1 00:00:18,372 --> 00:00:21,417 [faint indistinct chatter] 2 00:00:23,669 --> 00:00:26,255 [zipper unzips] 3 00:00:27,965 --> 00:00:30,885 [soft dramatic music] 4 00:00:30,926 --> 00:00:38,100 * * 5 00:00:48,611 --> 00:00:51,238 - Looking like a veritable movie star. 6 00:00:51,280 --> 00:00:53,282 - Don't know how I got picked, Mr. Summers. 7 00:00:53,324 --> 00:00:55,159 - Oh, you were our number one choice, Janet. 8 00:00:55,201 --> 00:00:56,410 See you out there. 9 00:00:56,452 --> 00:00:58,746 - Here, Ma. Excuse me, Jerry. 10 00:00:58,788 --> 00:00:59,872 Where do you want this? 11 00:00:59,914 --> 00:01:02,666 - Oh, exam room. Thanks. 12 00:01:02,708 --> 00:01:03,918 - I feel bad asking, 13 00:01:03,959 --> 00:01:05,795 but do you think I could talk with Dr. Duntsch? 14 00:01:05,836 --> 00:01:08,172 - Oh, he's real busy. Can I do something? 15 00:01:08,214 --> 00:01:09,715 - It's more of a doctor-patient thing. 16 00:01:09,757 --> 00:01:11,050 - Definitely don't want me handling that stuff. 17 00:01:11,092 --> 00:01:12,468 I'll talk to him. 18 00:01:12,510 --> 00:01:14,136 - Thank you, Jerry. 19 00:01:14,178 --> 00:01:15,596 - Will you make sure your mom's memorized on what she's saying? 20 00:01:15,638 --> 00:01:16,555 I don't want her getting distracted 21 00:01:16,597 --> 00:01:19,433 with lights, camera, action. 22 00:01:19,475 --> 00:01:21,936 - Two reasons why patients normally present 23 00:01:21,977 --> 00:01:24,897 to their doctors for pain related to the spine. 24 00:01:24,939 --> 00:01:28,109 The first is related to the peripheral nervous system. 25 00:01:28,150 --> 00:01:29,944 That's called radiculopathy. 26 00:01:29,985 --> 00:01:31,862 Now, normally, that type of pain is associated 27 00:01:31,904 --> 00:01:33,489 with depression or with... - Yo, Chris. 28 00:01:33,531 --> 00:01:35,783 - Degenerative changes in-- - Cut. 29 00:01:35,825 --> 00:01:37,535 - [sighs] 30 00:01:37,576 --> 00:01:41,539 Okay, um, let's take a break. 31 00:01:41,580 --> 00:01:42,998 Knock out the patient's portion. 32 00:01:43,040 --> 00:01:44,250 Come back. 33 00:01:44,291 --> 00:01:46,961 - Good idea. 34 00:01:47,002 --> 00:01:49,338 Fuck me. 35 00:01:49,380 --> 00:01:52,591 I am so sorry. 36 00:01:52,633 --> 00:01:56,345 You're looking good. Feeling good? 37 00:01:59,432 --> 00:02:02,309 - I thought it'd be more professional. 38 00:02:04,562 --> 00:02:06,439 - Tell me what needs fixing, Chrissy, anything. 39 00:02:06,480 --> 00:02:09,942 - Kim's all over it. 40 00:02:09,984 --> 00:02:14,030 - I know you're in the zone, but Sarah wants to talk to you. 41 00:02:14,071 --> 00:02:17,324 Janet's daughter. Our patient? 42 00:02:17,366 --> 00:02:20,369 - Oh, yeah, that's fine. 43 00:02:23,539 --> 00:02:25,166 - Hey. Dr. Duntsch, how can I help you? 44 00:02:25,207 --> 00:02:27,209 - Hi, Dr. Duntsch. 45 00:02:27,251 --> 00:02:30,838 I noticed something in my mom's scar. 46 00:02:30,880 --> 00:02:34,925 Like, blue peeking out, like a piece of sponge. 47 00:02:34,967 --> 00:02:38,804 So I got some tweezers and... 48 00:02:40,014 --> 00:02:43,184 - Oh, wow. You should not have done that. 49 00:02:43,225 --> 00:02:44,935 - Oh, my God. What did I do? 50 00:02:44,977 --> 00:02:46,520 - No, it's just a stitch. 51 00:02:46,562 --> 00:02:48,689 It's fine, but-- okay, you should call me 52 00:02:48,731 --> 00:02:51,233 before you go digging around in there again, okay? 53 00:02:51,275 --> 00:02:53,819 - I did call a few times. - Quiet on set. 54 00:02:53,861 --> 00:02:55,613 - [shushes] - You ready, Jenny? 55 00:02:55,654 --> 00:02:59,825 - Should I tell my own story? Because this isn't my story. 56 00:03:01,285 --> 00:03:04,747 - Janet, you look great today. 57 00:03:04,789 --> 00:03:06,665 Thank you so much for doing this. 58 00:03:06,707 --> 00:03:07,458 [whispering] 59 00:03:07,500 --> 00:03:09,877 [dramatic music] 60 00:03:09,919 --> 00:03:11,837 * * 61 00:03:11,879 --> 00:03:14,632 - You did good. 62 00:03:17,218 --> 00:03:19,261 - [quietly] Yeah. 63 00:03:24,308 --> 00:03:27,603 - Roll camera. And action. 64 00:03:29,355 --> 00:03:33,693 - Dr. Duntsch is one great man. 65 00:03:33,734 --> 00:03:38,364 He is the best doctor I think that you could ever go to, 66 00:03:38,406 --> 00:03:41,742 and if you're having the problems that I had, 67 00:03:41,784 --> 00:03:47,915 you know, give him a call because he'll fix you. 68 00:03:56,173 --> 00:03:58,259 - No God damn way. 69 00:03:58,300 --> 00:03:59,885 - Mr. Duntsch... - Doctor. 70 00:03:59,927 --> 00:04:01,387 - I don't think you appreciate the position you're in. 71 00:04:01,429 --> 00:04:03,931 - Doctor. - Dr. Duntsch, 72 00:04:03,973 --> 00:04:05,933 I don't think you appreciate the position you're in. 73 00:04:05,975 --> 00:04:07,685 - No, I don't. 74 00:04:07,727 --> 00:04:11,397 I do not appreciate being locked up in a cage 75 00:04:11,439 --> 00:04:13,816 like a dog for a year and a half. 76 00:04:13,858 --> 00:04:15,651 And I certainly do not appreciate you telling me 77 00:04:15,693 --> 00:04:17,737 that my best bet going forward 78 00:04:17,778 --> 00:04:20,364 is not just to fire your asses and hire real lawyers, 79 00:04:20,406 --> 00:04:21,699 but to ask for a continuance. 80 00:04:21,741 --> 00:04:24,660 - I need to find someone to testify on your behalf. 81 00:04:24,702 --> 00:04:26,662 - Put me on the stand. 82 00:04:26,704 --> 00:04:28,497 If anybody else tries to describe what it is 83 00:04:28,539 --> 00:04:30,624 that I do or how I do it, 84 00:04:30,666 --> 00:04:32,668 they're just gonna end up looking like a bunch of jerks. 85 00:04:32,710 --> 00:04:36,172 - See, that right there is why you can't take the stand. 86 00:04:36,213 --> 00:04:37,715 You're emotionally driven. 87 00:04:37,757 --> 00:04:40,843 And when you're emotional, you can't control what you say. 88 00:04:42,928 --> 00:04:45,014 - [laughs] 89 00:04:48,059 --> 00:04:50,352 [grunts] 90 00:04:51,562 --> 00:04:53,314 [laughs softly] 91 00:04:53,356 --> 00:04:55,649 Try me. 92 00:04:55,691 --> 00:04:57,818 [soft tense music] 93 00:04:57,860 --> 00:04:59,737 * * 94 00:04:59,779 --> 00:05:01,864 - [sighs] 95 00:05:04,492 --> 00:05:07,411 You are a drug- and alcohol- addicted surgeon 96 00:05:07,453 --> 00:05:09,663 who was too impaired to perform surgeries. 97 00:05:09,705 --> 00:05:10,915 - Allegedly. None of that was-- 98 00:05:10,956 --> 00:05:13,793 - Like a drunk driver, which, by the way, 99 00:05:13,834 --> 00:05:15,169 you have on your record, Mr. Duntsch. 100 00:05:15,211 --> 00:05:16,379 - Doctor. 101 00:05:16,420 --> 00:05:18,172 - No, you're no longer a doctor. 102 00:05:18,214 --> 00:05:19,548 You had your license stripped. 103 00:05:19,590 --> 00:05:20,841 - Temporarily. 104 00:05:20,883 --> 00:05:22,510 - Not if we have anything to do with it. 105 00:05:22,551 --> 00:05:24,678 And how about that email? The one in which 106 00:05:24,720 --> 00:05:26,931 you're prepared to become a cold-blooded killer. 107 00:05:26,972 --> 00:05:28,349 - I never meant for that to be taken literally-- 108 00:05:28,391 --> 00:05:30,142 - You wrote it. 109 00:05:30,184 --> 00:05:31,685 So it was just a coincidence 110 00:05:31,727 --> 00:05:33,979 that you wrote that email to your lover, 111 00:05:34,021 --> 00:05:35,981 who also happens to be your assistant, 112 00:05:36,023 --> 00:05:38,275 just prior to killing or maiming over 33 patients? 113 00:05:38,317 --> 00:05:39,568 - It's not my fault! 114 00:05:39,610 --> 00:05:41,278 The anesthesiologists and the nurses 115 00:05:41,320 --> 00:05:44,156 and the fat fucking patients... 116 00:05:49,537 --> 00:05:51,914 [sighs] 117 00:05:51,956 --> 00:05:54,583 - Fire me, 118 00:05:54,625 --> 00:05:56,752 but know whoever slides into this seat 119 00:05:56,794 --> 00:05:59,088 is gonna tell you a version of the same thing. 120 00:05:59,130 --> 00:06:00,715 I am trying to keep you 121 00:06:00,756 --> 00:06:03,426 from spending the rest of your life in prison. 122 00:06:07,096 --> 00:06:08,848 - I don't want to. 123 00:06:08,889 --> 00:06:10,725 You've got my deposition, and you've got my records. 124 00:06:10,766 --> 00:06:12,059 I don't have anything more to give. 125 00:06:12,101 --> 00:06:14,061 - The judge ruled you have to testify in front-- 126 00:06:14,103 --> 00:06:15,271 - How could the emails not be true? 127 00:06:15,312 --> 00:06:16,397 He sent them to me. 128 00:06:16,439 --> 00:06:17,565 - The defense has a right 129 00:06:17,606 --> 00:06:20,109 to cross-examine you and confirm that. 130 00:06:20,151 --> 00:06:23,070 [soft uneasy music] 131 00:06:23,112 --> 00:06:29,910 * * 132 00:06:29,952 --> 00:06:31,287 - You know, I thought the other side of the world 133 00:06:31,328 --> 00:06:34,081 was far enough. 134 00:06:38,794 --> 00:06:41,922 They don't want me there because of the emails. 135 00:06:43,841 --> 00:06:47,636 They wanna know about us, about our relationship. 136 00:06:49,680 --> 00:06:52,016 [sniffles] 137 00:06:52,058 --> 00:06:55,269 [sighs] What are they gonna ask? 138 00:06:55,311 --> 00:06:57,229 - If it were me, 139 00:06:57,271 --> 00:06:59,940 I would remind them as often as I could 140 00:06:59,982 --> 00:07:01,901 that you two were sleeping together 141 00:07:01,942 --> 00:07:03,569 to establish a conflict of interest. 142 00:07:03,611 --> 00:07:06,155 - You mean to call me a whore who can't be trusted? 143 00:07:06,197 --> 00:07:09,033 - I know you're trying to leave this all behind, Ms. Morgan, 144 00:07:09,075 --> 00:07:11,619 but there's only one way to do that. 145 00:07:13,329 --> 00:07:14,663 [sighs deeply] 146 00:07:14,705 --> 00:07:16,916 - This is hostile. She's being hostile. 147 00:07:16,957 --> 00:07:18,501 - Do you need her to testify? 148 00:07:18,542 --> 00:07:21,170 - I do if I wanna introduce that email. 149 00:07:21,212 --> 00:07:23,255 - Can you prove your case without the email? 