The doors to the den are open once again...
..and our five multi-millionaires
are keen to dig deep and invest their cash
to help the next generation of entrepreneurs
find fortune and glory.
They'll occasionally be joined by some special guests,
including health and fitness heavyweight Joe Wicks...
Got to give you a little cuddle cos I'm feeling a bit emotional now
cos you're struggling a little bit. It's all right, mate.
..superstar fashion founder Emma Grede...
This is my opportunity just to pay it forward
and we'll do some great business together.
..and style guru turned beauty mogul Trinny Woodall.
I mean, I literally... Can I imagine going into business with you?
That's the thing. I just don't know.
Now the hunt is on to find the next big deal.
Hi, I'm Luke. And I'm Owen.
Oh, gosh.
And we're from Berkshire, and we're nonidentical twins
three minutes apart.
How's this?
Yeah. How about me? Yeah, I think so.
There's normally a mix of people saying that we do look the same.
Other people say that they can clearly tell us apart,
usually followed by shortly calling us the wrong name.
We do definitely get the twin telepathy.
There is occasions where we'll both say the exact same thing
at the exact same time.
Luke and Owen might have a secret weapon -
their sibling sixth sense -
but facing the Dragons remains a source of trepidation.
A mix of excitement and nerves, I guess.
A little bit apprehensive. It's probably more the unknown
about how it's going to go, what they're going to ask.
Trying to remember the numbers. Yeah.
Hopefully they'll be nice. Yeah. Fingers crossed.
Hello, Dragons. I'm Owen. And I'm Luke.
And we're the twin founders behind the brand Doughboys Pizza,
a dynamic and engaging pizza brand disrupting the frozen pizza market.
Today, we're here to ask for a £90,000 investment
in exchange for a 5% stake in our thriving business.
Our journey began when I was working in the kitchen at my local pub
and experienced first hand the challenges faced by venues
striving to offer a high-quality food menu,
especially amongst a growing skilled labour shortage.
Many hospitality venues have had to resort to using
ready-made food products such as inauthentic, highly processed
frozen pizzas as a quick and easy food option which doesn't require
a highly skilled chef.
Similarly, within retail, the UK frozen pizza category
is dominated by a handful of big manufacturers
and lacking handmade, authentic Italian pizza options.
And so Doughboys was born.
At Doughboys, we specialise in crafting premium, genuine Italian
frozen pizzas specifically for the hospitality and retail sectors.
All of our products are hand-stretched, hand-topped
and stone baked in Italy using fresh and locally sourced
Italian ingredients. We've already experienced significant growth
over the last few years, supplying our multi-award winning
pizza products to over 1,000 hospitality establishments
across the UK. In addition to this, at the end of last year,
we launched our very first retail range,
securing a listing with Ocado more or less straight away.
Since starting the company about three years ago,
we've sold just shy of two million pizzas
and generated a turnover exceeding £2.6 million.
Thank you for your time and, before we welcome any questions,
we'd love for you to try our pizzas.
Ooh, yes!
Frozen pizzas, which have been handmade in Italy...
Right, here we go.
..are the offering from Luke and Owen Buckmaster.
And, for Deborah, we've got our plain base and we've added
our own toppings to it, which is all plant-based.
Lovely, thank you.
They're seeking £90,000 in exchange for 5% of their business.
We've got our margherita and also our mixed vegetable one. Great.
Their product samples appear to be going down a treat.
That's good. Thank you.
But will the duo be able to lay their hands on a slice
of the Dragons' dough?
So, let me get this right,
this was made and frozen in Italy?
Yep. And shipped over to here?
Yep. And then cooked?
Correct. Yeah.
So, how come you two know so much about pizzas?
So, it's mainly... We don't really, as such.
We left school and I wanted to become a chef,
so I went and started working at my local pub doing an apprenticeship.
Erm, that was kind of exactly where initially...
They were just trying to simplify the menu as much as possible.
And pizza was one of the obvious options,
but the products that they were using and that they could access
were just these frozen sort of cookie cutter-type pizzas.
And we, yeah, kind of came together and thought, "We'll give this a go."
How do you know each other?
Twins.
Twin brothers?You missed that. I missed that.
Thought you were mates!
How old are you? We're 24. 24.
And where were you based again?
In Reading, Berkshire, but we're from...
Well, used to... We used to be based in Maidenhead.
So, just talk me through your financials
from the first year starting up to where we are today.
So, in year one, we generated a turnover for the six months
of that year of £320,000.
We made a gross of 130 and a net of 40,000.
Year two, we turned over 580,000
and we had a gross of 130,000...
Sorry, 230,000 gross,
and then another net of 40,000.
And then, the year just finished, our third year,
we turned over £1,045,000,
and we had a gross of 370
and our net was 100,000.
I'll tell you what, makes for good reading, doesn't it?
I mean, I was thinking, "Surely, if they taste this good,
"there's got to be a catch somewhere." And I'm yet to find it.
No. Great start, lads. Thank you. Thank you.
Luke, Owen, the next phase of your journey,
cos you have done quite... Well, the last year
particularly is good growth, isn't it?Yeah.
What's year four and five looking like?
So, right now, this year, we're on track to turn over
1.8 million in revenue.
We've got a gross of 875,000
and a net of 165,000.
So, 1.8, 875, 165.
So, you're really growing the sales
and you're growing your gross profit.
Yeah. But you're only increasing your net profit in the year by 65K,
and yet you're generating another four... What was it?
500,000 in gross margin?
Did you say 875 from 370?
Yeah. There's a lot of efficiencies that, as we're scaling up,
that we're kind of coming across, so...
Well, efficiencies should actually...
