1 00:00:16,480 --> 00:00:18,720 Every once in a while, I'll think about, 2 00:00:18,800 --> 00:00:21,960 you know, how my life would have been if not for this. 3 00:00:25,720 --> 00:00:28,520 At times, I believe, I deserve forgiveness. 4 00:00:30,040 --> 00:00:31,760 That I'm redeemable. 5 00:00:56,040 --> 00:01:00,120 I am very, very sorry for what happened. 6 00:01:01,000 --> 00:01:03,080 And I wish that I could take it back. 7 00:01:06,600 --> 00:01:08,240 What I did, it's not who I am. 8 00:01:11,920 --> 00:01:13,320 How could I do something like that? 9 00:01:23,160 --> 00:01:25,080 [man 1] And I walked up, I fired one shot. 10 00:01:25,160 --> 00:01:27,520 And as I got closer, I fired one more shot. 11 00:01:28,760 --> 00:01:32,360 [man 2] She was shot through the cheek and it stopped in her jaw. 12 00:01:33,600 --> 00:01:37,880 [man 3] I drove him around behind a desk and I stabbed him approximately 25 times. 13 00:01:42,760 --> 00:01:44,000 [man 4] I couldn't believe it. 14 00:01:44,080 --> 00:01:47,320 I just thought I can't believe I just killed somebody. 15 00:01:50,520 --> 00:01:54,360 [man 5] I don't feel bad about it. [laughs] 16 00:01:58,280 --> 00:02:02,080 [man 6] I started stabbing him, stabbing the guy on the couch. 17 00:02:45,760 --> 00:02:52,440 My name is Joshua David Nelson. I'm 40 years old and I'm on death row. 18 00:02:56,320 --> 00:02:59,040 I've been here 20 years. 19 00:02:59,120 --> 00:03:02,960 And I was 18 and, like, two months when I caught this case. 20 00:03:04,880 --> 00:03:09,160 My earliest memories were of my father as an alcoholic. 21 00:03:09,840 --> 00:03:13,960 I was probably four or five, maybe even younger. 22 00:03:15,720 --> 00:03:18,920 As soon as he came in, my mom was waiting on him and it would start. 23 00:03:20,600 --> 00:03:24,000 They would argue, and it would fill the trailer. 24 00:03:25,960 --> 00:03:32,360 And I-- I would run to my room and hide out in my room, 25 00:03:32,560 --> 00:03:37,640 uh, crying, as I knew what was happening. He was beating on her. 26 00:03:37,880 --> 00:03:42,400 And I couldn't help her, but I was also terrified that I was next. 27 00:03:47,320 --> 00:03:52,120 I was probably seven when it happened, when they eventually got, uh, a divorce. 28 00:03:52,360 --> 00:03:56,120 And then I thought it was gonna get a lot better, 'cause it's just me and my mom. 29 00:03:56,320 --> 00:04:00,000 But it didn't get better. 30 00:04:11,440 --> 00:04:14,640 [birds chirping] 31 00:04:24,320 --> 00:04:26,040 [Nelson] We came down to Florida. 32 00:04:26,120 --> 00:04:30,840 Within a year, I got, like, arrested four or five times. 33 00:04:30,920 --> 00:04:37,600 And it was multiple car thefts and breaking-and-enterings. 34 00:04:40,800 --> 00:04:41,840 I was doing drugs. 35 00:04:41,920 --> 00:04:44,560 I experimented with marijuana, alcohol, 36 00:04:44,640 --> 00:04:48,800 you know, hard alcohol, beer, uh, some roofies. 37 00:04:48,880 --> 00:04:51,040 I even huffed gasoline a couple of times. 38 00:04:53,520 --> 00:04:59,120 When the courts heard that, they suggested that I go to a drug rehab. 39 00:05:06,600 --> 00:05:10,000 I just showed up one day, they just dropped me down in one of those places, 40 00:05:10,080 --> 00:05:12,600 and there's ten other boys your age there, 41 00:05:12,680 --> 00:05:15,560 and they're all there, more than likely, for the same reason. 42 00:05:15,960 --> 00:05:17,880 And me and Keith, 43 00:05:17,960 --> 00:05:21,200 we just gravitated towards each other, I guess, and started talking. 44 00:05:22,800 --> 00:05:25,200 Became fast friends, really good friends. 45 00:05:25,280 --> 00:05:31,000 And the friendship built the longer we spent in that rehab. 46 00:05:31,080 --> 00:05:32,480 We became friends on the streets. 47 00:05:33,920 --> 00:05:37,360 Went to the same high school and hung out pretty much every day. 48 00:05:50,440 --> 00:05:55,160 Me and Keith started dating two sisters, and Tina was the youngest sister 49 00:05:55,640 --> 00:05:58,880 and she started dating Keith. 50 00:06:00,960 --> 00:06:03,000 That's how we all came together. 51 00:06:07,400 --> 00:06:11,080 Tommy was brought in to our group by another friend of ours. 52 00:06:11,640 --> 00:06:15,920 He just rolled up on us in his car one time, Tommy did, 53 00:06:16,200 --> 00:06:19,160 and I didn't really have much interaction with him at first. 54 00:06:21,880 --> 00:06:24,680 He seemed like, uh, a decent person. 55 00:06:25,080 --> 00:06:28,120 And, you know, he was a little bit older than us, 56 00:06:29,160 --> 00:06:31,040 and we just started hanging out. 57 00:06:38,600 --> 00:06:42,160 When me and Keith was in that rehab together, 58 00:06:42,240 --> 00:06:46,680 we would escape the reality of our situation by fantasizing about, 59 00:06:46,760 --> 00:06:50,360 yeah, when we get out, we would do all these things, you know, commit crimes 60 00:06:50,440 --> 00:06:54,880 and we would, you know, better our lives, we would get away from all these things. 