150 00:07:23,297 --> 00:07:25,007 - Precedent-setting is precedent-setting, 151 00:07:25,049 --> 00:07:27,676 Dr. Henderson. No one's ever done this before. 152 00:07:27,718 --> 00:07:29,512 Gotta assume every little bit helps. 153 00:07:29,553 --> 00:07:31,013 - She's been through enough. 154 00:07:31,055 --> 00:07:32,640 - What the hell are you talking about, Bob? 155 00:07:32,681 --> 00:07:34,600 She was in the O.R. She was in the consult. 156 00:07:34,642 --> 00:07:36,143 She had to know what was going on. 157 00:07:36,185 --> 00:07:38,020 You ask me, she hasn't been through enough. 158 00:07:38,062 --> 00:07:40,981 - What about questioning his training and the investments? 159 00:07:41,023 --> 00:07:42,525 And we have the hospitals moving him around. 160 00:07:42,566 --> 00:07:43,693 What? What? 161 00:07:43,734 --> 00:07:45,486 - We brought charges of elder abuse. 162 00:07:45,528 --> 00:07:46,821 The only way to prove that 163 00:07:46,862 --> 00:07:48,572 is to prove that he was trained well 164 00:07:48,614 --> 00:07:49,907 and that he knew what he was doing, 165 00:07:49,949 --> 00:07:52,535 the whole time, he knew he was going to harm her. 166 00:07:52,576 --> 00:07:53,619 - Well, what about the drugs? 167 00:07:53,661 --> 00:07:54,995 - That would be helpful, but-- 168 00:07:55,037 --> 00:07:57,123 - Fine, fantastic. Drag Kayla Gibson in here. 169 00:07:57,164 --> 00:07:59,834 - Unless Ms. Gibson knew he was high and was with him 170 00:07:59,875 --> 00:08:02,253 in surgery that day, it's inadmissible. 171 00:08:02,294 --> 00:08:04,255 - This is ridiculous. - No, it's not. 172 00:08:04,296 --> 00:08:07,800 You came to me to help you stop Duntsch. 173 00:08:07,842 --> 00:08:09,218 We have to choose. 174 00:08:09,260 --> 00:08:10,678 If he's our goal, 175 00:08:10,720 --> 00:08:13,639 then we have to focus on him and only him. 176 00:08:13,681 --> 00:08:15,975 [tense music] 177 00:08:16,016 --> 00:08:18,102 - State, call your first witness. 178 00:08:18,144 --> 00:08:19,019 - Drew Sweeney. 179 00:08:19,061 --> 00:08:20,521 - Joe Padua. - Harold Brennan. 180 00:08:20,563 --> 00:08:22,523 - Earl Burke. - Elaine Johnson. 181 00:08:22,565 --> 00:08:23,607 - Henry Aldrich. 182 00:08:23,649 --> 00:08:25,609 - Cindy Tremblay. - Stan Novak. 183 00:08:25,651 --> 00:08:27,611 - Would you tell us a little about yourself? 184 00:08:27,653 --> 00:08:29,447 - I'm 41. 185 00:08:29,488 --> 00:08:32,992 I work for the Collin County Medical Examiner's Office. 186 00:08:33,034 --> 00:08:34,493 - I worked for a pool company. 187 00:08:34,535 --> 00:08:37,997 - My wife, Shelley, was an elementary education teacher. 188 00:08:38,039 --> 00:08:40,541 - Dorothy and I were married 46 years. 189 00:08:40,583 --> 00:08:43,502 Two kids, nine grandkids. 190 00:08:43,544 --> 00:08:45,880 - Commercial construction project manager. 191 00:08:45,921 --> 00:08:47,673 - Started driving trucks in '98. 192 00:08:47,715 --> 00:08:50,092 - Two children--both had better be in school right now. 193 00:08:50,134 --> 00:08:51,969 - I'm an air conditioner contractor. 194 00:08:52,011 --> 00:08:55,139 - What were your symptoms prior to seeing Dr. Duntsch? 195 00:08:55,181 --> 00:08:57,475 - Light back pain. - Lower back pain. 196 00:08:57,516 --> 00:08:59,435 - We were decorating the Christmas tree, 197 00:08:59,477 --> 00:09:00,644 and Shelley missed a rung. 198 00:09:00,686 --> 00:09:02,021 - Neck pain. 199 00:09:02,063 --> 00:09:04,732 - Pain in the neck and numb pinky. 200 00:09:04,774 --> 00:09:06,275 - Numbness. Tingling in my finger. 201 00:09:06,317 --> 00:09:07,860 - Back pain. 202 00:09:07,902 --> 00:09:09,528 Hard to be a mom when you can't pick anything up. 203 00:09:09,570 --> 00:09:12,740 - Broke my back. Motorcycle accident. 204 00:09:12,782 --> 00:09:14,825 - How did you hear about Dr. Duntsch? 205 00:09:14,867 --> 00:09:16,410 - My doctor. - Family doctor. 206 00:09:16,452 --> 00:09:18,037 - Website called Best Docs. 207 00:09:18,079 --> 00:09:20,247 - Baylor Medical website. Five stars. 208 00:09:20,289 --> 00:09:22,583 - Seemed like he knew what he was talking about. 209 00:09:22,625 --> 00:09:24,877 - He told us he was gonna fix her. 210 00:09:24,919 --> 00:09:26,420 That's all we needed to know. 211 00:09:26,462 --> 00:09:28,214 - Arrogant. 212 00:09:28,255 --> 00:09:30,591 Told me he was the best in the metroplex. 213 00:09:30,633 --> 00:09:33,552 - So it's the day of the surgery. 214 00:09:33,594 --> 00:09:35,471 - I had second thoughts that day. 215 00:09:35,513 --> 00:09:37,765 - My understanding was my surgery was supposed 216 00:09:37,807 --> 00:09:41,685 to last a couple of hours. It took four. 217 00:09:41,727 --> 00:09:43,938 - When you woke up from surgery, 218 00:09:43,979 --> 00:09:45,272 what was that like? 219 00:09:45,314 --> 00:09:47,400 - A nightmare. 220 00:09:47,441 --> 00:09:52,029 I woke up in a nightmare, tubes coming out of everywhere. 221 00:09:52,071 --> 00:09:54,573 Feeding tubes, drain tubes. 222 00:09:54,615 --> 00:09:57,660 - I couldn't move, and the pain... 223 00:09:57,702 --> 00:09:59,829 - They were pumping me full of blood, 224 00:09:59,870 --> 00:10:01,455 and I didn't know why. 225 00:10:01,497 --> 00:10:03,332 - I was sore. I hurt. 226 00:10:03,374 --> 00:10:04,792 I was worse. 227 00:10:04,834 --> 00:10:08,170 - Couldn't move, and my wife told me he'd found a tumor 228 00:10:08,212 --> 00:10:10,464 and had to abort the surgery. 229 00:10:10,506 --> 00:10:13,050 It turns out it was a piece of my neck muscle. 230 00:10:13,092 --> 00:10:16,637 - Every bone hurt. I was crying. 231 00:10:16,679 --> 00:10:19,306 I'm sober, so I can't take the meds. 232 00:10:19,348 --> 00:10:20,975 - She never woke up. 233 00:10:21,016 --> 00:10:23,310 - I went home. I laid around. 234 00:10:23,352 --> 00:10:25,688 Wasn't eating or drinking anything 235 00:10:25,730 --> 00:10:27,148 'cause of the sore throat. 236 00:10:27,189 --> 00:10:28,899 - I remember being like I was a baby. 237 00:10:28,941 --> 00:10:30,776 You know, like a baby who can't hold himself up. 238 00:10:30,818 --> 00:10:34,321 First thing that went through my mind: what's he done to me? 239 00:10:34,363 --> 00:10:37,533 - He looked at the incision and said everything was fine. 240 00:10:37,575 --> 00:10:39,160 - He kept repeating himself. 241 00:10:39,201 --> 00:10:40,494 He kept saying that what was wrong 242 00:10:40,536 --> 00:10:42,038 wasn't related to the surgery. 243 00:10:42,079 --> 00:10:43,998 - I knew there was something wrong with this guy. 244 00:10:44,040 --> 00:10:46,167 Sorry, man. You looked high as a kite. 245 00:10:46,208 --> 00:10:48,002 - Objection. - Sustained. 246 00:10:48,044 --> 00:10:49,670 - Has this changed your life? 247 00:10:49,712 --> 00:10:51,630 - I walk with a limp. 248 00:10:51,672 --> 00:10:53,883 I have trouble with incontinence, 249 00:10:53,924 --> 00:10:55,509 erectile dysfunction. 250 00:10:55,551 --> 00:10:57,803 - I can't sing. 251 00:10:59,889 --> 00:11:01,724 Not that I was ever a good singer, 252 00:11:01,766 --> 00:11:05,728 but that's just an everyday reminder. 253 00:11:05,770 --> 00:11:09,357 - She was the love of my life. 254 00:11:11,067 --> 00:11:13,235 It's hard to get over a broken heart. 255 00:11:13,277 --> 00:11:14,904 - Just living one day at a time, 256 00:11:14,945 --> 00:11:16,447 just like recovery. 257 00:11:16,489 --> 00:11:19,200 - I can't play with my children like I used to. 258 00:11:19,241 --> 00:11:22,328 - I learned ways to control the pain, 259 00:11:22,370 --> 00:11:24,872 mostly through prayer and meditation. 260 00:11:24,914 --> 00:11:28,292 - I sit in a recliner, watch TV, 261 00:11:28,334 --> 00:11:31,712 a lot of medicine, antidepressants. 262 00:11:31,754 --> 00:11:34,423 - I miss her. 263 00:11:35,841 --> 00:11:37,927 She was-- 264 00:11:37,968 --> 00:11:41,680 she was a very-- 265 00:11:41,722 --> 00:11:44,600 very good woman. 266 00:11:44,642 --> 00:11:48,479 And that's all I can say. 267 00:11:49,271 --> 00:11:51,857 - Can you tell us how old you are? 268 00:11:51,899 --> 00:11:54,068 - 70. 269 00:11:54,110 --> 00:11:57,738 - And what did you do for a living? 270 00:11:57,780 --> 00:12:00,282 - I was a teacher's aide, 271 00:12:00,324 --> 00:12:04,412 and then I worked in physical therapy for a bit. 272 00:12:04,453 --> 00:12:06,789 Ironic. 273 00:12:08,165 --> 00:12:10,751 - What took you to Christopher Duntsch? 274 00:12:10,793 --> 00:12:13,796 - I had back pain for years, 275 00:12:13,838 --> 00:12:18,259 and it radiated to the end of my foot. 276 00:12:18,300 --> 00:12:21,512 And I tried all the treatments. 277 00:12:21,554 --> 00:12:24,765 Steroid shots, PT. 278 00:12:24,807 --> 00:12:26,392 Nothing worked. 279 00:12:26,434 --> 00:12:29,937 - Before you met the defendant, had you had surgery? 280 00:12:29,979 --> 00:12:31,981 - Mm-hmm. 2008. 281 00:12:32,023 --> 00:12:33,315 A laminectomy. 282 00:12:33,357 --> 00:12:37,570 It helped for a number of years, 283 00:12:37,611 --> 00:12:42,491 but it didn't last and then my pain management team 284 00:12:42,533 --> 00:12:44,785 referred me to Dr. Duntsch. 285 00:12:44,827 --> 00:12:48,956 - How did you feel going into the surgery? 286 00:12:48,998 --> 00:12:53,169 - Fine. Good. 287 00:12:53,210 --> 00:12:57,423 I walked into the hospital happy, 288 00:12:57,465 --> 00:13:02,053 and I was thinking, "This is gonna fix it." 289 00:13:02,094 --> 00:13:06,015 - And how did you feel when you woke up? 290 00:13:07,850 --> 00:13:10,102 - I was in pain. 291 00:13:10,144 --> 00:13:12,646 [disquieting music] 292 00:13:12,688 --> 00:13:15,649 I was in pain, 293 00:13:15,691 --> 00:13:18,486 and no one could tell me what was wrong with me 294 00:13:18,527 --> 00:13:20,988 until Dr. Henderson. 