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* *

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Sam Dunn: In the previous
episode I explored the

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emergence of heavy music in
America and what I learned

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is that the American bands
have a much bigger part

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in the story of metal than
I initially realized.

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But when I think of the great
bands that truly gave birth to

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heavy metal I think of British
bands like Black Sabbath and

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Deep Purple and Led Zeppelin and
so I've come to England because

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I want to find out why did this
music come out of England and

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what was its impact back
in the 1960's and 70's?

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* Intro *

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>> During the 60's
England gave rise to a number

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of bands that were heavier
than anything that had come

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before but before the emergence
of heavy metal this country

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was the home for another
musical style that

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transformed rock music,
the British Blues boom,

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so I'm meeting with blues
legend John Mayall to

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find out how this movement
paved the way for heavy metal.

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Sam Dunn: I want to spend
some time talking with you about

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what's famously known as
the British Blues boom.

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John Mayall: Well fondly enough
it wasn't known as that when it

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happened for the first few
years, it was just called R&B

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which in America is
totally different kind of music.

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There were just these venues
that supported the music and

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it was just an opportunity for
us to get out there and play

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what we wanted to play and
we're kind of surprised

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and delighted that there
was an audience for it.

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Sam Dunn: Why do you think
young musicians in England

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at that time were
attracted to this music?

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John Mayall: Well I think
generation to generation you get

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something that connects with
an audience, prior to the blues

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boom was ten years of jazz bands
so people flopped to those and I

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think the blues is something
that addresses itself to

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situations in people's lives
that they can identify with.

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Dave Lewis: Lots of these guys
were listening to records that

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were coming over from the
States, John Lee Hooker, Muddy

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Waters, Jimmy Page, Jeff Beck,
Eric Clapton, they were picked

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up on so they're massive
influences you know and I think

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that's where they began to
wanna play like those guys.

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* Music *

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Chris Welch: When the British
R&B bands first appeared

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like the Yardbirds for example,
really they were all playing on

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a kinda really nervy sort of
form of playing, R&B in a way,

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it was really fast almost
hysterical, it was very

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excitable and kind of lacked
power and depth, so gradually

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it's when bands learned to slow
down a bit and to use more bass.

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All these little ways of playing
the music changed the whole

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sound of it, so it's when they
learned to relax really, I think

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that's when bands
began to become heavier.

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* Music *

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Sam Dunn: If we think of
guitarists like Clapton

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and Page and a guy like
Jeff Beck, what was

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unifying do you think,
all of these players?

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John Mayall: It was all based
on blues initially and

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then it kinda got individualized
by different people,

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Eric was always into the
blues whereas Beck and Page

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although they started off with
the blues and then it very

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quickly mushroomed into there
on, all individual styles.

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* Music *

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>> Besides Cream, the Jeff Beck
Group, and The Yardbirds,

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the one band that unquestionably
transformed the blues into

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something much
heavier was Led Zeppelin.

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They're one of the most
celebrated bands in the

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history of rock and Rolling
Stone magazine even

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described them as the
heaviest band of all time.

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But what exactly was Led
Zeppelin's connection to the

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British Blues boom and what
was unique about their sound?

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Dave Lewis: Well Led Zeppelin
occurred at the time of the

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British Blues boom and they came
right smack in middle of it, you

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only got to look at the first
album "I Can't Quit You Babe" ,

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"You Shook Me", Within two or
three years they were taking the

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influences of Willie Dixon
and taking it much further.

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Billy Gibbons: Led Zeppelin
I think it's fair to say

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that people would like
to place them as

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probably the launch pad
of what exemplifies

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the early days of
heavy, and it is.

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Sam: How did Zeppelin
achieve their heaviness?

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What did Jimmy's
guitar tone contribute?

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Eddie Kramer: He was the guy you
would call if you wanted that

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really gritty distorted guitar
tone and he was master of that,

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I mean when you hear the
tone of his solo coming in,

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it's instantaneously
identifiable.

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Sam Dunn: Talk about Robert
Plant as a front man.

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Why do you think he was
important in terms of his

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presentation that was
doing something new?

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Frankie Banali: Robert Plant was
that golden god lead singer,

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he had the attitude, he had the
look, he had the mannerisms.

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Robert Plant was probably
more than any other

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singer that iconic role
model for singers.

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Sam Dunn: We're in Trinifold
Management, who manages

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Judas Priest, let us use this
room which is the office of

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Bill Curbishley who manages
Robert Plant, to be so

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close but so far because
we've been really trying

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to get Robert Plant
and Jimmy Page to be

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part of the series but
they've declined.

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The problem I guess for
Plant and Page is they

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don't like to be associated
with the term "Heavy Metal"

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even though they were
hugely influential.

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Eddie Kramer: I never really
thought of them as a heavy quote

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"metal band" basically because
of the complete diversity of

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material heavily acoustically
orientated with a strong beat.

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I guess you could say without
Zeppelin there wouldn't

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be quote unquote "heavy metal"
but I don't think that

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I would ever consider
them a heavy metal band.

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I think Sabbath probably
more than any band would be the

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definition of a heavy metal band
you know, the essence of one.

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* Music *

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>> Although Led Zeppelin didn't
self identify as a heavy metal

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band, Black Sabbath is the one
band that many argue marked

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the beginning of the heavy
metal sound, so I need to find

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out why Sabbath is considered
the pioneer of the genre.

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* Music *

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(Crowd Cheering)

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>> In the early 70"s
Black Sabbath created a

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sound that was darker and more
sinister than ever before

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so I've come to Birmingham,
Sabbath's home town

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in England's industrial heart
land to find out where

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they got the inspiration
to create this sound.

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* Music *

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Sam Dunn: When you started
out with Sabbath,

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describe for me what
Birmingham was like?

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Bill Ward: Birmingham's
profile is dismal,

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you know, rain swept and
factories and belching smoke,

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it's a very industrial place.
You could go into the factories,

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you could go to prison or
you could be a gangster.

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Geezer Butler: Birmingham
had a massive hammering

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during World War 2, there's
still a lot of bombed out

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buildings around, the place on
the corner where I grew up

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is completely demolished
by bombs in the war.

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Where we lived was very
very working class,

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there's a lot of immigration
there, very mixed racially

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and culturally and a lot
of street fighting.

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Sam Dunn: So how did this
sort of horrible reality

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influence what Black
Sabbath sounded like?

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Bill Ward: We all let some
feelings about the counter

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culture or a lot of the peace
movements but I think all of

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us had an attitude to well,
that's all well and good,

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but that's not what's going on
right now, I'm sitting here

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looking at a guy getting his
guts beaten up and music

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began to take a really good
look at what was really on

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the ground or really
what we were seeing.

