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[eerie discordant music plays]
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00:00:23,763 --> 00:00:27,723
[sheriff] Red Lodge, Montana
is a very close-knit community.
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00:00:29,083 --> 00:00:30,643
Everybody knows everybody.
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00:00:36,003 --> 00:00:38,683
This homicide,
everybody was talking about it.
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00:00:41,283 --> 00:00:46,283
And everybody had their own theories
on why it happened and what had happened.
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00:01:07,923 --> 00:01:10,643
[man] I remember the first time
when I went to court.
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They all looked at me differently,
like I was a…
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00:01:16,203 --> 00:01:17,523
like I was a monster.
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I kept trying to tell them
I never meant for anything to happen.
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I'm not a cold-blooded killer.
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There was no, in any way, shape or form,
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any intention
of hurting my best friend ever,
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ever, ever.
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[cryptic music plays]
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[eerie discordant music plays]
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-Are we good to go?
-[interviewer] We're good to go.
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[man] Okay.
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My name is Thomas Schifferns.
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I'm 37 years old.
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I'm currently imprisoned
in Shelby, Montana
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for the death of my best friend.
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[somber melodic music plays]
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I was born in 1984
in Kern County, California.
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When I was four years old,
my parents divorced.
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My dad got remarried to my stepmother.
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Life got really hard for me.
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My stepmother
really didn't like me at all.
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I was locked in a room a lot.
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I wasn't allowed out,
I wasn't allowed to play.
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I wasn't allowed
to pretty much do anything
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except for go to school and back.
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That continued pretty much
through my childhood.
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[birds chirping]
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[traffic passing]
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That's when things got really bad.
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I got caught smoking upstairs
in my brother's bedroom one day.
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My stepmom got mad about it,
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so that very night, they pretty much
kicked me out the back door
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and told me never to come back.
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[eerie discordant music plays]
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[music intensifies]
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[gate slams]
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Red Lodge is a ski resort town.
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There's a lot of rich people.
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The cops, once you're on their radar,
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they are on you all the time
for the rest of your life.
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Because I'm a convicted felon
and because of who I was,
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nobody would ever hire me.
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[somber melodic music plays]
50
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She was awesome.
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She understood what I had been through
and she didn't judge me for it.
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So it… it felt good for once in my life
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to not be judged for, you know, my past.
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I'd repair chainsaws.
I cut a lot of wood for 'em.
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I did a lot of welding for 'em.
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And that's where I met Jim.
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[melodic guitar music plays]
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He was like a small, frail man
with a white beard.
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He was always smoking his pipe,
he always had his pipe on him,
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sitting there next to the fire stove.
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I guess I would just sit there
and listen to his stories.
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His, you know, ranching days.
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[winds howling]
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It gets below zero quite a bit
in Red Lodge.
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[somber melodic music plays]
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Jim's shack didn't have any heat,
didn't have any water in it.
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He didn't have a place to go to
when it was cold.
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And so, me and Shilo
decided to invite him into our home.
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Me and Jim became inseparable.
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I mean, everywhere I was, Jim was.
Everywhere Jim was, I was.
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We went out shooting a lot.
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We went fishing a lot.
We went and did everything.
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He loved the outdoors.
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Um, things were good till that--
till awful day.
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[wind howls]
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[dog barks]
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It was a regular day.
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[eerie discordant music plays]
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We stop at the store
and we buy some beer.
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We drive out of town.
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We kept driving out of town, and I…
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I believe the place was called Bear Tract.
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We pulled in.
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I got out.
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00:10:01,123 --> 00:10:04,963
I was kind of like, uh, you know,
"The creek's frozen here."
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00:10:05,043 --> 00:10:06,803
"I don't really want to fish here."
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So Jim gets out,
and he had his .357 on him.
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We just did what we loved to do.
We started shooting.
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We just started shooting trees.
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00:10:26,843 --> 00:10:29,003
He tried to twirl it on his fingers.
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00:10:31,363 --> 00:10:33,563
I told him that he looked like
Billy the Kid.
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00:10:33,643 --> 00:10:35,883
"You look like Billy the Kid
with that thing."
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He wasn't really twirling it.
He was just trying to.
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He was trying to make the motions
to do it. It was hilarious.
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By that time, we were--
We had been drinking all day,
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00:10:54,523 --> 00:10:57,043
so we were just having a good time,
more or less.
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00:11:01,083 --> 00:11:04,283
I told him, "Let me see the gun.
I wanna try it, I wanna try,"
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00:11:04,363 --> 00:11:06,963
and see if I could do
what he was doing, you know.