295 00:13:21,030 --> 00:13:23,824 He said that he thought that 296 00:13:23,866 --> 00:13:27,328 the fusion was improperly placed, 297 00:13:27,370 --> 00:13:32,333 and that something was pressing against a nerve. 298 00:13:32,375 --> 00:13:34,335 He said he didn't want to wait 299 00:13:34,377 --> 00:13:38,172 to operate on me, so they rushed me in. 300 00:13:38,214 --> 00:13:41,675 - What happened after Dr. Henderson operated on you? 301 00:13:41,717 --> 00:13:44,970 - The pain was much better, and I could-- 302 00:13:45,012 --> 00:13:48,391 I could move my right foot a bit, 303 00:13:48,432 --> 00:13:50,476 but not my left. 304 00:13:50,518 --> 00:13:54,480 - So prior to surgery with Christopher Duntsch, 305 00:13:54,522 --> 00:13:59,402 you had pain, but you could still live life. 306 00:14:00,986 --> 00:14:03,572 And now? 307 00:14:05,408 --> 00:14:07,034 - I wish I could go back to the days 308 00:14:07,076 --> 00:14:09,787 before I met Christopher Duntsch. 309 00:14:09,829 --> 00:14:13,582 [unsettling music] 310 00:14:13,624 --> 00:14:16,502 [faint indistinct chatter] 311 00:14:23,884 --> 00:14:25,177 - Would you please introduce yourself to the jury? 312 00:14:25,219 --> 00:14:27,346 - Randall Parker Kirby. 313 00:14:27,388 --> 00:14:30,558 I went to Rice undergrad. Baylor for medical school. 314 00:14:30,599 --> 00:14:31,642 Stayed at Baylor for 315 00:14:31,684 --> 00:14:33,769 my five-year general surgery residency 316 00:14:33,811 --> 00:14:36,522 as well as my two-year vascular surgery fellowship. 317 00:14:36,564 --> 00:14:39,900 I have privileges at every major hospital in Dallas, 318 00:14:39,942 --> 00:14:42,486 including Baylor, Medical City Dallas, 319 00:14:42,528 --> 00:14:44,238 Medical City Children's, 320 00:14:44,280 --> 00:14:47,533 Methodist, Dallas Medical, Presbyterian, 321 00:14:47,575 --> 00:14:50,453 and approximately 40 other smaller hospitals 322 00:14:50,494 --> 00:14:53,539 and outpatient surgery centers here in the metroplex. 323 00:14:53,581 --> 00:14:58,210 My area of expertise is anterior spinal access. 324 00:14:58,252 --> 00:15:00,463 I work with most of the neurosurgical 325 00:15:00,504 --> 00:15:03,716 and orthopedic spine surgeons here in DFW. 326 00:15:03,758 --> 00:15:07,803 I open up the chest and the abdomen so they can correct 327 00:15:07,845 --> 00:15:10,848 whatever deformity they need to correct in the front. 328 00:15:10,890 --> 00:15:16,353 I perform between two to four of these operations per day. 329 00:15:16,395 --> 00:15:18,773 Five--call it six days a week. 330 00:15:18,814 --> 00:15:22,735 I do hernias, gallbladders, 331 00:15:22,777 --> 00:15:25,404 blockages of the legs and the neck arteries, anyone? 332 00:15:25,446 --> 00:15:30,076 But my area of expertise and the chapters I've published 333 00:15:30,117 --> 00:15:32,328 have all been on anterior spine access. 334 00:15:32,370 --> 00:15:33,954 - And were you called in on a case 335 00:15:33,996 --> 00:15:36,082 regarding a patient named Joe Padua? 336 00:15:36,123 --> 00:15:39,043 - Yeah, he works with the company 337 00:15:39,085 --> 00:15:40,294 that takes care of my pool. 338 00:15:40,336 --> 00:15:42,963 I was asked to come in, lend a hand. 339 00:15:43,005 --> 00:15:44,465 It seemed nobody else was available. 340 00:15:44,507 --> 00:15:45,466 - Available? 341 00:15:45,508 --> 00:15:46,801 - Nobody wanted to work with him. 342 00:15:46,842 --> 00:15:48,135 - Objection. 343 00:15:48,177 --> 00:15:49,303 The witness has no way of knowing that. 344 00:15:49,345 --> 00:15:50,763 - [chuckles] Oh, I do. 345 00:15:50,805 --> 00:15:52,848 - Sustained. - Eh. 346 00:15:52,890 --> 00:15:56,227 - Did you know Dr. Duntsch prior to this surgery? 347 00:15:56,268 --> 00:15:58,854 - I met him one time before we had a conversation. 348 00:15:58,896 --> 00:16:03,109 I was scrubbing in on a case, and he tried to convince me 349 00:16:03,150 --> 00:16:07,113 that he was the best spine surgeon in town. 350 00:16:07,154 --> 00:16:09,782 I found the conversation disturbing. 351 00:16:09,824 --> 00:16:12,576 I mean, sure, most surgeons are superior sons of guns, 352 00:16:12,618 --> 00:16:14,286 some would even say yours truly, 353 00:16:14,328 --> 00:16:16,872 but this guy was next level. 354 00:16:16,914 --> 00:16:17,998 I mean, he tried to tell me 355 00:16:18,040 --> 00:16:19,375 that all the surgeries in Dallas 356 00:16:19,417 --> 00:16:22,378 were being performed incorrectly. 357 00:16:22,420 --> 00:16:25,381 - And what did you observe during your operation with him? 358 00:16:25,423 --> 00:16:28,050 - An anterior lumbar fusion at L5-S1 359 00:16:28,092 --> 00:16:31,637 is about the easiest procedure a spine surgeon can perform, 360 00:16:31,679 --> 00:16:33,556 and he just struggled. 361 00:16:33,597 --> 00:16:35,141 I mean, he was functioning at the level 362 00:16:35,182 --> 00:16:37,852 of a first- or second-year resident. 363 00:16:37,893 --> 00:16:40,688 Instead of using a scalpel to remove the disc, 364 00:16:40,730 --> 00:16:44,316 he just started grabbing at it with a double-action rongeur. 365 00:16:45,901 --> 00:16:48,863 All right, imagine, instead of using a pizza slicer 366 00:16:48,904 --> 00:16:51,866 to divide and conquer your extra-large pepperoni, 367 00:16:51,907 --> 00:16:55,327 you went after it with a pair of lockjaw pliers. 368 00:16:55,369 --> 00:16:57,830 Not appetizing, right? 369 00:16:57,872 --> 00:16:59,331 - Did it appear to you 370 00:16:59,373 --> 00:17:02,168 that there was more blood loss than there should be? 371 00:17:02,209 --> 00:17:03,878 - When he was taking the disc out, 372 00:17:03,919 --> 00:17:05,504 he took off a bit of bone 373 00:17:05,546 --> 00:17:08,549 from the bottom of the L5 vertebral body. 374 00:17:08,591 --> 00:17:12,178 In surgical parlance, he violated the endplate. 375 00:17:12,219 --> 00:17:14,513 Very difficult to do in healthy bone. 376 00:17:14,555 --> 00:17:16,348 He did the same thing to the sacrum. 377 00:17:16,390 --> 00:17:18,184 When you start chewing into bone, 378 00:17:18,225 --> 00:17:19,727 you get a lot of bleeding. 379 00:17:19,769 --> 00:17:23,731 It's not easy to stop bleeding when it's coming from bone. 380 00:17:23,773 --> 00:17:26,525 You're just really not supposed to do that. 381 00:17:26,567 --> 00:17:28,736 - What are you supposed to do? 382 00:17:28,778 --> 00:17:30,905 - Curet off the cartilage. 383 00:17:30,946 --> 00:17:32,656 A curet is like a scraper. 384 00:17:32,698 --> 00:17:34,492 You scrape off all the cartilage 385 00:17:34,533 --> 00:17:37,953 so you can get a proper fusion, and then heal bone to bone. 386 00:17:37,995 --> 00:17:39,872 - When did you leave the surgery? 387 00:17:39,914 --> 00:17:43,501 - Midway, I was called into a previously scheduled operation. 388 00:17:43,542 --> 00:17:44,460 Grudgingly. 389 00:17:44,502 --> 00:17:47,129 - Grudgingly. Why grudgingly? 390 00:17:47,171 --> 00:17:50,132 [soft tense music] 391 00:17:50,174 --> 00:17:52,843 * * 392 00:17:52,885 --> 00:17:56,263 - He was the neurosurgeon. He was in charge. 393 00:17:56,305 --> 00:17:57,848 I did my job. 394 00:17:57,890 --> 00:18:03,354 I did my best to guide him, and then I left. 395 00:18:04,271 --> 00:18:08,234 In hindsight, I suppose I could have dragged him out of there. 396 00:18:08,275 --> 00:18:11,529 If there's ever a next time, I will. 397 00:18:11,570 --> 00:18:14,490 [faint indistinct chatter] 398 00:18:15,491 --> 00:18:18,119 - State passes. - Defense. 399 00:18:26,794 --> 00:18:30,256 - You stated that Dr. Duntsch was operating at the level 400 00:18:30,297 --> 00:18:33,217 of a first- or second-year surgical resident. 401 00:18:33,259 --> 00:18:35,594 How many years does a neurosurgical resident 402 00:18:35,636 --> 00:18:36,804 typically study? 403 00:18:36,846 --> 00:18:38,556 - Six. 404 00:18:38,597 --> 00:18:40,683 - And would that include his training? 405 00:18:40,725 --> 00:18:43,644 - [laughs softly] Or lack thereof. 406 00:18:44,979 --> 00:18:48,357 - Or lack thereof. 407 00:18:50,234 --> 00:18:52,111 Well said. 408 00:18:52,153 --> 00:18:54,238 Defense passes the witness. 409 00:18:54,280 --> 00:18:57,116 - We stand in recess until tomorrow. 410 00:18:57,158 --> 00:19:00,119 [indistinct chatter] 411 00:19:00,161 --> 00:19:03,080 [dramatic music] 412 00:19:03,122 --> 00:19:10,171 * * 413 00:19:12,465 --> 00:19:15,634 - We can shift the blame to your training. 414 00:19:18,721 --> 00:19:21,182 - My training was some of the best in the world. 415 00:19:21,223 --> 00:19:24,518 - No, it was some of the worst. 416 00:19:25,686 --> 00:19:27,313 - What are you talking about? 417 00:19:27,355 --> 00:19:29,523 - We'll say you slipped through the cracks. 418 00:19:29,565 --> 00:19:30,858 You were told you were good enough to graduate, 419 00:19:30,900 --> 00:19:32,443 but you didn't have enough training hours. 420 00:19:32,485 --> 00:19:35,029 Your financial ties to Skadden 421 00:19:35,071 --> 00:19:37,281 and the rest of the investors blinded them to your-- 422 00:19:37,323 --> 00:19:38,491 to your flaws. - Stop. 423 00:19:38,532 --> 00:19:39,700 - The entire medical community 424 00:19:39,742 --> 00:19:41,243 of Dallas should have recognized it. 425 00:19:41,285 --> 00:19:44,330 Instead, they simply moved you from hospital to hospital. 426 00:19:44,372 --> 00:19:48,542 - You are erasing my legacy. 427 00:19:49,794 --> 00:19:51,379 - Legacy? 428 00:19:51,420 --> 00:19:54,757 Christopher, you're done. 429 00:19:54,799 --> 00:19:55,925 - Fuck you. 430 00:19:55,966 --> 00:19:57,176 - You'll never practice medicine again. 431 00:19:57,218 --> 00:19:58,844 - Fuck you. 432 00:19:58,886 --> 00:20:00,346 And why aren't you pushing back on any of their witnesses? 433 00:20:00,388 --> 00:20:01,806 - How exactly would I do that, Chris? 434 00:20:01,847 --> 00:20:03,808 - I don't know. That's your job, isn't it? 435 00:20:03,849 --> 00:20:05,935 You break them down. You tell them they're wrong. 