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I think it had a
huge impact on Sabbath.

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* Music *

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Sam Dunn: Describe for me the
sound of Black Sabbath's music.

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How was it different than
what else was going on?

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Jim Simpson: The country was
inundated with blues bands and

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they all sounded the same or
looked the same or smelt the

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same and wore the same denim
jackets and all the guitar

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players played sixty mile long
solos and we were all anxious to

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get out of that because all
five of us believed the band was

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going somewhere so we had
to do something different.

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Geezer Butler: We'd jam around
and see what we came out

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with and we came out with
the song "Wicked World".

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That put us on you know, thought
this is good, we can do it,

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we'll have a go at another
one and the second song was

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"Black Sabbath" and then we
just thought, god this is

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really weird, different, let's
just give it a try on the next

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gig and we did the gig, we
played it right at the end

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"Black Sabbath" and the crowd
just went absolutely mental.

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They were saying play that
again, play that again, so we

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played it again, played it three
times (laughs), and we just

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realized you know that we had
something that nobody else had.

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* Music *

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Bill Ward: When we would sit
down and make a piece of

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music together one of the things
that I would try to create with

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drums, a lot of atmosphere I
definitely used a lot of toms to

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bring about certain words, Ozzy
sang "what is this that stands

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before me" I knew where I had
to go with the toms. I could

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have gone (imitates drums) it
would never have worked.

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Thomas Allom: In some ways
they were almost a jazz band,

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if you listened to what Bill
and Geezer are playing,

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Geezer's not playing rock
really, he's playing like sort

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of almost modern jazz, very
intricate stuff, but with it

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were these absolutely
staggering heavy lyrics and

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heavy vocal melodies and Tony's
fantastic guitar riffs.

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* Music *

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>> By combining the
heaviness of Tony Iommi's

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guitar with the eerie sounds
of Ozzy's vocals and Bill and

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Geezer's jazz influenced rhythms
Black Sabbath was creating

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a sound that have never
been heard before so given

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that this sound was so unusual
for it's time, how is the

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record industry reacting
to Black Sabbath's music?

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Jim Simpson: We did a demo
in Birmingham which is

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not very different
to the first album.

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I took this recording to
fourteen straight record

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companies and they
all turned me down.

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Sam: Why didn't they
want to take this record on?

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Jim: Because there wasn't a
current hit on the charts that

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sounded like that. If
you sit there in your

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posh purple office with
your white suit on,

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you want to hear something safe,
you want to go to the boss

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and say listen I've got a single
that sounds just like Rolling

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what are they called, Stones
was it, yes something like

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that but something new
they were scared of it.

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Geezer: I'll always remember
this one record company,

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we were in the northern most
part of England and we had

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to do a gig and then drive all
through the night to play

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this audition at this pub for
eleven o'clock in the morning

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in London so none of us
had slept we were all

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absolutely exhausted, the guy
came from the record company,

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we started playing and he just
literally walked out (laughs),

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after about halfway through the
second song, he just went,

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what's this crap and just walked
out, that's the way they

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treated us you know, they
just really didn't get it.

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And then we got this A&R
guy and he really liked

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us and he finally got
Vertigo to sign us.

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Sam: When you first saw
Black Sabbath play

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what were your impressions
of their music?

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Olav Wyper: My first thoughts
were it's a heavy metal band, as

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they went on I realized they
were much more than that because

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a lot of the lyrics were not
only intelligent but they dealt

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with some difficult subjects and
musically they were terrific, so

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after the gig I talked them in
to coming with us on Vertigo.

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Geezer: It happened so
incredibly fast, the first album

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charted and I think it came in
number thirteen, we didn't know

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anything about it we were in a
car going to a gig and we were

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listening to the album
charts and a bloke said

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new at thirteen this week
Black Sabbath, we went, what?

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Is there another band
called Black Sabbath?

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And then he played the
track off it and it was us.

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Jim: The week it went on the
charts it sold with 5200 records

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the first week, from that moment
on we were on a crusade,

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we knew that we got
something very very special

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and from that moment on it
became really serious.

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* Music *

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Sam: For you are they that
band that sets in motion

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this music that came to
be called heavy Metal?

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Bruce Dickinson: If there's
one band that did it

229
00:15:54,510 --> 00:15:56,776
and if there's one
album that did it,

230
00:15:56,843 --> 00:16:00,343
it is the first
Black Sabbath album

231
00:16:00,410 --> 00:16:06,510
because that influenced a
whole generation of kids that

232
00:16:06,576 --> 00:16:12,776
five years, six years later
appeared as heavy metal bands.

233
00:16:12,843 --> 00:16:16,276
Slash: Black Sabbath was the
band that first defined

234
00:16:16,343 --> 00:16:19,976
heavy metal for me
and seriously had

235
00:16:20,110 --> 00:16:22,876
that sort of heavy approach
that really seemed

236
00:16:23,010 --> 00:16:24,443
like these guys are for real.

237
00:16:24,510 --> 00:16:27,210
Sam: To what extent did
you consider yourselves

238
00:16:27,276 --> 00:16:28,843
a heavy metal band?

239
00:16:28,910 --> 00:16:31,310
Geezer: We just thought we were
a hard rock band at the time,

240
00:16:31,376 --> 00:16:34,276
that's what we liked and the
first I'd heard being called

241
00:16:34,343 --> 00:16:38,176
heavy metal was somebody
being derogatory about us,

242
00:16:38,243 --> 00:16:41,276
I read this review when we were
on tour and criticizing us

243
00:16:41,343 --> 00:16:44,310
as usual and it says it
sounded like a lot of

244
00:16:44,376 --> 00:16:48,443
heavy metal being dropped,
not musically whatsoever.

245
00:16:48,510 --> 00:16:50,410
Jim Simpson: The words
heavy metal were never banging

246
00:16:50,476 --> 00:16:53,376
around in those days,
we're just a heavy rock band.

247
00:16:53,443 --> 00:16:57,443
That's how Sabbath saw
themselves and not realizing

248
00:16:57,510 --> 00:17:00,676
they invented a whole
genre under their name.

249
00:17:00,743 --> 00:17:06,510
* Music *

250
00:17:06,576 --> 00:17:08,643
>> Black Sabbath clearly
didn't self identify as a

251
00:17:08,710 --> 00:17:11,810
heavy metal band, but future
generations of musicians and

252
00:17:11,876 --> 00:17:14,476
fans would credit Sabbath
for creating a distinctly

253
00:17:14,543 --> 00:17:18,643
darker sound and esthetic.
So now that Birmingham's

254
00:17:18,710 --> 00:17:21,710
Black Sabbath had laid this
foundation, how would this

255
00:17:21,776 --> 00:17:24,910
genre evolve as the focus
shifted to London, the capital

256
00:17:24,976 --> 00:17:27,743
of the seventies English
hard rock scene.

