[Sukanya Krishnan] Previously on Sister Wives: One on One...
There is a refusal to either communicate, to understand, or to partner.
Like, should I respect you? You're dividing the family.
You really are the only one that's having
a fully functioning relationship with Kody.
Makes me angry.
We all came out of this scarred, all of us did.
Can't.
[Sukanya] In this final episode,
I sit down individually with Kody, Janelle, Robyn, Christine, and Meri
to discuss the most talked about events in their lives.
I don't want polygamy 'cause I don't believe in it for me anymore.
At that point, she made a choice
that she was never gonna have a functioning marriage.
I didn't know things were as serious as they were.
We've got these great memories and we've got these beautiful children,
and you hate polygamy?
What the crap?
Are we ever gonna have an intimate marriage again?
And he just said, "Probably not."
I didn't want to be intimate
because I had somebody who was stabbing me in the back, I felt like.
So you can have an intimate relationship with somebody else,
but I get nothing.
It's a really tough place to get to where intimacy is a duty.
I'm Sukanya Krishnan, and this is Sister Wives: One on One.
[camera crew speaking indistinctly]
And it felt great for me. I... It felt great because I felt like I was--
[director] Standby in five, four, three...
So where are you and Kody at right now?
Kody and I are divorced. We're completely separate.
We're just gonna be friends eventually.
I just realized I had to make a decision for my heart,
and my heart was done being broken.
And it felt...
well, freeing.
Well, Christine, [sighs] okay,
so Christine's moved. She's left.
We are...
no longer married.
Um, I love her, and I... I um...
I don't know what to do 'cause I've got the grief, but I'm still angry.
- Yeah. - I'll take the grief right now for a little while,
just to be out of the anger phase,
and then just moving on, just have a good life and find happiness.
And I think, to be honest with you,
there's gonna be some relief from the rest of the family too.
How does something like this play out in the bigger family?
What a waste. [scoffs]
Help me understand that.
'Cause there's two functioning people that could figure it out.
[Sukanya] Mmm.
And...
sorry, I just...
I don't see why giving up is an option
when you haven't actually tried...
to fix it.
Feels like you're... You're angry a little bit.
I am frustrated, and angry...
and devastated by Christine's choice.
Yeah.
She's part of my big picture.
Her kids are part of my big picture...
and I have been wanting to have a close relationship with her for years.
Divorce just...
[sighs]
Just breaks everything up.
It's just hard.
I think that they just got to the point, that they just...
They tried, and tried, and tried, and they have tried.
They've been to counseling, they've tried.
On both sides, they've tried,
and I think it just got to the point where it just...
They just realized it didn't work anymore.
How do you think that dynamic is gonna affect
the whole family, the larger family?
It's been hard because, like, you're pulling apart
something that has been for 20-plus years, 25 years.
That's like... Who are you after that?
You've been something for 25 years,
- who are you when that no longer exists? - Mmm.
And how does that feel for you,
- since that has been such a bigger part of your life? - Well, so, yeah... No...
I mean, like, Christine has been such this huge thing.
So now, I'm, like, I'm trying to figure out how to not take sides.
So they're separated.
How does that affect you and the family, the bigger family?
I don't even know, like, it... Literally, it's, like, so new to me,
and I don't know what to do with it.
-I'm still trying to wrap my head around it, -Right.
And get it, like, it... 'Cause it makes no sense to me.
It's not just a marriage I'm leaving,
it's a whole family and it's sister wives,
and what does that do to us and I don't know,
but then you just have to make a decision for yourself anyway
'cause I'm like, am I being super selfish?
Is it the selfish decision?
I'm changing the whole dynamic of a huge family with so many people.
Is it just selfish? Is that what this is?
And I just decided, you know what, I gotta still live my life for me too,
and I wasn't... I just wasn't present,
I wasn't happy, and it wasn't...
Just wasn't working anymore.
All right.
I know you want to set the record straight.
You've got your version of the story, Christine has hers.
There's a lot to unpack with that.
