1
00:00:22,856 --> 00:00:25,167
<i>There is, I think, in his works</i>

2
00:00:25,191 --> 00:00:28,838
<i>an element of high tragedy,
and I am sure that tonight,</i>

3
00:00:28,862 --> 00:00:31,173
<i>he will be willing
to share with us</i>

4
00:00:31,197 --> 00:00:34,334
<i>the movements and gestures
of his dance macabre.</i>

5
00:00:37,237 --> 00:00:39,248
<i>I present to you, Stephen King.</i>

6
00:00:42,208 --> 00:00:43,208
<i>Thank you.</i>

7
00:00:44,477 --> 00:00:47,656
<i>You come to experiences in your
own life that are frightening,</i>

8
00:00:47,680 --> 00:00:50,493
<i>and you try to make sense
of them in what you write.</i>

9
00:00:50,517 --> 00:00:52,328
<i>And I can remember
living in Colorado</i>

10
00:00:52,352 --> 00:00:54,630
<i>and we had an old
American Motors car</i>

11
00:00:54,654 --> 00:00:57,266
<i>that just simply vomited
up it s transmission one day</i>

12
00:00:57,290 --> 00:00:58,330
<i>in the middle of the road.</i>

13
00:00:59,292 --> 00:01:00,770
<i>And a tow truck came along</i>

14
00:01:00,794 --> 00:01:02,438
<i>and took it away
to wherever they take</i>

15
00:01:02,462 --> 00:01:04,306
<i>transmissionless Matadors,</i>

16
00:01:04,330 --> 00:01:07,877
<i>and they called around after
it had started to get dark</i>

17
00:01:07,901 --> 00:01:10,446
<i>and said, "Your car's ready
if you want to come and get it."</i>

18
00:01:10,470 --> 00:01:11,881
<i>And my wife said,
"Are you going to take a cab?"</i>

19
00:01:11,905 --> 00:01:13,582
<i>And I said, "No, I'll walk."</i>

20
00:01:13,606 --> 00:01:15,351
<i>And I walked and it got
darker and darker,</i>

21
00:01:15,375 --> 00:01:17,453
<i>and this was really on
the edge of town, you know.</i>

22
00:01:17,477 --> 00:01:19,221
<i>There's nothing there and
you could see the dealership,</i>

23
00:01:19,245 --> 00:01:20,689
<i>but it was a ways away.</i>

24
00:01:20,713 --> 00:01:23,225
<i>And the path went across
this bridge, you know,</i>

25
00:01:23,249 --> 00:01:25,261
<i>a little arched humpback wooden bridge.</i>

26
00:01:25,285 --> 00:01:26,462
<i>And I'm walking across it,</i>

27
00:01:26,486 --> 00:01:29,331
<i>and I can hear my heels
clacking on the bridge</i>

28
00:01:29,355 --> 00:01:31,834
<i>and I flashed to this
story when I was a kid</i>

29
00:01:31,858 --> 00:01:34,537
<i>about these goats that were
going across a bridge</i>

30
00:01:34,561 --> 00:01:36,441
<i>and there's this troll
underneath and he said...</i>

31
00:01:37,363 --> 00:01:39,708
<i>-"Who's that
trip-trapping on my bridge?"</i>

32
00:01:39,732 --> 00:01:42,344
<i>And I thought, "Wouldn't it be a scream</i>

33
00:01:42,368 --> 00:01:44,480
<i>if something just reached
up now and grabbed me,</i>

34
00:01:46,306 --> 00:01:47,783
<i>-and pulled me down there,
and that was the last</i>

35
00:01:47,807 --> 00:01:49,652
<i>anybody heard of
old Stevie King?"</i>

36
00:01:49,676 --> 00:01:50,653
<i>So.</i>

37
00:01:50,677 --> 00:01:53,255
<i>But the incident
stayed in my mind,</i>

38
00:01:53,279 --> 00:01:55,825
<i>and over a period of five years,</i>

39
00:01:55,849 --> 00:01:57,026
<i>I would come back to that</i>

40
00:01:57,050 --> 00:01:58,427
<i>and come back to that,
and little by little,</i>

41
00:01:58,451 --> 00:02:01,764
<i>I began to evolve a story
until now it's developed into</i>

42
00:02:01,788 --> 00:02:03,866
<i>a novel that's about
1,300 pages long.</i>

43
00:02:03,890 --> 00:02:05,201
<i>It's called IT,</i>

44
00:02:05,225 --> 00:02:08,337
<i>and it all came from that
one little moment of fear.</i>

45
00:02:08,361 --> 00:02:09,905
<i>And I think that a moment
of fear is worth having</i>

46
00:02:09,929 --> 00:02:12,541
<i>if you can get something good
out of it.</i>

47
00:02:12,565 --> 00:02:14,877
<i>This is Tim
Reid, Richard, in Virginia.</i>

48
00:02:14,901 --> 00:02:17,704
<i>It's back.
I found a picture of Georgie.</i>

49
00:02:19,506 --> 00:02:20,783
<i>IT's enduring power</i>

50
00:02:20,807 --> 00:02:24,787
<i>may come from the chords
it strikes among all of us.</i>

51
00:02:24,811 --> 00:02:28,424
<i>We're all human beings
and we were all children once.</i>

52
00:02:28,448 --> 00:02:30,593
<i>It's amazing
to me all these years later</i>

53
00:02:30,617 --> 00:02:32,628
<i>how people are still coming up
and talking about</i>

54
00:02:32,652 --> 00:02:35,764
that it has this lasting
effect and impact.

55
00:02:35,788 --> 00:02:38,300
<i>You never think
that something you've created</i>

56
00:02:38,324 --> 00:02:41,270
will, you know,
this will live on forever.

57
00:02:41,294 --> 00:02:42,271
<i>As an actor,</i>

58
00:02:42,295 --> 00:02:43,272
<i>I didn't really
pay much attention</i>

59
00:02:43,296 --> 00:02:44,940
<i>to the impact that I was having.</i>

60
00:02:44,964 --> 00:02:46,775
I was just something
I was doing as a kid.

61
00:02:46,799 --> 00:02:48,902
<i>-This is battery acid,
you slime!</i>

62
00:02:50,904 --> 00:02:53,549
<i>I've done
shows in Mexico or in Europe</i>

63
00:02:53,573 --> 00:02:55,484
<i>where the crew
that I've worked with there,</i>

64
00:02:55,508 --> 00:02:56,986
they're like,
"Oh, my god. You did IT!"

65
00:02:57,010 --> 00:02:57,987
<i>I think the story itself</i>

66
00:02:58,011 --> 00:02:59,221
<i>is kind of timeless...</i>

67
00:02:59,245 --> 00:03:00,456
<i>People going through issues</i>

68
00:03:00,480 --> 00:03:02,491
<i>and having to come together
to overcome them.</i>

69
00:03:02,515 --> 00:03:03,492
<i>-We do it.</i>

70
00:03:03,516 --> 00:03:05,494
<i>-Oh yeah. We.</i>

71
00:03:05,518 --> 00:03:08,297
-You know,
it's a coming-of-age story.

72
00:03:08,321 --> 00:03:10,432
<i>It always surprises me when people say,</i>

73
00:03:10,456 --> 00:03:12,835
<i>"Oh, my god, I always
wanted to be you in IT.</i>

74
00:03:12,859 --> 00:03:14,270
<i>I always wished I was Bev."</i>

75
00:03:14,294 --> 00:03:15,704
And I think,
"Oh, you poor thing.

76
00:03:15,728 --> 00:03:17,606
What was your childhood like?"

77
00:03:17,630 --> 00:03:19,775
<i>It's
talking some pretty serious talk</i>

78
00:03:19,799 --> 00:03:23,245
<i>about what it's like
for each of us to be a child.</i>

79
00:03:23,269 --> 00:03:25,414
- The fun.
<i>- Yeah! Yeah!</i>

80
00:03:25,438 --> 00:03:26,906
-And the scary parts.

81
00:03:28,641 --> 00:03:29,885
<i>You know, most TV movies</i>

82
00:03:29,909 --> 00:03:31,887
<i>disappear into oblivion.</i>

83
00:03:31,911 --> 00:03:34,790
<i>I think the fact that IT
is consistently played on cable</i>

84
00:03:34,814 --> 00:03:37,793
has opened it to.
A much wider audience.

85
00:03:37,817 --> 00:03:39,562
<i>It was one of the first</i>

86
00:03:39,586 --> 00:03:41,297
<i>terrifying mini-series.</i>

87
00:03:41,321 --> 00:03:43,499
People were invested in it.
It became an event.

88
00:03:43,523 --> 00:03:45,301
<i>-Something is coming.</i>

89
00:03:45,325 --> 00:03:47,503
<i>And because it was made for TV,</i>

90
00:03:47,527 --> 00:03:50,339
<i>it allowed a younger audience
to view it as well.</i>

91
00:03:50,363 --> 00:03:51,840
<i>Little kids, who saw</i>

92
00:03:51,864 --> 00:03:54,810
IT on television,
it's still in their minds

93
00:03:54,834 --> 00:03:56,679
as the scariest thing
they've ever seen.

94
00:03:56,703 --> 00:03:57,647
<i>Ah!</i>

95
00:03:57,671 --> 00:03:59,882
-That movie scared
the beep out of me, like,

96
00:03:59,906 --> 00:04:02,585
<i>I couldn't sleep,
I hate clowns, I hate spiders.</i>

97
00:04:02,609 --> 00:04:04,520
Like, couldn't even go
near a drain.

98
00:04:04,544 --> 00:04:06,388
<i>People
tend to gravitate towards things</i>

99
00:04:06,412 --> 00:04:07,823
<i>that struck them as a kid.</i>

100
00:04:07,847 --> 00:04:09,992
And I think probably
a lot of the people who saw IT

101
00:04:10,016 --> 00:04:12,728
<i>as teenagers or younger,
it just, it burned themselves.</i>

102
00:04:12,752 --> 00:04:15,331
<i>So as an adult, it
becomes a fun memory,</i>

103
00:04:15,355 --> 00:04:17,433
then it takes on
this whole other cult level.

104
00:04:17,457 --> 00:04:21,070
-It scared the hell
out of millions of people.

105
00:04:26,366 --> 00:04:28,377
-One of the comments is...
Is typically

106
00:04:28,401 --> 00:04:31,037
"Tim Curry is the reason
why I'm terrified of clowns."

107
00:04:32,739 --> 00:04:34,483
<i>The portrayal of
Pennywise probably went from</i>

108
00:04:34,507 --> 00:04:35,818
<i>"Yeah, we're gonna
have some clowns over</i>

109
00:04:35,842 --> 00:04:38,387
for little Johnny's
birthday party" to,

110
00:04:38,411 --> 00:04:39,722
"Uh, probably not."

111
00:04:39,746 --> 00:04:41,557
<i>Well, a character
that manifests itself</i>

112
00:04:41,581 --> 00:04:43,959
<i>in the shape of your fears
is terrifying</i>

113
00:04:43,983 --> 00:04:46,629
<i>at any age, in any era.</i>

114
00:04:46,653 --> 00:04:49,598
And so, I think that's why
that concept is so indelible.

115
00:04:49,622 --> 00:04:51,433
<i>A lot of people tell me</i>

116
00:04:51,457 --> 00:04:52,835
<i>that IT poisoned their childhood</i>

117
00:04:52,859 --> 00:04:55,537
<i>when they saw it on television.</i>

118
00:04:57,130 --> 00:04:58,173
<i>-And I would always think,</i>

119
00:04:58,197 --> 00:04:59,908
<i>"You shouldn't have been
watching it."</i>

120
00:05:22,755 --> 00:05:23,899
<i>I had written Carrie,</i>

121
00:05:23,923 --> 00:05:26,969
<i>and that had put Steve
King, Brian de Palma,</i>

122
00:05:26,993 --> 00:05:29,571
the actors and me on the map

123
00:05:29,595 --> 00:05:33,575
<i>in a way that I became a
go-to for horror adaptations.</i>

124
00:05:33,599 --> 00:05:34,843
I got a call one day.

125
00:05:38,071 --> 00:05:40,849
.from my agent
in Los Angeles who said

126
00:05:40,873 --> 00:05:43,385
<i>he'd been approached
by a pair of producers</i>

127
00:05:43,409 --> 00:05:46,789
<i>who'd set up a new
Stephen King project at ABC</i>

128
00:05:46,813 --> 00:05:50,125
as a novel for television
and was I interested in that?

129
00:05:50,149 --> 00:05:52,995
<i>The next day the doorbell rang,</i>

130
00:05:53,019 --> 00:05:54,663
<i>Federal Express at the door,</i>

131
00:05:54,687 --> 00:05:57,066
and the guy is carrying
the most humongous

132
00:05:57,090 --> 00:05:59,868
FedEx package I've ever seen.

133
00:05:59,892 --> 00:06:03,405
I took this unwieldy,
bulky piece from him

134
00:06:03,429 --> 00:06:05,941
and was about to close the door
and he said, "Hang on a minute."

135
00:06:05,965 --> 00:06:07,409
And he went back to the elevator

136
00:06:07,433 --> 00:06:10,479
and came back with
these two giant containers

137
00:06:10,503 --> 00:06:14,116
<i>containing the typed manuscript
of IT in its earliest stages.</i>

138
00:06:14,140 --> 00:06:19,421
I sat down and read the opening
with young Stuttering Bill.

139
00:06:19,445 --> 00:06:24,693
<i>-Well, we have to
seal it first with paraffin.</i>

140
00:06:24,717 --> 00:06:26,562
<i>And baby brother Georgie,</i>

141
00:06:26,586 --> 00:06:29,198
and what turns out to be
a horrible demise

142
00:06:29,222 --> 00:06:32,768
at the hands of Pennywise.
In the sewer.

143
00:06:32,792 --> 00:06:34,660
I went, "I'll do it."

144
00:06:36,763 --> 00:06:39,475
<i>We went in for a first
meeting with the network</i>

145
00:06:39,499 --> 00:06:42,611
<i>and the executive vice
president of movies for television</i>

146
00:06:42,635 --> 00:06:44,613
<i>and she looked at me
and she said,</i>

147
00:06:44,637 --> 00:06:47,182
"So tell me, what is IT?"

148
00:06:47,206 --> 00:06:51,120
And I said, "Well it's
an inter-terrestrial beast...

149
00:06:52,745 --> 00:06:54,790
-"that has come down eons ago

150
00:06:54,814 --> 00:06:57,559
and has the power to screw
with kids' minds.

151
00:06:57,583 --> 00:06:59,661
<i>-Beep-beep, Richie.</i>

152
00:06:59,685 --> 00:07:01,730
<i>"And attack their worst fears."</i>

153
00:07:01,754 --> 00:07:03,932
And she looked at me
and she nodded, and she said,

154
00:07:03,956 --> 00:07:06,168
"Yes, but what is IT?"

155
00:07:06,192 --> 00:07:07,636
So, I went, "Okay."

156
00:07:07,660 --> 00:07:10,005
And I answered another answer
and she asked me,

157
00:07:10,029 --> 00:07:11,907
I don't know, five more times.

158
00:07:11,931 --> 00:07:13,842
<i>And I looked over
at the producers and went,</i>

159
00:07:13,866 --> 00:07:15,144
<i>"I'm in hell."</i>

160
00:07:15,168 --> 00:07:17,246
<i>I was coming back home
to New York,</i>

161
00:07:17,270 --> 00:07:18,781
<i>and I'm sitting on the plane,</i>

162
00:07:18,805 --> 00:07:21,483
<i>and I see a guy
with his back to me</i>

163
00:07:21,507 --> 00:07:24,887
reading what is clearly
the cover of my script.

164
00:07:24,911 --> 00:07:26,855
<i>It's Bob Iger,
who was the head of</i>

165
00:07:26,879 --> 00:07:29,525
<i>all of the programming at ABC.</i>

166
00:07:29,549 --> 00:07:31,093
And he whipped
through night one,

167
00:07:31,117 --> 00:07:33,529
<i>went through his briefcase,
pulled out night two,</i>

168
00:07:33,553 --> 00:07:35,898
whipped through night two,
stood up, stretched,

169
00:07:35,922 --> 00:07:37,266
sort of smiled,

170
00:07:37,290 --> 00:07:40,202
<i>and it said to me
IT had his support,</i>

171
00:07:40,226 --> 00:07:42,704
<i>and I think he
decided in that reading,</i>

172
00:07:42,728 --> 00:07:44,006
"Yeah, let's do it."

173
00:07:49,602 --> 00:07:53,182
The producers had a brainstorm
and they picked up the phone

174
00:07:53,206 --> 00:07:56,552
and they made an overture
toward George Romero.

175
00:07:56,576 --> 00:07:59,755
<i>He loved the book;
he was as nuts for it as I was.</i>

176
00:07:59,779 --> 00:08:03,192
He saw the possibilities
of what IT could be.

177
00:08:03,216 --> 00:08:08,697
<i>I pitched it to the network
as a long novel for television.</i>

178
00:08:08,721 --> 00:08:12,734
I said, "I think it should be
eight and ideally ten hours."

179
00:08:12,758 --> 00:08:17,272
<i>We exchanged maybe five times
in the course of the process.</i>

180
00:08:17,296 --> 00:08:19,541
I would do what was needed,

181
00:08:19,565 --> 00:08:21,877
<i>which was called a bible
in television terms,</i>

182
00:08:21,901 --> 00:08:24,279
<i>which was just
a really detailed outline.</i>

183
00:08:24,303 --> 00:08:26,682
And I'd send it to George.

184
00:08:26,706 --> 00:08:28,817
<i>He'd look at the
outline, and a week later</i>

185
00:08:28,841 --> 00:08:33,589
<i>I would get a 45-page
typed version of mine</i>

186
00:08:33,613 --> 00:08:37,893
<i>interspersed with his thoughts,
his notes, and his suggestions.</i>

187
00:08:37,917 --> 00:08:39,294
<i>There was never a
question that he thought</i>

188
00:08:39,318 --> 00:08:41,830
<i>it was going to be a gross-out,</i>

189
00:08:41,854 --> 00:08:43,122
lots of blood,

190
00:08:44,257 --> 00:08:45,300
kind of picture.

191
00:08:45,324 --> 00:08:48,604
<i>He understood what television offered</i>

192
00:08:48,628 --> 00:08:52,808
was the chance for
you to go right up to the line.

193
00:08:52,832 --> 00:08:58,680
<i>But his radar was out for
what would the network allow.</i>

194
00:08:58,704 --> 00:09:01,216
I think the dream
of what we had in mind

195
00:09:01,240 --> 00:09:03,085
was absolutely amazing.

196
00:09:03,109 --> 00:09:05,988
I think we were just about
20 years early in having it.

197
00:09:06,012 --> 00:09:07,890
We would have been <i>Game of Thrones</i>.

198
00:09:07,914 --> 00:09:10,325
<i>That would have been the way
to do this piece of material</i>

199
00:09:10,349 --> 00:09:11,951
<i>in its fullest possible way.</i>

200
00:09:13,252 --> 00:09:16,932
-The network started to get very
nervous.

201
00:09:16,956 --> 00:09:19,201
<i>Nobody had ever gone
where this piece had gone,</i>

202
00:09:19,225 --> 00:09:23,272
and they sort of went
from it being eight hours,

203
00:09:23,296 --> 00:09:26,141
<i>which became the official
running time bible,</i>

204
00:09:26,165 --> 00:09:28,610
to maybe it should be four,

205
00:09:28,634 --> 00:09:30,903
at which point
George said, goodbye.

206
00:09:35,708 --> 00:09:37,819
<i>We were looking for a director.</i>

207
00:09:37,843 --> 00:09:38,921
<i>We had an air date.</i>

208
00:09:40,212 --> 00:09:43,392
<i>Stephen
King's IT starting tomorrow.</i>

209
00:09:43,416 --> 00:09:46,061
<i>Tommy Lee Wallace came to mind.</i>

210
00:09:46,085 --> 00:09:47,996
<i>Tommy was also a writer.</i>

211
00:09:48,020 --> 00:09:51,900
Part two needed the help and
I felt that a director-writer

212
00:09:51,924 --> 00:09:54,069
<i>would probably be
the person to do that.</i>

213
00:09:54,093 --> 00:09:56,338
<i>-And action!</i>

214
00:09:56,362 --> 00:10:01,109
<i>I cut my teeth on synopsizing
manuscripts for agents</i>

215
00:10:01,133 --> 00:10:04,346
and developed a knack
for condensing novels

216
00:10:04,370 --> 00:10:07,683
into a couple of pages
of synopsis,

217
00:10:07,707 --> 00:10:11,386
<i>So I just made an attempt
to do that with the book.</i>

218
00:10:11,410 --> 00:10:14,289
<i>Larry Cohen wrote
this wonderful script,</i>

219
00:10:14,313 --> 00:10:16,224
and I'm referring to
night number one

220
00:10:16,248 --> 00:10:18,760
because that's what got me
truly excited.

221
00:10:18,784 --> 00:10:21,063
<i>The trick in IT was</i>

222
00:10:21,087 --> 00:10:23,732
<i>in putting on the King hat</i>

223
00:10:23,756 --> 00:10:26,702
<i>and going, "Okay,
I've now read this 400 times,</i>

224
00:10:26,726 --> 00:10:29,838
I breathe it with
every pore of my body,

225
00:10:29,862 --> 00:10:32,774
and I'm gonna pretend
I'm Stephen King

226
00:10:32,798 --> 00:10:35,677
<i>for as long as it takes for me
to get this done."</i>

227
00:10:35,701 --> 00:10:37,913
<i>I did three-by-five cards
on the wall,</i>

228
00:10:37,937 --> 00:10:41,683
and I went, "Okay, we're missing
how you get from here to here.

229
00:10:41,707 --> 00:10:44,019
It's not in what he wrote."

230
00:10:44,043 --> 00:10:48,290
<i>I retained a part of Steve's
back-and-forth juggling...</i>

231
00:10:48,314 --> 00:10:50,292
<i>I brought this old
photo album from home.</i>

232
00:10:50,316 --> 00:10:51,860
<i>Of the two time periods.</i>

233
00:10:51,884 --> 00:10:55,163
I thought it had a lot
of emotional resonance.

234
00:10:55,187 --> 00:10:57,432
<i>That's
the only time I've ever seen</i>

235
00:10:57,456 --> 00:11:01,136
<i>the absurdity of
a seven-act TV movie structure</i>

236
00:11:01,160 --> 00:11:04,940
<i>actually work because of the
seven characters involved.</i>

237
00:11:04,964 --> 00:11:06,475
<i>So, for the first night,</i>

238
00:11:06,499 --> 00:11:09,211
<i>the structural job
became really clear</i>

239
00:11:09,235 --> 00:11:13,348
and weirdly the limitation
became a tremendous asset.

240
00:11:13,372 --> 00:11:15,350
<i>Each act focused on</i>

241
00:11:15,374 --> 00:11:16,618
<i>one of the characters</i>

242
00:11:16,642 --> 00:11:19,388
<i>and told the story
of what happened in childhood</i>

243
00:11:19,412 --> 00:11:22,324
<i>and the alarm being
sounded for them.</i>

244
00:11:22,348 --> 00:11:23,825
<i>- Hello?
- Beverly,</i>

245
00:11:23,849 --> 00:11:25,160
<i>it's Mike Hanlon.</i>

246
00:11:25,184 --> 00:11:28,096
-I was less enamored
with the second night

247
00:11:28,120 --> 00:11:33,101
<i>because it deviated so far away
from the novel itself.</i>

248
00:11:33,125 --> 00:11:34,870
I didn't know that
in the beginning

249
00:11:34,894 --> 00:11:37,739
because I hadn't read the novel,
but I knew something was amiss.

250
00:11:37,763 --> 00:11:40,075
It just didn't
deliver the goods.

251
00:11:40,099 --> 00:11:42,044
The husband of Bevy...

252
00:11:42,068 --> 00:11:43,845
<i>-No, I'm not married.</i>

253
00:11:43,869 --> 00:11:45,414
<i>Re-entered the picture</i>

254
00:11:45,438 --> 00:11:49,017
<i>and became kind of
the villain of the piece.</i>

255
00:11:49,041 --> 00:11:50,318
- <i>
- Being more or less</i>

256
00:11:50,342 --> 00:11:53,088
animated by Pennywise.

257
00:11:53,112 --> 00:11:55,157
In dramatic terms,

258
00:11:55,181 --> 00:11:59,161
<i>it did what it needed to do
to bring the movie to an end,</i>

259
00:11:59,185 --> 00:12:02,064
but it had little to do
with the book

260
00:12:02,088 --> 00:12:05,033
<i>and I felt like it
kind of gypped the viewer.</i>

261
00:12:05,057 --> 00:12:09,771
It was a much more prosaic
TV-style climax.

262
00:12:09,795 --> 00:12:12,007
<i>[</i>

263
00:12:12,031 --> 00:12:14,476
-I was candid with Larry
about that.

264
00:12:14,500 --> 00:12:18,880
And by this point, the impetus
is moving to Vancouver

265
00:12:18,904 --> 00:12:22,951
and Larry couldn't come
to Vancouver to work with me

266
00:12:22,975 --> 00:12:26,321
to bring the second night
up to the first.

267
00:12:26,345 --> 00:12:28,056
<i>By this time,
I'd been working on the project</i>

268
00:12:28,080 --> 00:12:29,991
<i>for about two-and-a-half,
three years.</i>

269
00:12:30,015 --> 00:12:31,560
Not quite as long as
it took Steve to write it

270
00:12:31,584 --> 00:12:34,029
but the runner-up prize.

271
00:12:34,053 --> 00:12:35,964
<i>We were about to start Carrie</i>

272
00:12:35,988 --> 00:12:38,266
<i>with the Royal Shakespeare
Company over in England</i>

273
00:12:38,290 --> 00:12:41,303
<i>and I was owing a draft
on something else, and I went,</i>

274
00:12:41,327 --> 00:12:45,364
"I think this is my cue to say,
'Go with God. I'm done.'"

275
00:12:46,932 --> 00:12:49,377
<i>So, the job fell to the best guy</i>

276
00:12:49,401 --> 00:12:52,981
I could find for free, me.

277
00:12:53,005 --> 00:12:55,350
<i>And so,
I did the rewrite myself.</i>

278
00:12:55,374 --> 00:12:58,220
<i>And in this case,
we simply were up against</i>

279
00:12:58,244 --> 00:13:00,922
<i>a production schedule
that was hurtling toward us</i>

280
00:13:00,946 --> 00:13:03,125
<i>and was not going to be
pushed back.</i>

281
00:13:03,149 --> 00:13:05,460
<i>So I just went back to
the book again and again</i>

282
00:13:05,484 --> 00:13:09,598
<i>until I could find a way
to bring the adult story around</i>

283
00:13:09,622 --> 00:13:13,135
<i>to something
resembling the book.</i>

284
00:13:13,159 --> 00:13:17,839
It really is a deep challenge
to condense a novel

285
00:13:17,863 --> 00:13:20,408
that rich, that deep,
that dense,

286
00:13:20,432 --> 00:13:24,012
into just a few hours
of television.

287
00:13:24,036 --> 00:13:26,948
<i>I used Mike
as a narrative device.</i>

288
00:13:26,972 --> 00:13:28,984
<i>-I'm sure by now
you all remember</i>

289
00:13:29,008 --> 00:13:31,219
<i>what was going on
in Derry 30 years ago.</i>

290
00:13:31,243 --> 00:13:34,456
<i>There was a rash of killings,
maimings, disappearances.</i>

291
00:13:34,480 --> 00:13:36,958
<i>Because
you can save a lot of frames of film</i>

292
00:13:36,982 --> 00:13:39,895
if somebody's summing up
the story.

293
00:13:39,919 --> 00:13:41,496
<i>-Henry Bowers confessed to everything,</i>

294
00:13:41,520 --> 00:13:42,831
<i>and the killing stopped.</i>

295
00:13:42,855 --> 00:13:44,399
<i>I thought
it was poignant for him</i>

296
00:13:44,423 --> 00:13:46,935
and helped his character
actually.

297
00:13:46,959 --> 00:13:51,072
<i>But it was going so fast
that at night in the hotel</i>

298
00:13:51,096 --> 00:13:52,096
<i>I would just...</i>

299
00:13:54,500 --> 00:13:56,411
as fast as I could go.

300
00:13:56,435 --> 00:13:58,647
<i>I don't think Night Two
is the masterpiece</i>

301
00:13:58,671 --> 00:14:00,182
<i>that Night One is,</i>

302
00:14:00,206 --> 00:14:04,486
because I do respect
Larry Cohen's script

303
00:14:04,510 --> 00:14:06,922
<i>and didn't feel all that great</i>

304
00:14:06,946 --> 00:14:09,624
<i>about changing
it so drastically.</i>

305
00:14:09,648 --> 00:14:11,593
-Tommy Lee
did what he needed to do

306
00:14:11,617 --> 00:14:13,586
given what the circumstances
were.

307
00:14:29,501 --> 00:14:31,112
<i>This reminds you
very much of your childhood,</i>

308
00:14:31,136 --> 00:14:32,180
<i>this neighborhood?</i>

309
00:14:32,204 --> 00:14:33,515
<i>Yes, it does.</i>

310
00:14:33,539 --> 00:14:35,951
<i>It does. Same dirt road.</i>

311
00:14:35,975 --> 00:14:39,087
<i>Same old Grange Hall
at the end of the road.</i>

312
00:14:39,111 --> 00:14:40,388
<i>That's you.</i>

313
00:14:40,412 --> 00:14:41,723
<i>That's me
when I sold my first story.</i>

314
00:14:41,747 --> 00:14:44,659
<i>I look a little bit surprised
about the whole thing.</i>

315
00:14:44,683 --> 00:14:47,629
-Stephen King
is such great drama and mystery.

316
00:14:47,653 --> 00:14:50,932
And for as much as his books are
about horrific things,

317
00:14:50,956 --> 00:14:54,269
<i>they are mostly about
deeply human</i>

318
00:14:54,293 --> 00:14:56,238
<i>psychological thought processes,</i>

319
00:14:56,262 --> 00:14:59,407
so you get a lot of
deep character study.

320
00:14:59,431 --> 00:15:01,309
<i>Well, I'd read most of the books</i>

321
00:15:01,333 --> 00:15:03,712
<i>because he's a master of
narrative.</i>

322
00:15:03,736 --> 00:15:06,314
He tells a whacking good story.

323
00:15:06,338 --> 00:15:09,417
<i>-People would say you ought to
write about what you know.</i>

324
00:15:09,441 --> 00:15:12,954
<i>I grew up in a small town.
We had no running water.</i>

325
00:15:12,978 --> 00:15:14,589
<i>I went to a one-room school</i>

326
00:15:14,613 --> 00:15:17,525
<i>with all the grades
together and.</i>

327
00:15:17,549 --> 00:15:20,362
<i>Somebody had to go up
to a house and bring back water.</i>

328
00:15:20,386 --> 00:15:22,130
<i>And to me, the whole existence</i>

329
00:15:22,154 --> 00:15:25,333
<i>was not pastoral
or beautiful or anything.</i>

330
00:15:25,357 --> 00:15:26,368
<i>It was just boring.</i>

331
00:15:26,392 --> 00:15:27,736
<i>I wanted to be in outer space.</i>

332
00:15:27,760 --> 00:15:32,040
<i>I wanted to fight monsters
in the swamps of the Amazon.</i>

333
00:15:32,064 --> 00:15:34,042
<i>So those were the things
that I wrote about.</i>

334
00:15:34,066 --> 00:15:37,245
<i>And later I found a way to.</i>

335
00:15:37,269 --> 00:15:39,514
<i>Blend those two interests:</i>

336
00:15:39,538 --> 00:15:43,251
<i>My interest in what was
strange and... and alien</i>

337
00:15:43,275 --> 00:15:46,554
<i>and the places where I lived
and where I grew up.</i>

338
00:15:46,578 --> 00:15:47,756
<i>Most of his works are</i>

339
00:15:47,780 --> 00:15:50,091
<i>difficult to turn into films.</i>

340
00:15:50,115 --> 00:15:52,160
<i>Because if you try to.</i>

341
00:15:52,184 --> 00:15:54,663
Visually show an audience
what this.

342
00:15:54,687 --> 00:15:56,631
<i>Incredibly talented writer</i>

343
00:15:56,655 --> 00:16:01,369
<i>that uses the English language
in order to have the reader</i>

344
00:16:01,393 --> 00:16:06,174
conjure up their worst fears,
it doesn't always work.

345
00:16:06,198 --> 00:16:08,710
<i>-The movie has to capture</i>

346
00:16:08,734 --> 00:16:12,781
<i>some of the spirit of
the writer's heart and-and mind.</i>

347
00:16:12,805 --> 00:16:14,749
<i>And if it doesn't,
generally speaking,</i>

348
00:16:14,773 --> 00:16:17,218
<i>what the reader went to the book
and found and loved,</i>

349
00:16:17,242 --> 00:16:18,787
<i>the movie audience won't.</i>

350
00:16:18,811 --> 00:16:20,655
-It's hard to capture
all the little nuances

351
00:16:20,679 --> 00:16:22,290
<i>that he puts in his books.</i>

352
00:16:22,314 --> 00:16:24,192
<i>His stuff was such an influence</i>

353
00:16:24,216 --> 00:16:26,761
on so many filmmakers as well,
as far as storytelling.

