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[narrator] Previously
on Sister Wives...
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Okay, so guys, Hunter is
coming home tomorrow.
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I'm about ready to
psychologically lose it
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if we don't start
getting together soon.
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You know, CDC is telling you not
to get into groups bigger than, like,
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10 or eight something?
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I don't know what
the answer is here.
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The conversations with the five of
us, I go home with a stomach ache.
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This pandemic has sort of
underscored this breakdown
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in how we communicate
with each other as adults.
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More than anything with Kody is, I
don't feel like I'm very important to him.
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Some of the difficulties we have in
plural marriage may be unreconcilable.
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I just don't know what
this means for our future.
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Meri, I have a very difficult time,
like, visualizing us in the future.
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Dude, you've got four wives
and 18 kids.
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You're just gonna pick and
choose who you're gonna keep?
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Ever since COVID-19 hit,
we lost our film crew
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because they can't afford
to be exposed.
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It's all backwards
'cause I'm filming backwards.
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So, first there... Mm-hmm.
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We are now using
our little phones.
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And our, uh, tripods.
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And we are trying to
record ourselves.
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We don't know what we're doin'.
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Well, the pandemic's been
goin' on for about seven weeks.
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[Kody] The numbers are climbing.
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I'm the only one that's
going from home to home.
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So today, I'm meeting with
my wives.
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Outta Coyote Pass.
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Today, we're getting together
and having a socially distant picnic.
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[Kody] Hopefully, this works.
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Um, Hunter's home now and
he's gonna be coming with Janelle.
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[Janelle] Hunter has come home from
Air Force Academy. He's graduated.
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Gathering as a family and being
around the family is a big deal to Hunter.
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And it's really sad because
right now, we don't know
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how that's gonna go.
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- [Kody] Hi!
- [Janelle] Hi!
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Hi, Hunter!
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[Janelle] We sort of figured we
would set up our lawn chairs...
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and visit. But stay socially
distanced.
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- Well, I'm hungry.
- Can I, uh...
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I'm not ready to, like,
melt down.
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I brought myself a sandwich.
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I made salmon patties.
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- That sounds fantastic.
- ...you have to get 'em off the ground.
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- You want one?
- Yeah, I'll try it.
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- It's thousands of dollars.
- Six feet!
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- Six feet.
- I'm really not worried about it.
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- I know.
- I tested negative, so...
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[Meri] I absolutely think that we need
to keep our distance from each other.
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I'm kinda following
the guidance of Kody.
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I'm good to just stay home.
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And I'm good to just sit out
six feet apart on the property.
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I know that Kody wants
everybody to stay apart.
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Hunter's gonna come over anyway.
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Okay, so if you're not
worried about it,
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who's not worried about it?
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I wouldn't go home if, like, don't
come within six-feet of me mom,
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like, we're all in the same house,
'cause at that point it doesn't matter.
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So, my doctor told me...
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"Do you want to have
a child or not?"
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The only pure prevention
from having a child
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is not having sex.
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So, if you don't want to get
the disease, you cannot interact
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with other people.
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I think what he's saying is
a absolutely perfect analogy.
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Wearing a mask, wearing gloves,
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- you know, she used...
- That won't prevent pregnancy, wearing a mask.
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- [Kody] Well, I will say...
- [speaking]
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- [indistinct chatter]
- [Kody] It's an analogy.
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If you want to cheat a little bit,
you need to take the precautions.
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It's a perfect analogy.
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I don't have a problem at all
with everybody getting together.
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- The family getting together at all.
- It's the psychology.
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Well, I don't mind. I don't mind at
all. And I would love it. I would love it.
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But I think that we do need to
look out. You don't want to at all?
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It's not that I want to.
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I'm still struggling with the fact that
we're not taking advantage of this time.
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I'm not saying I don't
want to get together.
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If lives are at stake here, that's gotta
be the most important thing, right?
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[Kody] But if Hunter, you wanted to
see everybody after your two weeks,
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you going from house to house
now increases that risk by double
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what the risk was
with just me going.
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To me, it's like
if we're all quarantined
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we assume that nobody
has the disease.
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So I don't get why
that increases the risk.
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If everybody's home,
there's no exposure.
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Janelle's got Garrison working,
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and involved in a social life.
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And Gabriel is also
involved in a social life.
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I believe he's got a girlfriend.
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I do not think the family
should get together.
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You're saying that we're gonna have
to stay this way the whole summer?
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I'm not saying that. You're
jumping to conclusions.
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Some of the attitudes I'm getting
from the family don't give me peace
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about their behavior
when I'm not around.
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I'm sitting here questioning whether I
should even be going from house to house.
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[Janelle] Then what
the hell are you saying?
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That there's no way that
we could ever be safe?
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With more than one
person moving around?
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Well, he's saying that we will
live the way that we're living now
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for indefinitely until
this thing is over.
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Me going from house
to house is the...
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one safe thing.
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I've had pneumonia. I'm a high
risk because I've had pneumonia.
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I actually believe that there
are other members of our family
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that are high risks too.
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I don't know if it's
my place to say it.
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If you do get it, and if you
do get a heavy case of the,
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uh, strong case of it...
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It will change your life
forever.
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- Okay, I'm just trying to...
- That's so Will.
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That's so Will.
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He's turned into his
father here,
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he was always like...
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Yeah. I just was like wow!
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Look, I get all the facts, Kody.
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But I want you to hear
this one thing.
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[Janelle] No, you've been
telling me over and over again.
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This sickness, if you get
the heavy duty one,
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it's like a concussion.
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It will change who you are.
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It's not gonna change
who you are.
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Like, it could... can you imagine
me not being able to work out,
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not being able to exercise?
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[overlapping chatter]
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...you're making it sound
like, Dad, I'm gonna be
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a schizophrenic
for the rest of my life.
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I don't know what
the virus is about.
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I don't know how deadly
it is going to be.
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So you're talking about
no summer, no holidays,
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no Christmas, nothing together?
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You're jumping to the end,
and we don't know.
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Why don't we just wait two weeks
and then have the discussion again?
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"Well, we'll get together
when it's safe."
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We'll be lucky if we have a
family at the end of that time.
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I... just feel this
is my whole freaking life.
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The BS of plural marriage is "you
love her more, so you're over there."
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[Kody] I love everybody, and
so I'm not spreading the disease.
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You're making choices that
make it so that I'm not coming over.
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I think polygamy is making COVID harder
just because Kody has to stay separate.
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Like, we have to have
separate family groups right now,
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which is something that
none of us ever wanted.
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I think that whatever
issues might be happening
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between him and any
of his wives,
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um,
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my guess is that...
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COVID is just expounding
on those issues.
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I absolutely cannot do this.
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I might as well pack up and go to
Maddy in North Carolina for the summer.
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[Robyn] We could lose a family member,
is that gonna be worth a couple of parties
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that we have?
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Okay, so we reconvene
again in a couple of weeks?
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Yeah.
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Ideally, Hunter would like
to see everybody all together.
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He feels like the differences between
where he and Kody are on precautions
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about COVID are so far
apart that
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I think he feels this push
to see his siblings
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before he goes back
on to his next duty station
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and probably doesn't come
home again for a long time.
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Those two. "Oh, Dad. You
know. You're so stupid, Dad.
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I'd rather be around
the kids than you anyway."
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This is how it feels to me.
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[Kody] I'm just gonna
do what I'm gonna do.
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And you guys all choose.
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And if you don't choose
my standards,
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then I won't be around you.
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I think there's gonna be tolls
higher than any risk of virus.
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[Janelle] We've spent
our whole family life
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trying to build
a one family culture.
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And this could tear that apart.
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[Christine] So, all of us adults just
went out onto the property... the property.
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About COVID and what
we're gonna do.
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And basically, what we're
gonna do is the same
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as what we're doing and
Janelle is really struggling with it,
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Meri is struggling with it,
my girls are struggling with it.
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More than anything, I just
don't like going to the property.
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I just really want
to move back to Utah.
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I think that we need the support
of being around a plural community
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now more than ever.
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Um, with our family
being separated like it is,
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with Kody going super dark
about polygamy in general,
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I think us living in Utah
right now,
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just makes a lot more sense.
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So yeah, I mean, I think right now is a
perfect time to talk about moving back to Utah.
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All right,
we are driving to graduation.
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Christine's taking the kids
to Utah,
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because she wants to
celebrate the graduation.
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I don't understand why
she feels like this is okay.
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A little bit of distance
for Kody and I is okay.
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Things are just hard
at home when he's there.
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Okay, two cups flour.
Baking powder.
