1 00:00:07,675 --> 00:00:09,375 Guerrero: In the early 2000s, 2 00:00:09,477 --> 00:00:10,976 "girls next door" was one 3 00:00:11,078 --> 00:00:13,912 of the most popular reality shows on tv. 4 00:00:14,015 --> 00:00:17,016 We all fell in love with those blonde girls next door, 5 00:00:17,118 --> 00:00:19,251 and we also fell in love with hugh hefner. 6 00:00:19,353 --> 00:00:22,388 That world seemed fun and innocent, 7 00:00:22,490 --> 00:00:24,990 and the girls were pretty fun to watch. 8 00:00:25,092 --> 00:00:27,593 In the final season of the show, two twins, 9 00:00:27,695 --> 00:00:31,530 karissa and kristina shannon, played two of hef's girlfriends. 10 00:00:31,632 --> 00:00:34,299 -Hi. I'm kristina. -I'm karissa. 11 00:00:34,402 --> 00:00:35,901 After the "secrets of playboy," 12 00:00:36,003 --> 00:00:37,669 they decided to finally come forward 13 00:00:37,772 --> 00:00:40,139 and share their story. 14 00:00:40,241 --> 00:00:42,107 And we're about to hear a side of their story 15 00:00:42,209 --> 00:00:45,044 that they have never told until today. 16 00:00:45,146 --> 00:00:48,280 It's like you're in a cult. The isolation that I had-- 17 00:00:48,382 --> 00:00:49,748 I was a shell of a person. 18 00:00:49,850 --> 00:00:52,051 Hef doesn't like to use protection. 19 00:00:52,153 --> 00:00:54,119 There was at one point an std that went around. 20 00:00:54,221 --> 00:00:56,922 I got a call saying, like, "hey, you're pregnant." 21 00:00:57,024 --> 00:00:58,524 I didn't want any part of it. 22 00:00:58,626 --> 00:01:01,660 He's just a creepy old man 23 00:01:01,762 --> 00:01:03,462 with power. 24 00:01:03,564 --> 00:01:07,766 ♪♪♪ 25 00:01:08,936 --> 00:01:13,205 ♪♪♪ 26 00:01:13,307 --> 00:01:16,475 you know, I've been fascinated 27 00:01:16,577 --> 00:01:19,078 with, uh, your stories, because although 28 00:01:19,180 --> 00:01:21,513 I'm a chief investigative correspondent 29 00:01:21,615 --> 00:01:22,648 on "inside edition"... 30 00:01:22,750 --> 00:01:24,416 Why would you try to take advantage 31 00:01:24,518 --> 00:01:26,585 of young women like this? 32 00:01:26,687 --> 00:01:29,021 ...When I was 20 and 21, I used to be a "playboy" model. 33 00:01:29,123 --> 00:01:30,989 I shot for "playboy" lingerie, 34 00:01:31,092 --> 00:01:32,758 and then eventually I did a cover... 35 00:01:32,860 --> 00:01:34,560 -Oh, wow. I didn't... -...In 2006. 36 00:01:34,662 --> 00:01:37,496 And there are so many questions I wanna ask you. 37 00:01:37,598 --> 00:01:40,766 I think the best way to do this is to just talk about 38 00:01:40,868 --> 00:01:42,367 how you got there to begin with 39 00:01:42,470 --> 00:01:44,036 and a little bit about your background. 40 00:01:44,138 --> 00:01:46,105 Tell me about your childhood and--and how you grew up 41 00:01:46,207 --> 00:01:47,773 and where you grew up. 42 00:01:47,875 --> 00:01:49,374 We were three months premature. 43 00:01:49,477 --> 00:01:51,376 We were born in ann arbor, michigan. 44 00:01:51,479 --> 00:01:54,913 Our biological mom was never involved in our lives. 45 00:01:55,015 --> 00:01:56,515 We didn't even get to really know our father. 46 00:01:56,617 --> 00:01:59,384 -He was very abusive. -We always think to ourselves 47 00:01:59,487 --> 00:02:02,087 we were born into this life together because we knew 48 00:02:02,189 --> 00:02:04,356 we were gonna need each other. -We were gonna... 49 00:02:04,458 --> 00:02:08,727 That's so sweet, and that's, um, that's really sad. 50 00:02:08,829 --> 00:02:11,230 Our father's side is the one who raised us, 51 00:02:11,332 --> 00:02:13,465 so when we refer to "mom," that's--it's our grandma. 52 00:02:13,567 --> 00:02:15,067 -Your grandma. -Annette. 53 00:02:15,169 --> 00:02:17,703 Yeah, our grandma. But she's "mom" to us. 54 00:02:17,805 --> 00:02:19,037 And where did you grow up? 55 00:02:19,140 --> 00:02:21,306 We moved to clearwater beach, florida, 56 00:02:21,408 --> 00:02:23,408 with our grandmother. 57 00:02:23,511 --> 00:02:26,678 She was really, like, our stability, our foundation. 58 00:02:26,780 --> 00:02:29,581 When my grandfather passed away of cancer, 59 00:02:29,683 --> 00:02:31,750 he had left her under a mountain of debt, 60 00:02:31,852 --> 00:02:34,186 so we ended up having to move off of clearwater beach 61 00:02:34,288 --> 00:02:36,155 and into a trailer park in florida. 62 00:02:36,257 --> 00:02:38,423 -For four years. -For four years. 63 00:02:38,526 --> 00:02:41,326 Basically, school wasn't an option for us. 64 00:02:41,428 --> 00:02:42,961 We had to drop out and get jobs. 65 00:02:43,063 --> 00:02:45,097 We worked at winghouse as waitresses, 66 00:02:45,199 --> 00:02:46,498 which is the same exact outfit like hooters. 67 00:02:46,600 --> 00:02:48,667 You have a dolphin short. 68 00:02:48,769 --> 00:02:50,469 And we always wanted to be models, 69 00:02:50,571 --> 00:02:53,739 so this was like the beginning of our modeling career, 70 00:02:53,841 --> 00:02:55,040 is being able to be like winghouse girls, 71 00:02:55,142 --> 00:02:58,944 doing commercials, menus, billboards. 72 00:02:59,046 --> 00:03:00,412 Wings, beer, and atmosphere. 73 00:03:00,514 --> 00:03:02,381 Both: And yes, we're identical twins. 74 00:03:02,483 --> 00:03:04,650 All: Need we say more? 75 00:03:04,752 --> 00:03:06,919 How old were you when you first started working for winghouse? 76 00:03:07,021 --> 00:03:08,554 Both: 15. 77 00:03:08,656 --> 00:03:10,522 And you kind of considered this glamorous. 78 00:03:10,624 --> 00:03:11,823 -Yeah. -Yeah. 79 00:03:11,926 --> 00:03:13,425 So we were like, "this could be our chance." 80 00:03:13,527 --> 00:03:14,927 yeah. 81 00:03:15,029 --> 00:03:17,196 At what point did you start watching "girls next door"? 82 00:03:17,298 --> 00:03:18,497 -15, 16. -So I think that's when 83 00:03:18,599 --> 00:03:20,933 we were hostessing. We were fans of the show. 84 00:03:21,035 --> 00:03:22,201 We were very much fans, yeah. 85 00:03:22,303 --> 00:03:24,369 And we loved kendra and most identified with her. 86 00:03:24,471 --> 00:03:26,104 'cause she was the younger one. She liked rap. 87 00:03:26,207 --> 00:03:28,440 She was more like hip-hop like us. 88 00:03:28,542 --> 00:03:29,908 We liked rap music. 89 00:03:30,010 --> 00:03:33,478 This is interesting because the fan base was young women. 90 00:03:33,581 --> 00:03:34,780 We knew there would be some interest 91 00:03:34,882 --> 00:03:36,081 because it was the playboy mansion. 92 00:03:36,183 --> 00:03:38,517 What I did not anticipate was how 93 00:03:38,619 --> 00:03:40,152 hugely popular it would become, and particularly, 94 00:03:40,254 --> 00:03:41,920 how hugely popular with young women. 95 00:03:42,022 --> 00:03:44,389 We wanted to have their boobs. We wanted to, like, 96 00:03:44,491 --> 00:03:45,691 we were dirty blonde naturally. 97 00:03:45,793 --> 00:03:47,159 We wanted to have platinum blonde hair. 98 00:03:47,261 --> 00:03:48,460 So the playboy mansion-- 99 00:03:48,562 --> 00:03:50,095 I'm, like, it just looks like heaven. 100 00:03:50,197 --> 00:03:53,832 It's like you're royalty there, and hef looks so nice. 101 00:03:53,934 --> 00:03:57,236 You viewed the mansion as an adult disneyland. 102 00:03:57,338 --> 00:03:58,904 -Yes, exactly. -Yeah. 103 00:03:59,006 --> 00:04:00,505 Did you ever think that you 104 00:04:00,608 --> 00:04:03,442 would end up on "girls next door"? 105 00:04:03,544 --> 00:04:04,910 No, not at all. 106 00:04:05,012 --> 00:04:06,545 We just wanted to be models, but, um, 107 00:04:06,647 --> 00:04:08,680 when we were watching "the girls next door," 108 00:04:08,782 --> 00:04:10,282 and we were modeling for winghouse, 109 00:04:10,384 --> 00:04:11,783 the photographer's, like, 110 00:04:11,885 --> 00:04:14,386 "hey, I know how to get girls into 'playboy.'" 111 00:04:14,488 --> 00:04:15,988 "and, like, do a photo shoot and submit your photos." 112 00:04:16,090 --> 00:04:18,290 "and do a photo shoot and submit your photos." 113 00:04:18,392 --> 00:04:19,391 -how old were you? -Both: 17. 114 00:04:19,493 --> 00:04:21,026 -17. -Both: Mm-hmm. 115 00:04:21,128 --> 00:04:22,628 So you're underage. 116 00:04:22,730 --> 00:04:23,829 -Underage, yeah. -Mm-hmm. 117 00:04:23,931 --> 00:04:25,631 Asked if you would be willing 118 00:04:25,733 --> 00:04:27,432 to take nude pictures to send to "playboy." 119 00:04:27,534 --> 00:04:28,367 -yeah. Yeah. -Correct. 120 00:04:28,469 --> 00:04:29,835 Now do you remember 121 00:04:29,937 --> 00:04:34,072 the first time that you posed for "playboy"? 122 00:04:34,174 --> 00:04:35,874 We were flown out to miami for a test shoot. 123 00:04:35,976 --> 00:04:39,111 -We had just turned 18. -Mm-hmm. 124 00:04:39,213 --> 00:04:40,579 And, um, it was tasteful. 125 00:04:40,681 --> 00:04:42,381 That was al the first time that I looked at a, 126 00:04:42,483 --> 00:04:45,617 you know, a monitor and seen we're actually beautiful. 127 00:04:45,719 --> 00:04:46,952 -I've never had, you know... -Hair and makeup done. 128 00:04:47,054 --> 00:04:48,887 ...Professional hair and makeup and all that. 129 00:04:48,989 --> 00:04:51,957 And it's like, oh, my gosh. We are gorgeous. 130 00:04:52,059 --> 00:04:55,761 What happens next? How do you actually get out to the mansion? 131 00:04:55,863 --> 00:04:57,996 Halfway through the test shoot in miami, 132 00:04:58,098 --> 00:04:59,665 they were sending the photos over, 133 00:04:59,767 --> 00:05:00,799 and all of a sudden, we see 134 00:05:00,901 --> 00:05:02,601 the photographer talking really fast 135 00:05:02,703 --> 00:05:04,403 to someone on the phone. 136 00:05:04,505 --> 00:05:05,871 Then all of a sudden, they just quit, and they're like, 137 00:05:05,973 --> 00:05:08,473 "hefner likes them. He wants 'em there." 