It should help. ..should help. Yeah. So, yeah, we're also...
We are still... As we're obviously growing,
we're trying to invest in things like trade shows, things like that,
which is probably going to be affecting our numbers a little bit.
Erm... We're starting to look at employing our first staffs as well.
Yeah. So, it's just been me and Luke in the business.
We think that by getting a salesperson
and getting more support in marketing and stuff,
we'll be able to substantially increase our sales
and drive it much further.
Yeah, no, I get that. It's just... I'm trying to fill that gap.
It's quite a lot of money you're spending.
Yeah.
So where's that money going?
Yeah, it... God, I don't know, off the top of my head, to be honest.
Erm... And what do you guys pay yourselves?
Right now, we pay ourselves our basic allowance of 12 grand a year,
and then we... At the end of the year,
we'll process dividends depending on what we have,
but we don't necessarily pull that from the company straight away.
So you're paying yourselves way below minimum wage.
Yeah. Yeah.
We obviously want the company to make a profit first
and to reinvest it in the growth.
You know, hopefully it will, you know, pay later down the line
as the company scales.
Guys, I'll tell you where I am.
I think you're great.
Thank you. I honestly do. I think 24-year-old,
to where you've come is fantastic.
However, in order to go further,
you need to employ more people. Yeah. Yeah.
And when you put your infrastructure in to run a proper business,
is this going to be one of those businesses
where you turn over a lot but don't make any money?
That concerns me...
..and because of that...
..I'm not going to make you an offer, unfortunately,
and I'm out. Thank you. Thank you anyway.
Luke, Owen, erm, I... I think I've sat here for quite a long time
because I... You're so investable, and I always feel like you should
back entrepreneurs first and foremost.
However, I don't actually eat pizza,
although, you know, today was a bit of an exception,
but I just... I'm not excited about pizza.
So, for that reason, I'm going to say that I'm out.
Guys, I think... I think you've done really well.
Really well. Thank you. Thanks.
Erm, so, my sister had holiday parks -
she sold her last one about a year ago.
And it's just...
It's funny, you're describing a scenario
that I was having the discussion with her
about how is she going to deliver a quality product, you know,
with the inconsistencies of pizza chefs? Yeah.
Sorry, I've just offended every pizza chef in the world now.
But, you know, let's face it, they move on,
they don't turn in, you know? Yeah. No different to a lot, you know,
a lot of what's going on in hospitality,
so this kind of solves that.
Erm, I think you're right to be in here now.
You're at a tender moment.
Yeah. Erm, because you are going...
You've got a lot of decisions to make ahead of you,
and your risk will be - you choose the wrong path,
hire the wrong people, go in the wrong direction...
..and-and-and-and...
..you know, ruin this thing that you've so carefully nurtured
to this point. Yeah. Erm, and I think I can help you with that.
So I, erm...
I'm going to make you an offer.
Thank you. Erm, and I'm going to offer you all of the money
for 10% of the business.
Cool. Thank you. Thank you very much.
I'll tell you where I'm at, guys.
Erm, I think it's a great business.
I think you've got a really good offer from Deborah. Erm...
I was keen to make an offer.
I'm not quite sure it was that good...
..but I'll make it anyway.
So, I would be prepared to offer you all 90,000
that you're asking for,
but I wouldn't be willing to look at anything less than 15%.
OK. Thank you. Thank you for the offer.
I'd also take another slice of pizza if you're offering.
There's plenty. Thank you.
Luke, Owen...
..I've paused and sitting here quietly for quite a long time,
because I'm also a Maidenhead lad as well.
I've seen you around. Have you?
I've seen you round, yeah, at the petrol station and stuff. Oh, God.
He pumps his own petrol?
I'm sure I saw you at the petrol station down the road from us once
in a classic car. Yeah, yeah, I drove here - that's how I got here.
The fact that you're quite local and I was picking on that,
because, when you're investing in people, you know,
it is nice to be able to meet, because we're all used to Teams
or Zoom or something, and it's tough. Yeah.
But I think you've done really, really well.
And there is no way
I can let this go to Deborah Meaden. No chance.
So I'm coming in to compete here, because I think that... I think...
I think I could really help you scale this business...
Thank you. ..at speed, actually, without the pitfalls
that happens when you scale a business at pace.
Yeah. So I'm going to offer you all of the money...
..at 10% as well.
OK. Same as Deborah.
And, yes, I am completely copying Deborah here.
But I did it first! Thank you. Thank you.
All right to have a chat to the wall? Go ahead.
Thank you. Thank you.
I thought twins had, like, telepathy or something.
Luke and Owen have three competing bids to consider,
with Sara Davies offering £90,000 in exchange for 15% -
triple the equity originally on offer...
Do we just accept it as it is?
..while Deborah Meaden and Peter Jones
have both gone in at 10%.
Yeah. Do you want me to say?
Cool. Thank you again for all of your offers.
Yeah, thank you all for the offers, really do appreciate it.
Erm, Peter, we would love to accept your offer.
Yeah.
Wow. Thank you so much. Thank you.
Brilliant. Thank you. Thank you, guys.
A moment of triumph for nonidentical twins Luke and Owen,
who leave the den with £90,000 and the backing of a Dragon
who can help them earn more than just a crust.
Thank God that's over.
We're really thrilled to have Peter on our team now.
We think he adds huge amounts of value.
He's local to us as well, so we don't have to travel very far.
Well, the gauntlet's down, Mr Jones.
It's only because I'm more local than you,
that's the only reason why. Oh, is that...? OK.
I'm not sure about that, Mr Jones.
I think you won that fair and square, but I will remember this.
Hi, I'm Rachel, and this is Holly, my wife.