354
00:16:26,785 --> 00:16:29,464
<i>Steve's
got a very particular genius</i>

355
00:16:29,488 --> 00:16:31,599
<i>in creating villains.</i>

356
00:16:31,623 --> 00:16:34,536
They become iconic
and come into a level

357
00:16:34,560 --> 00:16:37,072
<i>of the public's consciousness
and the viewer's conscious</i>

358
00:16:37,096 --> 00:16:38,540
that's forever.

359
00:16:38,564 --> 00:16:40,141
<i>-You were one
of the first people</i>

360
00:16:40,165 --> 00:16:42,410
<i>to have the idea that a clown</i>

361
00:16:42,434 --> 00:16:45,513
<i>could be a scary figure.</i>

362
00:16:45,537 --> 00:16:48,049
<i>Did you find clowns scary
when you were a kid?</i>

363
00:16:48,073 --> 00:16:50,752
<i>-Well, you know, as a kid
going to the circus,</i>

364
00:16:50,776 --> 00:16:53,355
<i>there would be like,
12 full-grown people</i>

365
00:16:53,379 --> 00:16:55,824
<i>that would all pile out
of a little tiny car.</i>

366
00:16:55,848 --> 00:16:58,226
<i>Their faces were dead white.</i>

367
00:16:58,250 --> 00:17:01,196
<i>Their mouths were red as
though they were full of blood.</i>

368
00:17:01,220 --> 00:17:03,431
<i>They're all screaming.
Their eyes are huge.</i>

369
00:17:03,455 --> 00:17:04,615
<i>What's not to like, you know?</i>

370
00:17:07,493 --> 00:17:11,139
<i>The circus is
still the greatest show on earth,</i>

371
00:17:11,163 --> 00:17:15,543
<i>and to have a circus,
you have to have clowns.</i>

372
00:17:18,537 --> 00:17:21,249
<i>Well, there's
a long tradition of clowns.</i>

373
00:17:21,273 --> 00:17:24,452
When I was a kid and used to go
to pantomimes in England,

374
00:17:24,476 --> 00:17:27,288
<i>they used to have a guy
whose name I think</i>

375
00:17:27,312 --> 00:17:30,492
<i>was Charlie Cairoli,
who wore the classic</i>

376
00:17:30,516 --> 00:17:34,462
<i>kind of pointed hat
and was rather a gentleman.</i>

377
00:17:34,486 --> 00:17:36,564
He wasn't threatening at all.

378
00:17:36,588 --> 00:17:38,133
<i>Growing up,
my brother was into clowns</i>

379
00:17:38,157 --> 00:17:40,135
<i>and ran away
and joined the circus.</i>

380
00:17:40,159 --> 00:17:43,505
<i>If you've ever been
backstage at a circus,</i>

381
00:17:43,529 --> 00:17:46,174
it changes your perceptions
of clowns.

382
00:17:46,198 --> 00:17:49,778
-Often there's sort of mayhem
involved with being a clown.

383
00:17:49,802 --> 00:17:54,449
-They're usually, both
silly and scary or playful,

384
00:17:54,473 --> 00:17:56,451
<i>which can all be frightening
to a kid.</i>

385
00:17:56,475 --> 00:17:58,787
-I went to the circus in 1974,

386
00:17:58,811 --> 00:18:01,289
<i>when I was a little kid,
and I have a photo of me</i>

387
00:18:01,313 --> 00:18:02,724
where the clown's putting
his arm around me,

388
00:18:02,748 --> 00:18:03,758
and I'm only about this tall.

389
00:18:03,782 --> 00:18:06,461
And I have this
paralyzed look like, you know,

390
00:18:06,485 --> 00:18:07,695
I'm not happy.

391
00:18:07,719 --> 00:18:08,431
<i>I think it's almost archetypal</i>

392
00:18:08,455 --> 00:18:10,231
<i>in the sense that clowns,</i>

393
00:18:10,255 --> 00:18:12,267
<i>like Pagliacci, the opera...</i>

394
00:18:12,291 --> 00:18:14,569
There's always something
behind that smile.

395
00:18:14,593 --> 00:18:18,273
-I think prima facie,
clowns are fucking scary.

396
00:18:18,297 --> 00:18:20,175
<i>Even when you're enjoying them,</i>

397
00:18:20,199 --> 00:18:23,845
<i>there's something in there
in the grotesquery of it all,</i>

398
00:18:23,869 --> 00:18:26,548
<i>and it's really in
the eyes, I think.</i>

399
00:18:26,572 --> 00:18:28,883
You know, you can have
this very funny thing.

400
00:18:28,907 --> 00:18:31,252
<i>Even if the mouth
isn't overtly scary,</i>

401
00:18:31,276 --> 00:18:33,221
<i>which sometimes
clown mouths are,</i>

402
00:18:33,245 --> 00:18:36,157
but the minute
the eyes get hard,

403
00:18:36,181 --> 00:18:39,227
the minute the eyes aren't,
you know...

404
00:18:41,954 --> 00:18:43,555
You know, aren't that,
and they go.

405
00:18:47,759 --> 00:18:49,204
Wow!

406
00:18:49,228 --> 00:18:51,372
-I would go to McDonald's
when I was a little kid.

407
00:18:51,396 --> 00:18:54,409
I would not go hang out with
the Ronald McDonald cutout.

408
00:18:54,433 --> 00:18:55,510
<i>-The fry guy!</i>

409
00:18:55,534 --> 00:18:57,378
-There's something
weird about it.

410
00:18:57,402 --> 00:18:59,714
I didn't think he was going to
grow teeth and eat my face.

411
00:18:59,738 --> 00:19:01,716
-Not every single clown you see

412
00:19:01,740 --> 00:19:04,519
<i>makes you want to
instantly turn around</i>

413
00:19:04,543 --> 00:19:05,488
<i>and run away in horror.</i>

414
00:19:05,512 --> 00:19:07,555
<i>I think adults and kids</i>

415
00:19:07,579 --> 00:19:09,824
<i>understand clowns
very differently.</i>

416
00:19:09,848 --> 00:19:11,726
<i>I can't go to circuses.</i>

417
00:19:11,750 --> 00:19:14,295
<i>I can't go somewhere
where there's clowns,</i>

418
00:19:14,319 --> 00:19:15,930
<i>even a picture of it.</i>

419
00:19:15,954 --> 00:19:17,554
<i>What's going
to happen if you look at it?</i>

420
00:19:19,324 --> 00:19:21,803
<i>It is a phobia,
and it is called coulrophobia.</i>

421
00:19:21,827 --> 00:19:24,806
<i>The majority of people that are
afraid of clowns are adults.</i>

422
00:19:31,236 --> 00:19:32,847
<i>I think for kids,</i>

423
00:19:32,871 --> 00:19:34,282
<i>clowns are great fun.</i>

424
00:19:34,306 --> 00:19:37,418
There's just not any menace
or danger at all.

425
00:19:37,442 --> 00:19:39,988
<i>And Steve's particular spin
was to take something</i>

426
00:19:40,012 --> 00:19:41,990
<i>that's much loved and familiar</i>

427
00:19:42,014 --> 00:19:45,493
<i>and ratchet it up
as far as it could possibly go.</i>

428
00:19:45,517 --> 00:19:46,761
<i>-Somebody who's got problems</i>

429
00:19:46,785 --> 00:19:50,465
<i>and fears and phobias,
they go to a psychiatrist,</i>

430
00:19:50,489 --> 00:19:52,800
<i>and it costs maybe
150 dollars an hour.</i>

431
00:19:52,824 --> 00:19:53,968
<i>And they don't even get
a full hour,</i>

432
00:19:53,992 --> 00:19:55,603
<i>they get 50 minutes.</i>

433
00:19:55,627 --> 00:19:57,805
<i>I do what people pay me.</i>

434
00:19:57,829 --> 00:19:59,374
<i>There's lots of things</i>

435
00:19:59,398 --> 00:20:01,910
<i>that feed into what
King was doing</i>

436
00:20:01,934 --> 00:20:04,946
with creating a clown
as the main antagonist.

437
00:20:04,970 --> 00:20:07,448
<i>At the time, John Wayne Gacy
had just happened,</i>

438
00:20:07,472 --> 00:20:09,784
<i>so we're dealing with
people being afraid of clowns,</i>

439
00:20:09,808 --> 00:20:12,253
<i>and the guy next door
is a threat.</i>

440
00:20:12,277 --> 00:20:13,955
-At one point,
I saw a painting of Pennywise

441
00:20:13,979 --> 00:20:15,857
that Gacy had done.

442
00:20:15,881 --> 00:20:17,325
<i>A dark landscape,</i>

443
00:20:17,349 --> 00:20:18,626
<i>a portrait of Elvis,</i>

444
00:20:18,650 --> 00:20:20,528
<i>and a scene with seven dwarfs.</i>

445
00:20:20,552 --> 00:20:23,431
<i>But this is the work
of John Wayne Gacy,</i>

446
00:20:23,455 --> 00:20:26,935
<i>an evil man who buried
more than 25 of his victims</i>

447
00:20:26,959 --> 00:20:29,604
<i>in the crawl space
of his own house.</i>

448
00:20:29,628 --> 00:20:32,540
<i>Arts Factory owner
showed us five pieces,</i>

449
00:20:32,564 --> 00:20:34,609
<i>including this
Pennywise the Clown</i>

450
00:20:34,633 --> 00:20:36,411
<i>from Stephen King's IT.</i>

451
00:20:36,435 --> 00:20:39,447
-I was like, should
I be flattered or offended?

452
00:20:39,471 --> 00:20:40,748
I don't know
how I feel about this.

453
00:20:40,772 --> 00:20:43,851
<i>The scary
clown is that realization</i>

454
00:20:43,875 --> 00:20:46,588
<i>deep within the child that
they can't express, that no,</i>

455
00:20:46,612 --> 00:20:48,389
something's not quite
right in the world, you know.

456
00:20:48,413 --> 00:20:50,692
Like, I've seen the homeless guy
in the street.

457
00:20:50,716 --> 00:20:52,827
<i>-Any spare change, mister?</i>

458
00:20:52,851 --> 00:20:55,029
-Or, you know, I've seen
really sick people,

459
00:20:55,053 --> 00:20:57,899
or I myself have experienced
some kind of abuse

460
00:20:57,923 --> 00:20:59,701
or discrimination, right?

461
00:20:59,725 --> 00:21:01,803
<i>But you're not supposed
to talk about it as a child.</i>

462
00:21:01,827 --> 00:21:04,305
You feel like you have to
smile and be happy.

463
00:21:06,031 --> 00:21:07,308
<i>That's
what the evil clown is about.</i>

464
00:21:07,332 --> 00:21:09,744
<i>It's about the fact
that there's something rotten.</i>

465
00:21:10,836 --> 00:21:12,213
-at the heart of society.

466
00:21:12,237 --> 00:21:15,350
<i>This whole town
is IT in some way. All of them.</i>

467
00:21:15,374 --> 00:21:17,719
-And as a kid, you're
not allowed to express it.

468
00:21:17,743 --> 00:21:18,987
<i>Pennywise is really important</i>

469
00:21:19,011 --> 00:21:22,824
<i>because the '50s were
considered safe and sweet</i>

470
00:21:22,848 --> 00:21:25,560
<i>and nostalgic and fun.</i>

471
00:21:25,584 --> 00:21:28,763
<i>And at the heart of it,
they're not.</i>

472
00:21:28,787 --> 00:21:31,733
<i>So, the clown works
on that metaphorical level</i>

473
00:21:31,757 --> 00:21:34,402
<i>that it's saying this is
what the decade was like.</i>

474
00:21:34,426 --> 00:21:35,637
On the outside, it's one thing.

475
00:21:35,661 --> 00:21:38,406
Inside, it's something
completely different.

476
00:21:38,430 --> 00:21:40,608
<i>The mythology
of clowns being scary</i>

477
00:21:40,632 --> 00:21:44,579
<i>has exponentially grown
over the last 20 years.</i>

478
00:21:44,603 --> 00:21:45,813
<i>Fuck you!</i>

479
00:21:45,837 --> 00:21:48,916
-I do feel as though this book

480
00:21:48,940 --> 00:21:51,386
<i>and this movie
had some influence on that.</i>

481
00:21:51,410 --> 00:21:53,488
<i>-I was about five or six</i>

482
00:21:53,512 --> 00:21:55,657
and I was in
a video rental store,

483
00:21:55,681 --> 00:21:57,558
<i>and then all of a sudden,
there's this face</i>

484
00:21:57,582 --> 00:21:59,627
<i>just staring back at me,
and I just froze.</i>

485
00:21:59,651 --> 00:22:00,928
<i>Like, if you see a spider,
you freeze with fear,</i>

486
00:22:00,952 --> 00:22:02,196
<i>and I just froze.</i>

487
00:22:02,220 --> 00:22:05,466
<i>People,
I think, perceptions change</i>

488
00:22:05,490 --> 00:22:07,602
<i>because that's what
they're being sold.</i>

489
00:22:07,626 --> 00:22:10,438
They're being sold
that clowns are scary.

490
00:22:10,462 --> 00:22:11,706
<i>Sightings of a mysterious clown</i>

491
00:22:11,730 --> 00:22:12,874
<i>have been creeping out</i>

492
00:22:12,898 --> 00:22:14,008
<i>some people in Staten Island.</i>

493
00:22:14,032 --> 00:22:15,810
<i>-Media sites have been abuzz
with stories</i>

494
00:22:15,834 --> 00:22:18,146
<i>of a mysterious
and creepy clown.</i>

495
00:22:18,170 --> 00:22:20,548
-And you know,
I'm sure that Pennywise

496
00:22:20,572 --> 00:22:22,850
<i>and John Wayne Gacy
didn't do the best job</i>

497
00:22:22,874 --> 00:22:25,486
<i>in creating a positive image
of clowns.</i>

498
00:22:25,510 --> 00:22:28,022
And I'm sure it wasn't
Tim Curry's goal

499
00:22:28,046 --> 00:22:30,825
to have people hate clowns
for the rest of their lives.

500
00:22:30,849 --> 00:22:32,493
<i>But I think it is
kind of a hallmark</i>

501
00:22:32,517 --> 00:22:33,895
<i>of a good performance.</i>

502
00:22:33,919 --> 00:22:36,164
<i>He had a tremendous impact on</i>

503
00:22:36,188 --> 00:22:38,599
growing people's fears
about clowns.

504
00:22:38,623 --> 00:22:40,601
<i>I can't say
that I ever saw clowns</i>

505
00:22:40,625 --> 00:22:42,136
<i>as being threatening,</i>

506
00:22:42,160 --> 00:22:44,672
although I loved
being threatening.

507
00:22:44,696 --> 00:22:46,974
<i>That's it! Let go!</i>

508
00:22:46,998 --> 00:22:48,743
<i>Be afraid!</i>

509
00:22:48,767 --> 00:22:50,511
-It was a lot of fun.

510
00:22:50,535 --> 00:22:51,713
<i>There's enough room</i>

511
00:22:51,737 --> 00:22:54,549
<i>in our understanding of clowns</i>

512
00:22:54,573 --> 00:22:57,151
to have some of them
be not so scary,

513
00:22:57,175 --> 00:22:58,953
<i>to be sweet and nice,</i>

514
00:22:58,977 --> 00:23:01,189
and maybe some of them
just downright awesome.

515
00:23:01,213 --> 00:23:03,157
<i>Beep-beep.</i>

516
00:23:16,128 --> 00:23:18,072
<i>Push this closer
to the monster, please.</i>

517
00:23:21,032 --> 00:23:22,643
<i>A little farther,
Tim. Find the light.</i>

518
00:23:22,667 --> 00:23:24,212
<i>All right, here
we go. Yeah. Thank you.</i>

519
00:23:24,236 --> 00:23:25,114
<i>And clear, please.</i>

520
00:23:25,138 --> 00:23:26,981
<i>And action!</i>

521
00:23:27,005 --> 00:23:29,217
<i>I believe casting has been</i>

522
00:23:29,241 --> 00:23:31,519
<i>as much a contributing factor</i>

523
00:23:31,543 --> 00:23:34,222
to the success
of my version of IT

524
00:23:34,246 --> 00:23:36,190
<i>as any other factor at all.</i>

525
00:23:36,214 --> 00:23:39,193
It was beautifully cast. Period.

526
00:23:39,217 --> 00:23:42,130
-They brought me the script
and they said,

527
00:23:42,154 --> 00:23:44,198
"You want to do it?"
And I'm like, "Well, yeah."

528
00:23:44,222 --> 00:23:45,967
<i>This is an amazing piece.</i>

529
00:23:45,991 --> 00:23:48,669
<i>We knew what we had
when we were working on it.</i>

530
00:23:48,693 --> 00:23:52,006
<i>Pennywise was
such a brilliant character.</i>

531
00:23:52,030 --> 00:23:54,108
-We were looking
for television leads

532
00:23:54,132 --> 00:23:57,678
<i>to promote the picture
in our marketing campaign.</i>

533
00:23:57,702 --> 00:23:59,680
Victoria turned her list in,

534
00:23:59,704 --> 00:24:02,941
<i>and we began going after
the network-approved actors.</i>

535
00:24:04,142 --> 00:24:07,522
We had approval
of Harvey Fierstein

536
00:24:07,546 --> 00:24:12,560
<i>to star as Pennywise.
And we were saying,</i>

537
00:24:12,584 --> 00:24:14,695
"We need to continue to
look on the list here.

538
00:24:14,719 --> 00:24:16,831
We don't know whether
the network will approve him."

539
00:24:16,855 --> 00:24:17,999
<i>I think they'd
mentioned it was going to be</i>

540
00:24:18,023 --> 00:24:20,067
<i>either Roddy McDowell
or Malcolm McDowell.</i>

541
00:24:20,091 --> 00:24:23,638
-And they explored Alice Cooper
at one juncture.

542
00:24:23,662 --> 00:24:25,640
-So, who else have we got?

543
00:24:27,699 --> 00:24:30,111
-I do remember
that we had brought up

544
00:24:30,135 --> 00:24:32,847
<i>Rocky Horror Show
and said, "Look at that."</i>

545
00:24:32,871 --> 00:24:35,616
<i>-I had to buy the Rocky Horror
Picture Show album,</i>

546
00:24:35,640 --> 00:24:38,643
<i>I had to buy the books,
I had to buy the scripts.</i>

547
00:24:40,011 --> 00:24:41,889
<i>You're a very expensive date.</i>

548
00:24:41,913 --> 00:24:42,990
<i>-I know.</i>

549
00:24:43,014 --> 00:24:44,625
-Just the freedom
of the character,

550
00:24:44,649 --> 00:24:47,562
<i>the intensity
that he gave to it,</i>

551
00:24:47,586 --> 00:24:50,031
<i>was so wonderful
and you could see</i>

552
00:24:50,055 --> 00:24:52,266
that this would
translate brilliantly

553
00:24:52,290 --> 00:24:53,901
into a horror character.

554
00:24:53,925 --> 00:24:55,069
<i>-How 'bout that?!</i>

555
00:24:55,093 --> 00:24:58,906
-We were focused on Tim Curry.

556
00:24:58,930 --> 00:25:00,141
<i>-Me?</i>

557
00:25:00,165 --> 00:25:01,909
<i>I think he's
one of the best actors</i>

558
00:25:01,933 --> 00:25:03,211
that's ever come out of England,

559
00:25:03,235 --> 00:25:05,112
and I don't think
he gets his due.

560
00:25:05,136 --> 00:25:06,180
<i>Was there any time in your life</i>

561
00:25:06,204 --> 00:25:07,715
<i>when you said, "I
want to be an actor"?</i>

562
00:25:07,739 --> 00:25:09,050
<i>Yes, I did, actually.</i>

563
00:25:09,074 --> 00:25:09,785
<i>What is there in it</i>

564
00:25:09,809 --> 00:25:10,876
<i>which appeals to you most?</i>

565
00:25:12,711 --> 00:25:15,590
<i>-A sort of voluntary
schizophrenia, really.</i>

566
00:25:15,614 --> 00:25:19,794
<i>It's a high-risk profession
and I enjoy risks.</i>

567
00:25:19,818 --> 00:25:21,796
<i>He's created
so many iconic characters</i>

568
00:25:21,820 --> 00:25:22,930
<i>that we've known through time,</i>

569
00:25:22,954 --> 00:25:25,132
and they've been
so uniquely different.

570
00:25:25,156 --> 00:25:27,602
<i>You said that
being British in Hollywood means</i>

571
00:25:27,626 --> 00:25:29,770
<i>that you're usually stuck
playing a butler or a villain,</i>

572
00:25:29,794 --> 00:25:30,805
<i>but that's okay with you.</i>

573
00:25:30,829 --> 00:25:32,073
<i>-I think that they probably feel</i>

574
00:25:32,097 --> 00:25:35,343
<i>that we bring some kind of
style to the... the job</i>

575
00:25:35,367 --> 00:25:36,477
<i>that... that we might not</i>

576
00:25:36,501 --> 00:25:38,813
<i>necessarily have acquired
in the States.</i>

577
00:25:38,837 --> 00:25:39,947
<i>Yeah, but you
know what I think it is about you?</i>

578
00:25:39,971 --> 00:25:41,148
<i>I think it's that
you're very seductive</i>

579
00:25:41,172 --> 00:25:43,851
<i>and, you know, I thought
if you were the devil,</i>

580
00:25:43,875 --> 00:25:44,952
<i>I would pay to go to hell.</i>

581
00:25:46,278 --> 00:25:47,722
<i>His Darkness character has</i>

582
00:25:47,746 --> 00:25:50,291
stood out from any other
devil I've ever seen.

583
00:25:50,315 --> 00:25:52,660
<i>Looking at
his body of work, I feel like,</i>

584
00:25:52,684 --> 00:25:54,262
there's nothing
that he can't do.

585
00:25:55,620 --> 00:25:57,899
Is he available?

586
00:25:57,923 --> 00:25:59,066
<i>-I will kill you all.</i>

587
00:25:59,090 --> 00:26:01,202
-Is he interested?

588
00:26:01,226 --> 00:26:02,637
Can we make a deal?

589
00:26:02,661 --> 00:26:03,671
<i>-I'll kill you all.</i>

590
00:26:03,695 --> 00:26:05,106
-Will the network
be okay with it?

591
00:26:05,130 --> 00:26:06,974
<i>-You are priceless!</i>

592
00:26:06,998 --> 00:26:09,043
-Of course, everyone was.

593
00:26:09,067 --> 00:26:11,979
<i>I didn't audition
or even do a meeting.</i>

594
00:26:12,003 --> 00:26:13,948
<i>They just asked me
if I wanted to do it,</i>

595
00:26:13,972 --> 00:26:15,850
and I said, yes, I did.

596
00:26:15,874 --> 00:26:17,852
<i>Tim Curry
just had all those elements</i>

597
00:26:17,876 --> 00:26:20,245
that he would be fearless
in the role.

598
00:26:21,713 --> 00:26:24,125
<i>-Kiss me, fat boy!</i>

599
00:26:25,884 --> 00:26:28,296
-He brought
more to the character

600
00:26:28,320 --> 00:26:30,197
than what was
written on the page.

601
00:26:30,221 --> 00:26:32,667
<i>So, he was
approved at the network</i>

602
00:26:32,691 --> 00:26:34,268
and the rest is history.

603
00:26:34,292 --> 00:26:36,170
<i>-You all taste so much better</i>

604
00:26:36,194 --> 00:26:40,408
<i>when you're afraid,
really afraid!</i>

605
00:26:40,432 --> 00:26:42,810
<i>Tim
brings his considerable intellect</i>

606
00:26:42,834 --> 00:26:44,636
when he does a part.

607
00:26:46,338 --> 00:26:48,249
<i>I sometimes
ask myself that question</i>

608
00:26:48,273 --> 00:26:49,550
<i>after I've done a take.</i>

609
00:26:49,574 --> 00:26:51,886
<i>One of the great advantages
is that you can whisper.</i>

610
00:26:51,910 --> 00:26:54,789
<i>I mean, that you can do things
that are very small</i>

611
00:26:54,813 --> 00:26:57,291
<i>which you couldn't do
on... on a stage</i>

612
00:26:57,315 --> 00:26:59,794
<i>and then that's what
I'm discovering about that.</i>

613
00:26:59,818 --> 00:27:01,062
<i>We didn't talk at great length</i>

614
00:27:01,086 --> 00:27:04,265
<i>intellectually about it
because it was clear to me</i>

615
00:27:04,289 --> 00:27:06,734
that he had the correct
instincts.

616
00:27:06,758 --> 00:27:09,003
<i>-It's got to be true,</i>

617
00:27:09,027 --> 00:27:11,906
<i>whatever you're doing,
and the camera picks that up</i>

618
00:27:11,930 --> 00:27:17,244
<i>much more cruelly than
anything else.</i>

619
00:27:17,268 --> 00:27:20,748
<i>Tim Curry
managed to capture the humor</i>

620
00:27:20,772 --> 00:27:22,083
that a clown can bring.

621
00:27:24,442 --> 00:27:26,120
-And then
just managed to switch it.

622
00:27:27,445 --> 00:27:30,191
<i>And be
this magnificent evil villain</i>

623
00:27:30,215 --> 00:27:32,293
<i>that would kill you and eat you.</i>

624
00:27:32,317 --> 00:27:33,294
Like that.

625
00:27:33,318 --> 00:27:34,895
<i>-I'll kill you all!</i>

626
00:27:34,919 --> 00:27:38,065
-In a funny way,
it's a very simple performance.

627
00:27:38,089 --> 00:27:43,070
<i>-Take your pick,
B-B-B-Billy boy!</i>

628
00:27:43,094 --> 00:27:44,905
<i>Whenever you
see fearlessness in a colleague,</i>

629
00:27:44,929 --> 00:27:46,774
it's always an inspiration.

630
00:27:46,798 --> 00:27:49,210
<i>Some
wise person in the movie business</i>

631
00:27:49,234 --> 00:27:53,014
<i>said for directors the key is...</i>

632
00:27:53,038 --> 00:27:55,816
90 percent of it is
casting the right actor

633
00:27:55,840 --> 00:27:57,852
and then
getting out of their way.

634
00:27:57,876 --> 00:28:00,187
<i>Tim was a director's dream.</i>

635
00:28:00,211 --> 00:28:01,322
<i>A little further, Tim.</i>

636
00:28:01,346 --> 00:28:03,791
<i>Find the light, uh,
somewhere in there.</i>

637
00:28:03,815 --> 00:28:04,992
<i>There's not much there.</i>

638
00:28:05,016 --> 00:28:07,161
<i>Okay. There! There's some.</i>

639
00:28:08,120 --> 00:28:10,264
<i>I liked Tommy Lee a lot.</i>

640
00:28:10,288 --> 00:28:13,191
He was very direct,
which was nice.

641
00:28:16,394 --> 00:28:21,075
-Tommy Lee Wallace was a
brilliantly minimalist director.

642
00:28:21,099 --> 00:28:22,743
<i>Remember in-in the script,</i>

643
00:28:22,767 --> 00:28:24,345
<i>where I talked about,</i>

644
00:28:24,369 --> 00:28:27,014
<i>and I hope we still have it
standing by.</i>

645
00:28:27,038 --> 00:28:29,383
-He basically trusts his casting

646
00:28:29,407 --> 00:28:33,821
<i>and just gives the actors
their head and lets them do</i>

647
00:28:33,845 --> 00:28:35,156
what they do well.

648
00:28:35,180 --> 00:28:37,058
<i>He was very
clear about what he wanted.</i>

649
00:28:37,082 --> 00:28:39,060
<i>Now, his hands come up first,</i>

650
00:28:39,084 --> 00:28:41,896
<i>and then pulls himself up.
There. That's it.</i>

651
00:28:41,920 --> 00:28:44,965
<i>Which was
great. I really liked that.</i>

652
00:28:44,989 --> 00:28:46,834
<i>Okay, your chin's a little low.</i>

653
00:28:46,858 --> 00:28:48,903
<i>Ah, that's perfect.</i>

654
00:28:48,927 --> 00:28:51,505
-Because then it
becomes a pleasure to deliver.

655
00:28:51,529 --> 00:28:54,942
<i>I'll drive you crazy
and I'll kill you all!</i>

656
00:28:54,966 --> 00:28:57,111
<i>I'm every nightmare
you've ever had.</i>

657
00:28:57,135 --> 00:29:00,014
<i>I am your worst dream come true.</i>

658
00:29:00,038 --> 00:29:03,984
<i>I'm everything you
were ever afraid of.</i>

659
00:29:04,008 --> 00:29:06,520
-He did give me a lot of room.

660
00:29:06,544 --> 00:29:11,058
<i>Pennywise
was a very dangerous invention.</i>

661
00:29:11,082 --> 00:29:14,028
And I use dangerous
in the best sense of the word.

662
00:29:15,453 --> 00:29:19,200
-What I mean by it is that
they're pitched at a level

663
00:29:19,224 --> 00:29:23,037
that totally can go very wrong
very quickly,

664
00:29:23,061 --> 00:29:24,538
with the wrong casting,

665
00:29:24,562 --> 00:29:26,107
with the wrong direction,

666
00:29:26,131 --> 00:29:27,908
<i>with any number of
fill-in-the-blank</i>

667
00:29:27,932 --> 00:29:29,477
<i>mistake possibilities.</i>

668
00:29:29,501 --> 00:29:35,316
Tim was the genius choice
that radiated perfection

669
00:29:35,340 --> 00:29:37,075
<i>everywhere every time
he appeared.</i>

670
00:29:49,387 --> 00:29:50,664
<i>You guys don't have to do this.</i>

671
00:29:50,688 --> 00:29:53,024
<i>My dad says you have to know
when to take a stand.</i>

672
00:29:55,093 --> 00:29:56,170
<i>Let's get out of here!</i>

673
00:29:56,194 --> 00:29:57,505
<i>Yeah, let's go.</i>

674
00:29:57,529 --> 00:30:00,040
<i>We live in
dangerous times, boys and girls.</i>

675
00:30:00,064 --> 00:30:03,511
<i>I want you to be careful.</i>

676
00:30:03,535 --> 00:30:07,014
<i>Not just any
car. It 's a bicycle.</i>

677
00:30:07,038 --> 00:30:09,884
<i>They always made the best noise.</i>

678
00:30:09,908 --> 00:30:11,152
<i>Come on, Laurie Anne.</i>

679
00:30:11,176 --> 00:30:12,987
<i>It's gonna storm.</i>

680
00:30:21,986 --> 00:30:23,230
<i>No one even thought of</i>

681
00:30:23,254 --> 00:30:25,199
<i>going to Vancouver
in those days.</i>

682
00:30:25,223 --> 00:30:27,401
<i>I wish this
summer would never end.</i>

683
00:30:27,425 --> 00:30:29,136
<i>It's the best summer
of my whole life.</i>

684
00:30:29,160 --> 00:30:31,138
<i>Your hair is winter fire,</i>

685
00:30:31,162 --> 00:30:33,898
<i>January embers.
My heart burns there too.</i>

686
00:30:35,366 --> 00:30:37,111
<i>This was poor town.</i>

687
00:30:37,135 --> 00:30:39,180
<i>Yeah, still is.</i>

688
00:30:39,204 --> 00:30:40,481
<i>It's all I need.</i>

689
00:30:40,505 --> 00:30:42,883
<i>The wave
of filmmaking in Vancouver</i>

690
00:30:42,907 --> 00:30:44,418
<i>started in 1984.</i>

691
00:30:44,442 --> 00:30:46,120
I think the dollar dropped.

692
00:30:46,144 --> 00:30:47,988
<i>And so more shows started to go,</i>

693
00:30:48,012 --> 00:30:50,524
<i>"Oh, you can get a bigger bang
for your buck in Vancouver,</i>

694
00:30:50,548 --> 00:30:52,593
and we're only
two hours away from LA."

695
00:30:52,617 --> 00:30:55,062
<i>Hey!</i>

696
00:30:55,086 --> 00:30:56,487
<i>I'm back!</i>

697
00:30:57,856 --> 00:31:01,168
<i>When the time
came for us to start producing,</i>

698
00:31:01,192 --> 00:31:05,406
I had Vancouver implanted in
my head as a place to go.

699
00:31:05,430 --> 00:31:06,208
<i>You think
we're gonna let you have</i>

700
00:31:06,232 --> 00:31:07,599
<i>all the fun there, Billy boy?</i>

701
00:31:10,602 --> 00:31:13,547
-Having such a big production
over such a long period of time

702
00:31:13,571 --> 00:31:15,082
<i>created a huge buzz.</i>

703
00:31:15,106 --> 00:31:19,520
-In '89,
it was really busy in town.

704
00:31:19,544 --> 00:31:23,014
<i>Okay, here
we go. And roll, please.</i>

705
00:31:26,017 --> 00:31:28,562
-The studio that we used
was called The Bridges

706
00:31:28,586 --> 00:31:33,601
<i>and it was an abandoned shipyard
building that was converted.</i>

707
00:31:33,625 --> 00:31:34,835
<i>I was
working at Thomas Special Effects,</i>

708
00:31:34,859 --> 00:31:37,671
<i>which is a local special effects
house here in Vancouver,</i>

709
00:31:37,695 --> 00:31:39,440
owned by John Thomas.

710
00:31:39,464 --> 00:31:41,375
<i>He had a great
stable of crew people.</i>

711
00:31:41,399 --> 00:31:43,210
<i>He had all these
people that he nurtured</i>

712
00:31:43,234 --> 00:31:45,679
and had what we call
"real-world" abilities...