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00:11:09,763 --> 00:11:15,083
So he handed me the gun, and I remember
there was two shots left in it.
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00:11:20,643 --> 00:11:24,403
And I was gonna try to, you know, twirl it
and act like some kind of cowboy,
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some Billy the Kid,
see if I could do it, you know.
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[grim instrumental music plays]
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And I remember twirling it forward
and the gun went off.
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[gunshot echoes]
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[birds chirping]
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I remember seeing Jim fall to the ground.
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00:12:06,483 --> 00:12:08,843
And at that point, I was just…
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[music intensifies]
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I didn't… I guess I didn't comprehend
at the moment what had just happened
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because I didn't expect
the gun to go off like that.
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I remember walking over to Jim,
and I grabbed his leg to, you know…
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I said, "Jim, get up, stop playing around,
stop effing around," and, uh…
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[sniffles]
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[sighs]
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I felt how limp his leg was,
and I knew that there was something wrong.
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And, um…
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That's when I saw the blood in the snow.
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It felt like my soul
had been ripped out of my…
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out of my body at that time.
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00:13:01,203 --> 00:13:04,683
Because I--
I knew Jim wasn't there anymore.
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00:13:04,763 --> 00:13:05,643
[sniffles]
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00:13:21,563 --> 00:13:25,083
[wind howling]
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00:13:36,363 --> 00:13:40,563
[grim instrumental music plays]
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I can't tell you how many times
I told them it was an accident that day.
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They tried to say
that I had Jim on his knees,
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and that I had the gun to the back
of his head, and then I shot him.
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00:13:58,643 --> 00:14:03,163
I'm not gonna lie about what happened.
You know, I'm not…
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00:14:03,763 --> 00:14:05,483
I'm not a cold-blooded killer.
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00:14:10,643 --> 00:14:12,643
[music intensifies]
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00:14:12,723 --> 00:14:15,323
I didn't mean for anything to happen.
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00:14:17,883 --> 00:14:20,643
I kept trying to tell them
I never meant to hurt Jim.
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It was an accident.
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00:14:30,843 --> 00:14:32,443
I think about Jim quite a bit.
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00:14:34,243 --> 00:14:37,563
Uh, he… He was the only friend
I really had.
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00:15:14,363 --> 00:15:17,363
[somber melodic music plays]
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00:15:20,363 --> 00:15:23,083
[dog barking]
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00:15:31,323 --> 00:15:35,043
[man] When Jimmy was found deceased,
I was torn apart.
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00:15:36,323 --> 00:15:37,563
My heart was broken.
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00:15:41,483 --> 00:15:45,363
And to find out that such a gentle soul
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was taken in such a violent manner,
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00:15:49,323 --> 00:15:51,923
it just… it made it hurt that much worse.
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00:16:03,083 --> 00:16:04,483
I am John Price,
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00:16:06,163 --> 00:16:09,883
and one of my best friends
was Jimmy McGregor.
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00:16:13,643 --> 00:16:17,603
Whenever I work on a skull like this,
I think of Jimmy.
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00:16:20,563 --> 00:16:25,003
Knowing that he would look down right now
and just see how I'm preserving
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00:16:25,083 --> 00:16:27,563
someone's hunting memories for a lifetime.
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00:16:31,843 --> 00:16:34,123
Being that this occurred
in such a small town,
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00:16:34,203 --> 00:16:36,283
a lot of rumors went flying around.
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People still speculate about it.
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00:16:39,483 --> 00:16:42,043
People still try to figure out a motive.
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00:16:43,643 --> 00:16:46,763
This sort of thing
just does not happen in Red Lodge.
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00:16:51,883 --> 00:16:54,203
Jimmy was a kind and gentle man.
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00:16:54,283 --> 00:16:57,963
Always had a smile,
always greeted you with a handshake.
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00:16:58,643 --> 00:17:02,403
Uh, wanted to know how the family
was doing and whether you were doing well.
155
00:17:05,323 --> 00:17:07,323
[birds chirping]
156
00:17:08,363 --> 00:17:11,563
Jimmy's relationship with money
was he had very little.
157
00:17:12,443 --> 00:17:14,803
He pretty much was penniless.
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00:17:16,443 --> 00:17:19,963
Jimmy and I were talking one afternoon
and he had had some assistance
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00:17:20,043 --> 00:17:21,043
from a local woman
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00:17:21,123 --> 00:17:23,683
that helped him file
for his Social Security.
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00:17:26,043 --> 00:17:30,123
He realized that he was gonna get
one lump sum at the beginning
162
00:17:30,203 --> 00:17:32,043
and then his monthly payment.
