[distant vocalizing]
-[whirring] -[bear squealing]
-[snoring] -[machines beeping]
-[horse neighs] -[handsawing]
[beeping, whirring]
[engine winding down]
[beeping continues]
[whirring]
Hmm.
[computer] Merging with simulator in three...
-two... -[whirring]
-...one... -[zapping]
[knocking]
-Hold on one sec. -[computer] Okay.
Mom?
Hi, Mom.
-Hi, Duncan. -Would you be in my vidcast?
[low voice droning]
What... What's it like having me as a son?
-[both laughing] -[urinating]
It is a joy having you as a son.
You, um...
How old was I-- How old was I when you had me?
[both laugh]
You were five weeks early.
[Duncan] Yes?
-[Mom] Yes. -What's the story?
Can you tell the story of my birth?
-Absolutely. -[Duncan] Then we'll get to you.
Sure, absolutely.
Well, you were five weeks early.
It was a full moon, of course.
And on the day of your birth...
April 20th...
Yes.
...we were splashing around in the pool with your older brother
and it became obvious to me that it was time to go to the hospital
-instead of hanging out in the baby pool. -[Duncan] Right.
Unless I wanted to have a baby in the baby pool.
-[Duncan] Right. -[Mom] Which I didn't.
So we went to the hospital
and you proceeded to be born as quickly as you possibly could.
-I had to get out. -Obviously, you did.
You had things to do.
And then... So then I popped out of you.
-Yes. -And then what happened?
Well, I mean...
What did you do? Did you look at me?
Or how does that work when you have a baby?
Well, you know, I don't want to get too personal here, Duncan.
-You can. They know everything about me. -Do they know this?
Do they know that you actually came into the world...
peeing on the doctor's glasses?
I haven't mentioned that one.
[both laugh]
I don't remember it.
Well, that's the first thing that happened.
You came into the world like you had saved it up for nine months, perhaps.
I still have to pee all the time.
Well, this was into the doctor's glasses.
So I piss in the doctor's glasses--
And I watch you do this.
When do they snip me?
After that.
So right after I pee in the doctor's face,
-he cuts off the tip of my cock. -He cuts...
Well, that...
Oh, I thought you meant snipping the umbilical. The next thing was--
No, circum-- Forget the umbilical!
When do they-- when do they do the circumcision?
[Mom] That was, like, two minutes later, I'm sorry to tell you, and you did cry.
-You did. -Of course!
You screamed.
-Who wouldn't? -I felt terrible.
I thought it was a bad idea.
[Duncan] So this is the process of an American baby.
American baby
-gets blasted out of the pussy... -[squeaks]
...sprays in the doctor's face and then gets the tip of his penis cut off.
And then-- then--
-No wonder we're all nuts! -[Mom] Oh, no, no.
That's not the end of the story.
-Then, they wrapped you in a pink blanket. -[Duncan] Oh, great.
-[Mom] They didn't have any blue ones. -"Humiliate him!"
[snickers]
"Snip off the tip of his penis and wrap him in a pink blanket."
[laughing]
It's like some evil initiation into a terrible fraternity.
Well, it was pretty funny, actually. It was a funny start.
All except the circumcision, which I think was a bad idea.
I would never circumcise another child.
How do you run out of pink blankets?
-[Mom] You mean blue blankets. -Blue blankets. It's your job.
I guess they had a run on blue babies.
-I see. -I don't know.
[Duncan] Hold on a second. I'm gonna make sure this is recording.
[squeaking]
So, um...
Yes?
You've given birth to me,
and then so what happens after that?
[Mom] Um...
-I proceeded to nurse you. -Right.
'Cause you were hungry. You were a little teeny guy.
-You were 5 lb. 19 oz. -Premature.
Five weeks premature.
But perfectly fine.
I mean, there was nothing wrong with your lungs or anything.
Now, if a child's born that early,
they'll put the child in neonatal
in the intensive care units and things like that,
-but you were fine. -[squeaks]
[Mom] So your brother walked into the room, saw me nursing you...
and screamed down the hall to his daddy
that that baby was eating Mama up.
