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[narrator] Previously on
Sister Wives...
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Flagstaff now has
a case of coronavirus.
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We always grew up
thinking that we were so cool.
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- That 2020 would be like be the best year...
- [woman laughs]
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- ...to graduate, and the coolest.
- Yeah.
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- And now we're all, like, hating it...
- Yeah.
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...because it feels
like the worst.
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These kids are young
and they're not quite
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understanding the gravity
of the situation.
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Their health is more important
than a prom or a graduation, any day.
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I think we miss the idea of us,
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we don't miss each other.
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Speak for yourself.
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[Robyn] Kody and Meri's
relationship is really sad.
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I want...
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wives who get along with each
other and who like each other.
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And who don't sit there...
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and say snotty little
[bleeped] things to each other
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that break their hearts.
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Would every one of these women
be better off married to another guy?
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That's the question
I'm asking myself.
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[theme music playing]
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[Kody] Recently,
Meri and I went out
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for our 30th
wedding anniversary.
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Wasn't an easy
discussion 'cause...
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we essentially experienced a
quasi breakup five years ago.
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I mean, we honestly haven't
lived together for five years, I think.
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[Meri] He really doesn't come
to my house very often.
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And I don't know how long
this is gonna last.
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[Kody] I sort of unraveled a
lot of the experience we've had
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since we moved
to Flagstaff with Meri,
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in explaining sort of
this struggle
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that not only her,
but all my wives
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are having in plural marriage.
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He keeps making references
to the fact
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that he doesn't know
how he feels about...
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plural marriage anymore.
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Would he even do it again?
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[Kody] All this unraveling and
all this feedback from my wives
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and all this experience
that we've had...
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has made me question
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whether or not we can
be functional in the future.
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It's been a reckoning for me.
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I have looked at this and I have
gone, "Oh, ladies, if you are not happy,
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we gotta figure something out."
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[Christine] I'm recording now.
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- Can I start?
- I'm playing
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- with my dog.
- I'm recording.
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[Robyn] I've seen a lot
of differences
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in our family culture since we
moved to Flagstaff.
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And COVID in this whole
situation is making it even harder
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to figure that out because,
you know, now,
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you know, seeing each other
as a family is a risk.
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- Hey, y'all.
- Hi, guys.
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- [Janelle] Hello.
- Hi, guys.
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[Janelle] I'm feeling
the isolation a lot.
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I'm starting to kind of not be
mentally good with this.
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- Come on, this is better than a group text.
- I actually really like this
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- compared to group text.
- For sure.
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We're gonna have
a discussion now.
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[Robyn] Our decisions are
going to affect each other.
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That may have some long-term
effects on the relationship.
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I just don't know.
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Okay, so guys,
Hunter is coming home tomorrow
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or the next day.
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What are we gonna do when
he's home?
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Are we gonna get together...
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How long is he gonna be home?
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He'll be here for
the whole summer.
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I will just be upfront.
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I'm about ready
to psychologically lose it
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if we don't start getting
together soon,
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because... And my kids
are kind of at that space, too.
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I think my ideas
of the whole family
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getting together
are fairly radical
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for some people in the family.
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'Cause there are some voices that
would have us completely stay separate.
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[Robyn] You know, CDC is telling
you not to get into groups bigger
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than, like, ten or eight
or something.
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I don't know what
the answer is here.
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I think that teleconferencing
is probably our best...
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the best we can do for now.
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Okay, I wanna hear what
everybody else has to say
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'cause I sort of have
my feelings about the extreme.
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'Cause this decision affects
us all.
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We have to all be
on the same page.
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I don't know if we're all
gonna get on the same page.
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So far, we haven't really
handled COVID as a team.
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I think it'd be awesome
to get together.
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I think it'd be super,
super cool.
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I think it's sad
to be separated.
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I think it might be the safest and the most
responsible thing to do, to stay separated.
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Am I a fan of it? No.
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I think it's ridiculous
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that we're not getting together.
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Just trying to be smart,
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so that there are no regrets,
you know.
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If it's gonna save,
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you know, keep our family
healthy and safe,
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then we can do it.
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I love my family so much,
I'll stay away from them.
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That's kinda how I feel.
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I spent some time with our
family doctor, not in person.
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But she even made the comment
that our ICU is full of cases,
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here in Flagstaff.
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She has advised me
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that we should still not
be gathering as a family.
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I don't necessarily agree with
100% of what she's saying
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based on everything I'm reading.
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[Robyn] I do trust our doctor.
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I know that she has the best
intention for our family.
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I do, I do think that.
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I think our family doctor is
giving her perspective
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and we're taking it
like gospel truth.
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I absolutely am embracing
everything the CDC tells us to do.
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I wear a mask, I wash my hands,
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I carry hand sanitizer with me.
When I go to the grocery store,
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I'm careful.
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Like, I'm not going
a lot of places.
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Kody seems to be taking it to a
whole different level of isolation.
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I'm trying to get us together
and nobody seems to
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be playing ball with me
and I'm just kinda like,
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"Come on, guys!"
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So, I guess if they wanna
continue to be apart
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and maybe we're apart for
18 months or two years
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and maybe the family
exists or not
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in that, after that time period.
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[Kody] Everybody just needs
to stay home.
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And then, I can see everybody.
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If each one of you
wanna be able to see me,
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then I can be the only one
that you see besides your,
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- um, immediate children.
- [dog barks]
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Does that seem understandable?
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I don't like telling them
what to do
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because they just like to put
me in my place.
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But right now
is one of those times
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when I would like to
be able to say, "Hey!
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These are the rules
and you're gonna do 'em."
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And everybody's got a choice to
make and everybody gets to choose.
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- Not really.
- What?
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Not really. We don't all
get a choice to make
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and get to choose.
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I can't see Maddie and the kids?
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I can't see Hunter?
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I... I really am not willing
to do that.
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We have to each decide.
Each household gets to decide.
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Each mom gets to decide.
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All of you are getting to
decide what you're gonna do.
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I want everybody to feel like
they've got a choice.
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But what they're literally
doing is they're choosing
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whether or not they're gonna
have a relationship,
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a physical relationship
with me or not.
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You can't have a relationship
if you're not alive. [laughs]
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So, I don't know. I mean
that sounds morbid,
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but that's really kinda
what it boils down to.
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I'm not gonna follow the same
rules that Robyn is following.
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We already made plans
to go do stuff,
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and we're going to go do stuff.
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I will tell you that
I can't go all summer
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doing this.
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'Cause she doesn't want to
hear the facts.
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She doesn't want to hear it.
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Frankly, I think Janelle's lazy
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about an ounce of prevention.
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- I just can't. So...
- That's...
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- I mean I can't.
- [indistinct]
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[Janelle] I'm getting the impression
Christine and I are kind of in the same boat.
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I can at least maybe try
to make small alliances
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so that our kids can at least
hang out this summer.
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My kids are to the point where
we would choose hanging out
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at Christine's house
over you coming, Kody.
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Sorry. That's where they're at.
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[Robyn] This is between
Kody and Janelle.
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And I just have to kind of...
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[vocalizing] you know?
Awkward. [laughs]
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I mean, that's
an extreme compliment.
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I do love Janelle's children.
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But I don't want them
coming over
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to make them
not hang out with Kody.
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But I really do want to see
them really badly.
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They're kinda up to the point
where we can't keep away
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from the family.
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I think Janelle is
full of [bleeped]
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and this is why
she's full of [bleeped].
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Because the kids aren't seeing
each other all the time anyway.
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[Janelle] If he wants to throw
the whole family
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under the bus, that's fine.
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[Kody] She doesn't want me
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coming down hard on her children
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for their lack of...
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observation of
the coronavirus protocols.
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You... You make your choice.
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My choice is going to be
whatever I think
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is going to make it so
I don't live with
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a life of regret
for some screw-up
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in a three-month time period versus
the 30 years of the rest of our lives.
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If Janelle and I come to
a conclusion
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that we're gonna let our kids
hang out with each other,
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that's gonna mean that Kody's
not going to come over.
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Everybody gets to make
their choice,
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but I will be making mine and,
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to be honest with you,
nobody's gonna dictate it
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to me.
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Kody is here now talking to us
and just saying,
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you know, you guys make
your own decision,
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I'm gonna make my own decision.
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I would rather see us
all work together,
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make a decision together
rather than...
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him or anybody just being like,
"Oh, do your thing. I'll do my thing.
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Whatever, we'll just
all do our own thing."
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What if there's some sort of
middle ground?
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I mean, the weather's gonna be
so beautiful.
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What if the five of us,
at least,
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drove our cars somewhere and...
