1 00:00:12,445 --> 00:00:14,312 ♪♪♪ 2 00:00:14,314 --> 00:00:16,448 Reporter: Just hours after he left for work, 3 00:00:16,450 --> 00:00:18,383 George altidor became concerned 4 00:00:18,385 --> 00:00:20,719 When no one answered the phone at his home. 5 00:00:20,721 --> 00:00:24,523 What police would find inside the home no one could imagine. 6 00:00:24,525 --> 00:00:27,259 29-year-old marie altidor was lying in a pool of blood. 7 00:00:27,261 --> 00:00:29,261 Also dead--her mother 8 00:00:29,263 --> 00:00:31,163 And the couple's two small children, 9 00:00:31,165 --> 00:00:32,965 Brutally murdered. 10 00:00:36,670 --> 00:00:38,203 Have you ever had one this bad? 11 00:00:38,205 --> 00:00:41,206 No. None of our cases are easy, 12 00:00:41,208 --> 00:00:45,077 But this one takes it to an all-new low. 13 00:00:45,079 --> 00:00:47,946 ♪ captive of my own thoughts ♪ 14 00:00:47,948 --> 00:00:51,216 ♪ battles I have not fought ♪ 15 00:00:51,218 --> 00:00:56,021 ♪ catch the light ♪ 16 00:00:56,023 --> 00:00:58,557 Tonya and I are here in miramar, florida, 17 00:00:58,559 --> 00:01:01,760 To investigate one of the most horrific 18 00:01:01,762 --> 00:01:04,230 And heartbreaking cases we've ever worked on-- 19 00:01:04,232 --> 00:01:09,234 The 24-year-old murders of "mamie" marie altidor, 20 00:01:09,236 --> 00:01:10,902 Her mom theresia, 21 00:01:10,904 --> 00:01:14,940 Her 2-year-old daughter, and her 6-week-old daughter. 22 00:01:14,942 --> 00:01:18,244 She's 29 years old, and her mom is here from haiti visiting her, 23 00:01:18,246 --> 00:01:22,314 60 years old, and then those two babies. 24 00:01:22,316 --> 00:01:24,984 Three generations all wiped out. 25 00:01:24,986 --> 00:01:26,585 Marie was a haitian immigrant 26 00:01:26,587 --> 00:01:28,920 Who was very devoted to her family. 27 00:01:28,922 --> 00:01:31,123 On April the 30th, 1997, 28 00:01:31,125 --> 00:01:34,259 Her husband george returned home from work 29 00:01:34,261 --> 00:01:36,795 To find marie and her mom theresia 30 00:01:36,797 --> 00:01:40,332 Both fatally shot and beaten with a hammer, 31 00:01:40,334 --> 00:01:44,603 Along with his two babies, dead from blunt force trauma. 32 00:01:44,605 --> 00:01:48,473 Within that very gruesome scene, a big clue was left behind. 33 00:01:48,475 --> 00:01:50,809 And then we have that note on the wall-- 34 00:01:50,811 --> 00:01:52,611 "they stole my $100,000." 35 00:01:52,613 --> 00:01:53,913 -Yeah. -Drug money, right? 36 00:01:53,915 --> 00:01:57,282 Right. Who's gonna take the time to do that? 37 00:01:57,284 --> 00:02:00,018 And why even write on the wall? 38 00:02:00,020 --> 00:02:01,220 It's not often a killer leaves a note, 39 00:02:01,222 --> 00:02:02,554 So there's clearly a purpose behind it. 40 00:02:02,556 --> 00:02:04,489 But was it actually written by drug dealers, 41 00:02:04,491 --> 00:02:07,559 Or is someone else trying to throw off investigators? 42 00:02:07,561 --> 00:02:13,099 Using a hammer is so much more personal and violent and vicious 43 00:02:13,101 --> 00:02:14,633 Than a gun or a knife. 44 00:02:14,635 --> 00:02:15,901 Right. 45 00:02:15,903 --> 00:02:17,169 Cracking a 6-week-old baby's skull. 46 00:02:17,171 --> 00:02:20,706 -I don't-- -and a 2-year-old baby's skull 47 00:02:20,708 --> 00:02:22,908 That's hiding with her dollies behind a couch. 48 00:02:22,910 --> 00:02:24,309 Who could do that? 49 00:02:24,311 --> 00:02:26,511 There could not be any more vulnerable victims. 50 00:02:26,513 --> 00:02:28,714 -It's a monster. -Exactly. 51 00:02:30,918 --> 00:02:33,318 It has been 16 years and still no answers... 52 00:02:33,320 --> 00:02:35,387 Police consider her killing a cult killing... 53 00:02:35,389 --> 00:02:37,356 Years later, the case is still unsolved... 54 00:02:39,194 --> 00:02:42,595 Siegler: I've chosen cold cases from across the country 55 00:02:42,597 --> 00:02:45,564 And teamed up with the best detectives to solve them. 56 00:02:49,471 --> 00:02:51,536 We're more determined than ever 57 00:02:51,538 --> 00:02:53,238 To bring justice to these victims. 58 00:02:55,810 --> 00:03:03,014 ♪♪♪ 59 00:03:03,016 --> 00:03:04,317 -Morning. -Hello. Good morning. 60 00:03:04,319 --> 00:03:05,283 Hi, ladies. 61 00:03:05,285 --> 00:03:06,585 -Hi. Tonya rider. -Hi. 62 00:03:06,587 --> 00:03:08,153 -I'm jonathan zeller. -Welcome. Danny smith. 63 00:03:08,155 --> 00:03:09,554 -Nice to meet you. -Welcome. 64 00:03:09,556 --> 00:03:10,690 Well, we read it all. We studied it all. 65 00:03:10,692 --> 00:03:13,159 We wanna do whatever we can to help you all. 66 00:03:13,161 --> 00:03:14,893 Thank you very much. We're very happy to have you guys. 67 00:03:14,895 --> 00:03:16,094 Absolutely. 68 00:03:16,096 --> 00:03:17,964 There's not a more horrible case than this. 69 00:03:17,966 --> 00:03:21,900 It's really weighed heavily on the hearts of residents, 70 00:03:21,902 --> 00:03:23,235 Family, obviously, and the officers 71 00:03:23,237 --> 00:03:24,569 That were here at the time 72 00:03:24,571 --> 00:03:27,906 And have kinda caught up with it over time. 73 00:03:27,908 --> 00:03:29,107 Absolutely. 74 00:03:29,109 --> 00:03:30,375 -Y'all ready to get to work? -Let's go. 75 00:03:30,377 --> 00:03:31,309 -Let's do it. -I think we got a lot to do. 76 00:03:31,311 --> 00:03:32,810 -Yeah. -Okay. 77 00:03:32,812 --> 00:03:36,281 This case will stick with me for the rest of my life. 78 00:03:36,283 --> 00:03:37,916 Nobody deserves to die like that, okay? 79 00:03:37,918 --> 00:03:40,653 Especially the two kids. 80 00:03:40,655 --> 00:03:43,523 And there's nothing I want more than to solve this 81 00:03:43,525 --> 00:03:47,392 And bring justice for-- for the victims. 82 00:03:47,394 --> 00:03:50,729 Okay, let's--let's start off with putting 83 00:03:50,731 --> 00:03:52,731 Our victims up on the wall. 84 00:03:52,733 --> 00:03:55,000 Gonna start with the baby. 85 00:03:55,002 --> 00:03:57,135 The baby was how old, guys? 86 00:03:57,137 --> 00:03:58,937 -6 weeks. -6 weeks. 87 00:03:58,939 --> 00:04:00,872 -And her name? -Officers: Sabrina. 88 00:04:00,874 --> 00:04:04,609 And then we have her older sister. 89 00:04:04,611 --> 00:04:06,077 -Samantha. -Samantha. 90 00:04:06,079 --> 00:04:07,046 -Who was how old? -2 years old. 91 00:04:07,048 --> 00:04:09,514 -2 years old. -2. 92 00:04:09,516 --> 00:04:12,751 -And then we have marie. -Yes. 93 00:04:12,753 --> 00:04:14,020 -Last name altidor? -Altidor. 94 00:04:14,022 --> 00:04:15,755 And her nickname was "mamie," right? 95 00:04:15,757 --> 00:04:17,555 Yes. 96 00:04:17,557 --> 00:04:19,624 Who was how old when this happened? 97 00:04:19,626 --> 00:04:21,159 -29? -29. 98 00:04:21,161 --> 00:04:22,695 And then we have theresia laverne, 99 00:04:22,697 --> 00:04:25,030 And theresia was 60. 100 00:04:25,032 --> 00:04:28,099 Theresia is marie altidor's mom. 101 00:04:28,101 --> 00:04:29,669 She lives in haiti. 102 00:04:29,671 --> 00:04:33,105 She offered to come to miramar and help her with the new baby. 103 00:04:33,107 --> 00:04:35,241 Who is in this picture with our mother-in-law? 104 00:04:35,243 --> 00:04:39,177 -Marie, her mom theresia. -George altidor. 105 00:04:39,179 --> 00:04:40,445 -And george. -Correct. 106 00:04:40,447 --> 00:04:42,081 That's horrible. 107 00:04:42,083 --> 00:04:46,317 Sabrina, at 6 weeks old-- she would be 24 now, 108 00:04:46,319 --> 00:04:48,721 Presumably in her career, maybe married, 109 00:04:48,723 --> 00:04:51,189 Maybe kids of her own, 110 00:04:51,191 --> 00:04:54,393 And nobody in her family got a chance to-- 111 00:04:54,395 --> 00:04:56,861 To experience any of that, and that goes for samantha 112 00:04:56,863 --> 00:05:00,031 And marie also, and ms. Laverne. 113 00:05:00,033 --> 00:05:01,867 It's three generations. 114 00:05:01,869 --> 00:05:04,669 We owe the family a resolution to this case. 115 00:05:04,671 --> 00:05:08,873 April 30, 1997. Tell us how it all began, danny. 