61 00:07:01,320 --> 00:07:03,520 Fast forward to that day, 62 00:07:04,760 --> 00:07:08,920 I don't remember exactly how that came up, but it came up. 63 00:07:09,920 --> 00:07:11,640 We said we could kill Tommy. 64 00:07:19,560 --> 00:07:21,720 We could take his car, take his money 65 00:07:22,640 --> 00:07:28,800 and do whatever we wanted to do. Be on our own. 66 00:07:37,280 --> 00:07:41,760 At first, I thought it was just blowing off steam, at first. 67 00:07:41,840 --> 00:07:43,400 I gave it no mind. 68 00:07:43,480 --> 00:07:45,960 I didn't think that it was really gonna happen. 69 00:07:48,160 --> 00:07:51,200 I wasn't, you know, in essence, 70 00:07:51,280 --> 00:07:54,680 planning it out as you would, uh... 71 00:07:55,960 --> 00:07:58,720 You know, meticulously planning it out, I wasn't doing that. 72 00:07:59,440 --> 00:08:00,600 Neither was Keith. 73 00:08:10,320 --> 00:08:14,840 We called him. He came over, picked us up. We drove around. 74 00:08:19,200 --> 00:08:22,760 Keith said, "You know, um, we gotta get some money." 75 00:08:26,640 --> 00:08:27,960 So he's like, "Okay." 76 00:08:28,040 --> 00:08:32,280 And Keith says, "Well, if we give you some of that money, 77 00:08:32,360 --> 00:08:35,720 will you take us to the rendezvous point so we can pick the money up?" 78 00:08:35,799 --> 00:08:38,239 He was like, "Yeah. I'll take you there. I'll help." 79 00:08:45,440 --> 00:08:47,920 [Nelson] I still don't have the feeling like, that's a done deal-- 80 00:08:48,000 --> 00:08:50,040 that's gonna happen, we're gonna kill him. 81 00:08:54,440 --> 00:08:59,480 So, we drive out to this abandoned area, 82 00:08:59,560 --> 00:09:01,560 this undeveloped area in Cape Coral. 83 00:09:08,920 --> 00:09:10,160 We tell him, you know, uh... 84 00:09:10,560 --> 00:09:13,600 we're gonna "wait for them," wait for them to come and give us money. 85 00:09:18,640 --> 00:09:19,800 So we get out the car. 86 00:09:25,560 --> 00:09:27,600 Baseball bat came from Tommy. 87 00:09:27,680 --> 00:09:30,160 He carried it around in the back of his car. 88 00:09:30,240 --> 00:09:31,840 He said for protection. 89 00:09:32,640 --> 00:09:36,320 So, when I got out, I used that as a premise. 90 00:09:36,400 --> 00:09:39,040 We're standing out in the dark in the middle of nowhere, 91 00:09:39,120 --> 00:09:43,120 I'm gonna have this bat just in case somebody comes out of the woods. 92 00:09:46,120 --> 00:09:51,120 Me and Keith are outside and we're kind of talking about what's gonna happen. 93 00:09:53,560 --> 00:09:55,640 I say, 'I'll hit him first. If I knock him out, 94 00:09:55,840 --> 00:09:57,000 you gotta finish him off." 95 00:10:00,360 --> 00:10:01,240 "You gotta kill him." 96 00:10:05,480 --> 00:10:07,840 Then we talk about, "How are we gonna get him out the car?" 97 00:10:10,320 --> 00:10:15,600 We knew how much he valued that car. 98 00:10:15,680 --> 00:10:16,520 He loved that car. 99 00:10:20,320 --> 00:10:22,040 Keith had the box cutter. 100 00:10:22,880 --> 00:10:24,720 We cut the bumper with the cutter and told him, 101 00:10:24,800 --> 00:10:27,600 "Hey, when you was driving back here, you must've hit something 102 00:10:27,680 --> 00:10:30,080 or something happened, and there's a cut on this bumper." 103 00:10:33,760 --> 00:10:35,080 He got out. 104 00:10:36,440 --> 00:10:37,960 He looked at the bumper. 105 00:10:40,160 --> 00:10:44,560 I felt, like, this rush of adrenaline. I was trying to get myself to do it. 106 00:10:46,920 --> 00:10:48,800 And I just couldn't do it. 107 00:10:49,360 --> 00:10:53,280 And then I just stepped past that... 108 00:10:53,680 --> 00:10:56,360 that part of me that wasn't allowing me to do that 109 00:10:56,440 --> 00:10:58,480 and I hit him with the baseball bat. 110 00:11:03,960 --> 00:11:05,000 He fell down. 111 00:11:05,560 --> 00:11:08,080 And then I tried to hit him again. 112 00:11:08,400 --> 00:11:09,440 And... 113 00:11:11,360 --> 00:11:14,720 then I hit-- I definitely hit him, and he's... 114 00:11:15,400 --> 00:11:20,640 and he was just crying and scream-- 115 00:11:20,720 --> 00:11:25,760 not screaming, but like, you know, moaning and saying, 116 00:11:25,840 --> 00:11:29,000 "Stop." You know, "Stop, stop. Please stop. Please stop." 117 00:11:29,080 --> 00:11:30,120 Begging. 118 00:11:30,720 --> 00:11:31,840 And then... 119 00:11:36,320 --> 00:11:38,000 he said he-- that's when he said, 120 00:11:38,080 --> 00:11:40,480 "Take the car. Take the car, take the money." 121 00:11:40,640 --> 00:11:44,080 And we kind of walked off to the side and said, you know, 122 00:11:46,200 --> 00:11:47,880 "Is that a possibility?" 123 00:11:48,360 --> 00:11:51,640 Kind of talked amongst ourselves and said, "That's not... that's never-- 124 00:11:51,720 --> 00:11:54,120 You know, we're gonna get in trouble for this." 125 00:11:58,880 --> 00:12:00,720 Keith says, "We had that agreement." 