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To the property? Should we
go have a picnic five feet apart?
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- Everybody has to bring their own food, I guess.
- Six feet.
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Like, I'll be, like,
your own picnic lunch
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that we eat together,
right? or something.
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Exactly. I think as adults,
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we could do it just fine.
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So, at least, there's a plan
to see each other, physically.
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That's good.
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[Kody] I'm willing to try it,
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but...
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you know, in the midst of
a pandemic,
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it seems like risky behavior.
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We... We haven't solved
this problem.
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There's some underlying
lack of trust
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within the family.
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Those who don't believe that
coronavirus can cause harm
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are not trusting those who
are following
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sort of
the draconian recommendations
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of the government.
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Guys, I need to get going.
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Bye, everybody.
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[Kody] This car is buried.
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- It's impossible.
- [Christine] Wow, she really is stuck.
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All I know is that I wish
I owned a tractor.
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[Kody] Coyote Pass is a reference
that we make to the property
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that we bought
here in Flagstaff.
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That's kind of where
the family likes to go
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when we socialize.
We do picnics out there.
243
00:11:20,913 --> 00:11:22,447
We hang out there a little bit.
244
00:11:22,481 --> 00:11:25,950
But we plan to build
homes there.
245
00:11:25,984 --> 00:11:30,422
But because it's really
a year process for building,
246
00:11:30,456 --> 00:11:33,258
and then you've
also gotta finance,
247
00:11:33,292 --> 00:11:35,927
we are really not
in a position to do it yet.
248
00:11:36,996 --> 00:11:40,932
Gwendlyn took her car out
to the property
249
00:11:40,966 --> 00:11:43,234
'cause her and Ysabel want to
go out there and have fun.
250
00:11:43,269 --> 00:11:48,440
And I gave her this
little lecture about um...
251
00:11:48,474 --> 00:11:50,942
you know, how muddy it was
out there and to stay on the road.
252
00:11:50,976 --> 00:11:52,577
[chuckles] It's funny.
253
00:11:52,611 --> 00:11:54,979
She went out and got stuck.
254
00:11:55,014 --> 00:11:57,816
Mine and Christine's daughters
decide they needed to go do a picnic.
255
00:11:57,850 --> 00:12:00,118
So, Ysabel, Gwendlyn and Truely
256
00:12:00,152 --> 00:12:02,987
went out to Coyote Pass
when it was muddy,
257
00:12:03,022 --> 00:12:05,890
and they got
themselves stuck so bad
258
00:12:05,925 --> 00:12:08,126
that you know, they...
They can't get it out.
259
00:12:08,160 --> 00:12:09,661
Christine's been out
to check it out.
260
00:12:09,695 --> 00:12:10,929
She's, like,
"I can't get it out."
261
00:12:10,996 --> 00:12:14,799
So, we're going today now,
to see if we can't
262
00:12:14,834 --> 00:12:19,070
pull them out with...
With more tools.
263
00:12:19,772 --> 00:12:20,972
Get them out of that mess.
264
00:12:24,510 --> 00:12:26,211
[Kody] Here we are
at Coyote Pass.
265
00:12:27,480 --> 00:12:31,149
Coming up on
Gwendlyn's handiwork.
266
00:12:32,818 --> 00:12:35,186
[laughs]
267
00:12:35,221 --> 00:12:37,489
[Robyn] There's this car
out there, just kind of
268
00:12:37,523 --> 00:12:39,524
halfway sunk into ground.
269
00:12:39,558 --> 00:12:40,992
I actually drove over there
to see it.
270
00:12:41,026 --> 00:12:44,195
And it is like deep,
deep in the mud.
271
00:12:44,230 --> 00:12:45,663
[Kody laughs]
272
00:12:46,599 --> 00:12:48,032
Looks like they tried
to get out.
273
00:12:48,067 --> 00:12:51,436
Oh-oh!
274
00:12:51,470 --> 00:12:54,038
It is up to the axle.
275
00:12:54,073 --> 00:12:56,141
This car is buried.
276
00:12:56,175 --> 00:13:01,546
[laughing] I mean, It's...
It's impossible.
277
00:13:01,580 --> 00:13:03,982
[laughing]
278
00:13:04,016 --> 00:13:07,418
Coming out here... I'm sorry.
279
00:13:07,453 --> 00:13:09,187
Literally, the frame of the car
280
00:13:09,221 --> 00:13:11,189
is floating on the ground,
281
00:13:11,223 --> 00:13:13,958
and the tires
are spinning freely.
282
00:13:13,993 --> 00:13:15,760
[Christine] I came out here
a few days ago.
283
00:13:15,795 --> 00:13:18,029
[Kody] Why do you blame
the tractors?
284
00:13:22,067 --> 00:13:25,236
Not yourself for
not staying on the road?
285
00:13:25,271 --> 00:13:27,272
If I had a tractor,
I'd use a tractor.
286
00:13:27,306 --> 00:13:28,840
But to ask my neighbor to come
and do it
287
00:13:28,874 --> 00:13:32,477
would be sheer embarrassment
for me.
288
00:13:32,511 --> 00:13:33,978
It needs a tractor.
289
00:13:34,914 --> 00:13:37,482
[engine whirring]
290
00:13:39,251 --> 00:13:42,821
[Janelle] Wow, my God.
She really is stuck.
291
00:13:42,855 --> 00:13:45,290
- Wow.
- [engine whirring]
292
00:13:48,060 --> 00:13:50,762
All I know is that I wish
I owned a tractor.
293
00:13:50,796 --> 00:13:52,730
- [Christine] We dug through...
- Is there a shovel in there?
294
00:13:52,765 --> 00:13:53,865
Did you bring a shovel?
295
00:13:53,933 --> 00:13:58,536
If I am unsuccessful here,
she will go get the neighbor
296
00:13:58,571 --> 00:14:02,841
and she will tell the neighbor
that she did all this stupid.
297
00:14:02,875 --> 00:14:05,076
- [laughs]
- And that she needs
298
00:14:05,110 --> 00:14:08,479
the neighbor to rescue her
from stupid because...
299
00:14:08,514 --> 00:14:11,015
- And if she mentions my name...
- I won't. I will not.
300
00:14:11,050 --> 00:14:12,383
I would not betray you.
301
00:14:12,418 --> 00:14:13,751
Don't you have a husband?
302
00:14:13,786 --> 00:14:16,421
- Oh.
- Oh, he looked at this and said...
303
00:14:16,455 --> 00:14:17,856
And I wouldn't even say that.
304
00:14:17,890 --> 00:14:19,991
He'd go, "Don't you have a
husband?" I'd just go,
305
00:14:20,025 --> 00:14:21,960
"He's at another woman's house."
306
00:14:21,994 --> 00:14:24,863
- Oh yeah, that one would work.
- [laughs]
307
00:14:24,897 --> 00:14:27,532
This area needs to be
cleared out.
308
00:14:27,566 --> 00:14:30,735
[Robyn] You know what's
ironic? Kody...
309
00:14:30,769 --> 00:14:33,238
used to say all the time
in Las Vegas,
310
00:14:33,272 --> 00:14:36,040
that he wanted to move somewhere
so he could go with his kids
311
00:14:36,075 --> 00:14:37,742
and play in the dirt and mud.
312
00:14:41,113 --> 00:14:42,714
[Kody] Yeah, go ahead
and start it, Christine.
313
00:14:44,950 --> 00:14:46,317
The battery's dead?
314
00:14:46,352 --> 00:14:49,587
Yeah, I don't know if it could
get any worse than this right now.
315
00:14:50,122 --> 00:14:51,522
[Kody] Go.
316
00:14:52,057 --> 00:14:54,859
[engine revving]
317
00:14:54,894 --> 00:14:58,496
I mean, the car, it is so old.
Like, it was 15 years old
318
00:14:58,530 --> 00:15:00,131
when we bought it for Maddie
in high school.
319
00:15:00,165 --> 00:15:01,432
It's been through its kids.
320
00:15:01,467 --> 00:15:04,702
- I'm not sure it will survive beyond Gwen.
- [indistinct]
321
00:15:04,737 --> 00:15:06,437
- Tell Mom to give it a little bit of gas.
- Okay,
322
00:15:06,472 --> 00:15:07,805
give it a little bit of gas!
323
00:15:08,340 --> 00:15:10,508
[engine whirring]
324
00:15:11,710 --> 00:15:13,511
Oh, yeah, baby.
325
00:15:18,350 --> 00:15:19,450
That was a blast.
326
00:15:19,485 --> 00:15:21,986
Mom, you did so good.