436 00:20:05,976 --> 00:20:08,562 You get them to admit-- admit whatever it was 437 00:20:08,604 --> 00:20:10,106 that they lied to me about that messed up their surgery. 438 00:20:10,147 --> 00:20:11,315 - Chris-- 439 00:20:11,357 --> 00:20:13,317 - You do something to defend me. 440 00:20:13,359 --> 00:20:14,694 - The only witness, 441 00:20:14,735 --> 00:20:16,487 the only defense that I have right now 442 00:20:16,529 --> 00:20:20,199 is gonna speak to your narcissism. 443 00:20:20,241 --> 00:20:22,618 Our best bet is to prove 444 00:20:22,660 --> 00:20:24,328 that you never should have practiced medicine. 445 00:20:24,370 --> 00:20:27,123 Give me this. Please give me this, 446 00:20:27,164 --> 00:20:29,333 and we might be able to save you. 447 00:20:29,375 --> 00:20:32,002 - [sighs] 448 00:21:21,802 --> 00:21:24,472 - Thanks for being here today, Mr. Summers. 449 00:21:24,513 --> 00:21:28,017 Can you tell us how you know Mr. Duntsch? 450 00:21:30,936 --> 00:21:35,191 - We were classmates. Went to high school together. 451 00:21:35,232 --> 00:21:36,776 Lost touch. 452 00:21:36,817 --> 00:21:40,071 Reconnected when he returned to medical school in Memphis. 453 00:21:40,112 --> 00:21:43,657 - What led you to have surgery with Mr. Duntsch? 454 00:21:43,699 --> 00:21:47,244 - Sharp, stabbing-like sticking pain in my neck. 455 00:21:47,286 --> 00:21:48,621 Numbness. 456 00:21:48,662 --> 00:21:50,706 - Did he explain the risks? 457 00:21:50,748 --> 00:21:53,209 - He advised it was dangerous. 458 00:21:53,250 --> 00:21:55,920 He promised to take care of me. 459 00:21:55,961 --> 00:21:59,548 - What did you do the night before the surgery? 460 00:22:08,849 --> 00:22:13,229 - Watched a game. Basketball. 461 00:22:13,270 --> 00:22:16,190 Then I went to bed around 10:00. 462 00:22:16,232 --> 00:22:19,985 May--maybe more like 11:30. 463 00:22:20,820 --> 00:22:24,699 - What's the first thing you remember after the surgery? 464 00:22:26,325 --> 00:22:29,620 - I could barely move. 465 00:22:29,662 --> 00:22:35,042 I just kind of started freaking out, hollering. 466 00:22:35,084 --> 00:22:36,502 Wanting to know what was going on. 467 00:22:36,544 --> 00:22:39,755 - And did Chris come and talk to you? 468 00:22:39,797 --> 00:22:44,051 - Not at first, but eventually. 469 00:22:44,093 --> 00:22:47,138 And then they took me in for a second surgery, 470 00:22:47,179 --> 00:22:49,974 and when I got out, I couldn't move at all. 471 00:22:50,015 --> 00:22:52,935 - Do you remember making a statement in the ICU 472 00:22:52,977 --> 00:22:55,479 that you and Chris were doing cocaine together 473 00:22:55,521 --> 00:22:58,024 the night prior to surgery? 474 00:23:05,114 --> 00:23:07,950 - I wanted to see him. 475 00:23:07,992 --> 00:23:13,205 He wasn't coming around, and I--I was mad. 476 00:23:13,247 --> 00:23:15,332 I made it up. 477 00:23:15,374 --> 00:23:18,252 He was my doctor. 478 00:23:18,294 --> 00:23:20,546 I wanted to know why I couldn't move. 479 00:23:20,588 --> 00:23:22,673 He was in charge. 480 00:23:22,715 --> 00:23:26,177 He wouldn't come see me. 481 00:23:26,218 --> 00:23:28,512 - And he was your friend? 482 00:23:31,557 --> 00:23:34,518 Let the record show the witness nodded. 483 00:23:34,560 --> 00:23:36,771 He was your best friend? 484 00:23:38,773 --> 00:23:41,067 Let the record show the witness nodded. 485 00:23:42,735 --> 00:23:45,363 And he abandoned you? 486 00:23:45,404 --> 00:23:48,324 [pensive music] 487 00:23:48,366 --> 00:23:49,658 * * 488 00:23:49,700 --> 00:23:52,703 The State passes the witness. 489 00:23:59,085 --> 00:24:03,089 - I'm terribly sorry for what happened to you. 490 00:24:05,800 --> 00:24:10,096 You and Chris played football together, yes? 491 00:24:10,137 --> 00:24:11,305 - That's right. 492 00:24:11,347 --> 00:24:14,266 - And did you have some victories 493 00:24:14,308 --> 00:24:16,602 and some not-so-great games? 494 00:24:18,479 --> 00:24:19,647 - Yeah. 495 00:24:19,689 --> 00:24:21,941 - And how did Chris deal with those games? 496 00:24:21,982 --> 00:24:26,112 Did he always go in and always try to do his best? 497 00:24:27,446 --> 00:24:29,615 - Yeah. 498 00:24:30,449 --> 00:24:33,536 - Were you aware that he was in a fellowship program 499 00:24:33,577 --> 00:24:35,830 studying under Dr. Geoffrey Skadden? 500 00:24:35,871 --> 00:24:37,248 - Yes. 501 00:24:37,289 --> 00:24:39,834 - And from your understanding, was it very important, 502 00:24:39,875 --> 00:24:42,044 what he was doing for Dr. Skadden? 503 00:24:44,255 --> 00:24:45,381 - Yeah. 504 00:24:45,423 --> 00:24:47,633 - And things like doing surgeries 505 00:24:47,675 --> 00:24:51,262 while he was there under Skadden's supervision, 506 00:24:51,303 --> 00:24:54,557 that was important to becoming a successful surgeon? 507 00:24:54,598 --> 00:24:55,933 - Yeah. 508 00:24:55,975 --> 00:24:59,103 - Did you ever see Chris get out of obligations 509 00:24:59,145 --> 00:25:00,855 that he had at school? 510 00:25:02,314 --> 00:25:04,108 - I felt that way sometimes. 511 00:25:04,150 --> 00:25:06,110 - Can you give us an example of that? 512 00:25:06,152 --> 00:25:09,822 Like, something that you saw or that made you think that? 513 00:25:09,864 --> 00:25:12,283 - I can just remember maybe making a phone call 514 00:25:12,324 --> 00:25:13,743 to a doctor, 515 00:25:13,784 --> 00:25:15,619 maybe Dr. Skadden or another doctor, 516 00:25:15,661 --> 00:25:19,331 to say that he had stuff to do for DiscGenics. 517 00:25:19,373 --> 00:25:22,752 And I can remember them 518 00:25:22,793 --> 00:25:25,671 let him out whatever he had to do. 519 00:25:25,713 --> 00:25:27,631 - When you would find out that Dr. Skadden 520 00:25:27,673 --> 00:25:29,592 and/or some other doctor would just excuse him 521 00:25:29,633 --> 00:25:33,012 from doing things at school in lieu of staying in the lab, 522 00:25:33,054 --> 00:25:34,680 I mean, did you think that was a problem? 523 00:25:34,722 --> 00:25:36,807 - I never knew that, you know, what was happening, 524 00:25:36,849 --> 00:25:40,770 and so I--I--I don't know what he was missing 525 00:25:40,811 --> 00:25:43,397 or where he was going. So I--I don't know. 526 00:25:43,439 --> 00:25:44,482 - Okay. 527 00:25:44,523 --> 00:25:45,733 Well, did you ever meet 528 00:25:45,775 --> 00:25:49,236 any one of his classmates, or anyone 529 00:25:49,278 --> 00:25:51,322 who went to the University of Tennessee Med School, 530 00:25:51,364 --> 00:25:52,907 and talk to them about the rigors 531 00:25:52,948 --> 00:25:57,078 of completing medical school and completing that fellowship? 532 00:25:57,119 --> 00:25:58,746 - I don't remember. 533 00:25:58,788 --> 00:26:00,539 - You don't remember anyone saying 534 00:26:00,581 --> 00:26:03,542 that he only got through medical school 535 00:26:03,584 --> 00:26:05,294 because Skadden liked him? 536 00:26:05,336 --> 00:26:07,213 - I heard that after--you know, 537 00:26:07,254 --> 00:26:09,340 something similar to that since my surgery. 538 00:26:09,382 --> 00:26:12,551 - Do you remember who that was that told you that or is that-- 539 00:26:12,593 --> 00:26:14,512 - I heard it from a friend 540 00:26:14,553 --> 00:26:15,679 who heard it from another friend, 541 00:26:15,721 --> 00:26:17,139 and he made a comment 542 00:26:17,181 --> 00:26:21,685 that Chris was able to circumvent the program. 543 00:26:22,395 --> 00:26:25,439 - Did they attribute that circumventing to Dr. Skadden 544 00:26:25,481 --> 00:26:27,191 or some other doctor or both? - I don't know. 545 00:26:27,233 --> 00:26:28,442 I don't--I don't know. 546 00:26:28,484 --> 00:26:29,944 - Okay. - I don't know. 547 00:26:29,985 --> 00:26:31,654 - Okay, you said you understood-- 548 00:26:31,696 --> 00:26:32,988 - I think what they attributed to is the fact 549 00:26:33,030 --> 00:26:34,031 that they had companies with them. 550 00:26:34,073 --> 00:26:35,533 - Well, that was the next thing 551 00:26:35,574 --> 00:26:36,826 I was gonna ask you about. 552 00:26:36,867 --> 00:26:40,287 You said they had companies with him. 553 00:26:40,329 --> 00:26:43,374 They gave all the funds to those companies. 554 00:26:43,416 --> 00:26:44,667 - Right. 555 00:26:44,709 --> 00:26:47,002 - For him to do the research, right? 556 00:26:47,044 --> 00:26:48,170 - Right. 557 00:26:48,212 --> 00:26:50,464 - Okay, and it was very important 558 00:26:50,506 --> 00:26:53,551 that research be successful to those companies. 559 00:26:53,592 --> 00:26:55,594 Is that correct? 560 00:26:56,971 --> 00:26:58,389 - Yeah. 561 00:26:58,431 --> 00:27:00,391 - Now, when Chris moved here, 562 00:27:00,433 --> 00:27:02,143 did he cut off all work 563 00:27:02,184 --> 00:27:05,271 with Dr. Skadden and DiscGenics? 564 00:27:05,312 --> 00:27:06,480 - Not that I know of. 565 00:27:06,522 --> 00:27:08,065 - So Chris came to Dallas, 566 00:27:08,107 --> 00:27:10,693 and he worked at the Minimally Invasive Spine Institute. 567 00:27:10,735 --> 00:27:12,069 Is that correct? 568 00:27:12,111 --> 00:27:13,070 - Yeah. 569 00:27:13,112 --> 00:27:14,947 - And while he was working there, 570 00:27:14,989 --> 00:27:18,034 he was being pursued by Amy Piel at Baylor-Plano. 571 00:27:18,075 --> 00:27:19,076 Is that correct? 572 00:27:19,118 --> 00:27:20,745 - Well, she was interested in having 573 00:27:20,786 --> 00:27:22,705 a successful clinic on the property. 574 00:27:22,747 --> 00:27:26,333 - Mm-hmm. All to herself. 575 00:27:26,375 --> 00:27:30,087 Because if he was with Missy, 576 00:27:30,129 --> 00:27:33,966 she wasn't getting all the fees that he would generate. 577 00:27:36,302 --> 00:27:37,803 - Yeah. 578 00:27:37,845 --> 00:27:43,934 - So both the chair of his fellowship, 579 00:27:43,976 --> 00:27:45,853 the person responsible for his training, 580 00:27:45,895 --> 00:27:48,189 and one of the largest hospitals 581 00:27:48,230 --> 00:27:52,151 in the Dallas-Fort Worth area had financial reasons 582 00:27:52,193 --> 00:27:56,739 for ensuring that Christopher Duntsch was successful. 