126 00:12:00,800 --> 00:12:03,880 If I'd knock him out, he would finish him. 127 00:12:08,400 --> 00:12:10,120 So, I hit him with the bat. 128 00:12:10,800 --> 00:12:12,600 I hit him again with the bat. 129 00:12:12,920 --> 00:12:16,640 And he stopped making noise. He stopped begging, he stopped talking. 130 00:12:21,400 --> 00:12:25,600 And Keith pulled out one of his shoestrings from his shoes 131 00:12:25,680 --> 00:12:27,080 and tied him up. 132 00:12:31,240 --> 00:12:35,400 I said, "Keith, you know, it's on you. He's out." 133 00:12:35,480 --> 00:12:38,040 That's when Tommy said, "I'm not out! I'm not out!" 134 00:12:38,160 --> 00:12:39,600 And then I walked over there 135 00:12:42,040 --> 00:12:45,800 and I hit him with the bat several more times. 136 00:12:46,400 --> 00:12:47,640 Really hard. 137 00:12:53,640 --> 00:12:56,840 Everything that I had dealt with my entire life came out at that moment 138 00:12:56,920 --> 00:13:00,200 and all those feelings, all that anger, and-- 139 00:13:00,840 --> 00:13:02,000 It just... 140 00:13:03,920 --> 00:13:08,080 It just-- it just all happened in that moment and-- 141 00:13:14,960 --> 00:13:17,920 He didn't make-- he wasn't-- he was out then, 'cause he didn't... 142 00:13:18,000 --> 00:13:21,680 he didn't say anything else, he didn't... 143 00:13:24,040 --> 00:13:26,880 he didn't resist. 144 00:13:27,240 --> 00:13:31,400 And then Keith went over there and started cutting his throat with a box cutter. 145 00:13:37,760 --> 00:13:40,280 [Nelson] We drug him to an area 146 00:13:40,360 --> 00:13:44,960 with more, like, shrubs and ground cover, I guess you would say, 147 00:13:45,400 --> 00:13:47,080 instead of just next to a road. 148 00:13:52,000 --> 00:13:55,480 We took a big piece of wood and put it over him. 149 00:14:01,040 --> 00:14:05,200 And when we drove off, we threw the bat in the water and the razor away. 150 00:14:05,280 --> 00:14:10,760 We got rid of the clothes we were wearing because we were covered in blood. 151 00:15:07,200 --> 00:15:10,360 [voice altered] My sister had met Josh through McDonalds 152 00:15:10,440 --> 00:15:12,200 'cause he was working there. 153 00:15:13,480 --> 00:15:17,200 I met Keith through Josh, 154 00:15:17,600 --> 00:15:21,520 and shortly after, we started dating. 155 00:15:24,680 --> 00:15:28,480 All of us had problems in our families. 156 00:15:28,920 --> 00:15:32,200 And we had all been talking for quite some time 157 00:15:32,760 --> 00:15:35,720 about wanting to run away together. 158 00:15:36,440 --> 00:15:42,680 And our biggest problem was how any of us were gonna go anywhere. 159 00:15:42,920 --> 00:15:44,320 And Keith and Josh had said, 160 00:15:44,400 --> 00:15:47,120 "You know, don't worry about it," that they would get a car. 161 00:15:52,120 --> 00:15:57,840 That particular day, they had called and said, "We're leaving tonight." 162 00:15:59,880 --> 00:16:00,800 We said okay. 163 00:16:00,880 --> 00:16:04,760 So we just waited around for the phone call 164 00:16:05,200 --> 00:16:09,800 to leave our house and walk down the street to be picked up. 165 00:16:16,320 --> 00:16:20,440 As soon as we seen Tommy's car, we knew something was wrong. 166 00:16:22,520 --> 00:16:28,120 We didn't know if they had, somehow, convinced Tommy to give up his car 167 00:16:29,080 --> 00:16:31,240 or what was going on. 168 00:16:34,040 --> 00:16:39,040 They were both very quiet, and we asked, "Where's Tommy?" 169 00:16:42,920 --> 00:16:46,080 And Keith responded with, "We killed him." 170 00:18:08,240 --> 00:18:12,760 [woman] This is a picture of Tommy when he was about 18. 171 00:18:15,160 --> 00:18:17,520 And this is Tommy when he worked at Winn-Dixie. 172 00:18:17,600 --> 00:18:20,760 He was about 16 then. 173 00:18:23,440 --> 00:18:28,120 And, um, this here was the last picture taken. 174 00:18:28,200 --> 00:18:29,600 That's, uh, Tommy. 175 00:18:29,680 --> 00:18:34,280 That was the Thursday night before he died, and my sister. 176 00:18:34,360 --> 00:18:39,600 That was the car, the Ford Probe that they wanted. 177 00:18:43,160 --> 00:18:45,040 I took the picture of him and my sister. 178 00:18:45,120 --> 00:18:47,280 He was tickling her ribs. 179 00:18:50,600 --> 00:18:55,360 And then the following night is when he... he got killed. 180 00:18:55,440 --> 00:18:58,280 So I know that was the last picture taken of him. 181 00:19:15,920 --> 00:19:19,760 Tommy was a very happy, energetic person. 182 00:19:22,560 --> 00:19:27,160 He liked cars, installing stereos. 183 00:19:28,560 --> 00:19:31,360 Always on the go, liked to make friends. 184 00:19:32,520 --> 00:19:35,560 Um, I don't think he had any enemies. 185 00:19:38,920 --> 00:19:43,200 Never drank, smoked. Couldn't find a better person. 186 00:19:50,880 --> 00:19:53,800 He was going to community college. 187 00:19:53,880 --> 00:19:57,720 He'd just started taking up criminal law. He wanted to be a cop. 188 00:20:00,680 --> 00:20:02,880 And he said, "I'll buy a duplex." 