713
00:31:45,703 --> 00:31:48,549
<i>Welders, woodworkers, people
that work with fiberglass.</i>

714
00:31:48,573 --> 00:31:51,385
<i>They are all the veterans
of the film industry</i>

715
00:31:51,409 --> 00:31:53,354
that Vancouver has created.

716
00:31:53,378 --> 00:31:54,955
<i>It put a lot of people to work.</i>

717
00:31:54,979 --> 00:31:56,457
<i>It used a lot of locations</i>

718
00:31:56,481 --> 00:31:58,492
<i>and it also put Vancouver
on the map.</i>

719
00:31:58,516 --> 00:32:00,418
- <i>Cut!
- Cut! Very nice.</i>

720
00:32:13,364 --> 00:32:15,209
<i>What are you guys anyway?</i>

721
00:32:15,233 --> 00:32:17,211
<i>-We're sort of a club.</i>

722
00:32:17,235 --> 00:32:19,046
<i>I can
remember going to the movies</i>

723
00:32:19,070 --> 00:32:21,749
<i>and they used to have
Saturday matinees.</i>

724
00:32:21,773 --> 00:32:24,251
<i>We'd all line up,
usually with our money</i>

725
00:32:24,275 --> 00:32:26,220
<i>tied in a handkerchief
or something</i>

726
00:32:26,244 --> 00:32:27,621
<i>so we wouldn't lose it,</i>

727
00:32:27,645 --> 00:32:28,856
<i>and then we'd
get in the theater,</i>

728
00:32:28,880 --> 00:32:32,026
<i>and everybody would turn
their popcorn boxes into bugles</i>

729
00:32:32,050 --> 00:32:34,228
<i>and then the giant grasshoppers
would come on</i>

730
00:32:34,252 --> 00:32:36,397
<i>and destroy Chicago and London.</i>

731
00:32:36,421 --> 00:32:39,500
<i>I wrote about some of this stuff
in a book called IT.</i>

732
00:32:39,524 --> 00:32:41,468
<i>It's funny, I think a lot of us</i>

733
00:32:41,492 --> 00:32:44,571
<i>have only the haziest memories
of our childhood.</i>

734
00:32:44,595 --> 00:32:46,573
<i>-I don't remember much of it
at all, what we did.</i>

735
00:32:46,597 --> 00:32:49,310
<i>We can access
some of the good memories,</i>

736
00:32:49,334 --> 00:32:51,612
<i>and maybe we can access
some of the really bad memories</i>

737
00:32:51,636 --> 00:32:54,214
<i>if a bully beat us up
on the school yard.</i>

738
00:32:54,238 --> 00:32:55,416
<i>-You're dead!</i>

739
00:32:55,440 --> 00:32:57,284
<i>-But what I discovered
in writing IT was that</i>

740
00:32:57,308 --> 00:33:00,020
<i>the more I thought
about my childhood,</i>

741
00:33:00,044 --> 00:33:02,222
<i>the more
those memories came back.</i>

742
00:33:02,246 --> 00:33:04,024
<i>There's symbolism everywhere</i>

743
00:33:04,048 --> 00:33:06,727
<i>in the writing
that Stephen King created</i>

744
00:33:06,751 --> 00:33:09,163
to express the fears
of all children

745
00:33:09,187 --> 00:33:11,131
<i>that go through feeling
like a loser.</i>

746
00:33:13,124 --> 00:33:14,401
<i>Feeling like an outsider.</i>

747
00:33:14,425 --> 00:33:15,436
<i>You're only here because</i>

748
00:33:15,460 --> 00:33:16,737
<i>Mom says it's
our Christian duty.</i>

749
00:33:16,761 --> 00:33:18,605
-That's what
the Losers Club was about

750
00:33:18,629 --> 00:33:22,142
<i>and that's the bond that kept
these people together,</i>

751
00:33:22,166 --> 00:33:24,778
<i>because they didn't find
sanity, peace,</i>

752
00:33:24,802 --> 00:33:28,549
or even really a loving family
except with each other.

753
00:33:28,573 --> 00:33:30,150
<i>Their chosen family.</i>

754
00:33:30,174 --> 00:33:32,252
<i>We're seven now.</i>

755
00:33:32,276 --> 00:33:33,277
<i>Lucky seven.</i>

756
00:33:34,779 --> 00:33:36,390
<i>The gold
of the book were the kids.</i>

757
00:33:36,414 --> 00:33:37,524
<i>That's where I responded;</i>

758
00:33:37,548 --> 00:33:39,626
<i>I think it's where the
audience responded.</i>

759
00:33:39,650 --> 00:33:42,629
That horror was
the icing on the cake,

760
00:33:42,653 --> 00:33:45,766
<i>and very particular icing
in this case.</i>

761
00:33:47,091 --> 00:33:50,437
<i>We had
a casting director in Canada</i>

762
00:33:50,461 --> 00:33:52,172
by the name of Sid Kozak,
and Mark and I

763
00:33:52,196 --> 00:33:53,207
did the U.S. casting.

764
00:33:53,231 --> 00:33:55,275
<i>We were looking for three</i>

765
00:33:55,299 --> 00:33:57,177
<i>major things with the kids.</i>

766
00:33:57,201 --> 00:33:59,279
One was a sense of humor.

767
00:33:59,303 --> 00:34:00,303
<i>-Richie Tozier's my name.</i>

768
00:34:01,539 --> 00:34:02,217
One was they always
had to do a scene

769
00:34:02,241 --> 00:34:05,753
<i>that was painful and heartfelt.</i>

770
00:34:05,777 --> 00:34:08,255
<i>-You killed
my brother George, you bastard.</i>

771
00:34:08,279 --> 00:34:10,691
-And then
they also had to be scared.

772
00:34:13,451 --> 00:34:14,795
<i>A lot of times,
when you see them right off,</i>

773
00:34:14,819 --> 00:34:17,865
<i>you go, "They're not prepared
emotionally to handle this yet."</i>

774
00:34:17,889 --> 00:34:19,266
You're looking for an old soul.

775
00:34:19,290 --> 00:34:21,568
You're looking for people
that have a pain

776
00:34:21,592 --> 00:34:25,172
<i>and kids that could
truly, truly feel depth,</i>

777
00:34:25,196 --> 00:34:26,607
truly feel the fear.

778
00:34:26,631 --> 00:34:29,209
<i>Without projecting it,</i>

779
00:34:29,233 --> 00:34:32,437
<i>truly feel the camaraderie
of the humor of the group.</i>

780
00:34:34,739 --> 00:34:36,383
<i>And when you're coming in alone,</i>

781
00:34:36,407 --> 00:34:38,252
that's hard for those kids.

782
00:34:38,276 --> 00:34:39,787
<i>All these different characters</i>

783
00:34:39,811 --> 00:34:42,122
<i>that seem to come
from different backgrounds</i>

784
00:34:42,146 --> 00:34:43,791
<i>all had the same thing
in common...</i>

785
00:34:43,815 --> 00:34:46,160
They're misfits,
they're outcasts,

786
00:34:46,184 --> 00:34:48,595
<i>they have an undesirable
home life.</i>

787
00:34:48,619 --> 00:34:49,997
<i>-What you got there?</i>

788
00:34:50,021 --> 00:34:51,498
<i>They don't feel
like they're worth anything.</i>

789
00:34:51,522 --> 00:34:52,699
<i>-It's the Losers Club.</i>

790
00:34:53,825 --> 00:34:55,903
-And yet,
when they all work together,

791
00:34:55,927 --> 00:34:58,172
they are literally unstoppable.

792
00:34:58,196 --> 00:35:02,176
<i>-I think the six of us
could put you in the hospital.</i>

793
00:35:02,200 --> 00:35:03,510
<i>-Seven.</i>

794
00:35:03,534 --> 00:35:04,845
-We went to the producers
to do a mix and match.

795
00:35:04,869 --> 00:35:08,449
<i>We wanted to have three
in each roll for the first one</i>

796
00:35:08,473 --> 00:35:10,651
<i>and see how the
kids worked together.</i>

797
00:35:10,675 --> 00:35:13,253
-It was
challenging having kids...

798
00:35:13,277 --> 00:35:14,888
<i>-Eddie, which way is Derry?</i>

799
00:35:14,912 --> 00:35:16,723
-and adults...

800
00:35:16,747 --> 00:35:17,825
<i>-That way.</i>

801
00:35:17,849 --> 00:35:20,518
-and you had to cast
both in the like.

802
00:35:22,887 --> 00:35:23,931
Like <i>Stand by Me</i>,

803
00:35:23,955 --> 00:35:25,833
<i>the challenge was
in finding adults</i>

804
00:35:25,857 --> 00:35:27,835
<i>that would both physically
match up with them.</i>

805
00:35:27,859 --> 00:35:29,570
<i>This was a case
where I think the network</i>

806
00:35:29,594 --> 00:35:31,905
<i>was completely
right in its choices.</i>

807
00:35:31,929 --> 00:35:34,174
-You really needed to believe

808
00:35:34,198 --> 00:35:37,644
<i>Seth Green grows up to be Harry.</i>

809
00:35:37,668 --> 00:35:39,646
<i>I feel like
every one of those parts,</i>

810
00:35:39,670 --> 00:35:42,783
<i>there's a poignancy involved,
because those kids,</i>

811
00:35:42,807 --> 00:35:45,919
I believed that they grew up
to be those people.

812
00:35:45,943 --> 00:35:47,821
<i>At that
time, what was really popular</i>

813
00:35:47,845 --> 00:35:50,824
<i>was to find the iconic TV actors</i>

814
00:35:50,848 --> 00:35:53,427
<i>that would be ensemble players.</i>

815
00:35:53,451 --> 00:35:54,962
-The ideas kept coming.

816
00:35:54,986 --> 00:35:57,898
Richard Thomas for Bill.

817
00:35:57,922 --> 00:36:00,901
Those were quick decisions
in an office.

818
00:36:00,925 --> 00:36:02,603
<i>John Ritter, Harry Anderson,</i>

819
00:36:02,627 --> 00:36:05,372
<i>Annette O'Toole, Richard Masur,</i>

820
00:36:05,396 --> 00:36:07,365
<i>Dennis Christopher, Tim Reid..</i>

821
00:36:08,599 --> 00:36:11,445
<i>Stephen King's IT.</i>

822
00:36:11,469 --> 00:36:12,579
<i>I mean, those were like</i>

823
00:36:12,603 --> 00:36:14,314
<i>a gold mine of actors.</i>

824
00:36:14,338 --> 00:36:16,850
-We were getting TV's best

825
00:36:16,874 --> 00:36:19,853
<i>and then piled
Tim Curry on top of that.</i>

826
00:36:19,877 --> 00:36:22,256
Well, we knew we had something.

827
00:36:22,280 --> 00:36:24,958
-They all
came together wonderfully.

828
00:36:24,982 --> 00:36:26,226
<i>That's lightning in a bottle.</i>

829
00:36:26,250 --> 00:36:28,262
<i>You just don't always get that.</i>

830
00:36:28,286 --> 00:36:29,763
<i>The adult actors wanted to</i>

831
00:36:29,787 --> 00:36:30,964
<i>spend time with the kids,</i>

832
00:36:30,988 --> 00:36:32,799
<i>wanted to get to know them.</i>

833
00:36:32,823 --> 00:36:34,968
<i>We had a Lucky Seven camp</i>

834
00:36:34,992 --> 00:36:37,504
<i>for the express purpose</i>

835
00:36:37,528 --> 00:36:40,307
<i>of having the children
and the adults interact</i>

836
00:36:40,331 --> 00:36:42,709
<i>and work out business.</i>

837
00:36:42,733 --> 00:36:45,612
Bill Denbrough goes like this.

838
00:36:45,636 --> 00:36:46,980
It's no accident.

839
00:36:47,004 --> 00:36:50,717
<i>We brought the group that
wasn't being shot right then</i>

840
00:36:50,741 --> 00:36:54,555
in for three days
simply to have them develop

841
00:36:54,579 --> 00:36:57,357
<i>little tricks of that sort
so that it really would feel</i>

842
00:36:57,381 --> 00:36:59,826
a veracity to the whole thing.

843
00:36:59,850 --> 00:37:01,461
<i>When you see that first part</i>

844
00:37:01,485 --> 00:37:04,398
and those kids who then later
become those adults,

845
00:37:04,422 --> 00:37:06,800
<i>the end result was, I
think, very successful</i>

846
00:37:06,824 --> 00:37:08,902
<i>because the characters
were more in synch.</i>

847
00:37:08,926 --> 00:37:12,272
-I think
that paid just untold dividends.

848
00:37:12,296 --> 00:37:13,041
<i>It was really important</i>

849
00:37:13,065 --> 00:37:14,174
<i>for Tommy Lee Wallace</i>

850
00:37:14,198 --> 00:37:17,411
<i>that all the kids
were bonded in reality</i>

851
00:37:17,435 --> 00:37:19,046
so that that would come across
on screen.

852
00:37:19,070 --> 00:37:21,348
<i>-I mean,
are we men or are we mice?</i>

853
00:37:21,372 --> 00:37:22,816
<i>We're mice!</i>

854
00:37:22,840 --> 00:37:25,586
-You feel this trust
that he has for you.

855
00:37:25,610 --> 00:37:28,922
<i>And as much as he knows
about all the characters</i>

856
00:37:28,946 --> 00:37:31,325
and how all the puzzle pieces
fit together,

857
00:37:31,349 --> 00:37:34,461
<i>he knew how much
our characters meant to us.</i>

858
00:37:34,485 --> 00:37:35,562
<i>-To the Losers Club!</i>

859
00:37:35,586 --> 00:37:37,598
<i>- All right.
- To the Losers Club!</i>

860
00:37:41,025 --> 00:37:43,470
<i>The first kid that was cast</i>

861
00:37:43,494 --> 00:37:44,471
<i>was Jonathan Brandis,</i>

862
00:37:44,495 --> 00:37:45,806
<i>because he just was rich.</i>

863
00:37:45,830 --> 00:37:48,508
<i>And when you look at it,
oh, my god.</i>

864
00:37:48,532 --> 00:37:52,379
He can reach points of pain
and depth, very simply,

865
00:37:52,403 --> 00:37:54,514
deeply, very quickly.

866
00:37:54,538 --> 00:37:58,652
<i>-It's some kind of monster.
And it's right here in Derry.</i>

867
00:37:58,676 --> 00:38:01,455
<i>I had a crush
on Jonathan Brandis for sure.</i>

868
00:38:01,479 --> 00:38:03,390
I thought he was pretty cute.

869
00:38:03,414 --> 00:38:04,891
<i>My heart burns there too.</i>

870
00:38:04,915 --> 00:38:07,527
-I remember he was on the cover
of every, like,

871
00:38:07,551 --> 00:38:08,996
<i>Teen Beat magazine.</i>

872
00:38:09,020 --> 00:38:12,523
-Brought an awful lot
of gravity to that role...

873
00:38:14,959 --> 00:38:15,837
<i>-George.</i>

874
00:38:15,861 --> 00:38:19,640
-that somehow was a good
emotional match

875
00:38:19,664 --> 00:38:22,676
<i>for his adult counterpart,
Richard Thomas.</i>

876
00:38:22,700 --> 00:38:23,944
<i>-George.</i>

877
00:38:23,968 --> 00:38:25,946
<i>I remember
Jonathan because we met,</i>

878
00:38:25,970 --> 00:38:29,816
we talked, you know, to get
a feeling of the same person,

879
00:38:29,840 --> 00:38:33,387
but that felt like it was
an essential meeting to have.

880
00:38:33,411 --> 00:38:36,990
I don't know if he had to
put a mole on his cheek. He did!

881
00:38:37,014 --> 00:38:38,525
<i>They made him put a mole
on his cheek.</i>

882
00:38:38,549 --> 00:38:41,395
Oh, the poor kid.
That's terrible.

883
00:38:41,419 --> 00:38:43,764
<i>That's right,
he had to wear a mole.</i>

884
00:38:43,788 --> 00:38:45,732
Oh god.

885
00:38:45,756 --> 00:38:46,668
<i>They both had something</i>

886
00:38:46,692 --> 00:38:47,801
<i>in their personalities</i>

887
00:38:47,825 --> 00:38:51,605
<i>that's serious,
that takes the cruel world</i>

888
00:38:51,629 --> 00:38:55,008
<i>and the hurts and the
angers and the angst of it all</i>

889
00:38:55,032 --> 00:39:01,014
and takes it personally and
wants to do something about it.

890
00:39:01,038 --> 00:39:02,983
<i>I'm going back in.</i>

891
00:39:03,007 --> 00:39:04,818
<i>This time I'm gonna kill It.</i>

892
00:39:04,842 --> 00:39:08,555
-There's a sense of nobleness
about both of those people

893
00:39:08,579 --> 00:39:11,558
<i>and Jonathan had that
as a child.</i>

894
00:39:11,582 --> 00:39:13,026
<i>Now, listen.</i>

895
00:39:13,050 --> 00:39:15,062
<i>You guys don't have to do this.</i>

896
00:39:15,086 --> 00:39:16,396
<i>And he was the natural</i>

897
00:39:16,420 --> 00:39:18,765
<i>leader of the kid actors, too.</i>

898
00:39:18,789 --> 00:39:20,934
<i>He didn't do it
by making a lot of noise.</i>

899
00:39:20,958 --> 00:39:23,804
<i>He just did it
by being who he was.</i>

900
00:39:23,828 --> 00:39:25,539
<i>I felt
very close to that character</i>

901
00:39:25,563 --> 00:39:27,074
<i>when I read it.</i>

902
00:39:27,098 --> 00:39:30,444
When a script comes to you
or a play text and you read it,

903
00:39:30,468 --> 00:39:34,881
<i>you can feel the proximity
of the character,</i>

904
00:39:34,905 --> 00:39:37,984
the affinity that you have,
and you can feel the distance.

905
00:39:38,008 --> 00:39:41,188
<i>But with Bill, I just thought,
"Oh, no, I know how this feels.</i>

906
00:39:41,212 --> 00:39:42,923
<i>I know who this guy is."</i>

907
00:39:42,947 --> 00:39:45,125
<i>It was the
Bill-Georgie-Pennywise sequence</i>

908
00:39:45,149 --> 00:39:48,028
<i>with the observation
of what siblings were,</i>

909
00:39:48,052 --> 00:39:51,198
but emotionally I believed in
the truth of those brothers

910
00:39:51,222 --> 00:39:53,667
loud and clear,
and I thought the scene

911
00:39:53,691 --> 00:39:55,902
<i>was one of Steve's best.</i>

912
00:39:55,926 --> 00:39:58,138
<i>-You made it for me?</i>

913
00:39:58,162 --> 00:39:59,639
<i>Can I go sail it?</i>

914
00:39:59,663 --> 00:40:01,608
-I remember
the scene assembling the boat

915
00:40:01,632 --> 00:40:02,876
with Jonathan Brandis,

916
00:40:02,900 --> 00:40:04,878
<i>and giving him the kiss
and how awkward that was.</i>

917
00:40:04,902 --> 00:40:05,912
<i>-Yuck!</i>

918
00:40:05,936 --> 00:40:07,037
-But he was a great guy.

919
00:40:09,707 --> 00:40:12,853
<i>I was completely stunned.</i>

920
00:40:12,877 --> 00:40:17,057
I had no idea
that he had been suffering

921
00:40:17,081 --> 00:40:19,659
any kind of depression
or any other issues.

922
00:40:19,683 --> 00:40:21,962
All I knew is he was working.

923
00:40:21,986 --> 00:40:24,498
<i>I think he had just finished
a movie with Bruce Willis,</i>

924
00:40:24,522 --> 00:40:25,732
Hart's War.

925
00:40:25,756 --> 00:40:29,069
<i>He had an incredible
run on</i> Sea Quest.

926
00:40:33,597 --> 00:40:35,108
-Hello.

927
00:40:36,600 --> 00:40:38,645
-He'd learned
the craft of directing..

928
00:40:38,669 --> 00:40:41,915
-What you do is sit at it
and watch '70s television...

929
00:40:41,939 --> 00:40:42,717
- <i>Yeah.
- On a channel and...</i>

930
00:40:42,741 --> 00:40:43,817
<i>Just to find out all the ways</i>

931
00:40:43,841 --> 00:40:44,985
<i>you shouldn't direct
a television show.</i>

932
00:40:45,009 --> 00:40:47,854
<i>-Um, it's just
they're shot kind of cheesy</i>

933
00:40:47,878 --> 00:40:49,756
<i>and I just kind of want to learn
how to do something different</i>

934
00:40:49,780 --> 00:40:50,757
<i>with television.</i>

935
00:40:50,781 --> 00:40:52,025
<i>He was doing everything</i>

936
00:40:52,049 --> 00:40:55,662
<i>a resourceful actor could do.</i>

937
00:40:55,686 --> 00:40:57,931
I think he had everything
in front of him

938
00:40:57,955 --> 00:41:01,835
and I was excited
to see him moving forward.

939
00:41:01,859 --> 00:41:04,171
I was blown away
because he's my age.

940
00:41:04,195 --> 00:41:06,072
<i>That was probably
one of the first times</i>

941
00:41:06,096 --> 00:41:10,100
<i>I ever even considered
my own mortality.</i>

942
00:41:20,044 --> 00:41:21,044
<i>Swear to me.</i>

943
00:41:23,047 --> 00:41:27,027
<i>Swear to me that
if It isn't dead,</i>

944
00:41:27,051 --> 00:41:28,595
<i>we'll all come back.</i>

945
00:41:28,619 --> 00:41:31,565
-The kids moved me enormously,

946
00:41:31,589 --> 00:41:33,867
and I think about
the scene at the end

947
00:41:33,891 --> 00:41:36,603
when they come together
having won the battle

948
00:41:36,627 --> 00:41:41,098
but not the war and hold hands
and swear that they'll return.

949
00:41:42,733 --> 00:41:45,011
<i>Swear.</i>

950
00:41:45,035 --> 00:41:49,916
-When you have a project
that is such a good story

951
00:41:49,940 --> 00:41:52,652
and has such a good lead actor,

952
00:41:52,676 --> 00:41:56,056
it's really hard to
screw it up. musically.

953
00:41:57,882 --> 00:41:59,893
<i>Finding a focus
was the first thing.</i>

954
00:41:59,917 --> 00:42:01,628
What's the music going to do?

955
00:42:01,652 --> 00:42:04,865
<i>It could have been the most
horrific alien ever</i>

956
00:42:04,889 --> 00:42:07,834
to visit our planet
in the form of a clown.

957
00:42:09,226 --> 00:42:12,672
-.but to me, it was
kids in jeopardy.

958
00:42:12,696 --> 00:42:14,241
<i>-Hands squeeze.</i>

959
00:42:14,265 --> 00:42:16,076
<i>I focused on the kids.</i>

960
00:42:16,100 --> 00:42:19,946
<i>To a large extent that's
because Stephen King and I</i>

961
00:42:19,970 --> 00:42:21,248
<i>are about the same age,</i>

962
00:42:21,272 --> 00:42:24,885
<i>so when he writes about kids,
that's my childhood.</i>

963
00:42:24,909 --> 00:42:28,922
<i>In the '50s when we would play
outside and build dams</i>

964
00:42:28,946 --> 00:42:34,661
and all of that stuff, we would
score our activities ourselves.

965
00:42:34,685 --> 00:42:36,363
<i>If it was an action scene,
we would do:</i>

966
00:42:36,387 --> 00:42:40,267
<i>"Nah nah nah nah nah."</i>

967
00:42:40,291 --> 00:42:43,937
When they jump on Silver
to get away...

968
00:42:43,961 --> 00:42:46,940
<i>- Go!
- Hi-ho Silver, away!</i>

969
00:42:46,964 --> 00:42:49,142
<i>The
reference of hi-ho Silver means</i>

970
00:42:49,166 --> 00:42:51,278
that through their minds
was going:

971
00:42:51,302 --> 00:42:54,247
<i>badump badump badump
badump badump badump.</i>

972
00:42:54,271 --> 00:42:56,182
<i>Now I couldn't do
the William Tell</i>

973
00:42:56,206 --> 00:42:58,652
<i>and get away with it
with a straight face,</i>

974
00:42:58,676 --> 00:43:01,187
but that was the focus.

975
00:43:01,211 --> 00:43:03,957
<i>We would
put the pictures of the adults</i>

976
00:43:03,981 --> 00:43:06,092
<i>up first and as they were cast,</i>

977
00:43:06,116 --> 00:43:09,229
we put the kids that were
possible matches for them.

978
00:43:09,253 --> 00:43:15,135
And very early on Sid sent us
a tape and photos of Emily,

979
00:43:15,159 --> 00:43:18,371
<i>who was the young
Annette O'Toole...</i>

980
00:43:18,395 --> 00:43:20,173
<i>-Daddy, breakfast is ready.</i>

981
00:43:20,197 --> 00:43:22,809
<i>And she set a very high bar.</i>

982
00:43:22,833 --> 00:43:27,047
We kept looking for that role,
but she was really an old soul

983
00:43:27,071 --> 00:43:29,950
<i>that just matched
what we were looking for.</i>

984
00:43:29,974 --> 00:43:33,019
-The character of Bev
was like my mom's childhood.

985
00:43:33,043 --> 00:43:36,423
She grew up in the '50s,
her name was Bev, she was poor.

986
00:43:36,447 --> 00:43:38,725
<i>I just felt like
I was playing her.</i>

987
00:43:38,749 --> 00:43:42,028
She said, "Those are the exact
clothes that I used to wear,"

988
00:43:42,052 --> 00:43:44,864
<i>so it was this
really unique opportunity</i>

989
00:43:44,888 --> 00:43:47,367
to express my mother's story.

990
00:43:47,391 --> 00:43:53,073
-Emily was a singularly
professional young actress.

991
00:43:53,097 --> 00:43:55,976
<i>She was very mature
for her years.</i>

992
00:43:56,000 --> 00:43:58,445
She understood
that the relationship

993
00:43:58,469 --> 00:44:02,282
between her film
father and herself

994
00:44:02,306 --> 00:44:06,853
<i>was not the relationship
between her and me</i>

995
00:44:06,877 --> 00:44:10,991
and that makes life
a whole lot easier.

996
00:44:11,015 --> 00:44:17,063
-For me, Beverly Marsh
was the 1950s female child

997
00:44:17,087 --> 00:44:20,300
who was oppressed
based on her gender.

998
00:44:20,324 --> 00:44:21,434
<i>-Bev wants to help.</i>

999
00:44:21,458 --> 00:44:24,204
<i>I hope it's okay.
I mean, she's a girl.</i>

1000
00:44:24,228 --> 00:44:29,175
-.and very stringent ideals
of how women should behave.

1001
00:44:29,199 --> 00:44:30,243
-Let me see that.

1002
00:44:30,267 --> 00:44:33,346
-Bev's father is
extremely critical

1003
00:44:33,370 --> 00:44:35,949
of her developing sexuality.

1004
00:44:35,973 --> 00:44:37,450
<i>-Poetry from some boy?</i>

1005
00:44:37,474 --> 00:44:40,286
-That's a big theme
in the novel.

1006
00:44:40,310 --> 00:44:44,457
<i>The domestic and sexual violence
against Bev is a major theme.</i>

1007
00:44:44,481 --> 00:44:46,426
It's not as much I don't think
in the mini-series,

1008
00:44:46,450 --> 00:44:48,762
but it's there a little bit.

1009
00:44:48,786 --> 00:44:51,364
<i>My agent
suggested me for Al Marsh</i>

1010
00:44:51,388 --> 00:44:54,467
<i>and the casting
director said, "Oh, no.</i>

1011
00:44:54,491 --> 00:44:58,371
Frank's too much of a nice guy
to play that character. No."

1012
00:44:58,395 --> 00:45:01,341
They did three rounds
of auditions.

1013
00:45:01,365 --> 00:45:04,744
Finally, on the fourth round,

1014
00:45:04,768 --> 00:45:07,414
the casting director
let me go in and audition.

1015
00:45:07,438 --> 00:45:09,215
<i>Casting against type when</i>

1016
00:45:09,239 --> 00:45:12,419
<i>you're in that kind of project,</i>

1017
00:45:12,443 --> 00:45:15,922
that's part of our
being creative

1018
00:45:15,946 --> 00:45:18,858
and the agents and managers
submitting them and saying,

1019
00:45:18,882 --> 00:45:20,527
"Hey, what about this?"

1020
00:45:20,551 --> 00:45:24,230
-In the room, the director says,

1021
00:45:24,254 --> 00:45:25,765
"Would you shave your beard?"

1022
00:45:25,789 --> 00:45:28,368
I said, "You hire me,
my beard's gone."

1023
00:45:28,392 --> 00:45:29,469
<i>-Daddy, please!</i>

1024
00:45:30,361 --> 00:45:34,140
-He felt so guilty
having to smack me

1025
00:45:34,164 --> 00:45:39,345
and be this intimidating,
domineering, abusive father.

1026
00:45:39,369 --> 00:45:41,047
<i>-Let me alone,
you just let me alone!</i>

1027
00:45:41,071 --> 00:45:42,549
<i>-Come here!</i>

1028
00:45:42,573 --> 00:45:43,917
-And sometimes
you went a little over

1029
00:45:43,941 --> 00:45:46,310
the limits
in terms of discipline.

1030
00:45:48,078 --> 00:45:50,890
-He always apologized
at the end of the day

1031
00:45:50,914 --> 00:45:52,459
<i>but while he was in the moment...</i>

1032
00:45:52,483 --> 00:45:55,028
<i>-You get right the
hell back here, Bevvy!</i>

1033
00:45:55,052 --> 00:45:57,063
He was just really scary,

1034
00:45:57,087 --> 00:45:59,089
so I didn't have to do
a lot of acting.

1035
00:46:00,991 --> 00:46:02,993
The blood coming out
of the sink...

1036
00:46:05,596 --> 00:46:07,407
<i>stayed
with me because for a while</i>

1037
00:46:07,431 --> 00:46:10,410
<i>I was like afraid to take
showers,</i>

1038
00:46:10,434 --> 00:46:14,981
and there's that sewage,
subterranean element to IT.

1039
00:46:15,005 --> 00:46:17,417
<i>-Good afternoon, gentlemen.
I'm Beverly Marsh.</i>

1040
00:46:17,441 --> 00:46:19,018
<i>Annette O'Toole I had worked</i>

1041
00:46:19,042 --> 00:46:20,286
<i>with several times,</i>

1042
00:46:20,310 --> 00:46:22,322
<i>and I loved Annette
and the person that she was</i>

1043
00:46:22,346 --> 00:46:23,690
<i>and the actress that she was.</i>

1044
00:46:23,714 --> 00:46:26,426
<i>There
wasn't a lot that I needed to do</i>

1045
00:46:26,450 --> 00:46:29,129
to become the young Annette.

1046
00:46:29,153 --> 00:46:31,397
<i>They said that our mannerisms
were similar.</i>

1047
00:46:31,421 --> 00:46:33,533
<i>Well, I was thinking,
being Saturday now,</i>

1048
00:46:33,557 --> 00:46:35,568
<i>you could come down
with me to the Barrens.</i>

1049
00:46:35,592 --> 00:46:37,070
-My grandfather was an actor.

1050
00:46:37,094 --> 00:46:38,872
<i>He was in Gone with the Wind.</i>

1051
00:46:38,896 --> 00:46:41,141
<i>I think they were having
a 40th anniversary party</i>

1052
00:46:41,165 --> 00:46:43,476
and there was a lady there
who thought I was kind of

1053
00:46:43,500 --> 00:46:45,211
precocious and cute,

1054
00:46:45,235 --> 00:46:47,547
<i>and put me to work
almost right away.</i>

1055
00:46:47,571 --> 00:46:49,215
I was four.

1056
00:46:49,239 --> 00:46:51,317
<i>The Jonathan Ritter match,</i>

1057
00:46:51,341 --> 00:46:53,019
<i>little guy, Brandon,</i>

1058
00:46:53,043 --> 00:46:55,421
unbelievable from the moment
he came in.

1059
00:46:55,445 --> 00:46:56,623
<i>-Ten out of ten.</i>

1060
00:46:56,647 --> 00:46:57,724
<i>I remember getting a callback</i>

1061
00:46:57,748 --> 00:47:00,994
and it being an audition
that I really wanted to get.

1062
00:47:01,018 --> 00:47:03,563
<i>And there were probably
20 kids in the room.</i>

1063
00:47:03,587 --> 00:47:06,065
-There was a lot
of competition in that role.

1064
00:47:06,089 --> 00:47:08,067
<i>I looked
around and I remember noticing</i>

1065
00:47:08,091 --> 00:47:10,303
<i>there weren't any other Bens.</i>

1066
00:47:10,327 --> 00:47:15,275
So, I asked the AD,
"Where are the other Bens?"

1067
00:47:15,299 --> 00:47:17,310
<i>They said,
"It's pretty much just you.</i>

1068
00:47:17,334 --> 00:47:19,045
<i>We're looking at
a kid in Vancouver</i>

1069
00:47:19,069 --> 00:47:22,248
and I think one in Texas,
but I think it's gonna be you."

1070
00:47:22,272 --> 00:47:23,383
<i>Nobody does that, right?</i>

1071
00:47:23,407 --> 00:47:26,286
<i>Nobody tells you
during the casting process</i>

1072
00:47:26,310 --> 00:47:28,354
that it's probably gonna be you.