116 00:05:08,875 --> 00:05:11,777 The husband, george altidor, left his house at 7 a.M. 117 00:05:11,779 --> 00:05:15,146 He got to work. He tried to reach marie 118 00:05:15,148 --> 00:05:16,581 Numerous times throughout the day. 119 00:05:16,583 --> 00:05:20,451 He was unable to. He contacts his brother-in-law, 120 00:05:20,453 --> 00:05:23,488 Says, "can you run by my house? Starting to get worried." 121 00:05:23,490 --> 00:05:27,025 Brother-in-law went to the altidor residence, 122 00:05:27,027 --> 00:05:28,993 Found three generations, slain. 123 00:05:28,995 --> 00:05:32,898 Marie and her mom were both shot and savagely beaten 124 00:05:32,900 --> 00:05:34,833 With a blunt force object. 125 00:05:34,835 --> 00:05:37,068 The children were killed by a hammer 126 00:05:37,070 --> 00:05:38,703 Or a hammer-like object. 127 00:05:38,705 --> 00:05:40,972 We think that our murder weapon is a revolver? 128 00:05:40,974 --> 00:05:43,375 -We do. -And how many shots are fired? 129 00:05:43,377 --> 00:05:44,644 -Five. -Five. 130 00:05:44,646 --> 00:05:46,578 Okay, so let's break down the crime scene. 131 00:05:46,580 --> 00:05:49,715 The front door was unlocked. 132 00:05:49,717 --> 00:05:51,984 There's no signs of forced entry. 133 00:05:51,986 --> 00:05:53,118 The instrument was not left. 134 00:05:53,120 --> 00:05:55,520 There was no firearm left on scene. 135 00:05:55,522 --> 00:05:57,856 There were no casings anywhere throughout the house. 136 00:05:57,858 --> 00:06:00,191 In the area where sabrina and samantha were found, 137 00:06:00,193 --> 00:06:01,860 There was writing on the wall. 138 00:06:01,862 --> 00:06:04,363 It read, "I want my $100,000 drug money. 139 00:06:04,365 --> 00:06:06,932 They stole my drugs." 140 00:06:06,934 --> 00:06:08,633 So that's your single biggest clue, then, 141 00:06:08,635 --> 00:06:11,403 That writing on the wall. -Absolutely. 142 00:06:11,405 --> 00:06:12,604 Investigators didn't find any evidence 143 00:06:12,606 --> 00:06:15,140 Of drugs or drug activity, 144 00:06:15,142 --> 00:06:17,108 Which raises the possibility that the message 145 00:06:17,110 --> 00:06:20,078 Was actually written just to divert the attention 146 00:06:20,080 --> 00:06:22,213 Away from the true killer. 147 00:06:22,215 --> 00:06:23,882 So the investigators began looking at the person 148 00:06:23,884 --> 00:06:26,018 Closest to the victims. 149 00:06:26,020 --> 00:06:27,887 The handwriting had been looked at twice. 150 00:06:27,889 --> 00:06:30,690 They actually had the husband, george, write 151 00:06:30,692 --> 00:06:32,957 The same phrase over and over and over again. 152 00:06:32,959 --> 00:06:35,293 And so far, your handwriting experts say 153 00:06:35,295 --> 00:06:36,562 Just inconclusive? 154 00:06:36,564 --> 00:06:37,696 -Inconclusive. -Okay. 155 00:06:37,698 --> 00:06:39,563 -Times two. -Times two. 156 00:06:39,565 --> 00:06:42,167 So we're gonna send off george's handwriting 157 00:06:42,169 --> 00:06:43,969 To the new handwriting expert 158 00:06:43,971 --> 00:06:45,570 To see what he says. 159 00:06:45,572 --> 00:06:48,439 Very, very, very curious to see how that goes. 160 00:06:48,441 --> 00:06:49,974 Yeah, I agree. 161 00:06:49,976 --> 00:06:53,179 So talking over here, starting on our suspect board. 162 00:06:53,181 --> 00:06:55,914 Let's put up here george. 163 00:06:55,916 --> 00:07:00,117 George, at the time, I believe he was 33. 164 00:07:00,119 --> 00:07:01,353 He's from haiti. 165 00:07:01,355 --> 00:07:03,555 So let's start with the big picture-- 166 00:07:03,557 --> 00:07:07,459 The marriage, the relationship between george and marie. 167 00:07:07,461 --> 00:07:08,594 What evidence do we have 168 00:07:08,596 --> 00:07:11,263 That they had any trouble in that marriage? 169 00:07:11,265 --> 00:07:12,865 -None. -None. 170 00:07:12,867 --> 00:07:14,467 Nobody's talking about divorce. 171 00:07:14,469 --> 00:07:17,735 I think marie normally took pride in keeping 172 00:07:17,737 --> 00:07:19,137 Her personal life private. 173 00:07:19,139 --> 00:07:22,807 Which is pretty common in the haitian community. 174 00:07:22,809 --> 00:07:24,610 We don't know of any marital issues 175 00:07:24,612 --> 00:07:27,413 Between george and marie, and it's crazy to think 176 00:07:27,415 --> 00:07:30,481 That a father could do that to his own babies. 177 00:07:30,483 --> 00:07:32,885 But if george is a monster, 178 00:07:32,887 --> 00:07:34,819 Then we're gonna need to find a motive. 179 00:07:34,821 --> 00:07:38,891 Okay, so let's break down the person george altidor is. 180 00:07:38,893 --> 00:07:40,625 So what do we have 181 00:07:40,627 --> 00:07:42,427 That goes toward being able to do that? 182 00:07:42,429 --> 00:07:45,230 -The first wife. -And what'd she tell you all? 183 00:07:45,232 --> 00:07:47,165 -His jealousy. -Yeah. 184 00:07:47,167 --> 00:07:48,567 She was also very afraid of him. 185 00:07:48,569 --> 00:07:49,767 Yes. 186 00:07:49,769 --> 00:07:53,037 When he pointed the gun at her... 187 00:07:53,039 --> 00:07:54,239 The exact quote of what she said, 188 00:07:54,241 --> 00:07:57,375 I think from george was, 189 00:07:57,377 --> 00:08:00,011 "if I kill you, nobody would know." 190 00:08:00,013 --> 00:08:01,646 "nobody would know." 191 00:08:01,648 --> 00:08:03,214 During the initial investigation, 192 00:08:03,216 --> 00:08:04,849 George's ex-wife told the police 193 00:08:04,851 --> 00:08:06,852 That years before he had threatened her at gunpoint, 194 00:08:06,854 --> 00:08:08,921 But george claimed he never owned a gun. 195 00:08:08,923 --> 00:08:11,991 This shows not only his temper but maybe his mindset. 196 00:08:11,993 --> 00:08:14,927 Maybe he thinks he's clever enough to outsmart police. 197 00:08:14,929 --> 00:08:16,527 Um, what about the number of calls 198 00:08:16,529 --> 00:08:19,797 Once he starts checking on 'em? Do we think those are odd? 199 00:08:19,799 --> 00:08:21,467 That, to me, is a little extreme. 200 00:08:21,469 --> 00:08:22,935 -Okay. -Yeah, like it escalated... 201 00:08:22,937 --> 00:08:24,937 -Right. -...Really quickly. 202 00:08:24,939 --> 00:08:27,806 According to phone records, george called home 16 times 203 00:08:27,808 --> 00:08:30,174 Trying to get ahold of marie that day, 204 00:08:30,176 --> 00:08:32,410 But on other days, he didn't seem nearly as persistent 205 00:08:32,412 --> 00:08:34,078 When he couldn't get ahold of her. 206 00:08:34,080 --> 00:08:35,713 So was he sincerely concerned 207 00:08:35,715 --> 00:08:37,715 Or just trying to appear that he was? 208 00:08:37,717 --> 00:08:42,153 Okay. Let's put up here drug-related random intruder. 209 00:08:42,155 --> 00:08:44,489 So the note on the wall, message on the wall. 210 00:08:44,491 --> 00:08:45,690 Message on the wall. 211 00:08:45,692 --> 00:08:46,891 'cause that's what it was meant to be. 212 00:08:46,893 --> 00:08:48,559 It was meant to be a message, right? 213 00:08:48,561 --> 00:08:50,561 -But to who? -It was meant to be a message 214 00:08:50,563 --> 00:08:52,531 To the owner of the house, 215 00:08:52,533 --> 00:08:53,898 "ha ha ha. Look what I did to you 216 00:08:53,900 --> 00:08:56,234 'cause you owe me $100,000." 217 00:08:56,236 --> 00:08:58,236 Was there ever any evidence that george 218 00:08:58,238 --> 00:09:00,840 Or anybody in that family was ever involved in drugs? 219 00:09:00,842 --> 00:09:05,109 No. This is just a very normal, you know, home. 220 00:09:05,111 --> 00:09:08,913 Okay, now let's talk about that phone call at 7. 221 00:09:08,915 --> 00:09:09,847 7:09. 222 00:09:09,849 --> 00:09:11,916 "marie?" 223 00:09:11,918 --> 00:09:14,519 The call did originate from their landline, 224 00:09:14,521 --> 00:09:17,722 And it went to a relative in maryland, 225 00:09:17,724 --> 00:09:19,658 And we confirmed that with them. 226 00:09:19,660 --> 00:09:22,328 -What do we do with that? -That's the question, kelly. 227 00:09:22,330 --> 00:09:24,063 We don't know when the murders occurred, 228 00:09:24,065 --> 00:09:26,597 But the police department does believe 229 00:09:26,599 --> 00:09:29,467 That marie's godmother received a call 230 00:09:29,469 --> 00:09:33,405 From the house at 7:09 that morning. 