257
00:17:27,810 --> 00:17:41,310
* Music *

258
00:17:41,376 --> 00:17:43,676
>>BlackSabbathand
LedZeppelin

259
00:17:43,743 --> 00:17:46,710
weren't the only English bands
carving new directions

260
00:17:46,776 --> 00:17:50,610
in heavy music in the 70's, the
one band that pushed the sound

261
00:17:50,676 --> 00:17:53,110
of hard rock into something
much more complex and

262
00:17:53,110 --> 00:17:56,210
sophisticated was
London's Deep Purple.

263
00:17:58,643 --> 00:18:01,743
However the bands original
line-up nicknamed Mark 1 was a

264
00:18:01,810 --> 00:18:05,810
far cry from the heavy sound
that Purple is known for today.

265
00:18:05,876 --> 00:18:09,376
So I've traveled to the country
home of drummer Ian Paice to ask

266
00:18:09,443 --> 00:18:12,743
him about the bands Mark 1
origins and how they became the

267
00:18:12,810 --> 00:18:15,610
Deep Purple that has influenced
legions of heavy metal bands.

268
00:18:17,510 --> 00:18:20,676
Sam Dunn: How was Mark 2
different than Mark 1?

269
00:18:20,743 --> 00:18:24,443
Ian Paice: In Mark 1 we tried
to be like somebody else,

270
00:18:24,510 --> 00:18:26,743
we actually tried to be
like a British version of

271
00:18:26,810 --> 00:18:29,443
Vanilla Fudge by taking
other peoples songs

272
00:18:29,510 --> 00:18:32,410
and putting big
arrangements around them.

273
00:18:32,476 --> 00:18:46,210
* Music *

274
00:18:46,276 --> 00:18:48,876
Ian: What Mark 2 progressed
to was realizing

275
00:18:48,943 --> 00:18:53,610
there was no point being
number two Vanilla Fudge,

276
00:18:53,676 --> 00:18:57,610
very important to actually
become number one yourselves.

277
00:18:57,676 --> 00:18:59,610
Jon Lord: We had something
really rather good and

278
00:18:59,676 --> 00:19:02,543
quite interesting but it
wasn't gelling quite right,

279
00:19:02,610 --> 00:19:06,610
it wasn't making the
right noise somehow and

280
00:19:06,676 --> 00:19:08,443
unfortunately for Nick Simper
and Rod Evans we came

281
00:19:08,510 --> 00:19:10,810
to the conclusion that
it was their fault.

282
00:19:10,876 --> 00:19:28,776
* Music *

283
00:19:28,876 --> 00:19:31,610
Jon: They were not the two right
guys to help Paice, Blackmore

284
00:19:31,676 --> 00:19:36,443
and myself, quite realized
where we wanted to go.

285
00:19:36,510 --> 00:19:39,376
Sam: When you and Ian came
into the band what do you

286
00:19:39,443 --> 00:19:41,010
think changed in terms of
the sound of the band?

287
00:19:41,110 --> 00:19:44,776
Roger Glover: Ian and I were,
well we were songwriters, we

288
00:19:44,843 --> 00:19:48,543
were a partnership and I think
the musicianship of Paice and

289
00:19:48,610 --> 00:19:52,710
Ritchie and Jon was just
unbelievable, I don't I had ever

290
00:19:52,776 --> 00:19:55,710
played with people that good
before and there was a kind of

291
00:19:55,776 --> 00:19:58,943
marriage between the
sophistication of the other

292
00:19:59,010 --> 00:20:04,343
three and the naive simplistic
songwriting of us two,

293
00:20:04,410 --> 00:20:06,243
and I think that was the key.

294
00:20:06,376 --> 00:20:23,476
* Music *

295
00:20:23,543 --> 00:20:24,943
Roger: I wrote quite a few
of the riffs in the early

296
00:20:25,010 --> 00:20:27,443
days but Ritchie was really
the riff master, he's a complex

297
00:20:27,510 --> 00:20:31,343
player who really learned how to
be simple, but writing something

298
00:20:31,410 --> 00:20:35,376
simple that is unlike anything
else, that's really difficult.

299
00:20:35,443 --> 00:20:36,576
Sam: You grew up as a
big fan of Purple,

300
00:20:36,643 --> 00:20:38,343
why were they so important?

301
00:20:38,410 --> 00:20:40,443
Phil Collen: Ritchie Blackmore
was the reason I played guitar,

302
00:20:40,510 --> 00:20:42,576
my cousin took me to see
Deep Purple, I was

303
00:20:42,643 --> 00:20:45,476
front row in front of
Ritchie Blackmore, I'm like

304
00:20:45,543 --> 00:20:49,676
oh my god he's like smashing
his guitar up and playing,

305
00:20:49,743 --> 00:20:53,543
again he's playing was
just off the chart.

306
00:20:53,610 --> 00:20:55,543
Bruce Dickinson: I never heard
anyone play you know make

307
00:20:55,610 --> 00:20:57,843
sounds like that on guitar,
it was just so cool

308
00:20:57,910 --> 00:21:00,643
because up to then it was all
just you know Clapton is God

309
00:21:00,710 --> 00:21:04,843
and all that kind of stuff,
you know Clapton was tame

310
00:21:04,910 --> 00:21:09,276
compared to what Ritchie was
doing, it was the sound of Pan,

311
00:21:09,343 --> 00:21:11,710
like prancing all
over your brain.

312
00:21:11,776 --> 00:21:19,843
* Music *

313
00:21:19,910 --> 00:21:22,243
Sam Dunn: With the Mark 2
line-up of Gillan, Glover,

314
00:21:22,310 --> 00:21:27,243
Paice, Blackmore and Lord firmly
in place in 1970 Deep Purple

315
00:21:27,310 --> 00:21:30,343
released one of heavy metal's
all time classic records

316
00:21:30,410 --> 00:21:33,876
"In Rock" and one of the
elements that made "In Rock"

317
00:21:33,943 --> 00:21:37,876
unique was the thunderous sound
of Jon Lord's Hammond organ.

318
00:21:37,943 --> 00:21:43,810
* Music *

319
00:21:43,910 --> 00:21:45,776
Jon: The first time I really
became aware of what I could do

320
00:21:45,843 --> 00:21:49,376
with the Hammond on record was
on the organ seller in "Hard

321
00:21:49,443 --> 00:21:53,443
Lovin' Man" which is the first
time I just let myself loose in

322
00:21:53,510 --> 00:21:59,776
the studio to see exactly what
I can make that beast do.