138 00:05:08,575 --> 00:05:09,574 and we were like... [gasps] 139 00:05:09,677 --> 00:05:11,543 "oh, my god. So we're playmates? Did we make it?" 140 00:05:11,645 --> 00:05:13,211 and they're like, "oh, yeah, you made it." 141 00:05:13,314 --> 00:05:15,314 -oh, my gosh. Hef loves them. -They said hef loved the photos. 142 00:05:15,416 --> 00:05:17,382 They said holly loved the photos. 143 00:05:17,484 --> 00:05:18,383 That must have been an amazing feeling. 144 00:05:18,485 --> 00:05:20,352 -It was. -It really was. 145 00:05:20,454 --> 00:05:22,587 They ended up reaching out to us. 146 00:05:22,690 --> 00:05:24,089 Holly called, actually, 147 00:05:24,191 --> 00:05:26,224 and she said, "oh, you made 'playboy' playmate," 148 00:05:26,327 --> 00:05:28,794 and they wanted us to fly out to california to shoot 149 00:05:28,896 --> 00:05:30,762 55th anniversary on the tv show. 150 00:05:30,864 --> 00:05:32,064 And we... [laughs] so we quit our job. 151 00:05:32,166 --> 00:05:33,398 We quit winghouse, 152 00:05:33,500 --> 00:05:34,666 put together two luggage bags, 153 00:05:34,768 --> 00:05:36,601 and we're just getting ready to go to california. 154 00:05:36,704 --> 00:05:39,071 And then on top of it, you're going to the playboy mansion, 155 00:05:39,173 --> 00:05:42,674 and you're gonna be shooting a tv show, 156 00:05:42,776 --> 00:05:45,444 and you're gonna be part of the 55th anniversary search. 157 00:05:45,546 --> 00:05:46,912 It was a big deal. 158 00:05:47,014 --> 00:05:49,181 We had the hef 1 limo pick us up... 159 00:05:49,283 --> 00:05:51,316 -They miked us. -...From the airport. 160 00:05:51,418 --> 00:05:52,718 -Miked us right away. -Yeah. 161 00:05:52,820 --> 00:05:54,386 So when we first drove up 162 00:05:54,488 --> 00:05:56,788 and saw the mansion gates opening, 163 00:05:56,890 --> 00:05:59,291 this is what we saw on tv. ♪ come on-a my house ♪ 164 00:05:59,393 --> 00:06:01,093 both: ♪ my house ♪ 165 00:06:01,195 --> 00:06:02,828 driving up, it was like you're in tv land. 166 00:06:02,930 --> 00:06:04,463 It just didn't seem real. 167 00:06:04,565 --> 00:06:05,764 It's like "willy wonka and the chocolate factory." 168 00:06:05,866 --> 00:06:06,932 you're like, oh, my god. I'm here. 169 00:06:07,034 --> 00:06:08,734 Or you're like, the golden ticket. 170 00:06:08,836 --> 00:06:09,868 You know what I mean? Like, oh, my god. 171 00:06:09,970 --> 00:06:11,336 I got the golden ticket. 172 00:06:11,438 --> 00:06:13,171 And we're just driving up to shoot our centerfold, 173 00:06:13,273 --> 00:06:15,540 and then they, like, stopped at the security gate, 174 00:06:15,642 --> 00:06:17,042 and they were like, 175 00:06:17,144 --> 00:06:18,343 "okay, we're gonna film you guys getting out," 176 00:06:18,445 --> 00:06:19,478 and they just started directing you right away, 177 00:06:19,580 --> 00:06:20,946 and we just signed a release form. 178 00:06:21,048 --> 00:06:23,215 They're like, "you guys are gonna sign this release form." 179 00:06:23,317 --> 00:06:24,716 did you read it before you signed it? 180 00:06:24,818 --> 00:06:26,151 No. 181 00:06:26,253 --> 00:06:27,452 Never read a contract in our life. 182 00:06:27,554 --> 00:06:28,920 -Didn't know what we were doing. -We just--we were 18. 183 00:06:29,022 --> 00:06:30,722 Once you're there and you're seeing, like, 184 00:06:30,824 --> 00:06:32,691 it's like don't meet your hero behind the curtain or whatever, 185 00:06:32,793 --> 00:06:35,093 that's, like, totally what it was. 186 00:06:35,195 --> 00:06:37,229 It just started becoming a job right away. 187 00:06:37,331 --> 00:06:38,663 I remember seeing holly for the first time, 188 00:06:38,766 --> 00:06:42,601 and it was a completely different person. 189 00:06:42,703 --> 00:06:43,935 What do you mean? 190 00:06:44,037 --> 00:06:45,203 Like, before the cameraman would get her walking 191 00:06:45,305 --> 00:06:46,838 into the house, she'd just be like, you know, 192 00:06:46,940 --> 00:06:48,473 sitting there, you know, fixing her lipstick or whatever. 193 00:06:48,575 --> 00:06:49,775 Drinking. 194 00:06:49,877 --> 00:06:51,910 -Wouldn't even talk to you. -You know? 195 00:06:52,012 --> 00:06:53,044 And then when the cameras would go up, 196 00:06:53,147 --> 00:06:55,013 she's just back into character again. 197 00:06:55,115 --> 00:06:56,615 All of it was for sure fake. 198 00:06:56,717 --> 00:07:00,685 And that's one thing that hef was a genius at--was his image. 199 00:07:00,788 --> 00:07:02,621 -You thought it was fake. -Mm-hmm. 200 00:07:02,723 --> 00:07:04,556 You didn't think that he was really sleeping 201 00:07:04,658 --> 00:07:06,691 with these young girls. 202 00:07:06,794 --> 00:07:08,059 Hell, no. You don't think an 80-year-old man 203 00:07:08,162 --> 00:07:10,462 is sleeping with three of these women. 204 00:07:10,564 --> 00:07:11,463 Did it, uh, occur to you at some point 205 00:07:11,565 --> 00:07:14,065 that the girls had boyfriends? 206 00:07:14,168 --> 00:07:16,168 I actually thought that holly, 207 00:07:16,270 --> 00:07:17,769 since she was the main girlfriend, 208 00:07:17,871 --> 00:07:20,539 I thought that she, you know, was really trying to marry hef. 209 00:07:20,641 --> 00:07:24,976 For bridget, I kinda feel like she was just holly's sidekick, 210 00:07:25,078 --> 00:07:26,445 but with kendra, you could totally tell that 211 00:07:26,547 --> 00:07:29,214 she had dated on the side. 212 00:07:29,316 --> 00:07:33,418 Was it starting to occur to you that these three women 213 00:07:33,520 --> 00:07:35,086 were on their way out the door, 214 00:07:35,189 --> 00:07:38,123 and they were gonna be looking for new girlfriends? 215 00:07:38,225 --> 00:07:39,958 We didn't think they were leaving at all. 216 00:07:40,060 --> 00:07:42,527 Okay, so then from there, you go home. 217 00:07:42,629 --> 00:07:43,829 And then what happened? 218 00:07:43,931 --> 00:07:46,832 Yeah, so hef wrote a letter, old school, 219 00:07:46,934 --> 00:07:49,568 and he said, "I would love for you guys to be my girlfriends 220 00:07:49,670 --> 00:07:53,004 and to move in with me 221 00:07:53,106 --> 00:07:55,407 and film 'the girls next door' show." 222 00:07:55,509 --> 00:07:57,509 so when we got the letter, we were like, 223 00:07:57,611 --> 00:07:59,177 of course, we're gonna go. 224 00:07:59,279 --> 00:08:01,780 You knew what it meant to have a boyfriend... 225 00:08:01,882 --> 00:08:02,948 -Mm-hmm. -...Which is, at your age now, 226 00:08:03,050 --> 00:08:04,082 a sexual relationship. 227 00:08:04,184 --> 00:08:05,217 -Mm-hmm. -Right. 228 00:08:05,319 --> 00:08:08,153 Did you view the words in that letter 229 00:08:08,255 --> 00:08:09,287 as something sexual? -No. [laughs] 230 00:08:09,389 --> 00:08:10,922 no. No, no, no. Not at all. [laughs] 231 00:08:11,024 --> 00:08:12,991 when he said--when he said to move in and be girlfriends 232 00:08:13,093 --> 00:08:14,326 and live at the mansion... 233 00:08:14,428 --> 00:08:15,794 We were girlfriends on the show. 234 00:08:15,896 --> 00:08:18,096 ...We thought, okay, come be part of the tv show. 235 00:08:18,198 --> 00:08:20,699 You thought you were gonna be cast members in a tv show. 236 00:08:20,801 --> 00:08:22,167 -Yeah. Exactly. -Exactly. 237 00:08:22,269 --> 00:08:24,436 It was the best thing that's gonna happen to us from the life 238 00:08:24,538 --> 00:08:26,371 that we were coming from. This was insanely huge. 239 00:08:26,473 --> 00:08:28,006 So you joined the show. 240 00:08:28,108 --> 00:08:29,975 How soon afterwards do you realize 241 00:08:30,077 --> 00:08:31,276 that you're supposed to have 242 00:08:31,378 --> 00:08:33,879 a relationship with hef off-camera? 243 00:08:33,981 --> 00:08:35,847 Almost six months we were there. 244 00:08:35,949 --> 00:08:38,149 So during that six months... 245 00:08:38,252 --> 00:08:39,417 The other girls were transitioning out. 246 00:08:39,520 --> 00:08:40,886 ...The other girls, the old girls next door 247 00:08:40,988 --> 00:08:42,654 were transitioning out, so, like, we would hear 248 00:08:42,756 --> 00:08:44,523 on speakerphone, kendra ordering, like, pasta 249 00:08:44,625 --> 00:08:47,559 and all the stuff and we were like, what the hell? 250 00:08:47,661 --> 00:08:49,227 She was pregnant, and we didn't know. 251 00:08:49,329 --> 00:08:51,162 So we were, like, we heard that, like, we were, like, 252 00:08:51,265 --> 00:08:53,899 understanding holly's staying in a separate bedroom now. 253 00:08:54,001 --> 00:08:58,003 And on our 19th birthday, we all went out to a club, 254 00:08:58,105 --> 00:09:00,405 and that was the night that realized we were... 255 00:09:00,507 --> 00:09:02,073 -What we got ourselves into. -...What we got ourselves into. 256 00:09:02,175 --> 00:09:03,875 Like, this is what it is. 257 00:09:03,977 --> 00:09:06,611 So you turn 19, and you all go out. 258 00:09:06,713 --> 00:09:07,913 And what happens next? 259 00:09:08,015 --> 00:09:09,414 We had a bunch of the playmates 260 00:09:09,516 --> 00:09:10,849 that are shooting from our year. 261 00:09:10,951 --> 00:09:12,651 Holly was with us. Kendra was with us. 262 00:09:12,753 --> 00:09:13,952 We were all going out 263 00:09:14,054 --> 00:09:16,388 to a nightclub for our 19th birthday. 264 00:09:16,490 --> 00:09:19,491 And we were drinking, and then on the way back, 265 00:09:19,593 --> 00:09:21,459 kendra in the limo is like, "you guys wanna smoke weed? 266 00:09:21,562 --> 00:09:23,261 Do you guys smoke weed?" 267 00:09:23,363 --> 00:09:24,829 and we're like, "hell, yeah, we smoke weed." 268 00:09:24,932 --> 00:09:26,331 so we get back to the mansion, and we went upstairs 269 00:09:26,433 --> 00:09:29,267 to smoke weed in hef's room. 270 00:09:29,369 --> 00:09:32,203 And at the time, holly was not in there. 