231 00:09:33,407 --> 00:09:37,609 The thing is, george's coworkers confirmed way back then 232 00:09:37,611 --> 00:09:40,579 That george got to work on time at 7:30 that morning. 233 00:09:40,581 --> 00:09:44,215 There's no way that george could have killed 234 00:09:44,217 --> 00:09:48,186 His whole family after that phone call at 7:09 235 00:09:48,188 --> 00:09:50,555 And still made it to work on time. 236 00:09:50,557 --> 00:09:52,457 And that brings us back to the possibility 237 00:09:52,459 --> 00:09:55,226 Of an unknown suspect. 238 00:09:55,228 --> 00:09:57,963 Why do you need to kill a baby that can't even speak 239 00:09:57,965 --> 00:09:59,964 Or a 2-year-old? 240 00:09:59,966 --> 00:10:02,166 That's senseless. There's no reason for it. 241 00:10:02,168 --> 00:10:05,370 Why even use a hammer? If you're going there with a gun, 242 00:10:05,372 --> 00:10:06,971 Shoot everybody, and be done with it. 243 00:10:06,973 --> 00:10:08,239 Shoot everybody. 244 00:10:08,241 --> 00:10:10,575 I see the hammer as overkill rage. 245 00:10:10,577 --> 00:10:12,510 We have so many unanswered questions. 246 00:10:12,512 --> 00:10:16,481 Was this revenge? Was this staged? 247 00:10:16,483 --> 00:10:18,984 Could it have been more than one person, 248 00:10:18,986 --> 00:10:22,287 And how could anybody do something this horrible? 249 00:10:25,325 --> 00:10:28,060 ♪ are we in a dream? ♪ 250 00:10:28,062 --> 00:10:34,532 ♪ am I gonna wake up just to see that you're gone? ♪ 251 00:10:34,534 --> 00:10:36,802 ♪ gone ♪ 252 00:10:36,804 --> 00:10:41,740 Do you have any other cases nearly as sad as this one? 253 00:10:41,742 --> 00:10:45,611 No. Nothing--nothing that really even comes close to this. 254 00:10:45,613 --> 00:10:48,814 I've investigated this case and spoke with the family 255 00:10:48,816 --> 00:10:51,282 For about half of my career. 256 00:10:51,284 --> 00:10:53,351 We have grown close over the years. 257 00:10:53,353 --> 00:10:55,887 So yeah, I mean, you can't help but to say it's personal. 258 00:10:55,889 --> 00:10:57,922 -Hello, ladies. -Hello. 259 00:10:57,924 --> 00:11:00,125 This is that homicide, 260 00:11:00,127 --> 00:11:04,028 That violent crime that I cannot shake. 261 00:11:04,030 --> 00:11:05,830 This is my adopted haitian family. 262 00:11:05,832 --> 00:11:06,898 -I like that. -Yeah. 263 00:11:06,900 --> 00:11:08,466 [laughter] 264 00:11:08,468 --> 00:11:11,370 Can you tell us what marie was like? 265 00:11:11,372 --> 00:11:12,537 -Yeah. -And what'd she like to do? 266 00:11:23,450 --> 00:11:25,383 We grew up like sisters. I think that we-- 267 00:11:25,385 --> 00:11:27,452 All of our cousins. We have a big family, 268 00:11:27,454 --> 00:11:30,188 But we really knew each other very well. 269 00:11:30,190 --> 00:11:33,725 And how about your mom? What was she like? 270 00:11:43,470 --> 00:11:45,537 Were y'all able to visit enough to get to know samantha? 271 00:11:45,539 --> 00:11:47,271 She was only 2. 272 00:11:47,273 --> 00:11:50,142 Samantha--she was lovely. 273 00:12:42,195 --> 00:12:43,328 ♪♪♪ 274 00:12:57,745 --> 00:13:01,012 Listening to this family talk about 275 00:13:01,014 --> 00:13:04,015 How horribly devastating this has been to them, 276 00:13:04,017 --> 00:13:06,552 What do you say to 'em? 277 00:13:06,554 --> 00:13:08,819 Who could possibly say anything 278 00:13:08,821 --> 00:13:10,355 That's gonna make them feel any better? 279 00:13:10,357 --> 00:13:12,557 In those days around the funeral, 280 00:13:12,559 --> 00:13:14,759 Was there ever a time where george said to you 281 00:13:14,761 --> 00:13:16,694 From his mouth what he thinks happened, 282 00:13:16,696 --> 00:13:19,297 Who could've done this? 283 00:13:19,299 --> 00:13:21,566 Never? 284 00:13:21,568 --> 00:13:24,168 It's your mother and your sister and your nieces. 285 00:13:24,170 --> 00:13:28,307 And he's never out of his mouth tried to tell you anything. 286 00:13:33,046 --> 00:13:36,448 And to this day, all these years later... 287 00:13:36,450 --> 00:13:37,983 Nothing? 288 00:13:40,253 --> 00:13:41,253 Nothing. 289 00:13:41,255 --> 00:13:45,523 That's crazy, you know? 290 00:13:45,525 --> 00:13:47,325 We were all-- we're still in shock. 291 00:13:47,327 --> 00:13:49,327 There has to be justice. 292 00:13:49,461 --> 00:13:55,166 ♪♪♪ 293 00:13:55,167 --> 00:14:00,872 Our handwriting expert is ready to give us his findings. 294 00:14:00,875 --> 00:14:03,008 -You wanna call him? -Okay. 295 00:14:03,010 --> 00:14:07,278 [line rings] 296 00:14:07,280 --> 00:14:08,446 Good afternoon. 297 00:14:08,448 --> 00:14:09,548 Hey, grant, it's, uh, danny smith 298 00:14:09,550 --> 00:14:10,749 From the miramar police department. 299 00:14:10,751 --> 00:14:12,517 So how are we looking? 300 00:14:15,556 --> 00:14:19,490 In 1997, marie altidor, her mom theresia, 301 00:14:19,492 --> 00:14:21,893 And her babies were brutally murdered. 302 00:14:21,895 --> 00:14:25,898 The message on the wall implied that it was drug-related, 303 00:14:25,900 --> 00:14:27,365 But investigators have always suspected 304 00:14:27,367 --> 00:14:30,168 That maybe it was written by her husband george. 305 00:14:30,170 --> 00:14:32,203 We've asked our handwriting expert to compare 306 00:14:32,205 --> 00:14:35,574 The message on the wall to old handwriting samples 307 00:14:35,576 --> 00:14:37,576 Given by george. 308 00:14:37,578 --> 00:14:39,510 If george is the author of that note, 309 00:14:39,512 --> 00:14:41,145 It proves he was involved. 310 00:15:18,419 --> 00:15:20,685 Okay. 311 00:15:20,687 --> 00:15:22,421 Okay, well, thank you. That's not what we thought 312 00:15:22,423 --> 00:15:24,556 You were gonna tell us, but we appreciate it. 313 00:15:26,626 --> 00:15:27,759 If we could have matched 314 00:15:27,761 --> 00:15:29,226 The handwriting on that wall to george, 315 00:15:29,228 --> 00:15:31,829 It would have gone a long way to solving this case. 316 00:15:31,831 --> 00:15:34,499 But if george didn't write the note on the wall, 317 00:15:34,501 --> 00:15:35,833 Then who did? 318 00:15:35,835 --> 00:15:37,735 Sh--. 319 00:15:40,039 --> 00:15:43,841 ♪♪♪ 320 00:15:43,843 --> 00:15:46,110 I think you're really gonna like dr. Pinneri. 321 00:15:46,112 --> 00:15:48,579 She's the medical examiner from back home in texas, 322 00:15:48,581 --> 00:15:51,116 And then chris robinson-- he's from georgia, 323 00:15:51,118 --> 00:15:53,651 And he's like a firearms ballistics guy. 324 00:15:53,653 --> 00:15:55,252 We don't know what to do 325 00:15:55,254 --> 00:15:56,822 With that handwriting on the wall, 326 00:15:56,824 --> 00:15:58,522 But we do wanna look at all the other clues 327 00:15:58,524 --> 00:15:59,857 Left at the house. 328 00:15:59,859 --> 00:16:02,059 -So happy to see y'all. -Yes, happy to be here. 329 00:16:02,061 --> 00:16:04,328 Dr. Kathryn pinneri and chris robinson 330 00:16:04,330 --> 00:16:08,132 Are both here to help us re-examine the forensic evidence 331 00:16:08,134 --> 00:16:09,534 And recreate the crime scene. 332 00:16:09,536 --> 00:16:12,103 Dr. Pinneri re-examined all of the wounds 333 00:16:12,105 --> 00:16:14,272 On each victim to maybe help us figure out 334 00:16:14,274 --> 00:16:16,474 The order of the attack, 335 00:16:16,476 --> 00:16:19,143 Which might help tell us more about the killer. 336 00:16:19,145 --> 00:16:21,078 This is one of the most disturbing cases... 337 00:16:21,080 --> 00:16:22,481 -Horrible. -...Um, I've seen 338 00:16:22,483 --> 00:16:24,081 In my career, very haunting. 339 00:16:24,083 --> 00:16:27,019 This is in the top five worst cases I've been involved in. 340 00:16:27,021 --> 00:16:30,021 How many cases have you seen in your whole career? 341 00:16:30,023 --> 00:16:31,889 -Thousands. -Thousands. 342 00:16:31,891 --> 00:16:33,558 -And this is in the top five? -This is in the top five. 343 00:16:33,560 --> 00:16:36,160 -Damn. -Wow. 344 00:16:36,162 --> 00:16:39,630 There's a lot going on here. It's a quadruple homicide 345 00:16:39,632 --> 00:16:40,765 With a lot of different injuries. 