How are you feeling right now?
327
00:15:22,021 --> 00:15:24,422
- I was so excited!
- How are you feeling right now?
328
00:15:24,456 --> 00:15:26,157
Did you see that?
329
00:15:26,191 --> 00:15:28,192
[Kody] I realized the girls
are congratulating Mom
330
00:15:28,227 --> 00:15:29,994
on the great job she did.
331
00:15:30,029 --> 00:15:31,362
I don't care who gets
the praise.
332
00:15:31,397 --> 00:15:32,764
Now I get to go home.
333
00:15:33,699 --> 00:15:35,400
Yeah, I'm getting a tractor
out of this.
334
00:15:35,434 --> 00:15:37,168
A pickup out of this,
335
00:15:37,202 --> 00:15:39,671
- and maybe a four-wheeler.
- [Christine] And maybe I'll get a kiss out of this.
336
00:15:40,506 --> 00:15:41,439
There's my kiss.
337
00:15:45,077 --> 00:15:46,945
[Janelle] You know, I've been
thinking a lot
338
00:15:46,979 --> 00:15:49,480
about how our communication
as a family is going.
339
00:15:49,515 --> 00:15:53,017
And I had brought that up at dinner
with the adults a little while ago.
340
00:15:53,052 --> 00:15:56,654
And it... It was interesting
how it was taken.
341
00:15:56,689 --> 00:15:59,424
Do you want to have
a relationship
342
00:15:59,458 --> 00:16:00,758
with your sister wife?
343
00:16:02,361 --> 00:16:04,696
[Janelle] I think maybe that's
why I've started to think about this.
344
00:16:04,730 --> 00:16:07,165
'Cause I want something
different than what we have.
345
00:16:09,101 --> 00:16:14,739
This pandemic has sort of...
underscored this breakdown
346
00:16:14,773 --> 00:16:17,775
that we have in how
we communicate with each other
347
00:16:17,810 --> 00:16:20,912
as adults in the family.
348
00:16:20,946 --> 00:16:25,950
What can I change that makes
the communication go better?
349
00:16:30,089 --> 00:16:31,389
[Robyn] Today, Janelle
was asking me
350
00:16:31,423 --> 00:16:33,491
to come over to her house
and just kind of chat,
351
00:16:33,525 --> 00:16:36,661
like talk to me
a little bit about,
352
00:16:36,695 --> 00:16:38,062
I don't know,
what's been going on.
353
00:16:38,097 --> 00:16:40,531
I'm not really sure, exactly.
354
00:16:40,566 --> 00:16:42,900
- [Janelle] Hey.
- Hey, I'm here. Do you want...
355
00:16:42,935 --> 00:16:45,503
[Janelle] Oh, cool. Do you know
what? come through the RV gate.
356
00:16:45,537 --> 00:16:47,138
- On the side of the house, if you want.
- Okay.
357
00:16:47,172 --> 00:16:49,073
[Janelle] Since we had
a conversation
358
00:16:49,108 --> 00:16:50,942
via video-conferencing
or whatever, and
359
00:16:50,976 --> 00:16:53,511
we all decided that it would
be potentially workable
360
00:16:53,545 --> 00:16:56,314
for us all to get together
and meet, socially distanced.
361
00:16:56,348 --> 00:16:58,016
- Hi!
- [Janelle] Hi.
362
00:16:58,050 --> 00:16:59,917
I felt like this was a great
opportunity to kinda
363
00:16:59,952 --> 00:17:01,252
give that a test run.
364
00:17:01,286 --> 00:17:03,087
I'm actually really grateful
365
00:17:03,122 --> 00:17:05,957
that we have figured out a way
for us to see each other.
366
00:17:05,991 --> 00:17:07,959
- [Robyn] Tomatoes.
- Tomatoes. Look, how good they're doing.
367
00:17:07,993 --> 00:17:08,760
[Robyn] Those peppers,
368
00:17:08,794 --> 00:17:10,161
- right there?
- No, basil.
369
00:17:10,195 --> 00:17:11,929
- [Robyn] Basil...
- [Janelle] One change sometimes, is a catalyst
370
00:17:11,964 --> 00:17:13,431
for other changes.
371
00:17:13,465 --> 00:17:15,066
We signed up for plural marriage
372
00:17:15,100 --> 00:17:17,535
because we thought that
this made us better.
373
00:17:17,569 --> 00:17:21,272
And if you don't ever take advantages
of trying to be better yourself,
374
00:17:21,306 --> 00:17:22,840
then why are you doing it?
375
00:17:24,276 --> 00:17:25,276
I've realized...
376
00:17:26,645 --> 00:17:29,680
at 51, I think I'm ready
to turn over a new leaf
377
00:17:29,715 --> 00:17:32,683
as far as some
of my communication skills.
378
00:17:32,718 --> 00:17:34,819
And so that's kinda
what I really was gonna...
379
00:17:34,853 --> 00:17:36,921
There's no really easy way
to bring this up.
380
00:17:36,955 --> 00:17:41,559
I think I get so excited about
what I want.
381
00:17:41,593 --> 00:17:44,295
I think maybe,
my conversations get...
382
00:17:44,329 --> 00:17:46,597
They probably come off
as aggressive.
383
00:17:46,632 --> 00:17:49,934
I need to be more willing to hear what
everybody has to say, you know, just...
384
00:17:51,002 --> 00:17:52,603
And that's hard
'cause we all have,
385
00:17:52,638 --> 00:17:54,472
there's a lot of opinions.
386
00:17:54,506 --> 00:17:57,241
I think it's a culture
in plural families, too.
387
00:17:57,276 --> 00:17:58,843
-With women.
-You think? [both] Yeah.
388
00:17:58,877 --> 00:18:01,646
I think they... They feel like
they've gotta fight for their,
389
00:18:01,680 --> 00:18:03,281
um, their position.
390
00:18:03,315 --> 00:18:06,717
The conversations with
the five of us are,
391
00:18:06,752 --> 00:18:08,653
like, I go home
with a stomachache,
392
00:18:08,687 --> 00:18:10,655
- like, almost every single time.
- Mmm-hmm.
393
00:18:10,689 --> 00:18:12,657
COVID is really...
394
00:18:12,691 --> 00:18:16,661
magnifying our communication
breakdown issues.
395
00:18:16,695 --> 00:18:20,364
You know, there's a lot of unsafe
conversations that happen in this family.
396
00:18:23,068 --> 00:18:26,471
We're just not really talking
to each other about COVID.
397
00:18:26,505 --> 00:18:28,005
We're talking at each other.
398
00:18:28,040 --> 00:18:29,273
I think sometimes,
399
00:18:29,308 --> 00:18:31,075
you just are quiet
and I'm just like,
400
00:18:31,110 --> 00:18:32,777
- ram, ram, ram!
- [laughs]
401
00:18:32,811 --> 00:18:34,912
This is great, this is great,
this is great.
402
00:18:34,947 --> 00:18:35,847
It's all exuberance.
403
00:18:35,881 --> 00:18:39,050
But I know it can seem like
I'm forcing.
404
00:18:39,084 --> 00:18:40,818
- So...
- [Robyn] I'm just, uh,
405
00:18:40,853 --> 00:18:44,233
I'm a little more quiet.
I, um...
406
00:18:44,257 --> 00:18:48,192
I have a tendency
to be... cautious
407
00:18:48,227 --> 00:18:50,328
- of what I'm saying.
- I would like if you would say more.
408
00:18:50,362 --> 00:18:51,362
[laughs]
409
00:18:52,564 --> 00:18:55,533
[Robyn] More than likely
when I have a beef with Kody...
410
00:18:55,567 --> 00:18:56,868
Okay, let's just say that.
411
00:18:56,902 --> 00:18:58,136
It's rare that I fight with him,
412
00:18:58,170 --> 00:19:01,539
I... I probably could name
413
00:19:01,573 --> 00:19:03,674
five real fights in the last...
414
00:19:03,709 --> 00:19:05,843
10, 11 years we've been together
415
00:19:05,878 --> 00:19:08,379
on my hand, like,
probably five real fights.
416
00:19:08,413 --> 00:19:09,847
Maybe not even that.
417
00:19:11,383 --> 00:19:13,251
You know, I was, I was
married before.
418
00:19:14,119 --> 00:19:16,387
And in that marriage,
419
00:19:16,421 --> 00:19:18,656
there was a lot of fighting
and there was a lot of pain.
420
00:19:22,094 --> 00:19:24,962
I promised myself that
as I came out of my divorce,
421
00:19:24,997 --> 00:19:27,131
that I was like, if I ever
marry again,
422
00:19:27,166 --> 00:19:29,567
I'm just gonna be more
cautious and more careful.