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So, while Mom is here,
we have decided we're gonna
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kind of try out and perfect
some recipes
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that we've been playing around
with for the bed and breakfast.
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- Say hi, Mom.
- Hi.
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Mom's been here with me
for a couple of weeks,
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while Mariah and Audrey
are at the bed and breakfast.
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Kind of running that for us.
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[Meri] You should probably film
me as I walk around doing stuff, Mom.
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Just...[chuckling]
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I am the star, Mom.
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You know, COVID has basically
changed everything in our lives.
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Including how we document
everything in our lives.
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We're not necessarily the best
camera people in the world, so...
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it's kind of interesting.
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They look kind of amazing
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So, we're going to let
these biscuits cool
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but in the meantime,
we're just going to call
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Mariah and Audrey and just
kind of check up with them
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and see how things are going.
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[call ringing]
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Hi!
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- Hi, there. How's it going?
- Hi.
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I'm Face Timing me,
holding an Iphone.
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[chuckling] I guess that's what
we're supposed to be doing, huh.
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Let's just be real.
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I am technologically illiterate.
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That's the wrong angle
and I have to hold it this way.
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[exhales] Freaking "A," man.
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[exhales] This is stressing
me out.
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I don't know half of the time
what I'm doing with my phone.
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Freaking "A," man.
I didn't push "start" again.
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- My gosh.
- Or does it stop by itself?
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It shouldn't stop by itself.
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00:11:49,575 --> 00:11:52,010
You push it one time.
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"Stop." "Start." Wait,
which one is it? [chuckles]
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How's everything going
at the bed and breakfast?
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It's pretty good.
It's pretty chill.
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I mean, you could
easily just stay there.
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-[chuckling] -Until you
moved in. I'm just saying.
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I did not want to
stay there forever.
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I mean, I do love it, It's
really exciting to be in a place
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00:12:14,333 --> 00:12:16,201
that is so in my family.
235
00:12:16,302 --> 00:12:18,002
- Yeah.
- Um, but she wants us
236
00:12:18,104 --> 00:12:19,404
to stay here forever.
237
00:12:19,505 --> 00:12:21,539
Well, I did just apply
for a job the other day,
238
00:12:21,640 --> 00:12:23,041
- so I can't stay for...
- [Meri] Oh, yeah?
239
00:12:23,142 --> 00:12:25,443
We don't know for sure
how long they're going
240
00:12:25,544 --> 00:12:28,279
to be there but they will
be going up to Salt Lake,
241
00:12:28,380 --> 00:12:33,251
Mariah will be finishing up her
degree in social work and social justice,
242
00:12:33,352 --> 00:12:36,321
and then she plans on
getting a job in that field.
243
00:12:36,422 --> 00:12:38,790
That just makes me happy
that you're enjoying it.
244
00:12:38,891 --> 00:12:40,425
- Yeah.
- It's like being stuck in paradise
245
00:12:40,526 --> 00:12:41,926
it's fine, I'm enjoying it.
246
00:12:42,027 --> 00:12:44,429
Right before everything started,
247
00:12:44,530 --> 00:12:46,798
we went and looked
at some wedding venues.
248
00:12:46,899 --> 00:12:49,000
But we kind of haven't really
been able to make a decision.
249
00:12:49,101 --> 00:12:51,469
We're not sure whatever--
What's going on,
250
00:12:51,570 --> 00:12:53,638
like, there's a pandemic,
like, everyone's moving
251
00:12:53,739 --> 00:12:55,774
their weddings till next year,
so we're just
252
00:12:55,875 --> 00:12:58,476
still floating around
trying to figure it out.
253
00:12:59,478 --> 00:13:01,446
- All right, I love you.
- Love you.
254
00:13:01,547 --> 00:13:02,547
- Love you, guys.
- Bye.
255
00:13:02,648 --> 00:13:03,715
[Mariah] Bye.
256
00:13:03,816 --> 00:13:06,484
It's always good to check in
with Mariah and Audrey
257
00:13:06,585 --> 00:13:09,454
and I'm glad
that they're enjoying it.
258
00:13:15,861 --> 00:13:19,297
So I've talked to Christine
and Robyn individually
259
00:13:19,398 --> 00:13:22,534
about my thoughts that we
need to communicate better
260
00:13:22,635 --> 00:13:24,235
What we've been doing,
hasn't been working
261
00:13:24,336 --> 00:13:26,538
so I'd like to try
something different.
262
00:13:26,639 --> 00:13:29,507
And I guess the communication
is the biggest piece of it.
263
00:13:29,608 --> 00:13:31,342
- So...
- I think so too.
264
00:13:31,443 --> 00:13:34,412
I mean, you're talking about
changing the way we communicate.
265
00:13:34,513 --> 00:13:37,882
I would love
to change it dramatically.
266
00:13:37,983 --> 00:13:41,085
So today, I'm going to go
talk to Meri about
267
00:13:41,187 --> 00:13:43,188
what I've been thinking
and then the next step
268
00:13:43,289 --> 00:13:44,789
will be to get us all together.
269
00:13:46,759 --> 00:13:49,093
So, I'm actually going around,
talking to everybody
270
00:13:49,195 --> 00:13:51,296
just because I think
271
00:13:51,397 --> 00:13:54,799
we need to figure out
ground rules for conversation.
272
00:13:54,900 --> 00:13:59,437
Because we don't
do conversations very well.
273
00:13:59,538 --> 00:14:00,905
No, we don't.
274
00:14:01,006 --> 00:14:03,208
What is, um...
275
00:14:04,910 --> 00:14:06,678
driving this
conversation for you?
276
00:14:06,779 --> 00:14:09,914
I don't think we make progress
when we have conversations.
277
00:14:10,015 --> 00:14:11,649
And I think that's why
it takes us so long,
278
00:14:11,750 --> 00:14:13,418
because we don't
ever really make progress,
279
00:14:13,519 --> 00:14:16,154
we just keep talking,
talking, talking, talking, talking.
280
00:14:16,255 --> 00:14:19,257
Meri always gives these
answers that are sort of like,
281
00:14:19,892 --> 00:14:21,659
non-committal.
282
00:14:21,760 --> 00:14:24,195
So I'm just trying to
take her temperature
283
00:14:24,296 --> 00:14:26,297
and make sure she's
understanding what I'm asking her.
284
00:14:27,333 --> 00:14:29,100
I mean, do you see
kind of, my idea?
285
00:14:29,201 --> 00:14:30,435
Do you think it has value?
286
00:14:30,536 --> 00:14:32,737
Yeah, I think that it does.
287
00:14:34,139 --> 00:14:36,941
I think our, um...
288
00:14:37,042 --> 00:14:40,278
tendency is, if it gets hard,
we just don't talk about it
289
00:14:40,379 --> 00:14:41,980
- or we just never talk about it.
- No, right.
290
00:14:42,081 --> 00:14:44,148
And it's, everybody else
will talk about it,
291
00:14:44,250 --> 00:14:46,951
about me,
or we'll all talk about it,
292
00:14:47,052 --> 00:14:48,953
- about you, or whatever the case is...
- No, right.
293
00:14:49,054 --> 00:14:51,623
But people don't talk
294
00:14:51,724 --> 00:14:54,292
to who needs to be talked to.
295
00:14:54,393 --> 00:14:57,795
If there was more
conversations happening,
296
00:14:57,897 --> 00:15:03,134
With the people involved
rather than behind backs,
297
00:15:03,235 --> 00:15:06,337
I think relationships
could heal.
298
00:15:06,438 --> 00:15:08,673
So, that's why I think
I fundamentally want to work,
299
00:15:08,774 --> 00:15:11,509
I want to propose
that we work on.
300
00:15:11,610 --> 00:15:12,977
It's not me saying
that we have to work on it.
301
00:15:13,078 --> 00:15:15,213
I want to propose
that we work on this.
302
00:15:15,314 --> 00:15:18,116
Mmm-hmm. I'm cool with that.
303
00:15:18,217 --> 00:15:21,286
So, what I'm proposing is
that we all five get together
304
00:15:21,387 --> 00:15:26,291
and we talk about rules
for when we sit down
305
00:15:26,392 --> 00:15:28,226
and actually try
to talk about something.
306
00:15:29,194 --> 00:15:30,862
All right, well,
it'll be [sighs]
307
00:15:30,963 --> 00:15:33,798
an interesting conversation.
308
00:15:33,899 --> 00:15:37,368
I appreciate Janelle's interest
in starting this conversation
309
00:15:37,469 --> 00:15:39,637
It's kind of hard for me
to speak to this at this point
310
00:15:39,738 --> 00:15:44,909
because I am not in really
311
00:15:45,010 --> 00:15:47,512
a husband-wife
relationship with Kody.