346 00:16:40,767 --> 00:16:42,501 The grandmother, theresia-- 347 00:16:42,503 --> 00:16:44,635 She's got extensive blunt trauma of her head. 348 00:16:44,637 --> 00:16:46,971 There's 23 described blunt force injuries 349 00:16:46,973 --> 00:16:52,310 On multiple sides of her head, so she is moving, turning. 350 00:16:52,312 --> 00:16:53,778 Some of the injuries actually appear patterned, 351 00:16:53,780 --> 00:16:55,846 Which tells me a little bit about the weapon 352 00:16:55,848 --> 00:16:58,149 That was used to inflict it. 353 00:16:58,151 --> 00:17:00,451 I think the most likely thing would be a hammer. 354 00:17:00,453 --> 00:17:03,088 The hammer has the perfect edges and surfaces 355 00:17:03,090 --> 00:17:06,991 To create all of the wounds that she had. 356 00:17:06,993 --> 00:17:10,061 Additionally, she has 357 00:17:10,063 --> 00:17:12,130 A contact or near contact gunshot wound 358 00:17:12,132 --> 00:17:13,465 To the back of her head. 359 00:17:13,467 --> 00:17:15,866 One thing that you can tell from this injury 360 00:17:15,868 --> 00:17:18,937 Is that it came after the blunt trauma 361 00:17:18,939 --> 00:17:21,740 Because of the fracture patterns. 362 00:17:21,742 --> 00:17:24,542 A fracture line can't cross a pre-existing fracture line. 363 00:17:24,544 --> 00:17:26,411 Fracture patterns can help determine 364 00:17:26,413 --> 00:17:27,945 The order of an attack. 365 00:17:27,947 --> 00:17:30,381 In theresia's case, we can tell that she was first struck 366 00:17:30,383 --> 00:17:31,816 By a blunt object, 367 00:17:31,818 --> 00:17:34,151 Which produced a crescent-shaped fracture in her skull. 368 00:17:34,153 --> 00:17:35,986 Then she was shot, causing a new fracture, 369 00:17:35,988 --> 00:17:38,457 Which spread outward until it terminated 370 00:17:38,459 --> 00:17:40,191 On the earlier break. 371 00:17:40,193 --> 00:17:42,293 That wouldn't happen if the gunshot was first. 372 00:17:42,295 --> 00:17:45,296 The mother, marie, has five gunshot wounds, 373 00:17:45,298 --> 00:17:47,832 One of which is a re-entry from another wound. 374 00:17:47,834 --> 00:17:52,770 So she's shot here and turns and gets shot there 375 00:17:52,772 --> 00:17:55,706 And then either falls or collapses. 376 00:17:55,708 --> 00:17:57,109 And then she's shot in the head in the back. 377 00:17:57,111 --> 00:17:59,810 But then she also has blunt trauma, 378 00:17:59,812 --> 00:18:02,012 And there's about 19 described blunt entries 379 00:18:02,014 --> 00:18:03,648 To the head and face. 380 00:18:03,650 --> 00:18:06,484 Most of these wounds are on the left side 381 00:18:06,486 --> 00:18:09,987 Of her face and head, which is kinda how she fell. 382 00:18:09,989 --> 00:18:11,922 In my opinion, she was down on the ground 383 00:18:11,924 --> 00:18:16,093 When these blows to the head were sustained. 384 00:18:16,095 --> 00:18:19,931 She's not moving around to sustain injuries 385 00:18:19,933 --> 00:18:22,133 On the--all surfaces like the grandmother was. 386 00:18:22,135 --> 00:18:25,670 It seems crazy that two weapons were used, 387 00:18:25,672 --> 00:18:27,671 Especially when you consider 388 00:18:27,673 --> 00:18:30,341 That marie had already suffered fatal wounds. 389 00:18:30,343 --> 00:18:32,543 Is it possible that we're looking at two killers, 390 00:18:32,545 --> 00:18:35,279 Or is it just one trying to send a message? 391 00:18:35,281 --> 00:18:38,316 Is it someone with a lot of rage? 392 00:18:38,318 --> 00:18:41,352 Whatever the case, it's clearly overkill. 393 00:18:41,354 --> 00:18:42,653 Samantha, the 2-year-old, 394 00:18:42,655 --> 00:18:45,623 Has approximately 22 blunt force injuries 395 00:18:45,625 --> 00:18:48,225 Of the head and face, 396 00:18:48,227 --> 00:18:50,762 And sabrina, who's not even 6 weeks old-- 397 00:18:50,764 --> 00:18:53,364 She's got six injuries of her face. 398 00:18:53,366 --> 00:18:56,500 I was counting up your-- your number of hammer strikes 399 00:18:56,502 --> 00:18:58,302 On all four victims. 400 00:18:58,304 --> 00:19:00,437 It's exactly 70. 401 00:19:00,439 --> 00:19:02,073 I mean, think about that. Think about that. 402 00:19:02,075 --> 00:19:03,474 -It's really-- -you're like... 403 00:19:03,476 --> 00:19:06,444 You know, you talk about it-- 404 00:19:06,446 --> 00:19:08,246 It's horrible. The whole case is horrible. 405 00:19:08,248 --> 00:19:10,916 It takes a special kind of evil. 406 00:19:10,918 --> 00:19:10,981 ♪♪♪ 407 00:19:11,182 --> 00:19:23,595 ♪♪♪ 408 00:19:23,597 --> 00:19:26,964 It's gonna be an interesting discussion today, 409 00:19:26,966 --> 00:19:28,766 Going back to the house. 410 00:19:28,768 --> 00:19:32,736 Yeah. This is gonna be one that stays with me for a while. 411 00:19:32,738 --> 00:19:34,406 [sighs] 412 00:19:34,408 --> 00:19:36,340 ♪♪♪ 413 00:19:36,342 --> 00:19:40,144 ♪ there's nothing to hold ♪ 414 00:19:40,146 --> 00:19:44,081 ♪ voices and songs ♪ 415 00:19:44,083 --> 00:19:52,623 ♪ all about those still home where... ♪ 416 00:19:52,625 --> 00:19:54,559 In attempting to recreate a crime scene, 417 00:19:54,561 --> 00:19:57,494 Especially when you're dealing with four victims, 418 00:19:57,496 --> 00:19:59,563 Being able to go to the actual place 419 00:19:59,565 --> 00:20:01,900 Where it happened is crucial. 420 00:20:01,902 --> 00:20:03,367 Looks a lot smaller than in the pictures. 421 00:20:03,369 --> 00:20:04,702 -Yeah. -Doesn't it? 422 00:20:04,704 --> 00:20:08,439 The altidor home has been remodeled since then, 423 00:20:08,441 --> 00:20:09,707 But coming here today can still give us 424 00:20:09,709 --> 00:20:13,311 An invaluable look at what happened that day. 425 00:20:13,313 --> 00:20:14,980 Orient us. Where are we, and what's going on here? 426 00:20:14,982 --> 00:20:16,581 All right, well... [clears throat] 427 00:20:16,583 --> 00:20:19,117 Come in-- you come in the front door. 428 00:20:19,119 --> 00:20:23,321 You've got the bassinet there, so we've got sabrina. 429 00:20:23,323 --> 00:20:26,190 Kitchen left, we've got theresia, ms. Laverne. 430 00:20:26,192 --> 00:20:29,394 And then to the right we've got couches situated 431 00:20:29,396 --> 00:20:32,330 In essentially the same manner where we've got samantha. 432 00:20:32,332 --> 00:20:36,334 According to old statements, marie was very safety-conscious. 433 00:20:36,336 --> 00:20:38,002 Marie always locked her doors, 434 00:20:38,004 --> 00:20:40,504 And there was no sign of forced entry. 435 00:20:40,506 --> 00:20:43,807 She definitely would not open the door for a total stranger, 436 00:20:43,809 --> 00:20:46,544 So it's odd that marie and theresia 437 00:20:46,546 --> 00:20:48,480 Were going about their regular household duties, 438 00:20:48,482 --> 00:20:51,015 And they didn't seem to know that there was any threat 439 00:20:51,017 --> 00:20:52,683 Until it was too late. 440 00:20:52,685 --> 00:20:54,551 What do you all say we go to the kitchen, 441 00:20:54,553 --> 00:20:56,053 And then start going through your thoughts? 442 00:20:56,055 --> 00:20:57,088 Absolutely. Okay. Okay. 443 00:20:57,090 --> 00:20:59,791 -So in our kitchen... -Okay. 444 00:20:59,793 --> 00:21:03,027 ...Where is theresia standing when everything happens? 445 00:21:03,029 --> 00:21:04,361 The sink's here, and the bowl... 446 00:21:04,363 --> 00:21:06,631 -Is right there? -It's just really peculiar. 447 00:21:06,633 --> 00:21:08,365 And, guys, there were pots and pans 448 00:21:08,367 --> 00:21:10,234 With dinner-type food on the stove, right? 449 00:21:10,236 --> 00:21:13,103 -Yes, I think so. -And when she falls, 450 00:21:13,105 --> 00:21:15,306 Is she kinda like this? Just so--just so--this way. 451 00:21:15,308 --> 00:21:17,140 She kinda falls toward that direction. 452 00:21:17,142 --> 00:21:20,211 Okay, so I'll-- I'll be theresia. 453 00:21:20,213 --> 00:21:22,513 Chris, what's gonna happen first? 454 00:21:22,515 --> 00:21:24,582 I'm over here with my bowl doing my thing. 