423
00:19:30,702 --> 00:19:32,503
I think we need to figure out
how to have
424
00:19:32,538 --> 00:19:33,838
these conversations.
425
00:19:33,872 --> 00:19:37,341
- Yeah.
- Not, not the actual conversation,
426
00:19:37,376 --> 00:19:40,878
but, like, how to have
a conversation. [laughs]
427
00:19:40,913 --> 00:19:42,146
I mean, you're talking about
428
00:19:42,181 --> 00:19:43,981
changing the way we communicate.
429
00:19:44,016 --> 00:19:46,918
I would love to change
it dramatically.
430
00:19:46,952 --> 00:19:50,288
I'm relieved that Janelle's
saying, hey, let's...
431
00:19:50,322 --> 00:19:53,925
you know, maybe what we're
doing isn't working.
432
00:19:55,027 --> 00:19:56,794
Can we figure out a better way?
433
00:19:56,828 --> 00:19:59,830
I mean, yes, I'm 100%, you know,
434
00:20:01,233 --> 00:20:02,500
feel the same way.
435
00:20:03,502 --> 00:20:04,936
The next time
we all get together,
436
00:20:05,404 --> 00:20:06,704
we need to
437
00:20:06,738 --> 00:20:09,006
have a real discussion about
some ground rules
438
00:20:09,041 --> 00:20:10,841
for our conversations.
439
00:20:10,876 --> 00:20:12,777
- Yeah.
- [Janelle] I feel really good
440
00:20:12,811 --> 00:20:15,246
after the conversation
I had with Robyn.
441
00:20:15,280 --> 00:20:17,715
We are coming at everything
that's going on
442
00:20:17,749 --> 00:20:19,217
with a little bit
different perspective.
443
00:20:19,251 --> 00:20:21,519
But the one core thing that
we do agree on
444
00:20:21,553 --> 00:20:24,622
is that we want
the family to be long term.
445
00:20:24,656 --> 00:20:26,290
'Cause I think the whole idea
that we're a unit
446
00:20:26,325 --> 00:20:28,259
and we continue to make
these decisions together
447
00:20:28,293 --> 00:20:30,294
is what defines
our family structure.
448
00:20:30,329 --> 00:20:33,731
Otherwise, we're just a bunch of
monogamists who share a husband.
449
00:20:37,436 --> 00:20:40,471
We've had a rough relationship
for a couple of years.
450
00:20:40,505 --> 00:20:43,307
Plural marriage is a challenge
that she doesn't enjoy.
451
00:20:43,342 --> 00:20:44,342
I'll be frank,
452
00:20:44,376 --> 00:20:46,277
plural marriage is not
a challenge that I enjoy.
453
00:20:53,452 --> 00:20:55,953
[Janelle] It's been nice.
Kody's been here for a few days.
454
00:20:55,988 --> 00:20:57,788
He was gone for five weeks.
455
00:20:57,823 --> 00:21:00,091
I have some kids that are
working outside the home,
456
00:21:00,125 --> 00:21:02,193
and seeing people outside
of the home.
457
00:21:02,227 --> 00:21:05,630
So I asked him to stay away long
enough for me to kind of get a handle on
458
00:21:05,664 --> 00:21:08,232
if they were gonna be bringing
COVID home or,
459
00:21:08,267 --> 00:21:10,201
and it seems
like it's all been fine.
460
00:21:10,235 --> 00:21:13,337
Kody and I both feel like it's
okay for him to come home now.
461
00:21:13,372 --> 00:21:16,140
Christine's birthday date is
way overdue,
462
00:21:16,174 --> 00:21:19,176
and he needs to leave
and kind of go there.
463
00:21:19,211 --> 00:21:21,078
But you know, Hunter will be
home shortly,
464
00:21:21,146 --> 00:21:22,313
and it will be very...
465
00:21:22,347 --> 00:21:24,548
It will be a real bright
spot for my household.
466
00:21:25,917 --> 00:21:29,887
[Kody] Today, I made
it to, uh, Christine's house.
467
00:21:29,921 --> 00:21:32,423
Um, left Janelle's.
468
00:21:32,457 --> 00:21:38,496
And our reunion was lovely.
It was not...
469
00:21:38,530 --> 00:21:41,299
I was getting all vulnerable
and silly because I was,
470
00:21:41,333 --> 00:21:44,135
it'd been so long since we'd
seen each other.
471
00:21:44,169 --> 00:21:49,140
But we tried to figure out how
long it had been since...
472
00:21:49,174 --> 00:21:51,942
if we had ever gone
that long before,
473
00:21:51,977 --> 00:21:53,577
without seeing each other.
474
00:21:53,612 --> 00:21:54,712
I'm pretty independent.
475
00:21:54,746 --> 00:21:56,480
Like, when he's gone,
I miss him but it's not like,
476
00:21:56,515 --> 00:21:58,816
I kind of enjoy my freedom.
477
00:21:58,850 --> 00:22:00,951
But then I realize that
when he comes back
478
00:22:00,986 --> 00:22:03,220
how much I kinda miss him.
479
00:22:03,255 --> 00:22:07,558
I'm sort of making up for
Christine's birthday today.
480
00:22:08,160 --> 00:22:10,094
Because on her birthday,
481
00:22:10,128 --> 00:22:13,264
I was with Janelle
for Hunter's graduation.
482
00:22:14,433 --> 00:22:15,800
I'm just picking Christine up.
483
00:22:15,834 --> 00:22:17,568
We're just... She's just gonna
come out.
484
00:22:17,602 --> 00:22:19,370
We're just gonna go on a date.
485
00:22:19,404 --> 00:22:22,039
- Hey. How's it going?
- Want to come in? Hey.
486
00:22:22,074 --> 00:22:24,141
[Christine] About the only
thing you can do during COVID
487
00:22:24,176 --> 00:22:26,077
are long drives
for birthday dates.
488
00:22:26,111 --> 00:22:28,479
So, that's what we are doing
today. I'm super excited.
489
00:22:28,513 --> 00:22:30,792
We love road trips.
It'll be great.
490
00:22:30,816 --> 00:22:32,316
- All right.
- [Christine] Excited?
491
00:22:32,351 --> 00:22:34,185
We are out of here, Mrs. Brown.
492
00:22:34,219 --> 00:22:35,686
- Are you excited?
- [Christine] Yes, yes,
493
00:22:35,721 --> 00:22:37,088
- I'm really excited.
- Alrighty.
494
00:22:42,627 --> 00:22:44,128
Christine and I have
a lot of fun
495
00:22:44,162 --> 00:22:45,262
adventuring together.
496
00:22:45,297 --> 00:22:47,398
And we have a lot of fun when
we don't have a plan.
497
00:22:50,502 --> 00:22:51,769
We're just hitting the road,
498
00:22:51,803 --> 00:22:54,305
and we're gonna look for
the prettiest spots we can find.
499
00:22:59,477 --> 00:23:02,580
[Christine] All of the adults
went to Sedona years ago.
500
00:23:02,614 --> 00:23:04,081
And I think it was one
of the first times
501
00:23:04,116 --> 00:23:06,317
we ever met Nancy,
who's our therapist.
502
00:23:06,351 --> 00:23:08,185
I mean, it wasn't fun.
503
00:23:08,220 --> 00:23:10,955
[Kody] I want all of us to put
our arms around each other.
504
00:23:10,989 --> 00:23:14,859
- And I want all of us to put our foreheads together.
- [Janelle laughs]
505
00:23:14,893 --> 00:23:17,728
So that everybody is connected.
506
00:23:17,763 --> 00:23:20,631
And is that what you guys
really want?
507
00:23:20,665 --> 00:23:23,167
- Yes.
- [Kody] I think that is our ultimate goal.
508
00:23:23,201 --> 00:23:25,169
I hope today is more fun.
509
00:23:25,203 --> 00:23:26,604
We're just gonna look
at scenery.
510
00:23:26,638 --> 00:23:28,906
We're not taking Nancy with us.
511
00:23:28,940 --> 00:23:30,241
It's just gonna
be the two of us.
512
00:23:32,010 --> 00:23:34,545
Do you think we're going
too far with our family?
513
00:23:34,579 --> 00:23:35,880
What do you mean?
514
00:23:35,914 --> 00:23:37,948
I think that we're just, I don't
think we should be separated.
515
00:23:37,983 --> 00:23:40,384
What I feel like my family is
constantly doing
516
00:23:40,419 --> 00:23:43,754
is using emotion
against... science.