312
00:15:47,613 --> 00:15:49,781
You know,
we don't talk about things.
313
00:15:49,882 --> 00:15:51,783
It's just where we are.
314
00:15:55,087 --> 00:15:57,889
The whole family is just,
you know, been through a lot.
315
00:15:58,657 --> 00:16:00,925
I just feel very cautious.
316
00:16:07,166 --> 00:16:11,035
All right,
we are driving to graduation.
317
00:16:11,136 --> 00:16:13,972
Christine's already there
with her kids for Gwendlyn.
318
00:16:14,073 --> 00:16:17,809
So, today is Aurora and
Gwendlyn's high school graduation.
319
00:16:18,344 --> 00:16:20,044
Are you nervous?
320
00:16:20,145 --> 00:16:22,380
I mean, well,
it's my graduation,
321
00:16:22,481 --> 00:16:24,682
- so, there's definitely butterflies.
- [child chattering]
322
00:16:24,783 --> 00:16:28,252
Christine is driving Gwendlyn
and I'll be driving Aurora.
323
00:16:28,354 --> 00:16:31,022
We're super excited.
Super excited.
324
00:16:31,123 --> 00:16:33,224
They have the most
awesome graduation.
325
00:16:33,325 --> 00:16:36,227
It's a parade in our cars.
326
00:16:39,865 --> 00:16:42,133
[Robyn] It's really important
to me to make sure
327
00:16:42,201 --> 00:16:46,938
that we make this graduation
just kind of big as it can possibly be.
328
00:16:47,039 --> 00:16:48,573
Because it's not
the normal thing.
329
00:16:52,544 --> 00:16:54,012
[Christine] She loved
her graduation.
330
00:16:54,113 --> 00:16:55,880
As soon as
we turned on to the road
331
00:16:55,981 --> 00:16:59,650
where it all went down,
she just had a great time.
332
00:17:00,319 --> 00:17:01,319
[Kody] Are next.
333
00:17:01,420 --> 00:17:02,653
- Congratulations!
- [giggles]
334
00:17:02,755 --> 00:17:05,056
[Kody] Aurora
has an ear to ear grin.
335
00:17:05,157 --> 00:17:07,425
But this might be
the first and only class
336
00:17:07,526 --> 00:17:09,861
that ever
graduated in their cars.
337
00:17:09,962 --> 00:17:10,928
It's cool.
338
00:17:12,231 --> 00:17:14,866
Well, it's the end
of graduation day.
339
00:17:14,933 --> 00:17:16,801
[Christen] I asked Gwendlyn what
she wanted to do for graduation.
340
00:17:16,902 --> 00:17:19,303
She says she just
wanted to leave town.
341
00:17:19,405 --> 00:17:22,340
So, we're just going to go
and have a good time.
342
00:17:22,441 --> 00:17:24,275
We'll be super,
super careful though.
343
00:17:24,376 --> 00:17:26,644
- Graduations' over. Cool.
- [Aurora] Whoo!
344
00:17:26,745 --> 00:17:28,079
- We made it!
- [Gwendlyn] We made it.
345
00:17:28,180 --> 00:17:30,048
[Kody] Christine's taking
the kids to Utah
346
00:17:30,149 --> 00:17:32,016
because she wants
to celebrate the graduation
347
00:17:32,117 --> 00:17:33,584
with people I told not to come
348
00:17:33,685 --> 00:17:34,986
because I didn't
want to be spreading,
349
00:17:35,087 --> 00:17:36,554
you know, the risk of COVID.
350
00:17:36,655 --> 00:17:39,357
And it's a frustration to me
that I feel a little bit undermined,
351
00:17:39,458 --> 00:17:42,393
because Christine
is doing it anyway.
352
00:17:45,130 --> 00:17:47,465
[Robyn] That means that Kody won't
be able to see her for a couple of weeks.
353
00:17:47,566 --> 00:17:49,434
It was a shock to me,
'cause I was like,
354
00:17:49,535 --> 00:17:52,370
"Wait, we're not... we're not
supposed to be travelling."
355
00:17:55,074 --> 00:17:56,507
She's gonna go do it.
356
00:17:58,310 --> 00:18:00,678
I don't understand why she feels
357
00:18:00,779 --> 00:18:05,516
like this is okay to basically
separate our family.
358
00:18:05,617 --> 00:18:07,018
[stutters] Keep our
family separated.
359
00:18:10,389 --> 00:18:12,557
[Christen] So things
with Kody and I are hard.
360
00:18:12,658 --> 00:18:14,459
It's been really
hard between us.
361
00:18:15,260 --> 00:18:18,696
Um, in Flagstaff and here.
362
00:18:18,797 --> 00:18:21,232
And it's been hard for years.
Okay, that's not even true.
363
00:18:21,333 --> 00:18:23,034
It's been hard
for Kody and I for years.
364
00:18:23,135 --> 00:18:24,836
[indistinct chatter]
365
00:18:24,937 --> 00:18:26,971
[Christine] A little bit of
distance for Kody and I is okay.
366
00:18:28,507 --> 00:18:32,176
Just seeing him for a couple
of hours a week isn't enough.
367
00:18:34,079 --> 00:18:35,980
Things are just hard
at home when he's there.
368
00:18:37,716 --> 00:18:40,284
And I don't know what to do.
I don't know how to fix it.
369
00:18:40,385 --> 00:18:42,753
And Aspyn and Mich and Mykelti
370
00:18:42,855 --> 00:18:45,890
and Tony and Paedon
really want to be around us.
371
00:18:45,991 --> 00:18:49,293
And right now I really just
want to be around people
372
00:18:49,394 --> 00:18:52,597
that want to be
around me and my girls.
373
00:18:52,698 --> 00:18:53,865
So, that's why we're going.
374
00:18:58,637 --> 00:19:01,973
I've just stopped trying
to get the family united
375
00:19:02,074 --> 00:19:03,374
and get us all going
in the same direction.
376
00:19:03,475 --> 00:19:05,910
I don't care.
You know, sometimes...
377
00:19:06,011 --> 00:19:07,211
[Christine] So, he doesn't care?
378
00:19:07,312 --> 00:19:10,081
Like, it's taking all of my
self-control to just stay.
379
00:19:10,182 --> 00:19:11,582
That's ridiculous.
380
00:19:11,683 --> 00:19:12,984
We don't share the same values.
381
00:19:13,085 --> 00:19:14,252
I'm not taking about morals.
382
00:19:14,353 --> 00:19:15,853
Or I'm not
talking about religion,
383
00:19:15,954 --> 00:19:17,455
I'm talking about
just basic values.
384
00:19:17,556 --> 00:19:20,291
I am in the depths
of frustration.
385
00:19:20,826 --> 00:19:22,593
I am in polygamy hell.
386
00:19:32,771 --> 00:19:34,939
So, over the past a little bit
387
00:19:35,040 --> 00:19:36,674
I've had conversations
with my Sister Wives
388
00:19:36,775 --> 00:19:40,111
about the effectiveness of our
conversation as a family.
389
00:19:41,146 --> 00:19:43,080
So now I'm bringing
everybody together
390
00:19:43,182 --> 00:19:44,649
to see if we can figure out
391
00:19:44,750 --> 00:19:48,119
some sort of rules
for conversation as a family.
392
00:19:50,022 --> 00:19:54,192
I think that it would be a really good
thing to establish some ground rules
393
00:19:54,293 --> 00:19:56,961
because I'm tired
of going into conversations
394
00:19:57,095 --> 00:19:59,864
and leaving
not feeling like I matter.
395
00:19:59,965 --> 00:20:04,235
I think if we are honest
and talk to each other for real
396
00:20:04,336 --> 00:20:05,903
and we're kind and easy,
397
00:20:06,004 --> 00:20:07,305
I think this could
help us a lot.
398
00:20:08,607 --> 00:20:11,242
[Meri] I feel like I'm going
into this conversation
399
00:20:11,343 --> 00:20:14,845
open and yet slightly guarded.
400
00:20:14,947 --> 00:20:19,317
'Cause you just never know who's
going to be kind of in a pissy mood.
401
00:20:19,418 --> 00:20:21,452
Who's going to be on attack,
402
00:20:21,553 --> 00:20:23,221
who's going to be defensive.
403
00:20:23,322 --> 00:20:28,426
You just never know how people are
going to be going into a conversation.
404
00:20:28,527 --> 00:20:32,396
Um, well,
I don't really have a plan.
