 00:33:24,506 There is no reason to set aside these guilty findings merely 587 00:33:24,706 --> 00:33:27,656 because the verdicts cannot be rationally reconciled. 588 00:33:27,846 --> 00:33:28,906 I'm sorry, are you serious? 589 00:33:29,106 --> 00:33:30,236 You're supporting a decision 590 00:33:30,436 --> 00:33:31,866 that you're admitting is irrational? 591 00:33:32,066 --> 00:33:33,156 If they were found guilty 592 00:33:33,356 --> 00:33:35,056 of using a weapon in the commission of a crime 593 00:33:35,256 --> 00:33:36,346 then by that verdict, 594 00:33:36,546 --> 00:33:39,036 they must also be guilty of the crime 595 00:33:39,236 --> 00:33:40,626 the weapon was used in. 596 00:33:40,826 --> 00:33:44,346 But they were found not guilty of that crime. 597 00:33:44,896 --> 00:33:46,856 I have made my decision. Take a seat. 598 00:33:47,056 --> 00:33:48,146 But that doesn't make any sense. 599 00:33:48,346 --> 00:33:49,926 [Judge Smith] I said I am ready 600 00:33:50,126 --> 00:33:52,146 to move on to sentencing. 601 00:34:03,456 --> 00:34:04,896 The only person 602 00:34:05,096 --> 00:34:06,506 to show any contrition was Ruth Riddle, 603 00:34:06,706 --> 00:34:08,876 and as someone who was clearly manipulated 604 00:34:09,076 --> 00:34:09,986 by Mr. Koresh, 605 00:34:10,186 --> 00:34:11,986 you're not entirely to blame 606 00:34:12,186 --> 00:34:13,026 for your actions. 607 00:34:13,226 --> 00:34:15,806 Therefore, I am ordering you 608 00:34:16,006 --> 00:34:17,116 to be committed to the custody 609 00:34:17,316 --> 00:34:18,516 of the US Bureau of Prisons 610 00:34:18,716 --> 00:34:20,976 -for a term of five years. -[people murmuring] 611 00:34:21,176 --> 00:34:23,126 -Five years? -[Judge Smith] Paul Fatta. 612 00:34:23,326 --> 00:34:25,876 I'm ordering you committed to the custody 613 00:34:26,076 --> 00:34:27,086 of the US Bureau of Prisons 614 00:34:27,286 --> 00:34:28,526 for a term of 15 years. 615 00:34:28,726 --> 00:34:30,356 -But I wasn't even there! -[Judge Smith] Quiet. 616 00:34:30,556 --> 00:34:32,466 -I-I wasn't even there! -[Judge Smith] Quiet! 617 00:34:32,666 --> 00:34:36,056 Livingstone Fagan, 40 years. 618 00:34:36,256 --> 00:34:38,016 -Forty? What? -[Dan] Your Honor, 619 00:34:38,216 --> 00:34:40,766 there's no way this outcome was the jury's intention. 620 00:34:40,966 --> 00:34:42,856 They made their intention clear with their verdict. 621 00:34:43,046 --> 00:34:44,496 [Dan] You know what? This isn't justice. 622 00:34:44,696 --> 00:34:47,416 This is the government demanding their pound of flesh. 623 00:34:47,616 --> 00:34:50,146 They, they can't stand to let our clients walk away 624 00:34:50,346 --> 00:34:52,106 and they're getting you to do their dirty work. 625 00:34:52,306 --> 00:34:54,546 Another word and I will fine you a thousand dollars, Mr. Cogdell. 626 00:34:54,746 --> 00:34:56,236 I'm already broke. You can't get blood 627 00:34:56,436 --> 00:34:57,846 -from a stone. -[Judge Smith] Don't be so sure. 628 00:34:58,046 --> 00:34:59,016 That just cost you a thousand dollars. 629 00:34:59,216 --> 00:35:00,456 [Dan] People will remember this. 630 00:35:00,656 --> 00:35:02,206 This will be the first line on your obituary someday. 631 00:35:02,406 --> 00:35:03,536 Don't you wanna be on the right side of this? 632 00:35:03,736 --> 00:35:05,536 Another grand. The next time you speak, 633 00:35:05,736 --> 00:35:07,956 I will ask the bailiff to remove you 634 00:35:08,156 --> 00:35:09,816 from the courtroom. 