[laughing]
I forgot that story.
[growls]
Kind of true.
-[roars] -[Mom] Yeah, that's what Jeff thought.
[Duncan] So Jeff just sees this emaciated demon sucking on his mom's boobs
and is probably traumatized about that ever since.
Well, he probably is still traumatized by it, come to think of it,
because this baby moved into his home.
Now, before you retired, you were a psychologist for many years.
-[Mom] Right. -[Duncan] How much do you think
that kind of thing has an impact on a person's personality?
[Mom] An unbelievable amount.
There is something that happens for that firstborn child
that changes them forever with that.
[Duncan] Because suddenly you just have to share resources.
[Mom] Well, suddenly you are called "big" when you're actually little.
[squeaks]
And so, you know, it's a mind fuck right then and there.
Right.
And they have to... I mean, an 18-month-old is in no way big.
They're still in diapers and they're still babies.
And, all of a sudden, they're really required to be something that they aren't
and it changes them forever.
[Duncan] "Be a big boy."
-[Mom] A big boy or a big girl. -[crying]
Be unselfish. Help Mommy with this baby.
Don't ask for anything. Don't wake the baby up.
-Try to be something that you aren't. -[squeaking]
-And it changes people forever. -So that...
You subscribe to the idea that the formative years...
create the beginning of a pattern that goes throughout your life?
[Mom] Yes. I would say that the first five years of our lives
shapes the personality structure in such a way
that any kind of spiritual work that you're gonna do later...
[barking, chattering]
...is going to involve looking back at the patterns
that were set down in your family of origin.
There's no way to avoid that?
No. Because, think about it...
I mean, anything that you were reinforced for in a positive way,
you're gonna lock in as the way a person should be.
So if people thought you, um...
were especially wonderful if you brought Mommy the diaper for the new baby,
then that's gonna tend to make you more responsible.
Maybe more responsible than you ever tended to be.
Maybe super responsible or maybe compulsively responsible.
-Right. -So you start with where you are,
but if you don't go back and see what's real and what's not real,
then you're missing your way into reality,
which is what spirituality is all about, as far as I'm concerned.
It's distinguishing what's real from what's not real.
And that's why a teacher is needed,
and the teacher needs to be devoted to truth.
[squeaking]
[all giggling]
Now the question is...
Just a lot of people...
I think about when I've been in very confused, turbulent times
where I haven't wanted to be who I am and I mentally dislike myself...
and I use that as a reference point.
[screams]
[Duncan] A tangled mess of poverty and debt
and confusion and, like, bad relationships
and just general chaos.
Kind of like when you're going down a river and you don't know how to canoe
and you end up stuck on the side of the river in a bunch of branches,
-covered in mosquitoes. -Mm-hmm.
So, many people, that's where they're at right now.
-They're just... -True.
-The canoe-- -Almost everyone is.
The rudder was messed up and they end up on the side of the river,
then they blame themselves for that and they hate themselves. They're on--
They try to pretend that the side of the river is where you need to be.
That there's some romance in getting gnawed on by weasels and bees.
How do we get-- How do you get someone from the side of--
If someone like that was listening right now,
and they're hearing you talk about a teacher or this or that,
and they're like, "I don't have enough money to buy a sandwich to eat today..."
-[Mom] Mm-hmm. -...what do they do?
What are some steps that they could take to begin this process of coming to truth?
I think the easiest thing for that person to do
is to get present.
And that means to put the past aside, put the future aside,
and sense into their bodies.
They can do that, even if they don't have a penny.
If we can learn to perceive and sense ourselves from the inside,
-our state of consciousness changes. -[sighs]
Is there a-- Can you walk me through what that might be like?
Can you sense the inside of your hand right now?
Hold on.
Like under my skin?
Yeah. Like inside your hand.
-Yeah. -You can sense it from the inside?
I can... I mean, I don't know if I'm projecting that feeling,
-but I can feel a-- -What does it feel like?
Kind of like when you push magnets against each other or something.