583 00:28:01,744 --> 00:28:03,913 - I'd say so. 584 00:28:06,874 --> 00:28:09,502 - Defense passes the witness. 585 00:28:09,543 --> 00:28:11,796 - Redirect. 586 00:28:13,172 --> 00:28:16,801 Did Christopher ever visit you after the surgery? 587 00:28:16,842 --> 00:28:19,970 After you returned home to Memphis? 588 00:28:21,514 --> 00:28:24,183 - Once. He came to visit. 589 00:28:25,684 --> 00:28:29,355 - What did you talk about? 590 00:28:29,397 --> 00:28:33,359 - His baby, his practice. 591 00:28:33,401 --> 00:28:35,027 Nothing in depth. 592 00:28:35,069 --> 00:28:37,697 - Did he ask about you? 593 00:28:38,739 --> 00:28:42,743 About what was happening in your life? 594 00:28:44,829 --> 00:28:47,415 - No. 595 00:28:47,456 --> 00:28:51,836 - Ms. McClung said that she was sorry 596 00:28:51,877 --> 00:28:53,337 for what happened to you, 597 00:28:53,379 --> 00:28:56,340 even though she has no connection to your surgery. 598 00:28:56,382 --> 00:29:01,512 Has Christopher ever said he was sorry? 599 00:29:01,554 --> 00:29:04,515 [dramatic music] 600 00:29:04,557 --> 00:29:07,601 * * 601 00:29:07,643 --> 00:29:10,062 - No. 602 00:29:13,232 --> 00:29:17,194 - Final question, Mr. Summers. 603 00:29:17,236 --> 00:29:19,321 He's here now. 604 00:29:19,363 --> 00:29:22,033 Is there anything you want to say to him? 605 00:29:22,074 --> 00:29:24,785 - Objection. - Sustained. 606 00:29:29,457 --> 00:29:31,208 - I love you. 607 00:29:31,250 --> 00:29:35,046 - The jury will disregard that last statement. 608 00:29:35,087 --> 00:29:38,132 - The State has no further questions. 609 00:29:49,643 --> 00:29:52,396 - Would you please introduce yourself to the jury? 610 00:29:52,438 --> 00:29:53,939 - Major Kimberly Morgan. 611 00:29:53,981 --> 00:29:55,441 United States Air Force. 612 00:29:55,483 --> 00:29:57,818 - And are you currently out on deployment 613 00:29:57,860 --> 00:29:59,904 in a location you cannot disclose? 614 00:29:59,945 --> 00:30:01,697 - Yes, ma'am, due to security. 615 00:30:01,739 --> 00:30:03,574 - Are you familiar with a person 616 00:30:03,616 --> 00:30:04,909 named Christopher Duntsch? 617 00:30:04,950 --> 00:30:06,243 - Yes, ma'am. 618 00:30:06,285 --> 00:30:07,703 I ran the office at his clinic 619 00:30:07,745 --> 00:30:09,205 and assisted in surgery. 620 00:30:09,246 --> 00:30:11,540 - Can you tell us what the defendant was like? 621 00:30:11,582 --> 00:30:12,833 His demeanor? 622 00:30:12,875 --> 00:30:15,669 - Caring, kind, 623 00:30:15,711 --> 00:30:17,797 always very nice to the patients. 624 00:30:17,838 --> 00:30:19,298 He took time to listen to them. 625 00:30:19,340 --> 00:30:22,051 - And did that change over the course 626 00:30:22,093 --> 00:30:24,387 of the time you were with him? 627 00:30:24,428 --> 00:30:26,931 - Yes, 628 00:30:26,972 --> 00:30:29,725 after the event in February 2012. 629 00:30:29,767 --> 00:30:33,062 - The event? 630 00:30:33,104 --> 00:30:34,689 - Jerry Summers' surgery. 631 00:30:34,730 --> 00:30:37,817 [tender music] 632 00:30:38,401 --> 00:30:42,321 Mr. Summers wasn't able to use his limbs, 633 00:30:42,363 --> 00:30:46,033 was having difficulty breathing, 634 00:30:46,075 --> 00:30:48,244 and then he talked about how he and Dr. Duntsch 635 00:30:48,285 --> 00:30:51,080 were doing cocaine the night before the surgery. 636 00:30:51,122 --> 00:30:53,749 - You were ordered to take a drug test? 637 00:30:53,791 --> 00:30:57,336 - Myself and Dr. Duntsch. I took it right away that day. 638 00:30:57,378 --> 00:30:58,587 - Did the defendant? 639 00:30:58,629 --> 00:31:00,005 - Eventually. 640 00:31:00,047 --> 00:31:01,340 It came back clean, 641 00:31:01,382 --> 00:31:03,509 and Baylor reinstated his privileges. 642 00:31:03,551 --> 00:31:05,052 - Shelley Brennan would be 643 00:31:05,094 --> 00:31:07,513 the last patient you assisted on? 644 00:31:09,598 --> 00:31:10,891 - Yes. 645 00:31:10,933 --> 00:31:13,436 - What do you remember about her surgery? 646 00:31:14,395 --> 00:31:17,356 [ominous music] 647 00:31:17,398 --> 00:31:24,196 * * 648 00:31:24,238 --> 00:31:27,867 - It's a simple surgery. 649 00:31:27,908 --> 00:31:31,162 In one day, home the next. 650 00:31:32,538 --> 00:31:37,418 - This is an email from Duntsch@TNIclinic.net 651 00:31:37,460 --> 00:31:39,587 to Kimberly Morgan. 652 00:31:39,628 --> 00:31:41,672 The subject is "Occam's Razor." 653 00:31:41,714 --> 00:31:46,761 "Kim, unfortunately, you cannot understand that 654 00:31:46,802 --> 00:31:50,097 "I really am building an empire, 655 00:31:50,139 --> 00:31:53,142 "and I am so far outside the box 656 00:31:53,184 --> 00:31:57,229 "that the Earth is small and the Sun is bright. 657 00:31:57,271 --> 00:32:00,274 "Anyone close to me thinks that I'm likely 658 00:32:00,316 --> 00:32:02,943 "something between God, Einstein, 659 00:32:02,985 --> 00:32:05,112 and the Antichrist... 660 00:32:05,154 --> 00:32:07,323 - Because how can I do anything that I want 661 00:32:07,365 --> 00:32:09,116 across any discipline boundary 662 00:32:09,158 --> 00:32:12,203 like it's a playground and never ever lose? 663 00:32:12,244 --> 00:32:14,372 Unfortunately, despite the fact 664 00:32:14,413 --> 00:32:17,917 that I am winning, it is not happening fast enough. 665 00:32:17,958 --> 00:32:20,294 What is the problem, Kim? 666 00:32:20,336 --> 00:32:23,589 It is simply that everyone else is human, 667 00:32:23,631 --> 00:32:26,175 and there's nothing I can do about it. 668 00:32:26,217 --> 00:32:29,303 So I pick and choose my humans 669 00:32:29,345 --> 00:32:32,390 and try to help them. 670 00:32:32,431 --> 00:32:36,227 You, my child, 671 00:32:36,268 --> 00:32:41,273 are the only one standing between me and the other side. 672 00:32:41,315 --> 00:32:46,612 I am ready to leave the love and kindness and goodness 673 00:32:46,654 --> 00:32:50,866 and patience that I mixed with everything else that I am 674 00:32:50,908 --> 00:32:53,369 and become a cold-blooded killer. 675 00:32:53,411 --> 00:32:57,331 The sad fact is, I could go faster, do better, 676 00:32:57,373 --> 00:32:59,542 catch more honor and respect 677 00:32:59,583 --> 00:33:02,044 by fucking everybody in the brain, 678 00:33:02,086 --> 00:33:03,879 emotionally and mentally controlling them 679 00:33:03,921 --> 00:33:06,132 in a manner that borders on abuse, 680 00:33:06,173 --> 00:33:10,344 taking no prisoners, sending everyone in my way, 681 00:33:10,386 --> 00:33:13,514 especially that fucks with me, to hell 682 00:33:13,556 --> 00:33:17,184 for the simple fact that they thought they could. 683 00:33:19,103 --> 00:33:23,024 What I am being as what I am, 684 00:33:23,065 --> 00:33:26,068 one of a kind, 685 00:33:26,110 --> 00:33:30,948 a motherfucker stone-cold killer. 686 00:33:35,119 --> 00:33:38,664 - I'll pass my witness, Your Honor. 687 00:33:38,706 --> 00:33:40,124 - I don't think it's morning 688 00:33:40,166 --> 00:33:43,419 where you are, but good morning. 689 00:33:43,461 --> 00:33:47,506 Now, the State is making a big deal out of this email 690 00:33:47,548 --> 00:33:49,258 they just read. 691 00:33:49,300 --> 00:33:52,053 Did you know Christopher liked poetry? 692 00:33:52,094 --> 00:33:53,846 - I found out later. 693 00:33:53,888 --> 00:33:57,641 - But you're not surprised by his--his flowery language. 694 00:33:57,683 --> 00:33:58,976 I mean, he sent emails 695 00:33:59,018 --> 00:34:00,394 like that one quite often, didn't he? 696 00:34:00,436 --> 00:34:01,812 - Yes. 697 00:34:01,854 --> 00:34:04,648 - Do you think Dr. Duntsch was a cold-blooded killer? 698 00:34:04,690 --> 00:34:06,233 - No. 699 00:34:06,275 --> 00:34:09,111 - Now, it's no secret that you and Dr. Duntsch 700 00:34:09,153 --> 00:34:11,947 had an intimate relationship. 701 00:34:11,989 --> 00:34:14,033 We know that involves sex, 702 00:34:14,075 --> 00:34:16,160 but was there an emotional element? 703 00:34:16,202 --> 00:34:17,328 - Meaning? 704 00:34:17,370 --> 00:34:19,997 - Well, among the people in his life, 705 00:34:20,039 --> 00:34:22,291 based on everything you saw 706 00:34:22,333 --> 00:34:24,919 working with him day in and day out, 707 00:34:24,960 --> 00:34:26,295 sleeping with him, 708 00:34:26,337 --> 00:34:28,589 you thought you were pretty close? 709 00:34:28,631 --> 00:34:29,757 - I thought so. 710 00:34:29,799 --> 00:34:31,425 - Close enough that perhaps 711 00:34:31,467 --> 00:34:35,221 you didn't allow yourself to see the truth? 712 00:34:35,262 --> 00:34:37,056 - The truth? 713 00:34:37,098 --> 00:34:39,141 - About his abilities. 714 00:34:39,183 --> 00:34:40,768 - I don't understand. 715 00:34:40,810 --> 00:34:43,354 - Was he a good surgeon? 716 00:34:45,272 --> 00:34:47,233 - That's outside my area of expertise. 717 00:34:47,274 --> 00:34:49,485 - You were in his office. You were in the O.R. 718 00:34:49,527 --> 00:34:51,028 You don't have a professional opinion? 719 00:34:51,070 --> 00:34:53,197 - No. 720 00:34:53,239 --> 00:34:55,241 - Okay, well, after Shelley Brennan, 721 00:34:55,282 --> 00:34:57,451 did you ever work with Dr. Duntsch again? 722 00:34:57,493 --> 00:34:58,953 - No. - Why not? 723 00:34:58,994 --> 00:35:03,249 - I didn't wanna be in that environment anymore. 724 00:35:03,290 --> 00:35:05,626 - That environment? What environment? 725 00:35:05,668 --> 00:35:08,129 [uneasy music] 726 00:35:08,170 --> 00:35:10,172 * * 727 00:35:10,214 --> 00:35:14,260 - Unhealthy, you know? 728 00:35:14,301 --> 00:35:16,303 - You mean the environment in which patients 729 00:35:16,345 --> 00:35:17,555 were being maimed and killed? 730 00:35:17,596 --> 00:35:19,724 - Objection. - Sustained. 