1073
00:47:28,378 --> 00:47:31,524
<i>I had never been asked to read
anything like this before.</i>

1074
00:47:31,548 --> 00:47:32,625
<i>They wouldn't treat us like this</i>

1075
00:47:32,649 --> 00:47:34,260
<i>if Daddy were still alive.</i>

1076
00:47:34,284 --> 00:47:35,528
<i>Being a fat kid,</i>

1077
00:47:35,552 --> 00:47:38,598
<i>you literally don't have
a whole lot of roles that,</i>

1078
00:47:38,622 --> 00:47:40,500
I don't want to say
have any meaning,

1079
00:47:40,524 --> 00:47:42,502
but... but certainly don't have
a lot of depth.

1080
00:47:42,526 --> 00:47:46,005
<i>A lot of times, they're just
about food jokes or fat jokes.</i>

1081
00:47:46,029 --> 00:47:48,341
<i>What a porker.</i>

1082
00:47:48,365 --> 00:47:50,376
<i>They're
crazy of f-the-cuff one-liners.</i>

1083
00:47:50,400 --> 00:47:52,111
They're the crazy characters.

1084
00:47:52,135 --> 00:47:55,181
Obviously,
body image is a real key issue

1085
00:47:55,205 --> 00:47:56,950
<i>that a lot of kids
are dealing with,</i>

1086
00:47:56,974 --> 00:47:59,252
<i>probably more than
you even imagine.</i>

1087
00:47:59,276 --> 00:48:03,056
-I'd never been given anything
to read that wasn't that.

1088
00:48:03,080 --> 00:48:04,560
<i>There was a lot of gravitas
with this.</i>

1089
00:48:06,016 --> 00:48:08,428
I remember, "Wow, I'm gonna have
to be a real actor now."

1090
00:48:08,452 --> 00:48:11,097
<i>There's a moment where
I pull some Sugar Daddies</i>

1091
00:48:11,121 --> 00:48:13,633
<i>out of my pocket and eat them
because I'm nervous.</i>

1092
00:48:13,657 --> 00:48:15,935
<i>It was explained to me
that there was some importance</i>

1093
00:48:15,959 --> 00:48:17,503
<i>behind that because
I protested a little bit.</i>

1094
00:48:17,527 --> 00:48:20,506
I was like, "Ah, really?

1095
00:48:20,530 --> 00:48:22,075
Do we have to do this right now?

1096
00:48:22,099 --> 00:48:24,043
<i>And... and the way
Tommy articulated it,</i>

1097
00:48:24,067 --> 00:48:26,179
<i>it made perfect sense,
so I went along with the ride.</i>

1098
00:48:26,203 --> 00:48:27,547
<i>I was willing to do those things</i>

1099
00:48:27,571 --> 00:48:30,984
<i>because there was so much
more meat with the character</i>

1100
00:48:31,008 --> 00:48:32,151
<i>and so many situations</i>

1101
00:48:32,175 --> 00:48:34,053
<i>that I'd never been
able to portray before.</i>

1102
00:48:34,077 --> 00:48:35,188
I did those things willingly,

1103
00:48:35,212 --> 00:48:37,614
knowing that there would be
a huge payoff in the end.

1104
00:48:39,182 --> 00:48:41,160
<i>Knowing
that you were going to be</i>

1105
00:48:41,184 --> 00:48:44,497
<i>in the same movie with
John Ritter and Harry Anderson</i>

1106
00:48:44,521 --> 00:48:47,000
<i>and all these other
actors who I'd already</i>

1107
00:48:47,024 --> 00:48:50,703
seen on TV at this young age
was a phenomenal experience.

1108
00:48:50,727 --> 00:48:52,405
<i>I was a huge fan of John Ritter.</i>

1109
00:48:52,429 --> 00:48:54,240
<i>He was a massive
influence of mine.</i>

1110
00:48:54,264 --> 00:48:57,110
Not just as the kind of
actor that he was

1111
00:48:57,134 --> 00:48:58,578
but the kind of comedian
that he was.

1112
00:48:58,602 --> 00:49:01,214
The type of physical comedian
that he was and

1113
00:49:01,238 --> 00:49:06,019
<i>how deeply sincere he was
in all of his performances</i>

1114
00:49:06,043 --> 00:49:07,487
regardless of the character
that he was playing.

1115
00:49:07,511 --> 00:49:09,289
<i>-How important is being a star?</i>

1116
00:49:09,313 --> 00:49:11,024
<i>-Uh, it's not important.</i>

1117
00:49:11,048 --> 00:49:13,626
<i>Being thought of as a...
As a good actor is.</i>

1118
00:49:13,650 --> 00:49:15,495
<i>You have
one of the most gifted comedians</i>

1119
00:49:15,519 --> 00:49:16,496
<i>of his generation too,</i>

1120
00:49:16,520 --> 00:49:18,531
so obviously it's going
to be crazy, right?

1121
00:49:18,555 --> 00:49:21,634
-He was always full of mischief.

1122
00:49:21,658 --> 00:49:24,337
<i>Always up to something.</i>

1123
00:49:24,361 --> 00:49:25,538
<i>Here, boy!</i>

1124
00:49:25,562 --> 00:49:29,375
<i>That's it.
Oh, I can't stand it.</i>

1125
00:49:29,399 --> 00:49:30,634
<i>I can't stand it.</i>

1126
00:49:32,602 --> 00:49:34,347
<i>I had my two
kids come up and visit.</i>

1127
00:49:34,371 --> 00:49:37,083
They were big fans
of John Ritter

1128
00:49:37,107 --> 00:49:38,484
because they watched<i>
Three's Company</i>,

1129
00:49:38,508 --> 00:49:40,520
<i>so when I told them I
was working with him,</i>

1130
00:49:40,544 --> 00:49:42,522
my stature went way up.

1131
00:49:42,546 --> 00:49:44,057
They have never forgotten it.

1132
00:49:45,382 --> 00:49:46,459
<i>Cut!</i>

1133
00:49:46,483 --> 00:49:48,728
-We were all stirring up
our own fear.

1134
00:49:48,752 --> 00:49:51,264
That's what we did at work
all day internally,

1135
00:49:51,288 --> 00:49:53,733
to be ready to jump
into these scenes,

1136
00:49:53,757 --> 00:49:57,170
<i>which were kind of hard
and kind of dark.</i>

1137
00:49:57,194 --> 00:49:59,105
John would always lift us
up with humor.

1138
00:49:59,129 --> 00:50:02,442
<i>He's always got humor
in his back pocket and</i>

1139
00:50:02,466 --> 00:50:04,477
I know it served us really well.

1140
00:50:04,501 --> 00:50:06,412
<i>Here's a comic actor asked</i>

1141
00:50:06,436 --> 00:50:08,614
<i>to play the dramatic role,</i>

1142
00:50:08,638 --> 00:50:13,052
and I never doubted
for a minute that he could.

1143
00:50:13,076 --> 00:50:14,287
<i>-Mike?</i>

1144
00:50:14,311 --> 00:50:17,657
<i>Yeah, buddy.
Listen, It. It's come back.</i>

1145
00:50:20,384 --> 00:50:25,064
-He walked in and made
everyone around him better,

1146
00:50:25,088 --> 00:50:27,500
<i>like a good team player
in a sport,</i>

1147
00:50:27,524 --> 00:50:31,471
<i>just by his professionalism,
his sense of preparedness,</i>

1148
00:50:31,495 --> 00:50:34,507
and his ability to
get down to business

1149
00:50:34,531 --> 00:50:37,477
while still cracking wise
and having fun.

1150
00:50:37,501 --> 00:50:40,079
-John had a presence
about himself

1151
00:50:40,103 --> 00:50:43,116
<i>that interestingly related
more to young people.</i>

1152
00:50:43,140 --> 00:50:44,584
<i>-Hang tough, champ.
You're gonna make it.</i>

1153
00:50:44,608 --> 00:50:46,486
-He was adored by young people.

1154
00:50:46,510 --> 00:50:48,221
<i>He really appreciated</i>

1155
00:50:48,245 --> 00:50:51,190
<i>that we were just kids and</i>

1156
00:50:51,214 --> 00:50:54,193
sets should be
an enjoyable place to be.

1157
00:50:54,217 --> 00:50:55,661
<i>Maybe he was a
little bit responsible</i>

1158
00:50:55,685 --> 00:50:57,163
<i>for all the boys' antics.</i>

1159
00:50:57,187 --> 00:50:59,098
I wouldn't be surprised.

1160
00:50:59,122 --> 00:50:59,867
<i>He was, you know,</i>

1161
00:50:59,891 --> 00:51:01,367
<i>really interested in meeting me.</i>

1162
00:51:01,391 --> 00:51:04,604
I was him. He was... he was
one of my idols.

1163
00:51:04,628 --> 00:51:07,740
<i>But there was always a running
joke that of all the kids,</i>

1164
00:51:07,764 --> 00:51:11,677
<i>I looked the least like my
counterpart,</i>

1165
00:51:11,701 --> 00:51:13,646
and he was quick to sort of
notice that as well.

1166
00:51:13,670 --> 00:51:15,448
So he pulled me aside and said,

1167
00:51:15,472 --> 00:51:17,483
"Hey, let's spend
some time together

1168
00:51:17,507 --> 00:51:19,585
<i>and think of some things
that we can do</i>

1169
00:51:19,609 --> 00:51:21,521
that will sort of
bridge that gap."

1170
00:51:21,545 --> 00:51:23,156
There's that reveal
where I'm standing there

1171
00:51:23,180 --> 00:51:25,358
<i>in the classroom
and then we cut to him</i>

1172
00:51:25,382 --> 00:51:27,193
<i>and he's biting
his nail as well.</i>

1173
00:51:27,217 --> 00:51:28,494
That was what we came up with.

1174
00:51:28,518 --> 00:51:30,830
<i>We tossed the
football around on set with him</i>

1175
00:51:30,854 --> 00:51:34,500
because he was open to coming in
and playing with the kids.

1176
00:51:34,524 --> 00:51:36,202
<i>And I still
remember him saying, you know,</i>

1177
00:51:36,226 --> 00:51:37,837
<i>when he was,
"Okay, okay, I've had enough,"</i>

1178
00:51:37,861 --> 00:51:40,239
and we're like "Oh come on,
just a couple more,"

1179
00:51:40,263 --> 00:51:41,208
he was like,
"When I had no hair on my balls,

1180
00:51:41,232 --> 00:51:44,143
I could throw the ball
for hours."

1181
00:51:44,167 --> 00:51:45,278
<i>Everybody had a Game Boy,</i>

1182
00:51:45,302 --> 00:51:47,613
so I was playing my Game Boy.
I was playing Tetris,

1183
00:51:47,637 --> 00:51:48,515
and he walked up to me
and he said,

1184
00:51:48,539 --> 00:51:51,484
"What is this?"
I said, "It's Tetris."

1185
00:51:51,508 --> 00:51:53,252
"Tetris?"
I said, "Yeah, Tetris.

1186
00:51:53,276 --> 00:51:54,720
<i>It's a game. Everybody knows Tetris.</i>

1187
00:51:54,744 --> 00:51:56,823
You live under a rock?"

1188
00:51:56,847 --> 00:51:58,825
He grabs it out of my hand
and he starts playing.

1189
00:51:58,849 --> 00:52:00,726
<i>And... and from then on
I realized,</i>

1190
00:52:00,750 --> 00:52:02,161
"Okay, well, he's cool.

1191
00:52:02,185 --> 00:52:03,429
He's not just John Ritter
the actor.

1192
00:52:03,453 --> 00:52:05,398
<i>He's John Ritter, my peer.</i>

1193
00:52:05,422 --> 00:52:07,491
And maybe if I'm lucky,
my buddy."

1194
00:52:10,861 --> 00:52:12,939
<i>I got a call to come in</i>

1195
00:52:12,963 --> 00:52:15,408
<i>and speak with the
directors for this mini-series.</i>

1196
00:52:15,432 --> 00:52:16,776
I had not read the book,

1197
00:52:16,800 --> 00:52:20,780
so of course I rushed out and
spent all night

1198
00:52:20,804 --> 00:52:23,483
and part of the day,
because Stephen King writes

1199
00:52:23,507 --> 00:52:25,442
so many long books.

1200
00:52:26,743 --> 00:52:28,287
<i>I took on the role
for two reasons.</i>

1201
00:52:28,311 --> 00:52:29,889
<i>One, it was a nice gig,</i>

1202
00:52:29,913 --> 00:52:32,792
and it was going to be
for a long time up in Vancouver.

1203
00:52:32,816 --> 00:52:35,194
The other reason was working
with some of these actors

1204
00:52:35,218 --> 00:52:37,763
<i>that I had admired,
worked with one or two of them,</i>

1205
00:52:37,787 --> 00:52:39,823
so that was really
the... the two main reasons.

1206
00:52:41,791 --> 00:52:43,669
<i>I brought this whole
photo album from home.</i>

1207
00:52:43,693 --> 00:52:46,439
-Marlon was really wonderful

1208
00:52:46,463 --> 00:52:50,743
and he did this little monologue
at the beginning of the audition

1209
00:52:50,767 --> 00:52:54,447
that was simple, deep, and
had a lot of thought in it.

1210
00:52:54,471 --> 00:52:56,816
<i>-There was an
Easter egg hunt here,</i>

1211
00:52:56,840 --> 00:52:59,819
<i>but the ironworks exploded
and all these people got killed.</i>

1212
00:52:59,843 --> 00:53:01,087
<i>The lines
that they had me reading</i>

1213
00:53:01,111 --> 00:53:05,458
were pretty much the lines from
the actual classroom scene.

1214
00:53:05,482 --> 00:53:07,693
<i>That role
was so hard to audition for.</i>

1215
00:53:07,717 --> 00:53:12,532
It has very little material
in the group scenes

1216
00:53:12,556 --> 00:53:15,401
and takes a lot of
negative language.

1217
00:53:15,425 --> 00:53:17,537
<i>When you're casting
and you're being a bully</i>

1218
00:53:17,561 --> 00:53:21,741
to all these kids. wow,
it takes a lot out of the day.

1219
00:53:21,765 --> 00:53:24,644
<i>Thank god, he looked physically</i>

1220
00:53:24,668 --> 00:53:26,612
<i>a lot like what I looked like
at his age.</i>

1221
00:53:26,636 --> 00:53:27,747
You know, you always wonder,
"Oh my god,

1222
00:53:27,771 --> 00:53:30,850
he'll get somebody here
who looks nothing like me."

1223
00:53:30,874 --> 00:53:32,351
You know, like they bring
a white guy to play me.

1224
00:53:32,375 --> 00:53:34,620
No, it didn't happen!

1225
00:53:34,644 --> 00:53:37,623
<i>Mike represents to
me a few souls that I have met</i>

1226
00:53:37,647 --> 00:53:39,258
<i>in my journey in life,</i>

1227
00:53:39,282 --> 00:53:42,028
<i>and they're people who,
for whatever reason,</i>

1228
00:53:42,052 --> 00:53:46,532
something happened in their
childhood or young adulthood

1229
00:53:46,556 --> 00:53:48,834
that has affected them
for the rest of their life.

1230
00:53:50,961 --> 00:53:52,972
<i>I knew of a few people like him,</i>

1231
00:53:52,996 --> 00:53:55,942
and some ended
in very tragic situations,

1232
00:53:55,966 --> 00:53:58,844
some fate just never seemed
to bless them

1233
00:53:58,868 --> 00:54:00,680
with a good hand, you know?

1234
00:54:00,704 --> 00:54:02,715
It's like always
throwing snake eyes.

1235
00:54:02,739 --> 00:54:04,417
<i>And I think Mike
was that kind of guy.</i>

1236
00:54:04,441 --> 00:54:06,285
<i>I think that all of them
had a sense of that,</i>

1237
00:54:06,309 --> 00:54:07,653
that they were on their way,

1238
00:54:07,677 --> 00:54:10,623
they were young people
full of life, full of wonder,

1239
00:54:10,647 --> 00:54:13,426
<i>and all of a sudden, this
horrible thing happened to them</i>

1240
00:54:13,450 --> 00:54:14,894
<i>for the rest of their life.</i>

1241
00:54:14,918 --> 00:54:18,998
They have been hiding
in psychological fear of life.

1242
00:54:19,022 --> 00:54:21,968
<i>And to me, Mike
is the center spoke</i>

1243
00:54:21,992 --> 00:54:23,393
<i>that brought it
all back together.</i>

1244
00:54:25,061 --> 00:54:26,539
<i>-Lucky seven.</i>

1245
00:54:26,563 --> 00:54:27,673
-That's how in the series

1246
00:54:27,697 --> 00:54:29,842
when they got a phone call
from him,

1247
00:54:29,866 --> 00:54:31,386
didn't take a whole lot
of explanation.

1248
00:54:32,769 --> 00:54:34,981
<i>- Yeah?
- This is Mike Hanlon, Bill.</i>

1249
00:54:35,005 --> 00:54:36,782
-Immediately
they know what this is about.

1250
00:54:36,806 --> 00:54:38,985
<i>-Bill, It's back.</i>

1251
00:54:39,009 --> 00:54:41,887
-Now they have to decide,
do they want to participate.

1252
00:54:41,911 --> 00:54:43,155
<i>On my honor I will do my best</i>

1253
00:54:43,179 --> 00:54:45,658
<i>to do my duty to God
and my country.</i>

1254
00:54:45,682 --> 00:54:47,360
<i>Stephen King's big secret</i>

1255
00:54:47,384 --> 00:54:50,396
is about the wonders and
horrors of childhood...

1256
00:54:50,420 --> 00:54:52,431
<i>Stanley boy.</i>

1257
00:54:53,623 --> 00:54:55,635
<i>And how you get through it</i>

1258
00:54:55,659 --> 00:54:57,770
<i>and how important friends are</i>

1259
00:54:57,794 --> 00:55:02,041
<i>and bonding with special
people, like-minded youngsters.</i>

1260
00:55:02,065 --> 00:55:05,611
Those bonds can be
as strong as steel

1261
00:55:05,635 --> 00:55:09,849
<i>and his story is a demonstration
of just how strong,</i>

1262
00:55:09,873 --> 00:55:11,584
<i>when they made a promise
to each other</i>

1263
00:55:11,608 --> 00:55:13,777
<i>to return if It came back.</i>

1264
00:55:15,078 --> 00:55:17,623
<i>-I swear it.</i>

1265
00:55:17,647 --> 00:55:19,425
<i>They were very solemn about it</i>

1266
00:55:19,449 --> 00:55:21,427
<i>and they meant it.</i>

1267
00:55:21,451 --> 00:55:24,964
And you see what happens when
they have to keep that promise,

1268
00:55:24,988 --> 00:55:26,899
<i>especially in the case of Stan,</i>

1269
00:55:26,923 --> 00:55:28,868
<i>who couldn't face
keeping the promise.</i>

1270
00:55:28,892 --> 00:55:32,672
<i>It was that horrible for
him, and so he didn't bother</i>

1271
00:55:32,696 --> 00:55:36,642
to go back. but he did
something else instead.

1272
00:55:36,666 --> 00:55:39,045
<i>-I think I'll take a bath.</i>

1273
00:55:39,069 --> 00:55:41,013
<i>Stan was
most affected by Pennywise</i>

1274
00:55:41,037 --> 00:55:43,783
<i>and I suspect that
even as an adult,</i>

1275
00:55:43,807 --> 00:55:47,119
that memory never was
very far from his mind.

1276
00:55:47,143 --> 00:55:51,857
<i>-Stan saw It face to face.</i>

1277
00:55:51,881 --> 00:55:53,659
<i>Not the clown,</i>

1278
00:55:53,683 --> 00:55:56,495
<i>but he saw
what was behind the clown.</i>

1279
00:55:56,519 --> 00:55:58,731
-When he got the call
from Mike Hanlon...

1280
00:55:58,755 --> 00:55:59,732
<i>-Who did you say?</i>

1281
00:55:59,756 --> 00:56:01,067
<i>Mike Hanlon.</i>

1282
00:56:01,091 --> 00:56:02,134
<i>To come back to Derry,</i>

1283
00:56:02,158 --> 00:56:04,570
<i>it brought back
so much trauma to him</i>

1284
00:56:04,594 --> 00:56:07,139
<i>that he just couldn't
go on anymore.</i>

1285
00:56:07,163 --> 00:56:12,445
He couldn't even fathom the idea
of possibly facing It again.

1286
00:56:12,469 --> 00:56:13,679
<i>-Goodbye.</i>

1287
00:56:13,703 --> 00:56:15,781
<i>Bye, Stan.</i>

1288
00:56:15,805 --> 00:56:17,974
-And he chose an easy way out.

1289
00:56:26,583 --> 00:56:27,693
-For somebody like me who
grew up in the '70s,

1290
00:56:27,717 --> 00:56:29,795
It's a Who's Who.

1291
00:56:29,819 --> 00:56:33,432
<i>Richard Masur, who I'd literally
grown up watching.</i>

1292
00:56:33,456 --> 00:56:36,001
<i>He was the classic
character actor.</i>

1293
00:56:36,025 --> 00:56:38,437
So him coming in, even though
it was just for a day

1294
00:56:38,461 --> 00:56:40,873
and he had a small part in IT,
I was like, "Wow."

1295
00:56:40,897 --> 00:56:42,842
<i>I got a call from Jim Green</i>

1296
00:56:42,866 --> 00:56:46,512
and he told me they were doing
this miniseries.

1297
00:56:46,536 --> 00:56:50,649
-We talked about what we could
do to tie the character together

1298
00:56:50,673 --> 00:56:52,885
<i>between the adult and the child.</i>

1299
00:56:52,909 --> 00:56:55,020
<i>He asked what I thought
we should do.</i>

1300
00:56:55,044 --> 00:56:56,255
And for whatever reason,

1301
00:56:56,279 --> 00:56:59,225
<i>I immediately thought
of this thing where I was gonna</i>

1302
00:56:59,249 --> 00:57:01,694
<i>grab my ear, and he liked it.</i>

1303
00:57:01,718 --> 00:57:04,096
I remember just thinking,
"I have no idea what I'm doing

1304
00:57:04,120 --> 00:57:07,800
<i>and this well-respected actor
just said he likes my idea."</i>

1305
00:57:07,824 --> 00:57:10,569
I was like, you know,
over the moon about it.

1306
00:57:10,593 --> 00:57:12,838
<i>My favorite
part of the time I was there</i>

1307
00:57:12,862 --> 00:57:14,974
<i>was when we set
up that beauty shot</i>

1308
00:57:14,998 --> 00:57:16,976
<i>of all of us on the staircase.</i>

1309
00:57:17,000 --> 00:57:19,044
I thought that was
a wonderful shot.

1310
00:57:19,068 --> 00:57:21,847
<i>It was a lot of people
who were really well known</i>

1311
00:57:21,871 --> 00:57:24,784
at that time
all standing up there.

1312
00:57:24,808 --> 00:57:27,153
<i>To me, Stan Uris was an outsider</i>

1313
00:57:27,177 --> 00:57:28,921
<i>like the rest
of the Losers Club.</i>

1314
00:57:28,945 --> 00:57:30,689
He was very by the book

1315
00:57:30,713 --> 00:57:33,526
<i>in that he didn't deviate
from his school lessons</i>

1316
00:57:33,550 --> 00:57:35,928
or what his parents
may have told him,

1317
00:57:35,952 --> 00:57:38,564
<i>but he was able to connect
with these kids...</i>

1318
00:57:38,588 --> 00:57:40,599
<i>Lucky seven, Stanny.</i>

1319
00:57:40,623 --> 00:57:41,600
<i>-I said I was in.</i>

1320
00:57:41,624 --> 00:57:45,638
-and then explore
a different part of himself.

1321
00:57:45,662 --> 00:57:47,106
<i>One of the last casts</i>

1322
00:57:47,130 --> 00:57:48,274
<i>was a little kid named Adam.</i>

1323
00:57:48,298 --> 00:57:50,009
<i>-Some guy killed George.</i>

1324
00:57:50,033 --> 00:57:51,110
<i>Pulled one of his arms
right off,</i>

1325
00:57:51,134 --> 00:57:52,878
<i>just like a wing off a fly.</i>

1326
00:57:52,902 --> 00:57:55,815
-He was smaller
than most of the other kids

1327
00:57:55,839 --> 00:57:58,884
<i>and they were worried about the
size match-up and everything.</i>

1328
00:57:58,908 --> 00:58:01,086
-My character Eddie Kaspbrak,

1329
00:58:01,110 --> 00:58:04,990
I would say that he was kind of
the runt of the bunch...

1330
00:58:05,014 --> 00:58:06,294
<i>-How you doin', Eddie Spaghetti?</i>

1331
00:58:07,151 --> 00:58:09,795
-which was
already a fairly runty bunch.

1332
00:58:09,819 --> 00:58:10,930
<i>He was the quiet, shy kid</i>

1333
00:58:10,954 --> 00:58:12,698
<i>who was also the youngest
of the bunch,</i>

1334
00:58:12,722 --> 00:58:14,834
which I believe was true
in reality.

1335
00:58:14,858 --> 00:58:17,603
<i>I think I was the only one
who wasn't a teenager yet.</i>

1336
00:58:17,627 --> 00:58:20,840
<i>I was still 12 and I think
everyone else was 13 or above.</i>

1337
00:58:20,864 --> 00:58:22,041
<i>I went
in and met with the producers</i>

1338
00:58:22,065 --> 00:58:23,943
<i>and we talked with Tommy Lee</i>

1339
00:58:23,967 --> 00:58:25,678
<i>and I guess</i> they
got the feeling from

1340
00:58:25,702 --> 00:58:27,079
<i>the work of mine
that they had seen</i>

1341
00:58:27,103 --> 00:58:29,148
<i>that I was right to play Eddie.</i>

1342
00:58:29,172 --> 00:58:32,084
And of course, after that,
I devoured the book

1343
00:58:32,108 --> 00:58:34,153
<i>and was wondering
how in the hell</i>

1344
00:58:34,177 --> 00:58:37,957
they were going to fit
all of this beautiful writing

1345
00:58:37,981 --> 00:58:40,025
<i>and all of these amazing
background stories</i>

1346
00:58:40,049 --> 00:58:44,296
of these characters into
two nights of television.

1347
00:58:44,320 --> 00:58:46,699
<i>On the last mix and match,</i>

1348
00:58:46,723 --> 00:58:48,701
<i>Seth Green wasn't going
to be able to make it.</i>

1349
00:58:48,725 --> 00:58:51,203
And Victoria was like,
"Oh, my god,

1350
00:58:51,227 --> 00:58:52,738
<i>we have to get him here."</i>

1351
00:58:52,762 --> 00:58:54,874
<i>Everybody was confirmed
except Seth,</i>

1352
00:58:54,898 --> 00:58:56,842
and we were a little nervous
about that.

1353
00:58:56,866 --> 00:59:00,813
So I actually drove to his house
and picked him up.

1354
00:59:00,837 --> 00:59:02,114
<i>It was exciting to know</i>

1355
00:59:02,138 --> 00:59:04,116
<i>that I was getting close to it.</i>

1356
00:59:04,140 --> 00:59:07,686
When you audition,
you mostly don't get jobs.

1357
00:59:07,710 --> 00:59:10,155
<i>You... you don't get 90 percent
of the things you audition for,</i>

1358
00:59:10,179 --> 00:59:12,791
so to even get a callback
and be in the chemistry

1359
00:59:12,815 --> 00:59:14,793
part of it, I was very excited.

1360
00:59:14,817 --> 00:59:17,263
<i>Seth
was full of piss and vinegar.</i>

1361
00:59:17,287 --> 00:59:21,300
A great kid, clever and
cracking jokes all the time.

1362
00:59:21,324 --> 00:59:23,736
<i>I was a very curious kid,</i>

1363
00:59:23,760 --> 00:59:26,272
and then I was also interested
in filmmaking very young.

1364
00:59:26,296 --> 00:59:28,841
<i>Seth was the most precocious,</i>

1365
00:59:28,865 --> 00:59:31,911
<i>but he had this intelligence
about him and he would say,</i>

1366
00:59:31,935 --> 00:59:33,779
"I'm going to be a filmmaker
one day."

1367
00:59:33,803 --> 00:59:35,981
<i>Part of what they liked about me</i>

1368
00:59:36,005 --> 00:59:38,083
<i>was me doing voices.</i>

1369
00:59:38,107 --> 00:59:39,952
<i>-Your voices
all sound the same, Richie.</i>

1370
00:59:39,976 --> 00:59:41,153
<i>-Thanks a bunch, professor.</i>

1371
00:59:41,177 --> 00:59:42,288
-or impressions.

1372
00:59:42,312 --> 00:59:44,757
<i>-By George, Martha,
it's the river Nile.</i>

1373
00:59:44,781 --> 00:59:47,192
-.or being
fast-witted or funny.

1374
00:59:47,216 --> 00:59:50,095
<i>-Well, hey.
Larry, Curly, and Mo.</i>

1375
00:59:50,119 --> 00:59:51,397
<i>-Beep-beep, Richie.</i>

1376
00:59:51,421 --> 00:59:53,222
-That was the thing
that got me that part.

1377
00:59:55,191 --> 00:59:58,270
<i>Richie, to me,
always seemed both fearless</i>

1378
00:59:58,294 --> 00:59:59,896
<i>and also terrified.</i>

1379
01:00:01,097 --> 01:00:03,309
<i>Tozier!</i>

1380
01:00:03,333 --> 01:00:05,277
-He was willing
to keep going forward

1381
01:00:05,301 --> 01:00:06,679
even though he was scared.

1382
01:00:06,703 --> 01:00:08,247
<i>Richie!</i>

1383
01:00:08,271 --> 01:00:10,683
- but he was the first guy
to make a joke about it.

1384
01:00:14,677 --> 01:00:15,988
<i>And then Harry Anderson,</i>

1385
01:00:16,012 --> 01:00:19,191
whom I didn't know,
we had an instant rapport.

1386
01:00:21,784 --> 01:00:22,795
<i>Harry and I chatted a lot.</i>

1387
01:00:22,819 --> 01:00:25,297
And I'd watched him
on Cheers and Night Court.

1388
01:00:25,321 --> 01:00:27,066
<i>I'd seen him do stand-up
and magic.</i>

1389
01:00:27,090 --> 01:00:28,930
<i>This is one you probably know.</i>

1390
01:00:33,730 --> 01:00:37,710
-So, I was into that guy and
excited to get to play him.

1391
01:00:37,734 --> 01:00:39,345
<i>Directing kids,</i>

1392
01:00:39,369 --> 01:00:41,180
<i>in general, is challenging.</i>

1393
01:00:41,204 --> 01:00:44,450
<i>And he takes a powder and jumps.
Boom!</i>

1394
01:00:44,474 --> 01:00:49,088
<i>Jumps right over you and
suddenly you guys see him go,</i>

1395
01:00:49,112 --> 01:00:51,123
<i>and that'll be the end
of this first piece.</i>

1396
01:00:51,147 --> 01:00:54,126
<i>And directing seven,
sometimes ten,</i>

1397
01:00:54,150 --> 01:00:57,229
12 kids all in one scene...

1398
01:00:59,822 --> 01:01:01,467
<i>Don't go way over there.</i>

1399
01:01:01,491 --> 01:01:03,769
Is hugely challenging

1400
01:01:03,793 --> 01:01:05,137
because they have
so much energy.

1401
01:01:05,161 --> 01:01:06,138
<i>-Whoa!</i>

1402
01:01:06,162 --> 01:01:09,308
-I think Seth was more or
less the ringleader.

1403
01:01:09,332 --> 01:01:10,276
<i>We got in a lot of trouble.</i>

1404
01:01:10,300 --> 01:01:11,443
<i>-Let's get out of here!</i>

1405
01:01:11,467 --> 01:01:14,313
-We were kids.
Both on set and off.

1406
01:01:16,205 --> 01:01:17,249
<i>But I think
us getting in trouble together</i>

1407
01:01:17,273 --> 01:01:19,184
also made us a lot closer.

1408
01:01:19,208 --> 01:01:20,986
<i>-Yeah.</i>

1409
01:01:21,010 --> 01:01:23,422
-We also had our little spats,
like we got tired of each other.

1410
01:01:23,446 --> 01:01:26,425
<i>Jonathan Brandis and I
often took out our stresses</i>

1411
01:01:26,449 --> 01:01:29,895
by bagging on each other
pretty intensely, actually.

1412
01:01:29,919 --> 01:01:32,331
<i>But at the end of the day,
we were all pretty close.</i>

1413
01:01:32,355 --> 01:01:35,200
-If it were filmed now with
that same group of kids,

1414
01:01:35,224 --> 01:01:37,503
<i>there would be a lot of them
who had diagnoses.</i>

1415
01:01:37,527 --> 01:01:41,373
<i>Maybe ADHD,
oppositional defiance.</i>

1416
01:01:41,397 --> 01:01:43,509
Some of them just
would not shut up.

1417
01:01:43,533 --> 01:01:44,977
<i>We were
dropping water balloons off</i>

1418
01:01:45,001 --> 01:01:48,047
of our balcony onto
people's convertibles.

1419
01:01:48,071 --> 01:01:50,282
<i>I think one time we managed
to do it with Kool-aid</i>

1420
01:01:50,306 --> 01:01:52,885
and the person was fairly upset.