271 00:09:32,306 --> 00:09:36,775 So it was me, karissa, kendra, and hef. 272 00:09:36,877 --> 00:09:38,243 But when we all went to go smoke pot, 273 00:09:38,345 --> 00:09:40,845 kendra didn't smoke. 274 00:09:40,948 --> 00:09:42,948 So she leaves right when we're all going to smoke pot. 275 00:09:43,050 --> 00:09:46,551 It was just me, you, and hef, and he knew we were nervous. 276 00:09:46,653 --> 00:09:48,186 We were super nervous when kendra left. 277 00:09:48,288 --> 00:09:49,454 -We didn't feel comfortable. -Super nervous 'cause... 278 00:09:49,556 --> 00:09:51,556 And then he says, "hey, you could take this. 279 00:09:51,658 --> 00:09:53,725 It will make... You won't be so nervous." 280 00:09:53,827 --> 00:09:55,160 hugh hefner offers you a pill. 281 00:09:55,262 --> 00:09:56,127 -Pills. -Mm-hmm. 282 00:09:56,229 --> 00:09:57,629 And... 283 00:09:57,731 --> 00:09:59,097 There were a couple pills in his hand. 284 00:09:59,199 --> 00:10:00,732 -A couple of pills. -Mm-hmm. 285 00:10:00,834 --> 00:10:02,334 -Do you take them? -Both: Yeah. 286 00:10:02,436 --> 00:10:03,635 -You took them. -Yeah. 287 00:10:03,737 --> 00:10:06,237 -He's 83. You're 19. -Correct. 288 00:10:06,340 --> 00:10:07,706 So did you think that you would be having sex 289 00:10:07,808 --> 00:10:09,841 with hugh hefner that night? 290 00:10:09,943 --> 00:10:10,976 Both: No. 291 00:10:11,078 --> 00:10:13,278 -Not at all. No. -Mnh-mnh. 292 00:10:15,449 --> 00:10:17,983 T's your 19th birthday. You've been to the club. 293 00:10:18,085 --> 00:10:19,618 You've been drinking, 294 00:10:19,720 --> 00:10:21,052 and now you've accepted pills, 295 00:10:21,154 --> 00:10:22,754 and you don't really know what those are, 296 00:10:22,856 --> 00:10:25,290 from hugh hefner. 297 00:10:25,392 --> 00:10:27,258 How are you feeling at this point? 298 00:10:27,361 --> 00:10:30,028 [bleep] up. Like... 299 00:10:30,130 --> 00:10:32,163 Really hazy and just, like, laying-- 300 00:10:32,265 --> 00:10:34,399 the most inebriated we've ever been. 301 00:10:34,501 --> 00:10:37,335 We were wasted. 302 00:10:37,437 --> 00:10:39,537 So when we got back, we were smoking pot, 303 00:10:39,640 --> 00:10:42,374 taking pills, and just... 304 00:10:42,476 --> 00:10:43,842 We're just gone. 305 00:10:43,944 --> 00:10:46,478 [laughs] 306 00:10:46,580 --> 00:10:49,414 so that night when we did get back to his room, 307 00:10:49,516 --> 00:10:51,850 we put on the pajamas and all that, you know? 308 00:10:51,952 --> 00:10:56,388 Um, I just remember me being on one side of him, 309 00:10:56,490 --> 00:10:58,990 karissa being on the other side of him. 310 00:10:59,092 --> 00:11:03,061 He was pulling our heads down, like a very hard pull 311 00:11:03,163 --> 00:11:06,197 down to his penis so that we would give him oral sex. 312 00:11:06,299 --> 00:11:08,967 ♪♪♪ 313 00:11:09,069 --> 00:11:12,237 and that was our 19th birthday. You're never gonna forget that. 314 00:11:12,339 --> 00:11:14,339 ♪♪♪ 315 00:11:14,441 --> 00:11:19,077 we had never done a threesome together before. 316 00:11:19,179 --> 00:11:21,012 We'd never want to. 317 00:11:21,114 --> 00:11:23,948 He didn't-- he didn't even finish. 318 00:11:24,051 --> 00:11:25,750 Just imagine this. Just imagine his old hand, 319 00:11:25,852 --> 00:11:28,520 and it kind of shakes, touching a boob. 320 00:11:28,622 --> 00:11:31,456 It's gross. It's like you're having sex with your grandpa. 321 00:11:31,558 --> 00:11:33,725 And he laid there looking up, and he was like, 322 00:11:33,827 --> 00:11:37,295 "my babies. My babies. See, you love me." 323 00:11:37,397 --> 00:11:40,098 we were watching the clock next to his bed, 324 00:11:40,200 --> 00:11:42,333 and it was like 4 a.M., 5 a.M., 325 00:11:42,436 --> 00:11:44,469 we're waiting for him to fall asleep. He falls asleep. 326 00:11:44,571 --> 00:11:45,770 We ran down the hall 327 00:11:45,872 --> 00:11:46,905 to the spare bedroom that we were in. 328 00:11:47,007 --> 00:11:49,874 We hit the shower, steaming hot, 329 00:11:49,976 --> 00:11:51,943 and, like, our skin was red from just trying to, like... 330 00:11:52,045 --> 00:11:53,912 Both: Sterilize. 331 00:11:54,014 --> 00:11:55,613 Wow. 332 00:11:55,716 --> 00:11:58,817 After that night, I didn't feel like my body was mine anymore. 333 00:11:58,919 --> 00:12:01,419 Like, I felt used, disgusted. 334 00:12:01,521 --> 00:12:04,689 Yeah, like, I didn't wanna, you know, call my mom 335 00:12:04,791 --> 00:12:05,990 and tell her anything. 336 00:12:06,093 --> 00:12:07,292 -And now-- -both of us said 337 00:12:07,394 --> 00:12:08,927 he's going straight to hell. -Oh, we both, like, 338 00:12:09,029 --> 00:12:10,195 he's the devil. This is insane. 339 00:12:10,297 --> 00:12:12,997 We were disgusted with ourselves. 340 00:12:13,100 --> 00:12:16,735 Why did you feel like you had to do it? 341 00:12:16,837 --> 00:12:20,638 Coming from our abusive father 342 00:12:20,741 --> 00:12:23,742 and our biological mom leaving, 343 00:12:23,844 --> 00:12:25,276 we really felt like we had to take care 344 00:12:25,378 --> 00:12:28,146 of our grandmother who raised us, 345 00:12:28,248 --> 00:12:30,115 and we didn't want him to take away 346 00:12:30,217 --> 00:12:31,416 all of the success that we had built. 347 00:12:31,518 --> 00:12:34,652 We thought he'd revoke our centerfold. 348 00:12:34,755 --> 00:12:35,687 There was no going back. 349 00:12:35,789 --> 00:12:37,589 You couldn't-- we couldn't leave. 350 00:12:37,691 --> 00:12:40,692 ♪♪♪ 351 00:12:40,794 --> 00:12:45,563 I believe that hef would prey on the younger girls like us 352 00:12:45,665 --> 00:12:47,699 who came from a bad background 353 00:12:47,801 --> 00:12:50,301 or the girls who were not so pretty-- 354 00:12:50,403 --> 00:12:51,770 he could promise them, like, 355 00:12:51,872 --> 00:12:53,238 "oh, here's this beautiful castle, and you know, 356 00:12:53,340 --> 00:12:56,474 I have all these surgeons," and he can make them beautiful 357 00:12:56,576 --> 00:12:59,110 or give them an option to do "playboy," 358 00:12:59,212 --> 00:13:02,046 or, like, provide this playboy family to you. 359 00:13:02,149 --> 00:13:05,617 Did it occur to you that he was grooming you? 360 00:13:05,719 --> 00:13:06,918 Both: Yeah. 361 00:13:07,020 --> 00:13:09,354 For sure. That--I think that's how he does it. 362 00:13:09,456 --> 00:13:10,989 'cause we were only 18, turning 19. 363 00:13:11,091 --> 00:13:12,757 Mm-hmm. 364 00:13:12,859 --> 00:13:14,225 We were just learning and wanted to be women, 365 00:13:14,327 --> 00:13:16,528 and, like, we've never even had bleach in our hair. 366 00:13:16,630 --> 00:13:17,996 We don't know about makeup. 367 00:13:18,098 --> 00:13:21,166 He really is grooming us, completely. 368 00:13:21,268 --> 00:13:23,701 Everything's yes. You, like, get to eat what you want. 369 00:13:23,804 --> 00:13:24,836 The butlers are calling you. 370 00:13:24,938 --> 00:13:26,271 You can have alcohol on a platter. 371 00:13:26,373 --> 00:13:30,041 I'm like, "oh, patrón and pineapple, hell, yeah!" 372 00:13:30,143 --> 00:13:33,645 when we moved in, we got media training. 373 00:13:33,747 --> 00:13:34,612 I wanna talk about that for a second. 374 00:13:34,714 --> 00:13:36,714 -Mm-hmm. -What is media training? 375 00:13:36,817 --> 00:13:38,983 What did you understand it to be? 376 00:13:39,085 --> 00:13:41,119 They would just explain to us, you know, how to, um, 377 00:13:41,221 --> 00:13:45,056 answer certain questions and how to dodge certain questions. 378 00:13:45,158 --> 00:13:48,459 That would come up, like, the sister question. 379 00:13:48,562 --> 00:13:50,895 What is the sister question? 380 00:13:50,997 --> 00:13:53,998 Well, a lot of people would say we were incest 381 00:13:54,100 --> 00:13:57,101 'cause we were both with him. 382 00:13:57,204 --> 00:13:58,136 So they would say, you know... 383 00:13:58,238 --> 00:14:00,338 They'd think we were hooking up. 384 00:14:00,440 --> 00:14:01,873 So, like, those type of questions, 385 00:14:01,975 --> 00:14:04,275 and it's kind of going with grooming you on how to act. 386 00:14:04,377 --> 00:14:08,179 Is it kind of weird maybe kissing your boyfriend 387 00:14:08,281 --> 00:14:10,281 after he's kissed your sister? 388 00:14:10,383 --> 00:14:11,416 -No. -Not at all? 389 00:14:11,518 --> 00:14:13,718 Mnh-mnh. 390 00:14:13,820 --> 00:14:15,553 Ahh! [laughs] it's called acting. 391 00:14:15,655 --> 00:14:17,589 So they kind of warned you 392 00:14:17,691 --> 00:14:20,058 that this is what the press is gonna be asking you. 393 00:14:20,160 --> 00:14:21,192 -Mm-hmm. -Well-- 394 00:14:21,294 --> 00:14:22,994 and here's what to say, 'cause-- 395 00:14:23,096 --> 00:14:25,129 what we didn't realize, though, is he was protecting his image. 396 00:14:25,232 --> 00:14:27,398 They're training us to protect... 397 00:14:27,500 --> 00:14:28,533 Both: His image. 398 00:14:28,635 --> 00:14:30,335 It was not about us. 399 00:14:30,437 --> 00:14:33,605 Okay, so you guys say that you partied a lot 400 00:14:33,707 --> 00:14:34,739 at the mansion. 401 00:14:34,841 --> 00:14:36,207 So let's take a look at this clip, 402 00:14:36,309 --> 00:14:39,143 and you tell me what was happening here. 403 00:14:39,246 --> 00:14:42,547 ♪♪♪ 404 00:14:42,649 --> 00:14:44,816 kristina, we have to practice. Kristina! 405 00:14:44,918 --> 00:14:47,585 ♪♪♪ 406 00:14:47,687 --> 00:14:48,753 kristina, get up. 407 00:14:48,855 --> 00:14:50,855 We were drunk every night, 408 00:14:50,957 --> 00:14:51,990 so it was hard to get up in the morning 409 00:14:52,092 --> 00:14:53,791 and have to do everything. 410 00:14:53,894 --> 00:14:56,694 -You were drunk every night? -Every night to deal with him. 411 00:14:56,796 --> 00:14:58,363 Wake up in the morning. 412 00:14:58,465 --> 00:15:00,265 Especially kristina. I-I have to get her up sometimes. 