You owned your own plane.
And he hit a cone
and caused substantial damage to the propeller and the engine.
Those cones are made of plastic.
I don't care. You don't have to be a genius to figure out
that the plane flew perfectly fine before you hit the cone.
This is Judy Justice.
Albert Le is suing pilot instructor Ed Myer
for damage resulting from Ed moving his plane.
Court, come to order. All rise.
Have a seat, please.
Case 2145, Le vs. Myer.
- Thank you. - You're welcome.
Mr. Le, you are an amateur pilot?
Yes, I was a-- Yes.
And you owned your own plane.
I bought it to train in, yes.
When did you purchase the plane?
In, uh... I believe...
April of 2021.
Did you buy it new or used?
I bought it used.
What kind of plane is it?
It's a Cirrus SR22.
2010, Type-Golf.
- What did you pay for it? - I paid 420,000 for it, I believe.
- Is there a mortgage on the... - Yes, there is.
How much?
It's 2204 per month.
You paid $425,000 for the plane?
Yeah, I put a down payment on it. The outstanding balance is 347,000.
- The payment per month is 2000-- - Okay.
I don't need the payment per month, I just wanted to know what you paid for it
- and how much you put into the plane. - Yes.
The defendant is a pilot, a licensed pilot,
and he was giving you some training on the plane.
A certified flight instructor, yes.
It is your claim that at some point, you'll tell me when,
that the defendant was operating the plane by himself,
you weren't there, and he was moving it from one part of the FBO
to another part, and he hit a cone and caused substantial damage
to the propeller and the engine. And while you had--
Your insurance did cover some of it.
According to you, it did not cover all of the expenses.
And you want Mr. Myer to be responsible for that.
So, it's a simple question.
Mr. Myer, do you remember the date
that you were operating the plane when Mr. Le was not there?
- Yes. - What date?
It was in April some time.
- April of 2022? - Correct.
Do you remember the date, Mr. Le?
- Yes. - What date?
It's April 22nd.
That sound right?
Yes.
Okay. And from what I read in the papers,
Mr. Myer had in fact taken you out, but then the weather got bad.
You decided that you would make your way home
and that he would get the plane home
- when the weather was better. - Correct.
And that was on or about April 22nd.
I flew home on a commercial flight the day before, on April 21st.
- And you stayed with the plane? - Yes.
Now, would you agree, Mr. Myer, that if, in fact, you hit an object
with the plane, it would be your responsibility?
Yes.
Because it would mean that there was some sort of negligence involved.
Right.
And then there would be the issue of damages.
Mr. Le, you were not present when this incident happened.
- I was not-- - Not present.
- I was not present. Uh, I was able-- - No. You were not present.
- I was not present. - That's the answer.
Was this witness present?
He was not present, but he was the one responsible for
procuring the evidence on what happened and how the propeller was damaged.
- Who does he work for? - He has his own flight school,
and he also manages my airplane in terms of the maintenance and the upkeep.
Okay. Could you step up, please?
- Tell me your last name. - Last name is Williams.
Mr. Williams, were you charged with gathering the evidence to determine
what happened to the plane on the 22nd of April?
Yes, I was.
And you're paid a monthly fee by the plaintiff
- to manage his plane. - That's correct.
Did you retain the defendant as an instructor, or did Mr. Le?
That was both decided by Mr. Le and Mr. Myers to fly for him.
But you did not--
He was independent contractor at that time.
You did not have anything to do with sel-- As the manager of the plane,
you didn't have anything to do with selecting Mr. Myer--
I did select Mr. Myer to fly with Albert.
You did?
- Yes. - Okay.
Because-- Were you the one who introduced him
- to Mr. Myer? - That's correct.
When, Mr. Le, did you start to work with Mr. Myer?
It was probably a prior flight
where we flew to San Francisco for a business meeting I had.
- After that, I believe it was-- - In what month?
Roughly about the same month.
- In April? - Yeah, in April, maybe.
- So, you didn't know him for a long time? - No, not very long.
I'm going to get back to you in a minute, Mr. Williams.
Prior to the defendant, had anybody else been an instructor for you?