More than I want to.
So let's start the conversation.
Is it hard for you to sit there and question your polygamy?
I... I think in some ways, some people are really cut out for it...
and some people aren't.
I'm sitting here going, wow, I mean, we have really messed this up,
this call to be better than we are.
You know, and I... We might work it out,
but I know people, I know fundamentalist Mormons, I know polygamists
who are doing a much better job than me...
and I wonder though, are they... Is it they're... Is there a disconnect?
Are they living in that dissonance that I have experienced?
I want you to watch this next clip.
I think it might have surprised the audience
because they haven't seen that side of Kody.
Let's watch this and we'll get your reaction.
[Kody] I've told friends, recently, that I didn't want to be
an advocate of plural marriage anymore.
That's a hard one to hear, that's super hard to hear.
I've been nagged for years about the struggles in plural marriage.
Instead of rejecting Christine's complaints about plural marriage,
I've opened myself up to them,
and it's very much unraveled plural marriage for me,
and it's made me a little bit cynical.
I've just stopped trying.
I've just stopped trying to get the family united,
and get us all going the same direction...
'Cause I don't give a [bleep] anymore.
It's scary because I look at Kody as the head of our family,
and to have the leader just be like, um, I don't care anymore.
Like, where does that leave us?
And honestly, I'm at a point now
where I see the family, in many ways, as an obstacle to my own goals.
I'm just looking a Kody like, what the hell planet did you just come from?
We're in this plural marriage. You have agreed to this.
Like, the... Considering your family an obstacle to his own goals,
well, that's about the most selfish thing I've ever heard.
[Kody] My wives say, you know, if you weren't in the picture, we would still get along.
That's such bull. I've seen these women treat each other so [bleep]
for so many years that I can't take it anymore.
The struggles of plural marriage
make me just think that it's a waste of time,
that we have... We have embarked on an experiment that is a failure.
Wow, that sums it up big time with where I feel today.
I... I wanted my wives to love each other.
To me, my biggest anger with wives
- is the way they treat each other. - Mmm-hmm.
You know, if they treat me crappy, I really don't notice it.
I went years with being treated badly...
- Mmm-hmm. - and just really wasn't aware,
but when I see how they're treating each other,
that's a whole different story.
Honestly, there's a wake-up call that I had with moving to Flagstaff,
and it was if I was out of the picture...
it'd be over.
That's rough.
Like, this is not...
- This is not Kody. - Yeah.
This is not him,
and I hope that he can find the strength to carry what he needs to carry,
instead of, like, just walking away,
because that's what it sounds like
when I hear these kinds of things from him.
It's like... [sighs]
I'm done.
We've been struggling for a long time, and I'm a plural wife,
and the only way I'm in this family is because I'm a plural wife.
Uh, yeah, and we've been struggling forever,
so I definitely took it personally.
Yeah, because it seemed like you were
in a pretty fragile place with him anyway.
- Yeah, and then... - Were you?
Yeah, and then to hear that he doesn't want to try anymore,
he doesn't want to do it anymore, and I'm like...
okay, well, here I'm kind of holding on
to the last shred of hope that I have with wanting to stay,
and now you're saying that family doesn't mean much to you anymore,
you don't want to try it anymore.
She told me once, she hated plural marriage.
- This is after she was in Lehi with... - Yeah, yeah.
- With Meri and Janelle, living in the basement. - Janelle, yeah.
Christine's like, I hate plural marriage, and I hate this lifestyle.
And she's living two lives, she's promoting,
talking about how she loves plural marriage and all this stuff,
and how I didn't want the husband,
I wanted the sister wives, I wanted this family and all these things.
At the same time, she's telling me she hates plural marriage.
How does that make you feel?
Man, I, well... The mistake I made,
I can look back on this one and see the mistake,
the mistake I made was not... Not saying,
"I'm so sorry, I love you, and I... I validate what you're saying."
You know, I... I didn't validate her.
Instead, it made me angry. [laughing] It made me angry as hell.