And we're the owners and the directors
of The Chocolate Cocktail Club.
"London's sweetest bar."
Oh, espresso martinis. With chocolate.
Chocolate martinis. Oh! This is heaven.
The prospect of some free samples has put Peter Jones on cloud nine.
But prepping their pitch
has involved more than just blue-sky thinking for Rachel and Holly.
We've been practising a lot over and over again to each other constantly
and, I think, to anyone that will really listen at the moment! Yeah.
And we've got a six-week-old baby,
so every time I walk around the street, little Ted
has known the speech probably more than Holly does.
So I think his first words might be "Dragons' Den".
THEY CHUCKLE
I'm hoping the dragons will see the passion that we've got
behind our business.
We've got blood, sweat and tears - and chocolate - in this business.
And I really believe that they will see that.
We definitely think now is our time. And with the help, we can be big.
Hi, Dragons.
My name's Rachel and this is my wife and my business partner, Holly,
and we're the owners and the directors
of The Chocolate Cocktail Club.
And we're here in the den today to ask for £80,000
in exchange for 8% of our business.
Imagine a world filled with the indulgence of chocolate
and the sophistication of cocktails.
Welcome to The Chocolate Cocktail Club -
the UK's first - and only - chocolate cocktail bar.
Established in 2018, after five sold-out pop-ups,
we now have a permanent London home,
which we've held for the past three years,
celebrating two of our nation's favourite things -
chocolate and cocktails.
Since the launch of our first permanent site,
we've turned over £700,000.
We have over 25 variations of chocolate cocktails on the menu,
ranging from classic pairings to chocolatey twists,
making us the number one destination for chocoholics
and cocktail enthusiasts alike.
So join us on this delicious journey,
and let's take The Chocolate Cocktail Club
to new cities, new markets,
and help us become the number one destination for chocoholics.
Oliver's now just going to present you
with five of our different cocktails. After you, Oli.
Two of the nation's favourite indulgences - booze and chocolate -
are at the heart of the offering
from married couple Rachel and Holly Wisson-Brooks.
So which is your favourite? MY favourite?
I quite like the Clockwork Orange here.
OK, come on, then. Clockwork Orange here.
They're seeking £80,000 in return for an 8% share in their business.
Oliver? Well done. You're very welcome.
Ahh! Tipple time for Touker Suleyman.
Cheers, Dragons. Cheers.
But while Rachel and Holly have already managed to raise glasses...
Actually, I'm going to put that down before I start asking questions.
LAUGHTER
..can they also raise investment?
Good pitch. Thank you.
You're up and running. So where is your first club?
Cen... In... London - whereabouts?
Clerkenwell, Farringdon.
And how big? It's only a 24-25 seat capacity venue.
It's only small.
That's why we essentially would like some investment,
is to go into Soho, Central London, and where there's more footfall.
So you talked about a £700,000 turnover -
what does that mean in terms of profit?
So 2021 to 2022, we turned over 115,000.
Our gross was 87 and our net was 11.
Then in 2022 to 2023,
we turned over 275,000.
Our gross was 208,000
and our net was 84,000.
Then in 2023 to 2024,
we turned over 297,000.
Our gross profit was 232
and our net was 74,000.
OK, so I can see what's happening here -
you have pretty much hit a ceiling in your current...
That's exactly it. ..venue. We're max capacity.
OK.
Now, um... So your current venue is not prime location?
No. No. So have you worked out what happens
if you go into prime location, in terms of size and rent?
Yeah. You have - I thought you probably had, to be honest,
cos you're all over it.
Um, so what's - you know, what does that... What would that look like -
your next perfect venue?
So ideally I would say approximately about 50 covers.
Yeah. Yeah. And what are you going to pay in terms of rent?
So it would be approximately 200,000...to 100,000.
Yeah, I think it depends on the venue and the location.
It could be, you know, if it was maybe a 50 capacity,
it could be from 80,000-plus.
But you must have modelled forward.
So what does that model... What does that look like?
So we've estimated 100,000, is what we've... 100,000 rent.
So what turnover have you got to do to make that work?
So I've estimated that in year two we could turn over a million,
based on doubling what we currently do with the two venues.
Rachel, Holly. Looking at your financials...it...
To me, it looks like you'd be able to get funding for this new site
by other means...but also you'd be able to go to a landlord and get
a fit-out contribution if you went to a Central London location.
So... I mean, is anything I said there incorrect?
And also if so, if it is correct, then why are you here?
Essentially for yourselves, as well.
Yeah. Er... We want to really propel now.
Like, we've had so many people come to us,
"Are you a chain?", "Oh, my God, have you not franchised this?"
You know, "We could see this in Edinburgh",
"We could see this in Manchester."
And we really would like the help to really push that.
So it's not about the money, necessarily.
Because you could... I mean... The money... ..you're asking for 80K...
How much cash have you got in the bank at the moment?
About... 100,000. Yeah.
So you've got enough money in the bank theoretically... Yeah.
..to at least... Yeah. ..do a deal with a landlord.
Yeah. Essentially. Yeah.
And what is the brand?
The Chocolate Cocktail Club. The Chocolate Cocktail Club.
Because it does look like there's
a little bit of franchise potential here. Yeah. Yeah.
We've discussed franchising.
Obviously, the scare is you don't want someone to ruin
what you've built, with giving trust to someone else.
But it's not off the table. Yeah.
Can I take over for a second? Touk...
Did you have an empty glass delivered?
Wow.
They're good!
I did drink a couple of sips for him.
I've been waiting for your questions.
You've been waiting for my questions? Yeah, here we go.
Right, um, Rachel and Holly. Hiya.
To have one venue...