413 00:15:00,367 --> 00:15:02,433 -That was an all-nighter. -Yeah. 414 00:15:02,535 --> 00:15:05,203 Dinner started at 5 every Friday, Saturday, and Sunday, 415 00:15:05,305 --> 00:15:07,305 so at dinner is when we would start drinking. 416 00:15:07,407 --> 00:15:09,107 They had open bar. 417 00:15:09,209 --> 00:15:10,742 We would start drinking just in case 418 00:15:10,844 --> 00:15:13,077 hef wanted to apply that pressure. 419 00:15:13,179 --> 00:15:16,614 We'd party just like normal, and he's like, 420 00:15:16,716 --> 00:15:19,851 "obviously, you girls don't wanna sleep in my bedroom" 421 00:15:19,953 --> 00:15:22,453 because he realized we were 422 00:15:22,555 --> 00:15:23,988 waiting for him to fall asleep and leave. 423 00:15:24,090 --> 00:15:26,357 He's, like, not waking up with the twins next to him. 424 00:15:26,459 --> 00:15:28,493 So he's like, "we need someone else." 425 00:15:28,595 --> 00:15:30,929 [cheering] 426 00:15:31,031 --> 00:15:33,064 and so down at one of the parties, 427 00:15:33,166 --> 00:15:35,500 that's when we introduced him to crystal harris. 428 00:15:35,602 --> 00:15:37,502 We have a roped-off party, 429 00:15:37,604 --> 00:15:39,537 and we're just sitting there, like, at the table, 430 00:15:39,639 --> 00:15:43,141 and there's tons of girls. Like, I mean, a pool of girls. 431 00:15:43,243 --> 00:15:44,342 And they're like, "hef, hef, hef, 432 00:15:44,444 --> 00:15:45,910 can I get a picture with you?" 433 00:15:46,012 --> 00:15:49,681 crystal was one of the ones who came in with a friend, 434 00:15:49,783 --> 00:15:53,918 and then she ended up staying in his room, sleeping there. 435 00:15:54,020 --> 00:15:55,186 That night? 436 00:15:55,288 --> 00:15:56,521 She actually slept that night and every other night. 437 00:15:56,623 --> 00:15:57,989 -Stayed over. -Stayed over. 438 00:15:58,091 --> 00:16:00,925 Uh, around midnight, at the parties, 439 00:16:01,027 --> 00:16:02,360 he'd say, "oh, well, you know, I'm getting tired. 440 00:16:02,462 --> 00:16:05,296 Let's go upstairs," and we kinda noticed the pattern. 441 00:16:05,398 --> 00:16:06,597 After a while, it was like midnight. 442 00:16:06,700 --> 00:16:07,966 He really always wants to go upstairs. 443 00:16:08,068 --> 00:16:10,335 And a bunch of girls would just be begging 444 00:16:10,437 --> 00:16:13,104 to go upstairs with hef-- begging. 445 00:16:13,206 --> 00:16:15,406 And he's like, "is it okay with you if they come up?" 446 00:16:15,508 --> 00:16:17,375 and we're like, "we don't mind." 447 00:16:17,477 --> 00:16:19,277 -go ahead. -Do what he wants. 448 00:16:19,379 --> 00:16:21,279 Clearly, if he maybe is fulfilled with those girls, 449 00:16:21,381 --> 00:16:23,715 he won't want us. -So we, uh-- 450 00:16:23,817 --> 00:16:25,683 we just did not want any part of that. 451 00:16:25,785 --> 00:16:31,756 But, um, the problem was is hef doesn't like to use protection. 452 00:16:31,858 --> 00:16:32,890 -So he wouldn't use condoms? -No. 453 00:16:32,993 --> 00:16:34,459 -No. -From the butlers, 454 00:16:34,561 --> 00:16:37,729 we'd just order like a bowl-- big bowl, 455 00:16:37,831 --> 00:16:40,832 and we'd put hot water in it. Then we'd put rags in it. 456 00:16:40,934 --> 00:16:45,236 So whoever was, you know, having intercourse with him, 457 00:16:45,338 --> 00:16:48,306 when they were finished, they can wipe him off, 458 00:16:48,408 --> 00:16:50,608 and then the other girl could... 459 00:16:50,710 --> 00:16:51,909 -Do it. -...Do it. 460 00:16:52,012 --> 00:16:53,211 And so you had to take it upon yourself... 461 00:16:53,313 --> 00:16:54,345 Yeah. 462 00:16:54,447 --> 00:16:57,448 ...To try to have some semblance of... 463 00:16:57,550 --> 00:17:00,218 -Yeah. -To avoid infections. 464 00:17:00,320 --> 00:17:04,122 There was at one point an std that went around. 465 00:17:04,224 --> 00:17:07,525 We caught chlamydia, and, um, 466 00:17:07,627 --> 00:17:09,660 I remember going down to mary o'connor's office-- 467 00:17:09,763 --> 00:17:13,898 his assistant/ I'd say house mom for us, 468 00:17:14,000 --> 00:17:15,366 and, uh, she's like, 469 00:17:15,468 --> 00:17:17,301 "well, that's what happens when you're sexually active." 470 00:17:17,404 --> 00:17:19,437 we freaked out. 471 00:17:19,539 --> 00:17:21,239 When she said stds were normal when you're sexually active, 472 00:17:21,341 --> 00:17:24,208 we're like, "everyone's out of their mind here." 473 00:17:24,310 --> 00:17:26,744 well, this whole thing is-- is terrifying, I'm sure, for... 474 00:17:26,846 --> 00:17:29,447 -Yeah. -...For 19-year-old women. 475 00:17:29,549 --> 00:17:33,951 Are you still intimate with him during this stage? 476 00:17:34,054 --> 00:17:35,386 After we caught the std, 477 00:17:35,488 --> 00:17:38,322 we said we would never have sex with him again. 478 00:17:38,425 --> 00:17:40,124 -That was it? -Both: That was it. 479 00:17:40,226 --> 00:17:43,061 And we got different treatment because of that. 480 00:17:43,163 --> 00:17:46,364 ♪♪♪ 481 00:17:49,035 --> 00:17:50,134 from what I understand, there were rules 482 00:17:50,236 --> 00:17:51,135 that you had to live by... -Mm-hmm. 483 00:17:51,237 --> 00:17:53,037 ...When you were, uh, on the show 484 00:17:53,139 --> 00:17:55,139 and you lived at the mansion. -Mm-hmm. 485 00:17:55,241 --> 00:17:56,941 What were some of the rules? 486 00:17:57,043 --> 00:17:59,844 The rules were we had a 9:00 curfew. 487 00:17:59,946 --> 00:18:03,781 We weren't allowed to be seen out with other men, 488 00:18:03,883 --> 00:18:05,583 couldn't date other men. 489 00:18:05,685 --> 00:18:08,820 He told us if we loved him 490 00:18:08,922 --> 00:18:11,122 and we wanted to be his girlfriends, 491 00:18:11,224 --> 00:18:14,058 we had to have sexual encounters with him. 492 00:18:14,160 --> 00:18:16,961 So he turned it into proof of love. 493 00:18:17,063 --> 00:18:19,097 -Yeah. -Proof of love, exactly. 494 00:18:19,199 --> 00:18:21,365 ♪♪♪ 495 00:18:21,468 --> 00:18:22,733 I feel like on "girls next door," 496 00:18:22,836 --> 00:18:24,936 hef was portrayed as like a kindly grandpa, 497 00:18:25,038 --> 00:18:26,437 but that's not how he is. 498 00:18:26,539 --> 00:18:31,476 It would make me so angry how manipulative he was. 499 00:18:31,578 --> 00:18:34,078 Are there rules? Like, can you have boyfriends at all? 500 00:18:34,180 --> 00:18:35,880 -No. -No. 501 00:18:35,982 --> 00:18:37,014 -You're not allowed to. -Hef is our boyfriend. 502 00:18:37,117 --> 00:18:38,382 -So... -How do you know when you're 503 00:18:38,485 --> 00:18:39,984 called to the master bedroom? Do you have nights? 504 00:18:40,086 --> 00:18:41,219 -Yeah. -Yeah. 505 00:18:41,321 --> 00:18:42,887 Hef controlled every aspect of our life. 506 00:18:42,989 --> 00:18:45,523 You were encouraged to not have friends over. 507 00:18:45,625 --> 00:18:46,791 You weren't really allowed to leave 508 00:18:46,893 --> 00:18:49,560 unless it was like a family holiday. 509 00:18:49,662 --> 00:18:52,330 There was a 9 p.M. Curfew, uh, as a girlfriend, 510 00:18:52,432 --> 00:18:56,734 so you had to be on the property by 9 p.M. 511 00:18:56,836 --> 00:18:59,170 When it came to us, it was like, no. 512 00:18:59,272 --> 00:19:02,807 He tightened the belt even more. He didn't want us to leave. 513 00:19:02,909 --> 00:19:06,144 He hung, uh, certain things over our head. 514 00:19:06,246 --> 00:19:08,946 We got punished, so, like, 515 00:19:09,048 --> 00:19:11,716 we weren't allowed to do anything without security. 516 00:19:11,818 --> 00:19:13,484 He said, "the twins can't go visit their family 517 00:19:13,586 --> 00:19:15,186 unless security's there." 518 00:19:15,288 --> 00:19:18,055 he had even had security follow you 519 00:19:18,158 --> 00:19:20,091 if you went to the mall or... -Both: Oh, yeah. 520 00:19:20,193 --> 00:19:21,659 Mm-hmm. We'd be downstairs, and he'd have 521 00:19:21,761 --> 00:19:23,427 three security guards watching me 522 00:19:23,530 --> 00:19:24,896 and watching karissa. 523 00:19:24,998 --> 00:19:26,330 And they would always in the morning 524 00:19:26,432 --> 00:19:27,999 come up with their report 525 00:19:28,101 --> 00:19:29,834 of every single thing we did that night 526 00:19:29,936 --> 00:19:31,736 the next morning for him. 527 00:19:31,838 --> 00:19:35,206 Wait, what? They would write reports on everything you did? 528 00:19:35,308 --> 00:19:36,974 -Everything. -Everything we did. 529 00:19:37,076 --> 00:19:38,743 -Who we would hang out with. -Who we were hanging out with, 530 00:19:38,845 --> 00:19:42,813 what we were drinking, what we ate. Everything. 531 00:19:42,916 --> 00:19:44,115 Every time we left the property, 532 00:19:44,217 --> 00:19:46,584 when did we leave, what time did we get back? 533 00:19:46,686 --> 00:19:48,219 And then when we did start realizing 534 00:19:48,321 --> 00:19:49,654 we have to hang out with playmates, 535 00:19:49,756 --> 00:19:51,622 what playmates were we hanging out with? What did they eat? 536 00:19:51,724 --> 00:19:53,758 What's with the "what did they eat?" 537 00:19:53,860 --> 00:19:55,693 -he likes his girls thin. -To be thin. 538 00:19:55,795 --> 00:19:56,827 -Very thin. -Very thin. 539 00:19:56,930 --> 00:19:58,963 So hef has everybody on a certain diet. 540 00:19:59,065 --> 00:20:00,565 This was such controlling... 541 00:20:00,667 --> 00:20:02,366 -Mm-hmm. -...Behavior. 542 00:20:02,468 --> 00:20:04,835 ♪♪♪ 543 00:20:04,938 --> 00:20:06,938 [indistinct conversations] 544 00:20:07,040 --> 00:20:09,373 we'd normally have our parties every weekend. 545 00:20:09,475 --> 00:20:11,175 He'd would go upstairs with crystal and say, 546 00:20:11,277 --> 00:20:13,144 "all right, have a good night. Security's watching you," 547 00:20:13,246 --> 00:20:15,913 and we got to stay down. 548 00:20:16,015 --> 00:20:18,182 We weren't allowed to be with any friends 549 00:20:18,284 --> 00:20:21,752 that were not playboy circle. 