517
00:23:43,789 --> 00:23:45,756
The virus doesn't care about
our emotion.
518
00:23:45,791 --> 00:23:48,225
Everybody has to be
accountable for it.
519
00:23:48,260 --> 00:23:50,628
And everybody has to accept
the question...
520
00:23:50,662 --> 00:23:52,763
Have you been accountable?
521
00:23:52,798 --> 00:23:57,635
Are you being... are you
social distancing?
522
00:23:57,669 --> 00:24:04,508
It feels like I'm policing
the entire situation.
523
00:24:04,543 --> 00:24:07,011
And I'm like this lifeguard
that keeps
524
00:24:07,045 --> 00:24:09,113
kicking kids out of the pool.
525
00:24:09,147 --> 00:24:12,349
Because they can't sit
and play nice in the pool.
526
00:24:12,384 --> 00:24:14,718
Even if Maddie
and the grandkids come,
527
00:24:14,753 --> 00:24:17,021
Kody, I'm not staying
away from them.
528
00:24:17,055 --> 00:24:19,356
I have a lot of other kids in
my life, too.
529
00:24:19,391 --> 00:24:23,093
And some of those other kids
belong to other moms.
530
00:24:23,128 --> 00:24:26,564
But if Maddie comes and brings
Axel and Evie,
531
00:24:26,598 --> 00:24:28,332
What? I can't hold them?
532
00:24:28,366 --> 00:24:31,035
I mean, by Kody's rules, I
shouldn't even see them, then.
533
00:24:31,069 --> 00:24:33,370
- Maddie asked me to...
- Christine, you're talking about a dilemma
534
00:24:33,405 --> 00:24:36,807
that is more confusing for
people than polygamy is.
535
00:24:36,842 --> 00:24:38,175
- [laughs]
- Okay?
536
00:24:38,210 --> 00:24:40,277
- I just think...
- No, really. This is a dilemma
537
00:24:40,312 --> 00:24:42,880
that is extremely confusing
for all people.
538
00:24:42,914 --> 00:24:44,915
It's not more complicated
than polygamy.
539
00:24:44,950 --> 00:24:46,784
I'm sorry, that's ridiculous.
540
00:24:46,818 --> 00:24:49,753
If it was illegal to
visit people,
541
00:24:49,788 --> 00:24:51,822
then maybe I'd have
to think about it differently.
542
00:24:54,759 --> 00:24:58,062
- [Kody] All right. Let's put the top up?
- [Christine] Okay.
543
00:24:58,096 --> 00:25:02,032
- We might still get a sunset.
- Okay, we're gonna get a sunset.
544
00:25:02,067 --> 00:25:03,868
Tell you what, it's all about
a convertible,
545
00:25:03,902 --> 00:25:05,636
magical song and the sunset.
546
00:25:05,670 --> 00:25:07,838
That's the magic.
547
00:25:11,977 --> 00:25:14,311
[Christine] See the sunset? Run.
548
00:25:14,346 --> 00:25:16,514
[indistinct]
549
00:25:16,548 --> 00:25:17,781
Watch the cars.
550
00:25:20,218 --> 00:25:23,988
Oh, God. I think the sunset's
going to be good.
551
00:25:24,022 --> 00:25:26,790
[Christine] This is epic. It's beautiful,
right? We're just looking over Sedona.
552
00:25:26,825 --> 00:25:30,160
It's gorgeous here.
It's beautiful.
553
00:25:37,235 --> 00:25:39,737
[Christine] We've had a rough
relationship for a couple of years.
554
00:25:39,771 --> 00:25:42,106
Ever since, well...
555
00:25:42,140 --> 00:25:45,242
I guess, the big blow-up
about living in one house.
556
00:25:45,277 --> 00:25:47,389
And it's really been strained
since then.
557
00:25:47,413 --> 00:25:49,280
It honestly has.
It's been strained since then.
558
00:25:49,314 --> 00:25:51,081
So, and here we go.
559
00:25:51,116 --> 00:25:53,150
- There's the house.
- Wow...
560
00:25:53,184 --> 00:25:55,419
- Wow.
- [Truely] That's a big house.
561
00:25:55,453 --> 00:25:57,254
[Christine] Why didn't he
listen to everything that I said
562
00:25:57,289 --> 00:25:58,455
for the past, like,
five or six years?
563
00:25:58,490 --> 00:26:00,324
I don't want to live
together again.
564
00:26:02,160 --> 00:26:05,095
I told him point blank that was
something I would never do again.
565
00:26:05,130 --> 00:26:07,298
And then it's like he didn't
even care.
566
00:26:07,332 --> 00:26:09,700
I just thought, okay, well,
I'm just last
567
00:26:09,734 --> 00:26:12,136
on his list of important people.
568
00:26:12,737 --> 00:26:14,772
[wind blowing]
569
00:26:18,543 --> 00:26:21,378
[Kody] Instead of rejecting Christine's
complaints about plural marriage,
570
00:26:21,413 --> 00:26:23,180
I've opened myself up to them
571
00:26:23,214 --> 00:26:25,015
so that I can validate where
she's at,
572
00:26:25,050 --> 00:26:26,750
and have a deeper understanding.
573
00:26:26,785 --> 00:26:29,286
And it's very much unraveled
plural marriage for me.
574
00:26:29,321 --> 00:26:31,088
And it's made me a little
bit cynical.
575
00:26:31,723 --> 00:26:34,992
There's this... This belief
576
00:26:35,026 --> 00:26:38,562
in our religion of
this sort of thought process
577
00:26:38,597 --> 00:26:41,098
of endure to the end.
578
00:26:41,132 --> 00:26:43,934
I'm looking back at nearly
30 years of plural marriage,
579
00:26:43,969 --> 00:26:46,804
of marriage, in general,
of our family.
580
00:26:46,838 --> 00:26:48,817
And it has been sort of
581
00:26:48,841 --> 00:26:50,941
an endure to the end experience.
582
00:26:50,976 --> 00:26:52,776
Looking forward to your death
583
00:26:52,811 --> 00:26:55,713
so you can meet the Almighty
and go see how I endured
584
00:26:55,747 --> 00:26:58,415
all the personalities here?
585
00:26:58,450 --> 00:27:00,417
[Christine] He always talks
about his big picture,
586
00:27:00,452 --> 00:27:04,788
and I just think that if I am
in that big picture,
587
00:27:04,823 --> 00:27:06,123
I'm just a really small spot.
588
00:27:07,659 --> 00:27:11,929
It seems more and more that
589
00:27:11,963 --> 00:27:15,866
plural marriage is a challenge
that she doesn't enjoy.
590
00:27:17,168 --> 00:27:18,235
And I'll be frank,
591
00:27:18,269 --> 00:27:20,404
plural marriage is not
a challenge that I enjoy.
592
00:27:24,542 --> 00:27:28,846
More than anything
with Kody is...
593
00:27:28,880 --> 00:27:30,781
I don't feel like
I'm very important to him.
594
00:27:34,519 --> 00:27:36,020
[Kody] Some of
the difficulties that we have
595
00:27:36,054 --> 00:27:38,088
in marriage or
in plural marriage
596
00:27:38,123 --> 00:27:40,024
may be unreconcilable.
597
00:27:40,058 --> 00:27:43,394
I just don't know what
this means for our future.
598
00:27:46,464 --> 00:27:48,866
[Robyn] I have days
when I'm baby hungry
599
00:27:48,900 --> 00:27:50,567
and I really want another baby.
600
00:27:50,602 --> 00:27:52,670
[Kody] If you're trying
to commit me,
601
00:27:52,704 --> 00:27:56,306
like right now, and
I'd have to really focus.
602
00:27:56,341 --> 00:28:00,678
What she's doing is, "You gotta
decide if you wanna have more kids."
603
00:28:06,584 --> 00:28:08,652
[Robyn] So, are you okay to
have a discussion?
604
00:28:08,687 --> 00:28:11,355
[Kody] You know, like, a lot of times,
when any of my wives would say,
605
00:28:11,389 --> 00:28:13,590
"Hey, I need to have a chat
with you." I'd be like,
606
00:28:13,625 --> 00:28:16,160
"Okay, what have I...
Am I in trouble?"
607
00:28:16,194 --> 00:28:19,063
- [Robyn] Let's just sit right over here.
- Okay.
608
00:28:19,097 --> 00:28:22,166
Robyn's always really good
about taking the time
609
00:28:22,200 --> 00:28:23,634
to get me to understand
the paradigms
610
00:28:23,668 --> 00:28:26,103
and understanding
the viewpoints of others.