731 00:35:19,765 --> 00:35:21,350 - Just one more question. 732 00:35:21,392 --> 00:35:23,853 If you believed that Dr. Duntsch 733 00:35:23,894 --> 00:35:26,439 wanted to hurt patients, 734 00:35:26,480 --> 00:35:28,691 you certainly would go and tell somebody about that, 735 00:35:28,733 --> 00:35:31,444 wouldn't you? 736 00:35:35,823 --> 00:35:38,576 - Yes, ma'am. 737 00:35:39,869 --> 00:35:41,620 - Pass the witness. 738 00:35:41,662 --> 00:35:46,000 Stay safe, Ms. Morgan, wherever you've gone. 739 00:35:46,042 --> 00:35:50,755 * * 740 00:36:02,391 --> 00:36:05,394 - How are you feeling? 741 00:36:05,436 --> 00:36:08,564 - If they ask me questions about Duntsch's training, 742 00:36:08,606 --> 00:36:11,776 I can't promise you what I'm going to say. 743 00:36:13,194 --> 00:36:15,196 - Yeah. 744 00:36:17,531 --> 00:36:19,909 If we can't present our entire case, 745 00:36:19,950 --> 00:36:22,453 the good, bad, everything, 746 00:36:22,495 --> 00:36:25,164 if we can't lay it all out and still win, 747 00:36:25,206 --> 00:36:27,041 then we shouldn't win. 748 00:36:27,083 --> 00:36:28,876 [cell phone buzzes] 749 00:36:28,918 --> 00:36:30,211 - You take that call. 750 00:36:30,252 --> 00:36:32,671 - Hey, Ma. Hang on a sec. 751 00:36:32,713 --> 00:36:35,216 Dr. Henderson. 752 00:36:35,257 --> 00:36:39,428 If they ask, answer how you want. 753 00:36:41,263 --> 00:36:44,141 - Thank you. 754 00:36:45,643 --> 00:36:48,521 - Yeah, I'm here. 755 00:37:12,461 --> 00:37:14,755 We asked you here to give your opinion 756 00:37:14,797 --> 00:37:17,925 on four different cases the defendant performed. 757 00:37:17,967 --> 00:37:21,595 What surgery did the defendant recommend for Jerry Summers? 758 00:37:21,637 --> 00:37:26,767 - An anterior cervical fusion at C3-4 and C4-5. 759 00:37:26,809 --> 00:37:29,979 - What was the outcome of Mr. Summer's surgery? 760 00:37:30,021 --> 00:37:32,189 - He was rendered a quadriplegic. 761 00:37:34,150 --> 00:37:35,526 - Would you walk us through it? 762 00:37:35,568 --> 00:37:37,236 - There was a lot of bleeding. 763 00:37:37,278 --> 00:37:40,823 - Suction. - Suction. 764 00:37:40,865 --> 00:37:43,576 - Sponge. Give me a sponge. 765 00:37:43,617 --> 00:37:46,328 - How many CCs were lost? 766 00:37:47,955 --> 00:37:52,168 - A typical loss is somewhere between 25 and 200 CCs. 767 00:37:52,209 --> 00:37:55,546 Mr. Summers lost 1,900 CCs. 768 00:37:55,588 --> 00:37:58,924 - What accounts for that amount of blood loss? 769 00:37:58,966 --> 00:38:00,968 - Injuring a major structure. 770 00:38:01,010 --> 00:38:02,428 - Pituitary. 771 00:38:02,470 --> 00:38:05,598 - He removed the disc from C3-4 and C4-5, 772 00:38:05,639 --> 00:38:07,391 as he was supposed to do, 773 00:38:07,433 --> 00:38:09,810 and then he removed a tremendous amount of bone 774 00:38:09,852 --> 00:38:11,854 on the left side. 775 00:38:12,438 --> 00:38:15,107 Over a third of the vertebral body. 776 00:38:15,149 --> 00:38:19,570 And in doing so, he lacerated the vertebral artery. 777 00:38:23,240 --> 00:38:27,328 - The defendant chose to go back in for a second surgery. 778 00:38:27,370 --> 00:38:29,038 What procedure did he perform? 779 00:38:29,080 --> 00:38:30,748 - Double action. 780 00:38:30,790 --> 00:38:34,502 - A laminectomy in order to relieve pressure on the spine. 781 00:38:34,543 --> 00:38:36,587 But by removing excessive bone 782 00:38:36,629 --> 00:38:38,714 from both the front and the back, 783 00:38:38,756 --> 00:38:41,801 you're compromising the entire structure. 784 00:38:41,842 --> 00:38:44,637 - In layman's terms? 785 00:38:44,678 --> 00:38:48,349 - His head was barely attached to his spine. 786 00:38:48,391 --> 00:38:51,685 [soft gasps, exhales] 787 00:38:51,727 --> 00:38:53,729 - Let's move on to Shelley Brennan. 788 00:38:53,771 --> 00:38:56,315 The surgery Duntsch recommended, 789 00:38:56,357 --> 00:38:58,734 was that a surgery that would fix her issue? 790 00:38:58,776 --> 00:39:00,111 - Yes. 791 00:39:00,152 --> 00:39:03,114 - What was the outcome of Mrs. Brennan's operation? 792 00:39:03,155 --> 00:39:04,865 - She died. 793 00:39:04,907 --> 00:39:07,410 - Is that normal for this type of procedure? 794 00:39:07,451 --> 00:39:11,372 - Mortalities are less than 1 in 10,000. 795 00:39:11,414 --> 00:39:14,166 The pituitary rongeur went through 796 00:39:14,208 --> 00:39:17,378 the ligament in the front and lacerated the iliac vessels 797 00:39:17,420 --> 00:39:19,588 that lie directly on the side. 798 00:39:19,630 --> 00:39:22,091 - So Mrs. Brennan was bleeding? 799 00:39:22,133 --> 00:39:23,175 - Heavily. 800 00:39:23,217 --> 00:39:24,385 - Would there have been blood 801 00:39:24,427 --> 00:39:26,721 visible in the operative site? 802 00:39:26,762 --> 00:39:28,097 - Sometimes, yes. 803 00:39:28,139 --> 00:39:30,224 It doesn't appear to have been the case here, 804 00:39:30,266 --> 00:39:32,435 but they should have noticed a drop in her blood pressure. 805 00:39:32,476 --> 00:39:37,606 - Should a neurosurgeon know that a drop in blood pressure 806 00:39:37,648 --> 00:39:39,233 means there's a bleed somewhere? 807 00:39:39,275 --> 00:39:44,071 - It's a fundamental rule, but the likelihood of them 808 00:39:44,113 --> 00:39:47,074 being able to address the issue is small. 809 00:39:47,116 --> 00:39:51,287 They'd call in a vascular surgeon for assistance. 810 00:39:51,328 --> 00:39:53,956 - But he didn't do that. 811 00:39:55,958 --> 00:39:58,252 - No. 812 00:39:58,294 --> 00:39:59,754 - Dorothy Burke. 813 00:39:59,795 --> 00:40:03,007 - Mrs. Burke had a previous anterior cervical fusion 814 00:40:03,049 --> 00:40:08,012 at C5-6 and C6-7 that resolved her symptoms for a time, 815 00:40:08,054 --> 00:40:10,598 but she began experiencing neck and shoulder pain 816 00:40:10,639 --> 00:40:13,392 that had nothing to do with her prior surgery. 817 00:40:13,434 --> 00:40:17,063 Dr. Duntsch diagnosed a disc protrusion at C4-5 818 00:40:17,104 --> 00:40:20,733 and a disc extrusion at the C7 T1 level. 819 00:40:20,775 --> 00:40:25,237 He sliced through the vertebral artery again. 820 00:40:25,279 --> 00:40:28,407 [monitor beeping] 821 00:40:31,285 --> 00:40:35,373 - We've been talking a lot about the vertebral artery. 822 00:40:35,414 --> 00:40:37,958 Is it common for it to be hit during surgery? 823 00:40:38,000 --> 00:40:39,418 - Exceptionally rare. 824 00:40:39,460 --> 00:40:40,753 - How many times have you hit it? 825 00:40:40,795 --> 00:40:42,171 - Never. 826 00:40:42,213 --> 00:40:44,757 - And what happened to Mrs. Burke after her surgery? 827 00:40:44,799 --> 00:40:48,469 - Her heart rate elevated. She couldn't open her eyes. 828 00:40:48,511 --> 00:40:51,931 No verbal response to questioning or commands. 829 00:40:51,972 --> 00:40:56,519 - And what does that indicate to anyone in the medical field? 830 00:40:56,560 --> 00:40:58,729 - An impending disaster. 831 00:40:58,771 --> 00:41:01,107 - What should Mr. Duntsch have done 832 00:41:01,148 --> 00:41:03,901 as soon as he was informed of that information? 833 00:41:03,943 --> 00:41:06,487 - Physically examine the patient. 834 00:41:06,529 --> 00:41:08,781 Order appropriate studies. Scans. 835 00:41:08,823 --> 00:41:11,242 They were ordered by the ICU physician, 836 00:41:11,283 --> 00:41:13,369 which showed she was brain dead. 837 00:41:18,708 --> 00:41:20,835 - Where was Dr. Duntsch? 838 00:41:20,876 --> 00:41:22,753 - He was operating on Madeline Beyer. 839 00:41:22,795 --> 00:41:25,840 - Had the defendant focused on Dorothy Burke 840 00:41:25,881 --> 00:41:29,260 rather than Madeline Beyer, would she still be alive today? 841 00:41:29,301 --> 00:41:30,678 - Based on what I know 842 00:41:30,720 --> 00:41:32,346 of Dr. Duntsch's approach to surgery, 843 00:41:32,388 --> 00:41:35,224 Mrs. Burke was dead the moment she agreed for him to operate. 844 00:41:35,266 --> 00:41:36,517 - Objection. 845 00:41:36,559 --> 00:41:38,602 - Sustained. 846 00:41:40,229 --> 00:41:42,565 - Madeline Beyer? 847 00:41:42,606 --> 00:41:46,736 - Mrs. Beyer is the reason I'm sitting here today. 848 00:41:46,777 --> 00:41:50,156 I--I tried to fix her. 849 00:41:50,197 --> 00:41:53,284 One of the screws was violating the spinal canal, 850 00:41:53,325 --> 00:41:56,370 damaging dura and nerve roots. 851 00:41:56,412 --> 00:41:58,622 - How do you know when you've hit the dura? 852 00:41:58,664 --> 00:42:01,083 - Cerebral spinal fluid leaks out. 853 00:42:01,125 --> 00:42:05,421 I found evidence of three attempted screw placements 854 00:42:05,463 --> 00:42:08,966 on the left side where he put no screws. 855 00:42:10,176 --> 00:42:12,344 The most disturbing part was, 856 00:42:12,386 --> 00:42:15,639 the entire reason he was operating 857 00:42:15,681 --> 00:42:19,101 was to remove the disc, and he didn't touch it. 858 00:42:19,143 --> 00:42:20,728 - What did he take out? 859 00:42:20,770 --> 00:42:24,065 - A large piece of the psoas muscle. 860 00:42:24,106 --> 00:42:26,650 He made a portal through that muscle 861 00:42:26,692 --> 00:42:29,195 and stuffed an implant in there. 862 00:42:29,236 --> 00:42:30,738 - Cage. 863 00:42:30,780 --> 00:42:32,365 - Is a trained neurosurgeon 864 00:42:32,406 --> 00:42:36,535 going to know the difference between bone and muscle? 865 00:42:36,577 --> 00:42:38,162 - Yes. - Mallet. 866 00:42:38,204 --> 00:42:40,081 - Would a trained neurosurgeon know 867 00:42:40,122 --> 00:42:43,042 that by malpositioning the interbody device, 868 00:42:43,084 --> 00:42:45,544 he was reasonably certain to cause her injury? 869 00:42:45,586 --> 00:42:47,088 - Yes. 870 00:42:47,129 --> 00:42:49,298 - Would a trained neurosurgeon have been aware 871 00:42:49,340 --> 00:42:52,134 that if he malpositioned the pedicle screws, 872 00:42:52,176 --> 00:42:53,803 he was reasonably certain 873 00:42:53,844 --> 00:42:55,888 to cause her serious bodily injury? 