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00:17:34,403 --> 00:17:37,683
We were just so happy for him
to finally get to that stage
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00:17:37,763 --> 00:17:42,043
where he would have a steady income
to sustain himself throughout the year.
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00:17:47,403 --> 00:17:49,603
Red Lodge is a very small town.
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So it doesn't take long
for word to travel around
167
00:17:52,843 --> 00:17:56,363
that Jimmy was gonna be coming
into his Social Security finally.
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00:18:03,083 --> 00:18:07,083
[eerie discordant music plays]
169
00:18:12,483 --> 00:18:16,243
TJ was very forward with Jimmy
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00:18:16,323 --> 00:18:18,363
as far as his affections and such.
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00:18:19,003 --> 00:18:23,123
It was like he had prior motive
for building that relationship.
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00:18:27,883 --> 00:18:30,203
[music intensifies]
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00:18:30,283 --> 00:18:35,123
I found out that Jimmy
had moved in with TJ and his wife Shilo
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00:18:35,883 --> 00:18:38,163
and was very concerned. All of us were.
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[bird squawking]
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[TJ] Me and Jim became inseparable.
177
00:19:00,923 --> 00:19:04,483
I mean, everywhere I was, Jim was.
Everywhere Jim was, I was.
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00:19:06,043 --> 00:19:07,923
I think about Jim quite a bit
179
00:19:08,523 --> 00:19:11,523
because he was the only friend
I really had.
180
00:19:11,603 --> 00:19:14,243
You know, there wasn't a lot
I wouldn't do for that guy.
181
00:19:28,483 --> 00:19:29,723
It's all a lie.
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00:19:31,923 --> 00:19:35,403
He made out
that he and Jimmy were best of friends,
183
00:19:35,483 --> 00:19:37,683
and that was far from the case.
184
00:19:38,683 --> 00:19:42,883
TJ and Jimmy's relationship
was a relationship of convenience.
185
00:19:44,043 --> 00:19:48,523
TJ played that part to a tee
by taking advantage of Jim.
186
00:19:53,163 --> 00:19:55,683
[music intensifies]
187
00:20:00,723 --> 00:20:04,323
I had discovered
that Jimmy had purchased a truck.
188
00:20:05,843 --> 00:20:09,883
This was alarming
because Jimmy did not drive.
189
00:20:10,363 --> 00:20:13,403
So he had no use for the truck.
190
00:20:13,483 --> 00:20:16,003
I feel that he was taken advantage of,
191
00:20:16,083 --> 00:20:21,083
that TJ needed a vehicle
and preyed on him.
192
00:20:23,523 --> 00:20:26,443
I think TJ did it strictly for the money.
193
00:20:27,443 --> 00:20:29,003
He knew Jimmy had money,
194
00:20:29,083 --> 00:20:31,003
and killing him
195
00:20:31,083 --> 00:20:34,203
was gonna be the quickest way
for him to get all of it at once.
196
00:20:48,203 --> 00:20:52,203
[eerie discordant music plays]
197
00:21:23,363 --> 00:21:24,643
My name is Josh McQuillan.
198
00:21:24,723 --> 00:21:27,403
I am the Carbon County sheriff
in Red Lodge, Montana.
199
00:21:32,083 --> 00:21:34,643
So we're heading south
out of Red Lodge right now.
200
00:21:34,723 --> 00:21:38,643
This is the area in which
we had received a call at dispatch
201
00:21:38,723 --> 00:21:41,323
that Jimmy's truck had been found.
202
00:21:45,883 --> 00:21:48,603
[music intensifies]
203
00:22:03,203 --> 00:22:05,883
[cryptic music plays]
204
00:22:05,963 --> 00:22:10,123
It was very unusual that we found
Jimmy's truck all the way down here.
205
00:22:10,763 --> 00:22:15,083
This is an area that is frequented
during the summer by campers,
206
00:22:15,603 --> 00:22:17,403
but not so much during the winter time.
207
00:22:20,043 --> 00:22:24,403
At that time, snow down here was
well over a foot to 18 inches deep.
208
00:22:24,483 --> 00:22:28,443
And simply put, people just don't come
down here when there's that kind of snow.
209
00:22:33,523 --> 00:22:36,803
As we proceeded down here,
we could see the truck,
210
00:22:36,883 --> 00:22:39,483
and then we actually found
some blood on the ground.
211
00:22:39,563 --> 00:22:42,763
And then drag marks
that led us over here to this embankment
212
00:22:42,843 --> 00:22:44,603
that drops down into Rock Creek.
213
00:22:46,163 --> 00:22:51,283
We were able to see Jimmy's body
covered in snow laying on his back,
214
00:22:51,363 --> 00:22:54,923
and he had obviously been dragged
about halfway down this embankment.