455 00:21:24,584 --> 00:21:26,785 -Okay, so I come in. -I turn around. I've still got 456 00:21:26,787 --> 00:21:28,319 My bowl in my hand. -Okay. 457 00:21:28,321 --> 00:21:31,722 -There you are, whoever you are. -I strike her. 458 00:21:31,724 --> 00:21:34,693 -As hard as you can, right? -Yes. 459 00:21:34,695 --> 00:21:36,727 -So she falls just like this? -Yes, ma'am. 460 00:21:36,729 --> 00:21:42,200 She falls down, and then I give her the other 22 strikes 461 00:21:42,202 --> 00:21:44,135 Because I can clearly see the blood spatter 462 00:21:44,137 --> 00:21:47,738 Emanating all over the pantry doors here. 463 00:21:47,740 --> 00:21:50,708 I'm gonna have to go to the side 464 00:21:50,710 --> 00:21:53,077 Because I have the blood spatter going out 465 00:21:53,079 --> 00:21:54,411 Across the kitchen... -Okay. 466 00:21:54,413 --> 00:21:57,449 ...Out into the living room, 10 to 12 feet. 467 00:21:57,451 --> 00:21:59,817 Lot of rage, overkill. 468 00:21:59,819 --> 00:22:02,287 I have to get down and dirty. 469 00:22:02,289 --> 00:22:05,490 Then I pull out the gun just to make sure, 470 00:22:05,492 --> 00:22:06,791 And then I shoot her right in the back of the head. 471 00:22:08,662 --> 00:22:10,227 And then marie comes from the back 472 00:22:10,229 --> 00:22:12,730 Because she hears the-- -well, where is she coming from? 473 00:22:12,732 --> 00:22:14,298 She's coming from where I am right here. 474 00:22:14,300 --> 00:22:15,833 Oh, this wall wasn't here. 475 00:22:15,835 --> 00:22:18,402 She came from the back. 476 00:22:18,404 --> 00:22:21,805 Then he shoots her in the left shoulder. 477 00:22:21,807 --> 00:22:26,043 And then sees she's gonna turn, and then I shoot her again. 478 00:22:26,045 --> 00:22:29,480 And I'm turning to get away, and I make it around. 479 00:22:29,482 --> 00:22:31,982 The china hutch is here, and then... 480 00:22:31,984 --> 00:22:34,118 -Fall there. -She's gonna fall on the ground. 481 00:22:34,120 --> 00:22:37,020 -Falls on the ground. -And then-- 482 00:22:37,022 --> 00:22:38,556 Then he gives one to the back. -[gunshot] 483 00:22:38,558 --> 00:22:39,656 Okay. 484 00:22:39,658 --> 00:22:41,526 And then one right to the head, 485 00:22:41,528 --> 00:22:42,594 And then I start to hit. 486 00:22:42,596 --> 00:22:46,063 One, two, three, four. 487 00:22:46,065 --> 00:22:48,600 I had the spatter coming up the blinds 488 00:22:48,602 --> 00:22:50,467 Across the floor, 489 00:22:50,469 --> 00:22:53,438 Five, six, seven. 490 00:22:53,440 --> 00:22:55,205 19 strikes. 491 00:22:55,207 --> 00:22:56,473 That's a lot different than just talking about it. 492 00:22:56,475 --> 00:22:57,841 It takes forever. Sure. 493 00:22:57,843 --> 00:23:00,477 Marie's gunshot wounds were fatal, 494 00:23:00,479 --> 00:23:04,314 But her killer then struck her 19 more times with a hammer. 495 00:23:04,316 --> 00:23:08,887 This just screams of someone filled with rage or adrenaline 496 00:23:08,889 --> 00:23:11,354 As they continue to move through the home 497 00:23:11,356 --> 00:23:14,391 Murdering then her two babies, 498 00:23:14,393 --> 00:23:17,562 Presumably first was 6-week-old sabrina... 499 00:23:17,564 --> 00:23:20,098 There's six strikes to the baby. 500 00:23:20,100 --> 00:23:22,166 ...Followed by 2-year-old samantha, 501 00:23:22,168 --> 00:23:23,568 Who was hiding behind a couch. 502 00:23:23,570 --> 00:23:26,638 - And she's going to be around-- - oh, that's where she is. 503 00:23:26,640 --> 00:23:29,307 So she's right here by her little sister's massacre? 504 00:23:29,309 --> 00:23:30,841 - Yes. - Yes. 505 00:23:30,843 --> 00:23:33,343 So you're looking around. You find her. 506 00:23:33,345 --> 00:23:35,546 Again, this is a... 507 00:23:35,548 --> 00:23:38,315 - .22. - .22. 508 00:23:38,317 --> 00:23:40,050 Okay. 509 00:23:40,052 --> 00:23:42,186 Where's our note on the wall? 510 00:23:42,188 --> 00:23:44,855 And the furniture's accurate, right? 511 00:23:44,857 --> 00:23:46,524 Furniture is fairly accurate, yeah, 512 00:23:46,526 --> 00:23:48,927 Where you would have to lean over to draw on that. 513 00:23:48,929 --> 00:23:51,862 If drug dealers were trying to send a message to george, 514 00:23:51,864 --> 00:23:54,398 It seems the murders would have done that on their own. 515 00:23:54,400 --> 00:23:56,401 The murders speak for themselves. 516 00:23:56,403 --> 00:23:59,738 Why take the time to find a marker and write on the wall? 517 00:23:59,740 --> 00:24:01,438 Why give george nothing to live for 518 00:24:01,440 --> 00:24:04,141 And pave the way for him to rat you out to investigators? 519 00:24:04,143 --> 00:24:06,144 The writing doesn't make a lot of sense 520 00:24:06,146 --> 00:24:08,212 Unless someone wrote it to make police 521 00:24:08,214 --> 00:24:10,148 Think it was drug-related. 522 00:24:10,150 --> 00:24:12,683 The goal of all this was murder. 523 00:24:12,685 --> 00:24:15,419 They didn't look for one piece of valuable... 524 00:24:15,421 --> 00:24:18,355 No breaking and entering. No damage to the door. 525 00:24:18,357 --> 00:24:20,424 The jewelry is right there in plain view. 526 00:24:20,426 --> 00:24:21,892 This is not a ransacked house. 527 00:24:21,894 --> 00:24:23,760 After examining this crime scene, 528 00:24:23,762 --> 00:24:25,162 It does not appear to be 529 00:24:25,164 --> 00:24:28,766 An act of revenge or to be financially motivated. 530 00:24:28,768 --> 00:24:31,369 There was no forced entry. 531 00:24:31,371 --> 00:24:34,973 There was nothing taken, and george's locked office 532 00:24:34,975 --> 00:24:37,708 Does not appear to have been tampered with. 533 00:24:37,710 --> 00:24:39,643 If I came here looking for drugs or money, 534 00:24:39,645 --> 00:24:41,246 That locked office would have been 535 00:24:41,248 --> 00:24:42,847 The first damn place I checked. 536 00:24:42,849 --> 00:24:44,515 This is the greatest thing for me 537 00:24:44,517 --> 00:24:46,350 That I've ever done on this case. 538 00:24:46,352 --> 00:24:47,684 - Wonderful. - To be able to come here 539 00:24:47,686 --> 00:24:49,921 And see the inside and... -Re=enact everything. 540 00:24:49,923 --> 00:24:52,624 But if george is the killer, we have a problem 541 00:24:52,626 --> 00:24:55,459 With the handwriting on the wall not being his, 542 00:24:55,461 --> 00:24:58,395 And that 7:09 phone call that was made 543 00:24:58,397 --> 00:25:00,798 After he had already left for work. 544 00:25:00,800 --> 00:25:02,533 Either george didn't do it 545 00:25:02,535 --> 00:25:04,535 And we're left with a big old mess, 546 00:25:04,537 --> 00:25:06,270 Or george had some help. 547 00:25:06,272 --> 00:25:07,605 Is there any kind of way 548 00:25:07,607 --> 00:25:09,339 When you see it with your own eyes 549 00:25:09,341 --> 00:25:12,276 You would ever buy it was a drug killing? 550 00:25:12,410 --> 00:25:18,815 - No. - Okay. 551 00:25:18,816 --> 00:25:25,221 ♪♪♪ 552 00:25:25,224 --> 00:25:27,758 [truck horn blows] 553 00:25:27,760 --> 00:25:29,993 Okay, so we got a new name, danny, 554 00:25:29,995 --> 00:25:32,563 And it's erta arty. 555 00:25:32,565 --> 00:25:35,098 We've all but ruled out the theory that marie 556 00:25:35,100 --> 00:25:37,401 And her family's murder was drug-related, 557 00:25:37,403 --> 00:25:39,770 But if her husband george is the one who killed, 558 00:25:39,772 --> 00:25:41,439 Then how do we explain that the handwriting 559 00:25:41,441 --> 00:25:44,308 On the wall does not match george's? 560 00:25:44,310 --> 00:25:46,510 Or that he had already left for work 561 00:25:46,512 --> 00:25:48,111 When we believe that she was still alive 562 00:25:48,113 --> 00:25:50,414 Because she called her godmother? 563 00:25:50,416 --> 00:25:52,116 Hey, erta, this is danny smith. 564 00:25:52,118 --> 00:25:54,118 I'm with the miramar police department. 565 00:25:54,120 --> 00:25:56,653 Besides, what would george's motive be 566 00:25:56,655 --> 00:25:58,589 To murder his whole family? 567 00:25:58,591 --> 00:26:00,858 We're hoping that marie's friend erta 568 00:26:00,860 --> 00:26:03,027 Can help us figure out if we're missing anything. 569 00:26:06,533 --> 00:26:08,832 Erta, how long did you stay there? 