874 00:42:55,930 --> 00:42:57,264 - Yes. 875 00:42:57,306 --> 00:43:00,184 - Would a trained neurosurgeon have been aware 876 00:43:00,226 --> 00:43:02,520 that if he amputated the nerve root, 877 00:43:02,561 --> 00:43:03,688 he was reasonably certain 878 00:43:03,729 --> 00:43:06,107 to cause her serious bodily injury? 879 00:43:06,148 --> 00:43:07,316 - Yes. 880 00:43:07,358 --> 00:43:09,610 - The way the surgical tools were used 881 00:43:09,652 --> 00:43:11,404 in Madeline Beyer's case, 882 00:43:11,445 --> 00:43:13,447 do you think they were used in a manner 883 00:43:13,489 --> 00:43:17,660 that was capable of causing death or serious bodily injury? 884 00:43:21,455 --> 00:43:23,791 - Yes. 885 00:43:23,833 --> 00:43:26,836 - We pass the witness. 886 00:43:30,673 --> 00:43:33,592 - Dr. Henderson, Ms. Shughart made 887 00:43:33,634 --> 00:43:38,055 quite the point that a trained neurosurgeon 888 00:43:38,097 --> 00:43:40,933 should have done this or done that. 889 00:43:40,975 --> 00:43:44,478 You're aware Christopher has both an MD and a PhD 890 00:43:44,520 --> 00:43:46,480 from the University of Tennessee. 891 00:43:46,522 --> 00:43:47,898 - I am. 892 00:43:47,940 --> 00:43:51,444 - UT isn't some fly-by-night medical school. 893 00:43:51,485 --> 00:43:52,820 It's not like one of those in-- 894 00:43:52,862 --> 00:43:55,322 in Guadalajara or Granada, is it? 895 00:43:55,364 --> 00:43:57,616 - No, it's in Memphis. 896 00:43:57,658 --> 00:44:00,661 - Do you know Dr. Geoffrey Skadden? 897 00:44:00,703 --> 00:44:02,204 Does he have a good reputation? 898 00:44:02,246 --> 00:44:04,040 - I do, and he does. 899 00:44:04,081 --> 00:44:05,833 - And what was he responsible for 900 00:44:05,875 --> 00:44:07,918 in Christopher Duntsch's training? 901 00:44:07,960 --> 00:44:11,630 - After Dr. Duntsch finished his residency at UT, 902 00:44:11,672 --> 00:44:14,508 he came under the tutelage of Dr. Skadden 903 00:44:14,550 --> 00:44:15,843 for a fellowship training 904 00:44:15,885 --> 00:44:18,179 in minimally invasive spine surgery. 905 00:44:18,220 --> 00:44:20,639 - Were you familiar with the fact that Dr. Duntsch 906 00:44:20,681 --> 00:44:23,392 was doing medical cancer research on the side 907 00:44:23,434 --> 00:44:26,437 and that Dr. Skadden was involved in that research? 908 00:44:26,479 --> 00:44:27,938 - I wasn't at the time, no. 909 00:44:27,980 --> 00:44:31,525 - Should any doctor under any circumstances 910 00:44:31,567 --> 00:44:36,072 have their surgical training hours disrupted by research? 911 00:44:36,113 --> 00:44:37,198 - Absolutely not. 912 00:44:37,239 --> 00:44:40,451 - So a neurosurgical resident or fellow 913 00:44:40,493 --> 00:44:42,578 can't just skip those hours. 914 00:44:42,620 --> 00:44:45,289 The supervisor has to sign off, no matter the excuse. 915 00:44:45,331 --> 00:44:46,832 - Correct. 916 00:44:46,874 --> 00:44:49,335 - Do the doctors in charge of the program have to sign off 917 00:44:49,377 --> 00:44:51,504 that they're qualified to go and operate? 918 00:44:51,545 --> 00:44:52,713 - Yes. 919 00:44:52,755 --> 00:44:54,507 - Did Dr. Skadden write letters 920 00:44:54,548 --> 00:44:56,842 of recommendation for Dr. Duntsch? 921 00:44:56,884 --> 00:44:58,386 - Yes, he stated Dr. Duntsch 922 00:44:58,427 --> 00:45:02,390 was a satisfactory surgeon in his fellowship. 923 00:45:02,431 --> 00:45:05,393 - Well, had Dr. Skadden heard what was happening in Texas? 924 00:45:05,434 --> 00:45:07,144 - Yes, because he had mentioned 925 00:45:07,186 --> 00:45:09,605 poor outcomes at Baylor when filling out 926 00:45:09,647 --> 00:45:11,565 a credentialing form at Forest Park. 927 00:45:11,607 --> 00:45:14,694 - Do you have any idea why he wouldn't have explicitly told 928 00:45:14,735 --> 00:45:17,405 these hospitals not to hire Dr. Duntsch? 929 00:45:17,446 --> 00:45:20,199 - Dr. Skadden said that he had to write recommendations 930 00:45:20,241 --> 00:45:23,077 based on what he'd witnessed in his program. 931 00:45:23,119 --> 00:45:25,955 He couldn't speak to whatever was happening in Texas. 932 00:45:25,996 --> 00:45:28,290 He didn't write any more recommendations for Mr. Duntsch 933 00:45:28,332 --> 00:45:29,875 after we spoke. 934 00:45:29,917 --> 00:45:32,503 - Has there ever been an instance 935 00:45:32,545 --> 00:45:37,133 in which a doctor was sued for not writing a recommendation? 936 00:45:37,174 --> 00:45:39,385 - Yes. 937 00:45:39,427 --> 00:45:41,595 - Well, that's frightening, is it not? 938 00:45:41,637 --> 00:45:43,597 - It is to me. 939 00:45:43,639 --> 00:45:46,100 - So Skadden had to sign off on him, 940 00:45:46,142 --> 00:45:48,436 or he wouldn't have been able to get their credentials? 941 00:45:48,477 --> 00:45:49,645 - Correct. 942 00:45:49,687 --> 00:45:50,813 - I mean, Baylor wouldn't let 943 00:45:50,855 --> 00:45:52,440 somebody just walk in off the street, 944 00:45:52,481 --> 00:45:53,858 start doing neurosurgery. 945 00:45:53,899 --> 00:45:55,901 - I also assumed they would have reported 946 00:45:55,943 --> 00:45:58,571 the outcomes of his surgeries to the authorities. 947 00:45:58,612 --> 00:46:00,114 - As a matter of fact, 948 00:46:00,156 --> 00:46:04,618 they didn't say anything negative to anybody. 949 00:46:04,660 --> 00:46:09,290 Neurosurgery is a big moneymaker. 950 00:46:09,331 --> 00:46:12,001 Do you think the corporate level of the hospital 951 00:46:12,043 --> 00:46:14,754 was more interested in making money 952 00:46:14,795 --> 00:46:17,006 than in protecting their patients? 953 00:46:22,428 --> 00:46:24,472 [soft dramatic music] 954 00:46:24,513 --> 00:46:26,640 * * 955 00:46:26,682 --> 00:46:29,060 - [sighs] Yes, I do. 956 00:46:29,101 --> 00:46:32,521 I think everyone was more interested in making money 957 00:46:32,563 --> 00:46:34,273 and protecting themselves 958 00:46:34,315 --> 00:46:37,818 rather than protecting their patients. 959 00:46:41,739 --> 00:46:44,784 - Thank you for the truth, Dr. Henderson. 960 00:46:44,825 --> 00:46:47,119 No more questions. 961 00:46:47,161 --> 00:46:50,331 - I'd like to add something. 962 00:46:50,373 --> 00:46:52,458 - Redirect. 963 00:46:52,500 --> 00:46:56,003 Anything you'd like to add? 964 00:46:56,045 --> 00:46:59,465 - Everyone knows the first tenet 965 00:46:59,507 --> 00:47:03,010 of the Hippocratic Oath, "First, do no harm". 966 00:47:04,053 --> 00:47:06,972 But there are others. 967 00:47:07,014 --> 00:47:10,309 "I will respect the hard-won scientific gains 968 00:47:10,351 --> 00:47:14,563 of the physicians in whose steps I've walked." 969 00:47:14,605 --> 00:47:16,065 He did not. 970 00:47:16,107 --> 00:47:18,651 "I will apply, for the benefit of the sick, 971 00:47:18,693 --> 00:47:20,778 "all majors which are required, 972 00:47:20,820 --> 00:47:24,573 "avoiding those twin traps of overtreatment 973 00:47:24,615 --> 00:47:26,534 and therapeutic nihilism." 974 00:47:26,575 --> 00:47:28,327 He did not. 975 00:47:28,369 --> 00:47:31,080 "I will not be ashamed to say I know not, 976 00:47:31,122 --> 00:47:33,749 "nor will I fail to call them my colleagues 977 00:47:33,791 --> 00:47:36,127 "when the skills of another are needed 978 00:47:36,168 --> 00:47:39,714 for a patient's recovery." 979 00:47:39,755 --> 00:47:42,883 He did not. 980 00:47:42,925 --> 00:47:47,763 Had I performed any of the 33 surgeries 981 00:47:47,805 --> 00:47:49,640 in the manner that he performed them, 982 00:47:49,682 --> 00:47:51,726 I never would have allowed myself 983 00:47:51,767 --> 00:47:56,188 into an operating room again. 984 00:47:56,230 --> 00:47:59,984 Any one of them. 985 00:48:00,026 --> 00:48:03,279 Not ever again. 986 00:48:03,320 --> 00:48:10,286 * * 987 00:48:18,002 --> 00:48:19,295 - The State flooded you 988 00:48:19,336 --> 00:48:21,380 with every possible patient they could, 989 00:48:21,422 --> 00:48:25,134 but Madeline Beyer's case is the case the State chose 990 00:48:25,176 --> 00:48:28,220 to go to trial on, so let's focus there. 991 00:48:28,262 --> 00:48:31,265 Now, according to the state, Dr. Duntsch didn't head 992 00:48:31,307 --> 00:48:34,477 into Madeline Beyer's surgery to fix her-- 993 00:48:34,518 --> 00:48:36,353 he wanted to hurt her-- 994 00:48:36,395 --> 00:48:38,981 but that's not what the evidence shows. 995 00:48:39,023 --> 00:48:44,695 The evidence shows he was a suboptimal surgeon. 996 00:48:45,279 --> 00:48:47,531 Now, are we trying to blame the hospitals? 997 00:48:47,573 --> 00:48:48,783 No. 998 00:48:48,824 --> 00:48:50,326 Are we trying to blame Dr. Skadden? 999 00:48:50,368 --> 00:48:52,953 No, but the State asked time and time again, 1000 00:48:52,995 --> 00:48:57,083 what would a well-trained surgeon do? 1001 00:48:57,124 --> 00:48:59,085 I mean, what did Dr. Henderson tell you? 1002 00:48:59,126 --> 00:49:01,921 He got on the phone, called Skadden, and said, 1003 00:49:01,962 --> 00:49:03,464 "Hey, we got this guy here. 1004 00:49:03,506 --> 00:49:06,425 "It says he graduated from your medical school, 1005 00:49:06,467 --> 00:49:07,885 "went to your fellowship, 1006 00:49:07,927 --> 00:49:10,429 and I need you to stop recommending him." 1007 00:49:10,471 --> 00:49:15,142 And Skadden replied, "Yes, he did train at my fellowship. 1008 00:49:15,184 --> 00:49:18,062 But I don't know what to do." 1009 00:49:18,104 --> 00:49:20,356 Because Skadden has figured out, 1010 00:49:20,398 --> 00:49:23,609 "I screwed up. I let him out." 1011 00:49:23,651 --> 00:49:25,236 I mean, Jerry Summers told you, 1012 00:49:25,277 --> 00:49:30,241 he let him out of surgeries in order to do research. 1013 00:49:30,282 --> 00:49:33,828 Now, you don't get to punish Dr. Skadden. 1014 00:49:33,869 --> 00:49:35,955 You don't get to punish Baylor. 