Kind of like a... Kind of like there's a nail going through it.
-Really? -And I am on a cross.
-[Mom] Okay-- -I am Jesus.
I'm just kidding. I'm totally kidding.
[laughing]
Can I feel inside my hand? It's a really... I've never...
-Sense your hand. -I've never...
I've never tried to do this.
Okay. We're gonna try it right now.
Okay, so sense your hand.
Sense your index finger from the inside.
Index. That's pinkie.
[laughing]
Okay.
-Yeah, it's kind of warm. -Yeah.
Warm and what else?
Numb. I don't know. Warm and numb.
-Numb? -I don't know if numb is the right word.
It just feels like an energy, you know.
Yeah, you're right. See if you can sense your whole hand from the inside
in the same way.
Take your time.
If you've never done this before, it's hard.
Yeah, I can feel something in there. Like...
You do?
Let it just... Gently let your attention go up your arm.
Yeah.
See if you can sense your whole arm from the inside.
Yeah, it feels like there's wolves running in my arm.
Oh. It does not.
See if you can sense both of your arms at the same time from the inside.
Yeah, I could do that.
And if you can do that, add your legs, so that you can sense your arms
and your legs at the same time from the inside.
Yeah, it's weird. Yeah, I can do that.
[Mom] That...
is presence.
That's weird.
-I've never done that before. It's weird. -That's presence.
And what you're doing is you're not in your mind.
This gets you out of your mind.
You are not mediating your sense of your arms and legs through your mind.
-[Duncan exhales] -Through your mind. Mental.
So that's a way to get out of your head.
That's what you can do immediately when you're on the side of the river
being nibbled by weasels and bees.
[whirring]
[gasps]
[exhales]
[squeaks]
[Duncan exhales]
[exhales]
[crunches]
[exhaling]
[crunches]
[exhaling]
[Duncan grunts]
-[squealing] -[baby crying]
[groaning]
[panting]
[screaming]
[Mom's voice] And so the next thing you can do, Duncan...
Yes?
...is, while you are sensing your arms and your legs simultaneously...
Yes.
...add two more facets.
Look. Sense your arms and legs and look.
-Look at what? -Whatever you see.
Just let it come to you.
-Don't search it out. -Okay.
Just take in what you see.
It's a bee with a thousand eyes and horns,
-holding a dagger covered in pentagrams. -If you're on the side of the river,
what else could it be?
-You know-- -Wait a minute. There's one more piece.
Go ahead.
And listen.
So you sense your arms and legs...
you look and you listen, all at the same time.
Three things you're doing.
Yeah, I get it. It gives you a kind of clarity. It kind of...
It gives you clarity
and it takes you into a slightly different dimension of consciousness.
[sirens wailing]
It's quite different, actually. It is quite different.
Because I've got a microphone in my face, it's hard for me to do what I would...
Like if I was really sitting by myself...
But I think that this recipe for a meditative exercise is awesome.
Well, what it does is it allows you to get into presence without a teacher
and without a penny to your name.
-Yes. -And even as you are in that...
um, state of presence...
if you are in it, even for a minute,
if you can stay in it for a minute, you will begin to sense the flow...
-Right. -...of energy.
You will sense that there is a river,
because a lot of people on the side of the river
don't even realize there's a river.
Right.
-So-- -What's the river?
It's reality, with its...
flowing dynamism.
I mean, if you look out there at the world,
you'll see that it's constantly changing and transforming all the time.
-The same thing is true inside of us. -[Duncan] Right.
And there's a flow to it. You can sense a flow to it.
But you can't unless you're in presence.
Because if you're in your mental thinking mind,
it's your ordinary mind and you won't be able to do it.
Right.
So, it's just really easy.
You can move back and forth
between these dimensions of ordinary consciousness
and something that is out of space and time.
Right. And that thing outside of space and time is...
Is more real than the mental constructs.
-That's your true identity-- -It's what we've been talking about.
'Cause all of that is just...
stuff that you've learned throughout your life...
because of the family you were born in and the situations you had,
the circumstances you were in and your natural proclivities.