1421
01:01:52,909 --> 01:01:55,154
<i>The police came and told us it
wasn't a good idea to do that,</i>

1422
01:01:55,178 --> 01:01:57,389
<i>especially since
we weren't citizens.</i>

1423
01:01:57,413 --> 01:01:59,324
We thought we were
going to get deported.

1424
01:01:59,348 --> 01:02:02,995
-I honestly did
not get a lot of their jokes.

1425
01:02:03,019 --> 01:02:06,265
<i>All the other boys had read
the book, and in the book,</i>

1426
01:02:06,289 --> 01:02:10,069
<i>the kids all have sex with Bev.</i>

1427
01:02:10,093 --> 01:02:12,204
The boys knew this,
but I didn't know,

1428
01:02:12,228 --> 01:02:15,174
and so they kept making
references to this fact

1429
01:02:15,198 --> 01:02:16,475
<i>and they were just going
above my head.</i>

1430
01:02:16,499 --> 01:02:17,509
<i>So finally, my mom said,</i>

1431
01:02:17,533 --> 01:02:19,211
<i>"Why don't you
just read the book?"</i>

1432
01:02:19,235 --> 01:02:22,381
And so I read it
and I was kind of horrified

1433
01:02:22,405 --> 01:02:25,517
but in a way it was
kind of liberating too.

1434
01:02:25,541 --> 01:02:28,287
Because when I was 13, you know,
you're going through puberty

1435
01:02:28,311 --> 01:02:30,222
and your things
are changing and stuff.

1436
01:02:30,246 --> 01:02:32,958
<i>So it was just this
very sort of odd entry</i>

1437
01:02:32,982 --> 01:02:35,060
into adolescence for me.

1438
01:02:35,084 --> 01:02:36,929
<i>There were scenes that I</i>

1439
01:02:36,953 --> 01:02:38,330
<i>never thought twice about,</i>

1440
01:02:38,354 --> 01:02:41,100
meaning the orgy scene
with the kids with Bev.

1441
01:02:41,124 --> 01:02:43,235
<i>Pennywise and It are the things</i>

1442
01:02:43,259 --> 01:02:46,371
<i>that drive the
losers to, in the novel,</i>

1443
01:02:46,395 --> 01:02:52,277
have this very,
very obscure and weird orgy

1444
01:02:52,301 --> 01:02:54,179
in the middle of the narrative

1445
01:02:54,203 --> 01:02:55,905
where they're all
having sex with Beverly.

1446
01:02:57,106 --> 01:03:00,986
<i>It's to ward off It,
to keep It at bay,</i>

1447
01:03:01,010 --> 01:03:03,889
<i>because childhood
is what It loves.</i>

1448
01:03:03,913 --> 01:03:08,093
<i>I am an eater
of worlds and of children.</i>

1449
01:03:08,117 --> 01:03:10,262
-And if you want to push away
from the thing

1450
01:03:10,286 --> 01:03:13,432
that's scary to you,
you push into the thing

1451
01:03:13,456 --> 01:03:16,235
that it can't feed on,
and you do that through sex.

1452
01:03:16,259 --> 01:03:18,203
<i>I just thought it was one of</i>

1453
01:03:18,227 --> 01:03:21,607
<i>Steve's digressions
down a lane that didn't work.</i>

1454
01:03:21,631 --> 01:03:22,574
<i>I remember the guy</i>

1455
01:03:22,598 --> 01:03:23,409
<i>who played Officer Nell.</i>

1456
01:03:23,433 --> 01:03:26,011
He completely lost
his shit one day.

1457
01:03:26,035 --> 01:03:27,379
<i>There's a scene where we're all</i>

1458
01:03:27,403 --> 01:03:29,148
<i>in the Barrens,
building the dam.</i>

1459
01:03:29,172 --> 01:03:30,516
The policeman comes along
and says,

1460
01:03:30,540 --> 01:03:32,284
<i>"Hey, what are you kids
doing down there?"</i>

1461
01:03:32,308 --> 01:03:36,088
<i>and one of the kids
said, "Masturbating."</i>

1462
01:03:36,112 --> 01:03:38,090
We all started laughing
and then also it carried on.

1463
01:03:38,114 --> 01:03:39,424
We couldn't get the next

1464
01:03:39,448 --> 01:03:41,293
like three or four takes.

1465
01:03:41,317 --> 01:03:43,195
<i>We weren't focusing</i>

1466
01:03:43,219 --> 01:03:47,065
and I remember getting the "this
isn't professional" lecture.

1467
01:03:47,089 --> 01:03:49,935
<i>There were
times that Jim pulled them aside</i>

1468
01:03:49,959 --> 01:03:51,970
<i>and gave them the lecture.</i>

1469
01:03:51,994 --> 01:03:56,074
And I sometimes would sort of
lose it a little bit on set

1470
01:03:56,098 --> 01:03:58,010
and say,
"Look, you're actors here.

1471
01:03:58,034 --> 01:04:01,113
I know you're having fun.
I love you're having fun.

1472
01:04:01,137 --> 01:04:03,148
You have to do your job."

1473
01:04:03,172 --> 01:04:05,651
<i>Our director
came to me and he said,</i>

1474
01:04:05,675 --> 01:04:08,020
"Jim, I'm losing it
with these kids."

1475
01:04:08,044 --> 01:04:10,656
<i>So I said, "I need a meeting
with the kids</i>

1476
01:04:10,680 --> 01:04:12,457
<i>before we break for lunch</i>

1477
01:04:12,481 --> 01:04:15,093
<i>and I don't want
their parents there."</i>

1478
01:04:15,117 --> 01:04:19,064
They rallied around and I said,
"You are making a picture.

1479
01:04:19,088 --> 01:04:21,934
<i>If you came here because
you want to be an actor,</i>

1480
01:04:21,958 --> 01:04:24,603
then I can tell you right now
whatever you're doing on the set

1481
01:04:24,627 --> 01:04:27,072
will reflect on whether
you work again.

1482
01:04:27,096 --> 01:04:30,275
I do recommend that you pay
attention to your director.

1483
01:04:30,299 --> 01:04:32,110
<i>Shape up, guys."</i>

1484
01:04:32,134 --> 01:04:33,679
And walked away.

1485
01:04:33,703 --> 01:04:37,549
<i>The adults were...</i>

1486
01:04:37,573 --> 01:04:39,051
When they got the...
All the adults together,

1487
01:04:39,075 --> 01:04:40,152
'cause some of them
knew each other

1488
01:04:40,176 --> 01:04:41,353
and they were all buddies,

1489
01:04:41,377 --> 01:04:43,155
<i>they were actually more noisy
than the kids.</i>

1490
01:04:43,179 --> 01:04:45,424
-We used to try
to make each other throw up,

1491
01:04:45,448 --> 01:04:48,260
okay, by being as gross
as we possibly could, right,

1492
01:04:48,284 --> 01:04:50,062
to make the other person gag.

1493
01:04:50,086 --> 01:04:52,164
<i>We're adults, you know, sort of.</i>

1494
01:04:52,188 --> 01:04:55,234
It just got louder
and louder and louder

1495
01:04:55,258 --> 01:04:57,569
until the assistant director
finally came in and said,

1496
01:04:57,593 --> 01:04:59,171
"You guys have to leave.

1497
01:04:59,195 --> 01:05:01,240
You have to go outside
on the street.

1498
01:05:01,264 --> 01:05:03,508
You can't be in here because
we can't get any work done."

1499
01:05:19,448 --> 01:05:21,526
-I want to make sure
you remember my name.

1500
01:05:21,550 --> 01:05:23,119
-Oh god, Henry Bowers.

1501
01:05:28,057 --> 01:05:29,101
<i>My agent called and said,</i>

1502
01:05:29,125 --> 01:05:30,636
<i>"Guess what?
We've got an audition for you,"</i>

1503
01:05:30,660 --> 01:05:31,437
<i>and I said,
"Oh really, for what?"</i>

1504
01:05:31,461 --> 01:05:32,704
<i>She said, "Stephen King's IT."</i>

1505
01:05:32,728 --> 01:05:33,972
She said,
"It's a big production,

1506
01:05:33,996 --> 01:05:36,341
it's a miniseries,
it's incredible."

1507
01:05:36,365 --> 01:05:40,245
She said, "Please work your ass
off for this audition."

1508
01:05:40,269 --> 01:05:41,989
<i>'Cause, she said,
"It's once in a lifetime."</i>

1509
01:05:43,105 --> 01:05:44,316
<i>I knew.</i>

1510
01:05:44,340 --> 01:05:46,251
Hundreds of kids
had probably gone in there.

1511
01:05:46,275 --> 01:05:49,988
Big guys <i>were gonna go in
there and be the traditional bully...</i>

1512
01:05:50,012 --> 01:05:50,757
<i>Which I don't find
very threatening,</i>

1513
01:05:50,781 --> 01:05:51,890
<i>to be honest with you.</i>

1514
01:05:51,914 --> 01:05:53,258
<i>And so I thought, okay, who can I channel?</i>

1515
01:05:53,282 --> 01:05:57,029
<i>I always refer to Dennis Hopper
because he's a very small man,</i>

1516
01:05:57,053 --> 01:06:00,632
<i>but he conveys an
intensity that's menacing.</i>

1517
01:06:00,656 --> 01:06:02,734
<i>Jarred was an exceptional actor.</i>

1518
01:06:02,758 --> 01:06:04,269
You're dead, fat boy.

1519
01:06:04,293 --> 01:06:06,138
<i>For someone who was his age.</i>

1520
01:06:06,162 --> 01:06:09,107
<i>The level of commitment
that he had was frightening.</i>

1521
01:06:09,131 --> 01:06:10,142
<i>I went in for the audition</i>

1522
01:06:10,166 --> 01:06:11,443
and the casting director
grabbed me and he said,

1523
01:06:11,467 --> 01:06:12,744
<i>"I've got to get you
to the producers right away."</i>

1524
01:06:12,768 --> 01:06:15,047
<i>He said, "You're exactly
what they're looking for.'"</i>

1525
01:06:15,071 --> 01:06:16,181
And I said "Me?"

1526
01:06:16,205 --> 01:06:18,383
<i>And again, here I was,
this scrawny kid,</i>

1527
01:06:18,407 --> 01:06:21,086
and I was being
plucked out of that group.

1528
01:06:21,110 --> 01:06:23,088
<i>He just had...
Something about that guy,</i>

1529
01:06:23,112 --> 01:06:27,059
he had some sort of
menacing appeal about him.

1530
01:06:27,083 --> 01:06:29,061
Ta-ta, girls.

1531
01:06:29,085 --> 01:06:31,563
-I could be wrong, but I believe
I auditioned for it three times,

1532
01:06:31,587 --> 01:06:35,167
and the first one
was for Henry Bowers

1533
01:06:35,191 --> 01:06:38,437
<i>and I wanted that part
very badly.</i>

1534
01:06:38,461 --> 01:06:40,372
-I want you to think
about that before you die.

1535
01:06:40,396 --> 01:06:41,373
<i>As we know,</i>

1536
01:06:41,397 --> 01:06:43,175
<i>Jarred Blancard
got Henry Bowers.</i>

1537
01:06:43,199 --> 01:06:45,043
<i>And what character
I played on IT</i>

1538
01:06:45,067 --> 01:06:46,411
is actually
a little contentious,

1539
01:06:46,435 --> 01:06:49,114
because in the script
I was Patrick,

1540
01:06:49,138 --> 01:06:51,416
and I notice that IMDb,

1541
01:06:51,440 --> 01:06:55,554
<i>and depending where you
look online I played Victor,</i>

1542
01:06:55,578 --> 01:06:56,655
<i>which always confused me</i>

1543
01:06:56,679 --> 01:06:58,323
when the fans were like,

1544
01:06:58,347 --> 01:07:00,459
"Hey, we loved you playing
Victor in Stephen King's IT,"

1545
01:07:00,483 --> 01:07:01,693
and I was like,
"You mean Patrick,"

1546
01:07:01,717 --> 01:07:02,562
and they'd be like,
"No, Victor,"

1547
01:07:02,586 --> 01:07:04,086
and I'm like,
"No, it was Patrick."

1548
01:07:06,222 --> 01:07:07,332
<i>The very first thing that I did</i>

1549
01:07:07,356 --> 01:07:09,634
was another iconic film called<i>
NeverEnding Story</i>

1550
01:07:09,658 --> 01:07:11,761
<i>where, ironically,
I played a bully.</i>

1551
01:07:13,829 --> 01:07:15,807
<i>I managed to get typecast
in kind of that bully role...</i>

1552
01:07:15,831 --> 01:07:17,142
<i>Not because I was big,</i>

1553
01:07:17,166 --> 01:07:19,478
<i>just because I was intense
and could beat people up.</i>

1554
01:07:19,502 --> 01:07:21,179
Let me show you.

1555
01:07:21,203 --> 01:07:23,205
<i>And I could really
burp on command.</i>

1556
01:07:24,840 --> 01:07:26,575
-Without throwing up,
as well, I might add.

1557
01:07:28,577 --> 01:07:29,721
<i>In the book, it's-it's obvious</i>

1558
01:07:29,745 --> 01:07:31,356
<i>that Henry is badly...</i>

1559
01:07:31,380 --> 01:07:33,859
<i>I mean, abuse doesn't
begin to cover</i>

1560
01:07:33,883 --> 01:07:35,527
<i>what he suffers
at the hands of his father</i>

1561
01:07:35,551 --> 01:07:37,562
<i>and he has this true fear
of his father.</i>

1562
01:07:37,586 --> 01:07:38,597
<i>I'm not a method actor</i>

1563
01:07:38,621 --> 01:07:41,400
<i>but I did keep that
a bit in mind</i>

1564
01:07:41,424 --> 01:07:44,369
<i>when I was attempting to
torture and ultimately kill</i>

1565
01:07:44,393 --> 01:07:46,138
these poor children, right?

1566
01:07:46,162 --> 01:07:49,374
<i>He needed to transfer
those feelings of helplessness.</i>

1567
01:07:49,398 --> 01:07:51,676
<i>He wanted to impose
that same fear on other people</i>

1568
01:07:51,700 --> 01:07:53,478
that he suffered
when he went home at night.

1569
01:07:53,502 --> 01:07:54,679
<i>There's one scene in the film,</i>

1570
01:07:54,703 --> 01:07:57,716
<i>it's the only scene
where my character is vulnerable</i>

1571
01:07:57,740 --> 01:07:58,784
and that's in the classroom

1572
01:07:58,808 --> 01:07:59,818
<i>and that's when
he's being threatened</i>

1573
01:07:59,842 --> 01:08:02,454
<i>to be kicked out
after a disturbance.</i>

1574
01:08:02,478 --> 01:08:03,755
There's a crack in my voice
when he says,

1575
01:08:03,779 --> 01:08:06,124
<i>"But my father
will tan my hide."</i>

1576
01:08:06,148 --> 01:08:08,493
<i>and that sort of
typifies the fear</i>

1577
01:08:08,517 --> 01:08:11,163
<i>that he has of-of his father.</i>

1578
01:08:11,187 --> 01:08:12,731
I actually get emotional
about this because

1579
01:08:12,755 --> 01:08:13,755
<i>my dad's passed.</i>

1580
01:08:15,257 --> 01:08:17,869
<i>He, uh, wasn't
supportive at all.</i>

1581
01:08:17,893 --> 01:08:19,237
<i>He never went to
any of my plays,</i>

1582
01:08:19,261 --> 01:08:22,307
<i>he sort of scoffed at all of
my dreams and aspirations.</i>

1583
01:08:22,331 --> 01:08:23,909
But I remember
that he came home from work

1584
01:08:23,933 --> 01:08:26,711
and I said, "Dad, I got it!"

1585
01:08:26,735 --> 01:08:30,715
and his shock and the pride
and the sadness

1586
01:08:30,739 --> 01:08:33,218
that he hadn't embraced
this dream earlier.

1587
01:08:33,242 --> 01:08:35,821
<i>And from that point on, though,
it was nothing but-but pride</i>

1588
01:08:35,845 --> 01:08:37,456
and-and-and
it was a wonderful thing.

1589
01:08:37,480 --> 01:08:39,825
I apologize
for getting emotional.

1590
01:08:39,849 --> 01:08:42,727
<i>I wanted to be as
sensitive off camera</i>

1591
01:08:42,751 --> 01:08:44,162
<i>as I possibly could.</i>

1592
01:08:44,186 --> 01:08:47,232
<i>Yelling these racial slurs and
these obscenities, you know,</i>

1593
01:08:47,256 --> 01:08:49,701
<i>calling him, you know, fat boy
and all of that kind of thing,</i>

1594
01:08:49,725 --> 01:08:52,604
<i>I wanted to make sure
after the take that</i>

1595
01:08:52,628 --> 01:08:54,573
he knew that
that's not the way I felt.

1596
01:08:54,597 --> 01:08:56,875
Or what, boy? Or what?

1597
01:08:56,899 --> 01:08:58,009
<i>You know, he always told me</i>

1598
01:08:58,033 --> 01:08:59,111
<i>how uncomfortable he was
with having to say</i>

1599
01:08:59,135 --> 01:09:01,680
<i>some of the things
he had to say to me,</i>

1600
01:09:01,704 --> 01:09:04,416
which was great.

1601
01:09:04,440 --> 01:09:05,650
'Cause it was
some harsh words, man!

1602
01:09:05,674 --> 01:09:07,419
It was some harsh words said.

1603
01:09:07,443 --> 01:09:08,653
<i>I'd always apologize afterwards.</i>

1604
01:09:08,677 --> 01:09:10,388
<i>And the Americans were quite</i>

1605
01:09:10,412 --> 01:09:12,624
astounded by that; they thought,
"Well, you're playing a part."

1606
01:09:12,648 --> 01:09:14,860
<i>There's a
scene where I get confronted</i>

1607
01:09:14,884 --> 01:09:17,496
by Henry Bowers,
where he's supposed to carve

1608
01:09:17,520 --> 01:09:19,498
<i>the "H" in my belly.</i>

1609
01:09:19,522 --> 01:09:21,566
Hey look, it's the fat boy.

1610
01:09:21,590 --> 01:09:23,368
Top of the day, fat boy!

1611
01:09:23,392 --> 01:09:27,906
-And it was probably the scene
that I feared the most.

1612
01:09:36,605 --> 01:09:37,550
<i>I thought for a moment</i>

1613
01:09:37,574 --> 01:09:40,218
<i>that he could very well lose it</i>

1614
01:09:40,242 --> 01:09:41,653
and go ahead and just, you know,

1615
01:09:41,677 --> 01:09:43,922
start the artwork on my stomach
right then and there.

1616
01:09:43,946 --> 01:09:45,423
- Come on.
Don't really cut him.

1617
01:09:45,447 --> 01:09:47,459
Cut him? Huh?

1618
01:09:47,483 --> 01:09:48,727
Cut him?

1619
01:09:48,751 --> 01:09:51,663
<i>He made
it very easy to be afraid.</i>

1620
01:09:51,687 --> 01:09:53,665
But I remember
that being probably

1621
01:09:53,689 --> 01:09:56,859
the most difficult scene
for me to film.

1622
01:09:58,894 --> 01:10:00,472
<i>The only
source of disappointment for me</i>

1623
01:10:00,496 --> 01:10:02,874
was the fact
that we couldn't go as raw

1624
01:10:02,898 --> 01:10:05,877
and as bold
as they did in the book.

1625
01:10:05,901 --> 01:10:07,746
<i>The violence
is something that I just...</i>

1626
01:10:07,770 --> 01:10:09,414
<i>I wanted to go further with it.</i>

1627
01:10:09,438 --> 01:10:10,715
I just felt it would have been
more effective

1628
01:10:10,739 --> 01:10:12,284
if we were able to do that,

1629
01:10:12,308 --> 01:10:14,452
knowing fully well
that we weren't able to.

1630
01:10:14,476 --> 01:10:16,588
Henry Bowers.

1631
01:10:16,612 --> 01:10:20,559
<i>There were
two adults that were cast later</i>

1632
01:10:20,583 --> 01:10:22,827
and Green/Epstein
were very sweet

1633
01:10:22,851 --> 01:10:27,432
<i>about allowing us to look at
so me people that were friends.</i>

1634
01:10:27,456 --> 01:10:31,036
-Henry. Hen.

1635
01:10:31,060 --> 01:10:33,872
This is scaring me already!

1636
01:10:33,896 --> 01:10:37,042
<i>It
Needed a special</i> quality person.

1637
01:10:37,066 --> 01:10:41,746
<i>And in this case,
he was being cast after the boy</i>

1638
01:10:41,770 --> 01:10:45,350
<i>who played Henry Bowers, who
was also a very special person</i>

1639
01:10:45,374 --> 01:10:47,819
<i>and</i> had a strangeness about him.

1640
01:10:47,843 --> 01:10:52,457
-I tell you, people will
always remember Henry Bowers.

1641
01:10:52,481 --> 01:10:54,526
<i>Michael Cole, he was from a show</i>

1642
01:10:54,550 --> 01:10:56,695
<i>called Mod Squad
that I grew up on.</i>

1643
01:10:56,719 --> 01:10:59,397
<i>He wasn't traditionally a badass</i>

1644
01:10:59,421 --> 01:11:02,500
<i>but he just showed that side
and so he was just kind of</i>

1645
01:11:02,524 --> 01:11:04,736
one of these little gem finds,

1646
01:11:04,760 --> 01:11:07,706
<i>somebody that had some gravitas.</i>

1647
01:11:07,730 --> 01:11:10,909
-After all those years,
Michael had attained

1648
01:11:10,933 --> 01:11:14,813
<i>a patina of strangeness,
which some of us do.</i>

1649
01:11:14,837 --> 01:11:16,881
And so when he came in
to talk about it,

1650
01:11:16,905 --> 01:11:20,952
I felt very positive
right there and then

1651
01:11:20,976 --> 01:11:23,021
that he could pull
that roll off as.

1652
01:11:23,045 --> 01:11:25,790
, okay, that strange little boy

1653
01:11:25,814 --> 01:11:27,659
<i>grew up to be this strange man.</i>

1654
01:11:27,683 --> 01:11:29,394
I'll pay you back,

1655
01:11:29,418 --> 01:11:31,096
I'll pay you all back!

1656
01:11:31,120 --> 01:11:33,632
-Not many casting
directors will do this.

1657
01:11:33,656 --> 01:11:36,568
<i>I got down on the
floor crawling around,</i>

1658
01:11:36,592 --> 01:11:41,606
<i>and I was so shook up and sweat
was starting to run down,</i>

1659
01:11:41,630 --> 01:11:47,445
and Victoria got down
on the floor with me,

1660
01:11:47,469 --> 01:11:50,115
<i>sliding sheets of paper
in front of me</i>

1661
01:11:50,139 --> 01:11:53,518
<i>so I could get the cue.</i>

1662
01:11:53,542 --> 01:11:56,021
Boy, what a champion.

1663
01:11:56,045 --> 01:11:57,088
<i>I met Michael Cole</i>

1664
01:11:57,112 --> 01:11:58,156
<i>and he was perfectly polite</i>

1665
01:11:58,180 --> 01:12:01,660
<i>but not very effusive
or -or friendly,</i>

1666
01:12:01,684 --> 01:12:04,596
and I-I actually backed out
of his trailer and I thought,

1667
01:12:04,620 --> 01:12:07,032
"I'm just gonna leave you alone
to your business."

1668
01:12:07,056 --> 01:12:08,967
So, he did a great job
obviously.

1669
01:12:26,075 --> 01:12:27,852
<i>Pennywise is wonderful.</i>

1670
01:12:27,876 --> 01:12:29,421
I mean, he's charming and scary

1671
01:12:29,445 --> 01:12:32,157
and both elusive
and enthralling, you know.

1672
01:12:32,181 --> 01:12:33,525
<i>He's like any good drug.</i>

1673
01:12:33,549 --> 01:12:34,826
Like you just want to go to it,

1674
01:12:34,850 --> 01:12:36,161
but then you regret it
immediately.

1675
01:12:36,185 --> 01:12:39,531
<i>Pennywise
is much more overtly comic...</i>

1676
01:12:39,555 --> 01:12:42,667
Won't do
any good to run, girly boy.

1677
01:12:42,691 --> 01:12:44,603
<i>-
- As a lure for the kids</i>

1678
01:12:44,629 --> 01:12:46,538
And as a sort of perverse

1679
01:12:46,562 --> 01:12:48,530
<i>set of jokes for the audience.</i>

1680
01:12:50,132 --> 01:12:53,578
But when he scares,
he scares the crap out of you.

1681
01:12:53,602 --> 01:12:57,682
He found the way
to really lure you in

1682
01:12:57,706 --> 01:12:59,184
like Georgie in the sewer.

1683
01:12:59,208 --> 01:13:00,518
My boat!

1684
01:13:00,542 --> 01:13:02,787
Exactly!

1685
01:13:02,811 --> 01:13:05,557
<i>When Georgie
is first taken by Pennywise,</i>

1686
01:13:05,581 --> 01:13:07,759
which is a great scene
when he follows the boat

1687
01:13:07,783 --> 01:13:09,661
<i>down the street in the rain.</i>

1688
01:13:09,685 --> 01:13:11,162
S.S. Georgie.

1689
01:13:13,922 --> 01:13:15,300
<i>The effects guys had done this</i>

1690
01:13:15,324 --> 01:13:18,169
<i>brilliant job to figure out
how to get the boat to flow</i>

1691
01:13:18,193 --> 01:13:19,461
all in one take.

1692
01:13:20,696 --> 01:13:22,474
No, please no.

1693
01:13:22,498 --> 01:13:24,175
<i>Tommy Lee
Wallace opened the sewer grate,</i>

1694
01:13:24,199 --> 01:13:25,210
which was just a manhole cover

1695
01:13:25,234 --> 01:13:27,212
which was about four feet away
from the sewer,

1696
01:13:27,236 --> 01:13:29,814
and had Tim crouch down
and speak...

1697
01:13:29,838 --> 01:13:31,649
Hiya, Georgie!

1698
01:13:31,673 --> 01:13:32,984
Into the sewer.

1699
01:13:33,008 --> 01:13:35,854
<i>We
Had a strange day to shoot it.</i>

1700
01:13:35,878 --> 01:13:37,489
<i>You can almost always count on</i>

1701
01:13:37,513 --> 01:13:39,457
overcast in Vancouver,

1702
01:13:39,481 --> 01:13:41,659
<i>but this day
was sunny and bright,</i>

1703
01:13:41,683 --> 01:13:44,529
<i>but "We better go ahead
and do it because</i>

1704
01:13:44,553 --> 01:13:46,798
here we are
and the set is built."

1705
01:13:46,822 --> 01:13:48,099
<i>You can see the rays of sunshine</i>

1706
01:13:48,123 --> 01:13:50,168
<i>coming through the scaffolding</i>

1707
01:13:50,192 --> 01:13:52,070
<i>that they built to
create the rain.</i>

1708
01:13:52,094 --> 01:13:54,105
<i>I had trepidation about that</i>

1709
01:13:54,129 --> 01:13:57,108
<i>but the effect
was kind of wonderful.</i>

1710
01:13:57,132 --> 01:13:59,911
<i>The light was doing weird things
and of course you could see</i>

1711
01:13:59,935 --> 01:14:03,014
<i>the rain really well because
it was backlit by the sun.</i>

1712
01:14:03,038 --> 01:14:05,850
<i>Then you get
to the actual sewer.</i>

1713
01:14:05,874 --> 01:14:09,053
<i>That was a set.
It was done outdoors.</i>

1714
01:14:09,077 --> 01:14:11,856
The set was up high
and Tim was just standing

1715
01:14:11,880 --> 01:14:14,592
with his face
up against the opening,

1716
01:14:14,616 --> 01:14:16,027
<i>so we were on a riser,</i>

1717
01:14:16,051 --> 01:14:19,097
<i>looking down as if
we were on the street.</i>

1718
01:14:19,121 --> 01:14:21,566
<i>Little Georgie
at the beginning of the film</i>

1719
01:14:21,590 --> 01:14:25,069
<i>when he's chasing his
paper boat and I grab him,</i>

1720
01:14:25,093 --> 01:14:27,272
he stopped and said...

1721
01:14:27,296 --> 01:14:28,773
-"Tim, you're scaring me,
you're scaring me."

1722
01:14:28,797 --> 01:14:31,676
-"It'll save you
a little acting, won't it?"

1723
01:14:31,700 --> 01:14:33,244
<i>That wonderful little boy.</i>

1724
01:14:33,268 --> 01:14:34,446
Do they float?

1725
01:14:34,470 --> 01:14:36,247
<i>And Tim Curry's performance.</i>

1726
01:14:36,271 --> 01:14:39,284
They float, Georgie.

1727
01:14:39,308 --> 01:14:41,719
-to me,
that's what that scene is.

1728
01:14:41,743 --> 01:14:45,156
<i>Not much in the way
of special effects.</i>

1729
01:14:45,180 --> 01:14:47,559
You'll float too!

1730
01:14:50,819 --> 01:14:53,231
-One of the scenes
that was left out

1731
01:14:53,255 --> 01:14:57,836
of the final showing of IT
was that scene where

1732
01:14:57,860 --> 01:15:01,105
<i>Sharon comes to the door
and is presented with</i>

1733
01:15:01,129 --> 01:15:04,008
<i>a fireman holding
the body of her son.</i>

1734
01:15:04,032 --> 01:15:06,611
Holding me
with my arm in my sleeve

1735
01:15:06,635 --> 01:15:08,546
<i>and the blood dripping
out of the sleeve.</i>

1736
01:15:08,570 --> 01:15:09,614
<i>It's pouring rain</i>

1737
01:15:09,638 --> 01:15:12,283
<i>and she opens the
door and there he is,</i>

1738
01:15:12,307 --> 01:15:14,586
and I spent all day screaming

1739
01:15:14,610 --> 01:15:15,787
<i>as we did take after take.</i>

1740
01:15:15,811 --> 01:15:18,056
<i>I guess since it was made for TV</i>

1741
01:15:18,080 --> 01:15:20,658
<i>that that was pushing
the envelope a little bit.</i>

1742
01:15:20,682 --> 01:15:22,060
<i>We were certainly
aware that we were doing</i>

1743
01:15:22,084 --> 01:15:23,828
<i>a horror movie for television.</i>

1744
01:15:23,852 --> 01:15:26,598
George.

1745
01:15:26,622 --> 01:15:28,800
<i>And back
then, we were very limited</i>

1746
01:15:28,824 --> 01:15:30,168
to what you could show.

1747
01:15:30,192 --> 01:15:31,669
<i>We were breaking new ground,</i>

1748
01:15:31,693 --> 01:15:33,137
<i>because I don't remember</i>

1749
01:15:33,161 --> 01:15:35,740
<i>before any kind of material
like this</i>

1750
01:15:35,764 --> 01:15:37,709
<i>that I saw on television.</i>

1751
01:15:37,733 --> 01:15:40,178
<i>Sci-fi, horror.</i>

1752
01:15:40,202 --> 01:15:41,046
Float.

1753
01:15:41,070 --> 01:15:43,014
-.blood, and there was
a lot of that.

1754
01:15:47,175 --> 01:15:48,253
-And we had to work with

1755
01:15:48,277 --> 01:15:51,289
<i>the program practice department
at all times.</i>

1756
01:15:51,313 --> 01:15:55,760
There was a scene where
the kids become

1757
01:15:55,784 --> 01:15:59,297
<i>blood brothers and sisters
and they cut their hand</i>

1758
01:15:59,321 --> 01:16:02,634
<i>and they place
their palms on palms.</i>

1759
01:16:02,658 --> 01:16:05,270
<i>We had to change that</i>

1760
01:16:05,294 --> 01:16:07,038
<i>because it was in the early '90s</i>

1761
01:16:07,062 --> 01:16:08,806
<i>and it was during
the time of AIDS.</i>

1762
01:16:08,830 --> 01:16:11,276
<i>So, we wrote the scene
to spit in their hand.</i>

1763
01:16:11,300 --> 01:16:14,913
-The advertisers
were very nervous.

1764
01:16:14,937 --> 01:16:17,715
<i>This was a children
in jeopardy story</i>

1765
01:16:17,739 --> 01:16:19,951
<i>and we had to focus it on</i>

1766
01:16:19,975 --> 01:16:22,186
<i>the fact that it was
a Stephen King novel,</i>

1767
01:16:22,210 --> 01:16:23,888
<i>that it was very popular.</i>

1768
01:16:23,912 --> 01:16:25,823
<i>Executives, creatives knew it,</i>

1769
01:16:25,847 --> 01:16:28,259
<i>but program practices still
had to follow their guidelines</i>

1770
01:16:28,283 --> 01:16:31,195
<i>and we were constantly
up against them,</i>

1771
01:16:31,219 --> 01:16:33,398
pushing it, and fighting

1772
01:16:33,422 --> 01:16:35,800
for the creative integrity
of the piece.

1773
01:16:35,824 --> 01:16:38,903
<i>Broadcast
Standards rejected the picture,</i>

1774
01:16:38,927 --> 01:16:42,407
and the head of Broadcast
Standards at the time

1775
01:16:42,431 --> 01:16:45,310
happened to be someone I knew,
so it was easy for me

1776
01:16:45,334 --> 01:16:47,078
<i>to get on the phone to New York</i>

1777
01:16:47,102 --> 01:16:49,013
<i>and ask for help.</i>

1778
01:16:49,037 --> 01:16:51,282
The gentleman that was
in charge of

1779
01:16:51,306 --> 01:16:53,418
<i>censorship at ABC</i>

1780
01:16:53,442 --> 01:16:56,254
<i>agreed to come out and
look at the picture with me.</i>

1781
01:16:56,278 --> 01:16:59,691
His staff had rejected
the picture on so many levels

1782
01:16:59,715 --> 01:17:03,161
<i>that every note that they had
meant re-cutting the picture</i>

1783
01:17:03,185 --> 01:17:04,862
and I just simply said,

1784
01:17:04,886 --> 01:17:06,431
"We're not cutting
a piece of it."