405
00:20:32,497 --> 00:20:35,800
I just have gone around
and talked to you guys all
406
00:20:35,901 --> 00:20:38,302
individually about
what my thoughts were.
407
00:20:38,403 --> 00:20:39,437
Like, what is...
408
00:20:39,538 --> 00:20:41,138
I mean, my idea
was to write down
409
00:20:41,240 --> 00:20:44,308
what we all bottom line
need from a conversation.
410
00:20:44,409 --> 00:20:46,644
I am not someone
who's trained in this.
411
00:20:46,745 --> 00:20:48,346
I have no idea what I'm doing.
412
00:20:48,447 --> 00:20:52,683
So, I just feel like if we all sort of
talked about how we communicate.
413
00:20:52,784 --> 00:20:56,087
We need rules
for how to have conversations.
414
00:20:56,188 --> 00:20:59,390
I guess I still don't get
what we're talking about.
415
00:20:59,491 --> 00:21:00,891
Well, me neither really.
416
00:21:00,993 --> 00:21:02,627
Are we going to talk
about our feelings?
417
00:21:02,728 --> 00:21:03,461
- No.
- [woman laughing]
418
00:21:03,562 --> 00:21:04,629
[Christine] Communication.
419
00:21:04,730 --> 00:21:07,732
I'm coming to this whole
conversation very cynical
420
00:21:07,833 --> 00:21:11,335
'cause I'm extremely discouraged
that I can't get my wives to all agree
421
00:21:11,436 --> 00:21:15,473
on one simple thing, preventing
the spread of COVID in our family.
422
00:21:16,241 --> 00:21:18,409
And, so, it's pissing me off.
423
00:21:18,510 --> 00:21:20,544
Okay, there's kind
of mine I think. I think...
424
00:21:20,646 --> 00:21:24,248
When I boil it down,
I need to make sure I'm heard.
425
00:21:24,349 --> 00:21:27,485
I think we've had communication
problems for a long time.
426
00:21:27,586 --> 00:21:29,553
You know, my life
slowed down a lot
427
00:21:29,655 --> 00:21:32,623
when the COVID shutdown
started to happen.
428
00:21:32,724 --> 00:21:34,892
And I had time
to do a lot of reflecting
429
00:21:34,993 --> 00:21:37,728
on my own personal
communication styles.
430
00:21:37,829 --> 00:21:40,698
And I just began to see a
bigger picture, a bigger pattern.
431
00:21:40,799 --> 00:21:42,633
[Christen] So, I need to feel
important at the end of a conversation.
432
00:21:42,734 --> 00:21:44,135
I feel like sometimes my ideas,
433
00:21:44,236 --> 00:21:45,403
it's just kind of like,
434
00:21:45,504 --> 00:21:47,004
I don't feel like I'm important.
435
00:21:47,105 --> 00:21:49,273
I don't really
even have a say. So...
436
00:21:55,414 --> 00:21:57,682
[Janelle] You don't feel
heard, but it's also more like
437
00:21:57,783 --> 00:22:00,451
we hear you, but we,
sort of, discount your ideas.
438
00:22:00,552 --> 00:22:02,420
Yeah. And everyone just,
I mean, assumes
439
00:22:02,521 --> 00:22:03,421
I'm just being a princess,
440
00:22:03,522 --> 00:22:05,990
because I'm not
expressing myself well.
441
00:22:06,091 --> 00:22:08,926
I'm not intending
to ever be a princess,
442
00:22:09,027 --> 00:22:12,330
but I think I'm seen that way,
and it's frustrating.
443
00:22:12,431 --> 00:22:14,031
For the most part
in our conversations,
444
00:22:14,132 --> 00:22:17,735
I really do try
to speak authentically.
445
00:22:17,836 --> 00:22:19,270
And maybe I'm over dramatic,
446
00:22:19,371 --> 00:22:21,472
or flipping my hair,
or something like that,
447
00:22:21,573 --> 00:22:24,442
but it doesn't mean that
I don't want to be heard.
448
00:22:24,543 --> 00:22:26,477
I feel like everybody
feels that same way.
449
00:22:26,578 --> 00:22:29,146
Like, like,
it's a fight constantly
450
00:22:29,247 --> 00:22:33,584
to, like, have an idea
even heard, so, you know...
451
00:22:33,685 --> 00:22:35,119
What's your... What are you
gonna write down, Kody?
452
00:22:35,220 --> 00:22:37,455
[Kody] Oh, nothing.
[Robyn] Yes, you are.
453
00:22:37,556 --> 00:22:38,956
You have to play.
454
00:22:41,526 --> 00:22:43,227
[Kody] Um...
455
00:22:43,328 --> 00:22:45,229
My problem is, I don't want
to write anything down there,
456
00:22:45,330 --> 00:22:46,931
'cause I don't give
a [bleep] any more.
457
00:22:50,535 --> 00:22:52,069
You know, we've moved here,
458
00:22:52,170 --> 00:22:53,604
we're going through
the struggles.
459
00:22:53,705 --> 00:22:55,773
I've been arguing
about COVID now
460
00:22:55,874 --> 00:22:57,608
for so long with these ladies.
461
00:22:57,709 --> 00:22:59,910
That's the reason
I don't care any more.
462
00:23:00,011 --> 00:23:03,381
I don't enjoy
the relationship any more
463
00:23:03,482 --> 00:23:06,684
because it feels like
a constant fight.
464
00:23:06,785 --> 00:23:09,220
- I don't.
- What do you mean?
465
00:23:09,321 --> 00:23:11,122
Well, every time
we get together,
466
00:23:11,223 --> 00:23:13,958
and I try to, or you try to,
467
00:23:14,059 --> 00:23:16,961
or somebody tries
to express themselves,
468
00:23:17,062 --> 00:23:19,764
we end up in these
really, really bad places.
469
00:23:19,865 --> 00:23:22,600
I think Kody is in, sort of,
a darker place today,
470
00:23:22,701 --> 00:23:24,368
but I know
he has expressed to me
471
00:23:24,469 --> 00:23:27,037
that he's... He's tired.
472
00:23:27,139 --> 00:23:29,073
He's tired of having to be
the middle guy.
473
00:23:29,174 --> 00:23:31,842
He's tired of having to
facilitate the conversations.
474
00:23:31,943 --> 00:23:34,812
Well, it feels like most of the
times when we meet at home,
475
00:23:34,913 --> 00:23:37,181
or whatever, there's always this
476
00:23:37,282 --> 00:23:41,018
lack of, um, respect for
the values of others, so...
477
00:23:42,120 --> 00:23:44,054
Um, and I'm just as guilty
as everybody else.
478
00:23:44,156 --> 00:23:46,757
Sometimes I don't want
to hear an idea.
479
00:23:46,858 --> 00:23:49,193
I don't care,
you know, sometimes.
480
00:23:49,294 --> 00:23:51,362
Then why are we here?
Why are we doing this?
481
00:23:51,463 --> 00:23:53,597
So, he doesn't care?
So, he doesn't care?
482
00:23:53,698 --> 00:23:54,865
He doesn't think
that we need to.
483
00:23:54,966 --> 00:23:56,333
He doesn't care about what?
484
00:23:56,435 --> 00:23:58,536
What does he not give
a [bleep] about?
485
00:23:58,637 --> 00:24:01,672
Like, it's taking all of my
self-control to just stay.
486
00:24:01,773 --> 00:24:03,607
That's ridiculous.
487
00:24:03,708 --> 00:24:07,978
Yeah, I'm cynical,
because, um, I'm...
488
00:24:08,079 --> 00:24:10,915
I have just stopped trying.
489
00:24:11,049 --> 00:24:14,251
I've just stopped trying
to get the family united,
490
00:24:14,352 --> 00:24:15,786
and get us all going
in the same direction.
491
00:24:17,122 --> 00:24:18,889
Uh, being sensitive.
492
00:24:18,990 --> 00:24:20,891
And I've just gotten cynical.
493
00:24:20,992 --> 00:24:23,694
I am in the depths
of frustration.
494
00:24:24,229 --> 00:24:26,330
I am in polygamy hell.
495
00:24:26,431 --> 00:24:28,432
Because we don't respect
each other's values,
496
00:24:28,533 --> 00:24:30,167
or value each other's values,
497
00:24:30,268 --> 00:24:31,869
and realizing
the place we're at.
498
00:24:31,970 --> 00:24:33,471
We don't share the same values.
499
00:24:33,572 --> 00:24:34,672
I'm not talking about morals,
500
00:24:34,773 --> 00:24:36,006
or I'm not talking
about religion,
501
00:24:36,107 --> 00:24:38,142
I'm talking about
just basic values.