635 00:35:10,816 --> 00:35:12,196 Okay, okay. 636 00:35:12,396 --> 00:35:14,436 All right. Okay. 637 00:35:15,196 --> 00:35:18,346 [Judge Smith] Furthermore, Paul Fatta, Livingstone Fagan, 638 00:35:18,546 --> 00:35:21,036 and Ruth Riddle, upon your release, 639 00:35:21,236 --> 00:35:23,456 you must pay the US government restitution 640 00:35:23,656 --> 00:35:26,126 in the amount of $1,131,687... 641 00:35:26,326 --> 00:35:27,976 Oh, that is bullshit. 642 00:35:28,176 --> 00:35:30,006 The people decided this was wrong 643 00:35:30,206 --> 00:35:32,046 that what the government did was wrong. 644 00:35:32,246 --> 00:35:34,656 If you answer that judgment by steamrolling them, 645 00:35:34,856 --> 00:35:36,506 you're just asking to have this happen again! 646 00:35:36,706 --> 00:35:39,216 -I am applying the law. -The law is supposed to be fair! 647 00:35:39,416 --> 00:35:41,306 I decide what is fair! 648 00:35:41,506 --> 00:35:44,076 It is not my job to cater to the moral fringe-- 649 00:35:44,276 --> 00:35:45,496 It's not your job 650 00:35:45,696 --> 00:35:47,226 -to subvert the will of society! -[Judge Smith] Bailiff, please 651 00:35:47,426 --> 00:35:48,606 take Mr. Cogdell out of my courtroom. 652 00:35:48,806 --> 00:35:50,836 Who got to you? We need to be asking questions 653 00:35:51,036 --> 00:35:52,046 about how this had to go. 654 00:35:52,246 --> 00:35:53,486 We need to question the government... 655 00:35:53,686 --> 00:35:55,356 -Order! Order! -...and the people that made 656 00:35:55,556 --> 00:35:57,256 the decisions that led to this tragedy. 657 00:35:57,456 --> 00:35:59,386 Who got to you? Who got to you? 658 00:35:59,586 --> 00:36:03,026 dramatic music plays 659 00:36:07,866 --> 00:36:09,266 Ladies and gentlemen, 660 00:36:09,466 --> 00:36:11,046 my decision is made and my decision is final. 661 00:36:11,246 --> 00:36:13,796 -[gavel bangs] -[Judge Smith] Court adjourned. 662 00:36:19,466 --> 00:36:21,676 [Bill] Hell of a case, wasn't it? 663 00:36:25,216 --> 00:36:26,536 Are you here to rub it in? 664 00:36:26,736 --> 00:36:29,266 Because I'm happy to add an assault charge to this. 665 00:36:29,466 --> 00:36:32,186 No. No, I'm not here for that. 666 00:36:33,106 --> 00:36:35,106 You were a worthy opponent. 667 00:36:35,436 --> 00:36:38,296 Well, that's a nice consolation, 668 00:36:38,496 --> 00:36:40,466 seeing as the wheels of justice 669 00:36:40,666 --> 00:36:43,326 just ran right over my clients. 670 00:36:44,656 --> 00:36:47,266 Everything I did was above board. 671 00:36:47,466 --> 00:36:49,866 Oh, really? Even Jocelyn? 672 00:36:50,416 --> 00:36:53,026 -Who? -The pretty waitress at the bar. 673 00:36:53,226 --> 00:36:54,626 Don't tell me she wasn't a spy. 674 00:36:54,826 --> 00:36:57,106 Well, I honestly don't know what you're talking about. 675 00:36:57,306 --> 00:36:58,966 But if she was, she wasn't with us. 676 00:36:59,166 --> 00:37:01,176 Man, what do you want? 677 00:37:04,176 --> 00:37:07,416 I'd like to prosecute the ATF for perjury. 678 00:37:07,616 --> 00:37:09,836 And I could use someone from outside the system 679 00:37:10,026 --> 00:37:11,226 to help me. 680 00:37:13,686 --> 00:37:16,936 I might be able to make a little time for that. 681 00:38:00,356 --> 00:38:02,776 [birds chirping] 682 00:38:03,446 --> 00:38:04,886 [David] You might think that what you see here 683 00:38:05,086 --> 00:38:09,306 is a rundown old shell of what this place used to be. 684 00:38:09,506 --> 00:38:12,036 But your eyes lie to you. 685 00:38:12,236 --> 00:38:14,746 I alone see the truth. 