..it's easier to manage...the risk. Yeah. Yeah.
The moment you start building venues,
the more fixed overheads you'll get. Yeah. Yeah.
You need area managers to control. Yeah. You need monetary systems.
You get a bad week and you've got six stores...
You know? Yeah.
Um, although you're very successful and I think the product's great,
how do you get out there without the exposure?
Now, of course, franchise is one way. Yeah.
Which is the obvious way, of course. Yeah.
Um, but building up your own chain, I would be...
I'd say to you, think twice.
And my last question is...
You haven't asked them a question, Touker,
you've been talking to them! Right. The question I'm going to ask you
is this one, how many square feet is it?
1,000. 1,200.
So it's a good size. Yeah. Yeah.
So if you're going to go to a bigger size
and you're going to go more central,
you'll pay a lot more than 100 grand rent. Yeah. Yeah.
Guys...can I just say, you've given me three numbers.
This is a masterclass in how fantastic numbers are.
And I always say I never particularly like numbers.
Let me tell you about yourself.
You're good operators. Thank you.
And you've got yourself high margins.
In the latest year, you've increased your margins.
You've increased your margins because your overheads have gone up.
Yeah. And you spotted that early enough to think,
"We're going to have to respond to this,
"we're going to have to drive our margins really, really hard."
So that tells me that you are all over it.
And I just stopped for a moment because I'm forever saying
to people, "You only need to know three numbers in your business."
And this is like a masterclass in,
you know, how you can read how people are operating
their businesses from a very few level of numbers.
So well done, you guys. Thank you. Thank you. Um...
There's a "however."
I was waiting for it. Yeah.
I think franchising is going to be difficult for you.
And when you look at franchising,
you don't have enough money in here to excite them.
Because if you think about this,
they're going to need to pay for premises,
they're going to be paying their own staff,
they're going to have all of your costs,
AND they're going to be paying a franchise fee.
And when you look at your net profit,
even YOU haven't proved enough
that it's going to be worth the risk of the high investment
that they're going to have to take,
and you're not going to make your business model...
Doesn't give them that for a return,
it's not going to be worth taking that risk. Yeah.
I think franchising is going to be difficult for you... Yeah.
..until you can really drive home some of those profits.
I, um... I've got quite a lot of insight into this.
I'm really good friends with a lady called Sarah Willingham... Yeah.
..as you probably know, owns the London Cocktail Clubs,
and it's really hard at the moment... Yeah.
..so you're doing really well in a tough environment.
But it's not something that, right now, I want to walk into
because they're incredibly good operators and it's tough.
Yeah. Yeah.
So I'm afraid, right now, it's not an investment for me, so I'm out.
Thank you. Thank you very much. Thank you.
So, Rachel. Holly. Hello.
I've owned a bar and restaurant.
I had one in Windsor, and we had, like, the longest...
It was a cocktail bar. OK, yeah. And we did... It was incredible.
We felt like we, like, did really well...
..but it's really, really brutally tough to make a business out of it.
Having sort of been on this journey before,
and knowing how difficult and brutal it is,
it's not an investment for me today. I'm going to say that I'm out.
No problem. But well done. Thank you. Thanks.
Rachel and Holly. Hello. So this is my personal opinion,
and take on board what you want of this, OK?
I look at this and, as Deborah said, you are clearly smart businesswomen.
Yeah. And you can go one of two ways now.
You can either use your retained profits
to open a second, bigger site and push the business that way,
or to fund expansion through a franchise operation and go that way.
Erm...
My advice to you would be go this way
because you could take the knowledge,
the experience you've got,
and you two run a way more successful bar
on a much bigger scale and earn a really, really good living for it,
for you guys to have a great living.
Yeah. Or you could work really, really hard
managing hundreds of people up and down the country
who aren't as passionate about it as you,
who aren't quite going to make it the same success you are,
and then they're going to drive you round the bend.
Yeah! Yeah. Probably make less money
than you would do if you went this way. Yeah.
So my personal opinion is, I don't think it's right to invest.
OK. Thank you. Good luck, but I'm out. Thank you very much. Thank you.
Rachel, Holly. I think what you've done is great.
I think it's really, really difficult to operate a business
in this economic climate, that's in the space that you're in,
that's turning a pretty consistent profit year over year.
So I think that's really something to applaud.
And when I think about this as an investor,
this isn't an investment for me. OK. OK.
So I'm going to say that I'm out, and wish you well.
Thank you. Thank you very much.
Question mark - you're in Clerkenwell.
Yeah. You're full to capacity, yes?
Yeah. Yeah. So if you had a bigger store,
would you attract the same amount or more because you've got the space?
More. More. Fine, you've answered my question.
I would not think about a second store.
Two lots of overhead. Two lots of rent. Two lots of staff.
Can you double what you're doing now with a bigger store?
That's what you've got to ask yourselves. Yeah. Yeah.
And I think what you need is a bigger cocktail bar
where you've still got control, you're still there,
you keep the same staff,
and hopefully you create more of an experience. Yeah. Yeah.
And if you believe that you can attract more people
cos you've got the space, you don't need a second store.
You need to look for a bigger store in Clerkenwell. Yeah. Yeah.
And you might think I'm crazy... THEY LAUGH
Right? But when it comes to retail, I'm the best. Yeah. Yeah.
I can't see the opp... I can't see myself coming to a bar, and advis...
I've given you the advice for free. You're like you're in the bar now.
LAUGHTER
Um, anyway... Would you mind?
So... So I think...this journey is not for me. Yeah. Yeah.
And I wish you all the best, but I'm out. Thank you. Thank you.
Well, thank you very much. Thank you very much for having us. Good luck.