323
00:21:59,843 --> 00:22:01,843
I think one of the things I
really like about the Hammond

324
00:22:01,910 --> 00:22:05,843
organ is adaptability, I mean
I managed to adapt what was

325
00:22:05,910 --> 00:22:08,810
initially a church instrument
and then adapted by

326
00:22:08,876 --> 00:22:12,276
jazz musicians and blues
musicians and I managed to kind

327
00:22:12,343 --> 00:22:14,843
of shoe horn it into
a hard rock band.

328
00:22:14,910 --> 00:22:18,776
I wanted to emancipate the organ
from being something that just

329
00:22:18,843 --> 00:22:23,710
sat in the background and
colored the sound, I wanted it

330
00:22:23,776 --> 00:22:30,710
to create that hard sound and
here now finally I had something

331
00:22:30,776 --> 00:22:33,876
that could compete
with Ritchie you see.

332
00:22:33,943 --> 00:22:54,276
* Music *

333
00:22:54,376 --> 00:22:55,810
Sam: You had some pretty
heavy peers at that time

334
00:22:55,876 --> 00:22:58,643
speaking of Sabbath and
Zeppelin but I think one thing

335
00:22:58,710 --> 00:23:02,310
that set you guys apart
was that real complexity

336
00:23:02,376 --> 00:23:04,810
and that expansiveness
of the music.

337
00:23:04,876 --> 00:23:07,676
Jon: We had the genuine belief
that improvisation was

338
00:23:07,743 --> 00:23:10,510
part of the music and
indeed it was very often

339
00:23:10,576 --> 00:23:13,443
was how we came up
with the music.

340
00:23:13,510 --> 00:23:15,110
Dave Lewis: When you went
to a Purple show you were

341
00:23:15,176 --> 00:23:17,910
getting something very special
because it was never gonna

342
00:23:17,976 --> 00:23:20,710
sound the same, I think the
improvisation was definitely

343
00:23:20,776 --> 00:23:23,810
a key thing to putting them
apart from other bands,

344
00:23:23,876 --> 00:23:26,376
I don't think Sabbath had
that and there wasn't many

345
00:23:26,443 --> 00:23:28,943
bands that carried that
and Purple certainly did.

346
00:23:29,010 --> 00:23:32,543
Jon: We had that wonderful
freedom which is to go out on

347
00:23:32,610 --> 00:23:35,443
stage in front of paying
customers and saying hang onto

348
00:23:35,510 --> 00:23:37,443
your hats you're gonna like what
we're gonna do here, we don't

349
00:23:37,510 --> 00:23:39,243
know what we're gonna do, but
we know you're gonna like it.

350
00:23:39,410 --> 00:23:56,343
* Music *

351
00:23:56,410 --> 00:23:58,743
>> Deep Purple weren't
just great improvisers,

352
00:23:58,810 --> 00:24:02,876
their song "Smoke On The Water"
contains heavy metals most

353
00:24:02,943 --> 00:24:07,010
famousriffwhichtook
Purple
tonumber1ontheUK
charts.

354
00:24:07,110 --> 00:24:09,843
So what's the story behind the
riff and how do the band members

355
00:24:09,910 --> 00:24:13,610
feel about being considered a
leader of heavy metal music?

356
00:24:15,743 --> 00:24:18,610
Roger: Ritchie started playing
a riff, I don't know if he

357
00:24:18,676 --> 00:24:21,510
had it beforehand or whether it
just came to him instantly,

358
00:24:21,576 --> 00:24:24,276
we all just sort of joined
in and threw together an

359
00:24:24,343 --> 00:24:27,343
arrangement, it took all of
about maybe four minutes.

360
00:24:27,410 --> 00:24:30,810
Ian: You had this amazingly
simple catchy riff, you had

361
00:24:30,876 --> 00:24:35,010
quite a clever little chord
sequence and you had a story,

362
00:24:35,110 --> 00:24:38,810
most great songs are stories and
it really was the genius of Ian

363
00:24:38,876 --> 00:24:41,943
and Roger, they said look, we've
had a major occurrence here,

364
00:24:42,010 --> 00:24:44,610
we came to record, the place we
were gonna record, a beautiful

365
00:24:44,676 --> 00:24:49,243
big place has just burned down,
we've got all this story,

366
00:24:49,310 --> 00:24:52,610
let's tell the story
of the whole thing.

367
00:24:52,676 --> 00:25:09,476
* Music *

368
00:25:09,576 --> 00:25:11,643
Sam: It had a bit of a crossover
appeal, kind of moves

369
00:25:11,710 --> 00:25:15,643
you guys up the ladder in terms
of exposure and popularity.

370
00:25:15,710 --> 00:25:19,510
Roger: It amazes me to this
day that a song about such a

371
00:25:19,576 --> 00:25:23,676
specific incident has
such a general appeal.

372
00:25:23,743 --> 00:25:24,943
Most people come up
to me and say hey

373
00:25:25,010 --> 00:25:27,176
it's the first thing I
played on the guitar.

374
00:25:27,243 --> 00:25:29,976
I hear that everywhere we go
and you go in music stores

375
00:25:30,110 --> 00:25:32,676
and stuff like that you know
no "Smoke On The Water" or

376
00:25:32,743 --> 00:25:36,376
"Stairway To Heaven",
they're the two you get and

377
00:25:36,443 --> 00:25:38,676
that's a back handed
compliment but a great one.

378
00:25:38,743 --> 00:25:41,243
Sam: At the time in that
early seventies period did

379
00:25:41,310 --> 00:25:43,343
you see yourselves as
a heavy metal band?

380
00:25:43,410 --> 00:25:46,743
Ian: We just called ourselves
a hard rock band, metal is one

381
00:25:46,810 --> 00:25:51,810
facet of what us and a
couple other bands created,

382
00:25:51,876 --> 00:25:56,376
it's the nastier side of what we
do but there's also other stuff

383
00:25:56,443 --> 00:26:00,943
we do which is not any
way connected to that.

384
00:26:01,010 --> 00:26:03,110
Jon: I always felt that Purple
despite all the bomb blasts

385
00:26:03,110 --> 00:26:06,176
and the loudness on stage I
always felt it had one foot

386
00:26:06,243 --> 00:26:09,576
just dragging back into the
blues somehow and you know

387
00:26:09,643 --> 00:26:12,443
some people say that Purple
had a hand in heavy metal

388
00:26:12,510 --> 00:26:16,543
and I would accept that we
could be one of the godfathers

389
00:26:16,610 --> 00:26:20,310
but I defy the parenthood,
I thought that wasn't us,

390
00:26:20,376 --> 00:26:21,743
we weren't the parents.