When you really start getting honest,
and you start looking up to the heavens
and going, "Jeez, Father. I mean, you inspired me to do this,
"why is it such a mess now?"
It really has set me on my heels
and had me questioning the lifestyle itself.
It's a challenge,
- it's not like... - Are you questioning your own polygamy right now?
Oh, hell yes.
Yes, I question it all the time.
When you talk to women who are struggling in it,
- the pain in it. - Yeah.
Yeah, I don't want polygamy, that's for sure.
Part of the reason I'm sure that I'm leaving
is because I don't believe in it for me anymore.
I don't, it's not...
God's like, "no, girl, you did it. You can go. You're... Check." You know?
That's how it felt.
Do you still believe in polygamy?
Yes, I do. I'm here.
I mean, there was a point during COVID
- where I'm like, okay, do I still want to do this? - Yeah.
And there was a period of time where Kody was away for about six weeks,
and I, like, thought wow, life is really easy.
[laughing] Life is really easy.
And I had to really kinda do some soul-searching,
and realize that I want to be here still.
- Yeah. - I'm here.
If he doesn't love plural marriage, what does he do, you know?
What does he do? That's...
That's... That's three of us or all of us
that he moves on from?
And we've seen that in our... In our culture.
We have seen that, where a man decides he's done living plural marriage,
and he leaves all of his wives or he leaves all but one,
and he goes and starts a new life, he's tired of it.
I've put in a lot of work. He's put in a lot of work.
I still see the value in it.
- Do you think he still sees the value in it? - I don't know.
I don't know, honestly.
Does he get a chance to give up in the faith? Can he give up?
Anybody can do whatever they want.
If he wants to give up...
he can give up.
If he wants to walk away, he can walk away.
Do you think they're still all in love with you?
I don't know if... If it's about love,
or determination, or commitment, you know.
I know that... That... I... I'm not naive here,
but I... [clears throat]
I know that I've got a couple wives
standing on a bridge with a torch,
just wondering, you know, do I throw this in the water or do we light this thing up?
-Mmm. -You know, 'cause there's... There's no...
There's no...
better awareness than reading the facts
from the light of a burning bridge. [laughs]
You know what I mean?
But then it's too late. You... You can't rescue that.
I mean, 'cause here I am, and I'm looking at this whole experience with Christine,
and I'm going all the way back to 12 years ago.
I hate polygamy, and I just could've validated. You know?
I do not like what we're doing here, I do not like this.
And I could've just validated, instead of becoming so,
ugh, like, righteous indignation.
Yeah, that was some arrogance there. Yeah, some...
Some, like... My first reaction was,
like, I've been loving to you, and I've been this...
You know, I've been this husband, and we've done this,
and we've done all this together,
and we've got these great memories,
and we've got these beautiful children, and you hate polygamy?
What the crap?
You know, like, honestly that was my reaction,
instead of going, "oh, I know, it's so hard."
And I'm looking back now, and I'm going,
- if I could go back... - Yeah.
[clears throat]
would I save it all with just being empathetic instead?
I mean, do you think you would have?
You know, now, we'll never know.
[Sukanya] Coming up...
[Kody] I didn't know that she was going,
I don't want to be married to Kody anymore,
and I'm like, why am I in the dark here?
I didn't realize that if she didn't move to Utah, she was done.
I'm not gonna stay in that.
- It was like right there at that moment. - It was right there.
It was that moment where I was like, no.
- [director] Here we go in five, four... - [Sukanya] Oh, here we go.
All right, deep breaths because we're gonna really
unpack something else that's difficult,
and that was Christine and the moment that it came to light
that you weren't on the same page with her when it comes to Utah.
I want you to take a look at the clip
and then we'll talk about that.
[Kody] Mmm.
I remember saying specifically that I would definitely move to Flagstaff
unless the laws in Utah changed.
The laws have changed.
Well, you're talking about something that I want
that I just refuse to... To even entertain now.