1015 00:49:35,996 --> 00:49:38,040 You don't get to punish Dallas Medical, 1016 00:49:38,082 --> 00:49:41,460 but you have the right to know what they didn't do. 1017 00:49:41,502 --> 00:49:44,547 They didn't report him. 1018 00:49:44,588 --> 00:49:46,298 They didn't challenge him. 1019 00:49:46,340 --> 00:49:48,467 They didn't tell him that he was 1020 00:49:48,509 --> 00:49:53,472 a suboptimal surgeon who needs to find other work. 1021 00:49:53,514 --> 00:49:56,475 If you're a teacher and the children don't do well, 1022 00:49:56,517 --> 00:50:00,438 your principal tells you you're a suboptimal teacher. 1023 00:50:00,479 --> 00:50:02,106 If you're a mechanic 1024 00:50:02,148 --> 00:50:04,400 and the cars you're working on keep breaking down, 1025 00:50:04,442 --> 00:50:07,278 you're told you're a suboptimal mechanic. 1026 00:50:07,319 --> 00:50:11,574 If you're a pilot and you can't land, 1027 00:50:11,615 --> 00:50:15,161 well, you're told you can't do this anymore. 1028 00:50:15,202 --> 00:50:17,997 Well, Baylor does the opposite. 1029 00:50:18,039 --> 00:50:21,083 They allow him to resign. 1030 00:50:21,125 --> 00:50:22,918 And then they send a clearing letter 1031 00:50:22,960 --> 00:50:24,045 to Dallas Medical, 1032 00:50:24,086 --> 00:50:26,464 who hires him and then watches 1033 00:50:26,505 --> 00:50:29,592 as three surgeries in as many days go bad. 1034 00:50:29,633 --> 00:50:31,510 And what do they do? 1035 00:50:31,552 --> 00:50:34,221 Nothing. 1036 00:50:34,263 --> 00:50:35,931 They don't report him 1037 00:50:35,973 --> 00:50:38,642 to the National Practitioner's Data Bank 1038 00:50:38,684 --> 00:50:40,394 or the Texas Medical Board. 1039 00:50:40,436 --> 00:50:46,942 They allow this poorly-trained suboptimal surgeon to move on. 1040 00:50:49,195 --> 00:50:53,199 The system broke down from the very beginning. 1041 00:50:54,241 --> 00:50:57,078 Now, I don't envy your jobs. 1042 00:50:57,119 --> 00:50:59,121 Both sides have their own perceptions 1043 00:50:59,163 --> 00:51:01,207 of--of what happened, 1044 00:51:01,248 --> 00:51:05,044 but you're the sole judges of the facts. 1045 00:51:05,086 --> 00:51:07,880 Render your verdict according to the law, 1046 00:51:07,922 --> 00:51:09,465 not according to emotions 1047 00:51:09,507 --> 00:51:12,301 or sympathies or sending a message. 1048 00:51:12,343 --> 00:51:15,012 It's about whether or not the State has proven to you 1049 00:51:15,054 --> 00:51:18,099 that a crime was committed. 1050 00:51:18,140 --> 00:51:21,185 It was a failure. 1051 00:51:22,353 --> 00:51:25,731 It was a human failure, 1052 00:51:25,773 --> 00:51:31,654 a systemic failure, 1053 00:51:31,696 --> 00:51:34,365 but it wasn't a crime. 1054 00:51:35,783 --> 00:51:38,828 - On July 25th, 2012, 1055 00:51:38,869 --> 00:51:42,581 Christopher Duntsch went into surgery with Madeline Beyer, 1056 00:51:42,623 --> 00:51:44,083 an elderly individual. 1057 00:51:44,125 --> 00:51:46,669 He crippled her. 1058 00:51:46,711 --> 00:51:50,548 Pedicle screws, drilled and redrilled. 1059 00:51:50,589 --> 00:51:54,969 Nerves shredded. Leaking dural sacs. 1060 00:51:55,010 --> 00:51:57,596 Muscles hacked into. 1061 00:51:57,638 --> 00:52:00,057 These things happened. 1062 00:52:00,099 --> 00:52:03,561 But was it intentional? 1063 00:52:03,602 --> 00:52:06,731 How do you know what he intended? 1064 00:52:06,772 --> 00:52:12,403 You look at what he does before, during, and after. 1065 00:52:12,445 --> 00:52:15,990 He lied, about "this is normal pain." 1066 00:52:16,032 --> 00:52:18,117 "This is something new. 1067 00:52:18,159 --> 00:52:20,369 "I didn't do this to you. 1068 00:52:20,411 --> 00:52:22,747 "It's simply swelling, Jerry. 1069 00:52:22,788 --> 00:52:25,249 "Surgery went fine, Madeline. 1070 00:52:25,291 --> 00:52:27,501 "It's the surgical team's fault. 1071 00:52:27,543 --> 00:52:32,089 Your wives are dead, Earl, Harold." 1072 00:52:34,842 --> 00:52:37,386 Look at them. 1073 00:52:37,428 --> 00:52:42,391 Look at the faces of the lives that were ruined. 1074 00:52:42,433 --> 00:52:45,269 We didn't bring them to you to have you convict him 1075 00:52:45,311 --> 00:52:47,480 based on sympathy. 1076 00:52:47,521 --> 00:52:50,316 We bring them to you so that you can know 1077 00:52:50,358 --> 00:52:53,903 everything the defendant knew. 1078 00:52:53,944 --> 00:52:56,322 How many patients should it take 1079 00:52:56,364 --> 00:53:00,576 before you know that what you're doing is hurting people? 1080 00:53:01,827 --> 00:53:08,584 One, two, three? 1081 00:53:09,085 --> 00:53:12,630 You make your best friend a quadriplegic? 1082 00:53:12,671 --> 00:53:17,676 Four, you kill? Five, you kill? 1083 00:53:17,718 --> 00:53:19,845 Should I list all 33? 1084 00:53:19,887 --> 00:53:23,265 I want to call them tragedies, 1085 00:53:23,307 --> 00:53:27,853 but that implies no one could have seen them coming. 1086 00:53:27,895 --> 00:53:30,815 These were assaults. 1087 00:53:30,856 --> 00:53:34,694 We're here talking about Madeline Beyer. 1088 00:53:34,735 --> 00:53:38,489 I know you don't have a doubt that when Christopher Duntsch 1089 00:53:38,531 --> 00:53:40,408 went into Madeline Beyer's surgery, 1090 00:53:40,449 --> 00:53:45,162 he was reasonably certain he was going to hurt her. 1091 00:53:45,204 --> 00:53:47,164 That's the standard of knowing. 1092 00:53:47,206 --> 00:53:50,459 Not that you know 100%, 1093 00:53:50,501 --> 00:53:53,629 but that you're reasonably certain. 1094 00:53:53,671 --> 00:53:57,967 The defense is implying it was his training. 1095 00:53:58,008 --> 00:54:00,469 He was trained for 17 years 1096 00:54:00,511 --> 00:54:03,305 prior to operating on Mrs. Beyer. 1097 00:54:03,347 --> 00:54:05,433 Trained at the University of Tennessee. 1098 00:54:05,474 --> 00:54:07,768 Trained at Semmes-Murphey. 1099 00:54:07,810 --> 00:54:09,729 Institutions with doctors 1100 00:54:09,770 --> 00:54:12,690 who would not put their reputations on the line 1101 00:54:12,732 --> 00:54:16,819 by recommending a poorly trained surgeon. 1102 00:54:16,861 --> 00:54:19,697 [soft dramatic music] 1103 00:54:19,739 --> 00:54:24,285 Don't blame his training. Blame him. 1104 00:54:24,326 --> 00:54:28,164 Don't blame the system. Blame him. 1105 00:54:28,205 --> 00:54:32,543 He went into all those operations. 1106 00:54:32,585 --> 00:54:36,630 He put the scalpels to those patients' backs. 1107 00:54:36,672 --> 00:54:40,634 He kept going. 1108 00:54:40,676 --> 00:54:44,138 All these people. 1109 00:54:44,180 --> 00:54:47,558 If you're a human who values life, 1110 00:54:47,600 --> 00:54:51,145 who understands suffering... 1111 00:54:51,187 --> 00:54:53,647 You heard Dr. Henderson. 1112 00:54:53,689 --> 00:54:56,776 One botched surgery, just one, 1113 00:54:56,817 --> 00:55:01,655 and he never would have entered the operating room ever again. 1114 00:55:02,490 --> 00:55:05,618 If you don't stop him, 1115 00:55:05,659 --> 00:55:10,039 Christopher Duntsch will leave this courthouse, 1116 00:55:10,081 --> 00:55:13,459 leave this city, this state, 1117 00:55:13,501 --> 00:55:16,796 maybe even this country, 1118 00:55:16,837 --> 00:55:19,673 and he will find a corner of the world 1119 00:55:19,715 --> 00:55:24,595 that allows him to continue hurting people. 1120 00:55:27,139 --> 00:55:32,103 Only you can tell him no more. 1121 00:55:32,144 --> 00:55:38,401 * * 1122 00:55:39,318 --> 00:55:41,195 - They don't understand. 1123 00:55:42,863 --> 00:55:46,158 All I wanna do is go back to my research. 1124 00:55:46,200 --> 00:55:47,868 You gotta tell 'em, Dad. 1125 00:55:47,910 --> 00:55:51,288 I will never practice surgery again. 1126 00:55:51,330 --> 00:55:54,041 If they let me, I can still do good. 1127 00:55:54,083 --> 00:55:55,292 I can still help. 1128 00:55:55,334 --> 00:55:58,129 - Just stop, okay? 1129 00:55:58,170 --> 00:55:59,880 It's time to stop. 1130 00:56:01,674 --> 00:56:03,592 [sighs] 1131 00:56:07,471 --> 00:56:11,434 We had these hardwood floors when you were little. 1132 00:56:13,060 --> 00:56:15,730 Active, always active. 1133 00:56:15,771 --> 00:56:18,357 So energetic. 1134 00:56:18,399 --> 00:56:20,735 You were so strong. 1135 00:56:20,776 --> 00:56:24,447 You would push the furniture around across these floors. 1136 00:56:26,115 --> 00:56:29,410 You never played with toys. It was always the furniture. 1137 00:56:30,619 --> 00:56:32,705 And how many times did I ask you 1138 00:56:32,747 --> 00:56:36,500 to stop it with the furniture? 1139 00:56:36,542 --> 00:56:38,794 But you wouldn't stop. 1140 00:56:40,421 --> 00:56:42,923 You wouldn't stop. 1141 00:56:46,010 --> 00:56:50,890 Maybe jail's the best thing for you, my boy. 1142 00:56:57,813 --> 00:57:00,775 - You were less dull than I thought you'd be. 1143 00:57:03,110 --> 00:57:05,071 - You're too kind, Randy. 1144 00:57:05,112 --> 00:57:09,367 - Probably blown the whole case, but nice job. 1145 00:57:12,953 --> 00:57:17,708 - We could have done more. We should have done it more. 1146 00:57:17,750 --> 00:57:20,628 This is gonna happen again, you know. 1147 00:57:20,669 --> 00:57:23,422 - Suppose we could do something. 1148 00:57:23,464 --> 00:57:26,509 - I suppose we should. 1149 00:57:26,550 --> 00:57:28,511 - Jury's back. 1150 00:57:28,552 --> 00:57:31,180 - All right, well, we got time for some hoops. 1151 00:57:31,222 --> 00:57:33,849 - I wish. - [chuckles] 1152 00:57:33,891 --> 00:57:37,603 - We gonna win? 1153 00:57:39,313 --> 00:57:42,274 [dramatic music] 1154 00:57:42,316 --> 00:57:45,486 - I don't know. 1155 00:57:46,987 --> 00:57:49,448 - [sighs] 1156 00:57:50,991 --> 00:57:54,829 - I'm sorry. 1157 00:57:54,870 --> 00:57:57,915 - You did great. 1158 00:57:57,957 --> 00:58:04,880 * * 1159 00:58:36,871 --> 00:58:38,080 - [exhales] 1160 00:58:44,962 --> 00:58:51,886 * * 1161 00:59:21,248 --> 00:59:28,422 * * 1162 00:59:58,285 --> 01:00:05,459 * * 1163 01:00:35,322 --> 01:00:42,496 * * 1164 01:01:12,360 --> 01:01:19,533 * *