686 00:38:15,746 --> 00:38:18,506 This land right here under your feet, 687 00:38:18,706 --> 00:38:21,046 it's not land at all. 688 00:38:21,246 --> 00:38:22,756 It's a doorway 689 00:38:22,956 --> 00:38:25,966 through which we will change the whole world. 690 00:38:26,636 --> 00:38:29,596 When I look around at these old broken buildings, 691 00:38:29,796 --> 00:38:32,056 I see the building blocks of one giant house 692 00:38:32,256 --> 00:38:34,806 that we will build right here together. 693 00:38:35,556 --> 00:38:39,936 One giant house that we will all live in together as one. 694 00:38:41,146 --> 00:38:43,986 You believe it, don't you? 695 00:38:47,196 --> 00:38:49,346 You believe it still. 696 00:38:49,546 --> 00:38:51,016 Don't you, Clive? 697 00:38:51,216 --> 00:38:54,456 dramatic music plays 698 00:38:56,456 --> 00:38:57,996 Yes... 699 00:38:59,456 --> 00:39:00,956 I do. 700 00:39:11,466 --> 00:39:15,266 So now the FBI's sending agents to spy on us as we mourn? 701 00:39:15,466 --> 00:39:18,106 No. I'm not here for the FBI. 702 00:39:18,306 --> 00:39:20,016 I'm here for me. 703 00:39:20,566 --> 00:39:22,896 I care about what happened to you. 704 00:39:24,356 --> 00:39:26,816 That's why I'm here today. 705 00:39:32,656 --> 00:39:36,496 Maybe you could say some words to that effect. 706 00:39:39,376 --> 00:39:40,876 Okay. 707 00:39:41,796 --> 00:39:46,376 I was the lead negotiator here at Waco. 708 00:39:47,376 --> 00:39:50,386 Sometimes I feel like I never left. 709 00:39:52,426 --> 00:39:53,866 This place, 710 00:39:54,066 --> 00:39:55,926 these events... 711 00:39:56,636 --> 00:39:58,476 will stay with me forever. 712 00:39:59,016 --> 00:40:01,356 Now, I know there may be some of you here today 713 00:40:01,556 --> 00:40:04,426 and there's others that believe that the FBI came here 714 00:40:04,626 --> 00:40:09,906 and just wanted to purposely see everybody get killed. 715 00:40:11,116 --> 00:40:13,196 We didn't want that. 716 00:40:14,906 --> 00:40:17,866 None of us wanted that. 717 00:40:21,836 --> 00:40:25,296 So if we didn't want it to turn out this way, 718 00:40:25,496 --> 00:40:27,066 and neither did you, 719 00:40:27,266 --> 00:40:29,656 then how could it, 720 00:40:29,856 --> 00:40:32,046 when nobody wanted it? 721 00:40:32,676 --> 00:40:34,746 A religious friend of mine proposed once 722 00:40:34,946 --> 00:40:38,106 that maybe it was evil that made it happen. 723 00:40:38,306 --> 00:40:40,626 And I suppose he was right, 724 00:40:40,826 --> 00:40:44,316 but not necessarily in the way he meant, 725 00:40:44,976 --> 00:40:49,546 because I believe that the whole idea of evil, 726 00:40:49,746 --> 00:40:53,406 it keeps us from seeing a thing clearly. 727 00:40:54,446 --> 00:40:55,846 It blinds us, 728 00:40:56,046 --> 00:41:00,496 because the evil is never on our side. 729 00:41:00,996 --> 00:41:03,166 It's always the other guys. 730 00:41:07,956 --> 00:41:10,656 I think what's closer to the truth 731 00:41:10,856 --> 00:41:13,296 is that we were scared, 732 00:41:14,256 --> 00:41:16,176 and you were scared. 733 00:41:17,346 --> 00:41:20,086 And then we called you evil 734 00:41:20,276 --> 00:41:21,396 and you called us evil, 735 00:41:21,596 --> 00:41:24,606 and then we both stopped seeing each other 736 00:41:24,806 --> 00:41:26,976 and communicating. 737 00:41:28,816 --> 00:41:31,606 And that's when the tragedy came. 738 00:41:33,526 --> 00:41:35,886 And now, it keeps me awake at night 739 00:41:36,086 --> 00:41:38,786 worrying that if we cannot find a better way 740 00:41:38,986 --> 00:41:41,266 to remember that, that even though 741 00:41:41,466 --> 00:41:43,286 we might disagree 742 00:41:43,826 --> 00:41:47,496 or be on opposite sides of a thing, 743 00:41:48,876 --> 00:41:51,836 we are all fallible people. 