189 00:20:02,960 --> 00:20:07,320 And he'll live in one end with his family and I'll live in the other end. 190 00:20:08,120 --> 00:20:11,440 And he was gonna have his Lamborghini in the driveway. 191 00:20:12,160 --> 00:20:13,480 I said, "Okay." 192 00:20:13,880 --> 00:20:16,000 Sounded fine at the time. 193 00:20:26,320 --> 00:20:31,560 We didn't know at first what... what had happened. 194 00:20:31,640 --> 00:20:34,120 We never thought it would turn to this. 195 00:20:34,920 --> 00:20:41,160 Um, we had gone to Josh's house, talked to his stepfather. 196 00:20:42,880 --> 00:20:45,920 And we went to the high school, we were talking to friends. 197 00:20:46,000 --> 00:20:48,840 They assumed they all went to Fort Lauderdale. 198 00:20:49,320 --> 00:20:54,840 We thought the worst thing was that, being he was not a drug user, 199 00:20:56,440 --> 00:20:58,400 they got him on some kind of drug 200 00:20:58,480 --> 00:21:01,680 and he's just forgetting to call home. 201 00:21:01,760 --> 00:21:04,600 That was about the worst thing we thought. 202 00:21:10,480 --> 00:21:13,800 But it took 11 days before we knew what had happened. 203 00:21:14,760 --> 00:21:18,120 They did the positive ID's through the dental records 204 00:21:18,440 --> 00:21:19,960 because of the decomposition. 205 00:21:20,040 --> 00:21:24,400 Eleven days in a field, in Florida, in the heat. 206 00:21:52,000 --> 00:21:56,720 [man] He should have been able to do everything that he was gonna do. 207 00:21:58,360 --> 00:22:00,320 And he didn't get to do it. 208 00:22:00,720 --> 00:22:02,960 All over a stupid car. 209 00:22:08,800 --> 00:22:11,240 I mean, all I have to do is think about it, 210 00:22:11,320 --> 00:22:14,720 and I start crying like a little baby. 211 00:22:15,560 --> 00:22:18,800 [sniffs, clicks tongue] And believe me, I'm pissed. 212 00:22:23,160 --> 00:22:26,640 He's lived all this time as my family dies. 213 00:22:29,480 --> 00:22:32,160 Coming from a peaceful hippie, this is saying a lot. 214 00:22:32,600 --> 00:22:34,560 But I ain't that peaceful. 215 00:22:36,240 --> 00:22:40,640 Peace, love and happiness forever, until you brutally murder my brother. 216 00:22:46,120 --> 00:22:48,560 I will dedicate my life. 217 00:22:50,400 --> 00:22:52,800 I will dedicate my life! 218 00:22:55,720 --> 00:22:57,280 They will wish they never-- They're better off where they're at 219 00:22:59,000 --> 00:23:02,840 because they will not wanna meet me when they get out. 220 00:23:20,080 --> 00:23:22,640 [Owens] This is, uh, Tommy's dad. 221 00:23:22,720 --> 00:23:27,720 He died on December 4th of '04. Cancer. 222 00:23:27,800 --> 00:23:31,240 And, um, yeah, he was hoping 223 00:23:31,320 --> 00:23:35,400 he... he could be there at the execution. 224 00:23:35,800 --> 00:23:38,400 He was gonna eat popcorn in the front row. 225 00:23:38,560 --> 00:23:42,120 That was his-- what he said to the reporters back then. 226 00:23:43,040 --> 00:23:46,160 But as he got sicker and sicker, 227 00:23:46,240 --> 00:23:49,040 you know, we knew he wasn't gonna be there. 228 00:23:49,520 --> 00:23:53,520 It's just, you know, 22 years is a long time to wait, you know? 229 00:23:54,200 --> 00:23:58,320 And he's definitely should have been put to death a long time ago. 230 00:24:01,320 --> 00:24:05,080 [Owens] In their minds, they had a reason. They planned. 231 00:24:06,440 --> 00:24:11,000 But thinking back, no, there was... there was absolutely no reason. 232 00:24:11,080 --> 00:24:14,720 Tommy was trying to just tell them, "Take the car, take the car." 233 00:24:15,760 --> 00:24:17,840 You know, he knew they were killing him. 234 00:24:19,120 --> 00:24:22,280 But they continued. They made the decision to kill him. 235 00:24:23,480 --> 00:24:26,120 They could have just taken the car and left. 236 00:24:27,120 --> 00:24:30,760 But they made the wrong choice. And now they're paying for it. 237 00:24:30,840 --> 00:24:33,080 And one's gonna pay with his life. 238 00:25:10,240 --> 00:25:12,960 [Stewart] When I was 19, I was married to Peggy, 239 00:25:13,040 --> 00:25:15,680 and she is the mother of Heather, our daughter. 240 00:25:15,760 --> 00:25:19,200 And Peggy is also the mother of Josh Nelson. 241 00:25:27,840 --> 00:25:32,720 I think I was divorced at 21. 242 00:25:33,560 --> 00:25:35,160 And, uh... 243 00:25:38,000 --> 00:25:42,160 Josh came along about three years later. 244 00:25:49,160 --> 00:25:53,800 I can remember, uh, as Heather was six months old 245 00:25:53,880 --> 00:25:56,840 feeling just concerned on a bigger level 246 00:25:56,920 --> 00:26:01,160 as to the maternal care that Peggy was able to give to her. 247 00:26:02,880 --> 00:26:06,600 I can remember I could hear Heather crying in the back of the house. 248 00:26:07,080 --> 00:26:10,200 And I might go and check on Heather, and she'd quiet down. 249 00:26:10,280 --> 00:26:13,440 And then, uh, once Peggy got up 250 00:26:13,520 --> 00:26:16,800 and I heard her go to the back of the trailer, 251 00:26:16,880 --> 00:26:23,120 and the crying stopped quite suddenly, 252 00:26:23,200 --> 00:26:25,520 to a point that I was just conscious of it. 253 00:26:25,600 --> 00:26:27,960 It just seemed different. 