215
00:22:58,243 --> 00:23:01,563
We could clearly see that there was
one gunshot wound to the head.
216
00:23:05,123 --> 00:23:07,003
This spot can't be seen from the highway.
217
00:23:07,083 --> 00:23:09,843
So there's a good chance
that if we hadn't received that tip
218
00:23:09,923 --> 00:23:12,043
and came down here when we did,
219
00:23:12,123 --> 00:23:14,763
it's unlikely we would have found him
until the spring thaw
220
00:23:14,843 --> 00:23:18,203
when this became a more popular area
with people.
221
00:23:20,243 --> 00:23:23,963
It was apparent
that whoever had done this to Jimmy
222
00:23:24,043 --> 00:23:28,003
had tried to hide his body
and had no regard for trying to help him.
223
00:23:29,083 --> 00:23:30,883
[birds chirping]
224
00:23:35,803 --> 00:23:37,963
[wind howls]
225
00:23:40,683 --> 00:23:44,683
[grim instrumental music plays]
226
00:24:01,123 --> 00:24:03,723
What did I do? What did I do?
227
00:24:03,803 --> 00:24:04,843
You played a game.
228
00:24:04,923 --> 00:24:06,603
I'm not-- What did I do?
229
00:24:06,683 --> 00:24:07,603
You killed somebody.
230
00:24:07,683 --> 00:24:08,603
No, I fucking hell…
231
00:24:08,683 --> 00:24:11,563
I don't even have the balls
to kill somebody. Are you serious?
232
00:24:11,643 --> 00:24:12,923
Oh, I'm dead serious.
233
00:24:14,363 --> 00:24:16,603
[music intensifies]
234
00:24:24,683 --> 00:24:29,203
It was an accident.
It wasn't supposed to happen like that.
235
00:24:30,363 --> 00:24:33,563
As soon as I cocked back the hammer,
the gun went off.
236
00:24:35,083 --> 00:24:36,643
And I saw Jimmy fall.
237
00:24:38,603 --> 00:24:39,763
And it scared me.
238
00:24:54,723 --> 00:24:57,723
[eerie melodic music plays]
239
00:25:06,523 --> 00:25:10,323
[woman]You know, I really don't know, uh…
what happened that day.
240
00:25:12,283 --> 00:25:14,683
Only TJ and Jimmy know
what happened that day.
241
00:25:16,123 --> 00:25:18,243
And I don't want to speculate on that.
242
00:25:21,083 --> 00:25:24,643
I do know that they spent
a lot of time together
243
00:25:24,723 --> 00:25:27,803
playing with guns and drinking,
and that doesn't mix.
244
00:25:31,243 --> 00:25:35,723
My name is Suzanne Russell,
and I am TJ's mother-in-law.
245
00:25:39,243 --> 00:25:42,283
[somber guitar music plays]
246
00:25:42,363 --> 00:25:43,803
Why would TJ kill Jimmy?
247
00:25:44,803 --> 00:25:45,883
He loved Jimmy.
248
00:25:49,283 --> 00:25:53,883
He always would say, "I love Jimmy."
Jimmy was his friend, his best friend.
249
00:25:59,563 --> 00:26:04,963
I went over and seen them
maybe a week before this all happened.
250
00:26:05,043 --> 00:26:09,163
Everybody was happy and laughing
and getting along just fine.
251
00:26:23,523 --> 00:26:27,483
[eerie discordant music plays]
252
00:26:29,883 --> 00:26:33,603
People in the right frame of mind
would probably have called 911
253
00:26:33,683 --> 00:26:35,603
if they shot somebody accidentally.
254
00:26:36,963 --> 00:26:39,643
But TJ was scared to death.
255
00:26:39,723 --> 00:26:40,763
[inhales]
256
00:26:40,843 --> 00:26:42,963
Nobody in Red Lodge liked TJ.
257
00:26:45,363 --> 00:26:50,883
So, I think even if it was an accident,
nobody would believe him.
258
00:26:50,963 --> 00:26:52,843
I think he would run scared
259
00:26:53,323 --> 00:26:55,363
because he wasn't
in his right frame of mind.
260
00:26:58,083 --> 00:26:59,923
I can understand him doing that.
261
00:27:00,003 --> 00:27:02,563
I'm not justifying it, but I--
262
00:27:02,643 --> 00:27:04,643
I can see that he would do that, yes.
263
00:27:18,923 --> 00:27:21,483
TJ had a lot of issues growing up.