It's an exciting thought just 'cause all my friends are in St. George.
Polygamy got decriminalized, and I wonder why we're still here.
We can move back home. I want to move back.
[Janelle] There's nothing for me in Utah, nothing.
I'm in a place where I feel like, my kids... My kids love it here.
This is the most likely place for any of our kids to move back, our adult kids.
I'm surprised because I thought Kody was more in favor of this.
He's acting like we've never even talked about this and that...
He wasn't in favor the last time we talked.
We're not moving are we?
[sobbing]
[Christine] Meri, I can't be married
to Kody anymore, I don't want to...
[Meri] Just look at the mountain.
[Christine] I don't want to do it anymore.
I'm tired of feeling like I don't matter.
I'm tired of not having his support
when I really need it.
I'm just tired.
[Kody] So when we met last,
I felt like I was cutting you off too harshly.
I was like, "No, that'll never happen.
We're not moving back to Utah."
I was trying to be stoic.
Um, and I feel bad.
I'm... I want to say, I'm sorry.
What is the stupid word he's using, stoic?
[bleep] he was an ass.
I don't believe him that he's sorry.
Why would I want to live
on the same property
with a dysfunctional marriage
where right over there
he's got a full functioning marriage?
Who in their right mind
would ever want to live like that?
[sighs softly]
That's hard to watch.
Hmm, I...
Is it really about Utah?
Or is it really about
the relationship?
Her state of affairs with her sister wives?
What is that about?
I didn't know she said that until I saw it.
I didn't know what was going on.
I didn't know that she was going,
"I don't want to be married to Kody anymore."
I mean, I'd heard rumors from my children
that'd she'd been kind of throwing things around.
Uh, and, and I...
You know, even other wives saying,
"Oh, she's always threatened that she was going to leave."
And I'm like, "Why, why am I in the dark here?"
We're supposed to be taking care of
our kids that are here.
Who like living here.
And, and she throws that out
like it's something simple, like it's something easy,
something petty, and then she gets mad when we reject it.
And walks off with petulance.
I'm watching this...
For her, she's just had her life
completely controlled
by four other people.
I, I... That I get.
I had no idea that, that was what was at stake.
Like, I didn't realize that
if she didn't move to Utah
she was done.
Did you even know that they were struggling at this point, like that?
I knew there was some stuff going on,
but, you know, it's like also, like, it's supposed to be none of my business.
Right.
You know, even though
it affects life completely, and, and I...
She's someone I love, and he's someone I love and...
It's very, very...
Um...
Hard to watch.
Why is it hard to watch?
Because that...
It's one thing to be in your room
all quiet and alone and going, "I don't want to be in this marriage anymore."
It's a wholly different thing to
be on camera and say it
to your sister wife.
And I was just...
Had no idea I was sitting in a chair...
I was sitting in a chair chatting with Kody and Janelle,
you know, just thinking...
You know, Meri is...
You know, helping her.
She'll be okay, we'll figure this out kind of a thing.
So in a way, you feel like you failed your sister wife at this point?
I didn't know what was happening, but yeah.
I didn't know
things were as serious as they were.
The other part that struck me was
Christine saying, you know,
"Over here you have a fully functioning marriage.
And why would I ever want to live on a piece of property
- where mine isn't fully functioning." - Yeah.
I feel like at that point she made a choice
that she was never gonna have a functioning marriage.
Wow.
And look, I get that sometimes you just work, and work, and work,
and you get to the place where it just doesn't work.
And that's okay.
- Mmm. - But, you know, I mean...
So I think at this point she must have already maybe decided
that she was gonna move?
- Yeah. - I don't know.
'Cause I think that's a choice that you make by labelling it
as a not functioning never gonna be functioning relationship
that says a lot.
Were you not in tune
to what she was feeling?
- How she needs you-- - Well, yes, I feel...
Oh, man.
Suki, she's been complaining from the time we moved
to Las Vegas.
That's nine years, ten years.
She's been complaining about everything in her life.