391
00:26:21,810 --> 00:26:33,643
* Music *

392
00:26:33,710 --> 00:26:36,176
>> Despite Deep Purple's
pivotal role in expanding

393
00:26:36,243 --> 00:26:39,843
thesound of heavy musicmuch
likeSabbathandZeppelin

394
00:26:39,910 --> 00:26:42,110
theydidn'tdefinetheir
soundasheavymetal

395
00:26:42,143 --> 00:26:45,210
but now that these bands had
undeniably forged a new

396
00:26:45,276 --> 00:26:48,376
direction in heavy music, what
would happen next in the

397
00:26:48,443 --> 00:26:51,143
evolution of seventies
hard rock in England?

398
00:26:51,210 --> 00:26:54,310
*

399
00:27:07,676 --> 00:27:09,843
>> After the ground breaking
records of Black Sabbath,

400
00:27:09,910 --> 00:27:12,476
Led Zeppelin and Deep Purple
in the early seventies

401
00:27:12,543 --> 00:27:15,643
the sound of British hard
rock started to shift and

402
00:27:15,710 --> 00:27:18,376
so I've always wanted to know
why these bands drifted away

403
00:27:18,443 --> 00:27:21,276
from their iconic
aggressive sound.

404
00:27:22,843 --> 00:27:24,610
Geezer Butler: After "Master of
Reality" we wanted to branch out

405
00:27:24,676 --> 00:27:27,143
and get a bit of a different
sound and we were buying

406
00:27:27,210 --> 00:27:30,610
keyboards and stuff like that,
Tony was getting good at playing

407
00:27:30,676 --> 00:27:33,843
piano and we just wanted
to experiment a bit more.

408
00:27:33,976 --> 00:27:37,943
By the time 'Vol.4' and 'Sabbath
Bloody Sabbath' we thought let's

409
00:27:38,010 --> 00:27:42,110
spend a bit more time in
the studio and we had

410
00:27:42,143 --> 00:27:47,110
enough money by then to be
able to not be on the road,

411
00:27:47,143 --> 00:27:50,376
to be able to go into the
studio and spend more time.

412
00:27:50,443 --> 00:27:52,976
Bill Ward: All of us were
growing, all of us were

413
00:27:53,110 --> 00:27:57,543
still being influenced so I
think there was a departure

414
00:27:57,610 --> 00:28:00,376
from those first three records,
everything was always about

415
00:28:00,443 --> 00:28:04,510
the song so if we needed a
choir we'd add in a choir,

416
00:28:04,576 --> 00:28:07,210
if I needed to play tubular
bells, which I did,

417
00:28:07,276 --> 00:28:11,010
I would play tubular bells, so
we had very little resistance

418
00:28:11,110 --> 00:28:16,143
to going to other instruments
and to new ideas.

419
00:28:16,210 --> 00:28:19,276
Sam Dunn: Why do you think
these bands start to

420
00:28:19,343 --> 00:28:21,776
explore new sounds and
take new directions?

421
00:28:21,843 --> 00:28:24,810
John Ingham: There comes a point
of course when it probably

422
00:28:24,876 --> 00:28:27,576
gets very tiring to play
the same kind of riff

423
00:28:27,643 --> 00:28:29,910
and the same feeling,
you want to start

424
00:28:29,976 --> 00:28:32,576
exploring and widening
the palette out.

425
00:28:32,643 --> 00:28:35,776
Sabbath putting keyboards on an
album, you know that's a level

426
00:28:35,843 --> 00:28:37,976
that we should just, you just
don't really care what anybody

427
00:28:38,110 --> 00:28:40,276
says you know because
you know you can do it.

428
00:28:40,443 --> 00:28:57,376
* Music *

429
00:28:57,443 --> 00:28:59,476
Sam Dunn: Here's a now
legendary prog rock producer

430
00:28:59,543 --> 00:29:02,310
Rick Wakeman working
with Black Sabbath.

431
00:29:02,376 --> 00:29:04,976
What was it like having
him work with you guys?

432
00:29:05,110 --> 00:29:07,110
Geezer Butler: The way it came
about is we were trying to work

433
00:29:07,143 --> 00:29:11,443
a keyboard part out for ages,
we just couldn't get it right,

434
00:29:11,510 --> 00:29:13,910
I was trying to play it,
Tony was trying to play it

435
00:29:13,976 --> 00:29:16,643
and it just didn't sound
right. We were in the bar and

436
00:29:16,710 --> 00:29:19,976
Rick Wakeman came in and we
got talking to Rick and we're

437
00:29:20,110 --> 00:29:22,876
asking him his advice and he
went, what you trying to do?

438
00:29:22,943 --> 00:29:25,643
and he came into the studio,
you mean like this...

439
00:29:25,710 --> 00:29:28,376
...and we went, yes!
And that was it,

440
00:29:28,443 --> 00:29:30,943
you know we got him in and
did the keyboard parts.

441
00:29:31,010 --> 00:29:34,276
Bill Ward: So Rick definitely
enhanced the music and

442
00:29:34,343 --> 00:29:37,576
I'm glad that we went through
it, I'm glad that we played

443
00:29:37,643 --> 00:29:41,610
with other artists on our
records instead of being inside

444
00:29:41,676 --> 00:29:44,876
some very scared place about,
we're changing it too

445
00:29:44,943 --> 00:29:47,143
much you know, I think we
had to smash through a

446
00:29:47,210 --> 00:29:51,243
lot of what we might
have originally been.

447
00:29:51,310 --> 00:29:52,510
Sam: Taking risks.

448
00:29:52,576 --> 00:29:54,243
Bill: Very
much taking risks.

449
00:29:54,310 --> 00:30:03,176
* Music *

450
00:30:03,243 --> 00:30:05,876
>> Besides Black Sabbath, the
other British hard rock band

451
00:30:05,943 --> 00:30:08,610
that changed their sound
in the early seventies

452
00:30:08,676 --> 00:30:12,043
was Deep Purple. Tensions
within the band had led to

453
00:30:12,110 --> 00:30:15,876
a brand new Mark 3 line-up
featuring the R&B inspired

454
00:30:15,943 --> 00:30:18,876
duo of Glenn Hughes
and David Coverdale.

455
00:30:19,610 --> 00:30:37,510
* Music *

456
00:30:37,576 --> 00:30:39,943
Sam Dunn: How was what you
were doing in Deep Purple

457
00:30:40,010 --> 00:30:42,076
do you think different
than what the sound

458
00:30:42,143 --> 00:30:43,976
of the band before that?