264
00:27:21,563 --> 00:27:24,643
You know, I don't want to get
into a lot of his personal life,
265
00:27:24,723 --> 00:27:27,563
but there was abuse in different areas.
266
00:27:28,283 --> 00:27:29,563
He had it rough.
267
00:27:34,003 --> 00:27:39,083
He's sentimental, he cries over movies.
He's gentle, he's kind.
268
00:27:44,843 --> 00:27:46,563
If this had went to trial,
269
00:27:46,643 --> 00:27:48,603
I don't think TJ would have had a prayer
270
00:27:48,683 --> 00:27:53,803
because this is a small community
and he was the bad guy.
271
00:27:53,883 --> 00:27:56,163
Nobody cared about TJ.
272
00:27:58,843 --> 00:28:00,803
Jimmy was well-loved in this community.
273
00:28:00,883 --> 00:28:03,563
And TJ, they figured
he was just a monster.
274
00:28:12,803 --> 00:28:16,323
[somber melodic music plays]
275
00:28:20,963 --> 00:28:25,043
People know I'm TJ's mother-in-law
and I keep in touch with TJ.
276
00:28:25,803 --> 00:28:28,923
And people say, "You talk to him?
Why would you talk to him?"
277
00:28:29,003 --> 00:28:31,363
It's like, "Why wouldn't I talk to him?"
278
00:28:32,363 --> 00:28:35,843
Who does he have to turn to?
I'm all he's got right now.
279
00:29:03,563 --> 00:29:05,323
My name is Dave Beuscher.
280
00:29:05,403 --> 00:29:09,723
I'm the owner of AY Supply
in Red Lodge, Montana.
281
00:29:12,843 --> 00:29:16,323
I've had many men come and help me,
282
00:29:16,403 --> 00:29:18,003
kind of down-and-out men.
283
00:29:21,843 --> 00:29:26,643
People show up and they're hungry
and they need a day's work.
284
00:29:31,163 --> 00:29:36,643
TJ, he was needing work
and couldn't find any.
285
00:29:39,483 --> 00:29:41,923
It worked out fairly well at first.
286
00:29:43,203 --> 00:29:45,603
Since TJ was working for me,
287
00:29:45,683 --> 00:29:48,363
I let TJ and his wife Shilo
288
00:29:48,883 --> 00:29:53,483
live in a house that I owned
about six miles that way.
289
00:29:54,843 --> 00:29:56,723
I kind of overlooked the fact
290
00:29:56,803 --> 00:29:59,683
that occasionally,
they couldn't pay the rent.
291
00:30:04,603 --> 00:30:09,283
Jim was a neighbor
that lived a couple of blocks away.
292
00:30:11,883 --> 00:30:13,523
He was a very nice guy.
293
00:30:22,243 --> 00:30:25,363
We had a number of guys hanging out.
294
00:30:28,723 --> 00:30:31,763
TJ and Jim met each other here
295
00:30:31,843 --> 00:30:34,643
and became somewhat of friends.
296
00:30:37,723 --> 00:30:41,683
But another fellow here at, at the shop,
297
00:30:41,763 --> 00:30:46,563
he said to me
it was like mixing gasoline and matches.
298
00:30:46,643 --> 00:30:50,003
I guess he thought less of TJ than I did.
299
00:30:59,203 --> 00:31:03,203
[eerie discordant music plays]
300
00:31:44,483 --> 00:31:47,483
[TJ] Me and Shilo, we were
common-law married, I guess,
301
00:31:47,563 --> 00:31:49,923
because we'd lived together for so long.
302
00:31:51,243 --> 00:31:55,003
For a long time, I'd watch these jewelry
commercials or whatever,
303
00:31:55,083 --> 00:31:58,043
and I always wanted to get her
a real wedding ring.
304
00:31:59,403 --> 00:32:04,283
So I had asked the guy I worked for,
Dave at AY Supply,
305
00:32:04,363 --> 00:32:08,643
for some of the money
to buy a ring for her,
306
00:32:08,723 --> 00:32:11,363
and he ended up loaning me money.
307
00:32:11,443 --> 00:32:15,003
I don't know exactly how much.
A couple thousand, I guess.
308
00:32:16,363 --> 00:32:18,963
This was a few days
before all this happened.
309
00:32:22,563 --> 00:32:23,403
Huh.
310
00:32:24,283 --> 00:32:25,523
[chuckles]
311
00:32:27,163 --> 00:32:28,403
That's crazy.
312
00:32:30,043 --> 00:32:32,483
I never loaned him two thousand dollars.
313
00:32:34,083 --> 00:32:35,483
Not that I know of.
314
00:32:36,083 --> 00:32:40,843
And certainly not
a few days before this crime.