Like, remember
years ago, she shrugged.
She did not like her life anymore.
This is a singular moment
that has been building up for years.
And you've been trying to help her--
Oh, I've been trying to make her happy
all the time, it's this constant burden.
There's something missing, there's some problem.
Something's going on and it...
Frankly, it just could be plural marriage.
I don't know.
When she and I were out on the property...
At that moment I thought that she was just mad
or upset.
I thought I knew who she was,
and how she was,
and how,
you know, committed she was to the family and stuff like that.
Because of, you know, so many years together.
- Mmm-hmm. - You know,
so I went to her and I'm like, "Come on, you're stronger than this."
"You have to do the work. If there's a hiccup with him,
if there's a hiccup with a sister wife,
if there's a... You know, any issues anywhere you have to do the work."
And it's really, really, really hard to look
inward at yourself.
It's really hard to put a mirror up in front of yourself
and be like, "Okay, these are my issues. I need to fix them."
You can't just always put blame elsewhere.
Here's this woman
- who is also in a relationship with Kody-- - Yeah.
that could possibly mirror your future if you choose to stay.
Did you have that kind of moment where, "Wow,
this is not what I want."
Yeah, no, as soon as she said, "You know, it's really hard for us.
You know hard it's been. How separate it's been."
I was like, "Yeah."
And that's not what I'm going to have.
I'm not going to stay in that.
- It was like right there, at that moment. - It was right there.
It was at that moment where I was like,
"No, that's actually not...
I can't do that. That can't be my future."
There's no hope in a future like that.
There's no hope. I can't even look at those mountains
where I first heard the angels sing.
I can't even... No.
- Mmm-hmm. - Yeah, that was almost kind of like a...
-Reverse, you know, I think that she meant to be -Yeah.
Like all embracing and...
God bless her, I know she tried to be.
And I completely honor that
that's not the way that...
Of course, that's absolute polar opposite what she meant and...
Yeah, I'm sure, and I never want her to feel bad
for trying to include me at all.
- No. - 'Cause I know that wasn't her intention.
Um, but for me it was kind of like
a little bit of a wake-up call.
I'm like, "Oh, gosh. No."
[Sukanya] Coming up...
I didn't know her.
She didn't know me.
He didn't hear you.
He heard, but he had no idea what to do.
'Cause I'd changed so much.
- I'm gonna ask you now, Suki. - Yeah.
I don't want to talk about Christine anymore.
[Sukanya] With the separation of Kody and Christine,
let's take a look back at the ups and downs
of their 27 year relationship.
- You ready for your surprise? - Yes, you're killing me here.
Are you serious?
- We're gonna go on the-- Yes. - It's the helicopter.
["Your Firefly" playing]
♪ You're my shade ♪
♪ When the moon comes ♪
[Kody] When I first met Christine
I felt this great bolt of energy.
I just really, really liked her.
So at one point I told Kody, "Out of all the guys that I know
you're the one that I'd want to marry."
[Kody] So I called her dad, the head of our church, in order to
court Christine,
and we were married two months later.
- [Christine] Perfect date. - [Kody] Perfect date.
♪ Ooh ooh ♪
♪ Ooh ooh ooh ♪
♪ Ooh ooh ♪
[Christine] Some of my best memories
with Kody have been driving in the car
listening to super loud music
singing along and just
having a blast in the car together.
Those are my favorite memories.
I'm looking for love.
- That's right, you are looking for love. - [chuckles]
[Kody] I'm looking for solid foundation and structure.
- Honor the entire family and I will love you. - That's--
[Christine] Almost every day is hard.
It's just hard to see a silver lining every day.
[Kody] When you don't have trust, you don't have intimacy.
- Uh-uh. - And what became apparent to Christine was
the lack of intimacy.
I'm miserable.
I'm jealous as can be.
I didn't know that I would be a jealous person.
And I am so jealous.
Why are you not looking at me?
I don't know, I don't know, I just... Whatever.
- Let's just do it your way. - Okay, I'll make the orders and everybody else do it.