Well done, though. And you've got a good business. Thank you very much.
Bye. Bye. Well done.
That's it for Rachel and Holly,
who depart the den without the investment they were seeking,
as the Dragons call time on a deal.
You all right? Yeah, yeah. You OK? Yeah.
Relieved that it's over.
Yeah. It's quite daunting, having to stand up there
in front of all the Dragons. So... Yeah, I think it would be, um,
be good for our son not to hear our pitch 24/7 now.
Yeah! So I can now focus on being a mum
as well as being an entrepreneur.
I think people know what to do now, Touker, to get some Touker time -
just give you some drinks. Ohh...
Maybes another cocktail and he might have invested!
LAUGHTER
Hi, I'm Aaron, I'm 23, and this is Zara, the person I'm married to,
they're 24. GLASSES CLINK
We're in business together, which is quite unusual for our age,
and being married. But we love working together,
and I can't wait to see where we take it.
How are you feeling? Good. I think it's good. Yeah.
I think one of the downsides, though, is...
I'll give you the example of our anniversary dinner.
Erm, we went after a full day of work,
and we kind of didn't know what to talk about that wasn't work!
I'm going to take a second to remember this.
It hasn't really sunk in yet.
I grew up watching Dragons' Den,
so it just feels like, I guess, an emotionally loaded event.
My mum sent me the article when Steven Bartlett
actually joined as being, you know, the youngest Dragon ever,
and I was like, "It would be..."
You know, I want to be in his position someday,
so I feel like this is the first step of being in the chair myself.
Hello, Dragons. I'm Zara and this is my husband, Aaron,
and we're the founders of Choppity, an AI video editor
which allows people to do complex video editing
quickly and easily.
We're asking for £100,000 for a 6% equity stake.
Since Choppity is such a visual product,
I'm going to hand over to my lovely husband to give a demo now.
So, as you as you can see here, I've got a podcast video.
This one's about four minutes long,
but it could just as easily be a best man speech
that you've recorded on your phone at a wedding.
So, what I've been tasked with is I want to turn this
into lots of short videos to share on social media.
So, what I'm going to do is, I'm going to open up our website.
I'm going to click upload.
And, as you can see, now it's being uploaded.
So, because it takes a few minutes to analyse,
I'm just going to leave that to the side for one second,
and I've previously uploaded the video.
So I'm going to open up that folder.
And what you can see is that Choppity's automatically
made all of these projects for me.
So, I'm going to click play on one of those just so you get an idea
of what they are.
I think goal setting is important,
it's also why I think
having the right people around you is important, but...
So, I'm going to pause it there just for a second,
but you can see it's turned what was originally a landscape video
into a portrait one. It's detected the faces.
And when there were two people, it stacked them on top of each other.
And it's added this background music
and these animated captions automatically.
So, on top of that, on the left-hand side here,
you can see that there's a transcript.
And, on the right-hand side over here,
you can see that there's an AI-generated title.
But it isn't made for just making one video,
it makes a bunch of them. So, here I've got a 30-second video.
This one's about 28 seconds long.
And, actually, from what was originally a 45-minute-long video,
it's automatically made all of these clips.
So, at this point, what you could do is you could click download
on any one of these and post it to social media.
But if, for example, you want to edit it, you can just click edit.
Now, editing videos is usually a really daunting task,
and what we've tried to do is make it as simple as possible.
So, if what I wanted to do is make this video shorter,
all I need to do is... You see this purple bit here that's selected?
I can just drag this handle and trim it like this,
and now it's shorter.
So, if you can edit a word document,
you can edit a video in Choppity, is the idea.
So, the video that I uploaded at the start of the demo
has already been edited.
Again, I've touched nothing apart from just uploading it.
So, I'm going to open that one up,
and you can see it's made all of these clips.
So, I'm just going to click on this one
so you can see how it's edited it.
But the thing is, like, I also...
I mean, it's not that I'm never, like, up late or...
So, you can see it's added some nice pink animated captions.
It's added our logo in the top left corner
that appeared and animated in,
some background music and even some zooms.
So, at this point, these videos are ready to go out on social media.
AI video editing software designed with social media in mind
is the brainchild of Aaron Morris and Zara Paul.
The couple are seeking £100,000 in return for 6% of their business
and their product demo has clearly made an impression on Sara Davies.
Wow. Like, just wow.
Thank you. That is exceptional. Thank you very much. Thank you.
What is it about you two t hat has given you the skills
that has set you off in this market?
What's happened to get you to this point here?
So, Aaron and I met in uni,
and we got together pretty quickly
and have basically been building together ever since.
We spent a year working on a graphic design app,
and we took a lot of the skills that we'd learned from building that tech
and transferred it over to the video space.
And just a little bit on me as well, my background.
So, I've been developing since I was about 13 years old
and that's really my speciality.
And I have a bit of experience, background, of video editing,
but that's more just as a hobby.
And how long have you been working on it to get it to this stage?
We started development in November of 2022
and we launched in January of 2023.
And what have you spent on the development of the product so far?
Development - zero.
There are running costs, but development, zero,
cos it was all done in-house. Mm. Wow.
Well done. Thank you. Thank you.
Guys. Hello.
I'm the least tech-person you could imagine,
but I've got fashion businesses... Uh-huh.
..and we create videos. Mm-hm.
So, erm, how do I
use your technology and get the consumer's attention?
Er, so one of the common requirements
is just, first off, branding.
So, imagine if, instead of just having one of those videos,
you have 50.
To every single... For every single one of those to add the logo,
add a little outro animation, put background music,
if you need to correct any audio, like, if it's muffled,
there's background noise -
all of those sort of things can be done instantly
for every single one of them,
as opposed to having to do it one by one.