315
00:32:43,243 --> 00:32:45,283
There was no point at,
316
00:32:45,363 --> 00:32:48,683
at which TJ came to me and,
with a sob story,
317
00:32:48,763 --> 00:32:53,283
and said, "I need to get Shilo
a nice piece of jewelry, a ring."
318
00:32:53,363 --> 00:32:55,803
He, he never said that to me.
319
00:32:55,883 --> 00:32:59,723
That just didn't happen.
He didn't borrow 2,000 bucks from me.
320
00:33:01,083 --> 00:33:04,603
And-- And my gosh,
I wouldn't trust TJ with it.
321
00:33:05,203 --> 00:33:09,483
I knew him well enough that I didn't need
to be giving him any money,
322
00:33:10,203 --> 00:33:13,523
ring or no ring for his wife.
323
00:33:14,843 --> 00:33:16,923
[wind howls]
324
00:33:40,523 --> 00:33:44,523
[grim instrumental music plays]
325
00:33:53,043 --> 00:33:55,083
[TJ] I remember twirling it forward,
326
00:33:55,163 --> 00:33:57,723
and my thumb had caught the hammer on it.
327
00:33:57,803 --> 00:34:00,283
And when the gun started coming back,
328
00:34:00,363 --> 00:34:05,563
my first instinct was to push
my finger down, and the gun went off.
329
00:34:05,643 --> 00:34:07,923
And it was so loud, it scared me.
330
00:34:08,483 --> 00:34:11,163
And I remember seeing Jim
fall to the ground.
331
00:34:12,083 --> 00:34:14,763
And, at that point, I was just… I didn't…
332
00:34:14,843 --> 00:34:18,163
I guess I didn't comprehend at the moment
what had just happened
333
00:34:18,243 --> 00:34:21,843
because I didn't expect the gun
to go off like that.
334
00:34:24,283 --> 00:34:29,883
Am I guilty for killing somebody?
Yes, absolutely. I did.
335
00:34:30,403 --> 00:34:35,523
Am I guilty of deliberate homicide
for intentionally killing somebody
336
00:34:35,603 --> 00:34:38,883
and premeditated killing my best friend?
Absolutely not.
337
00:34:45,643 --> 00:34:48,443
[Josh] What TJ just said
is basically nonsense.
338
00:34:48,963 --> 00:34:50,803
I don't know why TJ won't admit
339
00:34:52,363 --> 00:34:54,043
to what actually happened that day.
340
00:35:00,323 --> 00:35:02,323
So, this is… This is the murder weapon.
341
00:35:04,363 --> 00:35:07,563
So, what you can see, that is a… the .357.
342
00:35:08,803 --> 00:35:11,243
King Cobra revolver.
343
00:35:15,483 --> 00:35:17,083
This is a pretty heavy gun.
344
00:35:18,403 --> 00:35:21,843
Then TJ talks about,
while he's twirling it on his finger,
345
00:35:21,923 --> 00:35:24,603
he accidentally pulls this back
346
00:35:24,683 --> 00:35:28,843
And you can see,
this requires pressure to pull this back.
347
00:35:28,923 --> 00:35:31,283
A true effort to do that.
348
00:35:31,803 --> 00:35:34,363
While at the same time,
pulling the trigger.
349
00:35:35,683 --> 00:35:36,643
Um…
350
00:35:36,723 --> 00:35:41,003
You know, just, even doing this right now,
this is not something you accidentally do.
351
00:35:41,723 --> 00:35:42,563
Um…
352
00:35:42,643 --> 00:35:43,843
That's a deliberate act.
353
00:35:43,923 --> 00:35:46,963
And Jimmy just happens to be
right in front of him.
354
00:35:47,523 --> 00:35:51,683
And if you look at the autopsy photo,
it can show the trajectory of the bullet,
355
00:35:51,763 --> 00:35:52,963
and it's a straight shot.
356
00:35:53,043 --> 00:35:56,003
The bullet goes basically level with him,
357
00:35:56,083 --> 00:35:59,163
enters and exits his head in that,
in that line.
358
00:35:59,883 --> 00:36:02,763
So, I don't believe TJ,
and I don't think it's
359
00:36:03,883 --> 00:36:06,683
even remotely possible
that that's what happened.
360
00:36:15,123 --> 00:36:19,123
[somber instrumental music plays]
361
00:36:30,243 --> 00:36:34,243
[cryptic melodic music plays]
362
00:36:39,843 --> 00:36:42,563
[man] This was a strong case
from the very beginning.