550 00:20:21,854 --> 00:20:23,721 We kind of got a lot of press 551 00:20:23,823 --> 00:20:25,189 from hanging out with all the people 552 00:20:25,291 --> 00:20:26,824 going onstage and dancing. 553 00:20:26,926 --> 00:20:28,593 We're very outgoing, like running the party. 554 00:20:28,695 --> 00:20:30,728 We start being able to meet people. 555 00:20:30,830 --> 00:20:32,029 Yeah. 556 00:20:32,131 --> 00:20:33,164 Like all these different celebrities 557 00:20:33,266 --> 00:20:34,298 that you're meeting and networking, 558 00:20:34,400 --> 00:20:36,734 and like it's our backyard. It is. 559 00:20:36,836 --> 00:20:38,836 And he found out we were hanging out with some asian girl. 560 00:20:38,938 --> 00:20:40,171 He goes, "you're hanging out with some asian girl. 561 00:20:40,273 --> 00:20:41,539 Is she a playmate?" 562 00:20:41,641 --> 00:20:43,741 and I'm like, "is there a problem that she's asian?" 563 00:20:43,843 --> 00:20:45,042 and he's like, "a playboy playmate, I told you, 564 00:20:45,144 --> 00:20:47,945 is a type of girl," and he goes, 565 00:20:48,047 --> 00:20:49,847 "you were hanging out with black guys at the bar!" 566 00:20:49,949 --> 00:20:53,851 wait a minute. I thought he had this image of being progressive. 567 00:20:53,953 --> 00:20:54,819 -Mm-hmm. -Um... 568 00:20:54,921 --> 00:20:55,820 That's for his image. 569 00:20:55,922 --> 00:20:58,089 Yes, he's genius about his image. 570 00:20:58,191 --> 00:21:01,993 Every woman he dated was a white girl. 571 00:21:02,095 --> 00:21:07,198 Hef would say, "all right, the twins are wild. 572 00:21:07,300 --> 00:21:09,500 When I'm going upstairs, lock 'em up. 573 00:21:09,602 --> 00:21:11,936 I want them on hmh arrest upstairs." 574 00:21:12,038 --> 00:21:12,870 hmh arrest? 575 00:21:12,972 --> 00:21:15,373 Hugh marston hefner. Hmh arrest. 576 00:21:15,475 --> 00:21:17,942 -Yeah. -He locked us in our bedroom. 577 00:21:18,044 --> 00:21:23,814 There would be a security guard sitting outside of our door. 578 00:21:23,916 --> 00:21:25,616 You are locked in your rooms, essentially. 579 00:21:25,718 --> 00:21:26,617 Mm-hmm. 580 00:21:26,719 --> 00:21:31,155 [indistinct conversations, squealing] 581 00:21:31,257 --> 00:21:33,424 so when he'd play backgammon every Sunday--Sunday funday-- 582 00:21:33,526 --> 00:21:34,725 we had to lay next to him. 583 00:21:34,827 --> 00:21:37,194 The girls would come and ask for photos all the time, 584 00:21:37,297 --> 00:21:38,829 that were invited up for those days, 585 00:21:38,931 --> 00:21:40,598 and as he's going to take the photos, 586 00:21:40,700 --> 00:21:43,067 he's, like, grabbing under, grabbing their vagina, 587 00:21:43,169 --> 00:21:44,568 or, like, grabbed their boob, 588 00:21:44,671 --> 00:21:46,137 or they'd, "look!" and they'd show their boobs to him, 589 00:21:46,239 --> 00:21:47,605 and he'd grab 'em. 590 00:21:47,707 --> 00:21:51,175 And the way he kisses, it's like, um, his mouth kisses. 591 00:21:51,277 --> 00:21:54,945 He kissed every girl like an open-mouth kiss. 592 00:21:55,048 --> 00:21:57,715 You guys, I went to the mansion when I was 20 and 21. 593 00:21:57,817 --> 00:21:59,850 And I first met him when I was 20. 594 00:21:59,952 --> 00:22:02,920 He came in for a, like, an open-mouth kiss. 595 00:22:03,022 --> 00:22:05,222 And I went like this, and it was like a dog slobber on me. 596 00:22:05,325 --> 00:22:06,991 -Mm-hmm. -But I could tell 597 00:22:07,093 --> 00:22:08,793 he did not like that I turned my head. 598 00:22:08,895 --> 00:22:10,261 -Turned. -Mm-hmm. 599 00:22:10,363 --> 00:22:11,796 I remembered how repulsive 600 00:22:11,898 --> 00:22:13,698 it was to be on the receiving end of that. 601 00:22:13,800 --> 00:22:14,965 -Mm-hmm. -I can't believe that you had 602 00:22:15,068 --> 00:22:18,135 to put up with that as long as you did. 603 00:22:18,237 --> 00:22:20,037 [indistinct conversations] 604 00:22:20,139 --> 00:22:22,640 he has so much power. It's like you're in a cult. 605 00:22:22,742 --> 00:22:26,711 The isolation that I had from the outside world--it was... 606 00:22:26,813 --> 00:22:28,846 Not talking to our family, too. 607 00:22:28,948 --> 00:22:30,614 Not being able to talk to my family. 608 00:22:30,717 --> 00:22:33,217 I wanted to go to church. I couldn't go to church. 609 00:22:33,319 --> 00:22:35,319 I was a shell of a person, you know? 610 00:22:35,421 --> 00:22:36,654 When we first got to the playboy mansion, 611 00:22:36,756 --> 00:22:39,090 we were really, um, confident. 612 00:22:39,192 --> 00:22:41,392 Big personalities. 613 00:22:41,494 --> 00:22:42,660 You know, I felt like there always was this bright light 614 00:22:42,762 --> 00:22:44,261 inside of us. 615 00:22:44,364 --> 00:22:47,565 Like, hef would say we used to bounce in and out of a room. 616 00:22:47,667 --> 00:22:49,033 Very entertaining to all of his friends and guests, 617 00:22:49,135 --> 00:22:51,302 and people used to say, "gosh, well, when you guys got here, 618 00:22:51,404 --> 00:22:53,604 it was a fresh breath of air." 619 00:22:53,706 --> 00:22:56,540 so from the time that you experienced 620 00:22:56,642 --> 00:22:59,143 that first night in his bedroom at 19... 621 00:22:59,245 --> 00:23:00,745 -Mm-hmm. -...Until the light went out 622 00:23:00,847 --> 00:23:03,114 was less than a year. -Less than a year. 623 00:23:03,216 --> 00:23:05,816 And you had completely changed personality. 624 00:23:05,918 --> 00:23:10,221 Yeah. I'm trying not to get emotional thinking about it. 625 00:23:10,323 --> 00:23:13,157 You lose yourself being there. 626 00:23:13,259 --> 00:23:16,193 All that innocence about us and all that, just being-- 627 00:23:16,295 --> 00:23:18,662 losing that and becoming a shell of a person, 628 00:23:18,765 --> 00:23:20,798 it--it's hard. 629 00:23:20,900 --> 00:23:24,235 It's like being in prison and like someone breaking you 630 00:23:24,337 --> 00:23:27,304 in solitary confinement, like, you're just broken. 631 00:23:27,407 --> 00:23:31,242 ♪♪♪ 632 00:23:31,344 --> 00:23:33,344 so you came to the mansion thinking, 633 00:23:33,446 --> 00:23:37,081 "we're gonna be centerfolds. I'm gonna be on a tv show. 634 00:23:37,183 --> 00:23:39,550 We're going to live in the mansion," 635 00:23:39,652 --> 00:23:43,487 but the reality was different than the fantasy. 636 00:23:43,589 --> 00:23:48,659 You had rules. You were watched constantly. 637 00:23:48,761 --> 00:23:50,294 And yet that wasn't the worst thing 638 00:23:50,396 --> 00:23:53,431 that happened to you, was it? 639 00:23:57,703 --> 00:24:00,738 We did stop having sex with him when the std hit. 640 00:24:00,840 --> 00:24:03,507 So for the first time, we put our foot down, 641 00:24:03,609 --> 00:24:06,677 and hef was pressuring us to hook up with him. 642 00:24:06,779 --> 00:24:08,846 So then mary o'connor suggested, "well, hef, 643 00:24:08,948 --> 00:24:11,415 why don't you stay with the three girls, then?" 644 00:24:11,517 --> 00:24:13,083 and he's never done that. 645 00:24:13,186 --> 00:24:14,885 He's used to seven girls, nine girls, 646 00:24:14,987 --> 00:24:16,854 but he actually agreed to that. 647 00:24:16,956 --> 00:24:19,123 So then we're like, "oh, great, now he agreed to it. 648 00:24:19,225 --> 00:24:21,559 Now we're gonna have to, like, end up having 649 00:24:21,661 --> 00:24:23,160 to hook up with him." 650 00:24:23,262 --> 00:24:24,528 this was like a business arrangement. 651 00:24:24,630 --> 00:24:25,796 -Mm-hmm. -It was--it's like 652 00:24:25,898 --> 00:24:27,398 a business arrangement, yeah. 653 00:24:27,500 --> 00:24:28,732 Did you feel like you would lose the opportunity 654 00:24:28,835 --> 00:24:31,836 to be on the show if you would have said no? 655 00:24:31,938 --> 00:24:33,938 It wasn't just about the show. 656 00:24:34,040 --> 00:24:35,272 We thought he would just send us back. 657 00:24:35,374 --> 00:24:38,042 Like, he would take everything away that we had got. 658 00:24:38,144 --> 00:24:39,810 Taking away the allowance, you know, 659 00:24:39,912 --> 00:24:42,413 and not being able to take care of our grandmother. 660 00:24:42,515 --> 00:24:45,182 We did not want him to take that away. 661 00:24:45,284 --> 00:24:48,586 I was young and naive. You don't know you're allowed to say no. 662 00:24:48,688 --> 00:24:52,456 And so you were kind of pulled back into this dark place... 663 00:24:52,558 --> 00:24:53,624 -Yeah. -...Of--of having 664 00:24:53,726 --> 00:24:56,760 to go upstairs, go into his bedroom, 665 00:24:56,863 --> 00:24:58,262 and have sexual intercourse with him. 666 00:24:58,364 --> 00:25:00,197 -Yeah. -We ended up doing it, like, 667 00:25:00,299 --> 00:25:02,633 two more times and then just said we couldn't do it anymore. 668 00:25:02,735 --> 00:25:05,870 And that's how later on, I ended up getting pregnant. 669 00:25:05,972 --> 00:25:08,272 ♪♪♪ 670 00:25:08,374 --> 00:25:10,474 one of those two times, you got pregnant. 671 00:25:10,576 --> 00:25:11,742 Mm-hmm. 672 00:25:11,844 --> 00:25:15,179 You know, he's having sex with you unprotected. 673 00:25:15,281 --> 00:25:17,248 Um, you know, you were old enough 674 00:25:17,350 --> 00:25:18,883 to know how people get pregnant. 675 00:25:18,985 --> 00:25:20,217 I didn't think that I would 676 00:25:20,319 --> 00:25:22,186 because I knew holly was trying to get pregnant, 677 00:25:22,288 --> 00:25:25,422 and I knew that holly tried so hard, 678 00:25:25,525 --> 00:25:27,658 so I was like, maybe we're in the clear. 679 00:25:27,760 --> 00:25:29,159 -Didn't think it was possible. -I didn't think it was possible. 680 00:25:29,262 --> 00:25:30,628 And again, how old is he? 681 00:25:30,730 --> 00:25:31,929 -84. -84. 