1785
01:17:06,455 --> 01:17:07,432
<i>"This is what you bought.</i>

1786
01:17:07,456 --> 01:17:08,900
<i>You bought
a Stephen King horror.</i>

1787
01:17:08,924 --> 01:17:10,034
We'll be able to show it

1788
01:17:10,058 --> 01:17:12,303
<i>in a very respectable,
responsible way...</i>

1789
01:17:12,327 --> 01:17:14,405
<i>is based on subject material</i>

1790
01:17:14,429 --> 01:17:17,442
<i>that may be unsuitable for,
and unsettling to</i>

1791
01:17:17,466 --> 01:17:19,811
<i>younger and
impressionable viewers.</i>

1792
01:17:19,835 --> 01:17:21,312
-"but we can't deny the audience

1793
01:17:21,336 --> 01:17:23,314
what they come to expect."

1794
01:17:23,338 --> 01:17:25,216
<i>I had made my argument</i>

1795
01:17:25,240 --> 01:17:28,286
<i>that these were recollections of adults.</i>

1796
01:17:28,310 --> 01:17:29,821
The blood.

1797
01:17:29,845 --> 01:17:31,856
I cleaned the whole thing up
that very same night.

1798
01:17:31,880 --> 01:17:33,758
<i>And so therefore,
we could get away with</i>

1799
01:17:33,782 --> 01:17:35,193
<i>children in jeopardy.</i>

1800
01:17:39,154 --> 01:17:40,198
<i>The next day we were told,</i>

1801
01:17:40,222 --> 01:17:43,125
<i>"No changes. Move forward."</i>

1802
01:18:11,853 --> 01:18:12,930
Cue background!

1803
01:18:12,954 --> 01:18:14,899
Background!

1804
01:18:16,091 --> 01:18:18,069
Eric, go.

1805
01:18:18,093 --> 01:18:20,471
<i>The idea of the carnival scene</i>

1806
01:18:20,495 --> 01:18:22,473
<i>is straight out of the book...</i>

1807
01:18:22,497 --> 01:18:25,410
<i>The hand that reaches
right out of the photo album</i>

1808
01:18:25,434 --> 01:18:27,245
and grabs at them.

1809
01:18:27,269 --> 01:18:29,347
-Come on, it's just a drawing!

1810
01:18:29,371 --> 01:18:31,282
<i>The photo
book was built by two people,</i>

1811
01:18:31,306 --> 01:18:33,217
<i>Mike Steffy, and Bob Comer.</i>

1812
01:18:33,241 --> 01:18:35,887
<i>Both of them had this
amazing mechanical ability</i>

1813
01:18:35,911 --> 01:18:37,855
<i>to build what we call
tabletop gags,</i>

1814
01:18:37,879 --> 01:18:39,123
<i>really intricate things.</i>

1815
01:18:39,147 --> 01:18:41,192
-That was my favorite thing,

1816
01:18:41,216 --> 01:18:43,928
<i>that you see a photograph
and I come alive.</i>

1817
01:18:43,952 --> 01:18:45,329
<i>Such a great idea.</i>

1818
01:18:53,095 --> 01:18:55,773
-I have never seen so many
cables attached to something

1819
01:18:55,797 --> 01:18:58,076
that operated those pages
to turn.

1820
01:18:58,100 --> 01:19:00,978
<i>It was a complex
push me-pull me cable system.</i>

1821
01:19:01,002 --> 01:19:02,447
<i>They had to hit their marks,</i>

1822
01:19:02,471 --> 01:19:04,282
so they had to have individual
cables for individual pages.

1823
01:19:04,306 --> 01:19:05,817
It took them weeks to build it.

1824
01:19:05,841 --> 01:19:07,285
<i>When they operated it,</i>

1825
01:19:07,309 --> 01:19:09,887
<i>it was one of those "How do you
hide all that stuff?"</i>

1826
01:19:09,911 --> 01:19:11,856
Visual effects
just didn't have the money.

1827
01:19:11,880 --> 01:19:12,791
All right, here we go. Yeah.

1828
01:19:12,815 --> 01:19:14,516
Thank you and clear, please.

1829
01:19:17,552 --> 01:19:18,830
<i>What I really, really</i>

1830
01:19:18,854 --> 01:19:22,233
<i>wanted to emphasize was
that "I think I see Pennywise</i>

1831
01:19:22,257 --> 01:19:24,469
<i>back there in the background
somewhere</i>

1832
01:19:24,493 --> 01:19:27,071
<i>but he's just not
bothering anybody."</i>

1833
01:19:27,095 --> 01:19:28,206
<i>And I picked up the book</i>

1834
01:19:28,230 --> 01:19:29,474
and the first thing we saw
was just a big hole in it.

1835
01:19:29,498 --> 01:19:32,076
<i>And he's like, "All right,
I want you guys to act</i>

1836
01:19:32,100 --> 01:19:33,211
<i>like you guys
are reading this book,</i>

1837
01:19:33,235 --> 01:19:36,581
<i>like Pennywise is
dancing down the street.</i>

1838
01:19:36,605 --> 01:19:38,349
<i>He jumps on the pole."</i>

1839
01:19:38,373 --> 01:19:39,318
Uh, remember the uh,

1840
01:19:39,342 --> 01:19:40,918
remember the pull-up.

1841
01:19:40,942 --> 01:19:41,587
Don't watch
the clown, background.

1842
01:19:41,611 --> 01:19:43,087
Keep doing your own stuff.

1843
01:19:43,111 --> 01:19:43,689
Remember that, uh,

1844
01:19:43,713 --> 01:19:45,389
little lower, and.yeah.

1845
01:19:45,413 --> 01:19:46,924
- "And then, here it comes..."

1846
01:19:46,948 --> 01:19:48,226
Aah!

1847
01:19:48,250 --> 01:19:49,460
-Oh, shit,
he's right in your face,

1848
01:19:49,484 --> 01:19:50,528
just like that.

1849
01:19:50,552 --> 01:19:52,263
-"and I need you
guys to react."

1850
01:19:52,287 --> 01:19:54,298
<i>It was Tommy's hand that kind of</i>

1851
01:19:54,322 --> 01:19:55,433
came up through there.

1852
01:19:55,457 --> 01:19:58,202
<i>I remember later
seeing the completed scene</i>

1853
01:19:58,226 --> 01:20:00,171
<i>and being blown away.</i>

1854
01:20:00,195 --> 01:20:02,940
-I thought that was
a good powerful moment.

1855
01:20:02,964 --> 01:20:04,942
<i>Makeup
effects were booming at that time.</i>

1856
01:20:04,966 --> 01:20:07,378
Garage shops
were popping up everywhere,

1857
01:20:07,402 --> 01:20:09,914
<i>and</i> Fantasy II <i>was
like an all-encompassing</i>

1858
01:20:09,938 --> 01:20:11,516
<i>movie effects house.</i>

1859
01:20:11,540 --> 01:20:13,618
<i>We had a makeup effects wing</i>

1860
01:20:13,642 --> 01:20:16,954
<i>and Bart Mixon
was the lead person in it.</i>

1861
01:20:16,978 --> 01:20:18,256
Tommy Lee Wallace

1862
01:20:18,280 --> 01:20:21,859
knew him from <i>Fright Night 2</i>

1863
01:20:21,883 --> 01:20:23,294
<i>I had set up their creature shop</i>

1864
01:20:23,318 --> 01:20:25,096
<i>for</i> Fright Night 2,

1865
01:20:25,120 --> 01:20:27,965
so it was just natural
for Gene to bring me back in.

1866
01:20:27,989 --> 01:20:30,134
<i>I had a crew of about a half
a dozen artists on the show,</i>

1867
01:20:30,158 --> 01:20:31,869
<i>but I... probably selfishly,</i>

1868
01:20:31,893 --> 01:20:33,571
<i>I wanted to do Pennywise myself.</i>

1869
01:20:33,595 --> 01:20:34,772
-That was Bart's baby.

1870
01:20:34,796 --> 01:20:37,875
<i>Bart sculpted it and did
the whole application.</i>

1871
01:20:37,899 --> 01:20:39,177
Fozzie Bear does the twist?

1872
01:20:39,201 --> 01:20:41,245
<i>Early on, I
was doing a fair amount of</i>

1873
01:20:41,269 --> 01:20:44,081
<i>clown research and sketching.</i>

1874
01:20:44,105 --> 01:20:46,584
-The idea, first of all,
was to do a lot of research

1875
01:20:46,608 --> 01:20:49,353
on representation of clowns
over time

1876
01:20:49,377 --> 01:20:51,589
to have a historical
perspective.

1877
01:20:51,613 --> 01:20:54,992
We have to think of
the size of the actor

1878
01:20:55,016 --> 01:20:57,295
<i>and how big we want him to be,</i>

1879
01:20:57,319 --> 01:20:59,497
<i>how nimble we want him to be.</i>

1880
01:20:59,521 --> 01:21:01,199
What we're doing
with the costume is

1881
01:21:01,223 --> 01:21:03,201
<i>we're serving his face;</i>

1882
01:21:03,225 --> 01:21:05,937
everything has to serve
the expression.

1883
01:21:05,961 --> 01:21:07,939
-The first time
I did prosthetics

1884
01:21:07,963 --> 01:21:10,174
<i>I was doing Legend
for Ridley Scott,</i>

1885
01:21:10,198 --> 01:21:12,043
<i>where I played the devil.</i>

1886
01:21:12,067 --> 01:21:14,445
-He had mentioned
that Rob Botin had literally

1887
01:21:14,469 --> 01:21:17,548
<i>casted every inch of his body,
so I think he wasn't anxious</i>

1888
01:21:17,572 --> 01:21:19,350
<i>to have his life cast
done again.</i>

1889
01:21:19,374 --> 01:21:21,485
<i>That's all right, I can bear it.</i>

1890
01:21:21,509 --> 01:21:24,222
<i>He was absolutely weighted down</i>

1891
01:21:24,246 --> 01:21:27,992
<i>with special effects makeup
to the point at which he was...</i>

1892
01:21:28,016 --> 01:21:31,362
To most people was no longer
recognizable as Tim Curry.

1893
01:21:31,386 --> 01:21:33,664
<i>I was
prosthetic down to my waist</i>

1894
01:21:33,688 --> 01:21:36,033
<i>and it was all glued on,</i>

1895
01:21:36,057 --> 01:21:38,402
<i>and to get it off
they used to sit me in a bath,</i>

1896
01:21:38,426 --> 01:21:40,271
tear a hole in my head

1897
01:21:40,295 --> 01:21:42,373
<i>and pour in solvent.</i>

1898
01:21:42,397 --> 01:21:45,109
<i>And the two guys
who were doing it were insane,</i>

1899
01:21:45,133 --> 01:21:49,080
<i>probably because they were
around solvents so much.</i>

1900
01:21:49,104 --> 01:21:51,215
<i>You do get horribly
claustrophobic,</i>

1901
01:21:51,239 --> 01:21:54,285
<i>particularly
if your whole face is covered.</i>

1902
01:21:54,309 --> 01:21:56,053
<i>So, his only reservation</i>

1903
01:21:56,077 --> 01:21:57,955
<i>was too much makeup</i>.

1904
01:21:57,979 --> 01:22:01,125
<i>He wanted to be
able to use his face.</i>

1905
01:22:01,149 --> 01:22:05,329
We pushed and pulled about
how much makeup to do.

1906
01:22:05,353 --> 01:22:07,365
<i>I met with him
and we had a few conversations</i>

1907
01:22:07,389 --> 01:22:09,734
<i>about what he did
or didn't want to wear.</i>

1908
01:22:09,758 --> 01:22:13,170
<i>He did want to go as light
as possible with the prosthetic.</i>

1909
01:22:13,194 --> 01:22:14,663
So there was some evolution.

1910
01:22:37,085 --> 01:22:39,363
I'll kill you all.

1911
01:22:39,387 --> 01:22:40,531
I'll kill you all.

1912
01:22:40,555 --> 01:22:41,966
<i>I saw it as a fantasy character.</i>

1913
01:22:41,990 --> 01:22:45,536
<i>It was an illusion that It's
presenting to these children.</i>

1914
01:22:45,560 --> 01:22:48,239
I wanted it to almost
be like a living cartoon,

1915
01:22:48,263 --> 01:22:50,308
<i>just as harmless and as pleasant looking</i>

1916
01:22:50,332 --> 01:22:51,342
<i>as it could be,</i>

1917
01:22:51,366 --> 01:22:52,277
and that's why the colors

1918
01:22:52,301 --> 01:22:54,512
<i>are pure white and red and blue</i>

1919
01:22:54,536 --> 01:22:56,647
<i>and very primary and very clean.</i>

1920
01:22:56,671 --> 01:22:58,449
I didn't want
there to be cracks.

1921
01:22:58,473 --> 01:23:00,484
<i>And at least when he's
presenting himself to the kids,</i>

1922
01:23:00,508 --> 01:23:02,286
he's casting this illusion,

1923
01:23:02,310 --> 01:23:05,389
so why would he
have flaws in it?

1924
01:23:05,413 --> 01:23:08,125
<i>The usual
accoutrement of clownmanship,</i>

1925
01:23:08,149 --> 01:23:10,328
<i>it was definitely
going to be whiteface.</i>

1926
01:23:10,352 --> 01:23:11,395
<i>It was really the classic</i>

1927
01:23:11,419 --> 01:23:14,465
<i>Bozo the Clown approach,
to begin with.</i>

1928
01:23:14,489 --> 01:23:16,434
-He came over to the shop,
we took a life cast,

1929
01:23:16,458 --> 01:23:19,603
<i>and then we produced
copies of busts of his head.</i>

1930
01:23:19,627 --> 01:23:22,306
<i>I believe I had three of those
that I did clay sketches on</i>

1931
01:23:22,330 --> 01:23:24,375
<i>where we did
three different concepts.</i>

1932
01:23:24,399 --> 01:23:26,510
<i>There was a hobo clown</i>

1933
01:23:26,534 --> 01:23:28,813
<i>with jowls and droopy face,</i>

1934
01:23:28,837 --> 01:23:29,914
and then there was
one in between

1935
01:23:29,938 --> 01:23:31,782
<i>that had more prosthetics
on his face</i>

1936
01:23:31,806 --> 01:23:34,685
<i>but made him a little more
angular and meaner.</i>

1937
01:23:34,709 --> 01:23:36,487
Once we-we produced the makeup,

1938
01:23:36,511 --> 01:23:38,356
<i>then we went up
to Canada to test it.</i>

1939
01:23:38,380 --> 01:23:40,591
And we did two makeup tests.

1940
01:23:40,615 --> 01:23:41,826
<i>When we got to Vancouver,</i>

1941
01:23:41,850 --> 01:23:45,162
<i>and were doing our test
makeup, I was so looking forward</i>

1942
01:23:45,186 --> 01:23:46,630
to that day and that moment

1943
01:23:46,654 --> 01:23:49,300
when we would be able to sit
with Tim with the makeup on

1944
01:23:49,324 --> 01:23:51,168
<i>and see this clown with</i>

1945
01:23:51,192 --> 01:23:53,738
bloodshot eyes and fangs
and a scary face.

1946
01:23:53,762 --> 01:23:56,440
<i>The first test
was just the head and the nose</i>

1947
01:23:56,464 --> 01:23:59,076
<i>with a paint scheme
that was what Tim had wanted.</i>

1948
01:23:59,100 --> 01:24:01,512
<i>He dictated the patterns
on the face.</i>

1949
01:24:01,536 --> 01:24:04,181
The second test, we added
the cheeks and the chin

1950
01:24:04,205 --> 01:24:06,450
<i>and then I painted something
closer to what I had</i>

1951
01:24:06,474 --> 01:24:08,119
<i>on my original design,</i>

1952
01:24:08,143 --> 01:24:10,721
where he's got like a bigger
red mouth and the blue eyes.

1953
01:24:10,745 --> 01:24:11,922
<i>They photographed both of those.</i>

1954
01:24:11,946 --> 01:24:13,824
<i>The decision was made
that he didn't really</i>

1955
01:24:13,848 --> 01:24:15,393
need the cheeks and chin,

1956
01:24:15,417 --> 01:24:17,161
<i>which at the time
I was kind of like,</i>

1957
01:24:17,185 --> 01:24:18,262
"Hey, wait a minute!"

1958
01:24:18,286 --> 01:24:20,264
<i>But I think he looks great
like he is.</i>

1959
01:24:20,288 --> 01:24:22,600
The paint scheme evolved
a little bit further.

1960
01:24:22,624 --> 01:24:24,268
<i>We did at least one more test</i>

1961
01:24:24,292 --> 01:24:26,303
<i>where we just painted
Tim's face white</i>

1962
01:24:26,327 --> 01:24:28,806
<i>and then refined the patterns.</i>

1963
01:24:28,830 --> 01:24:32,843
-It's always kind of tough
having that stuff stuck on you.

1964
01:24:32,867 --> 01:24:34,211
<i>There was a certain line</i>

1965
01:24:34,235 --> 01:24:36,247
<i>that I was going past,</i>

1966
01:24:36,271 --> 01:24:38,816
<i>and Bart Mixon was in
on that conversation,</i>

1967
01:24:38,840 --> 01:24:41,786
as was Doug Higgins,
the art director.

1968
01:24:41,810 --> 01:24:45,456
We were all having discussions
about Pennywise's look.

1969
01:24:45,480 --> 01:24:49,326
<i>I was excited about adding
certain appliance makeup</i>

1970
01:24:49,350 --> 01:24:51,228
like a bulbous forehead,

1971
01:24:51,252 --> 01:24:56,901
<i>perhaps exaggerated cheekbones,
big extended chin,</i>

1972
01:24:56,925 --> 01:24:59,837
things to cartoonize his face.

1973
01:24:59,861 --> 01:25:03,240
<i>Tim took a stand about that
and said he really didn't want</i>

1974
01:25:03,264 --> 01:25:04,742
to wear these things.

1975
01:25:04,766 --> 01:25:06,911
<i>He agreed to try them on.</i>

1976
01:25:06,935 --> 01:25:09,613
-And he said, "If you want me
to wear this scary makeup,

1977
01:25:09,637 --> 01:25:11,348
<i>then I think you have
the wrong actor."</i>

1978
01:25:11,372 --> 01:25:13,150
And I thought, "What?"

1979
01:25:13,174 --> 01:25:16,487
<i>He had great
patience and great forbearance,</i>

1980
01:25:16,511 --> 01:25:19,490
because I think that job
was a purgatory for him,

1981
01:25:19,514 --> 01:25:20,558
<i>I really do.</i>

1982
01:25:20,582 --> 01:25:22,927
One more, Tim.

1983
01:25:22,951 --> 01:25:24,462
<i>And God love him,</i>

1984
01:25:24,486 --> 01:25:25,729
he created a character

1985
01:25:25,753 --> 01:25:29,834
that has scared
the pants off of generations.

1986
01:25:29,858 --> 01:25:31,902
<i>He said, "Look, just make me</i>

1987
01:25:31,926 --> 01:25:35,573
<i>as a straight clown
and I will scare the audience."</i>

1988
01:25:35,597 --> 01:25:38,709
I thought, "Of course.
That's why we have Tim Curry."

1989
01:25:38,733 --> 01:25:40,211
Go!

1990
01:25:40,235 --> 01:25:41,912
Now.

1991
01:25:41,936 --> 01:25:44,215
<i>"He will scare
us. We don't need all of that."</i>

1992
01:25:44,239 --> 01:25:46,750
-In the end,
we removed all of them

1993
01:25:46,774 --> 01:25:49,720
except the bulbous head,
and I'm glad we stuck with that,

1994
01:25:49,744 --> 01:25:54,558
<i>but he was totally right that
his face is so expressive...</i>

1995
01:25:54,582 --> 01:25:55,902
Give us a profile, Tim.

1996
01:25:57,952 --> 01:25:59,029
<i>That it was good</i>

1997
01:25:59,053 --> 01:26:02,500
<i>to not see it too done up
with rubber.</i>

1998
01:26:02,524 --> 01:26:04,368
<i>But Tim
could act through a manhole cover</i>

1999
01:26:04,392 --> 01:26:05,736
<i>if he wanted to,</i>

2000
01:26:05,760 --> 01:26:08,363
because he has that kind of
charisma and presence.

2001
01:26:29,384 --> 01:26:31,729
<i>The look that we ended up with</i>

2002
01:26:31,753 --> 01:26:34,265
<i>was based in a large part</i>

2003
01:26:34,289 --> 01:26:35,966
<i>on the Lon Chaney Phantom
of the Opera.</i>

2004
01:26:35,990 --> 01:26:37,601
<i>That's why it's got
the upturned nose</i>

2005
01:26:37,625 --> 01:26:39,403
<i>and the bulbous head.</i>

2006
01:26:48,436 --> 01:26:50,514
<i>I didn't film
any of my scenes with Tim Curry</i>

2007
01:26:50,538 --> 01:26:51,782
'cause they didn't
want to scare me.

2008
01:26:51,806 --> 01:26:55,686
<i>I was walking back to go
to my trailer to go change</i>

2009
01:26:55,710 --> 01:26:59,823
and Tim Curry is in full gear,
his clown makeup, everything,

2010
01:26:59,847 --> 01:27:02,326
and he walks by me
and he goes, "Hi!"

2011
01:27:02,350 --> 01:27:05,563
And it scared me so much.

2012
01:27:05,587 --> 01:27:07,865
<i>To be honest that's the
reason why I...</i>

2013
01:27:07,889 --> 01:27:09,533
<i>I still haven't seen the movie,</i>

2014
01:27:09,557 --> 01:27:11,035
because I'm terrified of clowns.

2015
01:27:12,727 --> 01:27:15,372
-There was quite a good
photograph in a magazine of me

2016
01:27:15,396 --> 01:27:17,708
<i>heading for the makeup trailer</i>

2017
01:27:17,732 --> 01:27:22,513
<i>in a bathrobe with a Marlboro
dangling from my face.</i>

2018
01:27:22,537 --> 01:27:24,848
<i>Tim kept
himself quite aloof from us.</i>

2019
01:27:24,872 --> 01:27:28,686
He would basically just
hang out in his cast chair,

2020
01:27:28,710 --> 01:27:30,988
<i>chain-smoking in full makeup</i>

2021
01:27:31,012 --> 01:27:33,324
<i>and whenever he saw
us, he would just go</i>

2022
01:27:33,348 --> 01:27:35,059
"Grrrrr!"

2023
01:27:35,083 --> 01:27:36,293
<i>Those kind of people</i>

2024
01:27:36,317 --> 01:27:38,362
<i>always make your job easier.</i>

2025
01:27:38,386 --> 01:27:40,764
<i>The kids were
actually quite scared of me.</i>

2026
01:27:40,788 --> 01:27:42,366
-I'd been playing it really cool

2027
01:27:42,390 --> 01:27:44,001
<i>and then we wound up in a van</i>

2028
01:27:44,025 --> 01:27:45,569
<i>going back to the hotel together</i>

2029
01:27:45,593 --> 01:27:47,571
<i>and I was wearing
a Rocky Horror shirt</i>

2030
01:27:47,595 --> 01:27:50,641
and I was like trying
to cover it up,

2031
01:27:50,665 --> 01:27:53,644
and he saw it and he was like,
"Oh, you like the movie?"

2032
01:27:53,668 --> 01:27:56,880
And I go, "Yeah, I'm...
I'm into you, dude!"

2033
01:27:56,904 --> 01:27:59,917
<i>I have a picture of him
in half a clown costume</i>

2034
01:27:59,941 --> 01:28:02,920
<i>with me standing next to
him looking slightly scared</i>

2035
01:28:02,944 --> 01:28:04,555
<i>that was taken off the set</i>

2036
01:28:04,579 --> 01:28:07,625
<i>after shooting this shower scene</i>

2037
01:28:07,649 --> 01:28:09,026
<i>and</i> I was too scared to
ask him for that picture.

2038
01:28:09,050 --> 01:28:10,894
<i>My mom, however, was not.</i>

2039
01:28:10,918 --> 01:28:13,464
<i>I
Encouraged him to be really big,</i>

2040
01:28:13,488 --> 01:28:15,566
<i>because it's almost like
a character</i>

2041
01:28:15,590 --> 01:28:17,835
<i>who's satirizing himself
constantly.</i>

2042
01:28:17,859 --> 01:28:19,570
<i>He's being self-referential</i>

2043
01:28:19,594 --> 01:28:22,373
when he tells these
awful, stupid jokes.

2044
01:28:22,397 --> 01:28:24,541
Do you have
Prince Albert in a can?

2045
01:28:24,565 --> 01:28:26,076
-Then, urrah, urrah, urrah.

2046
01:28:26,100 --> 01:28:27,478
Urrah, urrah, urrah,

2047
01:28:27,502 --> 01:28:28,446
<i>urrah, urrah,</i>

2048
01:28:28,470 --> 01:28:30,881
you know, it's like, "Wait,

2049
01:28:30,905 --> 01:28:34,418
<i>he's just demented;
that's all there is to that.</i>

2050
01:28:34,442 --> 01:28:37,588
But wait, he's not even a clown,
he's some other kind of monster,

2051
01:28:37,612 --> 01:28:39,556
so, oh, I'm uneasy."

2052
01:28:39,580 --> 01:28:43,460
<i>Pennywise
is this really strange, queer...</i>

2053
01:28:43,484 --> 01:28:45,362
Not in LGBTQ sense,

2054
01:28:45,386 --> 01:28:49,600
but like queer as in strange,
as in aberrant.

2055
01:28:49,624 --> 01:28:51,702
I think that the novel,
more so than the miniseries,

2056
01:28:51,726 --> 01:28:53,470
is very much grounded
in the fact

2057
01:28:53,494 --> 01:28:57,141
that Pennywise
is on three different levels:

2058
01:28:57,165 --> 01:28:59,143
It is in disguise

2059
01:28:59,167 --> 01:29:01,145
<i>as Pennywise; Pennywise then</i>

2060
01:29:01,169 --> 01:29:03,714
disguises himself as, say,

2061
01:29:03,738 --> 01:29:04,815
the Creature
from the Black Lagoon,

2062
01:29:04,839 --> 01:29:06,374
the mummy, the leper.

2063
01:29:07,675 --> 01:29:11,055
Get out of Derry
while you still can!

2064
01:29:11,079 --> 01:29:13,557
<i>Beverly's dad in a dress,</i>

2065
01:29:13,581 --> 01:29:16,093
so it's drag on drag
on drag on drag.

2066
01:29:16,117 --> 01:29:18,062
It's all about these
very queer elements,

2067
01:29:18,086 --> 01:29:20,397
<i>which is what horror
fiction is always about.</i>

2068
01:29:20,421 --> 01:29:22,399
<i>It's always about the
thing on the outside.</i>

2069
01:29:22,423 --> 01:29:25,469
<i>So, King is really preying on those fears,</i>

2070
01:29:25,493 --> 01:29:26,737
<i>those fears of the outsider.</i>

2071
01:29:29,030 --> 01:29:30,140
Stan?

2072
01:29:30,164 --> 01:29:31,875
<i>My first day of</i>

2073
01:29:31,899 --> 01:29:34,912
shooting on the set
was with Jonathan Brandis,

2074
01:29:34,936 --> 01:29:38,482
<i>where Stan goes to do some
bird watching and ends up in</i>

2075
01:29:38,506 --> 01:29:39,683
a house...

2076
01:29:39,707 --> 01:29:40,718
Hello?

2077
01:29:40,742 --> 01:29:42,019
Stanley.

2078
01:29:42,043 --> 01:29:43,053
Yeah?

2079
01:29:43,077 --> 01:29:43,888
<i>And of course,</i>

2080
01:29:43,912 --> 01:29:46,090
It manifests itself
as that mummy.

2081
01:29:49,684 --> 01:29:51,628
<i>Jim McLaughlin
sculpted the mummy for me,</i>

2082
01:29:51,652 --> 01:29:53,931
<i>which was basically a makeup
that Jim had done</i>

2083
01:29:53,955 --> 01:29:55,132
<i>a year or so earlier
and I was like,</i>

2084
01:29:55,156 --> 01:29:57,468
"That looks cool, you mind
if we use that in the movie?"

2085
01:29:57,492 --> 01:29:59,252
<i>So he just, you know,
made me a copy of that.</i>

2086
01:30:00,795 --> 01:30:02,506
<i>There's a
werewolf which was really cool</i>

2087
01:30:02,530 --> 01:30:04,208
<i>that was done by Norman Cabrera.</i>

2088
01:30:04,232 --> 01:30:05,743
- This.
This isn't happening.

2089
01:30:09,370 --> 01:30:10,781
<i>He's
like, "We're doing an homage</i>

2090
01:30:10,805 --> 01:30:14,518
<i>to I Was a Teenage Werewolf,
the Michael Landon creature,"</i>

2091
01:30:14,542 --> 01:30:15,753
and I was like,

2092
01:30:15,777 --> 01:30:17,221
"Uh, yeah.
This is a no-brainer, man.

2093
01:30:17,245 --> 01:30:18,155
I want to do this."

2094
01:30:18,179 --> 01:30:18,923
<i>When I saw the stunt guy</i>

2095
01:30:18,947 --> 01:30:20,724
<i>in the suit the first time,</i>

2096
01:30:20,748 --> 01:30:22,126
all I wanted to do was touch it.

2097
01:30:22,150 --> 01:30:24,194
<i>Werewolves
was always my favorite monster</i>

2098
01:30:24,218 --> 01:30:27,064
<i>in every movie, and I loved
I Was a Teenage Werewolf</i>

2099
01:30:27,088 --> 01:30:28,732
<i>'cause he had these
really cool streaks</i>

2100
01:30:28,756 --> 01:30:30,601
<i>and he wore like
the school jacket</i>

2101
01:30:30,625 --> 01:30:32,069
and he was... kind of
was like a greaser.

2102
01:30:32,093 --> 01:30:34,705
<i>I basically got
my old monster magazines out</i>

2103
01:30:34,729 --> 01:30:36,573
<i>so I had the references
all there.</i>

2104
01:30:36,597 --> 01:30:38,542
<i>I knew exactly
what they were going for,</i>

2105
01:30:38,566 --> 01:30:40,744
<i>and I liked giving it
a slightly updated twist.</i>

2106
01:30:41,936 --> 01:30:43,747
-I look at night two

2107
01:30:43,771 --> 01:30:47,084
and I think it suffers
in part from the problems

2108
01:30:47,108 --> 01:30:50,521
of being only a night two.

2109
01:30:50,545 --> 01:30:53,757
<i>Steve's narrative
as it accelerates</i>

2110
01:30:53,781 --> 01:30:56,160
<i>benefits from more time
rather than less.</i>

2111
01:30:56,184 --> 01:30:57,294
That said,

2112
01:30:57,318 --> 01:30:58,996
<i>the fortune cookie scene
in the restaurant</i>

2113
01:30:59,020 --> 01:31:00,597
<i>and the scene</i>

2114
01:31:00,621 --> 01:31:02,666
<i>when Bev goes to her old house</i>

2115
01:31:02,690 --> 01:31:03,867
<i>and another
woman is living there</i>

2116
01:31:03,891 --> 01:31:05,269
<i>who is by no means</i>

2117
01:31:05,293 --> 01:31:06,804
what she appears...

2118
01:31:06,828 --> 01:31:09,573
If you're wise,
you'll run dear, run,

2119
01:31:09,597 --> 01:31:11,575
because to stay will mean
worse than your death.

2120
01:31:11,599 --> 01:31:13,239
Were as good
as anything in night one.

2121
01:31:15,703 --> 01:31:17,548
I worry about you, Bevvy.

2122
01:31:17,572 --> 01:31:19,550
I worry a lot.

2123
01:31:19,574 --> 01:31:22,152
<i>Norman Cabrera
did the Al Marsh corpse</i>

2124
01:31:22,176 --> 01:31:24,087
when Beverly goes back
to her home

2125
01:31:24,111 --> 01:31:26,957
and the old woman turns into
the corpse of her father.

2126
01:31:26,981 --> 01:31:29,660
<i>I had to do
the whole upper-body cast,</i>

2127
01:31:29,684 --> 01:31:31,695
<i>which is one of the
most grueling things</i>

2128
01:31:31,719 --> 01:31:33,864
<i>that an actor can do.</i>

2129
01:31:33,888 --> 01:31:39,036
<i>They tried to Krazy Glue
mealy worms to my face,</i>

2130
01:31:39,060 --> 01:31:42,239
actually live worms
jiggling on my face.

2131
01:31:42,263 --> 01:31:43,707
<i>But we
couldn't get them to stick.</i>

2132
01:31:44,765 --> 01:31:46,667
So, we had to lose
the mealy worms.

2133
01:31:51,205 --> 01:31:52,216
<i>When you get on some sets,</i>

2134
01:31:52,240 --> 01:31:55,018
<i>you can tell that
it's done in a way</i>

2135
01:31:55,042 --> 01:31:56,286
<i>that's going to make it
look good on camera</i>

2136
01:31:56,310 --> 01:31:57,955
<i>but it doesn't really look
that great up close...</i>

2137
01:31:57,979 --> 01:31:59,656
Not the case with this set.