Right. So, where do you believe you're going to end up with this...
..in two, three years' time?
So, we want to be in every business.
We want every marketer in the world to be using Choppity
for all of the videos that they need to be making.
Very impressive, you guys. Thank you. Even though I'm not in tech.
I think it's because we're not in tech
that we're... we're a little bit like,
"Whoa, this is really clever."
I know you guys... Like, you live in this world
and you see stuff like this all the time, and I'm just like, "Yeah."
Thank you. Thank you.
Aaron, Zara, erm...
..it's really cool. I think it's really cool. Thank you.
To say I know this space, this tool,
what it does, every competitor that exists... Mm-hm.
..is an understatement. Erm, I actually part own a company
which is essentially doing the same thing, taking long form,
turning it into clips. Mm.
And there is a lot of products that are trying to do the same thing.
There's a lot of them.
And, with these businesses, sometimes, you know,
it's hard to forecast the disruptive forces
that come out of nowhere, right? Yeah. For sure.
Because one of the... You know, you could have a Photoshop
or an Adobe, I'm sure that's probably a little bit...
Keeps you up a little bit at night, who introduce similar features
in their video editing software for long form video.
What happens to you in that situation? What do you do?
So, Aaron and I, we're very determined and driven people
and we're also very resourceful.
Whatever the landscape looks like, we'll figure something out.
Maybe not with this. If this is a sinking ship,
we'll let the ship sink and we'll go and do something else.
We don't want to lose anyone else's money or time,
that's not our attitude towards doing anything.
So, I'm going to tell you where I am,
just to make things a little bit easier for everybody.
When I think about who wins in this space,
many of these games are won by resource. Mm-hm.
And some of these games are winner-takes-all...
..to some degree.
You know, I'm not saying that there will be just one winner -
there's typically maybe three, you know, big, big names.
And then I look at the ask,
and this is for me, actually, where it falls down,
because 100K for 6%,
it's actually the 100K piece
that I... If you'd come in and that number was lower,
I think I would have had a shot at this.
But with what I know, the risk equation at that level...
..doesn't add up for me, unfortunately.
Erm, so I'm going to say that I'm out,
but I wish you the very, very best. Thank you. Thank you.
So... So, erm...
That was interesting, because, erm, I have to be honest,
I...I don't live in the... I don't know the landscape of this.
I do live in this world, I just don't know the landscape
because I'm not on the tech side of things.
Erm, and...and I have to say that Steven's comments
have wobbled me,
and they've wobbled me because, if I know a landscape,
any of these other Dragons can say what they like.
I know what I know.
In this particular situation, you guys are really impressive...
..I can see exactly why this product is needed and how it would be used,
but I have... I'm going to take into account
Steven's summary of the landscape.
So I am really sorry, I am really sorry...
..I won't be investing. I'm out. Thank you. I appreciate it.
Aaron and Zara.
Look, I think this is really... I think it's great what you've done.
It's without doubt, erm...
..really admirable,
and you are both really credible.
Thank you. Thank you.
It's really interesting because I do think you...
You do have something here. Erm...
..and I think I could really help...
..erm, help you build the business.
One of my best friends, the group CEO of a very large business
in the UK that does a lot of this sort of stuff.
But I have to take more than...
..the 6% because of the risk.
So, I am going to offer you all of the money...
..but I'm doing it at 15%.
OK. Mm. That's my offer.
Thank you. Thank you very much for your offer.
How are you going to feel if I put my money in today
and we spend this 100,000 pursuing this...
..this Choppity product, erm...
..and it doesn't work, and then you're starting from scratch
with something new, but you only own 94% of it?
Your value isn't the money that you're putting in.
Your value is you. The same with us.
And we would see it as going in as a partnership.
That was a great answer. That made my mind up.
Thank you. Thank you so much. Erm, I don't have expertise in this area.
I'm not investing in this product or this area,
I'm happy to back you two.
Wow, thank you. Thank you. Thank you so much. Thank you so much.
So I will offer you what you're asking for at what you're offering.
I'll offer you the whole 100,000 at the 6%.
Thank you very much. Thank you so much. Thank you.
Well, you got two offers. Mm-hm.
Erm...
I like you guys. You really are great.
You know? Thank you. So I'm going to offer you all the money...
..but I also want 15% like Mr Jones.
OK, thank you so much. Thank you.
Do you want to go and have a chat with yourselves at the wall?
Yes, please. Thank you. Thanks for your offers.
Aaron and Zara have three competing bids to consider,
with Sara Davies having met the couple's original ask -
£100,000 in return for 6%...
15 might be too high.
..whilst Peter Jones and Touker Suleyman
have both demanded 15%.
INAUDIBLE
So, thank you guys so much for your offers.
Erm...
..Peter, we're really interested in your connections.
But we were wondering if you would consider dropping
your equity ask...
..to 12.5%.
I would drop it if I get my 100K back
because then I've got no cash at risk and I own 12.5%.
I would be happy with that.
I think that's good. Yeah.
We'd like to accept your offer.
Yay!
Thank you. Such a pleasure. Thank you so much.
An amazing outcome for Aaron and Zara...
Thank you so much, guys. Bye.
..who leave the den £100,000 better off,
having clinched a deal with a Dragon
who has a wealth of experience in the world of tech.
It doesn't feel like that was real. I feel like I'm waking up right now.
They were brilliant.
Brilliant. We could not have let them walk out of this den
without getting investment. They're the most sort of...
They're the best we've seen in the den.
We're super delighted to have Peter on board.
He just has so much industry experience and, yeah, super excited
to be working with him.
My name's Alex Street. I'm originally from South London,
but now I'm living in Nottingham.