What's interesting to do is, from that place,
if you can learn to stay in that place and sustain it for a minute...
-Say for a minute. -Yes.
Then you will find yourself with questions that come up.
Like just naturally arising questions. Not questions that you read in a book.
Just, "Hmm, I wonder..." something.
"I wonder how come blah, blah, blah."
And, generally speaking, the very first thing that is gonna come up
is a judgment about it.
Something that is gonna say, "This is a really bad idea.
Go back to being who you really are."
Which is your old ego self.
A dick.
[inhales deeply] You know, it's...
Perhaps a dick,
but, on the other hand, it could be a baby sucking tit.
I don't think so. I think most people, it's more... I would...
A baby sucking on a boob is a sweet thing, but many people are so...
[clears throat] You know, I see it as a kind of...
I've seen video of dogs that have been beaten
and someone's giving them meat.
And as they're handing the dog food,
all the way up to giving the dog food, the dog's...
[growling]
...pissed, growling. But you can see that the dog just can't control it.
There's people whose personalities have cramped up
and become a growling, snarling dog
and anything that you bring to it, it's gonna growl and snarl.
And that's why I say a dick.
Okay, but I...
You know, I could say...
I could say that is a perfect example of what I'm talking about
with the tit imagery.
The sucking the tit.
Because if you have been around tit suckers...
[laughs] My whole life.
If you have been around a real, live tit sucker, which means a baby--
Are you talking about a baby? Can we just call them...
-Let's call them babies. -Okay, we'll call this a baby.
-So-- -That'd be awesome
if people called babies "tit suckers."
[laughing]
Well, this baby... Okay, so there are babies that get so frustrated
because their mother does not come and deliver the tit...
when the baby wants it
that the baby screams and screams and screams.
By the time the mother comes, the baby is so frustrated, he'll bite her tit.
-[Duncan] Really? -Like the dog and the meat.
Yes. He'll reject her, even though he's starving.
[Duncan] So what you're talking about
is the way so many people are reacting to the world,
which is that they are so upset
that they haven't received the thing they wanted
and then when the thing finally does come,
they try to punish everyone around them with the thing that they got.
-Exactly. -Right.
And that drives it away.
Because if you are in a state of poverty,
there's a certain amount that you can control.
Some stuff, you might not be able to control.
When the tornado comes whipping through your neighborhood
and your house gets blown down and somehow you didn't have insurance
and you lose everything, you can't control that.
But you can certainly control how you're gonna react to that situation.
If you can become aware of your reactivity,
then you can respond to it more easily, rather than just repeat the reactions.
Because the house is always gonna get knocked down.
That's part of life.
The house gets knocked down.
There's just no way out of that.
There is no way out of it.
But if you will think about all the times
that your houses have gotten knocked down in your life...
Yes.
They are actually the transformative moments.
-[Duncan] Right. -[squeaking]
That kind of brings us to the idea...
to something that you have been dealing with for four years now,
which is that you have stage-four bone cancer.
-[Mom] Metastatic breast cancer. -[Duncan] Metastatic breast cancer.
And this is an extreme, extreme...
version of a tornado knocking a house down.
Because, four years ago, you called to tell us that that you had...
six months to live.
I have been told that at least a dozen times.
A dozen times that you've had six months to live.
I have been told to call a crematorium and find out how much it would cost...
[Duncan sighs]
...to be cremated, because I had maybe a month or six weeks,
and that I needed to know that,
so that I could pay the money up-front
-[beeping] -...before I die.
And I have made the call to the crematorium
and I found out that it was $750, thank you very much.
[Duncan] Wow.
God, that is so fucked.
The possibility that there is some kind of force that, um...
[whirring]
...will take us out when it's time to go out...
is nothing that I can do anything about.
-So I may as well make peace with it. -Right.
It's easier to go with the flow of that particular river
than it is to try to fight it.
That there is that possibility. We are all gonna die.
I know.
And that...
This is that saying, and I don't know where it comes from,
but that meditation is preparation for death.