459
00:30:44,043 --> 00:30:46,076
David Coverdale: I think I
brought a soul element, my three

460
00:30:46,143 --> 00:30:49,643
most played albums when I joined
Deep Purple was "There's a Riot

461
00:30:49,710 --> 00:30:52,143
Goin' On" - Sly And The Family
Stone, Donny Hathaway - "Live"

462
00:30:52,210 --> 00:30:55,010
and "Music Of My
Mind" - Stevie Wonder.

463
00:30:55,110 --> 00:30:59,476
I was a huge hard rock fan but
I try to bring that the songs I

464
00:30:59,543 --> 00:31:02,310
mistreated you know that
kind of blues element.

465
00:31:02,410 --> 00:31:05,110
Glenn Hughes: I had seen them
at the peak of "Machine Head",

466
00:31:05,143 --> 00:31:07,276
I thought they were interesting
and I thought they were

467
00:31:07,343 --> 00:31:10,443
unique and I thought they
were a one off band.

468
00:31:10,510 --> 00:31:13,110
So when the call came in
for me to join them, I wasn't

469
00:31:13,176 --> 00:31:17,876
completely sold on the music
that I was about to play.

470
00:31:17,943 --> 00:31:19,876
But knowing that with
David coming in with me

471
00:31:19,943 --> 00:31:22,610
there would be a whole,
possibly a new structure

472
00:31:22,676 --> 00:31:26,376
in the form of
writing and singing.

473
00:31:26,443 --> 00:31:31,543
I wasn't trying to derail the
angst or metal vibe that was

474
00:31:31,610 --> 00:31:34,976
Purple but Purple
were changing radically.

475
00:31:35,110 --> 00:31:46,543
* Music *

476
00:31:46,610 --> 00:31:49,176
John Ingham: Bands like Purple,
Zeppelin and Sabbath and

477
00:31:49,243 --> 00:31:52,110
Spooky Truth, I mean all these
kind of bands had been around

478
00:31:52,143 --> 00:31:57,110
since say '68, '69, by 72', '73
that's almost a generation in

479
00:31:57,143 --> 00:31:59,310
rock and roll, it felt like
they were getting very removed.

480
00:31:59,410 --> 00:32:02,110
Everyone is very famous, very
rich, they live in limousines,

481
00:32:02,176 --> 00:32:04,910
they live in penthouses, rock
was started to be treated like

482
00:32:04,976 --> 00:32:08,110
some kind of, you know
like classical music.

483
00:32:08,110 --> 00:32:12,110
* Music *

484
00:32:12,176 --> 00:32:14,176
>> By the mid seventies
bands like Deep Purple

485
00:32:14,243 --> 00:32:17,110
and Black Sabbath were no
longer on the vanguard of

486
00:32:17,110 --> 00:32:20,010
heavy music in England, creating
a void for something new

487
00:32:20,110 --> 00:32:23,243
and then a whole new sound
emerged for the next generation

488
00:32:23,310 --> 00:32:26,576
of rock fans, that
sound was glam rock.

489
00:32:26,676 --> 00:32:41,576
* Music *

490
00:32:41,643 --> 00:32:43,110
Andy Scott: The music that
was coming out of the late

491
00:32:43,176 --> 00:32:48,110
sixties which we were all very
into had no identifiable look

492
00:32:48,110 --> 00:32:51,276
because when you think back
not many of these bands

493
00:32:51,343 --> 00:32:55,376
had big visual image,
there was a lot of bands,

494
00:32:55,443 --> 00:33:00,476
haircuts, curtains, nose,
that's all you saw.

495
00:33:00,543 --> 00:33:05,176
So I think kind of dressing
up the late sixties

496
00:33:05,243 --> 00:33:10,910
commercial rock was where
bands like Sweet came in.

497
00:33:10,976 --> 00:33:27,143
* Music *

498
00:33:27,210 --> 00:33:29,976
Chris Welch: Glam rock was
very big in Britain at that

499
00:33:30,110 --> 00:33:32,310
time so you would find
bands like The Sweet,

500
00:33:32,376 --> 00:33:34,243
they had a quite a heavy
rock style you know,

501
00:33:34,310 --> 00:33:37,476
it was all revolving around
guitars, bass and drums

502
00:33:37,543 --> 00:33:39,310
but at the same time they
were adopting a kind

503
00:33:39,376 --> 00:33:43,110
of a gay camp rock appearance
of Marc Bolan and

504
00:33:43,110 --> 00:33:45,810
David Bowie, they were
getting hit records much to the

505
00:33:45,876 --> 00:33:48,110
annoyance of Led
Zeppelin and Deep Purple.

506
00:33:48,176 --> 00:33:51,243
Sam: Why do you think fans
were moving away from that

507
00:33:51,310 --> 00:33:55,310
serious, 'We're gonna change the
world' mentality towards more

508
00:33:55,376 --> 00:33:58,543
just, we just want to go to a
show and have a good time.

509
00:33:58,610 --> 00:34:01,976
Andy Scott: England was having
harder times during the

510
00:34:02,110 --> 00:34:04,243
glam rock period, protest
marches, people were striking

511
00:34:04,310 --> 00:34:08,343
a lot but usually when all that
kind of stuff starts happening,

512
00:34:08,410 --> 00:34:13,243
the pubs fill up and people
generally want to have a

513
00:34:13,310 --> 00:34:16,610
good time that gets you away
from all the things that are

514
00:34:16,676 --> 00:34:19,010
going on in your life, you
know we were probably lucky

515
00:34:19,110 --> 00:34:21,243
to be the outlet for
their frustration.

516
00:34:21,310 --> 00:34:24,176
Chris Welch: The glam rock thing
was a big fashion thing and

517
00:34:24,243 --> 00:34:26,943
the younger generation of kids
who weren't so concerned

518
00:34:27,010 --> 00:34:30,243
about Vietnam war or death
doom and destruction,

519
00:34:30,310 --> 00:34:32,110
you know what they were really
concerned about was buying

520
00:34:32,110 --> 00:34:35,943
the next great hit record
by David Bowie or T. Rex,

521
00:34:36,010 --> 00:34:38,510
it's a party time really,
it's party music.

522
00:34:38,576 --> 00:35:05,110
* Music *

523
00:35:12,676 --> 00:35:14,310
>> Even though glam rock
was exploding in England

524
00:35:14,376 --> 00:35:17,576
and heavy metal appeared
to be on the ropes

525
00:35:17,643 --> 00:35:20,576
there was one British
hard rocker who helped
reignite heavy music

526
00:35:20,643 --> 00:35:23,276
in the mid seventies,
Ritchie Blackmore.

527
00:35:23,343 --> 00:35:35,410
* Music *

528
00:35:35,476 --> 00:35:37,976
>> Ritchie's new band Rainbow
was a far cry from the

529
00:35:38,110 --> 00:35:40,510
funk inspired
sounds of Deep Purple.