2138
01:31:59,680 --> 01:32:00,958
Standby for picture.

2139
01:32:00,982 --> 01:32:03,727
<i>Inside
that set, you really felt like</i>

2140
01:32:03,751 --> 01:32:06,821
<i>you were underground and
in some sort of sewer system.</i>

2141
01:32:08,890 --> 01:32:10,770
Okay. We're there.

2142
01:32:11,692 --> 01:32:13,337
-The set was awesome.

2143
01:32:13,361 --> 01:32:16,673
<i>It just kind of transformed you
and took you to another place.</i>

2144
01:32:16,697 --> 01:32:17,774
Who's missing?

2145
01:32:17,798 --> 01:32:19,776
- Stan!
- Oh no!

2146
01:32:19,800 --> 01:32:22,880
<i>There was a scene
where Stan got pulled aside</i>

2147
01:32:22,904 --> 01:32:24,815
<i>from the group
with Henry and Belch.</i>

2148
01:32:26,674 --> 01:32:30,754
- Hi, kid.
I uh, guess you're the first.

2149
01:32:30,778 --> 01:32:31,689
<i>I got a chance to confront</i>

2150
01:32:31,713 --> 01:32:33,357
<i>Ben Heller and you felt like,</i>

2151
01:32:33,381 --> 01:32:35,826
"Oh, this is it now.
He's a dead man."

2152
01:32:35,850 --> 01:32:38,862
<i>I felt that little segment
came closest to encapsulating</i>

2153
01:32:38,886 --> 01:32:40,063
<i>what Henry Bowers
was capable of.</i>

2154
01:32:40,087 --> 01:32:42,933
I want you to think
about that before you die.

2155
01:32:42,957 --> 01:32:44,735
<i>Belch, the guy that
gets pulled in the pipe,</i>

2156
01:32:44,759 --> 01:32:46,937
<i>the lower half of him
is a dummy so that</i>

2157
01:32:46,961 --> 01:32:49,206
they can fold, because it's kind
of hard to fold yourself over

2158
01:32:49,230 --> 01:32:50,641
<i>like he does.</i>

2159
01:32:50,665 --> 01:32:52,175
-When they told me
how I was going to die

2160
01:32:52,199 --> 01:32:54,311
<i>and the dimensions of the pipe,
I started stretching,</i>

2161
01:32:54,335 --> 01:32:55,712
so I'm just in there

2162
01:32:55,736 --> 01:32:57,014
trying to get my head
to my knees

2163
01:32:57,038 --> 01:32:58,248
so that I could fit in there,

2164
01:32:58,272 --> 01:32:59,583
and one of the stunt
coordinators said,

2165
01:32:59,607 --> 01:33:01,785
<i>"You're not going to be
able to do it. I can't do it."</i>

2166
01:33:01,809 --> 01:33:03,220
I wanted to do my own stunts
but they were like,

2167
01:33:03,244 --> 01:33:04,404
"No, no, it's an explosion...

2168
01:33:06,347 --> 01:33:07,424
<i>"and you can't do that."</i>

2169
01:33:07,448 --> 01:33:09,393
You know, I was
17 years old and being like,

2170
01:33:09,417 --> 01:33:11,828
"Yeah, yeah,
I did my own stunts!"

2171
01:33:11,852 --> 01:33:13,030
<i>As a young effects person,</i>

2172
01:33:13,054 --> 01:33:14,631
<i>I got a lot of the crappy jobs.</i>

2173
01:33:14,655 --> 01:33:16,333
We're down in the sewer,
and there's that pipe

2174
01:33:16,357 --> 01:33:17,534
<i>that light goes through,</i>

2175
01:33:17,558 --> 01:33:19,970
<i>and there's a bazillion holes
in that pipe.</i>

2176
01:33:19,994 --> 01:33:21,271
<i>Well, my job was, first,</i>

2177
01:33:21,295 --> 01:33:22,706
drill all the holes.

2178
01:33:22,730 --> 01:33:24,074
You got to make them
look perfect

2179
01:33:24,098 --> 01:33:25,809
<i>and then you had to go
inside it,</i>

2180
01:33:25,833 --> 01:33:27,077
<i>because with the
camera sliding in there</i>

2181
01:33:27,101 --> 01:33:29,012
<i>and also we had the
actor that got sucked into it,</i>

2182
01:33:29,036 --> 01:33:30,080
<i>all the holes had to have</i>

2183
01:33:30,104 --> 01:33:31,648
<i>all the little sharp edges
taken off.</i>

2184
01:33:31,672 --> 01:33:34,117
I just spent 12 hours a day

2185
01:33:34,141 --> 01:33:35,752
<i>doing that.</i>

2186
01:33:35,776 --> 01:33:38,155
Hey, Henry?

2187
01:33:38,179 --> 01:33:39,723
-I was lifted off the ground.

2188
01:33:39,747 --> 01:33:41,858
I was told to just have,
they described it as

2189
01:33:41,882 --> 01:33:42,760
dead eyes, right,

2190
01:33:42,784 --> 01:33:45,162
so there's no real
reaction to the fact

2191
01:33:45,186 --> 01:33:48,432
that you're being pulled in
by some mysterious force.

2192
01:33:48,456 --> 01:33:50,701
Belch!

2193
01:33:50,725 --> 01:33:52,836
<i>I love dying on film.</i>

2194
01:33:52,860 --> 01:33:53,971
<i>There's a finality to it.</i>

2195
01:33:53,995 --> 01:33:56,773
Just the ability to. let go.

2196
01:33:56,797 --> 01:33:59,076
This is battery acid, you slime!

2197
01:33:59,100 --> 01:34:01,378
<i>My character, Eddie Kaspbrak.</i>

2198
01:34:01,402 --> 01:34:03,113
<i>I don't know, I like to
think in kind of a way</i>

2199
01:34:03,137 --> 01:34:05,749
<i>he was the one who did
the most damage to It.</i>

2200
01:34:05,773 --> 01:34:07,184
<i>Like, the most protective with,
you know,</i>

2201
01:34:07,208 --> 01:34:08,208
<i>the battery acid scene.</i>

2202
01:34:10,111 --> 01:34:13,690
-He was a warrior on the inside.

2203
01:34:13,714 --> 01:34:14,825
<i>When the kids saw him,</i>

2204
01:34:14,849 --> 01:34:17,227
<i>I wanted him to be like this cartoon clown,</i>

2205
01:34:17,251 --> 01:34:19,429
<i>and when the adults saw him,
I wanted him to be</i>

2206
01:34:19,453 --> 01:34:23,433
<i>this like a horrific caricature
of that previous clown.</i>

2207
01:34:23,457 --> 01:34:26,169
The adults know
that this isn't really a clown.

2208
01:34:26,193 --> 01:34:27,804
They know that it's a monster,

2209
01:34:27,828 --> 01:34:30,207
<i>and so there's no reason for It</i>

2210
01:34:30,231 --> 01:34:32,809
<i>to necessarily
maintain this illusion</i>

2211
01:34:32,833 --> 01:34:35,212
other than
just to screw with them.

2212
01:34:35,236 --> 01:34:40,150
<i>And my original concept art
for it had blue eye sockets</i>

2213
01:34:40,174 --> 01:34:42,252
<i>which would become
eye sockets of the skull;</i>

2214
01:34:42,276 --> 01:34:43,920
<i>just the way
the mouth was painted</i>

2215
01:34:43,944 --> 01:34:46,023
<i>would suggest
more of a skullish mouth.</i>

2216
01:34:46,047 --> 01:34:49,026
And for various reasons,
we didn't go that route.

2217
01:34:49,050 --> 01:34:51,495
But when we ended up
doing the battery acid look,

2218
01:34:51,519 --> 01:34:56,199
<i>the disfigured part is what
that makeup would have been,</i>

2219
01:34:56,223 --> 01:34:58,135
only on his entire head.

2220
01:34:58,159 --> 01:34:59,836
<i>When we shot that
sequence in Canada</i>

2221
01:34:59,860 --> 01:35:01,271
<i>with the battery acid,</i>

2222
01:35:01,295 --> 01:35:02,539
<i>we didn't have time
to switch him over</i>

2223
01:35:02,563 --> 01:35:05,842
so we just shot the whole thing
with the regular clown face.

2224
01:35:05,866 --> 01:35:07,210
<i>At that point,</i>

2225
01:35:07,234 --> 01:35:10,347
<i>the intention was to not use
the disfigured prosthetics</i>

2226
01:35:10,371 --> 01:35:12,082
<i>and I went back to LA</i>

2227
01:35:12,106 --> 01:35:13,250
<i>kind of a little heartbroken.</i>

2228
01:35:13,274 --> 01:35:15,285
<i>And we were building
the miniature Pennywise</i>

2229
01:35:15,309 --> 01:35:16,486
<i>for when he goes down the drain</i>

2230
01:35:16,510 --> 01:35:19,756
<i>and I had it sculpted
with the normal face,</i>

2231
01:35:19,780 --> 01:35:20,757
<i>and literally</i>

2232
01:35:20,781 --> 01:35:22,993
the day I got the front half
of the mold done,

2233
01:35:23,017 --> 01:35:24,494
<i>Gene Warren comes back and goes,</i>

2234
01:35:24,518 --> 01:35:25,762
<i>"Hey, we're doing some reshoots</i>

2235
01:35:25,786 --> 01:35:28,265
<i>and we're going to use
the disfigured Pennywise."</i>

2236
01:35:28,289 --> 01:35:32,002
<i>Now I had to take a life cast
of his quarter-scale head</i>

2237
01:35:32,026 --> 01:35:34,304
<i>and do like a tiny prosthetic
to make it look like</i>

2238
01:35:34,328 --> 01:35:35,572
<i>the disfigured Pennywise.</i>

2239
01:35:35,596 --> 01:35:38,909
<i>To Tim's credit, the only
reason that that makeup,</i>

2240
01:35:38,933 --> 01:35:40,277
<i>even though it's
a heavier makeup,</i>

2241
01:35:40,301 --> 01:35:43,547
<i>is in the movie is because
he had seen the prosthetics</i>

2242
01:35:43,571 --> 01:35:46,516
<i>and he volunteered to wear it
for the day that we shot it.</i>

2243
01:35:46,540 --> 01:35:48,285
-I loved the fact
that we really got to work

2244
01:35:48,309 --> 01:35:49,820
with Tim in that scene.

2245
01:35:49,844 --> 01:35:50,821
Stan, no!

2246
01:35:50,845 --> 01:35:51,855
Bev, the stones!

2247
01:35:51,879 --> 01:35:52,956
Hurry, Bev. Kill It!

2248
01:35:52,980 --> 01:35:54,524
Kill me?

2249
01:35:54,548 --> 01:35:56,226
Oh, brat!

2250
01:35:56,250 --> 01:35:58,195
You are priceless!

2251
01:35:58,219 --> 01:36:00,230
-When Pennywise gets hit
in the head with

2252
01:36:00,254 --> 01:36:02,265
<i>the silver stone and knocks
the chunk out of his head.</i>

2253
01:36:02,289 --> 01:36:04,568
Bam! He nails him!

2254
01:36:04,592 --> 01:36:06,369
<i>Initially,
we shot that in Vancouver</i>

2255
01:36:06,393 --> 01:36:08,939
<i>with just the regular
Pennywise makeup.</i>

2256
01:36:08,963 --> 01:36:11,308
Kill it, Bev! Kill it!

2257
01:36:11,332 --> 01:36:12,342
Make that happen fast.

2258
01:36:12,366 --> 01:36:15,078
As soon as this... as soon as
he gets hit. Okay?

2259
01:36:15,102 --> 01:36:16,913
So, bam!
He gets hit in the head.

2260
01:36:16,937 --> 01:36:18,815
-I think it was
an interesting choice

2261
01:36:18,839 --> 01:36:22,085
by Stephen King
to have Bev, the only girl,

2262
01:36:22,109 --> 01:36:24,821
<i>be the one who actually
has mastered this weapon</i>

2263
01:36:24,845 --> 01:36:28,125
<i>and can use the weapon
against It.</i>

2264
01:36:28,149 --> 01:36:30,460
It's like
it's supposed to be Bev.

2265
01:36:30,484 --> 01:36:33,163
<i>In the movie,
it's a little silver earring</i>

2266
01:36:33,187 --> 01:36:34,431
about so big,

2267
01:36:34,455 --> 01:36:35,599
<i>but for the shot of it</i>

2268
01:36:35,623 --> 01:36:38,535
<i>flying out of the
slingshot and hitting him,</i>

2269
01:36:38,559 --> 01:36:42,372
<i>Bart sculpted at least twice
a duplicate of the earring.</i>

2270
01:36:42,396 --> 01:36:44,508
It's flat on the back with...
With a little hole

2271
01:36:44,532 --> 01:36:48,311
so they could mount it
on a... on a rig

2272
01:36:48,335 --> 01:36:50,380
and I think it probably rotated.

2273
01:36:50,404 --> 01:36:52,282
<i>I remember practicing</i>

2274
01:36:52,306 --> 01:36:55,585
<i>with a slingshot at
home. Once I fired it</i>

2275
01:36:55,609 --> 01:36:57,521
right into the camera

2276
01:36:57,545 --> 01:37:00,390
and it ricocheted
around the map box.

2277
01:37:00,414 --> 01:37:02,459
<i>Took me a while to live
that one down with the boys.</i>

2278
01:37:02,483 --> 01:37:03,560
<i>They were like, "I'll do it!</i>

2279
01:37:03,584 --> 01:37:05,562
I'll do it!
She's incompetent!"

2280
01:37:05,586 --> 01:37:07,597
I was just like, "Oh, men."

2281
01:37:07,621 --> 01:37:09,900
Kill It, Bev!

2282
01:37:13,127 --> 01:37:14,471
<i>Filming those scenes</i>

2283
01:37:14,495 --> 01:37:16,873
<i>in the sewer
and working with Pennywise.</i>

2284
01:37:17,898 --> 01:37:22,379
And you. are next.

2285
01:37:22,403 --> 01:37:24,481
- Definitely some of
the more memorable times.

2286
01:37:24,505 --> 01:37:25,506
Action!

2287
01:37:30,277 --> 01:37:33,089
<i>It really put you in the mood</i>

2288
01:37:33,113 --> 01:37:34,057
and it really
gave you the feeling

2289
01:37:34,081 --> 01:37:34,826
that you were actually
doing these things.

2290
01:37:34,850 --> 01:37:37,027
<i>Similar to the shower scene.</i>

2291
01:37:37,051 --> 01:37:39,095
It's okay, Eddie.

2292
01:37:39,119 --> 01:37:42,933
Hi. I just wanted to say hello.

2293
01:37:42,957 --> 01:37:44,334
-The entire thing
is built on a sound stage

2294
01:37:44,358 --> 01:37:49,906
so you have a bathroom
that is seven-eighths complete.

2295
01:37:49,930 --> 01:37:53,076
This is a little
inconvenient, Eddie.

2296
01:37:53,100 --> 01:37:56,079
Just hold on while I make
a few adjustments.

2297
01:37:56,103 --> 01:37:59,082
-It was a combination
of stop-motion

2298
01:37:59,106 --> 01:38:01,251
replacement animation.

2299
01:38:01,275 --> 01:38:05,488
<i>We sculpted the stretching
of the drain in the tiles</i>

2300
01:38:05,512 --> 01:38:09,359
<i>and it's sculpted
frame by frame and then cast</i>

2301
01:38:09,383 --> 01:38:12,019
<i>and then replacement,
one frame at a time.</i>

2302
01:38:13,487 --> 01:38:15,031
<i>You have all this noise.</i>

2303
01:38:15,055 --> 01:38:17,100
<i>The poles blowing
the compressed air,</i>

2304
01:38:17,124 --> 01:38:20,303
<i>which are loud bursts from
12 to 14 different poles.</i>

2305
01:38:20,327 --> 01:38:22,339
<i>The director yelling cues at me.</i>

2306
01:38:22,363 --> 01:38:23,406
Have Tim Curry

2307
01:38:23,430 --> 01:38:24,774
<i>reciting his lines for me</i>

2308
01:38:24,798 --> 01:38:28,211
<i>in Tim Curry Pennywise voice
over a loudspeaker system.</i>

2309
01:38:28,235 --> 01:38:31,014
<i>So, when you add
all those factors together,</i>

2310
01:38:31,038 --> 01:38:33,583
me having an asthma attack
at the very end of the scene...

2311
01:38:35,476 --> 01:38:38,188
it's not really
too much acting going on there

2312
01:38:38,212 --> 01:38:39,389
because there was
a lot of adrenaline,

2313
01:38:39,413 --> 01:38:40,624
there was a lot of pressure.

2314
01:38:40,648 --> 01:38:42,259
Well, sports fans,

2315
01:38:42,283 --> 01:38:44,361
this has been a real hoot.

2316
01:38:44,385 --> 01:38:45,729
<i>The Chinese restaurant scene</i>

2317
01:38:45,753 --> 01:38:48,999
<i>was sort of our scene
out of</i> Alien<i> in that</i>

2318
01:38:49,023 --> 01:38:52,736
the director did not let us see
what was going to happen.

2319
01:38:59,733 --> 01:39:00,611
<i>First of
all, you have to remember</i>

2320
01:39:00,635 --> 01:39:01,945
you have all these actors

2321
01:39:01,969 --> 01:39:04,314
<i>sitting around who have known
each other for years.</i>

2322
01:39:04,338 --> 01:39:07,217
<i>Ritter and I were very naughty.</i>

2323
01:39:07,241 --> 01:39:08,152
Poor Tommy, the director,

2324
01:39:08,176 --> 01:39:10,120
I think wanted to
really kill both of us.

2325
01:39:10,144 --> 01:39:12,022
<i>We were back in that time</i>

2326
01:39:12,046 --> 01:39:14,224
<i>so we were always relating
to each other in character</i>

2327
01:39:14,248 --> 01:39:16,326
as childhood friends.

2328
01:39:16,350 --> 01:39:18,028
<i>And Annette, who is so sweet</i>

2329
01:39:18,052 --> 01:39:19,229
<i>and such a dear heart</i>

2330
01:39:19,253 --> 01:39:20,397
and such a "nice girl,"

2331
01:39:20,421 --> 01:39:23,333
has got such a raucous
sense of humor.

2332
01:39:23,357 --> 01:39:25,302
I mean, we were just outrageous.

2333
01:39:25,326 --> 01:39:29,072
<i>You put a bunch of actors
around a table for hours,</i>

2334
01:39:29,096 --> 01:39:32,008
<i>it's crowd control at
a whole other level.</i>

2335
01:39:32,032 --> 01:39:34,277
I think it was very hard
and I want to apologize

2336
01:39:34,301 --> 01:39:36,613
right now to the director
and everybody.

2337
01:39:36,637 --> 01:39:39,716
<i>And then after
that, staying in character</i>

2338
01:39:39,740 --> 01:39:43,119
<i>knowing what this meant,
that this was again an omen.</i>

2339
01:39:43,143 --> 01:39:44,688
This thing is never
going to leave us.

2340
01:39:44,712 --> 01:39:46,089
<i>The little thing with the eye,</i>

2341
01:39:46,113 --> 01:39:47,090
<i>the fortune cookie,</i>

2342
01:39:47,114 --> 01:39:48,425
that was my favorite.

2343
01:39:48,449 --> 01:39:49,659
<i>Back then, you had to do</i>

2344
01:39:49,683 --> 01:39:51,394
<i>everything practically.</i>

2345
01:39:51,418 --> 01:39:54,164
<i>And if they had to fix it,
it was a lot of work and money.</i>

2346
01:39:54,188 --> 01:39:56,266
<i>So, the challenges
that IT brought</i>

2347
01:39:56,290 --> 01:39:57,500
<i>to the effects department</i>

2348
01:39:57,524 --> 01:39:59,202
<i>as a mechanical,
practical thing,</i>

2349
01:39:59,226 --> 01:40:00,437
was amazing.

2350
01:40:00,461 --> 01:40:01,438
<i>I loved that scene</i>

2351
01:40:01,462 --> 01:40:04,307
<i>and that's...
In my fading memory,</i>

2352
01:40:04,331 --> 01:40:07,444
making that scene is one
that's always stood out for me.

2353
01:40:07,468 --> 01:40:08,712
<i>That and where
I'm telling them all</i>

2354
01:40:08,736 --> 01:40:11,781
<i>we have to be strong
and we have to stay together</i>

2355
01:40:11,805 --> 01:40:12,849
<i>and we're going to do this.</i>

2356
01:40:12,873 --> 01:40:13,684
<i>And the reason
I remember that scene</i>

2357
01:40:13,708 --> 01:40:16,353
is that I just wonder
how terrible

2358
01:40:16,377 --> 01:40:18,154
my performance was
at that moment.

2359
01:40:18,178 --> 01:40:22,058
I've been afraid to revisit it
because I don't want to know.

2360
01:40:22,082 --> 01:40:23,093
For years,
I've been getting paid

2361
01:40:23,117 --> 01:40:24,418
to scare people,

2362
01:40:26,320 --> 01:40:28,465
but I'm the one
who's been scared.

2363
01:40:28,489 --> 01:40:29,733
<i>I was
just always afraid, oh god,</i>

2364
01:40:29,757 --> 01:40:32,102
was I as hokey
as I thought I was?

2365
01:40:32,126 --> 01:40:34,237
<i>There was so much love
and fun at the table</i>

2366
01:40:34,261 --> 01:40:35,472
<i>in the Chinese restaurant.</i>

2367
01:40:35,496 --> 01:40:39,376
<i>As difficult as it may have
been for them to get it quiet</i>

2368
01:40:39,400 --> 01:40:42,512
<i>and do the work, that chemistry
and that craziness</i>

2369
01:40:42,536 --> 01:40:46,750
is one of the things
that makes the picture work.

2370
01:40:46,774 --> 01:40:49,419
<i>I was responsible
for Stan's head in the fridge.</i>

2371
01:40:49,443 --> 01:40:51,187
Sorry I'm late!

2372
01:40:51,211 --> 01:40:52,622
<i>We were
building the stuff in Burbank</i>

2373
01:40:52,646 --> 01:40:54,457
<i>and then flying up to Vancouver.</i>

2374
01:40:54,481 --> 01:40:55,326
And so I had a big trunk

2375
01:40:55,350 --> 01:40:57,260
that I would carry
the Pennywise wigs

2376
01:40:57,284 --> 01:40:59,462
<i>and the various prosthetics.
You'd go through customs</i>

2377
01:40:59,486 --> 01:41:01,097
and typically
they would open it up

2378
01:41:01,121 --> 01:41:02,665
and uh, you know,
"What's all this stuff?"

2379
01:41:02,689 --> 01:41:05,268
<i>So, I'm going through this time
with the severed head in it,</i>

2380
01:41:05,292 --> 01:41:08,104
so I'm like, you know, "Oh, well
this ought to be funny!"

2381
01:41:08,128 --> 01:41:12,242
-From here to here
he built a kind of a false neck,

2382
01:41:12,266 --> 01:41:15,812
so it looked like my head
was sitting flat on the rack.

2383
01:41:15,836 --> 01:41:18,114
<i>Stan's head in
the fridge was a combination</i>

2384
01:41:18,138 --> 01:41:19,883
of a prosthetic on the actor

2385
01:41:19,907 --> 01:41:21,418
<i>to simulate the cut neck.</i>

2386
01:41:21,442 --> 01:41:24,521
<i>I'd already
slid into this refrigerator</i>,

2387
01:41:24,545 --> 01:41:26,289
<i>and you have to picture
it's a rack,</i>

2388
01:41:26,313 --> 01:41:28,324
<i>and the rack goes into
a little notch</i>

2389
01:41:28,348 --> 01:41:29,626
on either side of it.

2390
01:41:29,650 --> 01:41:31,528
So you have to
get it just right,

2391
01:41:31,552 --> 01:41:33,430
and it has to go in
at just the right angle,

2392
01:41:33,454 --> 01:41:36,366
and I'm part of the rack.

2393
01:41:36,390 --> 01:41:38,368
<i>They had
a shelf with a cutout in it</i>

2394
01:41:38,392 --> 01:41:40,637
that slid up against his neck

2395
01:41:40,661 --> 01:41:42,372
<i>and then, all that
was rodoed out</i>

2396
01:41:42,396 --> 01:41:43,606
<i>by my brother Brett.</i>

2397
01:41:43,630 --> 01:41:45,408
So it was just a neck prosthetic

2398
01:41:45,432 --> 01:41:48,311
<i>and then a death makeup
on Richard.</i>

2399
01:41:48,335 --> 01:41:49,846
-I slide into this thing...

2400
01:41:49,870 --> 01:41:52,382
<i>I just hate everybody
and I just want this over with.</i>

2401
01:41:52,406 --> 01:41:53,683
So I'm lying there like this.

2402
01:41:53,707 --> 01:41:57,420
<i>Then they start putting
these little cans and stuff</i>

2403
01:41:57,444 --> 01:41:59,589
<i>around my head
and I'm just going,</i>

2404
01:41:59,613 --> 01:42:02,192
"Can we just shoot this?
Can we please just shoot this?"

2405
01:42:02,216 --> 01:42:03,460
"Yeah, well,
we've gotta just."

2406
01:42:03,484 --> 01:42:05,628
<i>I said, "Come on,
let's shoot the fucking thing.</i>

2407
01:42:05,652 --> 01:42:08,465
I need to get this off,"
and then it's like,

2408
01:42:08,489 --> 01:42:13,903
"Hi, kids! How you doing?
Yeah, we all float down here."

2409
01:42:13,927 --> 01:42:16,697
You know, and I just...
I just wanted to kill somebody.

2410
01:42:29,977 --> 01:42:31,788
<i>When I read the novel,</i>

2411
01:42:31,812 --> 01:42:35,925
<i>all thousand pages of it,
I remember going,</i>

2412
01:42:35,949 --> 01:42:40,730
"Wha...? All this,
and it's a fuckin' spider?"

2413
01:42:40,754 --> 01:42:41,922
Damn me to hell.

2414
01:42:43,790 --> 01:42:47,370
-Oh man, come on. You can do
better than that rubber spider.

2415
01:42:47,394 --> 01:42:48,705
-Aww.

2416
01:42:48,729 --> 01:42:51,441
<i>I was a little let down,
to be frank,</i>

2417
01:42:51,465 --> 01:42:55,712
and you're talking to someone
who really loves that novel.

2418
01:42:55,736 --> 01:42:58,381
<i>If I'd had one
scene that I would have put in</i>

2419
01:42:58,405 --> 01:43:00,917
<i>that I think is one of
Steve's great sequences,</i>

2420
01:43:00,941 --> 01:43:04,287
<i>it was where they build
the underground clubhouse</i>

2421
01:43:04,311 --> 01:43:07,423
and use it as a smoke hole
and hallucinate IT

2422
01:43:07,447 --> 01:43:10,560
<i>as this extraterrestrial
arrival eons ago,</i>

2423
01:43:10,584 --> 01:43:12,495
<i>and I think it would have
added to the narrative</i>

2424
01:43:12,519 --> 01:43:14,631
<i>and just straight-out
storytelling,</i>

2425
01:43:14,655 --> 01:43:17,291
<i>and maybe directed the spider.</i>

2426
01:43:19,393 --> 01:43:20,673
<i>Into the junk pile.</i>

2427
01:43:21,962 --> 01:43:23,740
-The one thing I loathed

2428
01:43:23,764 --> 01:43:25,909
<i>was what they did with him
at the end.</i>

2429
01:43:25,933 --> 01:43:29,646
<i>They made him into
this awful plastic spider.</i>

2430
01:43:29,670 --> 01:43:31,714
I believe in the Tooth Fairy.

2431
01:43:31,738 --> 01:43:33,850
But I don't believe in you!

2432
01:43:33,874 --> 01:43:35,885
-Which wasn't scary at all.

2433
01:43:35,909 --> 01:43:38,454
<i>Then
I got over that and thought,</i>

2434
01:43:38,478 --> 01:43:40,557
"Okay, it's a spider.

2435
01:43:40,581 --> 01:43:41,658
<i>Why not?"</i>

2436
01:43:41,682 --> 01:43:42,926
All right, here we go.

2437
01:43:42,950 --> 01:43:45,628
<i>Because it's so much more
than that in the end.</i>

2438
01:43:45,652 --> 01:43:50,800
And there's this cosmic struggle
in space or space-time,

2439
01:43:50,824 --> 01:43:55,605
or Bill's mind or somebody's
mind, you know?

2440
01:43:55,629 --> 01:43:59,842
Come on. Can we have
the deadlights out on a cue?

2441
01:43:59,866 --> 01:44:00,910
- Yep.
- Yes.

2442
01:44:00,934 --> 01:44:01,812
<i>It gets into territory</i>

2443
01:44:01,836 --> 01:44:04,380
<i>that to me it was unfilmable</i>.

2444
01:44:04,404 --> 01:44:06,015
Okay, and the entire creature

2445
01:44:06,039 --> 01:44:07,850
is going to breathe
a little for me, right?

2446
01:44:07,874 --> 01:44:08,874
Here we go.

2447
01:44:10,611 --> 01:44:12,789
I think it has to breathe
a little heavier than that.

2448
01:44:12,813 --> 01:44:16,059
John Thomas, sharper moves!

2449
01:44:16,083 --> 01:44:17,961
<i>So, I
think we were all a little bit like,</i>

2450
01:44:17,985 --> 01:44:19,562
<i>"Okay, now we're
in a monster movie.</i>

2451
01:44:19,586 --> 01:44:22,256
Now we're going to be
fighting this big toy."

2452
01:44:25,025 --> 01:44:25,970
Somebody rear back

2453
01:44:25,994 --> 01:44:29,772
with their fist.
John! That's it!

2454
01:44:29,796 --> 01:44:31,507
More of that!

2455
01:44:31,531 --> 01:44:33,333
<i>It culminates in a struggle.</i>

2456
01:44:36,970 --> 01:44:39,882
<i>Between
humans and a giant spider.</i>

2457
01:44:39,906 --> 01:44:41,217
All right, fine.

2458
01:44:41,241 --> 01:44:44,420
<i>Our challenge of course
was to come up with a creature</i>

2459
01:44:44,444 --> 01:44:46,889
<i>that looks incredible.</i>

2460
01:44:46,913 --> 01:44:50,893
Only we had champagne ideas
and a beer budget.

2461
01:44:50,917 --> 01:44:51,894
Look at this masterful piece.

2462
01:44:51,918 --> 01:44:53,096
Yeah. Look at it, look at it.

2463
01:44:53,120 --> 01:44:55,632
- Look at this.
Aaron Sims. Aaron Sims.

2464
01:44:55,656 --> 01:44:56,633
Joey.

2465
01:44:56,657 --> 01:44:58,668
That's a bad
sculpture, very bad.

2466
01:44:58,692 --> 01:44:59,702
Oh, no it's not.

2467
01:44:59,726 --> 01:45:00,571
It's a very cool sculpture.

2468
01:45:00,595 --> 01:45:02,105
Aaron's doing his magic.

2469
01:45:02,129 --> 01:45:03,273
-It was me
and a colleague and friend,

2470
01:45:03,297 --> 01:45:05,708
<i>Joey Orosco,
which was creating the spider</i>

2471
01:45:05,732 --> 01:45:07,710
<i>that would be in the climax
of the show.</i>

2472
01:45:07,734 --> 01:45:08,945
Look what he's doing.

2473
01:45:08,969 --> 01:45:10,780
- It sucks.
I'm fucking it up. Look at it.

2474
01:45:10,804 --> 01:45:11,981
Hey, this is
for family television.

2475
01:45:12,005 --> 01:45:14,584
- Hey!
No, we got the edit coming now.

2476
01:45:14,608 --> 01:45:17,387
-Going into it,
I guess subconsciously,

2477
01:45:17,411 --> 01:45:19,780
<i>I didn't want people to just go,
"Oh, it's just a spider."</i>

2478
01:45:22,816 --> 01:45:24,060
-This is like...

2479
01:45:24,084 --> 01:45:25,084
I know, but.

2480
01:45:32,092 --> 01:45:34,637
<i>I didn't want it
to be just a big black widow</i>

2481
01:45:34,661 --> 01:45:35,972
<i>or a tarantula.</i>

2482
01:45:37,164 --> 01:45:43,713
Yeah, well I got...

2483
01:45:43,737 --> 01:45:45,481
-It's spider-like,

2484
01:45:45,505 --> 01:45:48,051
<i>but it was never intended to be a spider.</i>

2485
01:45:48,075 --> 01:45:49,686
<i>The design evolved,</i>

2486
01:45:49,710 --> 01:45:51,991
so there was a lot of different
designs that were created.

2487
01:45:52,145 --> 01:45:54,624
<i>Some were more spider-like</i>

2488
01:45:54,648 --> 01:45:55,858
<i>that felt they
were very grounded</i>

2489
01:45:55,882 --> 01:45:57,627
<i>to an earthbound spider.</i>

2490
01:45:57,651 --> 01:45:58,961
What we ended up going with is

2491
01:45:58,985 --> 01:46:00,587
<i>something that felt
otherworldly.</i>

2492
01:46:03,790 --> 01:46:06,469
If you actually delivered
a giant spider...