502
00:24:38,777 --> 00:24:39,877
We don't share 'em.
503
00:24:39,978 --> 00:24:41,846
Maybe it's my own
communication skill.
504
00:24:41,947 --> 00:24:44,248
Maybe it's just crap.
505
00:24:44,349 --> 00:24:45,516
I mean, we've been sitting here,
506
00:24:45,617 --> 00:24:46,917
arguing about this
over and over,
507
00:24:47,018 --> 00:24:48,152
and I'm just done with it.
508
00:24:50,655 --> 00:24:56,427
It's scary, because I look at
Kody as the head of our family.
509
00:24:56,528 --> 00:24:59,530
And to have
the leader just be like,
510
00:24:59,631 --> 00:25:01,265
"Mmm. I don't care any more."
511
00:25:01,366 --> 00:25:03,634
Like, where does that leave us?
512
00:25:03,735 --> 00:25:08,005
I need to do what I can
to hold this family together.
513
00:25:08,106 --> 00:25:12,243
And I feel like this is why Janelle is,
kind of, coming to these conversations,
514
00:25:12,344 --> 00:25:15,980
because she feels like
she needs to do what she can
515
00:25:16,081 --> 00:25:17,481
to hold the family together,
516
00:25:17,582 --> 00:25:19,283
'cause it's falling apart.
517
00:25:24,189 --> 00:25:27,424
[sighs] I just feel like
the family's falling apart,
518
00:25:27,526 --> 00:25:32,363
and, and it's
really, really scary to me.
519
00:25:35,867 --> 00:25:38,435
Honestly, I'm at a point now
where I see the family
520
00:25:38,537 --> 00:25:41,138
as an obstacle
to, to my own goals.
521
00:25:41,239 --> 00:25:44,742
We're not happy.
The five of us are not happy.
522
00:25:44,843 --> 00:25:47,144
My wives say, you know,
"If you weren't in the picture,"
523
00:25:47,245 --> 00:25:48,712
we would still get along."
524
00:25:48,813 --> 00:25:50,247
That's such bull.
525
00:25:50,348 --> 00:25:53,484
I've seen these women
treat each other so [bleep]
526
00:25:53,585 --> 00:25:56,420
for so many years
that I can't take it any more.
527
00:26:04,596 --> 00:26:06,363
My problem is I don't want
to write anything down there,
528
00:26:06,464 --> 00:26:08,032
'cause I don't give
a [bleep] any more.
529
00:26:09,901 --> 00:26:12,903
It's like, if everybody's happy
where they're living, great.
530
00:26:13,004 --> 00:26:15,005
We could sell this property,
you know?
531
00:26:15,106 --> 00:26:18,108
We are not one family any more.
532
00:26:18,209 --> 00:26:20,210
And in all of our years
in Vegas,
533
00:26:20,312 --> 00:26:23,814
we struggled, we struggled
to be this one family thing.
534
00:26:23,915 --> 00:26:25,482
And as I go through
that process,
535
00:26:25,584 --> 00:26:29,920
I learn how vastly different
each part of my family is
536
00:26:30,021 --> 00:26:31,889
and, kind of, has
their own values.
537
00:26:31,990 --> 00:26:33,857
Then we get to Flagstaff,
538
00:26:33,959 --> 00:26:37,461
and I feel like I'm not having
to struggle with it as much,
539
00:26:37,562 --> 00:26:39,630
because we're not
as close together.
540
00:26:39,731 --> 00:26:42,766
I don't see Team Brown any more.
541
00:26:42,867 --> 00:26:45,603
[Janelle] I actually think
that we're right on the cusp
542
00:26:45,704 --> 00:26:49,473
of being separate
or being together.
543
00:26:49,574 --> 00:26:51,976
In theory, in name,
we're all together, one team,
544
00:26:52,077 --> 00:26:53,611
but we're really
not working as a team.
545
00:26:54,646 --> 00:26:58,148
Um, I'm going
to read you something.
546
00:27:00,685 --> 00:27:02,953
"The Kody Brown family."
547
00:27:03,054 --> 00:27:04,321
[exhales deeply]
548
00:27:04,422 --> 00:27:05,522
Our family is forever joined
549
00:27:05,624 --> 00:27:08,192
with the purpose of developing
our own divine energy
550
00:27:08,293 --> 00:27:09,960
and raising righteous children.
551
00:27:12,030 --> 00:27:13,664
As sister wives and husband,
552
00:27:13,765 --> 00:27:14,765
we embrace one another
553
00:27:14,866 --> 00:27:16,934
with the covenant
of an eternal nature.
554
00:27:17,035 --> 00:27:18,736
We enjoy being together
as a family,
555
00:27:18,837 --> 00:27:21,505
because we have developed
a safe, peaceful,
556
00:27:21,606 --> 00:27:25,175
"and pleasant atmosphere, where
we love and respect one another."
557
00:27:25,276 --> 00:27:27,211
[sniffles]
558
00:27:27,312 --> 00:27:28,579
-Well-- -[Janelle] Our
mission statement.
559
00:27:28,680 --> 00:27:29,813
That's our mission statement.
560
00:27:30,949 --> 00:27:32,483
[Meri] I love that.
561
00:27:32,817 --> 00:27:34,351
It, um...
562
00:27:36,554 --> 00:27:38,656
reminds me of better times.
563
00:27:41,326 --> 00:27:44,361
I just want our family
to get back to that.
564
00:27:45,964 --> 00:27:46,630
[sniffles]
565
00:27:50,535 --> 00:27:53,003
And I get really scared
that we're not going to.
566
00:27:54,973 --> 00:27:58,075
We worked really hard on that. Took us
months, and months, and months, and months.
567
00:27:58,176 --> 00:28:02,413
And I think it's easier
to forget about it.
568
00:28:02,514 --> 00:28:05,783
I think it's easier
to do our own thing.
569
00:28:05,884 --> 00:28:09,586
Is it so much work
to come back together again
570
00:28:09,688 --> 00:28:11,288
and want to be
with each other again?
571
00:28:11,389 --> 00:28:13,223
Is it just too hard?
572
00:28:14,526 --> 00:28:16,894
Our relationships are optional.
573
00:28:16,995 --> 00:28:19,296
I have the family
mission statement on purpose.
574
00:28:19,397 --> 00:28:22,366
I brought it on purpose,
hoping to inspire everybody.
575
00:28:23,435 --> 00:28:25,269
And I...
576
00:28:26,905 --> 00:28:28,338
I don't know
where everybody's at.
577
00:28:28,440 --> 00:28:29,940
Also, I was, kind of, hoping
if we could figure out
578
00:28:30,041 --> 00:28:31,008
how to really communicate,
579
00:28:31,109 --> 00:28:33,844
we might, sort of,
not seem so hard.
580
00:28:33,945 --> 00:28:36,680
Because, right now, what I'm
hearing is that nobody listens,
581
00:28:36,781 --> 00:28:38,782
which, I think,
we probably knew.
582
00:28:38,850 --> 00:28:40,684
[Christine] Yeah. Because,
like, at the end of a conversation,
583
00:28:40,785 --> 00:28:43,220
I, usually, am nauseous,
584
00:28:43,321 --> 00:28:46,423
and I can't even
take care of the girls.
585
00:28:46,524 --> 00:28:48,592
And I just have to go to my
room and completely shut down
586
00:28:48,693 --> 00:28:51,829
at the end
of most conversations.
587
00:28:51,930 --> 00:28:55,766
This is the first time I'm hearing
that it completely wrecks her.
588
00:28:55,867 --> 00:28:58,435
Like, it's been very easy
for me to be like, "Whatever.
589
00:28:58,536 --> 00:29:01,238
Grow up. Grow a pair. Whatever."
590
00:29:01,339 --> 00:29:03,741
But I have to really acknowledge
that she feels like this.
591
00:29:04,609 --> 00:29:06,610
Kody, you're using
the word "values,"
592
00:29:06,711 --> 00:29:08,679
and I thought we had
the same values,
593
00:29:08,780 --> 00:29:10,748
so that's new for me.
594
00:29:10,849 --> 00:29:14,785
We... For years, we tried
doing things together.
595
00:29:16,454 --> 00:29:18,756
In the end, we...
I think we just determined
596
00:29:18,857 --> 00:29:21,925
that working together for us
wasn't even safe.
597
00:29:22,894 --> 00:29:24,228
And, honestly,
I am at a point now
598
00:29:24,329 --> 00:29:27,231
where I see the family,
in many ways,
599
00:29:27,332 --> 00:29:29,933
as an obstacle
to, to my own goals.