I think that's true.
And meditation is one spiritual practice that prepares us for death.
But also, you know, if you look at the world,
what you see is things appearing and disappearing,
and humans are a part of the whole of that,
and humans appear and they disappear.
-[Duncan] Hmm. -Off the face of the Earth.
That just happens.
You know, our egos personalize it and we consider ourselves special cases.
-Yes. -But we're really not, you know?
We are a part of the whole
and everything in the whole transforms all the time.
It changes form. Transfigures.
You're a special case.
-[chuckles] That's 'cause I'm your mama. -[laughs] No!
No, I know there's... I know, but come on.
There's no way to stop the heartbreak. How do you...
What do you do about that?
You cry.
[vocalizing]
[sniffles]
It's really hard.
But it's definitely something everyone's got to, you know, deal with.
Yeah.
[Duncan] And it's such a strange thing.
I mean, the universe, it...
-it seems so stable... -[machines whirring]
[Duncan] ...if you are...
you know....
[whirring]
...in this kind of automatic state.
And the encounter with truth,
which, for me, you dying...
your dying....
This thing has been probably the greatest...
run-in with truth that I've had in my whole life.
You can't really...
It's inexpressible.
Yeah.
But it's not like it makes you feel...
This... This is not a feeling of, like...
-This is not a desirable feeling. -No.
But it's a feeling that every single human being will experience
one way or the other.
It is.
But so much... So many of us are spending so much time
engaged in just ridiculous activities,
it seems like, just to try to avoid this experience.
Exactly.
People really try to avoid the consideration that they are gonna die
and that people they love are gonna die.
It opens your heart. It breaks your heart open.
-[Duncan] Yes. -You know?
Our hearts have been closed, because we've closed them.
We've defended ourselves against pain.
And this opens them.
[Duncan] Opening your heart sucks.
-[Mom] It hurts. -[Duncan] This is the thing.
This is the thing Ram Dass talks about all the... It hurts.
Does it always hurt?
Does opening your heart always just hurt?
Are you just in a constant state of--
[Mom] No, it doesn't always hurt.
But when it really cracks open, it hurts.
You know? And it does.
Even the hurt transforms, because if you inquire into the hurt,
you know what you're experiencing is love.
-Right. -The real deal.
[explosion]
[sirens wailing]
[explosion]
[Duncan] Yeah, it's... Yeah, right.
Because it's seeing newness.
It's seeing how much you value life.
[Mom] Yes. And the reason I look better now than I ever have
-is because I am more fully living. -[Duncan] Right.
[Mom] Because I'm living and dying consciously.
Simultaneously, I'm holding both.
[roars]
[Duncan] What advice would you give to people out there
who are dealing with this?
[Mom] I would tell them to cry when they need to cry.
And to turn toward this thing that's called death. Turn toward it.
And even if you're afraid to turn toward it, turn toward it.
It won't hurt you.
And see what it has to teach you.
It's a tremendous teacher, free of charge.
I don't think it'd sell a lot of goddamn tickets if it was trying to.
[laughing]
That's a show I'm gonna skip if I can.
Ah.
Wow.
But it's a teacher. We're talking about teachers.
It's a real... It's the real deal.
Yes.
And, you know, what I find is that, um...
[Mom continues] ...the closer I get to physical death...
the more alive I feel
and the more present I feel and the more...
real I am.
And I realize that...
I have no idea what lies on the other side of...
physical death,
but that there is so much aliveness that's building in me...
that I can't help but think there is some connection between that
and the movement toward physical death.
-Yeah, well-- -I can't explain that.
I don't have an explanation for that.
But I do think that we suffer more
if we resist that flow of the river.
-Right. -And it's always flowing.
If we... If we try to get over there to the side,
so that we can get on the bank and be exempt from the flow,
that's where we begin to suffer more and more.
[explosion]
-It's just letting go into that thing. -Yes.
And the amazing thing about letting go into it
is that you find that this thing called love...
is supportive, that it holds us.
It has a quality of benevolence that we might have never noticed.
And we ask, "What's that?"