744 00:41:52,756 --> 00:41:56,466 I make mistakes and so do you. 745 00:41:58,216 --> 00:42:02,626 We're more the same than we are different. 746 00:42:02,826 --> 00:42:05,856 A great divide opened here among us 747 00:42:06,056 --> 00:42:09,526 and I'm here today to push against that divide. 748 00:42:10,316 --> 00:42:11,566 And I hope... 749 00:42:12,356 --> 00:42:16,196 that each and every one of you can help me in that effort... 750 00:42:18,866 --> 00:42:21,496 or I don't know what will happen. 751 00:42:28,036 --> 00:42:29,906 [guard] Your last meal request. 752 00:42:30,096 --> 00:42:32,216 Any particular channel? 753 00:42:34,256 --> 00:42:35,506 Yeah. 754 00:42:36,716 --> 00:42:38,216 The news. 755 00:42:41,976 --> 00:42:44,836 Miami Beach police are looking for a man in his 20s. 756 00:42:45,036 --> 00:42:47,706 The shooting took place in front of several witnesses. 757 00:42:47,906 --> 00:42:49,966 [Clive] Please join us for a moment of silence, 758 00:42:50,166 --> 00:42:52,466 as we toll the bell one time 759 00:42:52,666 --> 00:42:55,026 for each life that was lost. 760 00:43:01,326 --> 00:43:04,576 [bell tolling] 761 00:43:10,626 --> 00:43:14,126 suspenseful music plays 762 00:43:38,446 --> 00:43:40,276 [grunts] 763 00:43:44,946 --> 00:43:46,286 [sighs] 764 00:43:46,956 --> 00:43:49,246 [police siren chirps] 765 00:43:52,456 --> 00:43:53,626 [grunts] 766 00:43:54,456 --> 00:43:56,466 [panicked breathing] 767 00:44:25,906 --> 00:44:29,456 [kids singing indistinctly] 768 00:44:56,026 --> 00:44:59,066 [explosion roars] 769 00:45:01,486 --> 00:45:02,716 [explosion rumbles] 770 00:45:02,916 --> 00:45:06,326 [car alarm beeping] 771 00:45:10,206 --> 00:45:13,706 [dog barking in distance] 772 00:45:15,496 --> 00:45:18,836 suspenseful music plays 773 00:45:24,296 --> 00:45:30,096 -[people screaming] -[car horns honking] 774 00:45:36,896 --> 00:45:39,756 [people screaming] 775 00:45:39,956 --> 00:45:43,196 [sirens approaching] 776 00:46:26,776 --> 00:46:30,236 dramatic music plays 777 00:46:48,006 --> 00:46:51,426 778 00:46:53,726 --> 00:46:56,436 [applause] 779 00:47:00,526 --> 00:47:03,686 [cheering, whistling] 780 00:47:06,156 --> 00:47:09,616 781 00:47:24,086 --> 00:47:28,336 782 00:47:51,276 --> 00:47:54,246 [President Clinton on radio] The bombing in Oklahoma City 783 00:47:54,446 --> 00:47:57,516 was an attack on innocent children 784 00:47:57,716 --> 00:47:59,706 and defenseless citizens. 785 00:48:00,246 --> 00:48:05,296 It was an act of cowardice, and it was evil. 786 00:48:05,876 --> 00:48:08,806 The United States will not tolerate it, 787 00:48:09,006 --> 00:48:11,956 and I will not allow the people of this country 788 00:48:12,146 --> 00:48:15,746 to be intimidated by evil cowards. 789 00:48:15,946 --> 00:48:18,036 I have met with our team 790 00:48:18,236 --> 00:48:21,026 which we assembled to deal with this bombing, 791 00:48:21,226 --> 00:48:23,816 and I have determined to take the following steps 792 00:48:24,016 --> 00:48:27,046 to ensure the strongest response to this situation. 793 00:48:27,246 --> 00:48:29,426 First, I have deployed a crisis-management team 794 00:48:29,626 --> 00:48:32,246 under the leadership of the FBI, 795 00:48:32,446 --> 00:48:35,866 working with the Department of Justice... 796 00:48:37,156 --> 00:48:40,576 797 00:48:48,796 --> 00:48:51,966 798 00:49:21,206 --> 00:49:24,626 799 00:50:38,076 --> 00:50:41,576 theme music plays 800 00:51:18,906 --> 00:51:25,156 [man] MTV