Well, that's kind of how we have to do it.
Then you've got somebody to blame.
You really are calling, Ken?
Listen, I don't need to talk to you about that.
He owes me an apology.
For what?
For saying, "Yeah, you're welcome back to the church
but you have to leave three of your wives behind."
I swear, this is all driven by her pride,
and now I'm pissed.
I don't want to talk to him.
I don't trust a word, there.
'Cause I don't trust a word coming out of his mouth.
This is not a safe conversation anymore.
I'm sorry, it's just not.
And I'm not gonna talk to you.
Feels like a bit of a crossroads
and I don't know what to do.
[sobbing]
For me the real reality is, is
I didn't know her.
She didn't know me.
When we got married we just didn't know each other.
And, and we have never seen each other
in tough situations.
So when we got married
frankly it was a bad match.
But within a year
I was like, "Man, this is magical."
And she had lifted the burden that
we were struggling with so much.
In a relationship between Janelle and Meri
that I was like really, just so I was just in love with her
for 10, 12 years.
It was a breath of fresh air?
Yeah, a breath of fresh air.
Yeah, and, and she was, [giggles]
You know, kind of happy, go-lucky
and she sort of, um...
Um...
Sort of brought a brightness to the experience.
I just had to be always positive, and upbeat,
and whatever you need, and absolutely, and...
Yeah, that's... And I...
It's so funny and it's like I didn't mind.
It's what was what I did and it was completely fine until it wasn't.
All of a sudden I just realized
I couldn't anymore.
My dad talked to me, it was actually my dad.
My dad's a very...
Sweetest most loving guy, and he's like,
"At what point are you gonna start saying, no?"
And he goes, "You're always saying, yes, to everything.
When are you gonna start saying, no?"
And I'm like, "Oh, gosh."
So the next day you woke up
and you said, " You know what? I'm gonna change this dynamic."
- Yeah. Yep. Yeah. - And then, "I'm gonna start standing up for myself."
And the moment you started standing up for yourself
Kody didn't like that change in personality.
No.
He didn't hear you.
I think that
- [Sukanya] He didn't hear-- - he heard, but he had no idea what to do.
'Cause I had changed so much in a blink.
Everything changed.
And Kody withdrew, and then I withdrew, and we just withdrew.
I know that your time in therapy is a very private time.
What did that unearth?
Like what did that peel back for you guys?
- Awful. Yes. - [Sukanya] Early stuff that just never healed?
Stuff where I was like, "Oh, my gosh.
You hold grudges way longer than I do."
Way longer.
- Mmm-hmm. - Yeah, no, stuff that shocked me completely.
We get to a point where
it's a great experience and it's a struggle,
and it's a great experience and it's a struggle.
And...
Um, and then we end up in Las Vegas
after she has told me she hates plural marriage
while she's at the same time,
pretty much,
you know, telling the whole world how awesome it is.
She had mentioned to me, grudges.
- That you could never let go of some grudges. - I don't carry grudges.
No, if somebody says
I hold a grudge, they're full of it. They don't know who I am.
They don't know me.
She also shared with me
that the moment that she started saying, no,
and not being the happy Christine that you liked
that you fell in love with,
the woman that lifted your burden,
that, that became a heavy lift for you.
Hmm...
Is it fair to say that?
- We can... We can-- - [Sukanya] Can you validate what she said?
We can sit and, um,
say that, um,
the he said, she says that's 'till the cows come home.
- She told you-- She-- - She'd told you things that I fundamentally disagree with.
- Okay. - And all I'm doing now is defending myself.
-Okay. Yeah -I'm gonna ask you now, Suki.
I don't want to talk about Christine anymore.
[Sukanya] Coming up...
Are we ever gonna have
an intimate marriage again?
And he just said, "Probably not."
[Sukanya] And later...
It's so weird. So now I have a new text thread.
I feel like somebody's missing.
Yeah.
So you can have an intimate relationship with somebody else,
but I get nothing.