2493
01:46:06,493 --> 01:46:08,137
The two effects guys
on the picture,

2494
01:46:08,161 --> 01:46:10,073
John and Gene.

2495
01:46:10,097 --> 01:46:11,908
<i>Living in a cave.</i>

2496
01:46:11,932 --> 01:46:16,012
<i>It took the film
from this frightening,</i>

2497
01:46:16,036 --> 01:46:17,814
heady picture,

2498
01:46:17,838 --> 01:46:19,473
<i>to a Ray Harryhausen
action adventure.</i>

2499
01:46:21,575 --> 01:46:23,152
<i>But that's what the script
called for,</i>

2500
01:46:23,176 --> 01:46:26,989
<i>so we did whatever
we thought we could do</i>

2501
01:46:27,013 --> 01:46:28,458
<i>for the time and money,</i>

2502
01:46:28,482 --> 01:46:31,461
<i>and we built
a stop-motion spider.</i>

2503
01:46:31,485 --> 01:46:33,696
<i>It was
Bart who created the model.</i>

2504
01:46:33,720 --> 01:46:36,132
<i>Did a masterful job
and it was beautiful.</i>

2505
01:46:36,156 --> 01:46:38,634
And I'd signed off on that.

2506
01:46:38,658 --> 01:46:40,970
-Well, I don't want to
point too many fingers.

2507
01:46:40,994 --> 01:46:42,171
<i>For some reason,
I think the spider</i>

2508
01:46:42,195 --> 01:46:46,142
<i>gets a lot of grief
that I don't think it deserves.</i>

2509
01:46:46,166 --> 01:46:49,045
<i>When the
crew came up from Los Angeles</i>

2510
01:46:49,069 --> 01:46:52,548
<i>and they got it out to
assemble the spider,</i>

2511
01:46:52,572 --> 01:46:55,518
<i>there was this kind
of, "Oh, by the way,</i>

2512
01:46:55,542 --> 01:46:58,721
<i>the spider, as planned,</i>

2513
01:46:58,745 --> 01:47:00,123
<i>was unwieldy.</i>

2514
01:47:00,147 --> 01:47:02,058
The physics of it
were just such that

2515
01:47:02,082 --> 01:47:03,893
we couldn't make that happen.

2516
01:47:03,917 --> 01:47:05,228
It was just too heavy.

2517
01:47:05,252 --> 01:47:08,064
It was collapsing
under its own weight."

2518
01:47:08,088 --> 01:47:10,566
<i>You're assembling something
that doesn't look anything</i>

2519
01:47:10,590 --> 01:47:12,702
<i>like we agreed upon.</i>

2520
01:47:17,030 --> 01:47:18,708
<i>And
now I'm just supposed to shoot it?</i>

2521
01:47:18,732 --> 01:47:19,909
<i>Well, the answer was:</i>

2522
01:47:19,933 --> 01:47:22,145
"Yeah, that's show business.

2523
01:47:22,169 --> 01:47:25,181
You don't have any more time.
You've got to do this."

2524
01:47:25,205 --> 01:47:28,851
Hold them up there,
hold them up. right arm in.

2525
01:47:28,875 --> 01:47:30,787
<i>So make it look
the best you can.</i>

2526
01:47:30,811 --> 01:47:31,811
Drop!

2527
01:47:33,513 --> 01:47:34,624
God!

2528
01:47:34,648 --> 01:47:36,526
Cut. Aces.

2529
01:47:36,550 --> 01:47:37,693
-So I tell people,
"Hey, it could have been

2530
01:47:37,717 --> 01:47:39,162
fighting a turtle
in outer space.

2531
01:47:39,186 --> 01:47:40,730
<i>Would you have liked
that better?"</i>

2532
01:47:40,754 --> 01:47:41,998
-I thought the spider
was fantastic,

2533
01:47:42,022 --> 01:47:43,199
to tell you the truth.

2534
01:47:43,223 --> 01:47:46,169
<i>The way it looked in
the shop was really cool.</i>

2535
01:47:46,193 --> 01:47:47,870
<i>We had 12 weeks to build it.</i>

2536
01:47:47,894 --> 01:47:49,839
<i>Unfortunately,
the shooting of the spider</i>

2537
01:47:49,863 --> 01:47:53,543
<i>was literally
the last two days of filming.</i>

2538
01:47:53,567 --> 01:47:54,944
All right, take it up to,

2539
01:47:54,968 --> 01:47:56,203
uh, a hundred.

2540
01:47:58,238 --> 01:47:59,882
Okay!

2541
01:47:59,906 --> 01:48:00,818
<i>I think a lot of times,</i>

2542
01:48:00,842 --> 01:48:02,985
for time constraints on set,

2543
01:48:03,009 --> 01:48:04,687
<i>or for whatever reason...</i>

2544
01:48:04,711 --> 01:48:07,690
Put the hands out slowly!

2545
01:48:07,714 --> 01:48:08,791
Cut!

2546
01:48:08,815 --> 01:48:10,660
-The director
can't get the shots

2547
01:48:10,684 --> 01:48:12,795
<i>or doesn't shoot it
to its full potential.</i>

2548
01:48:12,819 --> 01:48:14,931
-What we built and delivered
was capable of

2549
01:48:14,955 --> 01:48:18,267
<i>a lot more than what's seen in the film.</i>

2550
01:48:18,291 --> 01:48:20,269
And positions, please.

2551
01:48:20,293 --> 01:48:22,104
There we go.

2552
01:48:22,128 --> 01:48:23,040
<i>The big
problem with a lot of these movies</i>

2553
01:48:23,064 --> 01:48:25,708
is that you get the set
and they're like,

2554
01:48:25,732 --> 01:48:27,009
"Okay, put it
in front of the camera.

2555
01:48:27,033 --> 01:48:28,711
<i>Okay, make it move."</i>

2556
01:48:28,735 --> 01:48:30,246
<i>wiggle, wiggle, wiggle. "Okay."</i>

2557
01:48:30,270 --> 01:48:31,881
- Cut.
- Cut.

2558
01:48:31,905 --> 01:48:33,149
Nicely done.

2559
01:48:33,173 --> 01:48:34,383
<i>And
you're like, "Hold on a second,</i>

2560
01:48:34,407 --> 01:48:34,852
this could do much more..."
"No, no. We got it. We got it.

2561
01:48:34,876 --> 01:48:36,076
We're moving on."

2562
01:48:37,110 --> 01:48:38,287
<i>The head had
a full range of movement.</i>

2563
01:48:38,311 --> 01:48:39,655
<i>The fangs could move,</i>

2564
01:48:39,679 --> 01:48:41,724
<i>the mouth, the mandibles.</i>

2565
01:48:41,748 --> 01:48:44,594
Get the hands around
and then just pinch around.

2566
01:48:46,152 --> 01:48:47,563
<i>The fangs dripped poison.</i>

2567
01:48:49,089 --> 01:48:50,099
The eyes moved.

2568
01:48:50,123 --> 01:48:51,901
- Who's got the eyes?
- Mike.

2569
01:48:51,925 --> 01:48:53,165
There you go.

2570
01:48:54,728 --> 01:48:56,138
Go to town, Brent.

2571
01:48:56,162 --> 01:48:58,307
<i>Brent Baker
was my main mold maker</i>

2572
01:48:58,331 --> 01:49:01,277
and then he also performed
inside the spider.

2573
01:49:01,301 --> 01:49:02,861
Move the butt, Brent.

2574
01:49:04,137 --> 01:49:05,882
Yeah.-.

2575
01:49:05,906 --> 01:49:07,984
Move it
like a bug would move it, Brent.

2576
01:49:08,008 --> 01:49:11,921
He is! That's it!
It's a frightening bug.

2577
01:49:11,945 --> 01:49:13,356
<i>It's always
a challenge when you're</i>

2578
01:49:13,380 --> 01:49:15,291
playing inside a creature suit.

2579
01:49:15,315 --> 01:49:16,226
How is it in there, Brent?

2580
01:49:16,250 --> 01:49:17,326
You gotta speak up, Tommy.

2581
01:49:17,350 --> 01:49:18,618
You okay, Brent?

2582
01:49:21,755 --> 01:49:24,867
<i>They would insert me through
the rear of the spider</i>

2583
01:49:24,891 --> 01:49:28,371
<i>and pull off the abdomen,
and slide me up into it.</i>

2584
01:49:28,395 --> 01:49:29,206
<i>He was also inside the spider</i>

2585
01:49:29,230 --> 01:49:30,973
<i>when they flipped it over</i>,

2586
01:49:30,997 --> 01:49:32,909
but it had these metal ribs
around it

2587
01:49:32,933 --> 01:49:35,077
and those we hadn't
thought to pad.

2588
01:49:35,101 --> 01:49:37,847
When I say, "Action,"

2589
01:49:37,871 --> 01:49:40,049
IT will overlap, that is to say,

2590
01:49:40,073 --> 01:49:41,317
a few steps back,
you'll come in,

2591
01:49:41,341 --> 01:49:43,119
Rambo on the creature,

2592
01:49:43,143 --> 01:49:45,621
it will do its roll and go down.

2593
01:49:45,645 --> 01:49:46,923
<i>It's all fun and games</i>

2594
01:49:46,947 --> 01:49:50,626
<i>until they go to push
the spider over on its side</i>

2595
01:49:50,650 --> 01:49:51,994
and like a fool I was like,
"I'll do it.

2596
01:49:52,018 --> 01:49:54,058
Yeah, I'll be in it, you know.
How bad could it be?"

2597
01:49:55,255 --> 01:49:57,633
And, action!

2598
01:49:57,657 --> 01:49:59,068
<i>So, yeah,
he goes like 90 degrees</i>

2599
01:49:59,092 --> 01:50:03,005
<i>and then just slams
into these aluminum.</i>

2600
01:50:03,029 --> 01:50:05,007
Square stocks.

2601
01:50:05,031 --> 01:50:07,810
- Cut!
- Cut!

2602
01:50:07,834 --> 01:50:09,245
Brent, you all right?

2603
01:50:09,269 --> 01:50:11,314
-He had some nice bruises,
but he was a trouper.

2604
01:50:11,338 --> 01:50:12,348
Show your bruises.

2605
01:50:12,372 --> 01:50:13,216
Let's see the bruises.

2606
01:50:13,240 --> 01:50:14,217
You're going to be a star.

2607
01:50:14,241 --> 01:50:15,218
They're starting to turn

2608
01:50:15,242 --> 01:50:17,253
kind of greenish now.
There's the other one.

2609
01:50:17,277 --> 01:50:20,189
It's turning all kinds of
interesting colors.

2610
01:50:20,213 --> 01:50:22,224
<i>I was effectively
blind inside of there.</i>

2611
01:50:22,248 --> 01:50:23,659
Not to complain,

2612
01:50:23,683 --> 01:50:27,363
<i>because it's still great fun,
you know, playing a monster.</i>

2613
01:50:27,387 --> 01:50:29,398
It's like, "Hey, I'm almost
like part of the cast."

2614
01:50:29,422 --> 01:50:30,533
-It was his idea.

2615
01:50:30,557 --> 01:50:32,859
<i>He wanted to be an
actor, so there you go.</i>

2616
01:50:38,064 --> 01:50:40,343
There's a couple
of close-ups of the spider

2617
01:50:40,367 --> 01:50:42,845
that for some reason
they shot it at like 50,

2618
01:50:42,869 --> 01:50:45,214
<i>60 frames a second,
maybe even slower,</i>

2619
01:50:45,238 --> 01:50:48,818
to where it's barely perceived
that it's moving.

2620
01:50:48,842 --> 01:50:51,687
<i>I think if we delivered a spider
that did as little</i>

2621
01:50:51,711 --> 01:50:53,789
<i>as what you see in the show,</i>

2622
01:50:53,813 --> 01:50:55,373
I think they would have been
pissed off.

2623
01:50:59,285 --> 01:51:04,233
-Unfortunately, the timing
session after the fact...

2624
01:51:04,257 --> 01:51:06,969
After all the photography
is done

2625
01:51:06,993 --> 01:51:09,372
and you've got your movie
and now you're in a session

2626
01:51:09,396 --> 01:51:11,374
where you're looking at a scene

2627
01:51:11,398 --> 01:51:13,843
and you're making it
lighter or darker;

2628
01:51:13,867 --> 01:51:16,812
<i>at that point, I was in Tahiti</i>

2629
01:51:16,836 --> 01:51:18,381
on this other picture.

2630
01:51:18,405 --> 01:51:22,318
And so, the timing session
went on without us,

2631
01:51:22,342 --> 01:51:25,988
<i>with another member
of the organization who...</i>

2632
01:51:26,012 --> 01:51:29,358
He and I had not
communicated successfully.

2633
01:51:29,382 --> 01:51:31,827
<i>So, it was lit up
pretty brightly.</i>

2634
01:51:31,851 --> 01:51:35,131
<i>You saw everything,
and I was dismayed.</i>

2635
01:51:35,155 --> 01:51:39,035
And it was out there
before I could correct it.

2636
01:51:39,059 --> 01:51:41,837
<i>I would go back and
correct it now if I could.</i>

2637
01:51:41,861 --> 01:51:43,973
Okay and roll.

2638
01:51:45,865 --> 01:51:48,277
Five fifty-five, George.

2639
01:51:48,301 --> 01:51:50,146
Five fifty-five, Baker.

2640
01:51:50,170 --> 01:51:51,947
<i>I kept saying there has to be</i>

2641
01:51:51,971 --> 01:51:54,483
a weakness based in fear,

2642
01:51:54,507 --> 01:51:57,853
<i>not in physical strength,
that's inside Eddie.</i>

2643
01:51:57,877 --> 01:52:01,323
What is the secret that he has
not been able to tell anyone,

2644
01:52:01,347 --> 01:52:02,858
including these people?

2645
01:52:02,882 --> 01:52:05,961
<i>We're now crawling
through the tunnel</i>

2646
01:52:05,985 --> 01:52:08,931
<i>towards what will be the spider,</i>

2647
01:52:08,955 --> 01:52:12,334
<i>and that day
I'm saying to Tommy,</i>

2648
01:52:12,358 --> 01:52:15,171
"What are we going to do
about Eddie,

2649
01:52:15,195 --> 01:52:18,240
<i>and Eddie's fatal flaw,
his big fear?</i>

2650
01:52:18,264 --> 01:52:20,142
He hasn't confessed.

2651
01:52:20,166 --> 01:52:22,344
We know what's
going to happen to him

2652
01:52:22,368 --> 01:52:23,512
<i>moments after this."</i>

2653
01:52:23,536 --> 01:52:26,072
Push Dennis closer
to the monster, please.

2654
01:52:28,041 --> 01:52:30,453
Ready? Uh, Dennis' face
is blocked.

2655
01:52:30,477 --> 01:52:33,022
Yeah, go back up into that.

2656
01:52:33,046 --> 01:52:34,423
And then.

2657
01:52:34,447 --> 01:52:35,491
Action!

2658
01:52:44,157 --> 01:52:45,468
Cut!

2659
01:52:45,492 --> 01:52:47,436
<i>Eddie deserves to be completed.</i>

2660
01:52:47,460 --> 01:52:50,539
<i>So, I said to him at lunch
before we shot the scene,</i>

2661
01:52:50,563 --> 01:52:56,178
"What if he's just a virgin?
That's it. Finished."

2662
01:52:56,202 --> 01:52:57,147
Well,
I can't help you with that, pal,

2663
01:52:57,171 --> 01:52:58,414
but thanks for sharing.

2664
01:52:58,438 --> 01:52:59,815
Richie! Let him talk.

2665
01:52:59,839 --> 01:53:02,017
-We all saw how
uncomfortable, awkward

2666
01:53:02,041 --> 01:53:04,954
and really strange it is to...
It's not really strange,

2667
01:53:04,978 --> 01:53:06,889
it's not really strange at all,
it's a choice.

2668
01:53:06,913 --> 01:53:11,293
But how society reacts to people
that aren't sexual,

2669
01:53:11,317 --> 01:53:13,295
<i>and Eddie was not.</i>

2670
01:53:13,319 --> 01:53:14,463
I could
never sleep with somebody

2671
01:53:14,487 --> 01:53:16,899
that I didn't love.

2672
01:53:16,923 --> 01:53:19,058
And I've never
really loved anyone.

2673
01:53:21,161 --> 01:53:23,506
Except you guys.

2674
01:53:23,530 --> 01:53:24,474
And.

2675
01:53:24,498 --> 01:53:27,000
One, two, three, go!

2676
01:53:29,035 --> 01:53:31,280
<i>There are
things I wouldn't have done,</i>

2677
01:53:31,304 --> 01:53:33,415
<i>had I had the ability
to see in retrospect,</i>

2678
01:53:33,439 --> 01:53:36,352
<i>was the revelation of IT
as the spider.</i>

2679
01:53:36,376 --> 01:53:39,021
Had I been around, I would have
come up with something

2680
01:53:39,045 --> 01:53:40,180
involving Pennywise.

2681
01:53:42,916 --> 01:53:45,194
-Some things you can't
know until after the fact.

2682
01:53:45,218 --> 01:53:48,597
Who knew that Tim Curry was just
going to be such a home run?

2683
01:53:48,621 --> 01:53:53,068
It was like, okay, the book says
he disappears at this point

2684
01:53:53,092 --> 01:53:54,436
and never to return.

2685
01:53:54,460 --> 01:53:57,306
<i>But like probably
most of the audience</i>

2686
01:53:57,330 --> 01:54:01,043
<i>when I watch it, I go,
"Oh! There goes Tim."</i>

2687
01:54:05,572 --> 01:54:08,050
-Oh, I wish we could have
one more scene with him.

2688
01:54:08,074 --> 01:54:11,020
Some kind of goodbye scene,
some way of.

2689
01:54:11,044 --> 01:54:12,888
Well, maybe we should kill him,
you know?

2690
01:54:12,912 --> 01:54:17,092
Or maybe his face should be
the spider's face.

2691
01:54:17,116 --> 01:54:18,227
<i>Or... I don't know.</i>

2692
01:54:18,251 --> 01:54:19,962
That's a problem
we never solved.

2693
01:54:23,556 --> 01:54:25,100
You're ducking way down.

2694
01:54:25,124 --> 01:54:27,203
You got to look for the rock
standing straight up.

2695
01:54:27,227 --> 01:54:28,337
- Okay.
- It may look...

2696
01:54:28,361 --> 01:54:32,208
It may feel a little goofy, but.
- I... I didn't realize.

2697
01:54:32,232 --> 01:54:34,310
<i>I guess after
Beverly wounds the spider</i>

2698
01:54:34,334 --> 01:54:37,279
<i>with the slingshot and the rock
and it walks away,</i>

2699
01:54:37,303 --> 01:54:40,015
<i>when they came upon him
in that last bit,</i>

2700
01:54:40,039 --> 01:54:43,519
<i>had that been Tim Curry again,
mortally wounded,</i>

2701
01:54:43,543 --> 01:54:45,554
I think that might have been
a more satisfying ending,

2702
01:54:45,578 --> 01:54:48,457
<i>because you were just
so invested in Tim</i>

2703
01:54:48,481 --> 01:54:50,359
<i>as that villain at that point.</i>

2704
01:54:50,383 --> 01:54:52,595
-It would have been nice
had we been able to solve it,

2705
01:54:52,619 --> 01:54:56,232
<i>because I agree
that the story drops Pennywise,</i>

2706
01:54:56,256 --> 01:54:58,200
and he's such
an endearing character,

2707
01:54:58,224 --> 01:55:00,402
he deserved a better exit.

2708
01:55:00,426 --> 01:55:02,705
All right,
bring it to a climax now.

2709
01:55:02,729 --> 01:55:04,306
Everybody all at once.

2710
01:55:08,368 --> 01:55:09,378
And, cut!

2711
01:55:13,106 --> 01:55:15,150
<i>I suppose
people will revisit this</i>

2712
01:55:15,174 --> 01:55:16,652
<i>and know that it's a puppet,</i>

2713
01:55:16,676 --> 01:55:18,520
but it doesn't matter.

2714
01:55:18,544 --> 01:55:21,257
<i>The story returns
to the world of the psyche</i>

2715
01:55:21,281 --> 01:55:24,026
<i>and goes back into
very good territory, I think.</i>

2716
01:55:24,050 --> 01:55:25,995
<i>It goes back to the
heart of what the deep</i>

2717
01:55:26,019 --> 01:55:28,364
<i>thematic structure
of the piece is.</i>

2718
01:55:28,388 --> 01:55:30,199
The hardest part about that
for me really

2719
01:55:30,223 --> 01:55:32,167
was the fucking bicycle.

2720
01:55:32,191 --> 01:55:34,236
<i>Forget the horror and the drama,</i>

2721
01:55:34,260 --> 01:55:36,572
<i>it was the bicycle
that was the problem, okay?</i>

2722
01:55:36,596 --> 01:55:38,474
That's where the fear
and the terror was.

2723
01:55:38,498 --> 01:55:40,542
<i>I loved Olivia.
Great sense of humor,</i>

2724
01:55:40,566 --> 01:55:43,279
<i>but a fragility
which I thought was wonderful.</i>

2725
01:55:43,303 --> 01:55:46,148
And she was terrified
that I was going to kill her.

2726
01:55:46,172 --> 01:55:48,350
I know she was.
I think she said she was.

2727
01:55:48,374 --> 01:55:49,485
<i>I just said, "Please god,</i>

2728
01:55:49,509 --> 01:55:51,987
<i>let me not kill
this actress and myself."</i>

2729
01:55:52,011 --> 01:55:53,289
Hold on.

2730
01:55:53,313 --> 01:55:54,990
<i>You
can see the terror on my face</i>

2731
01:55:55,014 --> 01:55:56,458
<i>if you look very carefully.</i>

2732
01:55:56,482 --> 01:55:58,327
Behind the veneer
of performance,

2733
01:55:58,351 --> 01:55:59,361
<i>it's there.</i>

2734
01:55:59,385 --> 01:56:01,096
<i>I will forever associate Olivia</i>

2735
01:56:01,120 --> 01:56:04,223
<i>with going downhill
at speed on a bike.</i>

2736
01:56:21,107 --> 01:56:24,353
Alan and I
went down to the agency

2737
01:56:24,377 --> 01:56:27,656
<i>to meet with Stephen
and show him the picture.</i>

2738
01:56:27,680 --> 01:56:29,358
They had a screening room
all set up.

2739
01:56:29,382 --> 01:56:31,293
<i>And I remember he came up to us</i>

2740
01:56:31,317 --> 01:56:34,129
<i>and I put my hand out to shake
Stephen's hand</i>

2741
01:56:34,153 --> 01:56:37,766
<i>and he had a rat in it,</i>

2742
01:56:37,790 --> 01:56:40,502
a rubber rat.

2743
01:56:40,526 --> 01:56:44,073
It was kind of like
a shocking thing, you know,

2744
01:56:44,097 --> 01:56:45,774
and it was, I don't know,
maybe to break the ice.

2745
01:56:45,798 --> 01:56:48,377
<i>We had a few exchanged words</i>

2746
01:56:48,401 --> 01:56:51,080
and then he saw it privately.

2747
01:56:51,104 --> 01:56:53,549
<i>He didn't want us to be
there, but, um, we later heard</i>

2748
01:56:53,573 --> 01:56:55,250
that he liked it
and he was happy.

2749
01:56:55,274 --> 01:56:59,655
<i>I was
certain when we got a final cut</i>

2750
01:56:59,679 --> 01:57:01,657
that we had a good movie.

2751
01:57:01,681 --> 01:57:04,226
<i>At the premiere,
I was really just thinking</i>

2752
01:57:04,250 --> 01:57:07,720
that I can't believe I'm
actually a part of this film.

2753
01:57:09,122 --> 01:57:10,299
<i>The results were,</i>

2754
01:57:10,323 --> 01:57:13,268
<i>that we got a viewership
of 30 million people.</i>

2755
01:57:13,292 --> 01:57:15,304
<i>It was huge in the ratings.</i>

2756
01:57:15,328 --> 01:57:18,073
It was viewed as a big success.

2757
01:57:18,097 --> 01:57:21,677
<i>And the press on it
was very positive.</i>

2758
01:57:21,701 --> 01:57:24,246
<i>I think
the legacy of the original IT</i>

2759
01:57:24,270 --> 01:57:26,582
<i>was this brilliant performance</i>

2760
01:57:26,606 --> 01:57:29,551
on TV, which you would
usually see in film,

2761
01:57:29,575 --> 01:57:31,353
<i>in your living rooms.</i>

2762
01:57:31,377 --> 01:57:35,824
-It was just
an extraordinary event to.

2763
01:57:35,848 --> 01:57:40,396
<i>Have this King first piece for
TV as a mini-series</i>

2764
01:57:40,420 --> 01:57:42,865
come out and stake
that kind of territory

2765
01:57:42,889 --> 01:57:45,234
and resonate so strongly
with people.

2766
01:57:45,258 --> 01:57:49,104
<i>It became the proverbial
water cooler mini-series.</i>

2767
01:57:49,128 --> 01:57:51,573
And I think it then
went on to have

2768
01:57:51,597 --> 01:57:54,877
<i>the most unexpected afterlife.</i>

2769
01:57:54,901 --> 01:57:55,812
<i>I think the reason</i>

2770
01:57:55,836 --> 01:57:59,548
that IT was so successful
at scaring people

2771
01:57:59,572 --> 01:58:02,584
<i>is because these characters
don't have the ability</i>

2772
01:58:02,608 --> 01:58:06,688
<i>to name what scares them
or the forces that oppress them.</i>

2773
01:58:06,712 --> 01:58:08,424
<i>The high point was going up</i>

2774
01:58:08,448 --> 01:58:09,782
<i>and receiving the Emmy.</i>

2775
01:58:11,217 --> 01:58:13,595
<i>I'm told that when they
announced my name.</i>

2776
01:58:13,619 --> 01:58:15,564
Bam! I was gone.

2777
01:58:15,588 --> 01:58:17,633
<i>You know, as if I thought
they were going to take it back</i>

2778
01:58:17,657 --> 01:58:20,269
<i>if I didn't get up to
the podium quickly enough.</i>

2779
01:58:20,293 --> 01:58:24,807
-He just made magic
with that score.

2780
01:58:29,335 --> 01:58:33,916
- Meep, meep.
S.S. Georgie underway.

2781
01:58:33,940 --> 01:58:35,617
Rocks! Rocks?

2782
01:58:35,641 --> 01:58:36,776
Rocks!

2783
01:58:40,880 --> 01:58:42,224
<i>It 's a very lonely Emmy</i>

2784
01:58:42,248 --> 01:58:44,359
<i>sitting in my house,</i>

2785
01:58:44,383 --> 01:58:46,628
but that's all right.

2786
01:58:46,652 --> 01:58:50,833
<i>I credit Tim and Stephen King
for my Emmy.</i>

2787
01:58:50,857 --> 01:58:53,302
<i>It's very difficult
to write music</i>

2788
01:58:53,326 --> 01:58:57,473
<i>when the story is flawed
or when the acting is poor.</i>

2789
01:58:57,497 --> 01:59:01,243
When the story is.
I mean, that great,

2790
01:59:01,267 --> 01:59:03,645
and the performances
are that good,

2791
01:59:03,669 --> 01:59:08,617
<i>that all adds up
to any department's Emmy.</i>

2792
01:59:08,641 --> 01:59:12,278
You're elevated by those
performances in that story.

2793
01:59:17,416 --> 01:59:20,195
-One of the reasons that I think
it's a cult favorite

2794
01:59:20,219 --> 01:59:23,465
<i>is because
of Tim Curry and the clown.</i>

2795
01:59:23,489 --> 01:59:24,733
<i>He 's everything.</i>

2796
01:59:24,757 --> 01:59:26,502
He is the poster,

2797
01:59:26,526 --> 01:59:27,769
<i>he's on T-shirts.</i>

2798
01:59:27,793 --> 01:59:29,204
<i>Pop culture has taken</i>

2799
01:59:29,228 --> 01:59:31,673
<i>ownership of this miniseries.</i>

2800
01:59:31,697 --> 01:59:34,400
-Without the benefit of any CGI,

2801
01:59:36,269 --> 01:59:41,783
<i>just balls to the walls talent,
Tim nailed it in a way that.</i>

2802
01:59:41,807 --> 01:59:44,520
You say "IT"
and people say "Tim Curry."

2803
01:59:44,544 --> 01:59:47,389
Me?

2804
01:59:47,413 --> 01:59:49,291
-I think it's really
interesting how

2805
01:59:49,315 --> 01:59:53,328
<i>the Pennywise character
continues to gain that fan base.</i>

2806
01:59:53,352 --> 01:59:55,230
<i>As the internet grew,</i>

2807
01:59:55,254 --> 01:59:56,465
I started to really realize

2808
01:59:56,489 --> 01:59:58,433
<i>how much of an impact he had,</i>

2809
01:59:58,457 --> 02:00:00,569
and the film had
on a lot of people.

2810
02:00:03,529 --> 02:00:05,541
<i>Now we're in an age where</i>

2811
02:00:05,565 --> 02:00:07,676
<i>nostalgic things
are being passed down.</i>

2812
02:00:07,700 --> 02:00:10,546
We generationally are choosing
what icons to perpetuate

2813
02:00:10,570 --> 02:00:11,947
<i>to future generations.</i>

2814
02:00:11,971 --> 02:00:15,317
<i>Pennywise
as an ultimate horror icon,</i>

2815
02:00:15,341 --> 02:00:18,921
a demonic infinite that has
access to your deepest fears,

2816
02:00:18,945 --> 02:00:22,925
<i>I don't think that's gonna
dull anytime soon.</i>

2817
02:00:22,949 --> 02:00:25,594
<i>I'm just so happy to be part</i>

2818
02:00:25,618 --> 02:00:30,799
<i>of what Stephen King created
and part of what Tommy Lee</i>

2819
02:00:30,823 --> 02:00:32,601
gave to America.

2820
02:00:32,625 --> 02:00:34,570
<i>Being familiar
with Stephen King's work</i>

2821
02:00:34,594 --> 02:00:36,572
<i>and actually being able to
help realize this</i>

2822
02:00:36,596 --> 02:00:38,740
on any capacity
was a thrill for me.

2823
02:00:38,764 --> 02:00:40,484
We did it! Yeah!

2824
02:00:42,802 --> 02:00:44,604
-I enjoyed the tension.

2825
02:00:46,572 --> 02:00:48,717
I mean, not as a person
but as an actor.

2826
02:00:48,741 --> 02:00:50,919
<i>Throughout the whole
process of shooting IT,</i>

2827
02:00:50,943 --> 02:00:54,456
I was learning at
such an exponential rate.

2828
02:00:54,480 --> 02:00:57,292
<i>I was discovering
that there was more to acting</i>

2829
02:00:57,316 --> 02:00:58,994
<i>than standing on your mark.</i>

2830
02:00:59,018 --> 02:00:59,729
Take the outside

2831
02:00:59,753 --> 02:01:01,797
instead of the inside, Brandon.

2832
02:01:01,821 --> 02:01:02,699
There's a lot of room
right there.

2833
02:01:02,723 --> 02:01:04,933
Not too far out,
squeeze in behind Bill.

2834
02:01:04,957 --> 02:01:07,369
-I was loving it.

2835
02:01:07,393 --> 02:01:08,604
<i>I think it fits well</i>

2836
02:01:08,628 --> 02:01:12,074
<i>amongst some of the great
icons of the genre.</i>

2837
02:01:12,098 --> 02:01:15,410
There's even a comedic aspect
to it that was never intended.

2838
02:01:15,434 --> 02:01:16,712
Beep-beep!

2839
02:01:16,736 --> 02:01:17,846
<i>I never
would have known or thought</i>

2840
02:01:17,870 --> 02:01:19,715
<i>that it would have
become a cult classic.</i>

2841
02:01:19,739 --> 02:01:21,516
I always thought
that it was a great story.

2842
02:01:21,540 --> 02:01:23,485
<i>But I never realized</i>

2843
02:01:23,509 --> 02:01:25,587
<i>that it would go
as far as it's gotten.</i>

2844
02:01:25,611 --> 02:01:27,456
<i>I'm very proud of it</i>

2845
02:01:27,480 --> 02:01:30,692
<i>and I'm used to the
idea of cult movies,</i>

2846
02:01:30,716 --> 02:01:32,894
<i>so I'm glad that
it's having a life.</i>

2847
02:01:32,918 --> 02:01:34,763
It's a cracking story.

2848
02:01:34,787 --> 02:01:36,331
<i>The popularity of IT</i>

2849
02:01:36,355 --> 02:01:38,900
<i>down through the years
is multi-layered.</i>

2850
02:01:38,924 --> 02:01:43,405
<i>I think first it speaks
to really fine performances.</i>

2851
02:01:43,429 --> 02:01:45,107
That's first and foremost.

2852
02:01:45,131 --> 02:01:48,510
A good story as the foundation.

2853
02:01:48,534 --> 02:01:49,811
A great script,

2854
02:01:49,835 --> 02:01:51,513
<i>at least in Night One.</i>

2855
02:01:51,537 --> 02:01:53,115
Competent directing.

2856
02:01:53,139 --> 02:01:56,785
<i>That's a formula for something
that will be viewed</i>

2857
02:01:56,809 --> 02:02:00,555
<i>more than once among those
who consider it a favorite.</i>

2858
02:02:00,579 --> 02:02:01,690
They'll watch it again.

2859
02:02:01,714 --> 02:02:05,727
-Down here we all float!