We made it. Come on.
I love football shirts from all different years,
they have a history and a nostalgia that I just absolutely love.
Where's Gary Neville when you need him?
I wash an awful lot of football shirts every week.
We don't have any that look like that in our house.
Alex has dressed up especially for the Dragons.
I've put on a full suit today,
a little three-piece cheeky number.
Most of the time I'm wearing football shirts in the office.
Yeah, it feels nice to put on proper clothes.
The last time he was in formal wear was a much more sombre occasion.
It's been a really challenging couple of months.
I lost my dad and we had his funeral about a month ago,
but I'm here now.
I'm ready to deliver the best pitch I possibly can.
Don't shoot, you don't score.
And hopefully the Dragons will see a real, authentic, quality business
that they can get behind and invest.
Oh.
Hello, Dragons. My name is Alex Street
and I'm the co-founder of Mystery Jersey King.
I'm here today looking for an investment of £50,000
for a 10% equity share in my business.
Mystery Jersey King is the home of the football shirt mystery box.
The business is based on an idea for football fans and consumers
to purchase a mystery box experience and subscription service.
It is a new and exciting concept to collect football shirts
from all around the world at an amazing price.
Since starting the business from my spare room in February 2021,
we made our first move to our new office space in the same year
and then we took on four members of staff
to help with the day-to-day running.
This then allowed us to spend more time building relationships
with manufacturers, retailers and football clubs,
which in turn has given MJK the opportunity
to present a broad collection of unique and unexpected shirts,
which we present on our social media platforms,
which has over 100,000 followers.
We are really pleased to say we've accumulated
over £1 million worth of sales revenue.
Thank you for your time and, before we go on to the questions,
I've got a wonderful, cheeky little mystery box for each one of you.
Ooh. OK. Better be Manchester United.
Yours will be Chelsea, the best team.
A mystery box containing a football shirt
sourced from anywhere around the globe
and delivered to your door is the offering from Alex Street.
I love purple. Top colour.
He's seeking £50,000 in return for a 10% share in his business.
That is Pena Deportiva, yeah? Yes.
That captures the essence of the island which they call Ibiza.
Ooh. So it's got a big DJ on it. Funky colours.
That's me. You have got me down to a T.
Alex might have successfully sized up Deborah Meaden,
but his shirts also fit the bill
for self-confessed soccer mum Sara Davies.
Wow, Alex.
Hi. My kids would love this.
I mean, yeah, it's...it's amazing. Thank you.
I can see it, it's brilliant.
So, what's the premise in terms of
how often do people receive the subscription?
OK, so we work on a subscription basis where we work on
one a month and we charge 29.99 including delivery.
And so what is your average cost on one of those shirts
and delivered to a customer?
All the shirts that we actually source all come at different
sort of prices, so we could be sourcing the shirts at £6 to £7,
up to £14 to £15.
It all depends on the relationships we have with the manufacturers.
OK, so I can totally see how it's a win-win.
I can see how, from the manufacturer's standpoint,
they're getting rid of excess stock that they wouldn't be able to sell.
From your standpoint, you'd be able to negotiate,
buy at brilliant prices. And the consumer is happy,
because they're accepting, "I'm going to get something different
"and I'm getting it at a good price for a football shirt."
Yeah. Exactly right. I like...I like win-win businesses. This is great.
Sorry if it's a bit simple, but, like, erm...
..it works. Simple's best. And I'm a pretty simple geezer, just enjoy it
and I love what we do - trying to make these little deals.
Like, I had this guy the other day called Pedro.
He went to me, "Oh, Alex, 600 shirts, FC Porto, last season."
So, I've managed to source them in at 13 euros, right?
So, if you receive that in a £30 mystery box - amazing.
You've got right value for money cos if you Googled that actual shirt,
it's going to be £60, £70, £80.
I feel like I want a pint of beer
just to sit here and have a chat with Alex in the pub
and chat some football. You can have a glass of water,
not quite the same.
Erm, right, so how many people
do you have in the subscription model today?
We have 700 subscribers as of today, that's where we're at.
It will fluctuate because, you know, some go up, some go down.
Well, I want to understand your attrition. Like, how...? OK.
So, how long, generally, are you keeping a customer?
What's your retention rate month on month?
And then I also want to understand what your cost per acquisition
for a customer is.
HE EXHALES Those are great questions.
They are great questions - that's why I sit in this chair, mate.
And I would love...I would love to give you the answer to those.
Yep, I'm hoping you will. Yeah, erm, so, we just basically...
Every month, we just track how many subscribers we've got
and we work it out on a month-by-month basis.
And, so, roughly... So, if we take...
At the moment, you've got 700.
Do you know how many new customers have come in this month?
No. No.
Apologies that I don't know that number.
Have you got any data at all
I can work with to kind of analyse how well the business is doing?
I've got some numbers. So, once I can get rid of these numbers,
cos I've got a lot of numbers, I can kind of then just relax and...
I wouldn't take anything for granted.
I'm not sure you'll be relaxing.
I'll just manage that expectation now. OK, OK. OK.
So, for year one, the turnover was 365K
with a net profit of 62K.
Our second year, the turnover was 688K
with a net profit of 62K.
And for year three, the turnover was...600 and...
..672K,
with a net profit of 95K.
Mm-hm.
Alex, good to meet you. Hi, Peter.
700 subscribers... Yeah. ..paying 29.99 a month.
Yeah. That's where you are today. Yeah.
That's about, what, 21K a month coming in? Yeah.
And yet the numbers that you've already done previously last year
were nearly three times that. Yeah, so... What's happened?