530
00:35:40,576 --> 00:35:43,976
So why did he form Rainbow and
return to this heavier sound?

531
00:35:45,510 --> 00:35:47,510
Sam Dunn: Why do you think
Ritchie left Purple and

532
00:35:47,576 --> 00:35:50,376
wanted to do something
heavier with Rainbow?

533
00:35:50,443 --> 00:35:54,210
Glenn Hughes: I believe that
Ritchie didn't like the super

534
00:35:54,276 --> 00:35:57,110
groove thing that Dave
and myself and Ian Paice

535
00:35:57,143 --> 00:35:58,610
was doing and Jon Lord
is now playing a

536
00:35:58,676 --> 00:36:01,343
Fender Rhodes keyboard, so
by the time we were making

537
00:36:01,410 --> 00:36:05,110
"Stormbringer" Ritchie had
already got in his head that he

538
00:36:05,143 --> 00:36:08,210
was gonna start making the bark
influence medieval music.

539
00:36:08,276 --> 00:36:11,276
Jimmy Bain: I made the
bad move of putting on a

540
00:36:11,343 --> 00:36:14,576
"Stormbringer" CD in
the limo one time and

541
00:36:14,643 --> 00:36:16,976
he took it out and chucked
it out the window.

542
00:36:17,110 --> 00:36:20,943
He didn't care for that
period of Purple at all,
he didn't like it.

543
00:36:21,010 --> 00:36:24,443
From the first rehearsals we
had, he was definitely into

544
00:36:24,510 --> 00:36:27,410
getting a more raw
sound than he had before.

545
00:36:27,476 --> 00:36:30,943
Sam Dunn: Can you tell me
about the classical influence
that Ritchie brought in?

546
00:36:31,010 --> 00:36:34,010
Tony Carey: He was born like 500
years too late and his passion

547
00:36:34,110 --> 00:36:39,910
was always this 16th century
thing but at 130 decibels.

548
00:36:39,976 --> 00:36:43,343
He did a solo on "Stargazer"
and live sometimes,

549
00:36:43,410 --> 00:36:47,176
absolutely amazing, this Arabic
scale with slide guitar

550
00:36:47,243 --> 00:36:50,110
on a Stratocaster, I never
heard anything like it.

551
00:36:50,110 --> 00:37:03,710
* Music *

552
00:37:03,776 --> 00:37:07,143
>> Besides Ritchie Blackmore's
midevil inspired guitar sound,

553
00:37:07,210 --> 00:37:10,110
Rainbow also featured one of
the most powerful vocalists

554
00:37:10,143 --> 00:37:14,243
in the history of heavy
metal, Ronnie James Dio.

555
00:37:14,310 --> 00:37:17,110
And luckily I was ableto
meet RonnieathisL.A.home

556
00:37:17,143 --> 00:37:19,443
a few years before his death in
2010,

557
00:37:19,510 --> 00:37:22,810
and ask him about his
approach to metal vocals.

558
00:37:22,876 --> 00:37:24,876
Ronnie James Dio: I view the
music that I've made as being

559
00:37:24,943 --> 00:37:30,210
so much about the little man
because metal music has

560
00:37:30,276 --> 00:37:34,776
always been looked down upon
than obviously it's going to be

561
00:37:34,843 --> 00:37:38,810
something that affects people
who have been looked down upon.

562
00:37:38,876 --> 00:37:40,243
That's always been the thing
that I have written about,

563
00:37:40,310 --> 00:37:41,710
more than anything.

564
00:37:41,843 --> 00:37:52,476
* Music *

565
00:37:52,543 --> 00:37:54,276
Tony Carey: He had his own
voice, let me put it that way,

566
00:37:54,343 --> 00:37:57,476
he was really the first to
combine this tarot card,

567
00:37:57,543 --> 00:38:02,576
sorcery, Lord of the Rings type
thing, wizard flying over you

568
00:38:02,643 --> 00:38:05,243
know and a fist coming out of
the ocean grabbing a rainbow,

569
00:38:05,310 --> 00:38:08,943
this whole fantasy
thing with hard rock.

570
00:38:09,010 --> 00:38:13,910
Ronnie: Dragons and Medieval
times and the things that you

571
00:38:13,976 --> 00:38:16,910
see surrounding my home are
part and parcel of my life.

572
00:38:16,976 --> 00:38:22,110
I read at such an early age
and read all about dragons and

573
00:38:22,176 --> 00:38:27,010
knights and damsels in distress
and great science fiction works,

574
00:38:27,110 --> 00:38:30,110
Edgar Rice Burroughs and I was
just, wow I better create what

575
00:38:30,176 --> 00:38:33,543
these images are on myself,
that's so cool and so that's why

576
00:38:33,610 --> 00:38:36,876
eventually, writing and writing
and writing, I decided to put

577
00:38:37,010 --> 00:38:40,510
all the things that I wrote in
this kind of fantasy area which

578
00:38:40,576 --> 00:38:43,110
made you have to think,
what is he talking about?

579
00:38:43,176 --> 00:38:45,510
Oh he said that, I
wonder what that looks like?

580
00:38:45,576 --> 00:38:47,610
I wanted people to have to use
their imagination the way I did

581
00:38:47,676 --> 00:38:49,576
and create their own dragons.

582
00:38:49,643 --> 00:38:58,410
* Music *

583
00:38:58,476 --> 00:39:01,276
>> Ronnie James Dio pioneered
the fantasy-based imagery

584
00:39:01,343 --> 00:39:03,510
that's become part of
the fabric of many

585
00:39:03,576 --> 00:39:06,643
contemporary metal bands but
the first band to create

586
00:39:06,710 --> 00:39:10,010
the modern metal sound and
to actually identify as a

587
00:39:10,110 --> 00:39:13,110
true heavy metal band
was Judas Priest.

588
00:39:13,176 --> 00:39:22,210
* Music *

589
00:39:22,276 --> 00:39:26,110
Sam Dunn: Can we go back
to "Rocka Rolla" and

590
00:39:26,176 --> 00:39:27,476
"Sad Wings Of Destiny".
How do you think

591
00:39:27,543 --> 00:39:31,376
"Sad Wings" was a different
record than "Rocka Rolla"

592
00:39:31,443 --> 00:39:32,910
Rob Halford: I think
the difference between

593
00:39:32,976 --> 00:39:36,410
"Rocka Rolla" and "Sad Wings
Of Destiny", the band grew up

594
00:39:36,476 --> 00:39:39,110
very very quickly. Some of
those "Rocka Rolla" songs

595
00:39:39,176 --> 00:39:42,176
were already established
in the bands repertoire.