Yes. Uh, Klinton was my primary instructor.
But I flew with some other instructors as well.
But it wasn't until the month that this incident occurred that you had been
- connected with the defendant? - Correct.
Okay. Now, sir, how were you advised that the plane that you manage
was in an accident?
I received a phone call from Ed saying that there was a problem--
- From whom? - From Mr. Myers.
That there was a problem with the aircraft after he taxied and did the run-up
and returned the aircraft back to Signature in Las Vegas.
We notified and contacted a Cirrus--
Did you ask-- What you would usually ask is, "What happened?"
Yeah, what happened--
Just a second. And what did he say to you?
He said that he was having instrument problems with the aircraft
and he wasn't able to take off, so he returned the aircraft.
At that point in time, I contacted a Cirrus service center.
I had two technicians go out and look at the aircraft, see what was wrong.
At the time, the technicians found that the--
Don't tell me what they found.
Okay.
You can't tell me what they found. It's hearsay.
They sent me pictures of the damage to the propeller.
May I see the photographs?
Okay. So that's a fresh damage.
- Correct. - Can I scroll this?
- Yes, you may. - Or it's just one?
Okay, so you have a picture of that, you have a picture
of the cone that has a slice in it.
Correct. That's the object he hit.
We also have a video showing the plane taxi
and hitting the cone at the time--
I'd like to see that as well.
- Okay. - Okay, let's see what we got.
As you can see where the--
Just one second.
Mr. Myer, is that a fair and accurate representation
of where the plane was before you moved it?
It should be the last, on the far left side of that Learjet.
Okay.
Oh. Mr. Myer, do you see that you went over a cone?
It's interesting, I didn't even notice there was a cone.
You may not notice it, but you see it now?
- Yes. - Okay.
Your hitting of the cone caused damage to that plane.
I mean, you're not talking about flying a 747.
You're talking about a little single-prop plane?
- Right. - Yeah. They're like those planes
you put together--
we used to put together with rubber bands.
I wouldn't put my behind in one of those planes for all the money in the world.
Albert Le claims pilot instructor Ed Myer is responsible
for damage after Ed moved Albert's plane.
Okay.
In all of my years of flying...
which is pretty significant, I was an airline pilot too...
I've never, ever experienced that in my life.
- Okay, but you see it now? - Yes.
It's not an "on purpose." It's...
You know, that's why they call them accidents.
- We don't mean for them to happen. - Right.
We don't mean for them to happen.
But you do see that the plane did hit a cone.
Right.
Okay. And I have photographs of the cone
that has a slice in it, the same kind of slice from one of the propellers.
Now... so, that's conceded, that Mr. Myer did, in fact, hit the cone,
which, in all probability, caused damage to the plane,
caused damage to the propeller.
Now, tell me about your insurance.
The insurance covered the propeller.
They covered the teardown of the engine.
When something strikes the propeller,
they have to tear apart the engine, make sure the components--
- Do you have those... - I do.
...that paperwork for me? I'd like to see it.
Okay, so, here is the insurance-covered portion.
And here is my covered portion that I had to come out of pocket
- to pick up the plane. - Okay.
And I can explain both invoices.
And if you flip to the last page, that'll have the total.
Insurance covered about 60-something thousand
for the propeller and the engine teardown.
Okay.
So the damage to propeller, Mr. Williams, causes you to have to
take apart the engine, fix the engine, if there was damage to the engine,
- am I correct? - That's correct. The FAA requires...
Any time you strike an object with a propeller, the engine has to be inspected
- and the component parts, so the-- - Component parts of the engine?
Of the damage, potential damage of the engine.
Internal damage that could be caused by striking an object.
Okay. The insurance covered how much, sir? Mr. Le?
It's, uh...
Sorry, it's on the invoice, 60--
I think it was 63,000, 64,000.
- It's on the last page. - The last page...
- shows $63,000. - Shows a deposit of 40--
Yes, that's it.
The deposit was 40, balance due was 23.
Did the insurance company pay the entire 63--
They paid the entire $63,000.
$63,000.
This was what was submitted to them.
Yes.