600
00:29:33,037 --> 00:29:36,507
We're not happy.
The five of us are not happy.
601
00:29:36,608 --> 00:29:37,908
My wives say, you know,
602
00:29:38,009 --> 00:29:38,909
"If you weren't in the picture,
603
00:29:39,010 --> 00:29:40,477
we would still get along."
604
00:29:40,578 --> 00:29:42,079
That's such bull!
605
00:29:42,180 --> 00:29:45,315
I've seen these women
treat each other so [bleep]
606
00:29:45,416 --> 00:29:48,786
for so many years
that I can't take it any more.
607
00:29:48,887 --> 00:29:50,087
[Janelle] I'm just
looking at Kody like,
608
00:29:50,188 --> 00:29:52,523
"What the hell planet
did you come from?"
609
00:29:52,624 --> 00:29:55,225
We're in this plural marriage.
You have agreed to this.
610
00:29:55,326 --> 00:29:56,860
Like, but considering
your family
611
00:29:56,961 --> 00:29:59,129
an obstacle to his own goals,
612
00:29:59,230 --> 00:30:01,131
well, that's about the most
selfish thing I've ever heard.
613
00:30:01,232 --> 00:30:03,534
But... Okay.
614
00:30:05,236 --> 00:30:07,004
In the spirit of communication,
615
00:30:07,105 --> 00:30:10,174
I have to hear him and realize
that's where he's at.
616
00:30:10,275 --> 00:30:11,909
Well, we have
this, this guidebook,
617
00:30:12,010 --> 00:30:13,544
our family mission statement,
618
00:30:13,645 --> 00:30:15,345
and that is our beacon,
so to speak.
619
00:30:15,446 --> 00:30:18,448
That is our goal. This is
what we want to accomplish.
620
00:30:18,550 --> 00:30:20,217
But we're so far from it.
621
00:30:24,255 --> 00:30:26,623
It, it feels like hypocrisy.
622
00:30:28,393 --> 00:30:30,727
You know, the children
are getting older.
623
00:30:30,829 --> 00:30:33,163
What do I want to do
with the rest of my life?
624
00:30:33,264 --> 00:30:35,699
It scares me
when Kody talks like that
625
00:30:35,800 --> 00:30:37,534
'cause it makes me feel
very alone.
626
00:30:37,635 --> 00:30:40,437
But his attitude
is very much like,
627
00:30:40,538 --> 00:30:42,673
"Well, you guys are all
making your own decisions."
628
00:30:42,774 --> 00:30:44,675
You're all independent,
obviously.
629
00:30:44,776 --> 00:30:47,077
'Cause you're not
listening to me,
630
00:30:47,178 --> 00:30:49,646
and you don't want to work
as a team any more,
631
00:30:49,747 --> 00:30:52,883
so, then, that frees me
of the responsibility
632
00:30:52,984 --> 00:30:55,686
of being captain,
I guess you could say,
633
00:30:55,787 --> 00:30:57,621
"and rallying the troops."
634
00:30:57,722 --> 00:30:59,289
It's no fun.
And it's scary to me.
635
00:30:59,390 --> 00:31:00,424
I don't like it.
636
00:31:00,525 --> 00:31:02,593
I talk to my mom once a week,
637
00:31:02,694 --> 00:31:04,928
and she has such a great
relationship with her sister wife.
638
00:31:05,029 --> 00:31:08,031
That... That's her
social group, you know?
639
00:31:08,132 --> 00:31:10,734
And I thought, "Okay.
So I can see us."
640
00:31:10,835 --> 00:31:11,969
Like, we're the social group.
641
00:31:12,070 --> 00:31:14,171
This is the social group I want.
642
00:31:14,272 --> 00:31:16,039
But, you know, I don't know
what it looks like, guys.
643
00:31:16,140 --> 00:31:17,708
Because without the kids
to focus on,
644
00:31:17,809 --> 00:31:19,843
we have to, kind of,
rethink what we look like.
645
00:31:19,944 --> 00:31:22,145
You know, I have been feeling
very strongly
646
00:31:22,247 --> 00:31:25,449
for the last year, or maybe two,
647
00:31:25,550 --> 00:31:29,052
that with the kids starting
to be older and moving out,
648
00:31:29,153 --> 00:31:30,921
that there would be
a paradigm shift
649
00:31:31,022 --> 00:31:33,123
in what was the focus
of our family.
650
00:31:33,224 --> 00:31:36,293
But we need to all
thoughtfully craft
651
00:31:36,394 --> 00:31:38,228
what that group looks like.
652
00:31:38,329 --> 00:31:41,465
You know, my mother with her
sister wife, they live on the ranch.
653
00:31:41,566 --> 00:31:43,200
They chose that community.
654
00:31:43,301 --> 00:31:46,470
They felt united
in that community.
655
00:31:46,571 --> 00:31:48,705
And I think
that was a conscious choice.
656
00:31:48,806 --> 00:31:50,741
And so I want to make
that conscious choice,
657
00:31:50,842 --> 00:31:52,709
and I'm hoping
everybody else will, too.
658
00:31:52,810 --> 00:31:54,611
Okay. All right.
659
00:31:54,712 --> 00:31:56,280
That, kind of, hit
everybody's stuff.
660
00:31:56,381 --> 00:31:58,749
Should I e-mail these all out to
you guys before I laminate them?
661
00:31:58,850 --> 00:32:00,717
[Robyn] I think
we need to take them,
662
00:32:00,818 --> 00:32:02,653
put them in a little thing
in our wallet.
663
00:32:02,754 --> 00:32:04,922
That's exactly... I'm gonna
make a little foldable...
664
00:32:05,023 --> 00:32:07,691
Like, you know, sometimes
people carry little prayers.
665
00:32:07,792 --> 00:32:08,659
You know, I'm gonna...
666
00:32:08,760 --> 00:32:11,261
I'm gonna do these
as a laminated thing.
667
00:32:11,362 --> 00:32:14,898
I love this conversation.
I love it so much.
668
00:32:14,966 --> 00:32:18,402
I 100% believe
that we've got a good list
669
00:32:18,503 --> 00:32:21,104
of things
to follow and remember.
670
00:32:21,205 --> 00:32:25,876
I think, you know, if we just
stick to it, we can't go wrong.
671
00:32:25,977 --> 00:32:29,613
I will say that a lot of times
when we have conversations,
672
00:32:29,714 --> 00:32:32,049
we start something,
but we never finish it.
673
00:32:32,150 --> 00:32:37,988
I would propose that we
make a plan to continue it.
674
00:32:38,089 --> 00:32:40,524
I have a specific idea I will
bring to you in two weeks.
675
00:32:40,625 --> 00:32:43,760
- Okay.
- And we will use these skills.
676
00:32:43,861 --> 00:32:45,929
'Cause it's been a conversation
I haven't wanted to have.
677
00:32:46,030 --> 00:32:48,432
I really want to talk to them
about moving back to Utah.
678
00:32:48,533 --> 00:32:51,335
I first need to talk to Kody
about moving back to Utah.
679
00:32:51,436 --> 00:32:53,770
But before we do anything else
on this property,
680
00:32:53,871 --> 00:32:59,142
I really want to ask them how
they feel about moving back.
681
00:33:04,882 --> 00:33:05,949
The laws have changed.
682
00:33:06,050 --> 00:33:07,918
One, two, three,
four wives said,
683
00:33:08,019 --> 00:33:11,154
"No, we're never moving
back to Utah."
684
00:33:11,255 --> 00:33:13,490
She's simply
talking about something
685
00:33:13,591 --> 00:33:15,625
that I don't believe works
for the whole family.
686
00:33:15,727 --> 00:33:17,594
Not even close.
687
00:33:17,695 --> 00:33:20,664
It's about living
with the community again,
688
00:33:20,765 --> 00:33:22,332
living with
like-minded people again.
689
00:33:22,433 --> 00:33:26,136
We're living as monogamous
in a monogamous world now.
690
00:33:26,237 --> 00:33:27,404
We swore we never would.
691
00:33:38,716 --> 00:33:40,517
[Christine] Five years ago,
we sued the state of Utah.
692
00:33:40,618 --> 00:33:43,153
And then, we won for a bit.
693
00:33:43,254 --> 00:33:44,588
And it was decriminalized.
694
00:33:44,689 --> 00:33:46,023
And then, a year later,
it wasn't.