682 00:25:32,031 --> 00:25:33,731 Like, you don't really think that would happen. 683 00:25:33,833 --> 00:25:34,865 But we were--we were about the youngest girlfriends 684 00:25:34,967 --> 00:25:37,001 he had had. 685 00:25:37,103 --> 00:25:39,303 It was the end of 19. I was gonna turn 20. 686 00:25:39,405 --> 00:25:41,705 I had no idea until the blood test 687 00:25:41,807 --> 00:25:44,775 for my surgery, so a blood test is what told me. 688 00:25:44,877 --> 00:25:48,746 We had plans to get our noses done and our boobs done. 689 00:25:48,848 --> 00:25:52,016 So I got a call saying, like, "hey, you're pregnant, 690 00:25:52,118 --> 00:25:54,418 and you have the surgery coming up," and that's-- 691 00:25:54,520 --> 00:25:57,721 I freaked. Like, I'm, like, "who else knows about this?" 692 00:25:57,823 --> 00:25:58,756 and they're like, "well, we just called you," 693 00:25:58,858 --> 00:26:01,292 and I was like, "don't call mary. 694 00:26:01,394 --> 00:26:03,227 Don't call hef. Don't call anyone. 695 00:26:03,329 --> 00:26:04,662 I don't want anyone knowing." 696 00:26:04,764 --> 00:26:06,163 it's hard to hide things at the mansion. 697 00:26:06,265 --> 00:26:08,432 Wait. The first reaction that you had... 698 00:26:08,534 --> 00:26:10,067 -Was scared. -...Was "who knows?" 699 00:26:10,169 --> 00:26:12,236 who knows? Who in the office knows? 700 00:26:12,338 --> 00:26:14,638 Why didn't you feel like you could go to hugh hefner 701 00:26:14,740 --> 00:26:16,607 and say, "hef, I'm pregnant"? 702 00:26:16,709 --> 00:26:19,843 I didn't want him to know that I was pregnant. 703 00:26:19,946 --> 00:26:21,512 I didn't want him to want me to have it. 704 00:26:21,614 --> 00:26:26,183 I didn't wanna be stuck even more inside that bubble. 705 00:26:26,285 --> 00:26:28,619 I think it's a way for him to control me even more... 706 00:26:28,721 --> 00:26:30,688 -I see. -...Having me on a leash. 707 00:26:30,790 --> 00:26:32,323 Yeah. 708 00:26:32,425 --> 00:26:33,891 I felt disgusted with my body. I didn't-- 709 00:26:33,993 --> 00:26:37,695 I felt like there was something, like, like, an alien inside me. 710 00:26:37,797 --> 00:26:39,263 I was just grossed out. 711 00:26:39,365 --> 00:26:43,100 [voice breaking] I just wanted to get it over and done with, 712 00:26:43,202 --> 00:26:44,134 and... [sighs] 713 00:26:44,236 --> 00:26:45,903 I called around for a few clinics. 714 00:26:46,005 --> 00:26:47,037 And, um, 'cause we didn't wanna-- 715 00:26:47,139 --> 00:26:49,306 'cause security couldn't take us there 716 00:26:49,408 --> 00:26:50,841 'cause otherwise hef would've found out. 717 00:26:50,943 --> 00:26:53,110 Um, 'cause if we were together, I knew we would get a... 718 00:26:53,212 --> 00:26:55,179 A lot more attention or a chance of paparazzi 719 00:26:55,281 --> 00:26:57,314 walking in an abortion clinic. 720 00:26:57,416 --> 00:27:00,584 You two do everything together, 721 00:27:00,686 --> 00:27:03,520 but at this crucial moment in your life, 722 00:27:03,623 --> 00:27:08,325 you have to walk in alone 'cause you're worried about paparazzi. 723 00:27:08,427 --> 00:27:11,795 That is, to me, so gut-wrenching and sad. 724 00:27:11,897 --> 00:27:13,230 -Yeah. -You had to be alone. 725 00:27:13,332 --> 00:27:15,532 -[exhales deeply] -I'm so sorry. 726 00:27:15,635 --> 00:27:18,469 I can't imagine what the two of you went through. 727 00:27:18,571 --> 00:27:19,770 That's a double life. 728 00:27:19,872 --> 00:27:21,605 That's why we love each other so much, too. 729 00:27:21,707 --> 00:27:24,174 We really are strong for each other, you know? 730 00:27:24,276 --> 00:27:25,809 Yeah, you are. 731 00:27:25,911 --> 00:27:29,446 So, uh, I called my good friend juicy j from-- 732 00:27:29,548 --> 00:27:30,814 he's a rapper from three 6 mafia, 733 00:27:30,916 --> 00:27:32,983 but we're really close. 734 00:27:33,085 --> 00:27:37,054 So I made an appointment, and we went to sherman oaks mall, 735 00:27:37,156 --> 00:27:38,956 got dropped off and said we were going shopping, 736 00:27:39,058 --> 00:27:41,792 and juicy j picked us up at valet right away, 737 00:27:41,894 --> 00:27:44,728 drove us in his car, and we dropped karissa off by herself. 738 00:27:44,830 --> 00:27:48,132 I did the procedure, came out, got in his car, 739 00:27:48,234 --> 00:27:50,300 and they dropped us back off at the mall, 740 00:27:50,403 --> 00:27:52,202 and she ran up and purchased, like, two thongs 741 00:27:52,304 --> 00:27:54,938 from victoria's secret to act like we went shopping. 742 00:27:55,041 --> 00:27:56,607 Then we went back to the mansion, 743 00:27:56,709 --> 00:27:58,409 and then all of a sudden, hef's like, 744 00:27:58,511 --> 00:28:00,144 "oh, we have to film 745 00:28:00,246 --> 00:28:02,179 for 'the girls next door' promo opening." 746 00:28:02,281 --> 00:28:04,448 I think it was like two days later, maybe. 747 00:28:04,550 --> 00:28:06,884 And they wanted us for that opening to be in bikinis 748 00:28:06,986 --> 00:28:08,719 and all this stuff, and I couldn't go down there 749 00:28:08,821 --> 00:28:11,755 'cause my stomach was swollen and I was bleeding a lot. 750 00:28:11,857 --> 00:28:14,525 I just, uh, laid in bed and tried to play like I was sick. 751 00:28:14,627 --> 00:28:17,895 And then lauren, our main field producer, 752 00:28:17,997 --> 00:28:19,730 shuts the door and says, "what's going on?" 753 00:28:19,832 --> 00:28:21,231 I had to tell someone. 754 00:28:21,333 --> 00:28:24,168 Kristina says, "karissa just had an abortion." 755 00:28:24,270 --> 00:28:28,205 and lauren, thank god, she didn't say anything. 756 00:28:28,307 --> 00:28:30,340 But she did say, "well, what do you want me to tell hef?" 757 00:28:30,443 --> 00:28:32,276 so then hef comes up, and I'm crying, 758 00:28:32,378 --> 00:28:33,911 and he's like, "what's wrong?" 759 00:28:34,013 --> 00:28:36,046 I said, "I'm sick. I just can't film." 760 00:28:36,148 --> 00:28:38,282 he's like, "well, we could do it tomorrow." 761 00:28:38,384 --> 00:28:39,616 and I said, "no," 'cause I don't know 762 00:28:39,719 --> 00:28:41,251 if I'm gonna be all right by tomorrow. 763 00:28:41,353 --> 00:28:42,419 So hef's like, "whatever you wanna do," 764 00:28:42,521 --> 00:28:45,189 and, like, leaves, all mad, 765 00:28:45,291 --> 00:28:47,257 and then that's the first time we've said no. 766 00:28:47,359 --> 00:28:49,093 We never say no to filming. 767 00:28:49,195 --> 00:28:50,694 Lauren said, "all right, how about this, karissa? 768 00:28:50,796 --> 00:28:53,497 You do your hair and makeup and go down, 769 00:28:53,599 --> 00:28:55,532 and we will cut--put your head on your sister's body 770 00:28:55,634 --> 00:28:58,168 if she's okay with it." 771 00:28:58,270 --> 00:29:02,573 so, yeah, um, and then this opening, 772 00:29:02,675 --> 00:29:06,977 my head--it's kristina's body. My head's put on her body. 773 00:29:07,079 --> 00:29:08,278 I was the body double for both of us. 774 00:29:08,380 --> 00:29:09,913 She was the body double for both of us 775 00:29:10,015 --> 00:29:11,548 this day of the shoot for the opening. 776 00:29:11,650 --> 00:29:15,252 [voice breaking] I went down and put on different bikinis. 777 00:29:15,354 --> 00:29:18,889 And...That's the opening for "the girls next door" 778 00:29:18,991 --> 00:29:20,824 and the bobblehead thing. 779 00:29:20,926 --> 00:29:23,427 I mean, in a way, you were almost more concerned 780 00:29:23,529 --> 00:29:27,064 about this reality show opening 781 00:29:27,166 --> 00:29:29,600 than you were about your own body and health. 782 00:29:29,702 --> 00:29:33,537 [crying] so...It's hard watching the opening for it. 783 00:29:33,639 --> 00:29:34,705 [sniffles] 784 00:29:34,807 --> 00:29:38,575 the fact that you were pregnant by somebody 785 00:29:38,677 --> 00:29:40,277 that you didn't wanna have sex with... 786 00:29:40,379 --> 00:29:44,314 Every time I've done it with him it's assault. 787 00:29:44,416 --> 00:29:48,852 I'm ni--I'm a kid. I'm 19 years old. 788 00:29:48,954 --> 00:29:51,188 I'm not even old enough to drink yet. 789 00:29:51,290 --> 00:29:56,326 And he is just a creepy old man with power. 790 00:29:56,428 --> 00:29:59,630 Women don't understand that they can say no. [sniffles] 791 00:29:59,732 --> 00:30:04,501 I'm sorry. It's so hard to talk about, you know? 792 00:30:04,603 --> 00:30:07,571 Do you look back and think to yourself 793 00:30:07,673 --> 00:30:09,506 that you made the right decision? 794 00:30:09,608 --> 00:30:11,508 100% I did, yeah. 795 00:30:11,610 --> 00:30:13,243 Everyone, to each their own... 796 00:30:13,345 --> 00:30:16,847 But for me it's like rape. 797 00:30:16,949 --> 00:30:18,348 He would use control mechanisms 798 00:30:18,450 --> 00:30:19,783 completely throughout everything, 799 00:30:19,885 --> 00:30:22,586 so I'm happy that I had the abortion. 800 00:30:22,688 --> 00:30:24,321 Because you felt like he raped you. 801 00:30:24,423 --> 00:30:25,355 Yeah. 802 00:30:25,457 --> 00:30:27,624 ♪♪♪ 803 00:30:30,296 --> 00:30:31,628 [paparazzi shouting at once] 804 00:30:31,730 --> 00:30:33,997 you know, while we were there, we also had a lot of opportunity 805 00:30:34,099 --> 00:30:35,899 besides being "playboy" playmates. 806 00:30:36,001 --> 00:30:37,734 Like, movies, commercials. 807 00:30:37,837 --> 00:30:40,103 We did the "guitar hero" commercial with brett ratner. 808 00:30:40,206 --> 00:30:41,271 We've done l'oréal France. 809 00:30:41,373 --> 00:30:45,175 We've done, like, just tons of stuff, 810 00:30:45,277 --> 00:30:47,644 and we did the "somewhere" with sofia coppola. 811 00:30:47,746 --> 00:30:50,581 Can you tell me how you got that role in that film? 812 00:30:50,683 --> 00:30:53,650 Sofia coppola contacted the mansion. 