[indistinct chatter]
[man] Who you got?
[indistinct chatter]
Okay.
[Kody] Sorry, I'm a little angry, I'm not anger with you.
I get it, I get it.
[director] Cameras are still rolling, stand by.
[indistinct chatter]
Let's talk about intimacy in a relationship.
-Okay. -[Sukanya] It's a... It's a very
- strong foundation. - [Christine] Yeah.
It's a foundation that most couples need...
- Mmm-hmm. Yeah. - [Sukanya] ...want, desire.
This next clip...
It's a really raw look
at your relationship
and the lack of intimacy.
That was being had between the two of you.
Okay.
So we put on the door
and he goes, "I'm not really interested in that anymore."
[sighs] "I'm not interested in having an intimate marriage anymore.
"I don't like your behavior.
I don't like how you act.
We'll see how, what you do.
We'll see if you can be a good sister wife," and all this and I'm like,
"Okay, first and foremost, I didn't know I was being a bad sister wife."
I had no idea, I don't know what you're talking about.
I didn't know I was being bad.
What, so he gets to have an intimate with other wives, but not with me?
And I'm what gonna have nothing for the rest of my life?
And what? It's over?
So I don't know what this really means.
[clears throat] I don't know if this is a phase
or if this is just an awakening.
I don't know what to tell my kids.
[sobbing]
[crying]
What did I do so wrong?
I've always wanted
romantic marriage and...
That's been so hard for so long.
I feel like I don't have a choice, but to move his stuff out.
'Cause I can't.
It's too heartbreaking
to be around his stuff and it's too heartbreaking
to be around him and watch him with
Robyn, and Janelle, and the kids and...
I mean honestly there has been rumors in the family
that she has been saying she's gonna leave.
Right now, right this moment, I just don't know what to think...
or say.
Okay, I've just come out to Christine's house.
Kody's nightstand, Kody's clothes from the dresser,
Kody's bathroom stuff.
I have been moved out of my house.
I don't know why. Uh...
But I'm...
ambivalent.
I...
almost don't care.
And the first thought I have is this is my house. This is my stuff.
We never discussed this.
Second thought I have is...
relief.
Some kind of relief from the burden and the woe
of a loveless marriage.
The hardest time of my life.
Hardest decision
was to ask him to not be around anymore.
It was so hard.
[sighs]
I mean, yeah, what question do you want first?
Well, tell me where you wanna start?
I don't know.
Well, the conversation about not being intimate, right?
- Oh, gosh. - [Sukanya] That seemed like that was
the hardest thing for you to kind of understand.
Good, 'cause we put that door, we put a door downstairs.
We shut the door and I said, are we ever really going to need privacy?
Are we ever going to have an intimate marriage again?
And he just said, "Probably not."
I've...
actually never seen her side of this.
My perspective of that experience was she came to me
and she said, hey, we did this work on the house.
Wasn't that for our intimacy?
And I went, um, no.
It was just stuff we needed to do
and she goes well, are we going to be intimate, again.
And I said...
I never said no, that we weren't gonna be intimate again.
I was at a point where I wanted her...
to address...
the rumors that I'd been hearing from the kids...
that she was threatening to leave.
That discussion that she just had to her video journal
never happened with me.
I never said we weren't going to be intimate anymore.
But I didn't wanna be intimate because I had somebody
who was basically stabbing me in the back, I felt like.
But why wouldn't you ever question that?
Like, this is what I'm hearing.
This isn't sitting well with me.
Help me understand why you would never reach out to her
and tell her why you're so hurt by that.
FOMO, fear of missing out.
Something, like, if she really, if we really have this conversation
how frank are we gonna get.
I don't want her to leave.
Did she ever hear you say I don't want you to leave?
No.
I found out he wasn't attracted to me when we got married.
And I just thought, oh, gosh, well, that's terrible.
But then he said, you know, he loved me now and everything,
so I thought it was fine, and I thought we were fine.