254 00:26:29,280 --> 00:26:33,880 And I got up to walk back just to see what was going on. 255 00:26:34,200 --> 00:26:37,840 And as I went into the room, 256 00:26:38,440 --> 00:26:44,200 Peggy stepped back from Heather, the baby, and had a pillow in her hand. 257 00:26:44,280 --> 00:26:49,640 And it appeared as if Peggy was holding the pillow over Heather's face. 258 00:26:49,720 --> 00:26:53,480 When she stepped back, Heather started crying again. 259 00:26:53,800 --> 00:26:56,440 And I couldn't see it directly, 260 00:26:56,520 --> 00:27:01,720 but it just, it felt very much, to me, as if that's what was going on. 261 00:27:01,800 --> 00:27:04,200 And I questioned Peggy about it. 262 00:27:04,360 --> 00:27:05,840 And she denied it. 263 00:27:05,920 --> 00:27:10,800 She said she was just, you know, she was just trying to comfort Heather. 264 00:27:11,440 --> 00:27:15,880 Um, and there were... there were a few incidents similar to that. 265 00:27:25,320 --> 00:27:28,680 [Stewart] When I did get custody of Heather, 266 00:27:28,760 --> 00:27:30,520 I can remember asking Heather, 267 00:27:30,600 --> 00:27:32,520 "Is this something that you want?" 268 00:27:32,600 --> 00:27:37,480 Because, you know, you don't know for sure how kids feel about this. 269 00:27:37,800 --> 00:27:39,720 And I can remember Heather saying, 270 00:27:39,800 --> 00:27:43,920 well, yes, she did want to come to Michigan and stay with me, 271 00:27:44,000 --> 00:27:47,720 but she was very concerned about Josh. 272 00:27:48,400 --> 00:27:51,920 She said, "I don't wanna leave Josh there by himself." 273 00:28:00,800 --> 00:28:04,560 [Heather] My mom was not nurturing. 274 00:28:05,200 --> 00:28:10,520 I would say that she did not have the mothering ability. 275 00:28:11,960 --> 00:28:16,040 I think that there was just a void inside of her 276 00:28:16,120 --> 00:28:20,080 that she wasn't able to be the mother 277 00:28:20,160 --> 00:28:24,160 that myself and Josh needed, 278 00:28:24,360 --> 00:28:26,880 that children are supposed to have. 279 00:28:32,240 --> 00:28:34,960 [Heather] Alan, Josh's dad-- 280 00:28:35,040 --> 00:28:38,880 the alcoholic part, I think, is what defined him, 281 00:28:39,640 --> 00:28:43,640 'cause I know that he was physically abusive to Josh. 282 00:28:43,720 --> 00:28:50,680 I mean, he spanked him a lot. Um, he yelled at him a lot. 283 00:28:51,280 --> 00:28:52,360 Um... 284 00:28:54,080 --> 00:28:58,920 but I guess I don't know how much of that went on more 285 00:28:59,000 --> 00:29:00,640 when I wasn't there, 286 00:29:01,080 --> 00:29:03,040 than when I was visiting. 287 00:29:03,240 --> 00:29:08,200 You know, if that's one of those things that people, behind closed doors... 288 00:29:09,000 --> 00:29:10,120 I don't know. 289 00:29:14,160 --> 00:29:15,920 [quavering] It's kind of hard now. 290 00:29:27,880 --> 00:29:32,560 [Heather] I think that that kind of an environment destroyed Josh. 291 00:29:32,640 --> 00:29:36,000 He was never given the values, the morals. 292 00:29:36,080 --> 00:29:38,600 I don't think he was ever taught how to love. 293 00:29:38,680 --> 00:29:43,760 Um, and when you don't have that, you can't give that. 294 00:29:44,080 --> 00:29:46,960 And you can't, um-- 295 00:29:48,320 --> 00:29:50,040 There's just nothing at-- 296 00:29:50,120 --> 00:29:53,920 Like I said, I mean, I just don't think that he ever had a chance. 297 00:30:13,480 --> 00:30:17,720 [Heather] When they moved to Florida, in, like, 1991, 298 00:30:18,560 --> 00:30:23,960 that kind of cut off any communication or ties to family. 299 00:30:26,920 --> 00:30:31,720 I found out about the sexual abuse that was going on with him and Greg, 300 00:30:31,800 --> 00:30:35,080 his stepdad, during the trial. 301 00:30:35,720 --> 00:30:37,440 I mean, I had no idea. 302 00:30:43,560 --> 00:30:45,600 From what I read in the reports, 303 00:30:45,680 --> 00:30:50,040 Greg sexually abusing Josh was a daily thing, a weekly thing. 304 00:30:50,120 --> 00:30:54,240 It was not a... every-once-in-a-while thing. 305 00:30:54,320 --> 00:30:57,640 It was... It was-- From the way that the reports read, 306 00:30:57,720 --> 00:31:00,280 it was almost that was his entire life. 307 00:31:09,400 --> 00:31:12,280 [Nelson on recording] It first started where I would be in the shower 308 00:31:12,360 --> 00:31:16,480 and he would come in there and sit down on the toilet. 309 00:31:18,080 --> 00:31:24,960 And, you know, obviously, I knew something was not right about that. 310 00:31:26,400 --> 00:31:29,320 Eventually, one night, he came into my room and... 311 00:31:30,200 --> 00:31:33,840 he started touching me in my private-- my penis, 312 00:31:33,920 --> 00:31:37,400 and I would try to roll away. 313 00:31:38,840 --> 00:31:40,240 And he was persistent. 314 00:31:40,320 --> 00:31:44,120 And then I would try and roll, I-- I acted like I was asleep. 