695
00:33:46,124 --> 00:33:48,225
Then two years ago, Kody
wanted to move back to Utah,
696
00:33:48,326 --> 00:33:49,860
and we were like,
"Oh, it's not safe."
697
00:33:49,961 --> 00:33:52,729
The governor of Utah
just signed the bill
698
00:33:52,830 --> 00:33:55,532
that makes
polygamy decriminalized.
699
00:33:56,300 --> 00:33:57,067
All right.
700
00:33:57,668 --> 00:33:58,835
Okay.
701
00:33:58,936 --> 00:34:01,338
When I heard about the law,
702
00:34:01,439 --> 00:34:03,040
immediately,
my first thought was,
703
00:34:03,141 --> 00:34:05,942
"Well, if the law passes, why
wouldn't we move back to Utah?"
704
00:34:06,044 --> 00:34:08,245
So I want to talk
to Cody about it, too.
705
00:34:08,346 --> 00:34:10,647
Remember when we looked
at the property at Coyote Pass
706
00:34:10,748 --> 00:34:12,482
and we heard, like,
angels singing.
707
00:34:12,583 --> 00:34:14,851
It was awesome.
Fell in love with the place.
708
00:34:14,952 --> 00:34:17,087
I remember saying specifically
709
00:34:18,022 --> 00:34:20,390
that I would definitely
move to Flagstaff
710
00:34:20,491 --> 00:34:22,159
unless the laws in Utah changed.
711
00:34:24,395 --> 00:34:26,263
The laws have changed.
712
00:34:26,364 --> 00:34:28,932
- Does that mean anything?
- Not to me.
713
00:34:30,368 --> 00:34:32,035
You wouldn't move back?
714
00:34:32,136 --> 00:34:34,704
Christine, my...
I have four homes
715
00:34:35,973 --> 00:34:40,043
that shared a backyard
in St. George
716
00:34:41,245 --> 00:34:44,214
that I was ready
to put an offer on.
717
00:34:44,315 --> 00:34:49,686
This was just a month before I
made the presentation to my wives
718
00:34:49,787 --> 00:34:51,221
that we should
move out of Las Vegas,
719
00:34:51,322 --> 00:34:53,723
so that we,
if we are in agreement,
720
00:34:53,825 --> 00:34:56,626
can make an offer on those
four homes that I'd found.
721
00:34:56,727 --> 00:34:58,261
Everybody killed that.
722
00:34:58,362 --> 00:35:00,197
One, two, three,
four wives said,
723
00:35:00,298 --> 00:35:04,267
"No, we're never moving
back to Utah."
724
00:35:04,368 --> 00:35:06,770
Christine was the most adamant
of the four wives
725
00:35:06,871 --> 00:35:08,638
that we were not going
to move to Utah.
726
00:35:08,739 --> 00:35:10,774
She was the most
dramatic about it.
727
00:35:10,875 --> 00:35:13,543
I thought the reason
that my four wives
728
00:35:13,644 --> 00:35:15,979
didn't want to go to Utah
was for the sake
729
00:35:16,080 --> 00:35:20,083
of our children's social safety.
730
00:35:20,151 --> 00:35:22,853
That was part of it. I feel
like Utah's changed a bit.
731
00:35:23,955 --> 00:35:25,422
You don't?
732
00:35:25,523 --> 00:35:27,858
No, I thought it had, too,
733
00:35:27,959 --> 00:35:30,427
but you guys
weren't listening to me.
734
00:35:30,528 --> 00:35:32,796
When we were in Vegas,
735
00:35:32,897 --> 00:35:35,632
the idea of Utah
was very scary still
736
00:35:36,868 --> 00:35:37,834
because of the law.
737
00:35:37,935 --> 00:35:40,370
The fear that I was raised with
738
00:35:40,471 --> 00:35:42,906
was what I didn't want
to perpetuate in my children.
739
00:35:43,007 --> 00:35:45,175
You know, the fear of the
police were not the people
740
00:35:45,276 --> 00:35:47,644
you wanted to ever go to
if you were in danger.
741
00:35:47,745 --> 00:35:50,480
Because if the police found out
that you lived a plural marriage,
742
00:35:50,581 --> 00:35:52,682
they could come and arrest you.
743
00:35:52,817 --> 00:35:55,385
It was all because of the law.
744
00:35:55,486 --> 00:35:59,156
As soon as the governor
signed it, my first thought was,
745
00:35:59,257 --> 00:36:00,423
"We can finally move back home."
746
00:36:00,525 --> 00:36:02,726
- And where would we move to?
- And then,
747
00:36:02,827 --> 00:36:05,562
when we went there
to look at wedding venues,
748
00:36:05,663 --> 00:36:07,063
- with Mariah and Audrey...
- Yeah.
749
00:36:07,165 --> 00:36:09,132
...did you hear
the conversation in the car?
750
00:36:09,967 --> 00:36:11,568
It was all about
"I miss it here.
751
00:36:11,669 --> 00:36:13,603
I miss the mountains.
I miss being here.
752
00:36:13,704 --> 00:36:16,072
Utah's always going to be home."
753
00:36:16,174 --> 00:36:18,975
That was everybody.
All the wives mentioned that.
754
00:36:19,076 --> 00:36:21,545
I think Christine
was mistaking my nostalgia
755
00:36:21,646 --> 00:36:23,213
for a desire to move back.
756
00:36:23,314 --> 00:36:25,682
But I don't necessarily think
that means that my other wives
757
00:36:25,783 --> 00:36:27,784
want to move back to Utah.
758
00:36:27,885 --> 00:36:29,853
Man, I don't want to move again,
759
00:36:29,954 --> 00:36:31,755
and I don't want
to leave Flagstaff.
760
00:36:31,856 --> 00:36:33,990
I mean, this is
the neatest place
761
00:36:34,091 --> 00:36:35,992
I've ever lived, I feel like.
762
00:36:36,093 --> 00:36:38,962
[Christine] Family's there.
Everybody has family in Utah.
763
00:36:39,063 --> 00:36:41,798
My dad's there. I don't know how
long my dad's gonna be around.
764
00:36:42,800 --> 00:36:44,801
You know, my dad's super sick.
765
00:36:47,238 --> 00:36:48,705
He's super sick.
766
00:36:48,806 --> 00:36:52,275
And I would love to be there
the last few years of my dad's life.
767
00:36:52,376 --> 00:36:53,977
My kids need to get
to know him better.
768
00:36:54,078 --> 00:36:56,479
My dad being there
is a really big pull.
769
00:36:56,581 --> 00:36:59,049
My mom's there,
sister's there, Aspyn's there.
770
00:36:59,150 --> 00:37:01,418
- Mykelti's there.
- Mykelti's there, Paedon's there.
771
00:37:01,519 --> 00:37:02,953
Mariah and Audrey
are moving there.
772
00:37:03,054 --> 00:37:05,855
It's about living
with the community again,
773
00:37:05,957 --> 00:37:07,757
living with
like-minded people again.
774
00:37:07,858 --> 00:37:10,060
It felt so good
to go see the Dargers.
775
00:37:10,161 --> 00:37:14,130
How would it be to associate
with like-minded people
776
00:37:14,232 --> 00:37:16,066
on a regular basis?
777
00:37:16,167 --> 00:37:19,536
We are living as monogamous
in a monogamous world now.
778
00:37:19,637 --> 00:37:21,871
We swore we never would,
but we are.
779
00:37:21,973 --> 00:37:23,773
When we went to
visit the Dargers,
780
00:37:23,874 --> 00:37:26,009
I felt so normal again.
781
00:37:26,110 --> 00:37:29,980
It made me feel like
we weren't so broken.
782
00:37:30,081 --> 00:37:32,082
We haven't done anything
on the property.
783
00:37:33,317 --> 00:37:38,355
To me, I'm like,
"Let's not. Let's hold it.
784
00:37:38,456 --> 00:37:42,125
Sell it, use that money
in a couple of years.
785
00:37:42,226 --> 00:37:43,927
No one wants to move now."
786
00:37:44,829 --> 00:37:46,196
I just...
787
00:37:46,297 --> 00:37:49,332
I, I think
she's smoking something.
788
00:37:49,433 --> 00:37:51,968
Unless I'm totally up
in the night,
789
00:37:52,069 --> 00:37:53,803
and she's the one that's right,
790
00:37:53,904 --> 00:37:55,171
nobody in this family,
791
00:37:55,273 --> 00:37:58,074
not anybody, not even the kids,
792
00:37:58,175 --> 00:38:00,477
are going to want
to move to Utah.
793
00:38:00,578 --> 00:38:02,445
- I don't think--
- I don't think anyone's
794
00:38:02,546 --> 00:38:04,881
going to want to move.