OK, so, last year, we kind of dilly and dallied about
with, like, another... We basically got a lot of training gear in
and we used to sell it on eBay,
but then it was just taking away our attention from the main thing,
which is the brand and the mystery box element
and experience that people get when they open up.
OK, so that's why. So your revenue has dropped.
Yeah. But you're focusing back on your core offer.
Yeah, which is the brand.
And one question I had is -
could you tell me the proportion of revenue that's coming from eBay
versus Mystery Jersey King?
I-I'm really sorry. I-I don't know the answer to that.
I'm really sorry. I-I should have come here more prepared.
But, so, listen, I would allow some leeway for not knowing.
I'm not so pernickety about some things, because, you know,
I'm sure there's some things you can walk out of this den and find out.
Yeah. But this isn't the complicated stuff.
This isn't me asking you to read out your balance sheet
and quizzing you on it. Yeah.
I'm just asking how much money you made from eBay.
Yeah.
I'd be guessing and I wouldn't want to do... I wouldn't want to do that.
I'm going to tell you where I am. I don't feel like I'm able to invest
because, admittedly, you don't know the numbers.
OK. Erm, so I'm going to say that I'm out,
but well done. Thank you so much.
You know, I'm going to learn so much from this experience.
You've got a great business and I would say congratulations,
because you are generating 20K a month,
but your business, even the name of your business,
actually reflects
the numbers in it as well
because it's...it's beyond me.
It's a mystery that we can't even get...
THEY LAUGH We can't get to the bottom
of the detail of the numbers.
I mean, football shirt market is worth, like, £4 billion.
Like, people... Yeah, I know, but...
You know, how is it possible to invest?
Neither of us know actually what this business has done
and that's really a challenge to try and find a way to invest.
So, look, I'm going to say that I'm out.
Alex, you don't have to be an accountant,
but you do need to know the numerical mechanics
of your business. It's not that complicated.
Yeah, OK.
So, I'm afraid I won't be investing. I'm out. Thank you so much.
Look, you are a trader at heart
and traders are entrepreneurs,
and entrepreneurs sometimes are mavericks.
Am I building the picture? Yeah.
But, honestly, can you imagine you and I having a board meeting,
and I come to you and say, "Alex..."?
THEY LAUGH I actually can.
Yeah, I'd actually buy tickets to see you two have a board meeting.
I'd say, "Alex, give me the numbers." You'd say...
I think you two having a board meeting
will actually sell like billy-o. Touker, I'll tell you what...
Touker, I'll give you the money, invest in the man.
You hear this? He'll put the money up. No, no, what I'm saying...
What I'm trying to get to
is that you are a personality in your own self.
Thank you. You are the trader. You're the entrepreneur
and I believe that you would find it very difficult
to bring an investor on board,
so, for those reasons, I'm out.
OK.
Alex...
Yeah. Stressful, isn't it? HE SIGHS
And we're being really nice to you tonight.
You didn't know any of your numbers and none of us have got fiery.
You've been really lucky. Thank you.
Erm, what is it you've come in here for?
What do you think you want a Dragon for?
Just to move on to the next level. You know,
we've got a lovely little business with a couple of members of staff.
We're doing well. I just think you guys can open new doors for me.
And I just think, with one of your guys' help,
this can really go. You know, we can absolutely nail this, I know it.
Do you know what, Alex? I'm going to throw you a lifeline. OK.
Cos I think you're a top bloke. Thank you.
However, I totally agree with absolutely everything
that has been said by every other Dragon, OK?
And you not knowing your numbers,
this is a really, really risky business, OK?
Just because I... I'm putting my money into you,
and I don't quite know that you know how you're going to give me a return
as an investor, OK? OK.
So, what I'd be prepared to do is give you the 50,000
you're asking for
and I would want to do that for 15% of the business.
OK. And as long as you return my money to me within 18 months,
which I think is reasonable... Yeah. ..then I'm no longer at risk.
Yep, OK. And I'll drop down to the 10% shareholder that you want.
I think that's really fair and reasonable
given the absolute dog's dinner you've made your numbers today.
Yeah, OK. So that's my offer. Thank you. OK.
I must be mad.
You're not. You're not. You can bank on a geezer like me.
So does that mean we've got a deal?
100% yes. Brilliant!
Absolutely! Oh, bless you.
It's a massive win for Alex...
Well done. Thank you so much. Well done.
..who can't resist the opportunity to try and strike one more deal
before he leaves the den.
Are you playing Soccer Aid on Sunday? I am.
Couple of cheeky tickets, couple of cheeky...
STEVEN LAUGHS Sorry.
Couple of cheeky tickets? They're ten quid.
Alex departs without his tickets,
but, crucially, he does have £50,000...
HE EXCLAIMS
..and the backing of a Dragon
who understands how to take a business to the top of its league.
That was for you, Dad.
He just needs a bit of help.
He does. He needs putting in touch with a decent accountant.
Do you know what? I think you'll have a great time.
I think he's great. He's lovely. And I can't wait to go and ring the kids
and tell them I've invested in a football shirt company. Whoa!
I thought the final whistle had been blown on me.
You know, they all fell like dominoes - one, two -
and then a shining light came on - my substitute.
She smashed a goal, she believed in me, and...
Yeah, I'm... Yeah.
Come on, let's have it.
Next time... Saves time, doesn't it?
Cos you can poo and wash your hands... At the same time.
That's quite a big piece of information
you've just divulged there.
That was one of the best pitches I've seen in the den.
Oh, yes! Wow.
When you build your life again, this is driving you a lot.
Gosh, I feel a bit choked up. This is all about contacts.
I think Sara and I would be a great team on this.
I would never go against my wife.
I'm glad someone can understand my point of view!