611
00:28:28,640 --> 00:28:31,208
So... [laughs]
612
00:28:32,610 --> 00:28:36,947
- Darling... [laughs]
- Yes, dear?
613
00:28:36,981 --> 00:28:39,183
I actually don't know what
Robyn wants to talk about today.
614
00:28:40,185 --> 00:28:42,630
You know how,
like a couple years ago,
615
00:28:42,654 --> 00:28:46,190
when we went back to Vegas
for a little, you know,
616
00:28:46,224 --> 00:28:49,026
a little like, trip and I said,
617
00:28:50,061 --> 00:28:51,929
I said,
"Are we done having kids?"
618
00:28:53,832 --> 00:28:57,167
We both kind of went, uh, "I
think no. I think we're done."
619
00:28:58,203 --> 00:28:59,603
I'm 41 years old.
620
00:28:59,637 --> 00:29:01,205
We need to decide this now.
621
00:29:01,239 --> 00:29:03,507
Like, there is
a biological clock ticking.
622
00:29:03,541 --> 00:29:06,744
I'm not getting younger. We
can't sit here and stall out on this
623
00:29:06,778 --> 00:29:08,612
if this is what we're gonna do.
624
00:29:09,848 --> 00:29:12,249
I have days when I'm baby hungry
625
00:29:12,283 --> 00:29:14,818
and I really want another baby.
626
00:29:14,853 --> 00:29:17,654
And you keep making comments
and jokes
627
00:29:17,689 --> 00:29:20,958
and then,
"I don't know if I'm done."
628
00:29:20,992 --> 00:29:25,629
- Are you calling me out sort of?
- A little... yeah. [laughs]
629
00:29:25,663 --> 00:29:27,598
I brought you out to say...
630
00:29:29,400 --> 00:29:31,568
What is going on?
631
00:29:31,603 --> 00:29:34,371
I feel 100% like I want
to have Kody's commitment
632
00:29:34,405 --> 00:29:35,405
'cause he is older.
633
00:29:35,440 --> 00:29:38,709
He's got wives that are,
like, completely done.
634
00:29:38,743 --> 00:29:40,677
If we're gonna have a baby,
we're both gonna be committed
635
00:29:40,712 --> 00:29:43,213
and you're gonna be holding
a baby.
636
00:29:43,248 --> 00:29:47,117
If you're trying
to commit me, like, right now,
637
00:29:47,152 --> 00:29:48,952
and I'd have to really focus.
638
00:29:50,555 --> 00:29:52,256
What she's doing is,
639
00:29:52,290 --> 00:29:55,459
"You gotta decide if you want
to have more kids."
640
00:29:55,493 --> 00:29:57,928
I'm caught in a
conundrum, completely.
641
00:29:57,962 --> 00:29:59,329
You know, this is what I've
always done.
642
00:29:59,364 --> 00:30:00,597
This is what I've always been.
643
00:30:00,632 --> 00:30:01,799
I've always been
644
00:30:01,833 --> 00:30:06,336
fathering and having special
experiences with little people
645
00:30:06,371 --> 00:30:08,539
- 'cause they're just, they're just...
- Yeah.
646
00:30:09,240 --> 00:30:10,240
They're sweet.
647
00:30:10,275 --> 00:30:14,144
Logan was born in two... in '94.
648
00:30:14,179 --> 00:30:17,781
We have 18 children between
basically all the adults.
649
00:30:17,816 --> 00:30:21,385
Children from 26 years old,
down to four years old.
650
00:30:21,419 --> 00:30:23,587
[indistinct chatter]
651
00:30:23,621 --> 00:30:28,325
I'm pretty sure that I've been
having kids for 26 years.
652
00:30:28,359 --> 00:30:32,162
There's this real joy about
having a little one.
653
00:30:32,197 --> 00:30:36,033
Ari's been such a...
just a wonderful experience.
654
00:30:36,067 --> 00:30:40,971
But at the same time,
I'm caught in this conflict.
655
00:30:41,005 --> 00:30:43,173
Because Ari's been weaned
for a year
656
00:30:43,208 --> 00:30:45,742
and she's still keeping
us up at night.
657
00:30:45,777 --> 00:30:49,680
- Started to get better once she was weaned and stuff.
- No, it's not better.
658
00:30:50,782 --> 00:30:53,150
Ari is four years old.
She just turned four,
659
00:30:53,184 --> 00:30:55,686
and she is, uh,
she's a night owl.
660
00:30:55,720 --> 00:30:57,254
She doesn't like to go to bed.
661
00:30:57,288 --> 00:30:59,289
And she's active
through the night.
662
00:31:00,325 --> 00:31:01,725
[Kody] She's a night owl.
663
00:31:01,759 --> 00:31:05,429
I'm literally having a hard time
keeping my head from wobbling.
664
00:31:05,463 --> 00:31:07,464
Ariella's jumping on the couch
665
00:31:07,498 --> 00:31:09,466
trying to find out how high
she can go.
666
00:31:11,569 --> 00:31:12,803
If I looked in the mirror,
667
00:31:12,837 --> 00:31:15,606
I would just see this guy
that looks like bloodshot eyes,
668
00:31:15,640 --> 00:31:17,307
hair is just frazzled.
669
00:31:17,342 --> 00:31:19,977
Can you just
go to sleep? [chuckles]
670
00:31:21,412 --> 00:31:23,614
It's mental exhaustion.
671
00:31:23,648 --> 00:31:26,950
You're arguing
with a four-year-old
672
00:31:26,985 --> 00:31:31,588
who has the words of a
10-year-old,
673
00:31:31,623 --> 00:31:34,291
and the logic of an idiot.
674
00:31:35,727 --> 00:31:37,961
Women talk about
that feeling of, like,
675
00:31:37,996 --> 00:31:41,064
"Oh, I'm done." I've never
really got that.
676
00:31:42,533 --> 00:31:46,036
You know when you're young
and, um...
677
00:31:46,070 --> 00:31:48,438
And you're just thinking about
having children and people will say,
678
00:31:48,473 --> 00:31:50,140
"How many kids you're
gonna have?"
679
00:31:50,174 --> 00:31:52,943
I would always say, "Just as
many as I'm supposed to have.
680
00:31:52,977 --> 00:31:55,145
As many as I've made
promises to."
681
00:31:55,179 --> 00:31:56,647
It is, it's a big deal to me.
682
00:31:57,982 --> 00:31:59,549
[sniffles]
683
00:31:59,584 --> 00:32:01,251
[tearfully] To make sure...
684
00:32:01,286 --> 00:32:03,220
To make sure all my babies
are here with me.
685
00:32:03,254 --> 00:32:04,955
That's all.
686
00:32:04,989 --> 00:32:08,992
In my head, I made promises to
a certain amount of children
687
00:32:09,027 --> 00:32:11,495
to be their mother,
you know, in the pre-life,
688
00:32:11,529 --> 00:32:15,165
and I wanna fulfill all
those promises.
689
00:32:15,233 --> 00:32:18,936
I wanna have a life with you
that's not just all about our kids.
690
00:32:18,970 --> 00:32:21,405
- Okay.
- What do you think about that, though?
691
00:32:21,439 --> 00:32:24,107
Do you feel like, hallelujah?
692
00:32:24,142 --> 00:32:26,543
I feel relieved and sad
at the same time.
693
00:32:32,216 --> 00:32:33,417
[Kody] She's mixed on this.
694
00:32:35,253 --> 00:32:37,487
I'm walking on eggshells here,
in a way,
695
00:32:38,523 --> 00:32:42,592
because I don't want to
discourage Robyn
696
00:32:42,627 --> 00:32:44,194
from us having a baby,
697
00:32:45,196 --> 00:32:48,231
if she feels a premonition
that we should.
698
00:32:49,133 --> 00:32:51,768
I don't know what it was
but I...
699
00:32:53,004 --> 00:32:58,275
had something, someone,
hanging around our room all day.
700
00:33:01,412 --> 00:33:04,314
I believe that we exist in
a spiritual form
701
00:33:04,349 --> 00:33:06,149
before we are born
and come to earth.
702
00:33:07,051 --> 00:33:09,786
I believe that
I have had interactions
703
00:33:09,821 --> 00:33:12,622
with some of my children you
know, when they were a spirit
704
00:33:12,657 --> 00:33:15,592
just to, you know,
before they were born.
705
00:33:15,626 --> 00:33:18,395
Just a little dark-haired boy.
706
00:33:18,429 --> 00:33:19,896
- Really?
- [Robyn] Mmm-hmm.