Okay, now I'd like you to take a look at this, Mr. Myer.
No, I'm going to actually ask Mr. Williams to take a look at this document.
These are the items, Mr. Williams, that Mr. Le says were uncovered.
I would like you to go through all those items
and tell me which of those items relate to the engine and which do not.
Okay, is this the total?
Carefully, 'cause I'm going to potentially ask you about each individual thing,
because there looks to me like some things that bear no relation to an engine.
Okay, so most of the items you see that are "airworthiness" on the airframe
are the items that need to be inspected or replaced from the teardown.
So, your item one, item two, three, four...
item five, six, seven... eight, these are all items that the...
repair shop goes through the engine and assesses whether--
Well, tell me how the brakes would be impacted...
- I don't think the-- - ...would be impacted by hitting the...
- Which invoice is this? - And I don't know--
but how brakes would be impacted by hitting a nose cone.
Brake lining. I don't know what that is.
Okay.
Yeah, some of these items, Your Honor,
such as one of these items, the brake linings, as you pointed out,
is probably not part of the--
Well, that's what I want you to go through, sir.
- Okay. - Do you understand?
I want you to take a marker, a pen, and circle, because...
- I don't know a whole lot about airplanes. - Okay.
But I know a little bit about airplanes.
I know what's routine maintenance and what has to be taken care of, because...
a plane either falls on its nose or falls on its tail,
both of which I've experienced.
Well, this is a small invoice. This is not your--
- This is-- - Mr. Williams?
Don't ask him. I didn't ask you to have a conference with him.
Okay. No, I--
I asked you to look at that. You're the management company.
I want you to strike those items that are not related to this accident,
and go through them very carefully, because--
- Can I make a comment? Okay. - No. Nope.
- To you, directly. - Nope.
Okay.
Can I... Can I ask you something?
- Can you ask me something? - Yeah.
Well, he should tell you those cones are made of plastic.
I don't care. They're heavy cones.
You hit the cone.
And the plane flew perfectly fine before you hit the cone.
It didn't run after you hit the cone.
You don't have to be a genius to figure out the cone caused--
Your hitting of the cone caused damage to that plane.
I mean, you're not talking about flying a 747.
You're talking about a little single--
- This is a single-prop plane? - Right.
Yeah. They're like those planes you put together--
we used to put together with rubber bands.
I wouldn't put my behind in one of those planes for all the money in the world.
The only items I can see, Your Honor, are two items...
that may not be related to the accident, items seven and eight.
- Okay. May I have that back, please, sir? - Sure.
And you are familiar with planes, sir, is that correct?
- Yes. - Okay.
So what you're saying is,
- item seven and eight. - The circled items.
Correct.
So we have...
There's a couple of--
We have right and left main gear...
143...
plus 270...
plus... 66.
What about item nine?
"Pitch trim jam nut loose." What is that?
Probably what they do during the inspection and the teardown,
they go through the aircraft itself, make sure it's airworthy.
So they probably caught another item or two.
You can probably put that on an item that wasn't part of the accident.
The big-ticket items, adding up all of these items, Mr. Myer,
that probably have no relation to the accident which you caused...
- Correct. - ...still bring the total amount
to more than this court's jurisdictional limit.
Can you tell me, sir, why your insurance...
Mr. Williams, let's go back to you. You manage this plane.
Can you tell me why Mr. Le's insurance didn't cover all the damage to the plane?
A lot of the prospective renters or instructors that everybody uses,
or we used in this case, have their own--
carry their own insurance for this type of incident.
Their insurance covers, basically, downtime loss of operation.
Or, in this case, uh...
- You mean Mr. Myer... - Yes.
...would have his own.
Do you have your own insurance?
- No. - No.
Don't you do a check to find out if they have their own insurance
before you recommend someone?
He had insurance, but it was lapsed.
If you have insurance that's lapsed, then you have no insurance.
- Yeah. That's correct. - So you're lucky that he's not suing you.
Albert Le is accusing pilot instructor Ed Myer
of hitting a cone and damaging his plane.
Ed says Albert was already paid by his insurance company.