596
00:39:42,243 --> 00:39:45,110
So by the time we got to "Sad
Wings" there was, there was a

597
00:39:45,143 --> 00:39:47,443
growth, there was a
definite growth going on.

598
00:39:47,510 --> 00:39:49,976
Sam Dunn: It has a very
metallic sound compared

599
00:39:50,110 --> 00:39:50,910
to say the early
Sabbath records.

600
00:39:50,976 --> 00:39:51,976
Chris Tsangarides: Yes.

601
00:39:52,110 --> 00:39:53,476
Sam Dunn: How did you do it?

602
00:39:53,543 --> 00:39:55,543
Chris Tsangarides: The first
Sabbath albums were done in

603
00:39:55,610 --> 00:39:59,910
no time, basically they
set up live, recorded it,

604
00:40:00,110 --> 00:40:03,010
maybe threw the vocal on
at the end, that was it.

605
00:40:03,076 --> 00:40:06,076
"Sad Wings" took quite a few
months of intensive overdubs,

606
00:40:06,143 --> 00:40:09,476
it's orchestrated except
we don't have violins and

607
00:40:09,543 --> 00:40:13,543
you know orchestral instruments,
we've got drums, guitars,

608
00:40:13,610 --> 00:40:17,510
and bass but if you arrange
them like you would a

609
00:40:17,576 --> 00:40:20,943
classical piece of music,
that's heavy metal.

610
00:40:21,010 --> 00:40:23,443
Christopher Knowles: Judas
Priest represent a distinct

611
00:40:23,510 --> 00:40:27,943
shift away from the
blues roots of metal,

612
00:40:28,010 --> 00:40:30,776
their chord changes and their
progressions are not based

613
00:40:30,843 --> 00:40:34,476
on that old 145 blues
twelve bar kind of thing.

614
00:40:34,543 --> 00:40:40,510
They become a distinct metal
that has no real prior

615
00:40:40,576 --> 00:40:44,110
antecedence, it's now a style.

616
00:40:44,243 --> 00:40:51,243
* Music *

617
00:40:51,310 --> 00:40:54,576
Sam Dunn: Where did you get the
inspiration to create what

618
00:40:54,643 --> 00:41:00,476
is now hallmark of what you guys
do, the two-guitar approach?

619
00:41:00,543 --> 00:41:01,910
K.K. Downing: One band
in particular is called

620
00:41:01,976 --> 00:41:04,410
Wishbone Ash, they
had a couple of
guitar players

621
00:41:04,476 --> 00:41:07,676
that are kind of not heavy in
any particular way but it just

622
00:41:07,743 --> 00:41:11,210
seemed to be a really good idea
at the time because the sound

623
00:41:11,276 --> 00:41:15,143
was just fuller, you know it was
almost like a stereo effect

624
00:41:15,210 --> 00:41:18,010
on the stage, we were
very excited about it.

625
00:41:18,110 --> 00:41:20,310
Martin Popoff: There were
bands before Judas Priest

626
00:41:20,376 --> 00:41:22,676
that had two guitars
in them but

627
00:41:22,743 --> 00:41:25,510
they almost seemed like
disassociated with each other

628
00:41:25,576 --> 00:41:26,943
it was just two
guitarists in the band,

629
00:41:27,010 --> 00:41:29,276
you know Brad Whitford and
Joe Perry or Keith Richards

630
00:41:29,343 --> 00:41:31,976
and whoever was the guitarist
at the time, the twin

631
00:41:32,110 --> 00:41:35,710
guitarists chugging away on a
really good solid meat and

632
00:41:35,776 --> 00:41:38,343
potatoes riff is something
that comes from Judas Priest.

633
00:41:38,410 --> 00:41:40,510
Scott Ian: You know this is
(beep) as a kid that I had never

634
00:41:40,576 --> 00:41:43,976
heard before, Tipton would
just tear your head off,

635
00:41:44,110 --> 00:41:46,376
his leads, they were
blistering and then

636
00:41:46,443 --> 00:41:48,976
K.K. on the other
hand was the madman,

637
00:41:49,110 --> 00:41:50,843
you know the guy
holding the Flying-V

638
00:41:50,910 --> 00:41:52,176
and you know playing the
whammy bar like this.

639
00:41:52,310 --> 00:41:59,143
* Music *

640
00:41:59,210 --> 00:42:01,776
>> Judas Priest's influence
on modern metal went beyond

641
00:42:01,843 --> 00:42:04,876
their dual guitar approach;
they also established a look

642
00:42:04,943 --> 00:42:08,676
that would become the uniform
of the heavy metal culture.

643
00:42:08,810 --> 00:42:10,610
Rob Halford: It's one thing to
have the music but it's another

644
00:42:10,676 --> 00:42:14,510
thing to have the visual so that
everyone around the planet can

645
00:42:14,576 --> 00:42:17,910
connect and go, yah that's it,
the way that looks is totally

646
00:42:18,010 --> 00:42:22,376
representative of the sound of
the music, all I wear is black,

647
00:42:22,443 --> 00:42:27,010
I just don't feel, you'll never
find never wearing black.

648
00:42:27,110 --> 00:42:28,476
K.K. Downing: So many of the
other bands they were still

649
00:42:28,543 --> 00:42:31,610
kind of wearing obviously
leather, denims and

650
00:42:31,676 --> 00:42:36,310
different things but you did
have a sense of excitement that

651
00:42:36,376 --> 00:42:40,110
it was kind of fresh you know
and you had a sense that the

652
00:42:40,110 --> 00:42:44,843
audience recognized the
fact that well this is
new, this is metal.

653
00:42:44,910 --> 00:42:47,510
Sam Dunn: The big three never
really self identified

654
00:42:47,576 --> 00:42:51,143
or adopted the concept
of heavy metal,

655
00:42:51,210 --> 00:42:54,343
with you guys, you claimed it.

656
00:42:54,410 --> 00:42:57,110
K.K.: There was a period, wasn't
that really people were really

657
00:42:57,176 --> 00:43:02,143
sort of not admitting they were
metal but I think Priest, we

658
00:43:02,243 --> 00:43:05,776
always maintained that we were
proud to fly the flag of metal.

659
00:43:05,843 --> 00:43:07,643
Rob Halford: We are who we
are, we believe in ourselves,

660
00:43:07,710 --> 00:43:11,710
we're strong about what we feel
we want to do so yah right

661
00:43:11,776 --> 00:43:15,110
from the very beginning that's
all we ever wanted to be

662
00:43:15,176 --> 00:43:18,110
known as in Judas Priest
was we're heavy metal.

663
00:43:18,476 --> 00:43:48,443
*