I'm not naive in this.
795
00:38:04,982 --> 00:38:06,883
I'm not... What? Stop.
796
00:38:06,984 --> 00:38:09,719
I'm laughing at you
very specifically
797
00:38:09,820 --> 00:38:11,521
because I think
that I, I just...
798
00:38:11,622 --> 00:38:13,890
I'm like,
"Yes, please present this."
799
00:38:13,991 --> 00:38:15,625
Make me look better.
800
00:38:17,228 --> 00:38:20,997
"Uh, get crucified for saying,
'Let's move.'"
801
00:38:21,098 --> 00:38:25,101
I really want to see how
the family reacts to this idea
802
00:38:25,202 --> 00:38:26,670
of moving back to Utah.
803
00:38:26,771 --> 00:38:28,371
And I don't want to be the one
804
00:38:28,472 --> 00:38:31,908
getting the rash and the crap
for, you know, saying,
805
00:38:32,009 --> 00:38:34,044
"Hey, what about
moving back to Utah?"
806
00:38:34,145 --> 00:38:36,713
And just get, "What?
Are you nuts?" You know.
807
00:38:36,814 --> 00:38:38,181
I'd rather Christine do that,
808
00:38:38,282 --> 00:38:41,151
and me sit back and watch
and see what happens.
809
00:38:41,252 --> 00:38:43,920
I don't think Janelle
sees value in St. George.
810
00:38:44,021 --> 00:38:46,389
Meri doesn't
see value in St. George.
811
00:38:46,490 --> 00:38:49,526
St. George is as far
North as I want to go.
812
00:38:49,627 --> 00:38:52,962
She's simply asking
or talking about
813
00:38:53,064 --> 00:38:55,965
something that I don't believe
works for the whole family.
814
00:38:56,067 --> 00:38:57,334
Not even close.
815
00:38:57,435 --> 00:38:59,536
Not even close.
816
00:38:59,637 --> 00:39:03,039
I think Robyn, because
of her family being there,
817
00:39:03,140 --> 00:39:05,008
you could probably convince her
818
00:39:05,109 --> 00:39:07,844
even though swears,
she made me promise
819
00:39:07,945 --> 00:39:09,179
she was never going
to move again, you know.
820
00:39:09,280 --> 00:39:11,881
I think he's
821
00:39:11,982 --> 00:39:15,452
entertaining the thought.
I think I could sway him.
822
00:39:15,553 --> 00:39:16,986
I think I could sway him
to move to Utah.
823
00:39:17,088 --> 00:39:18,755
That's just him.
824
00:39:18,856 --> 00:39:22,492
But I think he would
be interested in moving.
825
00:39:22,593 --> 00:39:24,160
I really do.
826
00:39:24,762 --> 00:39:26,162
Gosh.
827
00:39:27,298 --> 00:39:30,300
I am so frustrated
by this, Christine.
828
00:39:30,401 --> 00:39:32,569
You're talking about something
that I want
829
00:39:32,670 --> 00:39:37,107
that I just refused to even
entertain now.
830
00:39:41,779 --> 00:39:44,314
It's an exciting thought,
just 'cause
831
00:39:44,415 --> 00:39:46,015
all my friends
are in St. George.
832
00:39:46,117 --> 00:39:48,385
I don't think Christine
will be able to convince
833
00:39:48,486 --> 00:39:50,387
any of us
but it's a roller coaster
834
00:39:50,454 --> 00:39:52,422
that I am more than willing
to join.
835
00:39:52,523 --> 00:39:54,324
I hate the idea of moving,
836
00:39:54,425 --> 00:39:57,060
but I love the idea
of living in St. George.
837
00:39:57,161 --> 00:39:59,629
I mean, and I'm just not
shutting her down, because
838
00:39:59,730 --> 00:40:03,666
I'm not going to sit here
and say "your idea is dumb,"
839
00:40:03,768 --> 00:40:06,302
especially when I like it.
840
00:40:06,404 --> 00:40:08,171
I just know
that it's not possible.
841
00:40:10,074 --> 00:40:11,841
Man...
842
00:40:13,811 --> 00:40:17,747
I feel like I sacrifice
so much coming here.
843
00:40:17,848 --> 00:40:21,050
When my whole plan,
for four years,
844
00:40:21,152 --> 00:40:24,721
four years, I was planning
on moving to St. George.
845
00:40:24,822 --> 00:40:26,623
And you guys all knew it.
846
00:40:26,724 --> 00:40:29,325
[Christine] My plan, my plan
now is to talk to the wives.
847
00:40:29,427 --> 00:40:30,794
I want to do it face to face.
848
00:40:30,895 --> 00:40:34,063
I don't want to do this over
a video chat, it's too big.
849
00:40:34,165 --> 00:40:36,766
So, I'm hoping
that when we talk about it,
850
00:40:36,867 --> 00:40:39,569
he like, talks about
how he's got family there,
851
00:40:39,637 --> 00:40:42,672
he has friends there,
he would love to retire there.
852
00:40:42,773 --> 00:40:45,241
I don't know if I want to get
my hopes up that much, right?
853
00:40:45,810 --> 00:40:47,510
[exhales]
854
00:40:47,611 --> 00:40:50,580
It's a bitter pill. Should I
use a marriage metaphor?
855
00:40:52,683 --> 00:40:55,318
She wasn't the best looking,
856
00:40:55,419 --> 00:40:57,387
but, I was in love with her
857
00:40:57,488 --> 00:40:59,322
and I wanted to
858
00:40:59,423 --> 00:41:00,523
make that marriage happen
859
00:41:00,624 --> 00:41:03,326
and that's what
I would call St. George.
860
00:41:03,427 --> 00:41:05,695
I asked my family,
861
00:41:05,796 --> 00:41:09,165
let's pretend that we're not
polygamous, that it's just a family,
862
00:41:09,266 --> 00:41:12,402
What so you think about
me marrying St. George?
863
00:41:12,503 --> 00:41:15,071
And they're all, "Ew! Hell no."
864
00:41:15,172 --> 00:41:17,540
So they're like,
"Pick another woman!"
865
00:41:17,641 --> 00:41:20,243
So I pick a beautiful woman,
866
00:41:20,344 --> 00:41:23,179
that I wasn't quite
as in love with,
867
00:41:23,280 --> 00:41:24,781
and that was Flagstaff.
868
00:41:24,882 --> 00:41:26,416
And I married Flagstaff.
869
00:41:27,585 --> 00:41:30,353
Now, St. George
is available again
870
00:41:30,454 --> 00:41:31,688
and the family's like,
871
00:41:31,789 --> 00:41:34,491
"Oh, we misjudged St. George,
872
00:41:34,592 --> 00:41:36,593
you should have married her."
873
00:41:36,694 --> 00:41:39,028
Well, I'm already married,
damn it!
874
00:41:41,599 --> 00:41:43,666
It's too late.
875
00:41:48,239 --> 00:41:50,340
[Kody] Next time
on "Sister Wives"...
876
00:41:50,441 --> 00:41:52,175
Ysabel was diagnosed
with scoliosis
877
00:41:52,276 --> 00:41:53,877
when she was, like, 13.
878
00:41:53,978 --> 00:41:56,045
Her curve is over
50 degrees now,
879
00:41:56,146 --> 00:41:58,014
so it's just time
to get the surgery.
880
00:41:58,115 --> 00:42:00,183
Do we send Ysabel by herself?
881
00:42:00,284 --> 00:42:03,086
I'm not going to get
surgery by myself.
882
00:42:03,187 --> 00:42:04,487
I shouldn't have said that.
883
00:42:04,588 --> 00:42:06,823
I'm feeling a little
emotional about it today.
884
00:42:06,924 --> 00:42:08,324
[sighs]
885
00:42:08,425 --> 00:42:09,759
The idea that I'm not
gonna see Kody
886
00:42:09,860 --> 00:42:13,196
for two months, really,
you know, I will miss Kody.
887
00:42:13,297 --> 00:42:18,167
I'm just worried about
my sanity and our relationship.
888
00:42:18,269 --> 00:42:21,704
Well, the state of my family
is anarchy right now.
889
00:42:21,805 --> 00:42:24,541
It's like everybody
for themselves, I guess.
890
00:42:26,443 --> 00:42:28,311
Meri, I can't do marriage
with Kody anymore.
891
00:42:28,412 --> 00:42:30,013
- I don't want to...
- You don't get to give up
892
00:42:30,114 --> 00:42:32,048
like that.
- I don't want to do it anymore.