Mr. Williams, you were the one who recommended
- Mr. Myers. - That's correct, I did.
Don't you do a check to find out if they have their own insurance
before you recommend someone?
He had insurance, but it was lapsed. It lapsed.
Well, that means he didn't have insurance. I get that all the time.
If you have insurance that's lapsed, then you have no insurance.
Yeah. As a flight school, our instructors are required to carry the insurance.
- Okay, but that didn't happen here. - That's correct.
So you're lucky that he's not suing you, 'cause you manage the plane for him.
And you recommended him, Mr. Williams.
You know, when you have a management company that manages your plane,
they're supposed to make certain that if you have a certain kind of plane,
that you have pilots certified to fly those kinds of planes.
And if they give me a list of pilots and those pilots aren't certified
to fly the kind of plane that I might have,
then it's the fault of the management company.
In this case here, the plaintiff and the defendant were working together
as far as their payment and their fees they were gonna charge.
Well, that's okay. That's okay. They may have been working head-to-head.
I mean, it was Mr. Myer's fault, but I'm just telling you
that Mr. Le relies on your advice.
What business are you in, Mr. Le?
I do commercial real estate.
I sell shopping centers and office buildings.
Okay. That's not his business, that's why he hires you.
And he hires you, he asks you for recommendations
as to where to get the plane repaired, for an instructor.
Now, the fact that he may pay him independently,
he's relied on you for information.
So, I suggest, Mr. Williams,
that you tighten up your ship a little bit.
Mr. Myer, you're responsible to the plaintiff for the damage
that you caused his plane.
Why did you let your insurance lapse?
It had lapsed-- I just didn't even realize the fact that it had lapsed.
I just realized the fact that when this came about,
that's what happened.
Well, when was the last time you paid premiums?
Probably about a year before that.
Anything else you want to tell me, Mr. Myer?
- Uh... - You owe him $10,000.
You caused the damage, you have to fix it.
Judgement for the plaintiff. We're finished. Thank you.
This court is adjourned.
I understand her point. The fact that-- What she saw.
I thought she's very fair.
These cones are made out of plastic.
It's hard to believe.
It sounds like a gunshot when you hit the cone.
And it triggered several warnings.
And for him to say he had no idea, it's a little bit hard to believe.
They don't have much weight to them.
With the loud bang after you hit it,
it's quite obvious that you should've stopped
and shut down and inspect the damage.
There normally is never a cone at the 12 o'clock position.
They're at the left side and the right side.
They place cones all the way around the aircraft.
And it's part of your responsibility as the pilot in command
to do a walkaround pre-flight,
make sure there's no object in front of your aircraft.
When I taxied out, halfway down, that's when I recognized
there was an EICAS message that came on.
I finally got it back, and no more student pilots,
so won't let any CFIs fly for a while.
You know what I thought about in this case, Sarah?
That laypeople have to look at something. Laypeople.
And while I'm in charge and have certain expertise,
I have no expertise in reading slips that show what's been done on a car...
- Yeah. - ...or an airplane,
or a train, or a boat.
- But we have common sense. - But we have common sense.
And your brakes are not part of an engine.
- Yeah. - You know, you have an engine job,
and then you have a brake job, and you have a...
- I saw where you were going. - ...different, different kind of...
And you know, if you have an accident that impacts on the right driver's door,
if you put in a new wheel casing in the left rear door,
well, that has nothing to do with an accident.
Probably just an oversight.
He did state that those two items were not part of--
- He did. He did. - He did at the end,
but it feels a little uneasy when they try and slip those things in there
that just common sense doesn't ring true
that it comes from the same incident.
- Yeah, you know, front, back, you know. - Yeah.
The head of a horse, the tail of a horse, it doesn't fit in.
And there's really no difference between not having insurance
when you're driving a car
and not having insurance as a flight instructor.
- Yeah. - Yeah. That's a pretty serious--
I would think there'd be a more rigorous check on that before you get behind
- an aircr-- the wheel of an aircraft. - Well, absolutely.
- You would think that there would be. - Yeah.
There's a flaw in the system someplace. Okay. I'm glad nobody was hurt.
Yeah.
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