And then it just became more and more apparent, certainly the last few years,
he just wasn't interested.
He just wasn't.
And we basically just had a non-intimate marriage, completely.
I mean, like, we didn't even touch, we didn't even hold hands.
Nothing, not even a hug, nothing.
And after he just laid it out point blank that I'm not interested
in, like, an intimate, romantic marriage with you anymore,
and then he goes, I have friends that have had relationships like this.
They have slept separate on the couch for years.
And I'm, like, so you can have an intimate relationship with somebody else,
but I get nothing.
And you think it's fine that we have a marriage like this.
It's insulting.
And why would he expect me to stay in a marriage like that?
It feels, like, at some point,
you never thought she would really leave.
- [Sukanya] And that's why-- - No, I wanted her to talk to me about it
and, uh, and go do some counselling.
That what I really thought would happen.
So, when I found my boxes in the garage...
You said relief.
Well, I was, I was, I was shocked,
but there was, uh, like a balloon, like lifting, like...
[Kody exhales]
I mean there's pressure
in a bad relationship...
that's still intimate.
It's a really tough place to get to where intimacy is a duty.
And... and I'm sitting there well aware of it.
And I'm sitting there without the tools...
to say
what's, what's going wrong here?
And I'm like I know where she's been
for 10 years, 12 years, 13 years.
She sat here and said I hate polygamy.
And she's told other wives that she was going to leave me
- or that she wanted to. - Well--
And then to sit and do the dance in Las Vegas trying
so hard to work it out with her,
doing the counselling, having the conversations,
and never really feeling like she was ever being accountable.
I'm done pretending.
I've been showing the kids that everything is fine.
I've been showing everybody that everything is fine.
And I can't pretend anymore.
If when he comes into my room,
he really doesn't wanna be there,
I don't want him there.
And I tell you it felt really good when he wasn't there anymore.
My biggest problem...
for all of this experience is that I'm angry.
Well, fast forward to this moment and the grief...
that settled in, the heartbreak
and the awareness.
[exclaims]
It's not that simple.
It's... I can't look at those moments
and just go, oh, oh, oh, I regret
because there's so much pain in the 10 years before.
As we're wrapping this up, like, I have to ask you,
what do you wish for her?
I hope she gets married.
I hope she has a wonderful relationship.
I hope she's happy.
- Future. - Yeah.
What does it look like for you?
Will there be dating? Will there be marriage?
I'm dating me. I'm getting to know me better.
And I'm like why don't I just figure out this awesome life
and be present in it and just love it.
- I feel light. - Yeah.
And I didn't know life could be like this.
You know, we're still the one big happy family.
But she gets to find somebody that she really loves or, you know, whatever.
Yeah.
And we, we just make it bigger.
It's so weird.
- So, now I have a new text thread... - [Sukanya laughs]
- that's just Kody, Robyn and Meri. - [Sukanya] Meri.
And we have now had to start having conversations
about the property and all these things
- with just the four of us. - Right.
And it feels like, I feel like somebody is missing.
- Yeah. - I don't know if it's really sunk in, yet.
Does it hurt?
I feel, like, maybe, it was a good move
- 'cause she is happier. - [Sukanya] Yeah.
She is a lot happier.
And so, I'm like how can I be sorry for something that she is so happy about.
Now, I just look forward to healing process of
managing it and coming to a place where we're, we're friends again.
And it's just, you know, you know, we had this experience
and that's over.
And...
have a good life
and uh...
be well, be happy.
You know, like, but I'm still in a grieving process now.
If you could look at that person,
- you, today, look at that person-- - [Christine] Mmm-hmm.
what would you say to her?
Can I look back in the past and be like I wish Kody would have done this,
I wish I would have done this, I wish I would...
Well, I'm not that person anymore,
and neither is he.
Nor do I want to be.
So it's kind of, when I look back in the past...
I mean what would have I told her.
I don't know.
Like, I'm here now.
I thank you for your honesty today.
- You're welcome. - I appreciate it.
You're welcome.