570 00:26:18,077 --> 00:26:20,143 Do you happen to remember while you were there, 571 00:26:20,145 --> 00:26:22,546 Do you think you or her mom 572 00:26:22,548 --> 00:26:26,516 Would have left, like, cooked dinner and dirty dishes out? 573 00:26:26,518 --> 00:26:28,953 Like, didn't put food away in the refrigerator? 574 00:26:28,955 --> 00:26:31,355 Would that happen? 575 00:26:31,357 --> 00:26:33,490 Okay. 576 00:26:33,492 --> 00:26:36,093 If marie and her mother wouldn't leave 577 00:26:36,095 --> 00:26:39,262 Dirty pots and pans on the stove overnight, 578 00:26:39,264 --> 00:26:40,697 Then maybe that's a clue 579 00:26:40,699 --> 00:26:42,232 That they were murdered the night before, 580 00:26:42,234 --> 00:26:44,234 And if so, then george would have had 581 00:26:44,236 --> 00:26:46,670 An opportunity to commit the crime. 582 00:26:46,672 --> 00:26:50,774 But that still doesn't explain the 7:09 phone call 583 00:26:50,776 --> 00:26:52,443 Or the writing on the wall. 584 00:26:52,445 --> 00:26:54,979 While you were there did-- did they seem to have a-- 585 00:26:54,981 --> 00:26:56,581 A good marriage? Were they happy? 586 00:27:01,320 --> 00:27:05,589 Did he seem excited to have a brand-new baby--george? 587 00:27:09,796 --> 00:27:13,430 So, can you compare the way that mamie was 588 00:27:13,432 --> 00:27:16,334 Before the marriage, before she met george? 589 00:27:30,049 --> 00:27:31,615 Yeah. 590 00:27:34,687 --> 00:27:37,621 Do you know what the argument was over? 591 00:27:42,027 --> 00:27:45,629 Okay. Okay. 592 00:27:45,631 --> 00:27:47,165 And this is gonna be how many days 593 00:27:47,167 --> 00:27:50,902 Before they all end up murdered? 594 00:27:50,904 --> 00:27:53,103 Okay. Ma'am, thank you very much. 595 00:27:53,105 --> 00:27:57,041 If you think of something else, you call us back, okay? 596 00:27:57,043 --> 00:27:58,041 All right, bye. 597 00:27:58,043 --> 00:28:00,044 She was great. 598 00:28:02,247 --> 00:28:07,852 ♪♪♪ 599 00:28:07,854 --> 00:28:10,053 Josetta was the one we were hoping 600 00:28:10,055 --> 00:28:12,189 Maybe mamie talked to. - Okay. 601 00:28:12,191 --> 00:28:14,525 [line rings] 602 00:28:14,527 --> 00:28:17,595 Hey, regine? This is, uh, danny smith 603 00:28:17,597 --> 00:28:19,062 With the miramar police department. 604 00:28:19,064 --> 00:28:21,599 Are you with josetta? 605 00:28:21,601 --> 00:28:22,733 Oh, okay. 606 00:28:22,735 --> 00:28:26,404 Hey, josetta? How are you today? 607 00:28:26,406 --> 00:28:30,073 Josetta janvier had a really close relationship with marie, 608 00:28:30,075 --> 00:28:32,276 And we're hoping that she can give us 609 00:28:32,278 --> 00:28:34,946 Some better insight into their marriage. 610 00:28:34,948 --> 00:28:37,615 Josetta's native languages is creole, 611 00:28:37,617 --> 00:28:40,217 So her daughter's joining us to help translate. 612 00:28:40,219 --> 00:28:42,085 So as you know, we're trying to talk to 613 00:28:42,087 --> 00:28:44,888 As many people as we can talk to that knew the family, 614 00:28:44,890 --> 00:28:48,058 That were around before the murders happened. 615 00:29:00,706 --> 00:29:02,974 "she doesn't want to stay with him," meaning george? 616 00:29:04,877 --> 00:29:07,244 [josetta speaks creole] 617 00:29:07,246 --> 00:29:09,045 Regine: Really looked not good? 618 00:29:09,047 --> 00:29:10,848 Josetta: Not for him, really. 619 00:29:13,185 --> 00:29:14,885 You can translate if you want, regine. 620 00:29:25,331 --> 00:29:27,364 Okay, and did she say why? 621 00:29:35,007 --> 00:29:38,074 She's told that to your mom before she ever married george 622 00:29:38,076 --> 00:29:41,211 Or after she was already married? 623 00:29:41,213 --> 00:29:46,117 Okay. Did your mom ever see the way george treated mamie? 624 00:29:58,897 --> 00:30:00,264 What? 625 00:30:02,367 --> 00:30:05,570 Are you saying that mamie knew george was cheating on her? 626 00:30:07,974 --> 00:30:09,639 Damn. 627 00:30:09,641 --> 00:30:12,709 This is huge, because according to josetta, 628 00:30:12,711 --> 00:30:15,612 Marie believed that george was having an affair. 629 00:30:15,614 --> 00:30:18,748 If this is true, then is it possible that george 630 00:30:18,750 --> 00:30:21,151 Just wanted to start a brand-new life, 631 00:30:21,153 --> 00:30:23,253 And would that have been enough to drive him 632 00:30:23,255 --> 00:30:24,721 To commit all these murders? 633 00:30:24,723 --> 00:30:25,857 -Well, thank you. -Thank you. 634 00:30:25,859 --> 00:30:27,591 -Regine: Okay, bye-bye. -Bye. 635 00:30:27,593 --> 00:30:27,657 Man, that was good. That was good. 636 00:30:27,859 --> 00:30:40,270 ♪♪♪ 637 00:30:40,272 --> 00:30:43,073 -All in a day's work, jon. -They're worth it. 638 00:30:43,075 --> 00:30:45,374 [knocking on door] 639 00:30:45,376 --> 00:30:47,177 If george altidor is responsible for committing 640 00:30:47,179 --> 00:30:50,947 All these murders, we've been trying to understand 641 00:30:50,949 --> 00:30:52,283 How a phone call could have been made 642 00:30:52,285 --> 00:30:55,752 At 7:09 from the house 643 00:30:55,754 --> 00:30:57,954 After george had already left for work. 644 00:30:57,956 --> 00:31:00,490 -Hello. -Hi. Come on in. 645 00:31:00,492 --> 00:31:02,626 - Woman: Down here, manman. - Thank you for seeing us. 646 00:31:02,628 --> 00:31:05,095 Marie's godmother, helene mondestin, 647 00:31:05,097 --> 00:31:07,697 Is the woman that we believe was called that morning, 648 00:31:07,699 --> 00:31:09,232 So we want to see if she remembers 649 00:31:09,234 --> 00:31:11,235 Anything unusual about that call. 650 00:31:11,237 --> 00:31:14,038 What we wanted to talk about was 651 00:31:14,040 --> 00:31:15,772 A phone call you received... 652 00:31:15,774 --> 00:31:17,607 -Yes. -...Early in the morning. 653 00:31:21,913 --> 00:31:23,947 Okay. Okay. 654 00:31:38,530 --> 00:31:40,531 - You see? - Okay. 655 00:31:52,144 --> 00:31:53,377 Mm-hmm. 656 00:31:58,751 --> 00:32:00,017 Okay. 657 00:32:06,024 --> 00:32:08,692 Has mamie ever called you guys 658 00:32:08,694 --> 00:32:09,893 At 7:00 in the morning? 659 00:32:09,895 --> 00:32:11,094 - [helene] never. - Okay. 660 00:32:11,096 --> 00:32:13,497 So this was just out of the blue. 661 00:32:13,499 --> 00:32:15,098 How many times have you spoken to her before? 662 00:32:15,100 --> 00:32:17,501 A lot, or many times? 663 00:32:17,503 --> 00:32:19,636 So if somebody were to have called 664 00:32:19,638 --> 00:32:22,706 And say, "hey, this is mamie," 665 00:32:22,708 --> 00:32:23,673 You would have no reason-- 666 00:32:25,110 --> 00:32:26,910 So you have no clue who called you? 667 00:32:26,912 --> 00:32:28,445 Mnh-mnh. 668 00:32:28,447 --> 00:32:31,315 We've been under the assumption that marie made that call, 669 00:32:31,317 --> 00:32:35,385 But helene can't say for sure that it was her. 670 00:32:35,387 --> 00:32:38,521 - Thank you so much. - Good night. Drive carefully. 671 00:32:38,523 --> 00:32:39,856 - Okay, thank you. - Night, y'all. 672 00:32:39,858 --> 00:32:41,624 Is it possible that the woman 673 00:32:41,626 --> 00:32:44,561 George was allegedly having an affair with 674 00:32:44,563 --> 00:32:45,863 Is the one that made the call? 675 00:32:45,865 --> 00:32:49,032 And if so, did she help with handwriting, too? 676 00:32:49,034 --> 00:32:52,335 This may change the whole complexion of this case. 677 00:32:52,337 --> 00:32:53,603 Before the person on the other end 678 00:32:53,605 --> 00:32:55,206 Could identify themselves by name, she said... 679 00:32:55,208 --> 00:32:56,940 -She already said-- ..."is this mamie?" 680 00:32:56,942 --> 00:32:58,575 Right, exactly. 681 00:33:01,913 --> 00:33:11,688 ♪♪♪ 682 00:33:11,690 --> 00:33:15,258 I never thought we'd end up in broken arrow, oklahoma. 683 00:33:15,260 --> 00:33:17,494 George and florence ended up here because 684 00:33:17,496 --> 00:33:20,031 They went to seminary school, and then they moved here. 685 00:33:20,033 --> 00:33:21,498 We've traveled to oklahoma to confront 686 00:33:21,500 --> 00:33:24,334 Our suspect, george altidor. 