363
00:36:43,723 --> 00:36:46,563
And certainly,
we were ready to go to trial
364
00:36:46,643 --> 00:36:49,723
when, uh, we learned that he was ready
to change his plea.
365
00:36:53,523 --> 00:36:54,643
What would somebody do
366
00:36:54,723 --> 00:36:57,443
if they did accidentally
shoot their friend through the head?
367
00:36:58,563 --> 00:37:02,323
Are you going to try to call
law enforcement or medical aid?
368
00:37:03,123 --> 00:37:05,443
Or do you take his money?
369
00:37:05,523 --> 00:37:09,163
Do you drag his body down to the creek
where it's going to be harder to find?
370
00:37:11,043 --> 00:37:13,723
There's nothing that he does
that is consistent
371
00:37:13,803 --> 00:37:17,323
with any sort of concern
for the, uh, the well-being of his friend.
372
00:37:22,123 --> 00:37:23,203
My name is Alex Nixon.
373
00:37:23,283 --> 00:37:26,083
I'm the Carbon County attorney
in Red Lodge, Montana.
374
00:37:33,763 --> 00:37:37,843
It's pretty hard to believe that, uh,
this was anything but a homicide,
375
00:37:37,923 --> 00:37:40,803
and we were very confident
that we could get a conviction.
376
00:37:41,403 --> 00:37:46,803
We had an actual first-hand admission
of what happened that evening.
377
00:37:47,323 --> 00:37:50,843
[eerie discordant music plays]
378
00:38:05,443 --> 00:38:09,123
TJ tells Kristen
that he had killed the man
379
00:38:09,763 --> 00:38:12,283
because he was homeless and disrespectful.
380
00:38:14,403 --> 00:38:16,603
She said that he, he begged for his life.
381
00:38:30,323 --> 00:38:33,603
She said that, uh, TJ described
dragging the body, uh,
382
00:38:33,683 --> 00:38:35,363
where it would be harder to find.
383
00:38:39,083 --> 00:38:40,003
It was a big deal
384
00:38:40,083 --> 00:38:44,923
because here you have a description of not
a person who was sorry or sympathetic
385
00:38:45,003 --> 00:38:48,123
because he had just killed
his so-called best friend.
386
00:38:48,203 --> 00:38:52,203
What you have is somebody who is angry
who felt like he was a victim,
387
00:38:52,283 --> 00:38:53,963
that he was being disrespected.
388
00:38:54,043 --> 00:38:56,483
He wasn't being properly appreciated.
389
00:38:59,003 --> 00:39:01,243
What you heard about was
390
00:39:01,323 --> 00:39:05,123
somebody describing a,
a brutal, cold-blooded homicide.
391
00:39:06,803 --> 00:39:09,883
It was anything
but the story of an accidental killing.
392
00:39:22,963 --> 00:39:25,163
[TJ] It made me really sound like
a monster.
393
00:39:25,683 --> 00:39:30,603
They tried to say
that I had Jim on his knees,
394
00:39:31,323 --> 00:39:33,483
and then I had a gun
to the back of his head,
395
00:39:33,563 --> 00:39:35,123
and then I shot him,
396
00:39:35,203 --> 00:39:38,043
which is not even close to the truth.
397
00:39:42,803 --> 00:39:43,643
[sighs]
398
00:39:44,323 --> 00:39:47,323
[Alex] Listening to this,
it seems that, uh…
399
00:39:47,403 --> 00:39:52,563
TJ was, uh, trying to say that
the narrative of Jimmy being on his knees
400
00:39:52,643 --> 00:39:55,883
was one that was
created by investigators, uh,
401
00:39:55,963 --> 00:39:59,403
when, in fact, we have him to blame
for that story.
402
00:39:59,483 --> 00:40:01,603
That is the story he told Kristen.
403
00:40:01,683 --> 00:40:05,403
[somber melodic music plays]
404
00:40:05,483 --> 00:40:09,603
What the final, uh, motivator was
for TJ to kill Jimmy, I don't know.
405
00:40:13,443 --> 00:40:18,403
What was most important was
there was no doubt that TJ killed Jimmy.
406
00:40:19,603 --> 00:40:22,803
It was just a matter of which,
which story you wanted to believe.
407
00:40:23,323 --> 00:40:28,523
At the end of the day, TJ wants you
to believe he's not a murderer,
408
00:40:28,603 --> 00:40:30,483
he's just a really shitty friend.
409
00:40:39,843 --> 00:40:42,843
[ominous music plays]
410
00:40:47,363 --> 00:40:49,363
[birds chirping]
411
00:41:08,283 --> 00:41:12,923
[TJ] I don't know how…
I don't know how to defend myself anymore.