707
00:33:23,101 --> 00:33:27,104
There's this crazy fear in my
head... [sighs]
708
00:33:29,140 --> 00:33:31,174
That I'll leave somebody behind.
709
00:33:31,209 --> 00:33:34,644
- You have not helped me answer this question.
- [laughs]
710
00:33:34,679 --> 00:33:37,047
[Kody] I felt like we...
The decision's made
711
00:33:37,081 --> 00:33:39,082
and then she blows me
out of the water
712
00:33:39,117 --> 00:33:42,052
with a visual
of a dark-haired boy.
713
00:33:44,255 --> 00:33:46,890
Now, if we got a blonde
girl... [laughs]
714
00:33:46,924 --> 00:33:49,493
If we decide to do it and
we got a blonde girl...
715
00:33:49,527 --> 00:33:51,194
we'd go, "All right",
716
00:33:51,229 --> 00:33:54,765
"we have somebody from somebody
else's pile now," you know?
717
00:33:54,799 --> 00:33:57,501
My blond hair really comes
out in the kids.
718
00:33:57,535 --> 00:33:59,069
So, I doubt that we'd have
a dark-haired boy.
719
00:33:59,103 --> 00:34:01,571
Maybe we're supposed
to adopt, I have no idea.
720
00:34:01,606 --> 00:34:05,308
Adoption was never an option 'cause
we were having our own children.
721
00:34:05,343 --> 00:34:07,644
But now that we're winding
up here,
722
00:34:07,678 --> 00:34:09,946
the idea of adoption
is something that would be
723
00:34:09,981 --> 00:34:11,648
more appealing to me.
724
00:34:13,551 --> 00:34:15,886
And well, if you don't
feel done,
725
00:34:15,920 --> 00:34:18,155
maybe we need to think
about this some more.
726
00:34:18,189 --> 00:34:21,825
If I don't know that I'm done,
maybe we need to make sure.
727
00:34:22,693 --> 00:34:24,594
I don't know what else to do
with it.
728
00:34:24,629 --> 00:34:28,131
Because I don't have
a strong answer either way.
729
00:34:35,807 --> 00:34:38,542
It's hard to get together
and feel like I still matter,
730
00:34:38,576 --> 00:34:40,210
I'm still important.
731
00:34:40,244 --> 00:34:43,313
If we don't start taking care
of our community now,
732
00:34:43,347 --> 00:34:44,748
it's not gonna exist.
733
00:34:46,751 --> 00:34:47,751
[cow mooing]
734
00:34:57,662 --> 00:34:59,429
- [Janelle] Oh, he's back!
- Hi, guys.
735
00:34:59,464 --> 00:35:01,598
[Gabriel] Get him!
736
00:35:01,632 --> 00:35:03,133
Oh, you're really back.
737
00:35:03,167 --> 00:35:05,535
[Janelle] So, Hunter's just
graduated from the Air Force Academy.
738
00:35:05,570 --> 00:35:07,537
And he'll be home for three
months, for the whole summer,
739
00:35:07,572 --> 00:35:10,340
which is the longest he's been
home since he graduated...
740
00:35:10,374 --> 00:35:12,175
like, right after he graduated
from high school
741
00:35:12,210 --> 00:35:13,977
and went to the Academy.
742
00:35:14,011 --> 00:35:15,278
[indistinct chatter]
743
00:35:15,313 --> 00:35:17,414
[dog barking]
744
00:35:17,448 --> 00:35:19,149
I'm actually really excited.
745
00:35:19,183 --> 00:35:21,251
As my children have gotten
older and they come back,
746
00:35:21,285 --> 00:35:24,621
I've realized how much I...
747
00:35:24,655 --> 00:35:27,491
my life is about having
them home.
748
00:35:27,525 --> 00:35:30,794
-[dog growls] -Get
down. [indistinct chatter]
749
00:35:30,828 --> 00:35:33,263
Hunter just is
kind of the life of the party.
750
00:35:33,297 --> 00:35:36,933
You definitely don't miss that
Hunter has come in the door.
751
00:35:36,968 --> 00:35:40,370
- Yeah, that's fine... Oh.
- [Gabriel laughs]
752
00:35:40,404 --> 00:35:43,740
[Janelle] Because we're trying to
be really careful about exposure risk,
753
00:35:43,774 --> 00:35:47,477
Kody is going to stay away
for a couple of weeks.
754
00:35:48,646 --> 00:35:51,081
[Hunter] Oh, it's good
to be home.
755
00:35:51,115 --> 00:35:53,550
[Janelle] It's a very rare
occurrence that he's home
756
00:35:53,584 --> 00:35:54,718
for more than two weeks.
757
00:35:54,752 --> 00:35:57,554
And so I think that's just
an impetus for us to finally
758
00:35:57,588 --> 00:36:01,024
figure out how we're gonna get
together as a family this summer.
759
00:36:14,705 --> 00:36:16,173
[Christine] Janelle called me
and asked me
760
00:36:16,207 --> 00:36:18,308
if we could talk today.
761
00:36:20,678 --> 00:36:24,014
I don't like conversations
that are heavy, no,
762
00:36:24,949 --> 00:36:28,051
but when you're with
four other adults,
763
00:36:28,085 --> 00:36:30,820
together, in a family,
764
00:36:30,855 --> 00:36:33,390
you have to have
serious conversations.
765
00:36:34,458 --> 00:36:37,794
So I have to put on my adult
panties today.
766
00:36:39,096 --> 00:36:41,431
- [Janelle] This is nice.
- [Christine] It's a nice backyard, huh?
767
00:36:41,465 --> 00:36:44,834
Yeah, I haven't been
out here for a long time.
768
00:36:44,869 --> 00:36:47,103
This is really awkward 'cause I
can't really figure out how, I can't,
769
00:36:47,138 --> 00:36:48,405
I can't figure out
the greatest way,
770
00:36:48,439 --> 00:36:49,673
so, I'm just gonna jump in.
771
00:36:49,707 --> 00:36:52,275
- I'm always a good fan of jumping in.
- [laughs]
772
00:36:52,310 --> 00:36:54,244
So, it's about
communication styles,
773
00:36:54,278 --> 00:36:56,446
and I've realized, I think,
there's something I wanna change
774
00:36:56,480 --> 00:36:59,449
about my communication style.
775
00:36:59,483 --> 00:37:02,452
And I think it's when I tend
to get so excited
776
00:37:02,486 --> 00:37:05,422
about what I want,
that I can't let it alone.
777
00:37:05,456 --> 00:37:08,491
[Christine] Janelle's very
stubborn. Like, she has blinders on.
778
00:37:08,526 --> 00:37:09,793
And that's what she's
aiming for,
779
00:37:09,827 --> 00:37:12,195
and that's what she's
going for. She does do that.
780
00:37:12,230 --> 00:37:13,763
I think I'm gonna try to
change that.
781
00:37:13,798 --> 00:37:15,532
'Cause we do have some
big things that we have to
782
00:37:15,566 --> 00:37:17,234
communicate about as a family,
783
00:37:17,902 --> 00:37:20,604
in the next several months.
784
00:37:20,638 --> 00:37:21,871
And I wanna make sure that
we're good
785
00:37:21,906 --> 00:37:24,274
because with
the one house conversation,
786
00:37:24,308 --> 00:37:27,410
- you and I were definitely very loud on opposite ends.
- Yeah.
787
00:37:27,445 --> 00:37:29,179
Janelle was way in favor of
788
00:37:29,213 --> 00:37:30,814
living in one house
all together,
789
00:37:30,848 --> 00:37:32,649
and she was at one end
of the spectrum
790
00:37:32,683 --> 00:37:35,051
and I was at completely
the other end of the spectrum
791
00:37:35,086 --> 00:37:37,520
saying, "No, I'm not gonna
live together in one house."
792
00:37:37,555 --> 00:37:40,890
And I really have no hard
feelings about...
793
00:37:40,925 --> 00:37:42,859
everything and I wanna just
make sure that,
794
00:37:42,893 --> 00:37:45,729
- I wanna clear the air.
- I'm good with you now.
795
00:37:45,763 --> 00:37:48,164
But when we were
in the one house,
796
00:37:48,199 --> 00:37:50,500
there's a few reasons
why I don't want to.
797
00:37:50,534 --> 00:37:55,472
One of the reasons was, I felt like everybody,
like, what you and Kody wanted me to do
798
00:37:55,506 --> 00:37:57,140
was more important than what
I wanted to do.
799
00:37:58,709 --> 00:38:02,846
I just look back and wish I
would've taken better care
800
00:38:02,880 --> 00:38:04,214
of my kids.