315 00:31:44,200 --> 00:31:47,520 I acted like it wasn't existing. I mean, it wasn't happening. 316 00:31:47,600 --> 00:31:49,240 It couldn't be happening. 317 00:31:49,480 --> 00:31:55,880 And I sunk deeper inside myself, and, eventually, I got an erection. 318 00:31:56,400 --> 00:32:00,360 I was young and my body responded. 319 00:32:00,640 --> 00:32:03,160 And then he would perform oral sex on me. 320 00:32:06,640 --> 00:32:08,240 When he would do that, 321 00:32:10,520 --> 00:32:15,440 I can't describe what I've... I can't describe what I felt. 322 00:32:15,520 --> 00:32:18,600 I felt nothing. I felt absolutely nothing. 323 00:32:19,720 --> 00:32:23,560 And like I said, I just sunk deeper inside of myself, 324 00:32:24,320 --> 00:32:26,360 running away from myself. 325 00:32:27,960 --> 00:32:31,720 Eventually, I got up the courage to tell my mom 326 00:32:31,800 --> 00:32:36,680 after it had been happening for six-- six months, a year. 327 00:32:38,960 --> 00:32:41,880 I sat her down and I looked at her and I said, "Mom, this is what he's doing to me." 328 00:32:45,880 --> 00:32:51,960 And she called him into the room and he acknowledged it. 329 00:32:52,040 --> 00:32:55,800 He said he thought that I liked it, that's why he was doing it. 330 00:32:56,000 --> 00:33:00,200 And she told him that if he ever did it again, 331 00:33:00,400 --> 00:33:01,880 that she would kill him. 332 00:33:03,360 --> 00:33:05,440 And I'm sitting there thinking the whole time, 333 00:33:05,680 --> 00:33:07,800 "If he ever does it again?" 334 00:33:09,000 --> 00:33:12,000 What about the times he did it, you know? 335 00:33:12,920 --> 00:33:15,280 What about all those times that he did it? 336 00:33:24,480 --> 00:33:25,520 [sniffles] 337 00:33:29,560 --> 00:33:30,400 [sniffles] 338 00:33:33,320 --> 00:33:34,520 [sighs] 339 00:33:35,160 --> 00:33:38,560 I find it hard to believe that... 340 00:33:43,240 --> 00:33:45,400 an innocent child 341 00:33:49,880 --> 00:33:51,920 is sitting in death row. 342 00:33:54,160 --> 00:33:56,560 [inhales] 343 00:34:04,360 --> 00:34:06,880 [sighs] 344 00:34:07,520 --> 00:34:09,920 And there is no accountability 345 00:34:12,960 --> 00:34:18,480 for the people who have put him where he is. 346 00:34:19,719 --> 00:34:22,879 I mean, I wish that I could have saved him. 347 00:34:24,800 --> 00:34:28,720 [sobs] I wish that somebody would have just saved him. 348 00:34:29,880 --> 00:34:31,120 [sniffles] 349 00:34:35,800 --> 00:34:39,360 Because nobody deserves that. [sniffles] 350 00:34:42,520 --> 00:34:47,280 [sniffles] There were so many people who could have saved him. 351 00:34:47,360 --> 00:34:49,840 Adults who should have stepped in. 352 00:34:52,960 --> 00:34:56,840 Whether when he was 2 or 12, 353 00:34:57,400 --> 00:35:00,640 nobody had his back. 354 00:35:01,160 --> 00:35:03,040 And I'm sorry that I didn't. 355 00:35:19,960 --> 00:35:23,200 [Nelson on recording] It made him stop for a little while, maybe a month or two, 356 00:35:23,400 --> 00:35:25,080 maybe three months. 357 00:35:25,720 --> 00:35:27,320 But yeah, it didn't stop. 358 00:35:29,800 --> 00:35:31,440 Yeah, he approached me again. 359 00:35:32,320 --> 00:35:34,520 By this time, I was 18, and... 360 00:35:35,280 --> 00:35:40,000 I felt like I wasn't gonna let it happen anymore. 361 00:35:41,280 --> 00:35:44,960 And he didn't react, 362 00:35:45,440 --> 00:35:48,440 but he's like, "You know, you need to come with me. 363 00:35:48,520 --> 00:35:49,720 We need to go talk to your mom." 364 00:35:49,800 --> 00:35:53,440 I was like, "Yeah. Let's go talk to my mom." 365 00:35:54,200 --> 00:35:57,880 So-- but he manipulated the situation 366 00:35:57,960 --> 00:36:01,280 where he wanted me to wait out in the car, 367 00:36:01,720 --> 00:36:04,360 and while he went in and talked to my mom. 368 00:36:04,440 --> 00:36:06,800 So, in hindsight, who knows? 369 00:36:06,880 --> 00:36:10,480 I just-- I was just trusting for whatever reason, I don't know. 370 00:36:10,560 --> 00:36:13,440 I just trusted those, and you know, 371 00:36:13,520 --> 00:36:16,680 in that position, I guess, like an authority figure. 372 00:36:16,760 --> 00:36:18,160 I just trusted him. 373 00:36:18,240 --> 00:36:24,960 And he went in, talked to my mom, and she came out livid, pissed. 374 00:36:26,040 --> 00:36:28,160 Told me to give her my key. 375 00:36:28,240 --> 00:36:30,560 And I was out. I had to get out. 376 00:36:30,760 --> 00:36:35,240 And I had no job. I had no money. 377 00:36:35,520 --> 00:36:37,880 I had to get my clothes and get-- get out. 378 00:36:38,360 --> 00:36:41,920 So, I was like, "All right. Well, what can I do?" 379 00:37:28,160 --> 00:37:34,160 [Tina] One night, my sister and I went to Josh's house to see Keith and Josh, 380 00:37:34,240 --> 00:37:36,240 and Keith was not there. 381 00:37:37,200 --> 00:37:41,720 I was going to walk to a pay phone to call Keith. 