What is it that has the quality of benevolence?
And the only word that I can come up with is "reality."
Reality actually has this quality of benevolence.
[Duncan] Yes. Right.
And even benevolence is not...
It's a very small word for what it is, isn't it?
-Yes. -It's just like... It's just so intense.
This experience of love energy is so powerful
that to combat against it, we build an entire life, an entire ego,
to try to not feel it.
-Yes. -It is so overwhelming.
It is. It's a killer.
-It's ego death. -Yeah.
Not desirable.
It is desirable and that's why it hurts. It's ego death.
Your heart cracks open and your ego is dying.
Right.
But you find that ego death is a transfiguration.
It's an alchemical transfiguration.
Yeah. 'Cause, yeah, who wants to carry around this fucking weight?
You don't.
[cracking]
I don't.
Well, I love you very much, obviously.
I love you too.
And, Duncan, that kind of love isn't going anywhere.
That's another thing you find.
That I may leave this plane of existence sooner rather than later...
but the love isn't going anywhere.
I'm as certain of that as I am of anything.
Right.
I believe you.
Let's cut to a commercial.
[jazz playing]
[sirens wailing]
[man] Surround him!
Oh, Dad, come on! Oh! Ah! [screaming]
Unlicensed sim user,
you have been judged guilty of illegal harvesting by Magistrate Hoops.
-Lay down on your floor and crawl outside! -Ow! Dad!
Stand still. Listen up!
List his crimes.
I will list all your crimes.
Crime one, green oil theft.
Crime two--
[policemen] Cops, cops, cops!
Ow! Dad, no!
Open your eyes, Daniel.
No. Come on, Dad.
-Daniel, open your eyes! -Dad, no!
[gunshots]
[policemen] Crime four,
being stupid.
I'm a good dad.
Crime five...
Uh-oh, the feds.
Burn it, boys!
Yes, Magistrate.
[policemen] Cops! Cops!
-[policeman] Hiya! -Cops! [grunting]
Why won't it light, Jim?
If the wind's... The wind's shifted. Move over here. No, it's shifted back.
-Jim! -Still ain't working.
Cops!
We're cops!
I am a cop!
Criminal!
Eject from that simulator or I will blast you
in five...
-four... three... -[Duncan screams]
[gun cocks]
...two... one...
[barks]
-[explosion] -[all screaming]
Oh, dang!
[screaming]
-[explosion] -[all screaming]
[policeman] I need to-- Oh, my God!
[shrieks] It's wobbling! Forfeit your bodies, children.
We will live in the electric light!
[distant implosion]
[explosion]
Get in.
-[rock music playing] -[clinking]
♪ You lose your mind ♪
-♪ All things dissolve in time... ♪ -[playing rhythmic music]
[clinking]
♪ Slowly diminishing ♪
♪ And fears subside ♪
♪ All things... ♪
Do you mind if I interview you for my, um...
Am I dead?
Just be here now.
[playing rhythmic music]
[man] Just be here now.
[rock music continues]
[vocalizing]
♪ Ooh, all of your dreams ♪
♪ Will wash away ♪
♪ Ooh, all of your dreams ♪
♪ Will wash away ♪
[distortion buzzing]
[Mom] So, anyway, call me back whenever. I know you're busy with your podcast.
But what you were saying is so true, about the soul.
That's such an interesting thing and I wanted to talk to you about that,
because, only this morning, I was aware of this phenomenon in me
that my soul could come full circle and talk to itself.
-[drumbeat pulsing] -[Mom] But it's like I am...
The soul and I are not estranged anymore.
It's kind of interesting.
I'll talk to you later. Bye. Bye. Bye.
[man whispers] Wow.
-[electronic music playing] -[voice chattering]
♪ I am am not alive I am not alive ♪
♪ Floatin' in the air around you ♪
♪ Waiting for you To reach out, reach out ♪
♪ Floatin' in the air around you ♪
♪ Around ♪
♪ I am not alive But I never died ♪
♪ I am not alive I am not alive ♪
Chirp.