801
00:38:07,618 --> 00:38:11,554
I just wish I would've stood
up for myself more.
802
00:38:12,590 --> 00:38:15,058
I got overwhelmed,
and I know myself.
803
00:38:15,092 --> 00:38:17,460
And I know that if I was
in a one-house again,
804
00:38:17,495 --> 00:38:18,595
it'd be the same thing.
805
00:38:18,629 --> 00:38:21,197
That's fair.
I could, I could see that.
806
00:38:21,232 --> 00:38:24,100
This is kind of a
long-standing deep hurt, I think.
807
00:38:24,135 --> 00:38:26,681
And I think that it could have
been handled so much better
808
00:38:26,705 --> 00:38:28,972
if we would've
been communicating,
809
00:38:29,006 --> 00:38:30,774
and really listening
and really saying
810
00:38:30,808 --> 00:38:32,742
what we needed to say.
811
00:38:32,777 --> 00:38:34,444
- Sometimes it just feels awkward...
- Yeah.
812
00:38:34,478 --> 00:38:36,179
...when we are all together.
813
00:38:36,213 --> 00:38:38,181
- I wonder why.
- Feels awkward?
814
00:38:42,720 --> 00:38:46,356
I'm always a little nervous.
I'm always a little nervous.
815
00:38:46,390 --> 00:38:49,125
Like nauseous, to the point of
being nauseous.
816
00:38:49,160 --> 00:38:51,961
It's hard to get together
and feel like I still matter,
817
00:38:51,996 --> 00:38:53,363
that I'm still important.
818
00:38:54,732 --> 00:38:57,000
'Cause I think when it comes
down to it...
819
00:38:59,503 --> 00:39:01,771
I don't matter that much,
not really.
820
00:39:02,840 --> 00:39:05,342
So, it's hard to come into
a place where...
821
00:39:06,477 --> 00:39:08,945
I think I'm gonna have
equal say 'cause I won't.
822
00:39:09,880 --> 00:39:11,981
I won't have equal voice,
'cause I won't.
823
00:39:17,455 --> 00:39:20,457
Do you think that the
communication methods or styles
824
00:39:20,491 --> 00:39:23,059
could help you feel
like you were more heard?
825
00:39:23,094 --> 00:39:24,527
I think so. I hope so.
826
00:39:25,896 --> 00:39:27,364
I don't feel like we're
at the point
827
00:39:27,398 --> 00:39:29,499
where we can
be completely honest.
828
00:39:29,533 --> 00:39:32,213
- Why not? Why not make it that point?
- Oh, God.
829
00:39:32,237 --> 00:39:34,571
I just think that it's time to
talk about some of that stuff.
830
00:39:34,605 --> 00:39:35,905
Are you thinking I'm nuts?
831
00:39:35,940 --> 00:39:38,274
I don't think you're nuts,
but I think it's unrealistic.
832
00:39:39,510 --> 00:39:42,479
There's a fine line between
being honest
833
00:39:42,947 --> 00:39:45,048
and being safe,
834
00:39:45,082 --> 00:39:46,516
and that can be crossed easily.
835
00:39:46,550 --> 00:39:48,985
Bring the fall-out. Bring it.
836
00:39:49,019 --> 00:39:52,422
'Cause we're never gonna make
progress until we get through the mess.
837
00:39:52,456 --> 00:39:54,691
I'm willing to give it a try,
just so you know.
838
00:39:54,725 --> 00:39:56,493
- I'm completely willing.
- Okay, you're not hopeful.
839
00:39:56,527 --> 00:39:58,194
No, well...
840
00:39:59,130 --> 00:40:02,599
um... I hate to say that
but yes.
841
00:40:02,633 --> 00:40:03,533
No, not really.
842
00:40:03,567 --> 00:40:05,034
It's easy to just live separate.
843
00:40:05,069 --> 00:40:07,570
- Like, it's really easy, I feel like thinking I should...
- It is easy.
844
00:40:07,605 --> 00:40:10,740
Like, I could just focus
on my kids and I don't want...
845
00:40:11,642 --> 00:40:13,943
part of me is that's so easy.
846
00:40:13,978 --> 00:40:16,746
But part of me is like, you know,
that's really not what I signed up for.
847
00:40:16,781 --> 00:40:19,249
No, it's not what any of us
signed up for.
848
00:40:19,283 --> 00:40:22,051
So I don't wanna do what
we have now,
849
00:40:22,086 --> 00:40:23,953
I don't think it's sustainable.
850
00:40:23,988 --> 00:40:26,189
Well, it's stupid.
It's separate.
851
00:40:26,223 --> 00:40:28,725
It's not what we signed up for.
852
00:40:28,759 --> 00:40:30,794
I really truly believe
at my core
853
00:40:30,828 --> 00:40:32,762
that if we can't figure
this out,
854
00:40:32,797 --> 00:40:34,030
nobody's wanna stick together
855
00:40:34,064 --> 00:40:35,732
if we're not
communicating effectively,
856
00:40:35,766 --> 00:40:36,800
who wants to stick around?
857
00:40:36,834 --> 00:40:38,568
That's way too much work
and it's not very much fun.
858
00:40:38,602 --> 00:40:41,438
[sniffs] So, I think it is
the key to our ultimate
859
00:40:41,472 --> 00:40:44,741
long-term survival
as a family unit.
860
00:40:44,775 --> 00:40:47,710
I think we are at a crossroads.
I think Janelle's 100% right.
861
00:40:48,412 --> 00:40:51,915
We are at a crossroads and...
862
00:40:51,949 --> 00:40:54,150
what she doesn't know
is another crossroad
863
00:40:54,185 --> 00:40:55,785
of moving back to Utah.
864
00:40:58,222 --> 00:40:59,622
I just think that
we need to move back to Utah.
865
00:41:02,593 --> 00:41:05,528
[Christine] I would love to
move back to Utah with all of us.
866
00:41:05,563 --> 00:41:07,430
We have a community there.
867
00:41:07,465 --> 00:41:10,967
Twenty years from now,
us just living by ourselves
868
00:41:11,001 --> 00:41:13,736
as the only polygamists
in this area,
869
00:41:14,638 --> 00:41:17,640
together on Coyote Pass,
870
00:41:17,675 --> 00:41:21,478
it just sounds really,
really lonely.
871
00:41:22,980 --> 00:41:25,482
I'm in a place where
I want something different.
872
00:41:25,516 --> 00:41:27,383
But what we've been doing
hasn't been working.
873
00:41:27,418 --> 00:41:29,519
So, I'd like to try
something different.
874
00:41:29,553 --> 00:41:32,155
And I guess the communication
is the biggest piece of it.
875
00:41:32,189 --> 00:41:33,089
So...
876
00:41:33,123 --> 00:41:34,457
I think so, too.
877
00:41:35,960 --> 00:41:38,595
I really truly believe that if
we don't start taking care of
878
00:41:38,629 --> 00:41:41,264
our quote, unquote
community now,
879
00:41:41,298 --> 00:41:43,266
uh, it's not gonna exist.
880
00:41:48,072 --> 00:41:50,106
[narrator] Next time on
Sister Wives...
881
00:41:50,140 --> 00:41:52,642
Well, the pandemic's been
going on for about seven weeks.
882
00:41:54,578 --> 00:41:56,546
I'm the only one that's going
from home to home.
883
00:41:56,580 --> 00:41:59,649
So, all I'm trying to do
is say, "Let's wait."
884
00:41:59,683 --> 00:42:02,151
This will not go away until
they have a vaccine.
885
00:42:02,186 --> 00:42:04,053
We'll get together when
it's safe.
886
00:42:04,088 --> 00:42:05,822
We'll be lucky if we
have a family at that...
887
00:42:05,856 --> 00:42:07,123
at the end of that time.
888
00:42:07,157 --> 00:42:10,193
"Oh, Dad! You know,
you're so stupid, Dad.
889
00:42:10,227 --> 00:42:12,328
I'd rather be around
the kids than you anyway."
890
00:42:13,097 --> 00:42:15,031
[indistinct chatter]
891
00:42:15,065 --> 00:42:17,367
[Christine] A little bit of
distance for Kody and I is okay.
892
00:42:17,401 --> 00:42:20,036
Things are just hard at home
when he's there.
893
00:42:20,070 --> 00:42:23,606
Just seeing him for a couple
of hours a week isn't enough.
894
00:42:23,641 --> 00:42:26,709
I just really wanna move back
to Utah.
895
00:42:26,744 --> 00:42:29,279
One, two, three, four wives
said, "No.
896
00:42:29,313 --> 00:42:31,948
We're never moving back
to Utah."