382 00:37:41,960 --> 00:37:43,720 And Tommy was there that night 383 00:37:43,800 --> 00:37:46,680 and he said that I could use the phone in his car. 384 00:37:50,760 --> 00:37:55,400 When we got into his car, he told me that we would have to drive up the road 385 00:37:55,480 --> 00:37:58,160 to where he could get service in order for me to make a call. 386 00:37:59,560 --> 00:38:01,000 And I agreed. 387 00:38:02,000 --> 00:38:07,840 Instead, he drove me to a remote area where no one else was around 388 00:38:07,960 --> 00:38:10,440 and proceeded to sexually assault me. 389 00:38:20,320 --> 00:38:22,360 And I had no intention of saying anything, 390 00:38:22,440 --> 00:38:25,080 but my sister could tell there was something wrong with me. 391 00:38:26,360 --> 00:38:28,320 As soon as I told her, 392 00:38:28,400 --> 00:38:31,600 she told Josh everything that happened. 393 00:38:32,520 --> 00:38:34,880 Of course, Josh was furious. 394 00:38:36,360 --> 00:38:40,120 At first, Tommy denied everything, 395 00:38:40,440 --> 00:38:44,120 but later on, finally admitted what he had done. 396 00:39:11,360 --> 00:39:13,640 [Tina] When I first found out what happened, 397 00:39:14,560 --> 00:39:16,680 I was glad Tommy was gone. 398 00:39:20,560 --> 00:39:22,960 That was my initial thought-- 399 00:39:23,040 --> 00:39:25,320 and I would never have to deal with him again. 400 00:39:26,560 --> 00:39:28,720 The guilt came afterwards. 401 00:39:34,480 --> 00:39:39,360 Not that I felt they did what they did 402 00:39:39,440 --> 00:39:42,960 simply because of what Tommy did to me. 403 00:39:43,160 --> 00:39:46,640 I knew they both had problems in their own lives. 404 00:39:46,720 --> 00:39:51,800 But I felt that telling them what had happened to me 405 00:39:52,120 --> 00:39:54,560 was the straw that broke the camel's back. 406 00:40:04,440 --> 00:40:09,040 A lot of lives were lost that night. 407 00:40:12,240 --> 00:40:13,960 Not just Tommy's. 408 00:40:18,160 --> 00:40:22,120 A lot of people were hurt, a lot of people were destroyed. 409 00:40:24,800 --> 00:40:29,280 Josh, Keith, the entire Owens family. 410 00:40:31,760 --> 00:40:36,360 Nobody will ever be the same after that night. 411 00:40:42,240 --> 00:40:47,000 Josh will always have a very special place in my heart. 412 00:40:47,360 --> 00:40:49,240 He's a good-hearted person. 413 00:40:50,720 --> 00:40:52,480 He was a scared kid. 414 00:40:52,800 --> 00:40:57,400 He had a lot of damage done to him in his life. 415 00:40:57,920 --> 00:41:00,200 And it came out in a terrible way. 416 00:41:25,160 --> 00:41:26,760 [Owens] It could have happened. 417 00:41:26,920 --> 00:41:28,240 We don't know. 418 00:41:29,640 --> 00:41:32,920 Well, I don't think it's relevant. They, um, mentioned that at trial. 419 00:41:33,440 --> 00:41:35,320 They were all friends 420 00:41:35,960 --> 00:41:40,000 and, um, there was no forcing or rape. 421 00:41:41,800 --> 00:41:44,360 It just wasn't talked about 422 00:41:44,440 --> 00:41:48,400 except brought up that one time, and that was the end of it. 423 00:41:53,440 --> 00:41:59,400 They planned it, premeditated. They wanted his car and they killed him. 424 00:42:02,120 --> 00:42:05,960 To lure somebody into the woods, to lure them out of their own car, 425 00:42:06,040 --> 00:42:12,360 and to beat them with a baseball bat and slice his throat, 426 00:42:12,600 --> 00:42:15,120 and he's begging for his life and saying, "Take the car." 427 00:42:15,200 --> 00:42:18,760 And they still, "No we're gonna kill you." And they did. 428 00:42:19,520 --> 00:42:21,800 And what did-- what did they gain? 429 00:42:22,120 --> 00:42:24,480 They're in prison and my son's gone. 430 00:42:25,760 --> 00:42:28,520 So, no, I... I wouldn't forgive them. 431 00:42:29,000 --> 00:42:30,400 I hope they burn in hell. 432 00:42:49,240 --> 00:42:53,640 [Nelson on recording] I still can't fully emotionally feel 433 00:42:53,720 --> 00:42:58,480 and understand and comprehend what I did that night. 434 00:42:59,520 --> 00:43:01,840 How could I... how could I do something like that? 435 00:43:01,920 --> 00:43:05,520 How could I, especially after being a victim my whole life, 436 00:43:05,600 --> 00:43:08,040 being other people's victim, that I would go out 437 00:43:08,120 --> 00:43:11,920 and just brutally victimize somebody like that? 438 00:43:17,480 --> 00:43:20,240 Because, I mean, I'm-- I'm totally responsible for that. 439 00:43:20,320 --> 00:43:22,920 No one else is responsible for that. I did that. 440 00:43:23,560 --> 00:43:28,400 And I wanna take it back, so bad. 441 00:43:28,680 --> 00:43:33,600 I wanna remove that pain that I caused from everybody. 442 00:43:34,960 --> 00:43:38,120 I wanna bring him back to life, but I can't. 443 00:43:41,400 --> 00:43:42,560 I don't know how... 444 00:43:46,080 --> 00:43:48,040 [quavering] I don't know how to make amends. 445 00:43:50,320 --> 00:43:53,720 I don't know how to apologize. 