687 00:33:24,336 --> 00:33:25,902 So we're going to be getting there way before time 688 00:33:25,904 --> 00:33:28,706 For them to go to church. They ought to be home. 689 00:33:28,708 --> 00:33:31,574 Depending on who answers the door, what's your plan? 690 00:33:31,576 --> 00:33:34,511 My plan is to first of all, introduce ourselves. 691 00:33:34,513 --> 00:33:36,646 We're the ones on the case. We have some updates, 692 00:33:36,648 --> 00:33:38,248 And that's where-- -you think they'll invite us in? 693 00:33:38,250 --> 00:33:39,917 You never know. Maybe things have changed. 694 00:33:39,919 --> 00:33:43,254 Maybe he is interested in-- in wanting an update 695 00:33:43,256 --> 00:33:46,589 On his two murdered daughters and his wife. 696 00:33:46,591 --> 00:33:48,992 His whole family. 697 00:33:48,994 --> 00:33:52,529 The last time george was approached back in 2007, 698 00:33:52,531 --> 00:33:55,732 He refused to talk and requested an attorney. 699 00:33:55,734 --> 00:33:57,934 Moving out here gets you a long way from miramar. 700 00:33:57,936 --> 00:33:59,869 -Oh, yeah. -A whole different world. 701 00:33:59,871 --> 00:34:02,272 But we've now learned about a possible motive. 702 00:34:02,274 --> 00:34:04,140 All right, let's have good luck, y'all. Come on. 703 00:34:04,142 --> 00:34:08,411 And after 24 years, it's time to get some answers. 704 00:34:08,413 --> 00:34:12,049 ♪♪♪ 705 00:34:12,051 --> 00:34:13,750 Hello. 706 00:34:13,752 --> 00:34:16,087 I'm looking for george. 707 00:34:16,089 --> 00:34:18,155 Are you george? Hey, george. 708 00:34:18,157 --> 00:34:20,157 I'm detective zeller, I'm the new person 709 00:34:20,159 --> 00:34:22,959 On your family's case in miramar. 710 00:34:22,961 --> 00:34:24,895 And I wanted to talk to you about the case 711 00:34:24,897 --> 00:34:27,230 And give you some updates. 712 00:34:27,232 --> 00:34:28,932 Uh, would you like to talk to me? 713 00:34:30,836 --> 00:34:33,636 Who's mister-- I don't know who mr. Diaz is. 714 00:34:33,638 --> 00:34:35,638 So you want me to call your lawyer 715 00:34:35,640 --> 00:34:39,609 So I can give you an update on your kids' murder? 716 00:34:42,146 --> 00:34:43,947 So then talk to me, then. 717 00:34:46,785 --> 00:34:48,518 You're not the least bit curious, as-- 718 00:34:48,520 --> 00:34:49,886 As far as what's going on? 719 00:34:58,997 --> 00:35:02,665 But, george, this is your family that got murdered. 720 00:35:02,667 --> 00:35:05,603 Okay, so my point is, is that if it's your lawyer, 721 00:35:05,605 --> 00:35:08,071 Call him. Call him now. 722 00:35:12,277 --> 00:35:14,211 Okay, this is not harassment. 723 00:35:18,350 --> 00:35:19,416 All right. 724 00:35:22,188 --> 00:35:24,854 I think I want to kiss you. Considering how that went, 725 00:35:24,856 --> 00:35:26,424 You couldn't have done any better. 726 00:35:26,426 --> 00:35:28,892 He looked like an idiot... And cold, 727 00:35:28,894 --> 00:35:30,760 And she's in the background, telling him what to say. 728 00:35:30,762 --> 00:35:32,229 I know. 729 00:35:32,231 --> 00:35:34,764 Whoo! Nice job, baby. 730 00:35:34,766 --> 00:35:37,134 George has a right to have an attorney, 731 00:35:37,136 --> 00:35:40,704 And asking for an attorney is no implication of guilt. 732 00:35:40,706 --> 00:35:45,509 But on the other hand, why wouldn't you open the door 733 00:35:45,511 --> 00:35:49,446 To hear what we have to say after 24 years? 734 00:35:49,448 --> 00:35:51,247 If he really wanted to know, 735 00:35:51,249 --> 00:35:53,583 He would say, "let me call my lawyer. 736 00:35:53,585 --> 00:35:55,385 I'll call you back and set up a time to come see you." 737 00:35:55,387 --> 00:35:57,720 That was pretty cold, the way he handled it. 738 00:35:57,722 --> 00:35:57,787 He didn't care. 739 00:35:57,988 --> 00:36:06,663 [bicycle bell rings] 740 00:36:06,665 --> 00:36:09,266 ♪♪♪ 741 00:36:09,268 --> 00:36:11,134 - Good morning, boys. - Morning. 742 00:36:11,136 --> 00:36:12,802 - Hey, good morning. - Morning, morning. 743 00:36:12,804 --> 00:36:15,239 -Y'all ready to get rid of us? -Yeah, let's do it. 744 00:36:16,876 --> 00:36:18,474 All right, so... 745 00:36:18,476 --> 00:36:22,679 There's nobody left we need to talk to, right? 746 00:36:22,681 --> 00:36:24,747 - No. - And we've done 747 00:36:24,749 --> 00:36:28,418 All the testing we can and gone and talked to george. 748 00:36:28,420 --> 00:36:30,754 We've covered this, you know, from beginning to end. 749 00:36:30,756 --> 00:36:32,889 With everything that we've learned, 750 00:36:32,891 --> 00:36:35,559 It's time to talk about our suspects. 751 00:36:35,561 --> 00:36:38,028 Is this truly a drug deal gone wrong? 752 00:36:38,030 --> 00:36:41,231 Is this a drug deal where they just hit the wrong house, right? 753 00:36:41,233 --> 00:36:43,099 So what all-- what all do we know? 754 00:36:43,101 --> 00:36:44,767 Well, marie's not going to let him in. 755 00:36:44,769 --> 00:36:47,571 -So they would get in how? -Forcing entry. 756 00:36:47,573 --> 00:36:49,005 They would be kicking that door in, 757 00:36:49,007 --> 00:36:51,041 Shooting it off or something, right? 758 00:36:51,043 --> 00:36:54,777 No breaking and entering. No damage to the door. 759 00:36:54,779 --> 00:36:57,213 The goal of all this was murder. 760 00:36:57,215 --> 00:36:59,550 You got nothing like that in this house. 761 00:36:59,552 --> 00:37:02,585 The big thing is that locked office door. 762 00:37:02,587 --> 00:37:04,121 If I'm there to look for something, 763 00:37:04,123 --> 00:37:06,257 Why would I leave a door locked? 764 00:37:06,259 --> 00:37:07,657 There could be someone in there. 765 00:37:07,659 --> 00:37:10,261 My money/drugs could be inside there. 766 00:37:10,263 --> 00:37:12,595 And if I'm really a drug dealer, and I'm really there 767 00:37:12,597 --> 00:37:15,365 To steal drugs and money, what should that house look like? 768 00:37:15,367 --> 00:37:16,600 Torn apart. 769 00:37:16,602 --> 00:37:18,668 And this house didn't look like that. 770 00:37:18,670 --> 00:37:20,603 Where do we even get the idea that this would be 771 00:37:20,605 --> 00:37:22,505 The house that they would want to hit? 772 00:37:22,507 --> 00:37:25,842 From the wall. This writing on the wall 773 00:37:25,844 --> 00:37:28,112 Was alluding to it being drug-related. 774 00:37:28,114 --> 00:37:30,546 And you're telling me that a killer just happened 775 00:37:30,548 --> 00:37:32,615 To find a marker laying around? 776 00:37:32,617 --> 00:37:36,853 Is there anything that makes anybody in this room 777 00:37:36,855 --> 00:37:39,622 Believe that this was truly a random intruder 778 00:37:39,624 --> 00:37:41,491 Or a drug-related hit? 779 00:37:41,493 --> 00:37:43,026 -No. -Nothing. 780 00:37:43,028 --> 00:37:46,496 Now let's talk about george altidor. 781 00:37:46,498 --> 00:37:49,699 Mamie had confided in someone 782 00:37:49,701 --> 00:37:52,169 And said that she was aware that he was cheating on her 783 00:37:52,171 --> 00:37:54,604 With the girl that lived down the street. 784 00:38:00,912 --> 00:38:02,779 You're wondering about the state of their marriage 785 00:38:02,781 --> 00:38:04,714 And if you have a motive, and here we go. 786 00:38:04,716 --> 00:38:05,982 John, what's your favorite piece? 787 00:38:05,984 --> 00:38:09,252 My favorite piece is his ex-wife. 788 00:38:09,254 --> 00:38:13,123 The fact about him having a gun, and she and her... 789 00:38:13,125 --> 00:38:14,290 Former boyfriend... -Old boyfriend. 790 00:38:14,292 --> 00:38:16,659 ...Were threatened at gunpoint by george 791 00:38:16,661 --> 00:38:20,863 Saying that he could kill them, and nobody would know. 792 00:38:20,865 --> 00:38:25,202 Yes, and now you also know, 24 years later, john, 793 00:38:25,204 --> 00:38:27,203 When you went knocking on that door in oklahoma, 794 00:38:27,205 --> 00:38:29,539 What was george's response? 795 00:38:29,541 --> 00:38:30,740 He didn't want to hear an update on-- 796 00:38:30,742 --> 00:38:32,809 On what's going on 24 years later. 797 00:38:32,811 --> 00:38:35,445 It doesn't seem like he gives a damn. 798 00:38:35,447 --> 00:38:38,415 You're not the least bit curious as far as what's going on? 799 00:38:44,423 --> 00:38:47,424 And now you know he had moved on... 800 00:38:47,426 --> 00:38:49,759 For this reason. He was ready to move on. 801 00:38:49,761 --> 00:38:52,095 -Start a brand-new life. -That's right. 