813 00:30:53,752 --> 00:30:55,786 They asked us, "hey, we have a part..." 814 00:30:55,888 --> 00:30:57,221 "do you want to come audition?" 815 00:30:57,323 --> 00:30:58,255 "...We want you guys to come and audition for." 816 00:30:58,357 --> 00:30:59,356 -she said-- -and then you got it. 817 00:30:59,458 --> 00:31:00,991 Both: Yeah, we got it. 818 00:31:01,093 --> 00:31:03,126 And hef was shocked. So they made a whole episode about it. 819 00:31:06,265 --> 00:31:08,465 Thanks for having us. 820 00:31:16,108 --> 00:31:17,441 Oh, yeah. 821 00:31:17,543 --> 00:31:19,843 -Oh. -"fan of your father." 822 00:31:19,945 --> 00:31:23,280 she's so uncomfortable. Like, he gave a backhanded compliment. 823 00:31:23,382 --> 00:31:25,415 It was almost like he was groveling to her. 824 00:31:25,517 --> 00:31:26,617 Both: Yeah. 825 00:31:26,719 --> 00:31:28,218 Clearly, he really loves celebrities. 826 00:31:28,320 --> 00:31:29,786 -It comes with movies. -Yeah, he loves movies. 827 00:31:29,889 --> 00:31:31,288 -It's a big deal. -It's movies. 828 00:31:31,390 --> 00:31:32,756 I'll tell you, this was the thing. 829 00:31:32,858 --> 00:31:35,859 When our, uh, red carpet came for the premiere, 830 00:31:35,961 --> 00:31:37,661 for the movie, we didn't want him to go, 831 00:31:37,763 --> 00:31:40,230 'cause I knew it was gonna be more about him, 832 00:31:40,332 --> 00:31:41,932 and he was gonna bring other women 833 00:31:42,034 --> 00:31:45,002 and make it more about them, and to us, this was, like, 834 00:31:45,104 --> 00:31:47,437 our--we did this. We got this on our own. 835 00:31:47,539 --> 00:31:49,740 Can we have this to ourselves? 836 00:31:49,842 --> 00:31:50,974 And so we told him 837 00:31:51,076 --> 00:31:52,442 we didn't want him to come to the premiere, 838 00:31:52,544 --> 00:31:55,379 and he said, "well, I'll send you with security in a limo, 839 00:31:55,481 --> 00:31:56,380 but you have to do movie night." 840 00:31:56,482 --> 00:31:58,348 "you have to stay for movie night..." 841 00:31:58,450 --> 00:31:59,783 -and dinner. -"...And dinner as normal." 842 00:31:59,885 --> 00:32:01,285 and this was what was embarrassing. 843 00:32:01,387 --> 00:32:04,521 By the time the movie ended, we jumped up, got in the limo, 844 00:32:04,623 --> 00:32:06,657 and by the time we got to the premiere, 845 00:32:06,759 --> 00:32:10,027 it was already halfway through the beginning of the movie. 846 00:32:10,129 --> 00:32:11,194 Sofia was waiting for us. 847 00:32:11,297 --> 00:32:12,863 He made you miss your premiere... 848 00:32:12,965 --> 00:32:13,964 -Both: Yeah. -...And the red carpet 849 00:32:14,066 --> 00:32:15,299 of your premiere. -Both: Yep. 850 00:32:15,401 --> 00:32:16,466 -So when-- -was he jealous? 851 00:32:16,568 --> 00:32:17,901 -100% he was jealous. -It was like 852 00:32:18,003 --> 00:32:19,236 he's now losing control of you, too, 853 00:32:19,338 --> 00:32:22,406 'cause you're out there starting to make your own career. 854 00:32:22,508 --> 00:32:23,640 Yep. 855 00:32:23,742 --> 00:32:24,574 And it's almost like he couldn't handle it. 856 00:32:24,677 --> 00:32:26,310 Yeah. 857 00:32:26,412 --> 00:32:28,578 He's actually made a lot of money off of us 858 00:32:28,681 --> 00:32:31,114 from just us living there. 859 00:32:31,216 --> 00:32:33,850 He really resented the success of the other girls that left, 860 00:32:33,953 --> 00:32:36,653 and he didn't want us to leave. 861 00:32:36,755 --> 00:32:40,023 Let's talk about how you were able, 862 00:32:40,125 --> 00:32:43,794 and I'm gonna use this word, escape. 863 00:32:43,896 --> 00:32:45,062 We actually were scared. 864 00:32:45,164 --> 00:32:46,863 We didn't know how to break up with him, 865 00:32:46,966 --> 00:32:48,231 so we went to mary o'connor's office 866 00:32:48,334 --> 00:32:50,467 and told her we didn't wanna be there anymore 867 00:32:50,569 --> 00:32:53,737 but didn't know how to tell hef that. 868 00:32:53,839 --> 00:32:56,440 It was like an hour goes by and then she calls us, 869 00:32:56,542 --> 00:32:57,808 and says, "hey, uh, come-- you girls come down here. 870 00:32:57,910 --> 00:32:59,943 I've got hef in here," and we were scared." 871 00:33:00,045 --> 00:33:02,045 -mm-hmm. -He was pissed. 872 00:33:02,147 --> 00:33:05,082 He said, "okay, so you guys wanna break up with me?" 873 00:33:05,184 --> 00:33:07,684 and we're like, "yeah." 874 00:33:07,786 --> 00:33:11,054 he said, "well, how about you go and live at the bunny house?" 875 00:33:11,156 --> 00:33:13,323 hef had a lot of the girls staying at the bunny house, 876 00:33:13,425 --> 00:33:15,759 which was across the street from the mansion, 877 00:33:15,861 --> 00:33:19,963 and he said, "I'll give you guys $500 a week rather than $1,000. 878 00:33:20,065 --> 00:33:21,098 -"you have to attend..." -attend. 879 00:33:21,200 --> 00:33:22,833 Friday, Saturday, and Sunday. 880 00:33:22,935 --> 00:33:26,670 We agreed, but the first night, we went out to a, um, nightclub. 881 00:33:26,772 --> 00:33:28,438 He saw that we were getting a lot of press, 882 00:33:28,540 --> 00:33:30,741 and he did not like it, and-- 883 00:33:30,843 --> 00:33:32,976 so he said, "you stay here at the mansion, 884 00:33:33,078 --> 00:33:34,511 and you can't be seen out, 885 00:33:34,613 --> 00:33:36,913 or you guys have to leave the playmate house," 886 00:33:37,016 --> 00:33:40,784 and we're like, you know what? That's great for us, 887 00:33:40,886 --> 00:33:43,253 'cause we just got a taste of freedom. 888 00:33:45,624 --> 00:33:48,658 ♪♪♪ 889 00:33:57,736 --> 00:34:00,003 it felt so weird, uh, going in a grocery store 890 00:34:00,105 --> 00:34:02,305 and just buying groceries. 891 00:34:02,408 --> 00:34:03,607 We just wanted to be adults, 892 00:34:03,709 --> 00:34:05,609 figure out who we are as adults and as women, 893 00:34:05,711 --> 00:34:07,644 'cause we weren't even women when we moved in. 894 00:34:07,746 --> 00:34:09,813 We decided to open our own full-service beauty salon 895 00:34:09,915 --> 00:34:13,583 in beverly hills, and we did do that for three years 896 00:34:13,685 --> 00:34:15,819 and then sold it. 897 00:34:15,921 --> 00:34:18,655 After you left the mansion, what was your emotional state? 898 00:34:18,757 --> 00:34:22,025 We were diagnosed with ptsd, 899 00:34:22,127 --> 00:34:24,461 and the psychiatrist said that we would need to go through 900 00:34:24,563 --> 00:34:25,929 a lot of therapy to unravel our brain. 901 00:34:26,031 --> 00:34:28,065 -Unwind our brain. -Unwind our brain. 902 00:34:28,167 --> 00:34:31,501 Can you describe why and how that has affected your life? 903 00:34:31,603 --> 00:34:34,237 -We're still dealing with it. -We're still dealing with it. 904 00:34:34,339 --> 00:34:39,276 Yeah. I don't think that that part is ever gonna go away-- 905 00:34:39,378 --> 00:34:42,245 that part of us that was taken will ever go away. 906 00:34:42,347 --> 00:34:45,015 And our mother passed away in 2014. 907 00:34:45,117 --> 00:34:46,650 And so when she was gone, 908 00:34:46,752 --> 00:34:48,885 it was like it just took everything away, 909 00:34:48,987 --> 00:34:50,554 'cause she was all we ever had. 910 00:34:50,656 --> 00:34:52,789 So you didn't have a biological family 911 00:34:52,891 --> 00:34:54,491 at that point once your grandmother passed. 912 00:34:54,593 --> 00:34:56,093 You didn't have your playboy family anymore 913 00:34:56,195 --> 00:34:59,029 because you left. -Mm-hmm. 914 00:34:59,131 --> 00:35:02,466 And so what did you wanna do with the rest of your lives? 915 00:35:02,568 --> 00:35:04,167 I think we're still figuring everything out. 916 00:35:04,269 --> 00:35:05,669 Yeah. 917 00:35:05,771 --> 00:35:06,536 We still are gonna work in therapy. 918 00:35:06,638 --> 00:35:08,138 Mm-hmm. 919 00:35:08,240 --> 00:35:10,907 We do wanna have a family of our own, 920 00:35:11,009 --> 00:35:13,643 but we need to get to the right space first. 921 00:35:13,745 --> 00:35:16,480 Have you been able to date since hugh hefner? 922 00:35:19,952 --> 00:35:21,284 Not serious dating. 923 00:35:21,386 --> 00:35:25,555 We can't emotionally...Connect like that. 924 00:35:25,657 --> 00:35:27,891 Did you ever go back and see hef again? 925 00:35:27,993 --> 00:35:29,759 When we heard he was, like, not doing good, 926 00:35:29,862 --> 00:35:32,362 went up for a movie night, like, at the end. 927 00:35:32,464 --> 00:35:33,864 We saw him in a walker. 928 00:35:33,966 --> 00:35:35,832 At this point, he's peeing in a bucket 929 00:35:35,934 --> 00:35:37,567 next to the bed. -Nightstand. 930 00:35:37,669 --> 00:35:41,471 He couldn't walk. Yeah, his health was bad. 931 00:35:41,573 --> 00:35:43,006 Did you pity him? 932 00:35:43,108 --> 00:35:45,909 I don't understand completely, 933 00:35:46,011 --> 00:35:49,679 but a part of me does feel bad. 934 00:35:49,781 --> 00:35:53,083 So it's like we wouldn't wish the worst on anyone. 935 00:35:53,185 --> 00:35:55,585 ♪♪♪ 936 00:35:55,687 --> 00:35:57,654 -people are gonna see this. -Mm-hmm. 937 00:35:57,756 --> 00:36:00,891 And they're gonna say, "the twins became famous. 938 00:36:00,993 --> 00:36:03,827 The twins were centerfolds. 939 00:36:03,929 --> 00:36:05,529 The twins got to live in the mansion. 940 00:36:05,631 --> 00:36:07,130 They got to live this life. 941 00:36:07,232 --> 00:36:09,032 Now they're coming forward after the dude's dead." 942 00:36:09,134 --> 00:36:10,200 both: Mm-hmm. 943 00:36:10,302 --> 00:36:12,202 Is that fair? 944 00:36:12,304 --> 00:36:15,472 But when we were staying there, he had a powerhouse behind him. 945 00:36:15,574 --> 00:36:17,541 He had a whole team-- he had a whole team behind him. 946 00:36:17,643 --> 00:36:19,376 He can hide anything. You can't even touch him. 947 00:36:19,478 --> 00:36:21,778 -He felt untouchable. -So he felt untouchable. 