446 00:43:57,520 --> 00:43:59,720 [stammers] I don't know how-- I don't know what... 447 00:43:59,800 --> 00:44:01,640 you know, I don't know what to say. 448 00:44:11,120 --> 00:44:16,440 So, he takes responsibility enough, 449 00:44:17,560 --> 00:44:20,400 but that's more or less all he said, that he... 450 00:44:22,880 --> 00:44:28,160 he's had all these years to think about that he is responsible for what happened. 451 00:44:29,040 --> 00:44:31,800 But I don't feel any different towards him. 452 00:44:33,280 --> 00:44:37,880 'Cause of that statement, it's not like I should forgive him. No. 453 00:44:40,560 --> 00:44:44,080 I think it's the words he needs to say right now 454 00:44:44,160 --> 00:44:47,800 'cause he knows his execution date is getting closer. 455 00:44:49,280 --> 00:44:53,040 And he'll say anything to, you know, to get some sympathy. 456 00:44:54,240 --> 00:44:56,520 But at the time, he didn't say nothing. 457 00:44:57,400 --> 00:45:00,640 He actually made a face at us leaving the courtroom. 458 00:45:00,920 --> 00:45:04,920 And that was brought up at trial, that he gave us a smirk. 459 00:45:05,600 --> 00:45:08,360 The only thing he was sorry for was getting caught. 460 00:45:16,880 --> 00:45:23,120 I-I don't recall that, but I would never smirk at them about something like that. 461 00:45:23,200 --> 00:45:27,880 I might have smirked about something that someone was saying on the stand 462 00:45:27,960 --> 00:45:30,480 or something that I didn't agree with, and... 463 00:45:32,640 --> 00:45:37,600 But even at that time, I wouldn't do that [stammers] at them. 464 00:46:01,720 --> 00:46:06,600 [Tina on recording] Not that I felt they did what they did 465 00:46:06,680 --> 00:46:09,360 simply because of what Tommy did to me. 466 00:46:11,560 --> 00:46:16,480 I felt that telling them what had happened to me 467 00:46:16,880 --> 00:46:19,320 was the straw that broke the camel's back. 468 00:46:20,600 --> 00:46:25,560 [sighs] I don't-- that's a hard, you know, that's a hard question to answer 469 00:46:25,640 --> 00:46:29,760 because, you know, uh, I think things happen-- 470 00:46:30,440 --> 00:46:35,320 You know, there are a series of things that happen that leads up to something. 471 00:46:37,600 --> 00:46:42,520 I don't think that that was the defining factor 472 00:46:43,000 --> 00:46:46,400 of killing him. 473 00:46:46,480 --> 00:46:47,320 No. 474 00:46:47,400 --> 00:46:49,640 But that was definitely a factor 475 00:46:51,160 --> 00:46:52,160 that... 476 00:46:54,040 --> 00:46:57,360 that made him not so innocent, you know, to me. 477 00:47:22,160 --> 00:47:24,280 [Nelson] You can't really hide from yourself, 478 00:47:25,120 --> 00:47:27,760 you know, when you're stuck in a cell all by yourself. 479 00:47:29,520 --> 00:47:30,680 That's helped me. 480 00:47:30,760 --> 00:47:34,080 That's helped me to change, to help me to examine who I really am 481 00:47:34,160 --> 00:47:36,760 and not who I am because of what I went through. 482 00:47:39,120 --> 00:47:41,600 I'm more in touch with my feelings, in touch with that side of myself 483 00:47:41,680 --> 00:47:43,160 and more... 484 00:47:45,600 --> 00:47:48,160 Yeah, I'm not angry, I'm not in pain, I'm-- 485 00:47:49,640 --> 00:47:53,400 Or those things don't dominate my life, you know? 486 00:48:05,280 --> 00:48:07,800 Sometimes, I think I deserve to die 487 00:48:07,880 --> 00:48:11,480 because, you know, that's what our society believes. 488 00:48:11,560 --> 00:48:15,920 That's the, you know, that's... that's the price you pay 489 00:48:16,560 --> 00:48:20,320 when you commit murder, sometimes. 490 00:48:20,560 --> 00:48:25,240 But at the same time, I don't feel like that I deserve to die either 491 00:48:25,320 --> 00:48:27,160 because, you know, [stammers] 492 00:48:27,240 --> 00:48:31,160 the death penalty, they say, is reserved for worst of the worst. 493 00:48:31,240 --> 00:48:33,280 But am I worst of the worst? 494 00:48:39,440 --> 00:48:45,160 I know you can't look at me without seeing that-- what I've done. 495 00:48:45,920 --> 00:48:50,760 But I would just hope that people could look at me and see, 496 00:48:50,840 --> 00:48:55,960 not forgetting about that, but seeing me as more than that. 497 00:48:57,640 --> 00:49:01,320 And I... I know that's extremely hard for people to do. 498 00:49:01,400 --> 00:49:04,680 I understand that, and... and... 499 00:49:06,720 --> 00:49:09,560 I just wanna-- you know, I just wanna be seen for all that I am, 500 00:49:09,640 --> 00:49:12,600 not that-- [stammers] that moment. 501 00:49:17,600 --> 00:49:19,120 That one... 502 00:49:20,520 --> 00:49:25,800 un... you know, unbelievable, terrible, horrific decision. 503 00:49:26,360 --> 00:49:28,120 I'm more than that, and... 504 00:49:29,360 --> 00:49:33,200 Yeah, that was one of the motivators for doing this, is I want... 505 00:49:33,720 --> 00:49:35,960 I know that it's probably not gonna matter much, 506 00:49:36,040 --> 00:49:39,800 but I want people to know that, that... that it's not so simple. 507 00:49:39,880 --> 00:49:44,200 It's not that clear cut. It's... you know?