802 00:38:52,097 --> 00:38:54,564 You know george altidor 803 00:38:54,566 --> 00:38:56,533 Didn't write the note on the wall. 804 00:38:56,535 --> 00:38:58,469 Somebody else is involved. 805 00:38:58,471 --> 00:39:00,437 -You know that. -Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah. 806 00:39:05,443 --> 00:39:09,179 So we're sitting here today trying to figure out 807 00:39:09,181 --> 00:39:11,615 How to get around that 7:09 phone call. 808 00:39:11,617 --> 00:39:14,618 We can't explain it, and we can't disprove it, 809 00:39:14,620 --> 00:39:16,652 And we can't evaporate it 'cause it is what it is, 810 00:39:16,654 --> 00:39:18,088 And it's the middle of this world. 811 00:39:18,090 --> 00:39:21,124 That phone call has been the hurdle 812 00:39:21,126 --> 00:39:24,594 Since, you know, 1997, and it continues to be. 813 00:39:24,596 --> 00:39:26,863 That is the one thing that is stopping us 814 00:39:26,865 --> 00:39:28,464 Moving forward with this case. 815 00:39:28,466 --> 00:39:31,401 We've uncovered a lot this week, 816 00:39:31,403 --> 00:39:34,270 But we still have unanswered questions about this phone call. 817 00:39:34,272 --> 00:39:37,107 We're hoping sometime in the near future 818 00:39:37,109 --> 00:39:40,143 We're going to be able to get justice for marie 819 00:39:40,145 --> 00:39:42,345 And her mom and her babies. 820 00:39:42,347 --> 00:39:44,947 The whole thing of this case just makes me sick, 821 00:39:44,949 --> 00:39:46,883 And we don't leave any stone unturned, 822 00:39:46,885 --> 00:39:50,421 But this is just heartbreaking. 823 00:39:51,823 --> 00:39:54,757 The only way to ever explain that call 824 00:39:54,759 --> 00:39:57,094 Is for something brand-new to break out 825 00:39:57,096 --> 00:40:00,696 Where somebody that knows about that call comes forward. 826 00:40:00,698 --> 00:40:04,301 But until that happens, this is where we are, and, uh... 827 00:40:04,303 --> 00:40:07,503 I don't know. It makes me sick. 828 00:40:07,505 --> 00:40:09,972 Makes me sick, 'cause I thought we could figure it out. 829 00:40:09,974 --> 00:40:11,375 Yeah. 830 00:40:13,646 --> 00:40:17,781 ♪♪♪ 831 00:40:17,783 --> 00:40:21,784 [seabird calling] 832 00:40:21,786 --> 00:40:24,787 ♪♪♪ 833 00:40:24,789 --> 00:40:26,789 You thought about what you're going to tell 'em? 834 00:40:26,791 --> 00:40:28,992 Unfortunately, I have had this conversation 835 00:40:28,994 --> 00:40:30,594 With them in the past. 836 00:40:30,596 --> 00:40:31,995 They never really had their hopes up 837 00:40:31,997 --> 00:40:35,265 Like they did this time, though. -I know. 838 00:40:35,267 --> 00:40:37,200 In this line of work, 839 00:40:37,202 --> 00:40:39,535 Having to tell a family that we didn't get as far 840 00:40:39,537 --> 00:40:42,740 As we wanted to is as bad as it gets. 841 00:40:42,742 --> 00:40:45,741 My heart aches for marie's family, 842 00:40:45,743 --> 00:40:48,211 But they deserve to know the truth. 843 00:40:48,213 --> 00:40:50,947 And unfortunately, 844 00:40:50,949 --> 00:40:54,150 Tragically, right now, that's the best we can do. 845 00:40:54,152 --> 00:40:56,752 I guess I'll do it like a band-aid. 846 00:40:56,754 --> 00:40:59,489 Unfortunately, we didn't get what we were looking for. 847 00:40:59,491 --> 00:41:01,691 We got a lot of good new information, 848 00:41:01,693 --> 00:41:04,360 But, um, that phone call, 849 00:41:04,362 --> 00:41:06,630 That 7:09 phone call... -Yes. 850 00:41:06,632 --> 00:41:09,967 ...Is, uh, that's what we're having a hard time getting past. 851 00:41:09,969 --> 00:41:12,835 I was hoping when we came here that we could figure that out, 852 00:41:12,837 --> 00:41:15,972 We could clear it up, but some female 853 00:41:15,974 --> 00:41:18,241 Called from that house, and it's-- 854 00:41:18,243 --> 00:41:19,709 We're locked into that time. 855 00:41:19,711 --> 00:41:23,779 And it's so frustrating to have these thoughts, 856 00:41:23,781 --> 00:41:25,748 But you can't quite get enough 857 00:41:25,750 --> 00:41:28,652 To file charges in a courtroom yet. 858 00:41:28,654 --> 00:41:29,720 Wow. 859 00:41:31,389 --> 00:41:32,922 I'm sorry. 860 00:41:32,924 --> 00:41:35,658 -It is hard. -It is so hard. 861 00:41:35,660 --> 00:41:37,260 -Even more now. -You want justice. 862 00:41:37,262 --> 00:41:38,461 -Justice. -You want the person 863 00:41:38,463 --> 00:41:40,129 Who did this to be held responsible. 864 00:41:40,131 --> 00:41:41,397 -Exactly. Exactly. -Yes. 865 00:41:41,399 --> 00:41:43,266 Such a painful wound, though. 866 00:41:43,268 --> 00:41:44,802 It's like every time, it reopens. 867 00:41:44,804 --> 00:41:46,269 -It's not like it ever closes. -Yeah, I know. 868 00:41:46,271 --> 00:41:47,937 -But I know I feel bad... -Yeah. 869 00:41:47,939 --> 00:41:51,407 [crying] ...For my cousin, because... 870 00:41:51,409 --> 00:41:53,210 She was just... 871 00:41:53,212 --> 00:41:55,345 It still hurts. 872 00:41:55,347 --> 00:41:58,080 It really hurts so much. It hurts. 873 00:41:58,082 --> 00:42:02,418 And we... [sobbing] 874 00:42:02,420 --> 00:42:05,988 It's just, we want justice, but it's just that... 875 00:42:05,990 --> 00:42:08,090 This is nearly 25 years. 876 00:42:08,092 --> 00:42:12,962 [crying] we are suffering. We are grieving every day. 877 00:42:12,964 --> 00:42:14,964 It has been 24 years, 878 00:42:14,966 --> 00:42:18,035 And every day we are waiting for an answer. 879 00:42:18,037 --> 00:42:20,836 We are still hurting. 880 00:42:20,838 --> 00:42:22,705 We are still grieving. 881 00:42:22,707 --> 00:42:25,174 We don't have closure. 882 00:42:25,176 --> 00:42:27,244 We are hoping for that day to come. 883 00:42:27,246 --> 00:42:29,579 It has to move forward. I'm willing to take that risk. 884 00:42:29,581 --> 00:42:31,647 I can't speak for my cousins, 885 00:42:31,649 --> 00:42:34,850 But I plead to the state to consider 886 00:42:34,852 --> 00:42:38,120 A circumstantial evidence case, even with the risks. 887 00:42:38,122 --> 00:42:41,057 Because there is the pain that we're feeling 888 00:42:41,059 --> 00:42:43,393 To come in front of a jury... -[sobbing] 889 00:42:43,395 --> 00:42:46,996 ...So that the jury can decide, even with that phone call. 890 00:42:46,998 --> 00:42:50,067 [sobbing] it's too painful for my cousin. 891 00:42:50,069 --> 00:42:53,469 This needs to move forward, guys. 892 00:42:53,471 --> 00:42:54,804 [sniffles] 893 00:42:54,806 --> 00:42:57,740 You need to call the state's attorney's office 894 00:42:57,742 --> 00:43:00,209 And go have a meeting, and you sit down in that room, 895 00:43:00,211 --> 00:43:01,545 And you tell them everything 896 00:43:01,547 --> 00:43:03,280 You just said at this table today. 897 00:43:03,282 --> 00:43:05,882 You have the right to do that, okay? 898 00:43:05,884 --> 00:43:06,949 -Mm-hmm. -You have the-- 899 00:43:06,951 --> 00:43:08,485 You're the victim here. 900 00:43:08,487 --> 00:43:10,486 You have the right to have a meeting 901 00:43:10,488 --> 00:43:12,021 And get your questions answered. 902 00:43:12,023 --> 00:43:13,489 That is your right. 903 00:43:13,491 --> 00:43:15,358 -We're not gonna lose hope. -There you go. 904 00:43:15,360 --> 00:43:16,759 -I should say. Yeah. -There you go. 905 00:43:16,761 --> 00:43:18,762 -And you keep praying. -Yes. It's a daily thing. 906 00:43:18,764 --> 00:43:20,729 Yeah. So sorry. 907 00:43:20,731 --> 00:43:22,365 You can't put into words 908 00:43:22,367 --> 00:43:25,035 What this family has gone through. 909 00:43:25,037 --> 00:43:28,971 They have every right in the world to be angry, 910 00:43:28,973 --> 00:43:30,507 And who in the hell can blame 'em? 911 00:43:30,509 --> 00:43:34,310 All they can do now is to continue to fight 912 00:43:34,312 --> 00:43:36,914 For their loved ones, and our hope, all of us, 913 00:43:36,916 --> 00:43:40,383 Is that one day, they will get justice. 914 00:43:40,385 --> 00:43:54,064 ♪♪♪