412
00:41:13,003 --> 00:41:15,723
I don't know what to say
to convince people.
413
00:41:20,083 --> 00:41:23,603
If I would have kept my mouth shut,
denied the whole thing, and lied about it,
414
00:41:23,683 --> 00:41:25,603
I probably wouldn't be sitting here today.
415
00:41:31,323 --> 00:41:35,963
Yeah, I didn't go to the cops at the,
at the beginning. I was terrified.
416
00:41:36,043 --> 00:41:37,803
I just took somebody's life.
417
00:41:38,883 --> 00:41:43,923
You know, put yourself in my shoes
during that 30 seconds. Two seconds.
418
00:41:45,763 --> 00:41:50,243
You know, that fraction of a second
changed the course of many people's lives.
419
00:41:52,003 --> 00:41:55,403
I do understand why there's
a lot of people that don't trust me
420
00:41:55,483 --> 00:41:57,203
or don't believe anything that I say.
421
00:41:57,283 --> 00:41:58,643
I do understand that.
422
00:41:59,163 --> 00:42:01,123
And there's no way that I can fix that.
423
00:42:01,803 --> 00:42:05,283
There's no way that I can fix that.
You know.
424
00:42:17,203 --> 00:42:19,483
[Josh] So this is,
this is the murder weapon.
425
00:42:20,243 --> 00:42:23,763
And TJ talks about,
while he's twirling it on his finger,
426
00:42:23,843 --> 00:42:26,123
he accidentally pulls this back.
427
00:42:26,763 --> 00:42:27,923
This requires pressure,
428
00:42:28,003 --> 00:42:30,603
while at the same time,
pulling the trigger.
429
00:42:31,363 --> 00:42:34,603
It's not something you accidentally do.
That's a deliberate act.
430
00:42:36,083 --> 00:42:38,283
Well, whatever, I guess.
431
00:42:38,763 --> 00:42:39,683
[laughs]
432
00:42:39,763 --> 00:42:40,803
Whatever.
433
00:42:44,443 --> 00:42:48,083
He's saying, "It takes a lot of pressure."
It don't take a lot of pressure.
434
00:42:48,163 --> 00:42:51,963
I've shot that gun many, many,
many hundreds of times.
435
00:42:52,043 --> 00:42:53,883
That very same gun I've shot.
436
00:42:53,963 --> 00:42:56,243
Me and Jimmy went shooting all the time.
437
00:42:57,723 --> 00:43:00,443
[interviewer] It's quite compelling
seeing the sheriff
438
00:43:00,523 --> 00:43:02,803
show how hard it is
to pull that trigger back.
439
00:43:02,883 --> 00:43:04,643
Oh, yeah. Yeah, I imagine.
440
00:43:04,723 --> 00:43:07,563
[stammers] And I imagine he put on
a good act and tried…
441
00:43:07,643 --> 00:43:11,883
and made it look like it was, uh,
quite a bit harder than it actually is.
442
00:43:11,963 --> 00:43:13,763
Because it's not really that hard.
443
00:43:16,363 --> 00:43:18,243
He's trying to make it sound like
444
00:43:18,723 --> 00:43:19,803
it's, it's…
445
00:43:19,883 --> 00:43:21,483
"There's only one way that this is,
446
00:43:21,563 --> 00:43:23,523
and this is the way
it could have happened."
447
00:43:23,603 --> 00:43:25,163
That's a lie. It's a lie.
448
00:43:28,563 --> 00:43:30,403
I don't care what people think.
449
00:43:31,203 --> 00:43:33,403
You know, I was there, I know happened.
450
00:43:34,643 --> 00:43:38,403
You know, I never intentionally
intended to hurt anybody.
451
00:43:38,483 --> 00:43:41,363
Never have and never will.
I'm just not that person.
452
00:43:42,483 --> 00:43:45,563
[interviewer] So everybody
that's saying otherwise is wrong?
453
00:43:45,643 --> 00:43:47,003
They're dead wrong.
454
00:43:47,083 --> 00:43:48,123
They're liars.
455
00:43:48,203 --> 00:43:51,443
I'd love to tell them to their face,
"You're lying. You're a liar."
456
00:43:51,923 --> 00:43:55,083
What do I have to lose?
I got a life sentence.
457
00:43:56,883 --> 00:44:00,803
I killed a man.
That man was my best friend.
458
00:44:01,523 --> 00:44:03,723
And I'm sorry. I'm very sorry.
459
00:44:03,803 --> 00:44:06,643
There's no words to say how sorry I am
for what happened.
460
00:44:12,363 --> 00:44:16,363
[eerie discordant music plays]