948 00:36:21,880 --> 00:36:23,747 He's squeaky clean. Untouchable. 949 00:36:23,849 --> 00:36:27,117 I didn't know how much power we had 950 00:36:27,219 --> 00:36:28,785 as young adults at 19. 951 00:36:28,887 --> 00:36:35,158 Like, we had a lot more power, but we didn't know. 952 00:36:35,260 --> 00:36:38,094 Coming up, dr. Kate balestrieri 953 00:36:38,197 --> 00:36:42,499 will talk to us about backlash and moving forward. 954 00:36:45,804 --> 00:36:47,671 ♪♪♪ 955 00:36:47,773 --> 00:36:51,875 talking about hugh hefner, he has a legacy, 956 00:36:51,977 --> 00:36:53,710 and people still exist that propped him up... 957 00:36:53,812 --> 00:36:55,478 -Mm-hmm. -...All those years. 958 00:36:55,581 --> 00:36:56,947 What would you like those people to know... 959 00:36:57,049 --> 00:36:57,881 -The truth. -...About how you feel 960 00:36:57,983 --> 00:36:59,549 about the legacy? 961 00:36:59,651 --> 00:37:01,851 He had a lot of power. It's a new... 962 00:37:01,954 --> 00:37:04,254 We're in a new era. We're in a new generation right now. 963 00:37:04,356 --> 00:37:05,222 We're in a new world. 964 00:37:05,324 --> 00:37:07,257 When the me too movement came out, 965 00:37:07,359 --> 00:37:10,093 it, like, kind of opened the floodgates for... 966 00:37:10,195 --> 00:37:11,294 -For a lot of women. -...For us to be able to talk 967 00:37:11,396 --> 00:37:13,530 and know that we're not alone in the situations 968 00:37:13,632 --> 00:37:14,664 we were all going through. 969 00:37:14,766 --> 00:37:17,467 -We have a voice. -Mm-hmm. 970 00:37:17,569 --> 00:37:19,569 ♪♪♪ 971 00:37:19,671 --> 00:37:23,139 we so appreciate you opening up and telling us your story. 972 00:37:23,242 --> 00:37:25,809 We know that it's painful. We saw how painful it was. 973 00:37:25,911 --> 00:37:27,911 I felt how painful this was for you. 974 00:37:28,013 --> 00:37:33,250 The story has been so powerful and really troubling. 975 00:37:33,352 --> 00:37:35,719 We brought out dr. Kate because we want her to be able 976 00:37:35,821 --> 00:37:38,989 to process some of the things that you are 977 00:37:39,091 --> 00:37:40,390 possibly experiencing right now as you're telling your story 978 00:37:40,492 --> 00:37:43,727 for the very first time. Dr. Kate. 979 00:37:43,829 --> 00:37:45,862 Well, hearing everything that you've been through, 980 00:37:45,964 --> 00:37:48,898 I really want to echo how brave and courageous it is 981 00:37:49,001 --> 00:37:51,201 for you to come forward and talk about everything 982 00:37:51,303 --> 00:37:52,502 that you have endured. 983 00:37:52,604 --> 00:37:54,971 This isn't easy for survivors to do, 984 00:37:55,073 --> 00:37:56,906 and I hope that both of you 985 00:37:57,009 --> 00:37:59,209 hold a lot of compassion for yourselves 986 00:37:59,311 --> 00:38:02,746 as you start to unpack all of this. 987 00:38:02,848 --> 00:38:06,349 Do you feel better now than you did this morning? 988 00:38:06,451 --> 00:38:07,851 -100%. -Yeah. 989 00:38:07,953 --> 00:38:09,252 -I feel better... -Yeah. 990 00:38:09,354 --> 00:38:10,287 ...Telling our story. 991 00:38:10,389 --> 00:38:12,555 -It's a lot to process, too. -Yeah. 992 00:38:12,658 --> 00:38:14,324 Like, I'll probably go to bed tonight thinking, 993 00:38:14,426 --> 00:38:16,459 oh, my gosh, and I'm gonna, like, you know, 994 00:38:16,561 --> 00:38:18,595 I'm just gonna probably rethink the whole day and everything, 995 00:38:18,697 --> 00:38:21,464 just to probably have anxiety, but...'cause it's hard. 996 00:38:21,566 --> 00:38:23,466 -Of course it is. -It's hard to talk about. 997 00:38:23,568 --> 00:38:25,835 Well, sometimes when people talk about the trauma 998 00:38:25,937 --> 00:38:27,137 that they've gone through, 999 00:38:27,239 --> 00:38:29,939 they can experience an emotional hangover. 1000 00:38:30,042 --> 00:38:31,775 -An emotional hangover. -That's amazing. 1001 00:38:31,877 --> 00:38:33,109 -It is, yeah. -I was just gonna say... 1002 00:38:33,211 --> 00:38:34,844 -Emotional hangover. -...Emotional hangover. 1003 00:38:34,946 --> 00:38:36,646 -That's what... -It's to be expected. 1004 00:38:36,748 --> 00:38:39,215 And I might encourage you to think about 1005 00:38:39,318 --> 00:38:40,884 getting a lot of support in the next couple of days. 1006 00:38:40,986 --> 00:38:43,853 You know, can you call the people you love and trust 1007 00:38:43,955 --> 00:38:45,588 and say, "hey, can you bring us some soup? 1008 00:38:45,691 --> 00:38:47,090 Can you bring us thai food?" 1009 00:38:47,192 --> 00:38:50,660 how do you like to be nurtured, and can you ask for that? 1010 00:38:50,762 --> 00:38:52,262 -I'll do that for you. -Thank you. 1011 00:38:52,364 --> 00:38:53,596 [laughter] 1012 00:38:53,699 --> 00:38:55,765 also, I think it's really important that if 1013 00:38:55,867 --> 00:38:58,301 there's a part of you that wants to process 1014 00:38:58,403 --> 00:39:00,270 how this special is received, 1015 00:39:00,372 --> 00:39:02,839 maybe ask a friend to read social media for you 1016 00:39:02,941 --> 00:39:05,642 and give it to you through a filter 1017 00:39:05,744 --> 00:39:07,811 so that you're not seeing those images 1018 00:39:07,913 --> 00:39:09,412 of what people have typed, 1019 00:39:09,514 --> 00:39:11,214 'cause that can lead us down a rabbit hole 1020 00:39:11,316 --> 00:39:14,417 of being constantly in a state of injury, 1021 00:39:14,519 --> 00:39:16,920 and we see the effects of that on social media all the time 1022 00:39:17,022 --> 00:39:18,988 with people taking their own lives 1023 00:39:19,091 --> 00:39:22,759 and people have significant ptsd, anxiety, and depression. 1024 00:39:22,861 --> 00:39:24,894 The other problem with writing something snarky about somebody 1025 00:39:24,996 --> 00:39:27,030 that you see on tv 1026 00:39:27,132 --> 00:39:28,498 is that other people are reading that tweet 1027 00:39:28,600 --> 00:39:32,669 or that post as well, and that has a silencing effect 1028 00:39:32,771 --> 00:39:35,105 on other women that might be considering coming forward. 1029 00:39:35,207 --> 00:39:36,773 It absolutely does. 1030 00:39:36,875 --> 00:39:40,310 It also creates a secondary victimization for survivors. 1031 00:39:40,412 --> 00:39:41,678 So when survivors are not believed, 1032 00:39:41,780 --> 00:39:44,414 when survivors are ridiculed, when they're harassed, 1033 00:39:44,516 --> 00:39:47,150 that compounds the trauma that they've experienced. 1034 00:39:47,252 --> 00:39:49,152 I mean, honestly, that's why I'm impressed with you, 1035 00:39:49,254 --> 00:39:51,955 because you've decided to come forward and share 1036 00:39:52,057 --> 00:39:54,357 these really traumatic experiences, 1037 00:39:54,459 --> 00:39:55,959 and you are such heroes for doing that. 1038 00:39:56,061 --> 00:39:57,727 -Thank you. -Because you'll never know 1039 00:39:57,829 --> 00:39:59,996 who you are impacting right this second. 1040 00:40:00,098 --> 00:40:01,531 What would you wanna say to the other women 1041 00:40:01,633 --> 00:40:03,466 that have endured what you have? 1042 00:40:03,568 --> 00:40:04,667 They're not alone, yeah. 1043 00:40:04,770 --> 00:40:06,102 And it helps to be able to tell our story, 1044 00:40:06,204 --> 00:40:08,004 but it is a healing process. 1045 00:40:08,106 --> 00:40:11,441 I just appreciate the women that are coming forward. 1046 00:40:11,543 --> 00:40:12,942 I appreciate hearing it. 1047 00:40:13,044 --> 00:40:14,511 We didn't just go through it ourselves. 1048 00:40:14,613 --> 00:40:15,545 It's a dark sisterhood, 1049 00:40:15,647 --> 00:40:17,313 but it's a lot of healing we gotta do, 1050 00:40:17,416 --> 00:40:19,749 so it's just gonna take time. 1051 00:40:19,851 --> 00:40:21,284 I am so thankful 1052 00:40:21,386 --> 00:40:24,521 that you wanted to come here and share your experiences 1053 00:40:24,623 --> 00:40:26,923 because they matter. -Thank you. 1054 00:40:27,025 --> 00:40:28,124 -And the truth matters. -Thank you. 1055 00:40:28,226 --> 00:40:29,692 -And I believe you. -Thank you very much. 1056 00:40:29,795 --> 00:40:31,161 Thank you. 1057 00:40:31,263 --> 00:40:36,433 ♪♪♪ 1058 00:40:36,535 --> 00:40:38,067 thank you for joining us. 1059 00:40:38,170 --> 00:40:40,103 This series was about providing a space 1060 00:40:40,205 --> 00:40:43,673 for women to come forward and tell their stories... 1061 00:40:43,775 --> 00:40:45,041 Okay. 1062 00:40:45,143 --> 00:40:47,143 ...And bringing those stories to an audience 1063 00:40:47,245 --> 00:40:48,378 who was ready to listen. 1064 00:40:48,480 --> 00:40:50,880 We wanna thank our brave contributors 1065 00:40:50,982 --> 00:40:52,816 and thank you for listening. 1066 00:40:52,918 --> 00:40:55,919 ♪♪♪ 1067 00:41:15,240 --> 00:41:17,440 next week on "secrets of playboy," 1068 00:41:17,542 --> 00:41:19,542 the whistleblowers reunite, 1069 00:41:19,644 --> 00:41:22,178 and a new survivor comes forward. 1070 00:41:22,280 --> 00:41:24,747 The fairy tale turned into a nightmare. 1071 00:41:24,850 --> 00:41:29,486 It went from being fun to being abusive. 1072 00:41:29,588 --> 00:41:31,654 This is a circle of people that expected you 1073 00:41:31,756 --> 00:41:33,122 to be sexually available... -Uh-huh. 1074 00:41:33,225 --> 00:41:35,725 -...For these men. -Day and night. 1075 00:41:35,827 --> 00:41:38,461 Did he have sex with you without your consent? 1076 00:41:38,563 --> 00:41:41,531 Yes, he did. -We really need to stop 1077 00:41:41,633 --> 00:41:46,302 idolizing a man who I can tell you was a rapist. 1078 00:41:46,404 --> 00:41:48,037 You're not getting away with this. 1079 00:41:48,139 --> 00:41:49,839 Whether you're dead or not, 1080 00:41:49,941 --> 00:41:53,042 we've never been allowed to tell our story, but it's our time.